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  Topic: Article linked from Disco institute, The tree of death? Check. Wait. Huh?< Next Oldest | Next Newest >  
BWE



Posts: 1898
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 19 2009,06:09   

http://www.discovery.org/a/10271
Quote
Slouching Toward Columbine: Darwin's Tree of Death

By: David Klinghoffer
BeliefNet
April 20, 2009


Link to Original Article

I've long been fascinated by the image of the Tree of Death, parallel to the Tree of Life in the Garden of Eden and cryptically referred to in mystical texts explaining the Hebrew Bible:

   And out of the ground made the LORD God to grow every tree that is pleasant to the sight, and good for food; the Tree of Life also in the midst of the garden, and the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil (Genesis 2:9).

   Come and behold: as soon as night falls, the Tree of Death rules in the world and the Tree of Life disappears high above. Then the Tree of Death is the sole ruler in the universe, and all inhabitants of the world taste of death (Zohar III:119a).

The image, and today's gruesome Columbine anniversary, provide an occasion to reflect on Darwinian evolution's social consequences, from school shootings to Nazi racism and more.

Uh... It gets even better, er, dumber.

I tried to connect the horror and tragedy of the Columbine killings with Darwin but I failed. Instead my restless brain kept coming round to images of a group setting with a man wearing hair gel and wingtips blabbering about time shares and me wondering if I would still get the free stuff if I tied him up and put my sock in his mouth.

--------------
Who said that ev'ry wish would be heard and answered
When wished on the morning star
Somebody thought of that, and someone believed it
Look what it's done so far

The Daily Wingnut

   
Schroedinger's Dog



Posts: 1692
Joined: Jan. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: May 19 2009,07:14   

They should try and also link the Columbine massacre to this:

Quote
The first sources of light for all of Arda were two enormous Lamps: Illuin, the silver one to the north and Ormal, the golden one to the south. These were cast down and destroyed by Melkor. Afterward, the Valar went to Valinor and Yavanna sang into existence the Two Trees, silver Telperion and golden Laurelin. Telperion was referred to as male and Laurelin female. The Trees sat on the hill Ezellohar located outside Valimar. They grew in the presence of all of the Valar, watered by the tears of Nienna.

Each tree was a source of light: Telperion's silver and Laurelin's gold. Telperion had dark leaves (silver on one side) and his silvery dew was collected as a source of water and of light. Laurelin had pale green leaves trimmed with gold, and her dew was likewise collected by Varda.

One "day" lasted twelve hours. Each Tree, in turn, would give off light for seven hours (waxing to full brightness and then slowly waning again), so that at one hour each of "dawn" and "dusk" soft gold and silver light would be given off together.

Jealous Melkor also known as Morgoth enlisted the help of the giant spider-creature Ungoliant (the first great spider and ancestor of Shelob) to destroy the Two Trees. Concealed in a cloud of darkness, Melkor struck each Tree and the insatiable Ungoliant devoured whatever life and light remained in them {their sap poured like blood}.

Again Yavanna sang and Nienna wept, but they succeeded only in reviving Telperion's last flower (to become the Moon) and Laurelin's last fruit (to become the Sun). These were assigned to lesser spirits, male Tilion and female Arien, after the 'genders' of the Trees themselves. This is why, in The Lord of the Rings, the Sun is usually referred to as "she" and the moon as "he".

However the true light of the Trees, before their poisoning by Ungoliant, was said to now reside only in the three Silmarils, created by Fanor the most gifted of the Elves.


I'm mean, it makes at least as much sense as their bronze-age mythology...

--------------
"Hail is made out of water? Are you really that stupid?" Joe G

"I have a better suggestion, Kris. How about a game of hide and go fuck yourself instead." Louis

"The reason people use a crucifix against vampires is that vampires are allergic to bullshit" Richard Pryor

   
BWE



Posts: 1898
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 19 2009,07:49   

They apparently abandoned the whole, "We got science." meme. It must not have been working.

--------------
Who said that ev'ry wish would be heard and answered
When wished on the morning star
Somebody thought of that, and someone believed it
Look what it's done so far

The Daily Wingnut

   
dvunkannon



Posts: 1377
Joined: June 2008

(Permalink) Posted: May 19 2009,08:32   

I think the DI is missing out on attacking the most subversive Darwinist voice of the 20th Century.

Cole Porter.

 
Quote
birds do it, bees do it
even educated fleas do it
let's do it, let's fall in love
in spain, the best upper sets do it
lithuanians and letts do it
let's do it, let's fall in love

the dutch in old amsterdam do it
not to mention the finns
folks in siam do it
think of siamese twins

some argentines, without means, do it
people say, in boston, even beans do it
let's do it, let's fall in love

romantic sponges, they say, do it
oysters, down in oyster bay, do it
let's do it, let's fall in love

cold cape cod clams, against their wish, do it
even lazy jellyfish do it
let's do it, let's fall in love

electric eels, i might add, do it
though it shocks 'em, i know.
why ask if shad do it
waiter, bring me shad roe.

in shallow shoals, english soles do it
goldfish, in the privacy of bowls, do it
let's do it, let's fall in love


and even more directly

Quote
You could have a great career,
And you should;
Yes you should.
Only one thing stops you dear:
You're too good;
Way too good!

If you want a future, darlin',
Why don't you get a past?
'Cause that fateful moment's comin' at last...

We're all alone, no chaperone
Can get our number
The world's in slumber--let's misbehave!!!

There's something wild about you child
That's so contagious
Let's be outrageous--let's misbehave!!!

When Adam won Eve's hand
He wouldn't stand for teasin'.
He didn't care about those apples out of season.

They say that Spring means just one little thing to little lovebirds
We're not above birds--let's misbehave!!!

It's getting late and while I wait
My poor heart aches on
Why keep the breaks on? Let's misbehave!!!

I feel quite sure affaire d'amour
Would be attractive
While we're still active, let's misbehave!

You know my heart is true
And you say you for me care...
Somebody's sure to tell,
But what the heck do we care?

They say that bears have love affairs
And even camels
We're merely mammals--let's misbehave!!!


--------------
I知 referring to evolution, not changes in allele frequencies. - Cornelius Hunter
I知 not an evolutionist, I知 a change in allele frequentist! - Nakashima

  
Lou FCD



Posts: 5402
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 19 2009,09:11   

Or even more blatantly, that bunch called the Bloodhound Gang

Quote
You and me baby ain't nothin' but mammals
so let's do it like they do on the Discovery Channel.


--------------
Lou FCD is still in school, so we should only count him as a baby biologist. -carlsonjok -deprecated
I think I might love you. Don't tell Deadman -Wolfhound

Work-friendly photography
NSFW photography

   
k.e..



Posts: 3746
Joined: May 2007

(Permalink) Posted: May 19 2009,09:24   

Quote (Lou FCD @ May 19 2009,17:11)
Or even more blatantly, that bunch called the Bloodhound Gang

Quote
You and me baby ain't nothin' but mammals
so let's do it like they do on the Discovery Channel.

THAT DON'T EXPLAIN THE HOMO MEME, HOMO!!!!   :angry: d.t. ©


Or Clive for that matter.

Is there a gene/meme for stupidty, mass murder?

Is there a gene for memes?

What does ID have to say about that?

God did it. ....ought to be ashamed of himself.

--------------
"I get a strong breeze from my monitor every time k.e. puts on his clown DaveTard suit" dogdidit
"ID is deader than Lenny Flanks granmaws dildo batteries" Erasmus
"I'm busy studying scientist level science papers" Galloping Gary Gaulin

  
dvunkannon



Posts: 1377
Joined: June 2008

(Permalink) Posted: May 19 2009,11:01   

Quote (k.e.. @ May 19 2009,10:24)
Is there a gene for memes?

What does ID have to say about that?

God did it. ....ought to be ashamed of himself.

Gene for Memes? Sounds like a Dawkins question.

God - that guy has to have hair on His palms by now...

--------------
I知 referring to evolution, not changes in allele frequencies. - Cornelius Hunter
I知 not an evolutionist, I知 a change in allele frequentist! - Nakashima

  
Ra-レl



Posts: 93
Joined: June 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 19 2009,16:23   

Quote (Lou FCD @ May 19 2009,09:11)
Or even more blatantly, that bunch called the Bloodhound Gang

Quote
You and me baby ain't nothin' but mammals
so let's do it like they do on the Discovery Channel.

Maybe more blatant, but Porter rhymes.

--------------
Beauty is that which makes us desperate. - P Valery

  
dvunkannon



Posts: 1377
Joined: June 2008

(Permalink) Posted: May 19 2009,20:42   

Quote (Ra-レl @ May 19 2009,17:23)
Quote (Lou FCD @ May 19 2009,09:11)
Or even more blatantly, that bunch called the Bloodhound Gang

 
Quote
You and me baby ain't nothin' but mammals
so let's do it like they do on the Discovery Channel.

Maybe more blatant, but Porter rhymes.

Cole Porter song = Intelligent Design!

--------------
I知 referring to evolution, not changes in allele frequencies. - Cornelius Hunter
I知 not an evolutionist, I知 a change in allele frequentist! - Nakashima

  
Ra-レl



Posts: 93
Joined: June 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 20 2009,15:48   

Quote (dvunkannon @ May 19 2009,20:42)
Quote (Ra-レl @ May 19 2009,17:23)
Quote (Lou FCD @ May 19 2009,09:11)
Or even more blatantly, that bunch called the Bloodhound Gang

Quote
You and me baby ain't nothin' but mammals
so let's do it like they do on the Discovery Channel.

Maybe more blatant, but Porter rhymes.

Cole Porter song = Intelligent Design!

I always thought so.

--------------
Beauty is that which makes us desperate. - P Valery

  
darwinoid



Posts: 12
Joined: Jan. 2003

(Permalink) Posted: June 23 2009,21:48   

Quote (Lou FCD @ May 19 2009,07:11)
Or even more blatantly, that bunch called the Bloodhound Gang

Quote
You and me baby ain't nothin' but mammals
so let's do it like they do on the Discovery Channel.

Nancy "I'm a Worldviews Expert" Pearcey uses that lyric in her talks all the time. Srsly.

http://www.pearceyreport.com/

--------------
john m. lynch
http://blog.jmlynch.org/....nch.org
http://www.public.asu.edu/~jmlync....jmlynch

   
J-Dog



Posts: 4402
Joined: Dec. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: June 24 2009,07:55   

Quote (darwinoid @ June 23 2009,21:48)
Quote (Lou FCD @ May 19 2009,07:11)
Or even more blatantly, that bunch called the Bloodhound Gang

 
Quote
You and me baby ain't nothin' but mammals
so let's do it like they do on the Discovery Channel.

Nancy "I'm a Worldviews Expert" Pearcey uses that lyric in her talks all the time. Srsly.

http://www.pearceyreport.com/

Whoa!  That's an ugly link - especially early in the a.m.

It's worth pointing out and laughing at the listing of "contributors".  The list is alphabetical - BY FIRST NAMES- proving that you must be a special brand of dumb to be a user.

--------------
Come on Tough Guy, do the little dance of ID impotence you do so well. - Louis to Joe G 2/10

Gullibility is not a virtue - Quidam on Dembski's belief in the Bible Code Faith Healers & ID 7/08

UD is an Unnatural Douchemagnet. - richardthughes 7/11

  
Erasmus, FCD



Posts: 6349
Joined: June 2007

(Permalink) Posted: June 24 2009,11:12   

NEW TARD!!! thanks!!! there is some really good shit in that sack

warm-up tard

Quote

Saturday, January 31, 2009
Global Warming Unearths Ancient Dragon
By Rick Pearcey January 31, 2009, 11:55 PM

The cable channel Sci Fi bravely aired tonight an "original movie" titled Wyvern.

This creature feature features the following terrifying plot: "When global warming unearths an ancient dragon, a small Alaskan town will be destroyed, unless . . ." You'll have to figure out the rest.

But why call this broadcast brave?

Because it dares to link ancient dragons and global warming, thereby raising in the mind of every school boy and girl a simple question: What's more mythical, ancient dragons or global warming?

I guess they're right about Sci Fi Saturday: "The Most Dangerous Night on Television."


clearly we are dealing with a brain trust of legendary proportion.

ETA EVEN BETTAR

Quote
Thursday, June 11, 2009
Dictatorship Watch: Holocaust Museum Shooter a Christian-Hating Socialist
By Rick Pearcey June 11, 2009, 01:05 PM

Racists, socialists, Marxists, and fascists red and yellow, black and white may want to hold onto their seats and secure their pews.

Writing at Frontpage magazine, Ben Johnson makes the case that "longtime neo-Nazi" James Wenneker Von Brunn "was . . . not . . .     a . . . conservative."

Moreover, writes Johnson, the murder suspect "denounced the Christian faith as a dastardly Jewish conspiracy" and as a "'HOAX' invented by the Apostle Paul to 'DESTROY ROMAN CULTURE' from within by undermining its pagan virility." (Note: The CAPS above, as Johnson points out, "appear in the original.")

One does not mean to be redundant, but the stereotype-challenging information Johnson provides may also upset members of a) the Collaborationist Press and b) the Obama administration.

Why? Because, sadly and tyrannically, many of these folks are also "Christian-Haters."

They constitute an elitist, secularist axis of those who despise -- in contradistinction to the genius of the Founding Fathers and the Founding Vision -- the humane, liberating, and dictatorship-challenging application of Creator-rooted information and thoughtforms to the public square.

Their way, including the Obama way, is the end of America the free.

The end of their way opens the door to humanity and dignity under God again. That's what the Declaration and Constitution are all about.

According to the evidence, Von Brunn hates this. As does the Washington-Centric establishment.


all you we worldnutdaily fans now have a choice in tard.   thanks for the link

--------------
You're obviously illiterate as hell.Peach, bro.-FtK

Finding something hard to believe based on the evidence, is science.-JoeG

the odds of getting some loathsome taint are low-- Gordon E Mullings Manjack Heights Montserrat

I work on molecular systems with pathway charts and such.-Giggles

  
darwinoid



Posts: 12
Joined: Jan. 2003

(Permalink) Posted: June 24 2009,13:58   

always a pleasure to make folks aware of the, ahem, joy that is Pearcey. She's a DI/CSC fellow, of course.

--------------
john m. lynch
http://blog.jmlynch.org/....nch.org
http://www.public.asu.edu/~jmlync....jmlynch

   
Louis



Posts: 6436
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: June 24 2009,15:10   

I read it.

Mr Palm, meet Mr Face.

Louis

--------------
Bye.

  
Schroedinger's Dog



Posts: 1692
Joined: Jan. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: June 24 2009,15:15   

Read it too, but then I decided to make a wiki search on Pearcey and after a few external link clicks, I found myself on PT, then in the comments on PT I followed a link that made me end-up on...

...the discussion about religious indoctrination and child abuse right here at AtBC.

The Circle is now Closed!

--------------
"Hail is made out of water? Are you really that stupid?" Joe G

"I have a better suggestion, Kris. How about a game of hide and go fuck yourself instead." Louis

"The reason people use a crucifix against vampires is that vampires are allergic to bullshit" Richard Pryor

   
J-Dog



Posts: 4402
Joined: Dec. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: June 24 2009,16:58   

Quote (Schroedinger's Dog @ June 24 2009,15:15)
Read it too, but then I decided to make a wiki search on Pearcey and after a few external link clicks, I found myself on PT, then in the comments on PT I followed a link that made me end-up on...

...the discussion about religious indoctrination and child abuse right here at AtBC.

The Circle is now Closed!

Thankfully for us tard addicts however, the UD Circle Jerk is open 24/7.

--------------
Come on Tough Guy, do the little dance of ID impotence you do so well. - Louis to Joe G 2/10

Gullibility is not a virtue - Quidam on Dembski's belief in the Bible Code Faith Healers & ID 7/08

UD is an Unnatural Douchemagnet. - richardthughes 7/11

  
Glen Davidson



Posts: 1014
Joined: May 2006

(Permalink) Posted: June 25 2009,15:37   

I didn't know where to put this response to Klinghoffer that I made and that he hasn't yet deigned to approve, although he still could. I thought where another of his articles was linked might be best:

 
Quote
What Klinghoffer wrote:
 
Quote
However, conducting the scientific debate per se on evolution is not what I do. I would have thought that was obvious. There are ample resources out there on the subject -- for example, Stephen Meyer's very important new book, published literally yesterday: Signature in the Cell: DNA and the Evidence for Intelligent Design.


If anyone wants to see how "very important" Meyer's rehash of old and useless "ID arguments" is, here's a preview:

http://browseinside.harpercollins.com/index.a...._061809

Needless to say, it's underwhelming. It's a long dreary story of how he came up with his "new argument" (DNA's complex, so god did it) for ID, complete with the usual false claims about ID, and the false dichotomy that if evolution didn't do it, god did, never mind the lack of any indications for intelligent design. He doesn't even bring up actual evidence for "intelligent design," merely relying on the old anthropocentric fallacy of assuming that functionality is design, or at least that it "looks like" design. From p. 12:

Quote
...Natural selection..., a purely undirected process that nevertheless mimicked the powers of a designing intelligence.


That is exactly the kind of nonsense that we're always getting from these clowns, mainly because they either are too ignorant to face the rather large differences between design, or they know better than to do so, and wish to simply conflate evolutionary effects with "design effects," the better to ignore the crucial evidence for evolution that design never has explained at all.

Evolution can't possibly mimic what design can do. It can't pick the best materials for a purpose, it can't come up with truly novel characteristics in organisms, it can't make the rational leaps that designers routinely effect, and so it can't produce a steam engine or a decent wheel. Evolution can't smelt metals, use fire, make rockets, or make vertebrate wings out of anything but terrestrial limbs.

Meyer has no interest in dealing with the real issues, in other words. Indeed, most of his polemic is aimed at the origin of life, and of the genetic code. Is the latter a largely unexplained matter in evolution? I believe it is, although there are hints in life of a time in which the code was not so rigidly followed, and in fact it may be that a number of evolutionary events needed a less rigid code. But then does Meyer explain how and why additional (apparently later evolved) amino acids, like pyrrolysine, co-opt a stop codon for coding?

No, apparently not. It's not interesting, he just wants to say that if events happening perhaps billions of years ago are not explained, then evolution falls apart. He needn't explain what evolutionary theory does, goddidit is all the "explanation" that is needed. Evidence for design isn't needed, because life "looks designed," something that even many ancients didn't believe--hence the magical and reproductive myths accounting for what was decidedly unmachinelike.

He writes very misleading junk like this (p. 396--context complicates this, but I don't want to write it all out):

Quote
...[Critics] do not [typically] dispute that DNA contains specified information, or that this type of information always comes from a mind...


They likely would, if Meyer wasn't simply begging the question by assuming exactly what he needs to prove. And of course many do disagree with it strenuously and with evidence, but he's not going to address those matters, just the "critics" he's blabbing to usually don't know enough to do more than to invoke authorities.

And from the same paragraph (p. 397):

Quote
Nor do they even dispute my characterization of the historical scientific method or that I followed it in formulating my case for intelligent design as the best explanation for the evidence.


Again, of course, he's still writing about critics selected for their lack of addressing the issues minutely and in detail (in talks, not in writing where his egregious claptrap is well demonstrated to be nonsense). But of course he didn't in the slightest follow proper scientific procedure of carefully matching up identifiable cause with identifiable effect, he simply used the false dilemma of "if evolution hasn't explained it, god did it."

By the way, he often uses Dembski as a reliable source, when his pseudoscientific writings have been thoroughly skewered. Most notably, because Dembski doesn't rely upon empirical data for his calculations, and he insists upon very specific targets in evolution. The fact that he calls what is simple, "complexity," obviously is meant to conflate our often simple creations with the very complex and undesign-like structures of life, and is an egregious misuse of language.

As far as I can tell, from the limited text and the index, he does not come up with even the usual ridiculous claims of "falsifiability" of ID that Cornelius Hunter promised (if not with those denotations and connotations). Apparently the naive conflation of functionality and design that many have made is enough "evidence" of design for Meyer, and he doesn't need to do the science needed to actually shore up his claims.

Well, those were the most obvious inanities, fallacies, and unsound reasoning that I saw in the preview. It's the usual bit of nonsense coming from the DI people, barely different from the worthless propaganda that we've already seen.

Glen Davidson


--------------
http://tinyurl.com/mxaa3p....p

Nothing in biology makes sense except in the light of coincidence---ID philosophy

   
Lou FCD



Posts: 5402
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: June 25 2009,15:58   

Quote (darwinoid @ June 24 2009,14:58)
always a pleasure to make folks aware of the, ahem, joy that is Pearcey. She's a DI/CSC fellow, of course.

colormeshocked.

noreally.

--------------
Lou FCD is still in school, so we should only count him as a baby biologist. -carlsonjok -deprecated
I think I might love you. Don't tell Deadman -Wolfhound

Work-friendly photography
NSFW photography

   
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