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  Topic: Wouldn't it be nice if......, Having fun with creationists< Next Oldest | Next Newest >  
Peter Henderson



Posts: 298
Joined: Aug. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: May 03 2009,15:44   

.....The 1,000,000th visitor to the creation museum was someone from the Panda's thumb. Ham is bumbing today about the 700,000th visitor to his anti-science museum:

http://blogs.answersingenesis.org/aroundt....isitors

 
Quote
As Dave and Colleen Bishop and their granddaughter Katelyn from Grand Rapids, Michigan, came through the Creation Museum entrance doors yesterday, they were greeted by our Director of Museum Operations, Dan Mangus, and congratulated for being the 700,000th visitors since opening 23 months ago.  Mally and I were waiting for these special guests and had our photos taken with them at our Photo FX booth.


It would be ironic (and embarrassing) for Mr. Ham if the 1000,000th visitor were either PZ Meyers or Genie Scott. I wonder how this could be arranged ? It might cost a bit of money but it would be worth it to see the look on his face !

  
Erasmus, FCD



Posts: 6349
Joined: June 2007

(Permalink) Posted: May 03 2009,16:01   

anyone have a mole in the museum?

someone in the head counting office?  this would be great.  i vote we send Louis

--------------
You're obviously illiterate as hell. Peach, bro.-FtK

Finding something hard to believe based on the evidence, is science.-JoeG

the odds of getting some loathsome taint are low-- Gordon E Mullings Manjack Heights Montserrat

I work on molecular systems with pathway charts and such.-Giggles

  
gene



Posts: 2
Joined: May 2009

(Permalink) Posted: May 15 2009,07:32   

I have some questions regarding evolution:

How does evolution explain the development of the reproduction process?  In other words, how is it that life evolved into male and female genders?   It seems that the evolutionary process would have to have occurred twice simultaneously in order to produce  male and  female counterparts for procreation to go forth.   How is this process explained?

Thanks for your help,
Gene

  
jeannot



Posts: 1200
Joined: Jan. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 15 2009,09:35   

Well, this is off topic but I recall that anisogamy (different sizes of gametes), is not unlikely at all. In fact, it has evolved several times.

You could probably search for "evolution of anisogamy".

  
gene



Posts: 2
Joined: May 2009

(Permalink) Posted: May 15 2009,10:22   

Thanks, and I will research evolution of "anisogamy" this evening.   Say, can you tell me who to direct my questions too regarding the evolutionary theory and its processes?    I have numerous questions and would like to find someone to whom I can direct my questions of interest.

Thanks,
Gene[I]

  
ppb



Posts: 325
Joined: Dec. 2006

(Permalink) Posted: May 15 2009,10:29   

Quote (gene @ May 15 2009,08:32)
I have some questions regarding evolution:

How does evolution explain the development of the reproduction process?  In other words, how is it that life evolved into male and female genders?   It seems that the evolutionary process would have to have occurred twice simultaneously in order to produce  male and  female counterparts for procreation to go forth.   How is this process explained?

Thanks for your help,
Gene

Gene,
This is a bit off topic, but here goes.

The short answer is, it didn't happen the way you are describing, with a male and female suddenly appearing in one shot.  Sexual reproduction is a very complicated business, with many variations.  Some species have multiple ways of reproducing.  Bacteria can swap genetic material. Many other organisms are hermaphroditic, having both male and female parts, like snails.  Others can change gender as needed.  Arriving at the male/female arrangement would have occurred after passing through some intermediate phases.

Think of it as crossing a wide river.  You wouldn't get across in one big jump.  You would do it in small steps, using stepping stones, a little at a time.  Evolution works by small variations over time.

The origin of sexual reproduction goes way back in time, so it is still an area of uncertainty.  There are however a number of theories.  You can Google "evolution of sexual reproduction" and get a lot of information on the subject.  Here's one place to start: Evolution of Sexual Reproduction.

I am not an expert on the subject, so I welcome any corrections anyone wants to make.

--------------
"[A scientific theory] describes Nature as absurd from the point of view of common sense. And it agrees fully with experiment. So I hope you can accept Nature as She is - absurd."
- Richard P. Feynman

  
Albatrossity2



Posts: 2780
Joined: Mar. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: May 15 2009,10:43   

Quote (gene @ May 15 2009,07:32)
I have some questions regarding evolution:

How does evolution explain the development of the reproduction process?  In other words, how is it that life evolved into male and female genders?   It seems that the evolutionary process would have to have occurred twice simultaneously in order to produce  male and  female counterparts for procreation to go forth.   How is this process explained?

Thanks for your help,
Gene

I'd start with John Maynard Smith's "Evolution of Sex". It's 30 years old, but I recall from reading it as a post-doc that it covers the ground fairly well. There may be a newer version of this book as well, but the old classic should still get you started.

Additionally, I'd caution you against making anthropogenic assumptions. Even bacteria and fungi have sex, but not "genders". The real hurdle to understanding the evolution of sex in eukaryotes, as I recall, was trying to understand the evolution of meiosis, which is required in order to produce haploid gametes. There is almost certainly more known about that now than was known in the late 1970's!

Happy reading!

--------------
Flesh of the sky, child of the sky, the mind
Has been obligated from the beginning
To create an ordered universe
As the only possible proof of its own inheritance.
                        - Pattiann Rogers

   
Schroedinger's Dog



Posts: 1692
Joined: Jan. 2009

(Permalink) Posted: May 15 2009,12:12   

Quote (Albatrossity2 @ May 15 2009,17:43)
Quote (gene @ May 15 2009,07:32)
I have some questions regarding evolution:

How does evolution explain the development of the reproduction process?  In other words, how is it that life evolved into male and female genders?   It seems that the evolutionary process would have to have occurred twice simultaneously in order to produce  male and  female counterparts for procreation to go forth.   How is this process explained?

Thanks for your help,
Gene

I'd start with John Maynard Smith's "Evolution of Sex". It's 30 years old, but I recall from reading it as a post-doc that it covers the ground fairly well. There may be a newer version of this book as well, but the old classic should still get you started.

Additionally, I'd caution you against making anthropogenic assumptions. Even bacteria and fungi have sex, but not "genders". The real hurdle to understanding the evolution of sex in eukaryotes, as I recall, was trying to understand the evolution of meiosis, which is required in order to produce haploid gametes. There is almost certainly more known about that now than was known in the late 1970's!

Happy reading!

Ok guys, don't break the line. I feel like we've got a good catch. Let's prepare the net and open a new topic, just in case...

Without Denial or FTK, we need to prep our godbaits...

"Let's put some shrimps on the barbie!" - Yoda, probably

--------------
"Hail is made out of water? Are you really that stupid?" Joe G

"I have a better suggestion, Kris. How about a game of hide and go fuck yourself instead." Louis

"The reason people use a crucifix against vampires is that vampires are allergic to bullshit" Richard Pryor

   
Peter Henderson



Posts: 298
Joined: Aug. 2007

(Permalink) Posted: May 16 2009,11:23   

This has been discovered recently:

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news....re.html

Quote
Save the males? Too late for Mycocepurus smithii (pictured).

This leaf-cutter ant species is all female and thrives without sex of any kind—ever—according to a new study. The ants have evolved to reproduce only when queens clone themselves.

"They appear to have evolved a new mode of reproduction, and the genetic mechanisms have yet to be worked out," said lead study author Anna Himler, a research associate at the University of Arizona.

In M. smithii the typical muscular reproductive organ of female ants has evolved into a "sort of a ghost of an organ at this point," Himler added.

No male of the species has ever been found, and "even if a male were theoretically to appear somewhere, we're not sure they could mate any more," she said.


Quote
M. smithii also has an idiosyncratic arrangement for that other apparent necessity: food. The ants, which range from northern Mexico to Argentina, are in a codependent relationship with a specific fungus.

"The fungus garden is quite wimpy," Himler said. "If you remove the ants, the gardens will quickly die."

The ants keep the gardens weeded, and they "feed" the fungus leaf bits, insect carcasses, and feces, which the ants clean and cut up before offering to the fungus. In return, the fungus provides the sole source of food for the ants' babies.

  
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