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Date: 2010/11/03 13:28:48, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote
Rather than engage in discussion, creationists run away, The Flounce, when backed into a corner.  How many times have we seen that around here, a thousand?  That's why it's so maddening.  These are not reasonable people.


Alas, yes.  When we defeat them in detail, they move the goalposts.  When we defeat them on the merits, they dodge the issue.  And when we finally throw up our hands in exasperation, they claim that we cannot answer their poorly formed and incoherent objections...

Our special friend, the topic of this thread, has often brought to mind a painting I saw in Beijing.  It showed Confucius and a goose looking at each other--the philosopher had a weary expression of disdain on his face, and the bird looked as puzzled as any other goose.  Our guide explained that this was an illustration for a maxim that may be freely translated as 'not every student can be taught'.

The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/11/03 14:07:43, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
He's not posting at the moment.  Confirmation or refutation may have to wait a few hours.

Although I can think of another reason why he might not be coming here!  The rules of this board do rule out some of his favorite tricks.

The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/11/03 14:21:51, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Almost certainly the truth.   :p

One wonders what he'll attempt next.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/11/03 18:44:12, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (prong_hunter @ Nov. 03 2010,18:34)
Matt Young answered on PT, when asked, "Do you have the ability to see if Flipper is another incarnation of IBelieveInGod?"

"Different e-mail address, different IP address, for whatever that is worth."

Thanks Matt.


Be that as it may, the tone and general attitude appear to be quite similar, so we could expect a similar pleasant experience trying to deal with this individual.

We'll need to run more tests.  Igor!  Fetch me my lightning-proof suit and warm up The Machine!

:p


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/11/03 18:56:39, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Wait...what?

Color this little rusty red chomper on bamboo truly and thoroughly puzzled. :O  That's worse than merely pointless.  That's absurd.

Oh, wait.  I forget who we're talking about, here.

(pause, looks around sheepishly)

This is the right room for an argument, yes?  'Cause the blond guy in the other room who looks just like Graham Chapman was a bit rude.

:)


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/11/03 19:06:34, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (OgreMkV @ Nov. 03 2010,18:49)
Keep trying to redirect here.

Done!  Although I see you beat me to it.  ???

I would like to think I was sufficiently polite about it...


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/11/03 19:25:46, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Alas, yes.

And now I have an old childhood memory stuck in my mind's eye: Les Lye, from You Can't Do That On Television, clutching his head and asking "where does the school board find them, and why do they send them here" in response to the kids' antics.

At the time, I thought that was pretty funny.  But then, at that time, all the jokes in Zorro the Gay Blade went whirring cheerfully way over my head.

The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/11/03 19:58:04, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
You, too?   :D

The ep where poor Moose got stuck behind nothing but a cue card at the very end because they'd bottomed out the wardrobe budget was particularly interesting.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/11/03 20:15:59, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote
#@$# #@@))#@ @#(&$@#  @#*@ #@*#  @#**#@)


I know that sentiment only too well. :(   There's a reason I was part of the annual brain drain from a lovely hole in the Twenty-first Century called Idaho not long after graduating from my alma mater.

Best of luck down there!


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/11/04 17:37:31, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Biggy finally found us.  Ogre, I owe you twenty spacebucks for lunch, gas, and tolls.

Quoting scripture apropos of nothing does not a valid point make, nor does it render an argument solid on the merits.  Quite the opposite.


Get back to us after you've read and understood at least two of the Gnostic Gospels and either the Analects of Confucius or the Tao Te Ching.  Then we'll talk.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/11/04 17:47:57, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Their culpability in this matter has already been established, if you were honestly paying attention.  Why do you continue making bald excuses for dishonest scholarship?

Your question about absolutes has also been answered, repeatedly and at length, by people who understand the entire matter far better than you do.  There is a fundamental (hah!;) error in your reasoning, which has also been pointed out to you.  (There is an even deeper problem with your question, but you are left to puzzle that out for yourself, if you are capable of doing so.)

Are you incapable of paying attention, or does your paycheck depend on your not acknowledging the facts in these matters?

The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/11/04 17:55:15, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote
It does not lead to a false conclusion. It is your claim that it leads to a false conclusion. Why do you think it leads to a false conclusion, give specifics?


Already been done.  Repeatedly.  But you weren't paying attention the first five times.

Why do you ask such silly questions if you aren't going to hold still for the answers?

The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/11/04 18:05:17, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (IBelieveInGod @ Nov. 04 2010,17:58)
Quote (MadPanda @ FCD,Nov. 04 2010,17:47)
Their culpability in this matter has already been established, if you were honestly paying attention.  Why do you continue making bald excuses for dishonest scholarship?

Your question about absolutes has also been answered, repeatedly and at length, by people who understand the entire matter far better than you do.  There is a fundamental (hah!) error in your reasoning, which has also been pointed out to you.  (There is an even deeper problem with your question, but you are left to puzzle that out for yourself, if you are capable of doing so.)

Are you incapable of paying attention, or does your paycheck depend on your not acknowledging the facts in these matters?

The MadPanda, FCD

Blah Blah Blah....everybody understands everything better then me...I've already heard that many times on PT:)

You are the ones that are arguing as though there are absolutes, yet you don't even accept that such absolutes even exist:) Sorry, but it is irrational for you to argue anything, because if absolutes don't exist, then nothing could be said to be right, and nothing could be said to be wrong.

Quote
everybody understands everything better then me...I've already heard that many times on PT


And you'd better be prepared to hear it many, many times here as well, unless you present plenty of evidence that you actually do pay attention to and understand the answers you get.

Have you put your brain to work on the flaw in your question about absolutes, yet?  Or gotten ahold of anything by Kant?  You have some remedial reading ahead of you if you want to be taken seriously.

The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/11/04 18:06:33, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Accursed quote failure!  This system shall take some time to become second nature...

The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/11/04 18:12:39, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote
Are there any square circles?:)


Do you know why the answer to this question is what it is?  

Do you understand why this is not an intelligent question to ask?

Are you going to engage in any conversation here with the intellectual honesty your entire discourse from the Bathroom Wall lacked?


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/11/04 19:39:53, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote
I'm asking to see if you believe in absolutes or not. If there were no such thing as a square circle, then that would be an example of one absolute now wouldn't it.

Now let me ask you this, is the earth really a cube?


Obviously, your answers to my three questions are 'no', 'no', and 'no'.

Go look up the word 'absolute' in a dictionary.  I'll wait.  There you will note, if you are paying attention to the details, that there are several different meanings of the adjective in question, all of which you are conflating.  (There is an application of the word as a noun, but it's a touch tautological.)

You are also conflating two different meanings of 'believe' in the process.

You're playing sophomoric semantic games while pretending to be clever.  Unfortunately for you, Alcibiades, we know this particular shtick.

The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/11/04 22:15:36, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
[quote=OgreMkV,Nov. 04 2010,22:03][/quote]
Quote
Arguably, "open to interpretation" does not equal "errors", but you'd think that The Word Of God would at least not be vague.

Just think, thousands of CHRISTIANS have been killing each other over interpretations of The Bible.

And he says we're nuts...


That's it exactly, Blackadder!  Why, it's not only plainly obvious that there is no questioning scripture, it's equally plain and obvious that only some bits are truly infallible and without error...while others are equally and plainly meant to be taken as merely colorful stories.

All the spilled blood over the centuries is merely misguided squabbling about which bits are which and whose interpretation is the right one.  Merely an unfortunate set of details.  When in fact, the truth is so plain and obvious!  Plainly.  And Obviously.  No True Believer would ever do anything so misguided as to kill anyone over a simple misinterpretation unless of course it were to be divinely ordered...

Plain and obvious.  Can't argue with that, now, can we?

The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/11/05 12:06:38, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
[quote=IBelieveInGod,Nov. 05 2010,09:43]
Quote
I don't know what happen millions of years ago, it would be speculation for me to say. I do know someone who does know though, and one day I will know exactly what happened. But, for the time being nobody knows and nobody will know in this lifetime.


You may wish to go doublecheck the definition of the word 'knowledge' when you look up 'absolute'.  What you have is not knowledge in any meaningful sense: what you have is opinion, learned by rote and unsupported by any actual evidence.  (It is, in fact, naught but supposition for you to speak of the En-Sof in any terms whatsoever, but I'll let you go do your homework to discover the reasons why...if you are capable of doing so.)

This has been pointed out to you before, and you've ignored it completely.

Now, about those rural spinsters murdered by your co-believers...

The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/11/05 12:27:12, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Occam's Aftershave @ Nov. 05 2010,11:29)
 
Quote (Wolfhound @ Nov. 05 2010,11:19)
     
Quote (Joe G @ Nov. 05 2010,07:45)
wolfie ain't no lady andy are an ignorant punk.

Alack and alas!  He hath wounded me unto the very heart!  My dreams of our torrid love affair have been ground to dust, unrealized.  <*sob*>  Cruel, cruel man to have dashed my hopes so cruelly! <*looks for fainting couch*>

Joe G "I'll show you what a real man is Wolfie.  How'd you like nine hard inches?'

Wolfhound "There's no way you can get it up three times."

Dear Sir (and Ms.)

Please find enclosed bill for repair of one (1) computer monitor, which was working perfectly until your combined witticisms caused our client to snort coffee all over it.

Insincerely yours,
Smaug, Senior Partner

Smaug, Fafner, Orochi, Dragons at Law


:D  :D  :D  :D  :D  :D


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/11/05 14:20:39, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
It isn't exactly our back yard, but we gots a squirrel that likes to hang off the suet feeder mounted on the deck railing, James Bond style.  Drives the cats stark raving bonkers.

Or maybe it's more than one squirrel, given how fast the suet is vanishing.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/11/05 19:05:14, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (sledgehammer @ Nov. 05 2010,18:17)
 
Quote (Reciprocating Bill @ Nov. 05 2010,15:38)
     
Quote (Richardthughes @ Nov. 05 2010,17:43)
     
Quote (JohnW @ Nov. 05 2010,16:41)
       
Quote (Richardthughes @ Nov. 05 2010,14:21)
       
Quote (JohnW @ Nov. 05 2010,16:15)
         
Quote (Richardthughes @ Nov. 05 2010,13:51)
         
Quote (OgreMkV @ Nov. 05 2010,15:46)
           
Quote (Richardthughes @ Nov. 05 2010,15:33)
           
Quote (JohnW @ Nov. 05 2010,13:11)
             
Quote (Joe G @ Nov. 05 2010,04:42)
Wrong again occam's afterbirth- the assumed words are still there- meaning the one-wrod sentences are not one-word.

Bollocks.

Agreed.

You!

What?

Ha!

Really?

Perhaps.

Aw....

Shit!

Word!

D'OH!

The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/11/06 00:42:02, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Yeah, Khan.  More or less just like that...but yours is a LOT more daring than ours.  Or maybe our suet feeder just doesn't allow for that sort of gravity denying hang time...

The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/11/11 16:49:58, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Awwwww, did he leave?  And we were going to crown him King of the Winter Carnival, too...(/Val Kilmer)

Eh bien.

Perhaps Biggy is simply taking a little time off, hoping that absence will make us fonder of him.   :p  Given the paucity of the arguments that seemed to impress our missing friend, it would not surprise me to find that such a thought had bubbled to the surface of his cranial cauldron.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/11/11 16:57:35, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Wolfhound, may I offer you the loan of a Cattleprod +1 +3 vs Annoyances?  Mine runs off of a car battery...

The MadPanda, FCD

:D  :p

Date: 2010/11/11 17:02:34, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Many happy returns!

The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/11/11 17:04:26, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Many happy returns!

And an extra pint or five.

The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/11/11 17:11:58, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
You almost lost your virginity on a fig?  (blinka blinka)  There isn't a lot of room on top of one of those things...

:D


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/11/11 17:45:06, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote
Hyprocrite - evil, wicked hypocrite.


What?  Ken Ham might not have the integrity and intellectual honesty to act in good faith on such a matter?  I am shocked. Shocked, I tell you.

Why, next you'll tell me that Biggy blithely ignored a ton of meaningful, content-laden responses to his...oh, yeah.  But I bet he never lied!  Oh, wait.  Uhm.  Surely he didn't excuse all manner of horrible acts simply because someone...

Awww, maaaaan.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/11/11 17:50:31, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
An update: the little blighter has actually managed to bust the suet feeder!  Or at least the added weight of one well-fed squirrel has caused the wire hanger to bend out of shape, leaving the feeder handing somewhat precariously from the stand.

The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/11/12 14:06:10, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Pardonnez-moi but...the prize is a lack of a Dembski sweater?  (blinka blinka)

Oh.  Right.  Fashion statement alert.  The things I miss by very carefully avoiding any and all photographic or video presentations by the Dembski.

:D

For a moment there I was hoping this was a clever variation on a Calabi-Yau topological manifold or a Klien bottle or a Mobius loop something.  (I am not up on the math, but darn, do they ever look neat!;)


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/11/18 12:53:17, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Bravo, Louis!

Imma put this in a file next to Dr. Lenski's retort to a certain other knucklehead who was "just askin' questions, man" as an example of relative diplomacy in the face of unrelenting willful ignorance.

Alas, I would have used far more of Brother William's seven classic four letter words and thus fueled someone's Worm Bucket*.

The MadPanda, FCD



* in reference to a campground song that goes something like 'nobody likes me / everybody hates me / I'm going to the garden / to eat worms'

Date: 2010/11/18 13:03:18, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Heartiest of congratulations to the whole clan!


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/11/18 13:14:30, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Ooo, ooo, do I get to go all Umberto Eco on him?  Can I?  Can I?  Can I?

Does anyone know what Joey's point is, other than he thinks he can cast aspersions...pardonnez-moi, assertions upon the waters, never provide the wondrous and copious evidence behind them that would surely revolutionize our understanding, and not be mocked for it?  Does he actually have a point?  Is there anything behind the snark?

His choice of avatar may be most apt.  It brings to mind a rather interesting polemic entitled (IIRC) The Captain America Complex, which dealt with zeal in American foreign policy.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/11/21 16:30:46, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote
Dang, the dude is on a roll... or at least a biscuit.


Mais pas de croissant.  He'd insist on having a Freedom Bun instead.  (eyeroll)

When my Cub is old enough to worry about such matters, I shall definitely have to reference the Joey--any and all candidates for significant other must exceed him in reading comprehension and logic.

No, you're right.  I must set the bar higher...

The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/11/21 16:43:06, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Point taken.

:D


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/11/21 16:50:19, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
You make that sound like an achievement...which it is, perhaps, in the same sense as being a common courtesan in the House of Lycus.

Did a funny thing happen on the way to the online forum?

:D

The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/11/21 16:58:37, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Wait...what?

He's not even doing it wrong.  That there is some weapons-grade ignorance.

If you'd like a few words, I doubt the Bard would mind if you borrowed his seven classic four-letter list...   :)


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/11/24 00:02:58, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quoth the carlsonjok:
Quote
What I don't get is if Joe is not religious, as he is quick to tell, why is he so invested in a global flood?


And then didymos added:
 
Quote
He's also got a real thing for baraminology.  But, you know, he's no creationist. No siree!


Gentlebeings, 'tis simple.  Joey is not religious.  What he has is a deep and meaningful personal relationship with an undefinable, invisible, amorphous entity that conjured up the whole of the multiverse last Thursday before teatime.  That this leads him to voice conclusions that look embarrassingly like the religious dogma of various other people who Are Not As Smart As Joey is completely coincidental.

Completely and utterly.

It's just one of those things.  Like alchemy.  Or Zaphod Beeblebrox.


:D


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/11/30 20:45:58, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Color me one stunned eater of bamboo: he's got nothing coherent but insults, and not even particularly creative insults at that.


For those of you who actually visit this person's little corner of cyberspace, I thank you from the bottom of my furry heart for your sacrifice.


Joe, you probably don't care one whit for the opinion of a complete stranger, but I gotta tell you, son, you don't come across as someone who knows the material, understands the field, or is capable of having a rational discussion about it.  In fact, you come across like a strong argument against the side to which you cling limpet-like in the face of contrary evidence.


It would help if instead of merely asserting (for example) that you've read the papers suggested and that they don't say what they're supposed to say...but were also capable of explaining when asked to do so where the papers fall down and why, without also stooping to the sort of language that gives the likes of Mooney and Nisbet conniptions.


As it is, you appear to have nothing but urine, wind, and vinegar to help make your case.  That may work with your echo chamber peanut gallery on your blog, sir, but it doesn't fly out nearly so well out here in the wild.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/01 09:56:18, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
A brilliant suggestion, O Hermagoras!  But it might make Joey feel a little more secure if you wrote yours in Elizabethan Modern English for that King James Version feel of things.  (Attempting to put it all in iambic pentameter would be silly.  Cool, but silly.)


:D


Alas, given that his likely response to your efforts would be to claim it insufficient without actually reading for comprehension, this would be a waste of bandwidth and time.  :(   Not every student can be taught...


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/01 11:30:33, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Leaflet bombing.  Demotivational posters.  Bumper stickers and tee shirts.  And if those doesn't work, we pull out the stops and surround them en masse singing Imagine off key to the plunking of improperly tuned guitars.

No?

Nuts.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/02 18:53:56, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quoth Little Joey, in response to something I said in his general direction:

Quote
Nice projection...


Truly, sirrah, you have a dizzying intellect.

This is your 'A' game, I take it?


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/02 20:46:15, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Joe G @ Dec. 02 2010,19:01)
 
Quote (olegt @ Dec. 02 2010,17:28)
Hermagoras,

Reasoning with Joe is a waste of time.

You can't be reasonable.

That's the problem right there.

What was that about projection, Joey?

Since I don't visit your blog, I only have the ample record you have presented here by which to assess your character or lack thereof.  And brother, you do a good job of selling the opposition's points for them.


Let me repeat that, in case your reading comprehension is for some reason not up to snuff: I don't read your blog.  I can only measure you by your comments here.  Those?  Do not make you look reasonable.  Quite the opposite.


But then, I also get the impression that your only reason for visiting here is to be the biggest jerk you can be out of some masochistic desire to rack up some martyr cred from some other ignoramuses when you are finally invited to take your tripe elsewhere.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/14 23:52:55, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Remember how that word 'projection' comes up every now and again, Joey?

Quote
That is the point. You don't hveay positive evidence for your position. All you can do is attack anyone and everyone who questions you...I just come here to stir the pot and to witness the fact that you asshioles still have nothing a you are proud of it.


Spell check is your friend.  Grammar check, also.  Checking your logic and attitude...there is not yet an app for that, but perhaps you ought to invest.

In the meantime, instead of slinging insults and invective, if you actually have some positive evidence, perhaps you might earn yourself a little more respect by actually posting it here, where it can be evaluated by people who have no interest in visiting your little blog.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/15 00:34:08, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Well, nuts.

I get distracted by my Cub's birthday, forget to log on, and I miss the celebration!

Many happy if belated returns, Wolfhound!


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/15 00:59:15, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Argh!  Yet more b-days I missed by being too busy IRL to log in...

Many happy (belated) returns to you both!


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/16 16:14:16, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Louis @ Dec. 15 2010,03:50)
Quote (MadPanda @ FCD,Dec. 15 2010,05:52)
[SNIP]

In the meantime, instead of slinging insults and invective, i

[SNIP]

Awwwww don't take that away from him, it's all he's got! ;-)

Louis

Quote
Awwwww don't take that away from him, it's all he's got! ;-)

Louis


Point taken.  Yet I remain optimistic that some day soon little Joey will realize that the only thing he's succeeded in doing is looking like a very spoiled little brat with a dirty mouth.

Of course, this would require that he had a working conscience (which may assume facts not in evidence) and enough self-awareness to realize that we're not laughing with him so much as at him (also may assume facts not in evidence).

Actually...perhaps someone else can explain Joe's point to me*?  Because I cannot for the life of my ever-lovin' bamboo snack chips what he thinks he's proving by this constant verbal vomiting forth of foul language, non-sequiturs, and bald assertions and I have no intention of visiting his blog to find out.

*  Assuming that he does, in fact, have a point in the first place, which may be overly generous on my part.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/19 13:39:37, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
I am quite afraid, O Cybertankish One, that Joey will no doubt hide behind Behe's skirts and claim that he, like Dembski, need not descend to our pitiful level of detail.


The gods are kind: they have made our foes ridiculous.  


The MadPanda, FCD :p  :p

Date: 2010/12/19 16:58:28, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Biggy just resurfaced over on Panda's Thumb, and of course he claims he took a little vacation from that site because the regulars were so mean to him (read: he ran away because he got his hide well tanned).

Lay you eight to five he won't bother to show up here.

Of course, I'm certainly not helping, since I greet him point blank with an honest assessment of his intellectual capacity... :p


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/19 17:01:07, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
And, oddly enough, they like to whine about how awful 'moral relativism' is, and how only their Absolute Truth (tm pat pend) is the one and only Right Way To Live, even as they honor it more by breach than observance.

I roll my eyes in their general direction.

The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/19 17:19:56, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Frankly?

Yes.  Yes, it is.  With sprinkles, even.

I admit it openly.  Just as I have been pulling my punches with another moron, not that they seems to appreciate the extra benefit of the doubt I've given them.

Biggy does not deserve the full eloquence of what wordsmithery I can summon when properly motivated.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/19 19:08:35, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
That was actually a misquote: it wasn't a dirty limerick.

I was quoting Cyrano de Bergerac at length, and the poor drunken fool thought to come after me with a blunt sonnet in the Italian vein.  So of course I had to resort to an unfortunate excess of e e cummings in self defense.  Nobody was killed, but the other fellow had to have fifteen stitches.

Since, at the time, I was dating someone who liked to improvise Gilbert and Sullivan patter-songs, it could have been far worse.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/19 22:51:06, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Stanton, I must regrettably admit that I missed that episode, and also that my curiosity is piqued.  I shall have to go a-hunting for it, now.  Or just put Muppet Show DVDs on my wish list.

IRT our dear friend with the reading comprehension problem, Biggy, I have a feeling that he'll take my jesting proposal to start running practical experiments in maleficium seriously.  Unfortunately, even though it would be for posterity, I doubt he'd honestly report any little aches, pains, or mishaps that follow...   :D

Dumber than advertised, that boy.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/20 11:13:02, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Just so!  Not that he'll have the guts to come over here, the poltroon...it's too scary!  We've read, like, books and stuff!

:p


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/20 11:18:34, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Oh, I get it.  Joey's doing the Full Humpty-Dumpty, is he?  Then someone ought to go Red Queen on his dishonest, cowardly hide.

Alas, he wouldn't learn a damn thing.  Worse, he seems awful proud of his little cognitive incapacity.  Or so I gather from what he posts here.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/20 15:18:25, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Stanton @ Dec. 20 2010,13:10)
Well, I reminded the nitwit of his cowardliness here, and, Mad, Gilda's Fiasco

Thanks, Stanton!  A little Muppetry always makes my day brighter.  Even better than listening to Biggy whimper like a flensed spleen.

Just call me MP, please  :)   And no, nobody ever calls me MISTER Panda.

Date: 2010/12/21 11:13:19, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Well, now that Kris is being all Internet Tough Guy and answering comments aimed at Biggy (apparently on Biggy's behalf?) and squealing like a little brat who's been told that he can't have his dessert until after the liver and onions...

It's circumstantial, but Kris and Biggy seem to be each other's muppets*.  The wankery is getting deep, and in spite of Our Cybertank's firm invitation for them to come over here and face a more prepared audience, I have a deep suspicion that they'll both pull a Sir Robin while declaring victory.

(* Apologies to Kermit and associates for the unfortunate imagery, but I'm not feeling kind today.)

The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/21 22:43:29, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Stanton @ Dec. 20 2010,13:10)
Well, I reminded the nitwit of his cowardliness here, and, Mad, Gilda's Fiasco

I have now seen the seven foot tall talking Carrot of Penzance and...it was, in a nutshell, more intellectually fulfilling and enjoyable than anything Biggy (or Steve P., or Kris, or FL, or...) has ever typed over at PT.


Thanks for the link, Stanton!  Quite enjoyable.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/22 12:12:30, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Stanton @ Dec. 22 2010,00:41)
Oh, you root for anything.  What about the time you started up that torrid affair with that parsnip?

If you can't turnip any pics, it didn't happen.

The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/22 12:19:20, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
You forgot 'coward', Robin.

He oh so blissfully ignored Biggy's refusal to talk to him, which would seem to be a greater insult than inviting him to post over here, but apparently cutting him a little slack and giving him the benefit of the doubt (both of which I did, both of which he has utterly ignored in favor of shrieking harpy-like at the world) counts as a demonstration of hypocrisy.  He seems to have mistaken me for someone who has been calling for his banning and deletion.  Not sure what's up with that.

In other news, Biggy's finally decided to grace us with his presence, which I will openly admit I did not expect and wrongfully predicted would not occur.  Fair enough--he gets a point for intestinal fortitude.  Now let's see how long the courage of his convictions for perjury shall last...


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/22 12:33:59, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote
Any chance of that Douglas? Perhaps a follow up could be "How come everything seems like an ad-hoc collection of evolved bits that fit the bill at the time but some very specific proteins absolutely had to be the product of design".


Absolutely not!  Actually doing good work, showing it, and providing alternative answers that can be tested would be against his religion. (/Eddie Murphy)

:p

But of course it never hurts to ask.  ;)

The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/22 15:22:50, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Ah, I see someone is bearing false witness.

Gotta love these people!  So very post-modern about their own lofty ethical standards.

Go read a proper science textbook, Trollish One, and do not return until thou mayst honestly profess comprehension of the contents thereof.  Thou art worth but a paltry 845XP divided amongst the party.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/22 15:25:14, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
He's certainly off the table and into someone's pint of lager.  Rather a childish little tantrum he's thrown just now...


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/22 15:36:52, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
It's on Nick Matzke's Behe's Blinders thread, left at 2:53pm today.  Permit me to violate Diplomacy protocol and copy and paste thusly...


Quote
Kris replied to comment from Stanton | December 22, 2010 2:53 PM

Where did I ever say that I “insist on deliberately ignoring all of the Creationist trolls here, save to defend them whenever we point out their egregious abuses of logic?”

Where do you GET this CRAP?????

You and others really are clearly demonstrating what this site and most of the people here really are about. It’s ALL about hating and ranting about creationists. That’s the ONLY purpose here. Science has nothing to do with it. You’re as fundamentalist in your belief system as any creationists. The only difference between you and the people you hate is the name of your religion.

You EXPECT me to attack every creationist who posts here. Otherwise, I’m not ‘one of you’ and don’t belong here. You call them trolls just because they don’t agree with you. For all I know any creationist who posts here may be sincere in their beliefs and sincere in the statements or questions they post here. That doesn’t necessarily make them right or wrong but I don’t assume they’re here just to cause trouble. If they were to make it apparent to me that they’re here just for that reason I might be as likely as anyone to jump on them about it.

I’m not a mindless zombie who joins a gang just because the current members of the gang think I should or demand that I should. I make up my own mind about what people say and I don’t automatically think that they’re a ‘troll’ (the most overused word on the web) just because I don’t or may not agree with them.

You guys just really won’t understand or even try to understand that someone could possibly disagree with you, and you obviously believe that anyone who does must be here only to deliberately pick fights and cause trouble. You’re so entrenched in YOUR belief system that, to you, no other line of thought could possibly have merit or sincerity of any kind.

Yeah, some lines of thought by some people are really wacko, but you guys expect absolute, strict obedience and devotion to your exact line of thought, at all times and in all ways. No exceptions of any kind.

And anyone who doesn’t obey and devote themselves to your line of thought (your belief system) absolutely, positively MUST be a ‘creationist troll’ and an enemy of the state (or church, your church). Off with their heads!

I never would have thought that alleged scientists could think and behave the way most of you people do, until I spent some time here. What an eye opener. No wonder I prefer the company of butterflies over people.


He's not making any friends, that's for sure.

The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/22 18:05:38, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Thanks, prong_hunter, but in all honesty it's the other folks on your list that do the real heavy lifting.  I am but an interested amateur who sounds off from the peanut gallery when opportunity presents itself.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/22 22:47:28, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
That might be descending to our pitiful level of detail, RB.

The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/23 00:11:50, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Ooooo, I bet that left a mark!

:D


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/24 13:23:10, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Kris is certainly a bit full of himself.  He may not be Biggy's sock puppet, but he sure acts like Biggy's personal muppet...

(Yes, it's unkind.  I'm no longer feeling generous.)

He seems to divide his time between repeating creotard talking points and raging at others for being willing to do the dirty job of cleaning up after the likes of Biggy, FL, Joe-G, Steve P., and so forth.  And the longer he yaps, the more he sounds like a creotard, rather than the scientist he claims to be.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/24 22:00:08, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Merry Xmas, Oh Cybertank!  Congrats on the gift!  :D  Use it wisely, use it well...don't do what I would have tried when I was but a young and single Panda and try finding bikini-clad alien girls on the Moon or something equally silly.   :)

I will likely be deafened by the happy squeals come morning, when my Cub shall be racing about in glee, helpng everyone to unwrap their presents with the brutal efficiency of a small child.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/25 16:57:03, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Hmmm.  Beaucoup de Kris, pas de Joey-bebe.

If Kris is not Biggy's personal muppet, perhaps he is Joey's.  The sudden recourse to foul language absent any sufficient provocation seems telling.

Back to the experiments in applied maleficiam.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/26 00:41:08, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
You know those three little words with which I preface so many of my responses to Biggy?

Little Kris has decided to throw them back at me.  It's so cute when they try to act all macho and stuff...

So Kris is Joey's muppet, not Biggy's.  Okay, fair enough.  He's still a foul-mouthed twerp who only seems to be around to scream abuse and ask creotard talking points as if they have weight.  (Either that or he's the genuine article who lost his head, let his mouth run away from him, and has too much pride to fess up take his lumps.)

He also parrots Colin's failed attempts with a certain question IRT insects...which is even funnier.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/27 12:26:33, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Nice of you to drop your muppet, Joey.  Not that he'd have the courage to come here anyway...

ID is just a Trojan Horse version of creationism, full stop.  Protest as loud and as long as you like, but that's the plain and simple truth.  It's the proverbial warthog with a lot of lipstick.

You have nothing solid upon which to build a case.  Nobody in ID has a solid case.  They never will, because they aren't interested in doing the actual legwork and labwork required.  All they have is rhetoric.  I would go so far as to call them parasites, because they build their spin by leeching off of the hard work of actual scientists whose toil, effort, and discipline deserves more reward than being ganked by a bunch of spin doctors.

But go ahead and tell yourself that you know better than people who work with this stuff day in and day out.  Shriek as many insults as are needed to assuage your puny ego.  In the end, the only thing that matters is the evidence.

This may come as a shock to you, Joey, but there's this thing called the real world.  It's the bits of life that don't vanish when you stop believing in them.  Scientists work with it, not with circles in the sky and imaginary friends (yes, even those quantum physics types who are always on about uncertainty--they have the experiments to support their weirdness).


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/27 12:41:11, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Face it: we're dealing with someone who can't tell the difference between an evidence based statement that includes incredulity and the 'argument from incredulity' logical fallacy.

In fact, we're dealing with someone who can't tell the difference between a psychotic break and communion with his imaginary friend!  (Remember what he said he'd do if his god ordered it?)

I doubt he's even capable of having an intelligent and civil conversation over, say, whether or not the Analects of Confucius offer a superior moral and ethical model for society than Biggy's favorite magic book.  Not that utter ignorance of the Analects would stop him from spewing...


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/27 13:59:01, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Joey, ID is a straw man.  It has nothing behind it.  It's smoke and mirrors and wishful thinking all the way down.

There is nothing of substance to it.  It has no weight, no meat, no oomph.  It's all word games.

Let's be clear: verifiable evidence of a designer, be it someone's invisible friend or aliens, would be earth-shattering.  The discoverer would be assured not only of a Nobel (at the least) but also of everlasting fame among human scientists for overturning a huge amount of incredibly well supported work.  That nobody has yet to come forth with such an astounding find is telling.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/27 14:10:23, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Oooo, muppet man decided to insult!  Consider me surprised.  My baby sister can do better than that, and she does it in three languages.

Joey, just because you are ignorant of the history and evolution (hah!) of ID does not mean that it doesn't have a backstory.

Just because you lack the courage to read the Dover decision (which touched on some of that history in all it's loathesome glisten) and understand what happened does not mean that ID didn't score a major own-goal in the process.

You keep asserting that ID is real, but you have yet to provide any solid evidence.  Burden of proof is on the extraordinary claim, which at this point would be ID.  Pony up or leave the table, Joey.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/27 14:20:28, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (OgreMkV @ Dec. 27 2010,14:15)
Joe, as I've asked you for a thousand times... why don't you tell us EXACTLY, in great excruciating detail what ID is... and then stick with your definition.

Then we don't have to argue about what it is and what it isn't.

Go ahead, we'll wait, but we won't hold our breath.  You haven't posted it yet after months of asking for it.

He can't post what he doesn't have, I suppose.

Not that ignorance of a subject ever stops him.  It's a common failing.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/27 18:36:52, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
We should repost DS's list of questions as well, I suppose.  Not that Biggy has what it takes to handle them.

Biggy: living proof that duckspeaking* isn't just a verbal phenomenon.


The MadPanda, FCD



* Se habla newspeak.

Date: 2010/12/27 18:42:18, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Richardthughes @ Dec. 27 2010,15:28)
Thanks for your detailed and well thought out reply, that addresses specifically nothing I've written at all. Its hard to create a strawman of ID as it's proponentists aren't sure what it is either. When someone tries to clarify it, you're keen to point out "they don't speak for ID".


(light bulb flickers on)

Yegads, a new application of the No True Scotsman fallacy!

"No True ID-iot".

You can't make stuff this crazy up, I tell you...


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/27 18:50:09, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote
These are not answers to my questions. Are you having trouble reading? Please go back to Panda's Thumb and read my questions again. The questions I asked should be very rudimentary if evolution from common descent is to have any credibility. All of the things you posted have other explanations. So, answer the questions that I gave you, or just admit that you don't know.


Not so fast, buster!  You still have to answer ALL of DS's questions first.  You ran away from them a few months ago, but we haven't forgotten.  I would go so far as to ask why we should bother answering your questions when we already know that you will a) lie, b) dodge answers you don't like, c) change the rules if you start losing, and d) will not understand the answers you are given, but you finally had the intestinal fortitude to show up here so I'll leave those points for later.

You can throw your pity party here as well as at Panda's Thumb, and here you won't be off-topic.

You should provide actual evidence of alternative explanations as well, if you want such claims to be taken seriously.  And by evidence, we do not mean quoting your magic book, invoking your imaginary friend, anecdote, analogy, or hearsay.

Get to work.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/27 18:59:57, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote
You keep playing little games, so that you don't really have to answer these questions, but it won't work. If you can't answer these questions and provide real evidence and not conjecture, speculation, or presuppositions, then you have nothing.


This is exactly what we've been telling you all along, Biggy.  You have yet to demonstrate an understanding of this, let alone implement it yourself.

Your projection is amusing and your mingled cowardice and ignorance are pathetic.

Get to work on DS's questions or admit that you don't have the authority to demand such rigor.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/27 19:04:24, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
In that case, not only do we not have to take you seriously, you have no standing to complain about anything in science.  Your blithering idiocy remains underwhelming.

Since you won't have the courage or intellectual honesty to actually do any homework, here's the big list of questions posted by DS as of October 22, 2010.

Quote
1) Why do dolphins have five digits early in development if they do not have five digits as adults?

2) Why do dolphin embryos start out with the nostril on the front of the head if it is positioned on the top of the head in the adult?

3) Why do dolphin embryos have pharyngeal gill pouches if they lack gills as adults?

4) Why do dolphin embryos start to develop hind limbs if they do not have hind limbs as adults?

5) Why do horse embryos have five digits if they have only one as adults?

6) Why are there fossils intermediate between apes and humans?

7) How old is the earth? How do you know?

8) Why is there a nested hierarchy of genetic similarity with Cetacea deeply nested within Artiodactyla? (Hint: common design is not the answer).

9) Why is there a nested hierarchy of SINE insertions with Cetacea deeply nested within Artiodactyla, the exact same relationship revealed by the developmental and other genetic data? (Hint: common design is not the answer).

10) Why are human and chimp chromosomes nearly identical gene for gene and band for band, including the extra centromeric and telomeric sequences found in human chromosome two? (Hint: common design is not the answer).

11) Why is there a nested hierarchy of genetic similarity for primates with humans most closely related to chimps? Why is this pattern consistent in both nuclear and mitochondrial genes and also consistent with the fossil evidence and the chromosome banding data?

12) Why is there a nested hierarchy of SINE insertions in primates, with humans most closely related to chimps? Why is this pattern consistent with all of the other fossil, morphological, developmental and genetic data sets? (Hint: common design is not the answer).

13) Why are there intermediates between terrestrial mammals and Cetaceans in the fossil record? Why are they in exactly the order predicted by descent with modification? Why are they precisely consistent with the developmental and genetic data?

14) Was there a world wide flood less than 10,000 years ago? How do you know? Why do no real geologists, paleontologists or archaeologists agree with you?

15) Why are there intermediates in the fossil record between horse ancestors with five digits and modern horses with only one? (Hint: you can’t get out of this one by redefining “digit” or “intermediate”).

16) Why is the human eye wired backwards?

17) Why must mutations for novel features be selectively advantageous from the time of their appearance? Why can’t they be selectively neutral or selected for other functions?

18) Exactly how many “kinds” of birds did god “create”? How do you know?

19) Why are there intermediates between birds and reptiles in the fossil record?

20) Why is there a nested hierarchy of genetic similarity with birds nested deeply within reptiles?

21) Why do birds have scales?

22) Why does nothing that is not a bird have feathers?


Get to work, you lying bigoted cowardly excuse for a miserable ignoramus.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/27 19:23:17, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote
Again, please, at least, learn enough to ask a coherent question.


That may be asking too much of Biggy, Oh Cybertank.

Funny how he thinks he can run in the big leagues but needn't actually do any of the work required.  'Course, it's all the more reason to apply the Cattleprod of Mockery to his fundament on a regular basis.

(Granted, this is a vanishingly tiny probability...)


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/27 20:30:29, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Point taken.

Impervious to evidence, reality, and common sense, that's our Biggy.  The worst part is, he won't ever learn, or admit a mistake, or even realize that he's a perfect argument against his precious beliefs (as your own sig points out).

Guess all we can do is keep pointing out the obvious to him until he gives up and pulls a Sir Robin again.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/27 21:16:51, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (IBelieveInGod @ Dec. 27 2010,21:09)
Quote (IBelieveInGod @ Dec. 27 2010,19:01)

Yet your assumptions are no more scientific then my belief in a Creator.

Quote (IBelieveInGod @ Dec. 27 2010,19:01)

Yet your assumptions are no more scientific then my belief in a Creator.


This is a bald assertion without evidence: it may be rejected out of hand as nonsensical.  Insert any given deity for 'creator' and the utter absurdity of this statement becomes obvious.  (It borders on the 'tu quoque' fallacy as well.)

Why, exactly, do you think that you can say such a thing?  Be specific. Show the evidence that would give you credibility on this issue.

So far, all you have demonstrated is badly mangled rhetoric and willful ignorance, to say nothing of repeated assertions about your imaginary friend.  Make an effort to avoid fallacious non-logic.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/27 21:21:39, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote
Let me say it again. An assumption is not EVIDENCE!!!


Right.  But that's all you've ever had.  Only you call it a presumption and base it on some half-baked misunderstanding of someone else's magic book.

You aren't even wrong, here.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/27 21:27:44, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Stanton @ Dec. 27 2010,21:20)

To ask that IBelieve refrain from using fallacious non-logic is an utterly impossible, implausible act tantamount to demanding that one fly to the moon in an empty tissue box.


Alas, this is undoubtedly true.

He can't even tell the difference between basing an assumption on available evidence (which is not only reasonable but acceptable) and the fallacious use of assumption as evidence.  He does this a lot, I've noticed: elsewhere he's demonstrated confusion between an argument based on evidence, which leads to a state of incredulity...and an argument from incredibility, which is what he uses.

I'm not sure Biggy passed English Comp 101.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/27 21:33:27, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (IBelieveInGod @ Dec. 27 2010,21:25)
You the ones who require evidence, yet when you have none your assumption is perfectly acceptable to you. An ASSUMPTION IS NOT EVIDENCE!!! That is the problem with origin science, and why I don't believe it is true science. There is no way of confirming anything, there will never be any more then assumptions, conjecture, speculation, presuppositions, etc... Your theories are built on a house of cards of assumptions stacked on assumptions:)

Failed again, Biggy.

Science is not a matter of belief.  It is a matter of evidence.  You seem congenitally unable to grasp this.  This is your problem.

Yes, all 'truth' in science is conditional, pending new data.  That is the greatest source of strength for science, but you seem convinced that it's a weakness.  This is your problem.

You don't have anything else but empty word-games and rhetoric.  You never will.  You certainly don't have any evidence.  Now, if you were happy to stay in your own little room with your imaginary friend and play your silly little-child games, that'd be that.  Instead, you had to come out into the world, loudly proclaim that you're an idiot, and then get all upset when we treat you accordingly.

Reflect, repent, and depart, or pull out the cork and stop lying.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/27 22:25:14, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
It's simple, Doc.

This particular muppet-pastor (heh) basically bogged down the Bathroom Wall over on PT by posting the same stupid, boring, insipid, godbotting bullshit for something like three hundred and fifty pages worth, and now he's back after taking a brief vacation (read: licking his wounds) to spout more stupid and inane bullshit.

Rather than have him foul various threads up with his troll-age, somebody (OgreMkV, I think) implored the Powers What Are (that is, didymos) to open a thread so that Biggy could throw his temper tantrums without having to worry about getting shut down for going off-topic.

Obviously, he can't be arsed to stay here...let alone learn a damn thing.  (I, on the other hand, appreciate the occasional science lesson, being an interested amateur.)


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/28 11:08:22, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Trollish overload, most likely.

I'd ask who let the clowns out, but then I'd have that song stuck in my sensorium.

Oh, damn...


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/28 11:35:00, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Point taken.  Biggy (like JoeyKris) is little more than the intellectual equivalent of a brick wall.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/28 13:03:43, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Point taken, again.

I suppose we ought to consider it a dubious badge of honor that these small minded gits spend so much of their own time and energy tilting at the windmills.  Granted, it's annoying and obnoxious (like a four year old asking the same question for the umpteenth time in a row)...but it really boils down to their inability to handle reality.

And before anyone points it out, yes, that comparison is unfair to four year olds.  They usually grow out of it.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/28 21:05:47, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
It's Joey.  He's completely impervious to things like facts, logic, actual research of any given paper trail...


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/29 09:32:42, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Maybe it's only immoral if someone who doesn't worship his imaginary friend does it.

(eyeroll)

I bet he pulled that list (whatever it is--I'M not gonna risk brain cells reading this punk's vomit) out of his favorite clergyman's gastrointestinal tract with his teeth.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/29 10:04:22, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
He can't take the heat in this here kitchen.  He can't take the heat over on PT, either, but that doesn't seem to stop him from trying.

Where do they find 'em and why do they send 'em here?  You'd think he'd be happier just curling up into a ball and thnking happy thoughts about his imaginary friend, rather than trying to engage in a battle of wits with fully armed opponents.

Eh bien.

Too bad ignorance and stupidity don't hurt.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/30 10:08:31, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Methinks 'tis more probable that Kris is Joey's muppet than Biggy's.

But yes, Kris is under suspicion of being someone's alternative handle.  So is Johan, for whom Kris cheerled.  Thus far, Steve P. has avoided this fate.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/30 12:11:10, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
So far as I am aware, Johan has not reappeared.  No big loss: he was impervious to information.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/30 12:14:06, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
vjtorley has obviously never worked with or spoken to someone with experience as an editor.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/30 12:19:05, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
(spit-take)

(laugh)

Oh, that's beautiful!  He can't find a sound argument to support his own One Chosen Truth (tm pat pend)?  And yet people who disagree with him, including those to state that the arguments for his side lack soundness, are idiots and fools?

What a maroon.  Get in the sack, boyo!


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/30 12:23:00, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
But Pandas and People was just a forgery made up by those eeeevil darwin-worshiping atheist types to make the True BeLIEvers (tm pat pend) look like liars.  That it was put forward by those in support of ID-is-too-Sciencey folks only goes to show how completely they were fooled by this...

Wait, no, they can't be fooled 'cause they speak the Trooth (tm pat pend), so that means they must have...but the book's a dead giveaway...

Hey, it's Joey.  He's not nearly as clever as he thinks he is, nor as creative with his insults.  In his little world, all you need to overcome actual evidence is a sufficiently strong assertion.

Pathetic.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/30 19:29:32, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
That only counts if I'm trying to pull a Poe.  :D  

I know better than to even attempt to compete with the utter nutters when it comes to underpants-on-the-head stream-of-consciousness rantage.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/30 19:41:27, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Dumber than advertised.  (eyeroll)  Totally impervious to reality, too.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/30 19:52:38, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Badger3k @ Dec. 30 2010,19:49)

If your underpants are on your head, is your stream of consciousness golden?

I've no idea.

Anybody seen FL? He'd know the answer to this one...  :p


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/30 20:19:19, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
IOW, Brother Floyd is the sort of Troo BeLIEver (tm pat pend) who makes atheists...not that he understands why or how this works, or would stop if it ever sank home that his efforts are counterproductive.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/30 20:20:18, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Steve P. tries harder, I'll give him that.  He's just a little bit confused on the details.   :D


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/30 21:15:50, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Oh, I'm sorry, umabu, but the correct answer was 'The Battle of Crecy'.  Thanks for playing, what a sport.  But at least you get to keep the lifetime supply of Dwarf Bread!  Give him a hand, ladies and gentlemen...


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/30 21:17:46, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Such grandmotherly kindness, Wolfhound!  I bet the little ingrate won't even say thank you.

:D

I'd give him six dozen of the best from a hickory switch, but he'd enjoy it.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/30 21:28:08, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
(ducks) (dodges) (waves flag of truce frantically)

It's from a Zen Buddhist koan, I swear!


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/30 21:30:49, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Say the secret fnord and win a million zinc zlotys.

This good constable's too cunning to be understood.  Besides, Mabus has all the talent for disguise of a giraffe in dark sunglasses trying to get into a polar bears only swim club.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/30 22:06:25, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
You got one of those, too?  My dead uncle was from Qatar and his suspiciously masculine niece (Roger?  Who names a girl Roger?*) wanted a little help defrauding their government.


The MadPanda, FCD



(* Apologies to Roger Howard, Lady Sheffield, cousin to Elizabeth I of England and apparently quite the professional beauty.)

Date: 2010/12/30 22:08:47, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Wolfhound @ Dec. 30 2010,21:51)
Quote (Texas Teach @ Dec. 30 2010,22:38)
Quote (Wolfhound @ Dec. 30 2010,21:09)
Hi, Floyd!

Fuck off.  And die.  In a fire.

Smooches!  :x

(I figured, as a Christmas gift, I'd give him what he REALLY wanted: A nasty, mean, evil atheist screed)

I think that would be extraordinarily bad.  Can you imagine what kind of hallucinogenic effects Troo Believer fumes would have on innocent passersby?

Keith Richards would inhale.

That would explain so, so much... :O

Oh, well.  Back to the experiments in applied maleficium.  Hey, Floyd, lemme know if the headaches get worse, would you?  And remember, this is for posterity so please, be honest!


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2010/12/31 23:17:57, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Fnord Motors, baby boy.  That and plastic.  Wave of the future, son.  Retro is back.

The men in the white coats are looking for you.  Better get off the 'Net so they can't track your IP.  And don't forget the tinfoil beret, eh?  Blocks the orbital mind control lasers.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/01 22:42:16, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Clearly we are dealing with a dizzy intelle...uhm, dizzying intellect.  No doubt he thinks of Plato, Aristotle, and Socrates and says "morons!".  Perhaps he also waxes eloquently about the classic blunders, the most famous of which is 'never get involved in a land war in Asia' before failing to check his drink more cautiously.

I am a little puzzled by the 'traitor' tag, though.  Perhaps our brilliant friend is unaware that cuius regio, eius religio is no longer the default assumption in statecraft?


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/01 22:46:10, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Would it be too harsh to suggest that perhaps the esteemed Mister Hunter might benefit from a little less enthusiastic consumption of recreational pharmaceuticals before setting fingers to keyboard?

His powers of analysis beggar description without recourse to some particularly coarse and ribald language and less than kind speculations concerning his sanity.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/01 22:49:13, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
They also take it poorly when their expertise in theological matters is questioned, and the more qualified the questioner the less they seem to like it.

I, for one, would be overjoyed to hear an ID advocate whose underlying presupposition concerning the designer was drawn from something other than the usual Abrahamic background. Surely there must be someone out there who cleaves instead to the primacy of, say, the Popul Vuh...


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/01 22:52:20, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (fnxtr @ Dec. 31 2010,12:25)
Most of us here understand the boundaries of the scientific endeavour. I don't know what makes you think we don't.


He'd have very little left of his initial attempts at throwing a fit were he to admit that. Says it all, really.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/02 11:38:28, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
I confess a tendency to wax Vancian (if not Shakespearean) when I am not pressed for time in responding to the incoherent inanities that result from these persons of prodigious ignorance.  My goal is to one day present a blow so cunningly disguised as to seem a pleasantry to the recipient but boldly recognizable by all onlookers for a harsh ego-lacerating stroke of the virtual pen.

Alas, I shall never in all likelihood achieve this, as it takes so very little to tempt me to go all JoeyKris on persons of this sort.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/02 21:13:10, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (OgreMkV @ Jan. 02 2011,20:18)
An attempt to link to the images taken so far.

Kevin's Astronomy Pics

These are from a 15inch optical scope on the Canary Islands.  

This is a link to facebook, so I hope the details appear for you.  Let me know if it doesn't work.

Thanks

Coolness!  Thanks for sharing, O Cybertank!


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/03 17:54:50, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Louis @ Jan. 03 2011,15:25)
*I* am not the one troubled by headaches, Denny. That's you.

Yeah, that'd be my fault.  Practical maleficium isn't exactly rocket science, ya know, and it's entirely possible that the entropic vibrations at the quantum level aimed at JoeyKris and Biggy might have rebounded due to the fratricidal factor and pinged our other friend.

I know better than to bother asking him to explain whether this is more like a red-hot needle slowly violating his hypothalamus or more like a pair of power drills being held to his molars, but an honest answer would at least narrow it down a bit...

More importantly, if it's like being awake for three days in a room with buzzing fluorescent lights, then that Phelps character has realigned his tinfoil beanie again and the entire project will have to be re-initialized.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/04 13:12:13, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (olegt @ Jan. 04 2011,07:54)
If you are American you have betrayed Canada!

I will grant that the United States is the experiment and Canada is the control, but that still doesn't mean that a US Citizen would therefore count as a 'traitor' to Canada.

Perhaps our learned friend is unaware that treason has a very specific legal definition, and that a disagreement over imaginary friends and magic words doesn't qualify (cuius regio, eius religio no longer remaining as a guiding principle in modern jurisprudence).

Back to the lab for me.  (How're those headaches, Dennis?)


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/04 13:28:56, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (IBelieveInGod @ Jan. 04 2011,12:22)
 
Quote (oldmanintheskydidntdoit @ Jan. 04 2011,12:18)
 
Quote (IBelieveInGod @ Jan. 04 2011,12:08)
Anyway God does answer many so-called impossible things all the time.

Name just one.

I've already done that on Panda's Thumb bathroom wall. You wouldn't believe it anyway, so it would be a wasted of my time to rehash all of that again.

If you're too scared to own up to your failed arguments and present them again, that's pretty telling.  They didn't work there, either.

Biggy, it should tell you something that your long-winded eloquence doesn't get you very far around here.  It should also tell you something that your imaginary friend and your magic book are not considered given factors in the discussion: you need to kick the reasoning up a notch if you want to be taken seriously.

But, as you have demonstrated so very clearly, you have no intention of discussing anything in good faith*...which again raises a questions you have fled every time it's been presented to you: Why Are You Here?


The MadPanda, FCD


* I suspect you are in fact pathologically incapable of doing so on account of your theological presuppositions.  It would be nice to have evidence to the contrary, but so far...

Date: 2011/01/04 18:51:00, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
And that, prong_hunter, is why I ended up prefacing so many responses to our learned associate with three rather pointed words.

The man is off the table and into somebody's pint of lager.  He is dense enough to sit down at a seven card stud game and ask to draw three cards, then wonder whose bid it is.  He's not even wrong.

But rather than accept the possibility that ikkle Biggy might not be up to snuff, he preaches at length and doesn't listen, then wonders why he gets smacked down repeatedly.  He won't even read the material so that he can at least understand what he's attacking (as has been demonstrated several times).

Stupidity this strong should hurt.

I'll give him points for finally stepping up and coming over here, minus a few more for having taken so long to do the right thing and minus several more for showing no sign of actual cogitation in the meantime.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/04 21:37:48, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
By the peculiarities of patriarchal nomenclature, I have a very, very French family name, but the vast majority of my heritage is German and Irish with generous helpings of English, Scots, and Welsh thrown in here and there.

Needless to say, that pesky article at the start of my family name has caused no end of trouble, as has the anglicized pronunciation...


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/04 21:43:01, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
My three words, which have the twin virtues of brevity and simplicity, are as follows:

"Fuck, you're stupid."

I occasionally managed a few more creative comments, but against the brick wall of Biggy's impious stubbornness in the face of reality, I confess my more vulgar tendencies came out with some gusto.

Amazingly enough, it wasn't until I'd called him 'delusional' a few times before he seemed to really respond to anything I said (by, ha ha, threatening me with legal action).  That was worth the chuckle.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/04 21:45:51, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (fnxtr @ Jan. 04 2011,18:58)
Shorter version:    
Quote (IBelieveInGod @ Jan. 04 2011,14:15)
A bunch of stuff happened. I believe in God. Therefore GODDIDIT.

Well. Can't argue with that sort of reasoning now, can you.

Sheesh. (headshake)

The truly embarrassing thing is, that's Biggy's "A-game".  That's as good as he can get, if his past performance is anything by which to measure his capacity.

He has yet to put away childish things, it seems.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/04 23:25:37, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
It ain't all it's cracked up to be, Wolfie: tracing a family line also means learning about all the skeletons in the closet.  (In my case, the closet stretches back to this leaky tub called the Mayflower...)   :p

Thieves, liars, bastards, and attorneys, mostly.  I'd disown the lot of 'em except that they're already dead.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/05 09:35:02, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
But not attorneys, Robin!  Take comfort from that.

:D


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/05 13:04:08, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Schroedinger's Dog @ Jan. 05 2011,10:09)
ps: with regard to Louis taking a short break from posting here (or at least lowering his post rate), I find my reading pleasure renewed everyday by MadPanda's posts. Thanks, I need this...

Merci beaucoup, Monsieur!

I do aim to please, and occasionally succeed.  I regret that most of what I can add is the equivalent of spitballs hurled from the peanut gallery, and take a certain blushing pleasure at hearing that my efforts at least amuse.  :)



The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/05 13:12:36, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Robin @ Jan. 05 2011,11:21)
Quote (MadPanda @ FCD,Jan. 05 2011,09:35)

 
Quote
But not attorneys, Robin!  Take comfort from that.

:D


The MadPanda, FCD


LOL!

True story, here...

My sister spent a year at the University of Pau.  While in France, she took a trip to Switzerland to informally poke around the ancestral stomping grounds, and she found quite a few distant cousins in the phone directory...most of them attorneys.  (The first three generations of the family in America were, uhm, attorneys...and then one wiseacre decided he wanted to be a jeweler and watchmaker instead.)

On Mom's side, of course, it could be said that I am descended from a long line of hellraisers, Presbyterian ministers, and hellraising Presbyterian ministers.  I'd almost rather have the attorneys.

Ain't genealogy fun?


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/05 13:26:54, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Que Eff Tee.

And oh, the tangled skeletons in mine...or anyone else's for that matter.  It's probably rather difficult to find a family somewhere without a few scoundrels in it.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/05 22:46:46, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Wolfhound @ Jan. 05 2011,18:43)
IBIG, you are one stupid, arrogant, deluded fucktard.  SRSLY.

(Hey, there's really not much point in going any deeper or even attempting a more elegant analysis, is there?)

Exactement...

The deeper analysis happens because, dammitall, we're science-y types.  Tinkering with anomalous responses and busted stuff is part of what we do.   :D


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/05 22:51:36, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (OgreMkV @ Jan. 05 2011,18:02)
 
Quote (Texas Teach @ Jan. 05 2011,17:45)
 
Quote (OgreMkV @ Jan. 05 2011,13:30)
So, my question is, which is the designer?  God -or- do we live in the Matrix?

Not to give Joe too much help, but if we lived in the Matrix, wouldn't the food be better?

Naw, the designers don't know what stuff tastes like, so everything tastes like chicken.

Uhm, no, not everything tastes like chicken.

Bamboo, I promise you, tastes like bamboo.  Especially when nicely steamed and served with mushrooms and a light brown sauce...(drools)...

Oh, sorry.  What were we talking about, again?   :p


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/05 23:02:15, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (prong_hunter @ Jan. 05 2011,18:57)
...if God knows everything about everything, then he know whether you will accept him or reject him?

And if you reject him, and he knows it, then you really didn't have a choice at all? It was predestined before the beginning of time that you would spend eternity in Hell?

So if God knows everything (omniscient is the word, I think), then there is no such thing as 'free will'.

And God is directly responsible for condeming so many souls to Hell.

That doesn't seem fair.

That's it exactly, prong_hunter: theodicy trumps bible-babble.

Not that Biggy will ever admit this: he likes thinking of himself as one of the elect, forgetting that Calvin's imaginary friend is an asshole who does as he pleases.

If we must have gods, let us have gods like Sun Wukong, Ganesh, and Hanuman, who are relatively good-tempered, not usually inclined to smite, and who appreciate a swinging party. They don't claim omni-anything, either, and don't demand too much in the way of phony self-degradation.

Biggy, reflect on the following five words: tantum religio potuit suadare malorum.  They describe you and your entire theological assumption to a T.


The MadPanda, FCD


(apologies for the slight truncation of prong_hunter's original comment)

Date: 2011/01/06 11:53:14, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Biggy, you are a historical ignoramus.

Besides all the openly religious wars, of which there have been a sufficient number presented, we may also include every war in which both sides declared that your imaginary friend was on their side.  Guess how many of 'em that was?

Christians have done an awful lot of killing in their time, and justified it by their faith.  There is no dodging that bullet at all, my son.

Hitler was Catholic, son.  There's no dodging that bullet, either.  Christianity is the primary source of Jewish persecution in history, period.  Go look at the Tsarist pogroms in the Ukraine in the 20th Century and tell me what separates those good Orthodox Christian boys from Hitler's SS.

But there is one black mark on the record that didn't make the list (albeit on a technicality): the T'ai Ping Rebellion, China, 1850's.  You can tell how bad it was because the estimates of the people killed by that range from a conservative low of 20 million up to 30 million or so.

That one was started by a failed bureaucrat who got a little of the Christian heaven on his mind.  It is spared association with your imaginary friend only because it also got filtered through enough Chinese assumptions that the result was more of a Joseph Smith / Reverend Moon thing...but if you'd asked his followers, guess what they would have told you they were?  Christians.  (This may have helped fuel the Righteous Harmony Fist's bad attitude a few decades later, but I have yet to find anything linking the two, and there was enough to spark the Boxer Rebellion as it was.)

Feh.  Even Confucius's goose would be better at this.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/06 13:29:22, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (brobotsb2 @ Jan. 06 2011,12:16)
madpanda- we are going to torture you and get that atheism out of your deluded little head..

You're dumber than advertised, Mabus.  Have you tried reasoned argument instead of empty threats?  Didn't think so.

How are your headaches doing?  Should I have Igor up the voltage on the power drills?


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/06 13:32:36, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (OgreMkV @ Jan. 06 2011,12:36)
Ah, IBIG, here's one of your fellow Christians now.

Why don't you explain to him how misguided he is... after all, he's promoting violence to remove atheism.  That can't be good and just and God's plan can it?

I've got a side bet that you will never engage whatshisface.

For a change, I'm not going to tease Biggy about his reluctance to deal with the other idiot.  Even Biggy isn't so monumentally stupid as to imagine that there's anything to work with on the other end to that connection.  (That he cannot or will not recognize that there isn't a great deal of difference between his delusions and those of Mabus is beside the point.)

On the other hand, I didn't think Biggy would ever have the guts and integrity to come here instead of vomiting all over the BW, so I could very well be in error (again).


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/06 13:35:59, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (fnxtr @ Jan. 06 2011,13:21)
 
Quote (Louis @ Jan. 05 2011,15:39)
There must be a way to harness the energy produced from the endless self-congratulatory/ignorant/bigoted wankfest that is UD...

...one downside, it may make our machinery dumber.

Louis

Like strapping a piece of buttered toast to the back of a cat and dropping it off the counter...

That never works.  Igor and I tried it, and all we got was a lot of ruined toast and an extremely angry cat.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/06 15:20:06, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (brobotsb2 @ Jan. 06 2011,15:05)
there is only one way to deal with you fuckers...

SILENCING...

[/B]]http://www.headlinezone.com/index.php?showtopic=18354[B][/b]

What an exquisitely Christian answer to things you don't like.  Well done, lad, well done.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/06 15:21:52, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (fnxtr @ Jan. 06 2011,13:44)
Quote (MadPanda @ FCD,Jan. 06 2011,11:35)
Quote (fnxtr @ Jan. 06 2011,13:21)
   
Quote (Louis @ Jan. 05 2011,15:39)
There must be a way to harness the energy produced from the endless self-congratulatory/ignorant/bigoted wankfest that is UD...

...one downside, it may make our machinery dumber.

Louis

Like strapping a piece of buttered toast to the back of a cat and dropping it off the counter...

That never works.  Igor and I tried it, and all we got was a lot of ruined toast and an extremely angry cat.


The MadPanda, FCD

How about putting in on a rotisserie with a drive belt attached?

Perhaps we'll try that, but with a less angry cat.  Once poor Igor's healed up, of course.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/06 17:27:51, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Badger3k @ Jan. 06 2011,17:02)
Quote (OgreMkV @ Jan. 06 2011,10:32)
Quote (IBelieveInGod @ Jan. 06 2011,10:19)
 
Quote (Robin @ Jan. 06 2011,10:01)
 
Quote (IBelieveInGod @ Jan. 05 2011,20:11)

   
Quote
Tell me how many people have been slaughtered by Atheistic Countries, or none Christian countries? You seem to think that those who follow God are the problem. I also have a problem with Religion, and there are many Religions, but there is only one true God, only one that we can have a Relationship with.


What an ignorant question that completely misses the point. What country or countries have ever slaughtered people  in the name of atheism? Any? No. Not a one. In fact, I can't think of any single person who's ever been killed in the name of atheism. Yet billions of people have been slaughtered in the name of Christianity alone. Try again, IBIG.

Atheism, not religion, is the real force behind the mass murders of history

Provide your sources the billions have been killed in the name of Christianity?

Salem Witch Trials
Inquisition
Pakistan Governor
First Crusade 1095–1099
Siege of Jerusalem
Crusade of 1101
Norwegian Crusade 1107–1110
Second Crusade 1147–1149
Third Crusade 1187–1192
Fourth Crusade 1202–1204
Albigensian Crusade
Children's Crusade
Fifth Crusade 1217–1221
Sixth Crusade 1228–1229
Seventh Crusade 1248–1254
Eighth Crusade 1270
Ninth Crusade 1271–1272
Northern Crusades
Crusades of the Teutonic Order
Swedish Crusades
Wendish Crusade
Stedinger Crusade
Aragonese Crusade
Alexandrian Crusade
Mahdian Crusade
Crusades in the Balkans
Crusade against the Tatars
Hussite Crusade
Children's Crusade
Anti-Abortion Violence
Christian Yugoslav government led by the popular leader Slobodan Milosevic slaughtered huge numbers of ethnic Albanian Muslims

Biblical references
Worldwide Flood
Sodom and Gomorrah
Isrealite takeover of Canaan (Deuteronomy 20:17)
Numbers 31:15-18
exodus, chapter 34, verses 11-14
leviticus, chapter 26, verses 7-9

How's that for a start?

But those weren't Real Christians!  He already said so.  Seriously, it sounds like he's getting his history from Barton, or Berlinsku (sp?).

Biggy's qualifications to proclaim such a thing and have it accepted as valid are (how shall I put this?) not exactly possessed of either sterling quality or solid foundation.  He may bleat all he wishes, but his abuse of the No True Scotsman fallacy is too blatant to ignore.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/06 20:59:53, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Badger3k @ Jan. 06 2011,17:37)
Quote (Robin @ Jan. 06 2011,13:38)
Quote (IBelieveInGod @ Jan. 06 2011,10:56)

 
Quote
Did you read the link that I posted?


I read the error-filled link. The problem is, once again you aren't paying attention. Neither Mao Zadong nor Stalin killed in the name of atheism. Hitler, OTOH, actually killed in the name of Christianity.  D'Souza, once again, just demonstrates his ignorance.

He used D'Souza?  Crap, that error-filled tome is strong enough to fertilize the Midwest, but the stench would take weeks to dissipate.  No wonder he's confused.

D'Souza's qualifications on this entire topic are (how do I put this kindly?) less than stellar.  Quoting him on anything is like citing Deepak Chopra as an authority on quantum physics.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/06 21:03:07, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
That's so much better than the alternative, yeah?   :)


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/06 21:06:08, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Ahh, that was probably it.  And using a Cornish Rex was probably not the wisest of decisions, either.  Poor Tarkin was most vexed by the crumbs.

Our next attempt will likely involve a Maine Coon purebred and some hot buttered fruitcake.  That way the breadlike substance will adhere to the fur coat without need for tape or twine.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/06 21:09:22, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Is 'small' a sufficient word for the organ in question?  I should think the words 'limp' or 'flaccid' as well as 'ridiculous' might apply...or so I hear from the few persons who count as credible witnesses whenever they can stop laughing long enough to answer questions.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/06 21:19:28, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (brobotsb2 @ Jan. 06 2011,21:09)
At least we're on the same page...

Correction:

We are not on the same page, in the same book, on the same topic, in the same library.  You are an utter nutball, so far around the proverbial twist that we could use you to decant bottles of wine.  You give nobody more pleasure than when you fall silent and depart, and your presence here serves no purpose whatsoever beyond providing an extraordinarily easy target for those who delight in plinking away at a hapless moron squirming in a pool of his own noxious juices.

See someone about upping the meds you ought to be taking for your condition and leave the stupidity to the merely delusional like your muppet pastor Biggy.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/06 21:20:07, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Stanton @ Jan. 06 2011,21:17)
 
Quote (MadPanda @ FCD,Jan. 06 2011,21:09)
Is 'small' a sufficient word for the organ in question?  I should think the words 'limp' or 'flaccid' as well as 'ridiculous' might apply...or so I hear from the few persons who count as credible witnesses whenever they can stop laughing long enough to answer questions.


The MadPanda, FCD

"Atrophied" is a far better descriptor.

We are talking about the brain, yes?

Uhm...yes?


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/06 21:24:10, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (brobotsb2 @ Jan. 06 2011,21:21)
 
Quote (MadPanda @ FCD,Jan. 06 2011,21:19)
 
Quote (brobotsb2 @ Jan. 06 2011,21:09)
At least we're on the same page...

Correction:

We are not on the same page, in the same book, on the same topic, in the same library.  You are an utter nutball, so far around the proverbial twist that we could use you to decant bottles of wine.  You give nobody more pleasure than when you fall silent and depart, and your presence here serves no purpose whatsoever beyond providing an extraordinarily easy target for those who delight in plinking away at a hapless moron squirming in a pool of his own noxious juices.

See someone about upping the meds you ought to be taking for your condition and leave the stupidity to the merely delusional like your muppet pastor Biggy.


The MadPanda, FCD

madpanda... we are actually going to torture and exterminate you, fucker...

you were at the WRONG PLACE at the WRONG TIME...

Did I strike a nerve, you cowardly imbecile?  Is it possible you are scared of me for some reason, you miserable vomit-faced wretch?  Or are you simply the sort of sick small-minded religious fanatic who enjoys giving people a reason to reject his supposed fantasies?

Don't answer that.  I already know what you are.  Your reputation precedes you, and you live down to it very effectively.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/06 21:37:03, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Wolfhound @ Jan. 06 2011,21:28)
LOL!  Crazy, stupid, dickless little fuckweasel creotard iz teh funeez!   :D

You forgot 'pathetic'.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/07 11:00:32, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Louis @ Jan. 07 2011,04:37)
Quote (Lou FCD @ Jan. 06 2011,21:37)
Quote (Amadan @ Jan. 05 2011,14:50)
I was an apprentice in a solicitors' firm run by a distant cousin. In the 1930s the firm had represented an unpleasant character (a clockmaker here in Dublin, a German immigrant) who objected to a new tenant who was Jewish. In a landmark case that stands as a tribute to Irish Catholic legal principles, Herr Schlegel won, it being found by the High Court that anti-semitism was a "reasonable ground" for the rejection of the assignment.

Of course that would have no standing today, but the kicker comes with the story of my great grand-aunt (or thereabouts), sister of the founder of that firm. She took it into her pretty head about that time to do some genealogical research. The exercise came to an undignified halt and was Never Mentioned Again after she ran across the Tel Aviv branch of the family.

This still causes me to cackle with malevolent laughter.

I once called my maternal grandmother to tell her how cool it was that I found census returns for an African-American branch of the tree in my grandfather's line. I thought it was awesome. She was not excited.

...apparently, she already knew.

That too found its way into the Never Speak Of It To Grandma Again file.

I did the genealogy thing as far as it was possible on one side of my family and found the standard "two warring tribes intermingled" malarky. Since by the time I did this my grandparents' generation were long dead, no need to mention it. I did get a laugh out of it with uncles/aunts and parents though. Since this side of my family is from what was effectively a third world country, we can get back to my great grandparents, perhaps my great great grandparents if you take a lot of the data with a MASSIVE pinch of salt

Geneaology on the other side of my family can be traced back to William the Bastard and a little beyond (so ~1000 years, which sounds a lot more impressive than it actually is). Which as far as I am concerned is a) amusing and b) so boring as to be insignificant. Most of southern UK and western France can likely make the same claim.

Louis

Given how many of our forefathers were prone to playing around like Hugh Hefner, this is less of a surprise than it could be.


(No offense, Mister Heffner.)


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/07 11:20:47, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
You want Biggy to start blabbing about his imaginary friend's best frenemy forever?  I can't even get the wet facial tissue to tell me how his headaches are going so that I can tell Igor how to adjust the gain on the transmitter.

He spouts off when he would be better served by shutting up, and runs away and hides when we want him to be open and honest with us (for the sake of posterity, of course).  This explains much.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/07 11:54:49, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Au contraire, O Cybertank.  Biggy does damage to all 38, 000 sects by association.  :p

Okay, 37,999 of them.  Catholicism has its own set of PR issues right now, and his blather doesn't touch on them in any meaningful way (except for that No True Scotsman thing).

Given that his imaginary friend's best frenemy is supposed to have the better PR department, what with all the temptations and legions of succubi and so on, I would imagine that if Biggy were truly being influenced by the infernal he'd be doing a much better, smoother, more convincing job of slapping lipstick on his warthog.  Unfortunately, the results mean that either a) the assumption about better PR is wrong or b) Biggy's not being manipulated by the Department for Infernal Affairs.  (If there's an unfairly excluded middle here, I'm sure someone will be along to make apologies for it shortly.)

Biggy reduces nicely to plain ol' delusion, stupidity, willful ignorance, and the mind-rotting influence of an ideology that is nicely success-safe and reality-impaired.

Tantum religio potuit suadare malorum.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/08 11:50:17, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
No.  Going GlennBeck involves public weeping, spit spraying, and paranoid delusions.  JoeyKris manifests something more like a severe case of Tourette's Syndrome.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/08 12:01:53, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Methinks we are dealing with a slightly different logical fallacy, folks.  This isn't "No True Scotsman" so much as it's a serious case of "Not MY Nigel!"

Biggy can't handle the thought that his imaginary friend has been the cause of atrocity and must by needs project all that bad stuff onto other people and make excuses so that his delusion may remain pristine.  What else can we expect of a supposed adult with an imaginary friend who thinks that all truth is to be found in an ancient anthology of uncertain editing and obscure authorship?

Nothing to do put pat him on the head, give him his cookie,and send him to bed like a good boy.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/08 12:25:49, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Schroedinger's Dog @ Jan. 08 2011,12:23)
Does that make any sense or do I need to get drunker?

You're making more sense than Biggy ever will, but by all means have another drink or five.   :D   No point in wasting a good buzz in hopes of making our learned friend understand his errors.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/08 19:15:18, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Two supremely stupid non-answers from Biggy.

Let's just take my usual three word response as given, shall we?

Yes, folks, this is his A-game.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/09 00:32:52, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Amazing, isn't he, folks?

Give the little deluded coward a hand, folks!  He's doing his best, but the handicap he's carrying is awfully heavy...such a brave lad he is.

Biggy, have you forgotten perhaps the many, many times you told us that (in essence) if your imaginary friend told you to kill someone, you'd do it?  And made excuses for the occasions when commands from on high were used as an excuse for various unpleasant historical events?  'Cause now you seem to be willing to say that murder isn't murder if it's ordained by your imaginary friend, which means that genocide isn't genocide so long as your imaginary friend said it's okay.  On top of that, you're claiming that it's the nonbelievers who have committed the greatest atrocities in history against not only the available evidence (D'Souza's revisionism doesn't count as credible, I'm afraid) but also common sense.  Even for a Troo BeLIEver (tm pat pend) that's pretty pathetic.

blipey, the Biggster ignores everyone who actually scores a point that he can't counter with empty rhetoric and talking points.  This is his A-game.  (shrug)


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/09 00:38:57, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (IBelieveInGod @ Jan. 08 2011,20:01)
Let me also add, if there were no GOD, we wouldn't be here, nothing would exist:)

Yet another baseless and incoherent assertion, void of either logic or evidence.

When you feel like joining the adult world, Biggy, and put childish things behind you, let us know.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/09 11:46:36, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (IBelieveInGod @ Jan. 09 2011,10:41)
God always was! He wasn't created.

Bald assertion without evidence.  Also incoherent and abstract, demonstrating nothing beyond an absurdity.

Biggy and evidence are not on speaking terms, it seems.  No matter how often we tell him that assertion, scripture, and word games don't count, that's all he ever gives us.  And then he wonders why the magic words don't work.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/10 18:02:29, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
I'm sure there are a number of First Nations that would be willing to front that opinion, as would the Aboriginal peoples of Aussie-land...   :D

The comparison is hardly equivalent, though: the better parallel in both cases would be the Palestinians.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/10 18:08:14, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Badger3k @ Jan. 10 2011,18:02)
Quote (the_ignored @ Jan. 10 2011,15:04)
HuH?  Olegt's "arrogant assholery"?  Do they not bloody read what Vox puts out?

 
Quote
First, if I only limited myself to those of my intellectual weight class, I'd have to ignore nearly everyone.


Dont' his syophants realize that he's zinging them as well?  Or do they all consider themselves to be in his "intellectual weight class"?

Then there's the man's posts about rape, that we all know about.

WTF is wrong with them?

They are in his "intellectual weight class" - it's just that it isn't as high as they like to think.

That's it exactly, Blackadder!

Remember: it's only arrogant and immoral if it's done by people who don't worship VD's imaginary friend.  (I leave the obvious jokes concerning the initials of this poor lad's handle to the more sadistic members of our community.)


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/10 18:22:18, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
One could point out that if not for their faith inciting the zealots to be such annoying little barbarians in the first place, then the Diaspora might well not have happened...

But noooooooo, they just had to piss off the Romans, who had very little in the way of a sense of humor when it came to things like obeying the law and honoring the Emperor.  Nope.  Just couldn't do like everybody else and salute with one hand while crossing their fingers behind their backs.  Had to be special, didn't they?   :p  Bloody idiot Sadducees and their legalistic wrangling!  Obviously didn't learn from what happened to Carthage.

(Okay, yes, I'm being a bit too flippant with this, but it's hard to see the Judean Revolt as a good idea in the first place.  Feel free to insert Life of Brian jokes as needed.)


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/10 18:43:35, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Yeah, more or less.

You'd think they'd have learned something from all that.  :p


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/10 23:37:03, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
[Graffiti moved to Bathroom Wall. - Lou FCD]

Igor wants to know how your headaches are doing, nutboy.  Also, are you feeling more of a power-drill-on-the-molars agony or a red-hot-electified-wire-in-my sinuses thing.

This is for posterity, so please be honest.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/12 12:28:36, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Badger3k @ Jan. 10 2011,18:20)
Quote (MadPanda @ FCD,Jan. 10 2011,18:08)
Quote (Badger3k @ Jan. 10 2011,18:02)
 
Quote (the_ignored @ Jan. 10 2011,15:04)
HuH?  Olegt's "arrogant assholery"?  Do they not bloody read what Vox puts out?

   
Quote
First, if I only limited myself to those of my intellectual weight class, I'd have to ignore nearly everyone.


Dont' his syophants realize that he's zinging them as well?  Or do they all consider themselves to be in his "intellectual weight class"?

Then there's the man's posts about rape, that we all know about.

WTF is wrong with them?

They are in his "intellectual weight class" - it's just that it isn't as high as they like to think.

That's it exactly, Blackadder!

Remember: it's only arrogant and immoral if it's done by people who don't worship VD's imaginary friend.  (I leave the obvious jokes concerning the initials of this poor lad's handle to the more sadistic members of our community.)


The MadPanda, FCD

I've heard that VD causes itching and a rash...is that what happens when you read him?

Yeah, I know, about as lame as VD himself, but it's the best I could come up with.

Although I tried to come up with the "cunning as a fox" bit of Baldrick, the best I can make is a comment asking if his followers like Turnips?

I'd have referenced Baldrick, but let's face it: Baldrick is at least a magnitude above VD when it comes to essential likability and decency.  Like George, he's simply incapable of being wicked, evil, or nasty...whatever the provocation.

If I must compare real people to the various incarnations of the Black Adder, I prefer to think of VD as Captain Darling, who (when all was said and done) turned out to be a rather prissy stuffed-shirt of a coward.

VD probably thinks of himself as Lord Flashheart.


The MadPanda, FCD


(Apologies to Mr. McInnery, Mr. Robinson, Mr. Mayall, Mr. Atkinson, Mr. Laurie, Mr. Fry...)

Date: 2011/01/12 12:39:48, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (OgreMkV @ Jan. 12 2011,08:29)
IBIG has proven over the past 6 months that he is not capable of learning.  And the Dunning-Krueger comment is so spot on... he could be a case study.

IBIG knows next to nothing about science, theology, history or anything else AFAIK.

So, yes, we are all wasting our time.  However, for me, picking holes in his statements is a learning procdess for me... sometimes.

Not to mention that there is a certain therapeutic value in kicking the hell out of a moron who is prone to pulling on the shoe and loudly proclaiming that it fits.

Is this unkind?  Well, nobody forces him to come here and spew his tripe...and frankly, there's very little that's as rude as telling other people that they're going to suffer for all time if they don't share your delusions (however politely this may be expressed).

I'd rather he grew up, got a clue, and wandered away to do something more productive with his life.  But since he insists on being a poster child for Dunning-Kruger, I'll happily toss a few darts in between watching people who know the material kick him around.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/12 19:46:12, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (OgreMkV @ Jan. 12 2011,17:23)
He is, pretty much, a waste of carbon and oxygen that could be put to better use in a wombat, they, at least, are cute.

They're also much more polite than the average Troo BeLIEver (tm pat pend), but that may be a side effect of being unable to talk.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/12 22:57:40, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Stanton @ Jan. 12 2011,21:14)
Quote (blipey @ Jan. 12 2011,21:09)
Nice link, IBIG.  I think you forgot either/or:

1.  the commentary
2.  the answer

Not necessarily in that order of importance.

For IBelieve to provide an answer, or a commentary that isn't about him screeching about how he's so much more smarter, richer, more powerful, and more virile than those stupid, evil, God-hating, devil-worshiping scientists, well...


That would require more brainpower than he currently possesses.

It would also require more maturity, humility, wisdom, and capacity for introspection than Biggy has demonstrated thus far...

He has yet to clearly explain why we should accept his interpretation of anything as authoritative in a manner that does not rely upon the Pasal's Gamble presuppositions that form his blinders.  It is as if he is so enamored with the magic words that he cannot grasp their failure to move us.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/13 12:12:19, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Henry J @ Jan. 13 2011,11:13)
What is there to prevent God from using natural processes if they would produce results that meet her requirements?

Simple: if the imaginary magic friend uses nothing but natural processes, then there is no need for the imaginary magic friend to explain nature at all.  Occam's Razor would then apply, and the excess entity gets dropped from the equation.

That's a gawd of the gaps argument.  It works slightly better than Pascal's Wager, which doesn't work once one realizes that Pascal was thinking about a flip of the coin, but the proper model is an (American) roulette wheel.

The alternative interpretation would be the imaginary magic friend deliberately constructing the universe to hide all actual evidence of its existence, and then (by doctrine and tradition) getting upset when we mortals use our faculties as designed and come to the conclusion that there is no such entity...and such a deity is almost certainly not worth respect, affection, and worship.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/15 16:13:13, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
That's not even off the table and into somebody's pint of lager.

At a guess, I'd say this chump's error lies in the collection of presuppositional extra entities he brought to the discussion.  Someone get Bill Occam on the line and tell him to bring his chainsaw...


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/18 21:51:18, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
[Graffiti moved to Bathroom Wall. - Wesley R. Elsberry]

There he goes again...

Save us the trouble, Mabus.  Get back on your meds and piss off, there's a good knucklehead.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/18 22:09:15, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
[Graffiti moved to Bathroom Wall. - Wesley R. Elsberry]

Oooo, was that a threat?  I am sooooo scared!  You couldn't beat up an egg, you poser.  Even for an internet tough guy, you're pathetic.  I know six year olds who have more sand than you, you yellow-bellied puking-lily greenhorn.

Go back to the booby hatch and don't let the door hit you on the way through.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/18 22:12:11, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
[Graffiti moved to Bathroom Wall. - Wesley R. Elsberry]

The same note again.  Can't you even try to be creative?

Fuck, you're crazy, stupid, and dull.  Why don't you go back to frightening small children, you buffoon?


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/18 22:20:24, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
[Graffiti moved to Bathroom Wall. - Wesley R. Elsberry]

BORRRRRRRRIIIIIIIIIING.

C'mon, nutboy, change the record.  If all you have is these pathetic and repetitive one-liners, you're going to be even less fun than Biggy, who at least attempted coherent arguments.

But then all you ever do is spam everybody and their pet board with your silly little screed, rather like a small boy with damp trousers begging to be taken seriously.

Here's a hint: I'm pointing and giggling at you, right now.  Does that hurt your feelings, little troll?


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/18 22:22:20, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (OgreMkV @ Jan. 16 2011,15:10)
Quote (oldmanintheskydidntdoit @ Jan. 16 2011,11:54)
Quote (blipey @ Jan. 16 2011,00:34)
 
Quote (Richardthughes @ Jan. 15 2011,12:32)
New Tard:

https://www.blogger.com/comment....7573486

Ah, puppets...

Funny how Joe can only sustain short conversations.

I imagine that reflects much of the rest of his life.

Joe, as I know you won't get it, I'm saying you can't get it up.

and he ain't talkin' 'bout your visitor count.

Maybe we could get the Mabus to visit him.  It's a win-win.  JoeyKris gets someone else at whom to scream, and the nutball gets someone to scourge and ban him so he can feel all persecuted.

Or would that be a violation of the Geneva Convention in some way that has escaped my notice?

:p

The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/19 10:16:17, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (OgreMkV @ Jan. 19 2011,08:50)
Hey MP, you still around?

(puts on That Kenny Loggins Song)

Yeah, I'm here.  Reports of my imminent demise were a wee bit premature.

I roll my eyes in the troll's general direction and laugh at his pathetic attempts to be scary.  Boy can't even think up something creative to use.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/19 14:49:31, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Should "methodology" not be in scare quotes?   :D


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/20 10:40:45, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (dvunkannon @ Jan. 19 2011,12:52)
Quote (OgreMkV @ Jan. 19 2011,13:03)
I'm on it.

Maybe Chris or RK will grace you with their presence, then run away as they refuse to answer questions and go on long regurgitive posts about nothing at all.

I'm waiting for Mabus to appear and threaten to cut my head off.

I think I scared the poor little baby off.  It cannot possibly have been that easy.  :p  Tell me it's a fluke, please...

If you really want one of those prizewinning threats, next time he shows up make fun of the way his mother dresses him.  That'll get you his personal attention in a hurry, but since he can't be arsed to put any effort into it, it's going to be a copy and paste job.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/20 10:45:36, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
(reads)

(breaks out into sarcastic sniggering)

If I had an irony meter, it might have hit elevenses on that one.  Can these yoiks possibly manage to avoid an own-goal with this stuff?  Or are the deafened by the sound of so many points whizzing over their heads?


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/20 10:50:28, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Biggy, Biggy, Biggy...

You fail on the merits, yet again.

Here is your daily meditation, my young padawan novice: contemplate the full meaning of the words tantum religio potuit suadare malorum as they apply to your own feverish collection of delusions.

Do not return until you have grokked the depth of this koan, for only then will you grasp the reason you are soundly mocked.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/20 12:11:53, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Biggy is unable to apply Lord Acton's observation to his imaginary friend.  To paraphrase the peer in question:

Power corrupts.  Absolute power corrupts absolutely.
 
Therefore, if his imaginary friend is omnipotent, it would also be utterly, thoroughly corrupt.

This conclusion is only avoidable through the fallacy of special pleading and some pseudointellectual rationalizations that make Stockholm Syndrome look like a healthy adjustment...and yet he wonders why his magic book with the magic words fails to move us.

Too bad the problem of theodicy predates the events of NT mythology by a fair margin.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/20 12:16:33, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Oh, of course...completely different person (wink, wink, nudge, nudge).  Totally different.  No reason to think otherwise, eh? (wink, wink)  Perhaps the meds are working today.

So long as he slunk off like a whipped coyote after a bad roadrunner moment, it's all good.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/20 12:21:26, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Wesley R. Elsberry @ Jan. 19 2011,07:52)
I'm just saying not to be upset if your witty response disappears along with the banned person's post that triggered your response.

No worries.  :)

I should probably learn to restrain myself in the presence of the Mabus instead of generating more work and stress for the admins by playing the gadfly.

By all means, if I must have posts vanish down the memory hole, any and all responses to the gentleman in question are disposable.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/20 12:23:00, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Richardthughes @ Jan. 20 2011,10:26)
Quote (OgreMkV @ Jan. 19 2011,23:33)
which is unfortunate because the first post is picture of a guy with a pink dick on his forehead and that's NSFW).

Great art is meant to challenge you.

Or at least challenge somebody.  Got to push the envelope, which is why we got impressionism, fauvism, pointalism, cubism, dada, surrealism, post-surrealism, last-tuesday-ism...


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/20 12:23:59, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
That...is a most impressive canard, M'sieur.  Does it do tricks?


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/20 12:55:10, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (OgreMkV @ Jan. 20 2011,12:40)
Quote (MadPanda @ FCD,Jan. 20 2011,12:23)
That...is a most impressive canard, M'sieur.  Does it do tricks?


The MadPanda, FCD

It's a 30 foot tall, 2 ton duck... it doesn't have to do freaking tricks.

Point taken that it doesn't have to do tricks.  I'm just wondering if it knows any.

That's a whole lotta Peeking Duck, there.

Where can we get fifty thousand gallons of orange sauce in a hurry?


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/20 18:31:55, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
I'm not sure about that one, but only because what passes for their manifesto is written in lolcat, and is even harder to parse than your average postmodernist essay on being and nothingness (as opposed to Sartre's work of the same name, which was simply verbose and a bit dull).

I'm personally inclined to see lolcatism as a variation of postpostmodern dadaism on an extra shot of caffeine and too many cute cat pix rather than as an independent style of it's own, as evidenced by the proliferation of other sites in the network.

Any work involving the lolrus and his missing bukkit, on the other hand, is clearly a cry for help cast echoing amidst the spiritually barren slums of the bourgeoisie commonly known as suburbia before being ruthlessly crushed by the banal common kultur that is conformity.

But what the hell do I know about art?   :D


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/21 11:18:29, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
And JoeyKris can't even make it one response out of the gate without demonstrating his usual antics.  Color me utterly unsurprised.  I'll call this one an EPIC FAIL for 800, please, Alex.

What a maroon.  What an ultramuppet.  What a joke.  For someone who claims not to be religious and an idiot, you respond very much like a religious idiot being called on the carpet...and that means you are more likely to be used as a chew toy than granted your civil discussion.

I suspect you are speaking, as always, in mauvais fois.  Please, please, please demonstrate that my cynical assumption is incorrect.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/21 11:28:23, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Kris @ Jan. 21 2011,08:10)
And before you or someone else asks me who the creator or designer is or was, I didn't say there is or was one. It will be interesting to see if any of you respond to what I actually said, instead of what you think I said.

You keep claiming to be a scientist, yet you also keep making statements like this.  You also make these pseudo-gotcha zingers as if you think they would demonstrate anything but a lack of understanding.

I read your little disclaimer as a 'get out of showing my work' card: whether or not you are a believer is immaterial at this point.  If you think ID ought to be taken seriously, present the evidence which you think is meritorious.  Coming from someone who does NOT believe in the designer, it would have a bit more weight.

The burden of proof lies with the extraordinary claim, which at this point would be ID.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/21 11:31:57, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
To which the correct answer would be:

"Which set, you goy?"

There are two...three if you count the difference between the Catholic and Protestant interpretations, but so far as I know everybody who blabs about 'hang ten' forgets about the Ritual Decalogue.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/21 11:41:03, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
JoeyKris is running true to form, which is kind of disappointing.

I'm just not getting a real high signal to noise ratio from him, and frankly if he has anything of importance to say, he's already set expectations in the other direction with his constant 'tu quoque' blather.

If we're nice, he's a jackass.
If we respond to his jackassery in like manner, that is proof that he's right.
If we bend over backwards to give him space to have a decent discussion, that's an excuse to accuse us all of being worse that the creotards and godbots he claims he isn't.

He is not acting and speaking in good faith, full stop.  His intent seems to be pointless monkey-wrenching for the sheer puerile joy of being a destructive little git.

I would prefer to see some strong evidence that my cynicism is misplaced, but prior experience says that this is not at all likely.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/21 18:48:40, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 21 2011,16:01)
I can't go tell PZ, Rich, he banned my ass years ago.  He doesn't allow dissent.

The first sentence is true.  The second sentence is so obviously false that anyone with a working conscience must blush to see the accusation made: the troll was invited to leave for being trollish, not merely for dissenting.  (Hint: there are practicing Xians who have earned the OM designation, some of whom have been known to tell Dr. Myers that he's full of it.  Funny how they haven't been hit with the banhammer yet.)

So, FTK, since you seem to think that abortion is a bad thing, what mandatory minimum sentence would you embrace for women seeking to terminate problematic pregnancies?

You, Biggy, what's the difference?


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/22 01:24:42, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Badger3k @ Jan. 21 2011,19:23)
Quote (MadPanda @ FCD,Jan. 21 2011,11:31)
To which the correct answer would be:

"Which set, you goy?"

There are two...three if you count the difference between the Catholic and Protestant interpretations, but so far as I know everybody who blabs about 'hang ten' forgets about the Ritual Decalogue.


The MadPanda, FCD

Ritual decalogue?  The second set (the one with the goats), or the 600-odd ritual commandments that are required?  ETA - Sure it's a bit redundant, but the long list of commandments or requirements for the follower to be ritually pure or right with god, or whatever the term may be.  Having an interesting night, so my vocabulary is a bit off.

The ethical decalogue is the usual list of suspects (Ex 20:1-17, which is not referred to as the Ten Commandments).  Then there's the other decalogue (Ex 34:11-28), often called the ritual decalogue, which repeats some of the first list, but which has such gems as 'thou shalt not boil a kid in its mother's milk'...and is in Ex 34:28 referred to as the ten commandments.

And after that you get the other 600 or so, which are listed separately and are not considered part of the Big Ten.

Frankly, I prefer the Analects of Confucius to all this confused babble about stone tablets...


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/22 01:27:39, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Kris @ Jan. 21 2011,22:54)
So much for a "rational discussion". Pfft.

So much for any effort at a point, let alone refutation.

Thanks for confirming my assessment.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/22 01:37:49, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Kris @ Jan. 21 2011,23:27)
I don't doubt that UD and some other sites are intolerant of some comments but that doesn't make it right for this site or any other religion bashing site to also be intolerant. This site, Panda's Thumb, Pharyngula, and some others are just as much an echo chamber as the sites you people condemn.

That's pronounced tu quoque, Kris.  It's a logical fallacy.  That seems to be all you've brought to the table this time, same as last time...and the seventeen times before that.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/22 10:15:27, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Wow.  Just...wow.

Kris just spent way too many words to say even more things that are neither surprising nor informative, and which again demonstrate that Kris's claim to being a scientist is at best questionable.

I honestly don't think he knows what he believes he knows, because he seems utterly amazed and astounded by things so basic to the process that they should be given.

Okay, I'm done with the muppet.  He's impervious.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/22 21:58:35, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Badger3k @ Jan. 21 2011,19:45)
I'd add that my conscience can't let two people who love each other be barred from getting married, even if they are of the same sex (consenting adults only, please).  Is that from God, too?  If so, then, boy...is he confused.

This, ex-fucking-zactly.  Cranked to eleven.

Oh, wait.  Biggy probably doesn't think gays are human, never mind being worthy of compassion instead of condemnation.  His imaginary friend likes to break its own toys, apparently.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/22 22:00:37, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Is the arachnid of unusual size also wearing roller skates?  If so, it's the result of the Ridikulus anti-boggart cantrip and does not count for argument-ending purposes.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/22 22:04:21, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (OgreMkV @ Jan. 22 2011,21:58)
Kris, I need to listen very carefully because this is the ENTIRE POINT OF THIS ARGUMENT AND WEBSITE.

Found your problem, O Cybertank.

The muppet has no interest in paying attention.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/22 22:29:31, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (qetzal @ Jan. 22 2011,22:11)
They're welcome to think it as much as they like. As long as they're not trying to get their opinions taught as legitimate scientific theories, or trying to force others to pretend their opinions are anything more than that, their beliefs don't bother me at all.

There you go, being all reasonable and stuff.  You guys know that makes JoeyKris's head go kablooey, and we can't have the precious little moppet throwing his tantrums over nothing.

After all, we're the ones obsessed and just as bad as the fundamentalists and like that.  He says so, ergo it must be true!

:D

Like a brick wall, that boy.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/23 00:16:30, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
[Graffiti moved to Bathroom Wall. - Wesley R. Elsberry]

Quote (Kristine @ Jan. 23 2011,00:08)
Urbotsu, you have been warned, you have been mocked, and now I'm going to hold you to that promise. Be a man and start with me. Let's see you get up from behind the internet and try to "exterminate" anyone.

Sorry, Ms. K., but the complete and utter waste of genetic material to whom you refer has already (checks notes) ah, yes, here it is...promised to behead and torture me, apparently for some demented reason that he invented while pretending to be one of his many sock-puppets.

You'll have to wait your turn.  But I promise that whenever what's left of him finally crawls home, you may suffer the dire consequences of having one of his little crushes directed at you.

:p


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/23 00:21:42, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Persistent little strain of bioweapon, ain't he?


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/23 11:19:02, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
I second that--I do not mock him for his condition: that would be unjust and cruel, and life is difficult enough without people lobbing brickbats at others for stuff they can't help.

At times, he makes me think of a dog that's gotten run over in the street because it chased traffic and tried to bite the tires off of a moving van: can't help feeling sorry for the poor mutt, but also can't help but notice that it'd been safer back on the sidewalk.

I hope to hear someday that he's gotten help and gotten his head straight.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/23 11:23:36, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Happy birthday to you both!

May yours be pleasant or eventful, whichever you prefer.

Many happy returns from the Bamboo Bunker.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/23 11:33:19, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
[Graffiti moved to Bathroom Wall. - Wesley R. Elsberry]

Quote (Badger3k @ Jan. 23 2011,01:40)
Is he going to behead you, and then torture you?  Seems a bit pointless, if you ask me, but whatever gets him off...deluded bugger.

I'm actually not quite sure of the intended order, myself, but given that a) we all know what he looks like, courtesy of a recent photograph, b) know that he's Canadian, and c) can be certain that he has no clue as to my actual name, age, location in meatspace, and capacity for premeditated self-defense, it's awfully silly of him to even contemplate such things.

I'd quote Sun Tzu at him, but the poor lad's got all the subtlety of Lu Bu and none of the skill of Kongming.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/23 11:35:45, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (qetzal @ Jan. 23 2011,08:48)
Quote (MadPanda @ FCD,Jan. 22 2011,22:29)
There you go, being all reasonable and stuff.

I'm sorry - was that wrong? Should I not have done that?

;)

Reason and logic, delivered without the abuse he so badly craves, makes Baby JoeyKris cry.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/23 22:31:33, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 23 2011,17:43)
Quote (khan @ Jan. 23 2011,17:41)
delete duplicate

Khan, I can't answer that.  It's not my place to judge...that is God's job, and he is a very forgiving God.

Objection!  Assertion assumes facts not in evidence and is (in light of a review of the literature) counterfactual.

And I still haven't gotten an answer--what sentence do you consider appropriate for these horrid slatterns who dare seek the MURDER of their innocent fetuses?

Your assumption and extrapolation from an undetermined sample size is noted.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/23 22:34:22, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 23 2011,18:44)
Well, shame on them then.  That is not how Christ would respond.

Objection!  Assumes facts not in evidence.  Also No True Scotsman fallacy...


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/23 22:39:15, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 23 2011,19:53)
Free will Badger....seeing how people respond today to God's will, I don't think telling them to 'stop' would have accomplished a thing.  He doesn't change His laws...we do.

Objection, assumes facts not in evidence...

You have read the Old Testament, perhaps?  In that very work of fiction your imaginary friend does not come across as particularly kind, nor forgiving, nor loving except perhaps in the same way as an abusive spouse.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/23 22:47:59, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 23 2011,22:38)
What sentence?  Umm....none?  I think I've stated several times that I have no opinion as to the legality of abortion.  I prefer to keep government out of it.  Education, counseling and support should be a priority here, not a sentence of some sort for those who chose abortion.

Thank you for answering my question.  That'll do nicely, in fact.

Too bad so many of your fellow True BeLIEvers (tm pat pend) don't agree with you on that score.  Funny thing is, they'll say that you're the one in the wrong...and you have nothing to clearly demonstrate why your interpretation of the magic book is more accurate.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/23 22:50:06, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 23 2011,22:41)
You can call it what you will.  It's the truth.  Christ showed compasion and love for those in need.  He was more apt to judge those who claimed to be of God than those who weren't.

I'm sorry, but what part of "assumes facts not in evidence" did you not understand?  You are parroting mythology, not speaking truth.  There's a big difference.

Your imaginary friend is in your head, nowhere else.  If you have evidence to the contrary, show it.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/23 23:09:19, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 23 2011,23:00)
People need to just shut up and help each other the best they can instead of cut each other apart for their choices.

There, at least, we are in full agreement.

Unfortunately, honesty demands that I point out quite firmly that the majority of people who see fit to tear others apart for their choices is on the 'believer' side of the line...and they justify it by appeal to the magic book about their imaginary friend.  So you do yourself no good to forward mythology and treat it as indisputable fact.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/23 23:28:50, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 23 2011,23:10)
I'm sure you've been given an abundant amount of evidence and rejected it all.  I honestly don't understand how people can be so divided on the subject.  The only thing I can come up with is what appears more and more all the time to be correct.  You either have the holy spirit in your heart or you don't.  You either see or you don't.  It's the only explantion I can find to understand how what I know to be true (and proven with little doubt) is so completely rejected and misunderstood by some.  

Yes, call me delusional, conceited, bigoted, etc., etc.,.  I really don't mind anymore.  I know there is a God...it's abundantly clear and why some don't see that.....it's a mystery. I know I don't have everything right, but there is a God and there is a reason for us being where and who we are.  And, I won't apologize for the sermon.

Nope: not a speck.  I have heard testimony, anecdote, assertion after assertion, and hours and hours of religious instruction.  I have seen and read more than you would be likely to guess, and listened for a long time to more voices than you might be willing to believe.  No actual evidence of any deity claimed to be, or to have been, has ever been presented, period.

That you believe is not in dispute.  That you have your reasons is also not in dispute.  The content of your beliefs...ah, that's another matter.

You are indeed delusional*--you have an imaginary friend, which at any age over twelve ought to be a source of profound embarrassment instead of a culturally coddled construct.  Further, you hold this imaginary friend to be more important than the very real people and relationships around you...possibly to the detriment of some, or worse than detriment.  You lift an ancient anthology of questionable accuracy and dubious scholarship up onto a pedestal and treat it as the guide to life, regardless of the actual contents.  (I give you credit for not going so far as some other delusional persons, who quote it as if it were indisputably authoritative.)  

You even have this pat little excuse for people who don't accept your interpretation--they're not full of the Holy Spirit, or led astray by Teh Debbil, or Not True Scotsmen, or they hate Baby Jeebus and Gawd, or whatever.  How very convenient!  It isn't possible, simply isn't possible, that you might be wrong...

You need not apologize for the sermon: you can't help it.

Here is an exercise for you: replace the word 'God' with the word 'Zeus'.  See if your protestations and declarations don't sound a little silly with the imaginary friend switched out.  Alternately, explain to me why you don't believe in Odin the All-Father...


The MadPanda, FCD


* Delusional is not the same thing as unsane.  We all have our little opinions that are not necessarily supported by objective evidence.  Ask any sports fan or dog lover or, dare I say it, sci fi fan...

Date: 2011/01/23 23:37:42, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 23 2011,23:21)
There you are doing the same thing as Dale.  If it was only the 'believer's' side of the line that was claiming their way is the only way, and that they are the only ones "tearing others apart" we wouldn't have any arguments, would we?  Do none of you get that?  Can't you see that both sides are pushing for their own beliefs and, agendas and worldview?  *Both* sides tear at each other.  We need to all stop with the anger, quit being so defensive and try to understand each other rather than play the blame game.

That's a false equivalence, at best.  Even if I were to grant you the NOMA, which I don't, only one side actually has practical support.

There is this thing called reality.  It does not go away when you decide to stop believing in it.  It is also a harsh mistress and a firm taskmaster (if you'll forgive the mixed metaphor).

If you wish to be taken seriously, you need to present evidence.  Not anecdote, not testimony, not quote scripture, not assertions...evidence.

What part of that are you not willing to understand?


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/24 00:02:30, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Dale_Husband @ Jan. 23 2011,23:52)
Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 23 2011,23:43)
Dale,

I believe I made almost all those same points in our previous discussions-no God botting necessary.  You were the one that brought up crimes against Jesus or whatever it was you said, and I told you that Jesus had nothing to do with it.  

Ultimately, you believe the same things the I do as well as what the Bible teaches.  That sucks, eh?  You're arguing with me for no reason other than you can't stand the thought of holding to anything biblical.

Did you not see the quote I gave from Psalms about killing babies? Go back and read that!

What I can't stand is dishonesty and stupidity, period.

She may not be dishonest so much as cognitively dissonant.  She has certainly mistaken truthiness for truth.

But we're so angry.  And defensive.  And obviously the only reason we don't accept her Trooth (tm pat pend) is that we aren't filled with a figment of her imagination, which is somehow subordinate to and yet part of her imaginary friend*.  (eyeroll)  I sense a bit of projection, here, but that may be my confirmation bias acting up.


The MadPanda, FCD

(* The doctrine of the Trinity is rather amusing, or would be if not for all the blood spilled over it across the years.)

Date: 2011/01/24 00:28:48, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Kris @ Jan. 23 2011,07:39)
For your information, most of humanity believes that a creator/designer is responsible for the universe and everything in it.

Argumentam ad populam fallacy.  Reality, last time I checked, is not a consensual construct that changes if only enough people believes something.

If six billion people believe a thing that is counter to factual data, it is still counter-factual.  Popularity's got nothing to do with it.  No matter how hard you believe you can fly, gravity will win if you leap off a tall building.  Closing your eyes and wishing will not render the oblate spheroid into a flat surface, round or otherwise.  This is pretty basic stuff.

Try again, please, without using a red herring that is not actually under dispute.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/24 00:37:03, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Yes, Dale, I know you're a UU, but that's immaterial to the point I was making about the doctrine of the Trinity.

God counts as an imaginary friend whether you'd say so or not...unless you can provide evidence otherwise.   :)   If I am not going to allow Odin, Thor, Zeus, Cthulhu, Amaterasu, Shiva, Ganesh (regrettably), Hanuman (also regrettably), Inanna, or any of the other multitude of purported deities to pass for given, I'm certainly not going to do it for any prospective, undefined, unevidenced entity.  That would be disrespectful in the extreme, to make an exception for something more familiar simply because I'd grown up hearing about it.  (I am not agnostic about leprechauns, nor about unicorns, dragons, qiling, or flying monkeys.  Why should I blindly accept Bigfoot without plenty of evidence?)

Frankly, I'd settle for someone making a sincere effort to prove the supremacy of Ganesh.  He's supposed to be laid back and fond of parties, so if we must have a deity we could do worst.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/24 09:54:06, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Schroedinger's Dog @ Jan. 24 2011,09:48)
After reading Kris's posts with an open mind, and can only come up with this conclusion:

The guy's a schmuck!

That is an insult to schmucks...


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/24 20:11:07, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Kris @ Jan. 24 2011,19:20)
Quote (MadPanda @ FCD,Jan. 23 2011,22:28)
 
Quote (Kris @ Jan. 23 2011,07:39)
For your information, most of humanity believes that a creator/designer is responsible for the universe and everything in it.

Argumentam ad populam fallacy.  Reality, last time I checked, is not a consensual construct that changes if only enough people believes something.

If six billion people believe a thing that is counter to factual data, it is still counter-factual.  Popularity's got nothing to do with it.  No matter how hard you believe you can fly, gravity will win if you leap off a tall building.  Closing your eyes and wishing will not render the oblate spheroid into a flat surface, round or otherwise.  This is pretty basic stuff.

Try again, please, without using a red herring that is not actually under dispute.


The MadPanda, FCD

Nice try, but you quoted me out of context, which makes your comments irrelevant to what I said.

And hey, you might want to consider that Argumentam ad populam thing when you and others here think you're right just because you agree with each other.

(eyeroll)

You really aren't very good at this, are you, son?


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/24 20:52:27, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
In all candor, O Cybertank, such an effort is casting pearls before a brick wall...

Wait.  JoeyKris is even less appreciative and observant than that.  Hold on.  Let me get my thesaurus rex.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/24 21:12:57, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Pour moi?  M'sieur is too kind...


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/24 21:18:36, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Coolness!  Always nice to see a few more pics of the wahs.

Thanks much!


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/24 21:33:23, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Texas Teach @ Jan. 24 2011,17:04)
Watch out.  Girls who sleep with you because you can quote the Silmarillion are into some freaky stuff.

...because obviously if you can get through the Silmarillion, you've got incredible focus, devotion, and above all endurance.

Never could get into that book.  Not sure I want to try.  I hear his pantheon is missing a deity of mischief, fun, and general hijinks, and such a lack is hard to forgive.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/24 21:44:18, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Heddle can't help it.  He's a Calvinist.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/24 22:04:09, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
I'm not sure.  My av is from Fuzhou...


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/24 23:12:20, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Awwww, did widdle JoeyKris not like having his logical fallacies pointed out to him again?

You haven't got the feel for this at all, lad.  Now you're starting in with tu quoque to go with the argumentam ad populam from earlier and your usual weapons-grade projection.

I think perhaps you're a little too obsessed with the obsession you've projected onto us.  Also a little too quick to leap to the insults regardless of the person you're addressing and the topic on which you're pontificating, but I suppose you can't help yourself.

Fewer logical fallacies, at the very least, would lend you some credibility, and you need as much as you can get.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/25 00:17:46, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Kris @ Jan. 24 2011,23:53)
Quote (MadPanda @ FCD,Jan. 24 2011,21:12)
Awwww, did widdle JoeyKris not like having his logical fallacies pointed out to him again?

You haven't got the feel for this at all, lad.  Now you're starting in with tu quoque to go with the argumentam ad populam from earlier and your usual weapons-grade projection.

I think perhaps you're a little too obsessed with the obsession you've projected onto us.  Also a little too quick to leap to the insults regardless of the person you're addressing and the topic on which you're pontificating, but I suppose you can't help yourself.

Fewer logical fallacies, at the very least, would lend you some credibility, and you need as much as you can get.


The MadPanda, FCD

Look who's talking about projection, and being obsessed and quick to insult.

The hypocrisy here is mind boggling.

Credibility? You don't have a clue about credibility.

Why are you talking to that mirror, JoeyKris?

When I'm polite, you're abusive.  Therefore, there is no point in playing nice-nice with you.

Throughout this joyous ritual you have demonstrated a tendency towards being obtuse, mean-spirited, hypocritical (constantly), intellectually dishonest, and only too willing to commit fallacy after fallacy, all while insulting people who point out your errors.

One wonders why you insist on demonstrating your childishness at such lengths, and with such enthusiasm.  You certainly cannot be taken seriously.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/25 00:50:37, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Kris @ Jan. 25 2011,00:28)
You, polite??

Wow.

Just because you have forgotten, or were not paying attention because it did not fuel your persecution complex, does not mean I have not at times been more civil to you than your conduct deserves.  Others here and back on PT have also been polite, even to the point of giving you the benefit of the doubt.  For this grandmotherly kindness, we have been rewarded with venom, bile, and threats of violence.

I am thus no less polite than you deserve, and probably a great deal more gracious than I ought to be, all things considered.  Unless, of course, what you mean by 'uncivil' is 'not agreeing with me'.

Odd double standard you have there, son.

I am uncertain whether to classify you as a fraud or a poser, although these are not mutually exclusive.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/25 00:56:26, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Kris @ Jan. 25 2011,00:43)
Quote (OgreMkV @ Jan. 24 2011,12:20)
Hey Kris, just out of curiosity, are you aware that there are several predictions that arise out of String Theory and that there is at least one recorded observation that could be indicative of a cosmic string?

Just curious...

Predictions? Could be indicative..?  Show me a String.

There 'could' be a creator and/or designer, and many people would swear that they've observed evidence or proof of such. Is that enough to convince you?  It doesn't convince me, and neither do a lot of claims in science.

Okay, if you don't find a lot of claims in science convincing, what else have you got that's worth the time and trouble of using to figure out the world around you?

I'd go further and note that "a lot of claims" is a bit vague.  Which bodies of theory do you find unconvincing, please?  Be specific.  More importantly, are you familiar with the evidence underlying those theories, or are you going off of the (very poor quality) media coverage of them instead?


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/25 10:12:52, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Kris @ Jan. 25 2011,09:18)
Quote (Louis @ Jan. 25 2011,06:51)
Quote mines with links to the original in context quotes? That's....original as a method of quote mining.

That word you use, I do not think it means what you think it means.

Louis

The quotes he mined don't show the entire or accurate context.

You keep using that excuse for some reason.  It doesn't fly.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/25 10:16:57, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Kristine @ Jan. 25 2011,09:48)
Quote (Louis @ Jan. 25 2011,09:42)

OI! Some of us grown ups are sat in the office as opposed to the lab today and are desperately trying to avoid work thank you.
Louis

:D  Some of us must go to work and deal with people, ya slacker!  ;)

My reference to "Put a sock in it" was definitely for Kris, who is like the actress I described.

Be good, all! Time for me to clamp down on swear words and sunflower seeds, and tell the kiddies to make up their minds choosing between coloring, Uno, and checkers.

(salutes)

Best of luck on watch, Kristine.  I have just the one Cub to watch over, and she's trial enough!


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/25 10:23:05, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
From a layman's perspective, I would guess that it's both, in that the process and the results cannot be easily separated into discrete boxes.  (This may also be part of the reason why there are so many working definitions of 'species' out there.  :)  )

I would start muttering a bit about Hegel's Dialectic* here for a few minutes, as I am prone to doing, but someone might think I actually know what I'm talking about and take me for an authority.


The MadPanda, FCD


* Yes, I know, but it's still an interesting model if you can get around the original author's fundamental error in assuming a final perfect form.

Date: 2011/01/25 10:28:48, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (OgreMkV @ Jan. 25 2011,10:21)
Pretty soon, MP, you'll have to watch her and ALL the little male cubs that come calling.  

Me, I stuck with male offspring so only have one to worry about (well, that and Catholic priests).

Hey, Kris, just a question.  Are you going to comment on my post at the top of page 7?

That or the little girl cubs.  (Not saying that that'll happen, just admitting that I'm prepared for it.)  Fear not!  Prospective suitors will have to pass muster, for I am a prepared panda.

She's disarmingly cute, she is.  And she's very smart, which means that I'd have my work cut out for me even if I weren't planning on raising her on the classics (Sun Tzu, the Thirty-six Stratagems, Three Kingdoms...).  So Baba-Xiongmao must show he can plan several steps ahead.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/25 10:49:03, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Kris @ Jan. 25 2011,06:26)
Quote (MadPanda @ FCD,Jan. 24 2011,22:56)
 
Quote (Kris @ Jan. 25 2011,00:43)
 
Quote (OgreMkV @ Jan. 24 2011,12:20)
Hey Kris, just out of curiosity, are you aware that there are several predictions that arise out of String Theory and that there is at least one recorded observation that could be indicative of a cosmic string?

Just curious...

Predictions? Could be indicative..?  Show me a String.

There 'could' be a creator and/or designer, and many people would swear that they've observed evidence or proof of such. Is that enough to convince you?  It doesn't convince me, and neither do a lot of claims in science.

Okay, if you don't find a lot of claims in science convincing, what else have you got that's worth the time and trouble of using to figure out the world around you?

I'd go further and note that "a lot of claims" is a bit vague.  Which bodies of theory do you find unconvincing, please?  Be specific.  More importantly, are you familiar with the evidence underlying those theories, or are you going off of the (very poor quality) media coverage of them instead?


The MadPanda, FCD

Hmm, I wonder if there's one of those fancy schmancy, high falootin' Latin terms for what's going on in your sentence below? Hey, I know, it's argumentum bullshitum!

"Okay, if you don't find a lot of claims in science convincing, what else have you got that's worth the time and trouble of using to figure out the world around you?"

You assume that since I said there are a lot of claims in science that I don't find convincing, I must think that all science is useless and should be dispensed with, and that I must think there's a better way of figuring out the world. That's quite a leap you mistakenly took there.

Earlier, you accused me of not being polite, implying that my comments to you in relation to civility were somehow improper.  You have also repeatedly asked for a civil, serious discussion.

"Hypocrite" is not a strong enough word for you,you pathetic bottom-feeding half-witted miserable excuse for a cancer-ridden dog's pizzle.

You need to fucking read for fucking comprehension, you semiliterate jerkass.  I asked you to present examples, specifically, of the bodies of theory that you claim not to find convincing, which is not only pertinent to your little boy claims about science, but respectful of the seriousness with which an actual human being would have meant such a query.

Instead, you respond with abuse, sarcasm, bullshit, and more dodging.

"Lying hypocritical scumwad" is not strong enough for you.

You make Biggy look rational.  Now go fuck yourself anally with a dead porcupine and take your dumbass little crybaby fucktard bullshit somewhere else.

I'm done.  This muppet's a waste of effort.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/25 10:50:49, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Erasmus, FCD @ Jan. 25 2011,10:44)
so if you have an abortion, FtK don't give a fuck

but if you have an abortion and observe some part of the procedure, you are subhuman.  nice.

FTK can't help it.  She's fundamentally immoral, pretending to be good (it's the willingness to write people off as subhuman that does it).

Happens all the time.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/25 10:52:07, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (fnxtr @ Jan. 25 2011,10:39)
Quote (MadPanda @ FCD,Jan. 25 2011,08:28)
Quote (OgreMkV @ Jan. 25 2011,10:21)
Pretty soon, MP, you'll have to watch her and ALL the little male cubs that come calling.  

Me, I stuck with male offspring so only have one to worry about (well, that and Catholic priests).

Hey, Kris, just a question.  Are you going to comment on my post at the top of page 7?

That or the little girl cubs.  (Not saying that that'll happen, just admitting that I'm prepared for it.)  Fear not!  Prospective suitors will have to pass muster, for I am a prepared panda.

She's disarmingly cute, she is.  And she's very smart, which means that I'd have my work cut out for me even if I weren't planning on raising her on the classics (Sun Tzu, the Thirty-six Stratagems, Three Kingdoms...).  So Baba-Xiongmao must show he can plan several steps ahead.


The MadPanda, FCD

When I commented on how cute my buddy's 5-year-old daughter was, his response was "Yeah. I'm gonna have to buy a gun."

I have...other means at my disposal.   :D  Guns are so banal and familiar.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/25 10:54:53, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Or you accept that the question is meaningless because you're quibbling over the impotence of a figment of imagination as described in a poorly edited compilation of myths.

I concur that heddle's attempt at an end run is the second answer dressed up in funny clothing.  He can't help it, though.  He's Calvinist.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/25 10:55:39, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (khan @ Jan. 25 2011,10:52)
Quote (MadPanda @ FCD,Jan. 25 2011,11:49)
Quote
Earlier, you accused me of not being polite, implying that my comments to you in relation to civility were somehow improper.  You have also repeatedly asked for a civil, serious discussion.

"Hypocrite" is not a strong enough word for you,you pathetic bottom-feeding half-witted miserable excuse for a cancer-ridden dog's pizzle.

You need to fucking read for fucking comprehension, you semiliterate jerkass.  I asked you to present examples, specifically, of the bodies of theory that you claim not to find convincing, which is not only pertinent to your little boy claims about science, but respectful of the seriousness with which an actual human being would have meant such a query.

Instead, you respond with abuse, sarcasm, bullshit, and more dodging.

"Lying hypocritical scumwad" is not strong enough for you.

You make Biggy look rational.  Now go fuck yourself anally with a dead porcupine and take your dumbass little crybaby fucktard bullshit somewhere else.

I'm done.  This muppet's a waste of effort.


The MadPanda, FCD

I think I'm in love.

I'll warn Mrs. MP, then...   :D


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/25 11:06:08, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 25 2011,10:59)
Quote (MadPanda @ FCD,Jan. 25 2011,10:50)
Quote (Erasmus @ FCD,Jan. 25 2011,10:44)
so if you have an abortion, FtK don't give a fuck

but if you have an abortion and observe some part of the procedure, you are subhuman.  nice.

FTK can't help it.  She's fundamentally immoral, pretending to be good (it's the willingness to write people off as subhuman that does it).

Happens all the time.


The MadPanda, FCD

You'll have to point out where I've been inconsistent.

Reading comprehension failure.

I did not accuse you of being inconsistent (although in many ways you are, and can't help it, given the nature of your delusions).  I said you are fundamentally immoral.

You are inconsistent, however, in that on the one hand you can't understand why this stuff is so divisive and on the other hand you make sweeping generalizations that dehumanize others without regard to circumstance.  That's pretty silly.  Of course, given the nature of your delusions, you can't help that, either.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/25 11:27:43, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (khan @ Jan. 25 2011,11:25)
Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 25 2011,12:18)
Same lifestyle as I've lived from time to time.  You play, you pay.  I'm not be condescending.  I could bring up my past payments, but I don't particularly care to see this thread turn into a Jerry Springer circus.

I'm just stating the obvious...chill brother.

So what is the punishment for me & the doctor & the kind folks at the clinic?

She keeps repeating that she doesn't think their ought to be any legal punishment, all the while no doubt harboring thoughts that these sinners will be roasting in hell for all eternity...

Which is a funny way of saying that there ought not be any punishment, but there you go.  Her imaginary friend is a bit unpleasant that way.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/25 12:05:28, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Robin @ Jan. 25 2011,11:57)
[quote=MadPanda, FCD,Jan. 25 2011,10:49][/quote]
Quote
...you pathetic bottom-feeding half-witted miserable excuse for a cancer-ridden dog's pizzle.


"Dog pizzle...whoa!!"

Now, now! Careful there Panda...there are roolz of edikate on these here boards.





...dog pizzle...man...that's just...I can't stop laughing! That and dead porcupines (ooohh...owwww!) and such!

Ooh...gotta breath...gotta breath...lol!

Wait 'til I really get going!  (/Vizzini)

I prefer to reserve my talents in such matters for truly deserving targets, rather than the insipid waste of potential who keeps pulling on a shoe and dramatically announcing to all and sundry that it fits his foot perfectly.

This was a real-life application of the BF&I Rule, which accepts that after fifteen minutes of unsuccessful lockpicking even the most accomplished master thief will be overheard saying "oh, let's just break the @#$%er thing down".  Kind of like using reason and logic on Biggy.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/25 12:17:07, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 25 2011,12:05)
Hmmm...I always find it interesting to watch how people picture me.  It's funny....I don't harbor any feelings of hate for anyone.  What is the point?  I found out loooongggg ago that hate sucks...make ya feel horrible 24/7.  Life's too short.  

What kind of legal punishment could possibly be given?   I don't think I've ever heard pro-choice people offering possible ideas for punishing people legally who have had an abortion.  Honestly, it's never crossed my mind.  From where I stand, I've always wanted to see the numbers of abortions decrease by millions through education, counseling, etc..  I've never once considered someone who had an abortion evil.  Gawd...I'm a woman...I know full well what goes through one's mind when you become pregnant.  Come on....chill a little.

Pull ye the other one: you pass judgment at one remove and pretend that you don't, because it's all about what your imaginary friend wants.

You judge those who do not behave as you do, be they promiscuous, premarital, or gay...but you hide it behind nice language and friendly concern.  It's all about what your imaginary friend tells you is right.  It's all about the magic book with the magic words and unquestionable instructions.

Your very belief system entails consigning people with whom you do not agree to everlasting punishment on the basis of what a figment of your imagination is said to have commanded.  It certainly allows you to write others off as subhuman when it's convenient!  Or do you discard the doctrine of hell when it proves to be an embarrassment?  Whoops!  There goes the reason for obeying the Sky Daddy!

And yet, you think I am hateful because I point these uncomfortable truths out to you.  Funny, that.  Project much?


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/25 12:26:56, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 25 2011,12:17)
Let's say for a moment, that we all lived the life....one man/one woman forever Amen.

Let's suppose the moon is made of green cheese, while we're at it.

Let's just write off anyone who just happens to be different, say, because they're genetically inclined to prefer their own gender.  Or both.  (Another entry in the file of evidence that your imaginary friend is an asshole, by the way, is the growing documentation of same-sex attraction in other species.  Do pay attention!)

How about you go play in the World of Reality for a while?

By your fruits we know you, and it isn't a pretty picture.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/25 12:39:04, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 25 2011,12:34)
Quote (MadPanda @ FCD,Jan. 25 2011,12:17)
Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 25 2011,12:05)
Hmmm...I always find it interesting to watch how people picture me.  It's funny....I don't harbor any feelings of hate for anyone.  What is the point?  I found out loooongggg ago that hate sucks...make ya feel horrible 24/7.  Life's too short.  

What kind of legal punishment could possibly be given?   I don't think I've ever heard pro-choice people offering possible ideas for punishing people legally who have had an abortion.  Honestly, it's never crossed my mind.  From where I stand, I've always wanted to see the numbers of abortions decrease by millions through education, counseling, etc..  I've never once considered someone who had an abortion evil.  Gawd...I'm a woman...I know full well what goes through one's mind when you become pregnant.  Come on....chill a little.

Pull ye the other one: you pass judgment at one remove and pretend that you don't, because it's all about what your imaginary friend wants.

You judge those who do not behave as you do, be they promiscuous, premarital, or gay...but you hide it behind nice language and friendly concern.  It's all about what your imaginary friend tells you is right.  It's all about the magic book with the magic words and unquestionable instructions.

Your very belief system entails consigning people with whom you do not agree to everlasting punishment on the basis of what a figment of your imagination is said to have commanded.  It certainly allows you to write others off as subhuman when it's convenient!  Or do you discard the doctrine of hell when it proves to be an embarrassment?  Whoops!  There goes the reason for obeying the Sky Daddy!

And yet, you think I am hateful because I point these uncomfortable truths out to you.  Funny, that.  Project much?


The MadPanda, FCD

You know...this doesn't even make sense to me AT ALL.  

So, are you saying that since I hold to a particular moral standard that I see as the perfect goal, that I then should be fucking mean as hell to people who can't maintain that standard?  How in the holy hell would I be able to do that and live with myself????  Wouldn't that be incredibly, insanely hypocritical???  Why do I have to be unfriendly, and not show friendly concern?  Shit, I would certainly hope that there would be people out there concerned when I fuck up.  Luckily there have been!

I am stating what I hold to be the best possible way of living.  We all make mistakes and all have regrets.  Must, then, my next response be to damn everyone to hell?  That is RIDICULOUS.

Try reading for comprehension, ftk.

Are you saying that all that stuff about hellfire and damnation isn't to be taken seriously?

Do you deny that you earlier commented that it is your imaginary friend's business to judge?

Do you understand the concept of 'Minnesota nice'?  You're using it.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/25 12:51:29, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 25 2011,12:45)
lol....no one is going to hell just for having an abortion.

Right.  And you would know this, how, exactly?  And your credentials in this matter would be what, exactly?  (Forgive the snarky tone.  This isn't so different from FL or Biggy claiming to have the right interpretation of scripture, all others be damned.  Just because I LIKE your take on the matter doesn't mean I should just overlook the questions.)

Instead of telling this to us, why aren't you out trying to convince your fellow believers of this?  Because this makes you the first (Christian) pro-birther I've ever heard make this (welcome and encouraging) concession...and there are a whole lot of others who haven't gotten the memo.

I would add that, all snark on my part aside, I do find your commitment to reducing the number of abortions by education and other means of birth control to be more consistent and helpful than the usual noise that results.  Credit where it's due...


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/25 13:06:43, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 25 2011,12:57)
"Try reading for comprehension, ftk."

OK

"Are you saying that all that stuff about hellfire and damnation isn't to be taken seriously?"

IN REGARD TO WHAT?  ABORTION?  DO I THINK THERE IS A HELL?  YES.  DO I THINK THAT BECAUSE YOU HAVE AN ABORTION, YOU'RE GOING TO HELL?  NO.

"Do you deny that you earlier commented that it is your imaginary friend's business to judge?"

OF COURSE NOT...IT'S *ONLY* HIS PLACE TO JUDGE.  IT IS MY PLACE TO SHARE MY VIEWS IN REGARD TO GOALS BEST STRIVED FOR.

"Do you understand the concept of 'Minnesota nice'?  You're using it."

NO, NOR DO I CARE.  I AM BEING ME...I WILL NOT BE MEAN (UNLESS I LOSE IT EMOTIONALLY) TO PEOPLE WHO HOLD DIFFERENT VIEWS THAN I DO JUST TO MAKE YOU FEEL BETTER FOR SOME WEIRD TWISTED REASON.  THAT'S NO WHO I AM, AND IT'S NOT HOW I FEEL REGARDLESS OF THE GOD FACTOR OR NOT.

Here's the thing.

You judge, all right.  You are perfectly willing to write other people off for not believing in your imaginary friend, or following your oh-so-perfect interpretation of your magic book with magic words...but you pretend that it's all your imaginary friend's doing.  That's an abdication of responsibility.  It's also deliberately acting in bad faith.  It's 'Minnesota nice' of you.

Why are you getting so upset over this?  It's all just whispers, isn't it?  It ought not be so divisive.  Remember?


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/25 13:12:06, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (dheddle @ Jan. 25 2011,13:04)
Quote (MadPanda @ FCD,Jan. 25 2011,12:51)
 
Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 25 2011,12:45)
lol....no one is going to hell just for having an abortion.

Right.  And you would know this, how, exactly?  And your credentials in this matter would be what, exactly?  (Forgive the snarky tone.  This isn't so different from FL or Biggy claiming to have the right interpretation of scripture, all others be damned.  Just because I LIKE your take on the matter doesn't mean I should just overlook the questions.)

Instead of telling this to us, why aren't you out trying to convince your fellow believers of this?  Because this makes you the first (Christian) pro-birther I've ever heard make this (welcome and encouraging) concession...and there are a whole lot of others who haven't gotten the memo.

I would add that, all snark on my part aside, I do find your commitment to reducing the number of abortions by education and other means of birth control to be more consistent and helpful than the usual noise that results.  Credit where it's due...


The MadPanda, FCD

You are kidding, right? Ftk is absolutely correct in this theological point--and it is broad-based Christianity 101. That is, Christianity teaches that you go to heaven if you have placed your faith in the power of Christ's death to atone for your sins. And if you don't, then you don't. On that there is nearly universal agreement--so much so that that is as good of a working definition of Christianity that you can find.

The consequence of which is:

If you have had abortions and have the aforementioned saving faith, you are saved.

If you devote your entire life to charity yet lack this faith, then you are lost.

The are a lot of details about which have internecine  warfare--such as how the faith is acquired, but on what I just wrote--no disagreement to speak of.  

We must associate with different Christians--because I never heard even one say "if you have an abortion you will go to hell." If I did, I'd be tempted to smack him.

Heddle, I understand that you can't help it because you're a Calvinist, but since I consider Calvinism to be an immoral doctrine at best, your interpretation of ftk isn't helpful here.

Here you go with the argument from incredulity again!  You have either redefined Christian to mean an incredibly tiny subset of the whole, or you have some heavy-duty blinders on.

There is a reason I refer to your variation of the imaginary friend as a monster, but that's a completely different discussion for another time.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/25 13:26:03, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 25 2011,13:13)
The capitals weren't to be equated with yelling or being upset..lol.  Just a way to respond so it's easy to read who said what.

Somehow I find it difficult to treat that claim credibly.  Can't think why.

Oh, right.  Because I've known too many Christians.  (/Inigo Montoya)  For that matter, I was one until the Biggys and FLs and heddles encouraged me to apply Occam's Chainsaw a bit more broadly.  But that's off topic.

I ask again--why should I take your interpretation of this matter more seriously than that being pushed forward by so many of your co-religionists?


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/25 13:33:28, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (dheddle @ Jan. 25 2011,13:25)
Nice try (not really)  but alas there is no Calvinism in my post. Being saved by faith in the finished work of Christ is a doctrine shared by the majority of Christians. Calvinists, non-Calvinists, Protestants, and Catholics.

That's about the third time you used "heddle is a Calvinist" as a blunt instrument. If you want a piece of advice--wait until I actually make an argument from Calvinism before you use it as an argument stopper.

Sorry, heddle, but mercy is for the merciful.  Your opinion on these matters is well known, as is your affiliation.  And since, in my opinion, your opinions on these matters come from your particular denomination's interpretation, I will continue to refer to this fact.  

If you feel I have misrepresented or misquoted you, of course, I would expect you to point it out...but let there be no misunderstanding--you are a Calvinist, as you have said so yourself many times.  It is hardly unfair of me to refer to you as such.

Since nobody is forcing you to read my posts, nor to respond to them, you might as well simply ignore them.  It isn't as though I have any plans of trying to change your mind.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/25 13:43:53, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 25 2011,13:36)
Quote (MadPanda @ FCD,Jan. 25 2011,13:26)
Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 25 2011,13:13)
The capitals weren't to be equated with yelling or being upset..lol.  Just a way to respond so it's easy to read who said what.

Somehow I find it difficult to treat that claim credibly.  Can't think why.

Oh, right.  Because I've known too many Christians.  (/Inigo Montoya)  For that matter, I was one until the Biggys and FLs and heddles encouraged me to apply Occam's Chainsaw a bit more broadly.  But that's off topic.

I ask again--why should I take your interpretation of this matter more seriously than that being pushed forward by so many of your co-religionists?


The MadPanda, FCD

Who's asking you to?  I'm long past the point of carrying whether people believe me or not.  Did years ago, but really doesn't matter much to me anymore.

So you are unable to answer the question.  I see.  Thank you.

Next contestant, please...


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/25 13:54:37, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (dheddle @ Jan. 25 2011,13:42)
No you haven't misquoted me or insulted me or anything of that nature. Nor have you been unfair, per se. What you did was argue ad hominem. "Heddle is a Calvinist" is not relevant when the point I am making has nothing to do with Calvinism. For example, we can ask FtK (whom I do not believe is a Calvinist) if she agrees with my working definition of Christianity--that salvation comes from having faith in the work of Christ to atone for your sins. For crying out loud, you could ask Wes. Actually you could ask anyone who has studied Christianity for more than 15 minutes.

While I did not intend to ad hom you, I will admit the possibility that I did so.  I intended that to be descriptive rather than dismissive--there are some lines of argument one must expect from a Calvinist, and you run true to form.  That I find your arguments less than convincing is not the same as saying that I expect, say, ftk to agree with that assessment.  You do, however, use slightly arguments than, say, a Jesuit would.  Hence the repetition.

Why do you assume I don't know anything about Christianity, exactly?


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/25 14:02:35, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 25 2011,13:50)
I don't even know what matter exactly you are talking about at this point?  Be specific.

Why?  You aren't interested in answering an honest question.  And if you're not interested, I'm certainly not going to force you.

But since you want me to be specific:

Committing a murder will get someone sent to hell, right?

And abortion is murder, yes?

But an abortion will not get someone sent to hell...even though it's murder, and even though a lot of other Christians say that it will.  (Heddle's incredulity aside, he doesn't speak for every possible sect, and frankly his 'common ground' is a bit like describing Led Zepplin's farewell concert as four guys on stage playing instruments.  Accurate but not quite complete.)

So the question is, even though I find your interpretation a refreshing change of pace, why should I take it seriously?  Why is your interpretation better than, say, the Pope's?  Jerry Falwell's?  Joel Osteen's? FL's?


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/25 14:31:35, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 25 2011,14:22)
i mean above....lol

I think I understand them pretty well.  It's this ridiculous 'get out of jail free' card that puzzles me, 'cause it's only available to people who agree with them, which seems neither just nor particularly coherent.

But you don't judge, obviously.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/25 14:48:27, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (dheddle @ Jan. 25 2011,14:25)
Ok, I don't get this. I didn't get when Lenny did it either. I mean, what is the pleasure derived from asking questions about one's religion--only to add "why should I believe you rather than [insert some other Christian, preferably as unattractive one as is possible] or my pizza man?"

In the abstract it is a fair question--but what's the fun in the exercise? Especially when the person keeps saying I'm not asking you to believe me. I'm just answering your question.

Either you ask because you are intellectually curious about what the person's answer will be or you don't ask. But asking and then following up with "why should I believe you and not, say, Fred Phelps?" seems a bit tiresome.

I mean, really, does this:

Q: will I go to hell if I have an abortion?
A: no you don't go to hell for having an abortion.
Q: why should I believe your answer instead of Jerry Falwell's answer?

actually seem productive? Or demonstrative? Or in lieu of anything substantive does is it at least have the virtue of being clever and funny?

Personally I think not.

Given the number of varying opinions on certain supposedly absolute truths, each of which claims to be exclusive, and for rejecting which one is often threatened with eternal unpleasantness, it would be intellectually dishonest not to hold each of them to the same standard.  Where that standard is not satisfied, further examination is required.

Is it tedious?  Yes, as is listening to sermons and lectures from people who are absolutely sure that their beliefs are the only correct ones, and everybody else is going to suffer for eternity.

But until your ilk stop preachifying at me and quoting your magic book with magic words as if it means something, and demanding respect for your imaginary friend upon threat of eternal suffering, I'm going to be playing the gadfly.

Don't like?  Don't read...and don't preach unless you want to have those questions thrown at you.

"I don't see the fun in it."

There is no fun at all in being badgered about eternal suffering because one cannot with intellectual honesty and integrity accept a ridiculous little fairy tale with a healthy side order of 'blame the victim' as a positive world view.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/25 15:17:22, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 25 2011,15:00)
By agreeing with them, you mean agreeing that we believe what the Christian faith says about who will and who will not be going to Heaven?  

Why should this puzzle you....why do you care?  This is what I don't understand.

From what I can tell, quite a few of you believe the exact same thing that I do about abortion....so why the argument ?  

You should have no issues about the "get out of jail (I think you're meaning hell) free card".  You should be worried about legislation on abortion only.  Hell doesn't have anything to do with this issue.

We ARE worried about legislation.  If you haven't noticed, there are a whole bunch of people who claim to be on your team who are working very hard to make it illegal, hard to get, expensive...without also expanding and improving education and other services to make it rare.

So long as one side insists on grouping in late-term abortions done to save the health of the mother in with stereotyped birth control carelessness, there will be argument.  

Go talk to your coreligionists about it instead of arguing with us.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/26 09:52:01, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Bradford keeps using that phrase 'free thinkers'.  I do not think it means what he thinks it means. (/Inigo Montoya)

Betcha he's one of those folks who likes to use Marxist, Communist, Stalinist, Maoist, Socialist, and Fascist as if they're interchangeable, too.

(eyeroll)

Whatta maroon.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/27 11:09:15, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Louis @ Jan. 27 2011,10:45)
Quote (J-Dog @ Jan. 27 2011,15:28)
Quote (Schroedinger's Dog @ Jan. 27 2011,09:18)
î PotW?

Hell, Louis should get POTW just for this bon mot!

 
Quote
And brother, you came in with an empty dance card and were shouting for partners from word one. It's almost like you wanted dancing. And...to mix metaphors even further...we all know where dancing leads don't we Kris? It leads to you getting fucked.

I have to admit I was rather proud of that mixed metaphor. It's not the best but it made I larf!

That's not a good thing is it?

Louis

P.S. That's 3 PotW nominations for this week. I demand my PotW last for at least 2 minutes, possibly 2 and a half!

That's actually pretty good*, Louis.  I might have to borrow that for my sig (since Imma having trouble coming up with something appropriate).

:D


The MadPanda, FCD


* read 'bloody brilliant!' in your best Rupert Grint voice.

Date: 2011/01/27 11:12:00, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Louis @ Jan. 27 2011,10:58)
Quote (OgreMkV @ Jan. 27 2011,16:55)
Quote (Louis @ Jan. 27 2011,10:51)
 
Quote (Kris @ Jan. 25 2011,06:25)
[SNIP]

Oh, by the way, I'm more than "big" enough to kick your pansy ass any day.

[SNIP]

I missed this earlier. Ladies and Gentlemen we have a fully fledged Internet Tough Guy! These are my favourite netizen. I love an ITG.

Now, Kris, please could you tell us precisely how, when and where you are going to kick any of our pansy asses? Are you, for example, really a secret mixed martial artist and actually 6 foot 7 inches tall, 240lb of solid muscle and an all in wrestler? I bet you're really, really, big and tough aren't you. Come on, tell us all about it. Could you also please tell us how you are in the Secret Service/Bloods/Crips/Mafia/Whatever and you "know people" who can have us all killed.

Thanks in advance.

Louis (Official Piss Taking Bastard for the London 2012 Olympics)

"No matter how subtle the wizard, a knife between the shoulder blades will seriously cramp his style." - Vlad Taltos

"No matter how ridiculous the internet tough guy, a thorough mocking is more effective than a swift kick to the gentleman fruit with a hobnailed boot"

Louis

Posted too soon!  I like this one LOTS better!  I can haz for sig line, plz?

:D  :D  :D  :D


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/27 11:27:14, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Louis @ Jan. 27 2011,11:23)
I have no ability to control what other people take for their signatures. It's tragic, I say these things and people find them funny/sig worthy. It's a terrible burden. I'm writing to my MP and what have you. I demand respect for my privacy or something.

Louis

P.S. Replacing the word "fruit" with the word "vegetables" improves the scansion IMO. You may go with what you will. ;-)

This is true, that you have no control, but it would be discourteous not to ask first.   :D


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/27 11:32:13, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Louis @ Jan. 27 2011,11:28)
Quite, quite. However, one question. When you typed your request was your pinky finger extended or unextended?

Louis

Unextended.  I was typing (with both hands) and needed them for the usual purposes.

Alas, I fail the posher standards test...but what can be expected from someone who likes a little bamboo with his afternoon tea?   :D


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/27 12:03:49, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Louis @ Jan. 27 2011,11:39)
No, no. You did well. The extended pinky finger is the hallmark of the social climbing middle classes who call the lavatory a toilet or, heaven forbid, a dinner jacket a dress suit. They may even be found referring to the Knave in a deck of cards as the Jack! Of all things!

You have my permission, sir.

{bows}

Louis

Well, on every deck of cards in the house except for the pair of (Spanish?  Italian?) bridge/whist decks and the Swedish one, that card has a 'J' in the corner and are thus Jacks or Johns.  The other two both say 'Kn', so would be Knaves.

I suspect this may be one of those Queen's English/American English divides.   :p

What do you fellows call the Queen of Spades?


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/27 15:49:49, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 27 2011,14:52)
Truth be told, I don't think...

Fixed that for you.

:p

But you don't judge...only your imaginary friend does that, right?  Amazing how what your imaginary friend doesn't like is always so in line with your own squicked-out viewpoint.  Truly incredible.

Does your imaginary friend permit an exception in case of rape, incest, the health and welfare of the mother, or delays caused by small minded bureaucratic twits?


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/27 17:21:40, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 27 2011,16:00)
Quote (MadPanda @ FCD,Jan. 27 2011,15:49)
Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 27 2011,14:52)
Truth be told, I don't think...

Fixed that for you.

:p

But you don't judge...only your imaginary friend does that, right?  Amazing how what your imaginary friend doesn't like is always so in line with your own squicked-out viewpoint.  Truly incredible.

Does your imaginary friend permit an exception in case of rape, incest, the health and welfare of the mother, or delays caused by small minded bureaucratic twits?


The MadPanda, FCD

lol....we've gone over all that too...

Hun, I honestly think you have a serious God fixation.  Get past it....might make your life less stressful.

You don't seem to think very much, period.

I don't have a fixation on your imaginary friend.  I do have an acute awareness of the problems caused by delusional people who use their imaginary friends as an excuse to be small-minded judgmental inquisitors and stick their prejudices and presuppositions into other people's lives.

There is a difference between the two, not that you seem to grasp this.

Just as you fail to grasp that your stance is neither consistent nor particularly moral (in that you seem quite happy to impose costs on others that you are unwilling to bear yourself, and to deny your responsibility in imposing them).

But as long as you don't judge other people's choices, I guess that's okay, isn't it?


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/27 17:22:41, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (khan @ Jan. 27 2011,15:56)
Her imaginary friend has a very large penis.

You owe me a new monitor.  This one's got coffee all over it.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/27 17:26:29, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Louis @ Jan. 27 2011,17:19)
Quote (OgreMkV @ Jan. 27 2011,18:16)
Quote (Wolfhound @ Jan. 27 2011,12:00)
 
Quote (Erasmus @ FCD,Jan. 27 2011,11:45)
if you are looking callously use the other hand.  or some lotion

Aw, c'mon, now.  Louis doesn't need to use that stuff.  He's married, you know, and...oh...wait...nevermind.

Erm, as you were...

That's what married means.  You sleep together, but you can't get none.

That's not true. The good lady wife and I engaged in conjugal unpleasantness quite recently. Twenty eight months ago to be precise. I now have a nineteen month old son. You don't think we will be doing it again do you? Look what happened last time! Gadzooks, it's positively un-British!

Louis

And now I have that song from Monty Python's The Meaning Of Life stuck in my head.

I would be vexed, but it has rather chased off the other song that was in there, which was at least an improvement over the Macarena...

...oh, damn...


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/27 18:27:15, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (Ftk @ Jan. 27 2011,17:48)
Uh, no.  This I never claimed to be true.  I can't know His mind other than what I read in scripture, and some of it is not in black and white.

And now we're back to those oh so very dreary questions "how do you know?" and "why should we accept your interpretation over someone else's?"

Your claim to know your imaginary friend's mind is pretty funny, though.  Are you a mind reader of mythical proportions as well?


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/28 16:10:54, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
False equivalence, there, Heddle...about what one might expect, but still, you're off your game here.  PZ Myers speaks only for PZ Myers, and he'll be the first person to tell you so...as you probably know.

Earlier, you say that Palin, Beck, Limbaugh, and Phelps are not representative of the Christian community.  Then you say you didn't say they aren't true Christians.

What you mean, obviously, is that three of these people are not clergy and have no official influence with any formally recognized denomination.  Phelps is clergy and does have official influence, but mercifully only holds sway over a tiny flock.

Unfortunately, what someone who isn't you sees in your response is "these people aren't really representative of a Christian attitude" even though they claim to be Christians, come from a Christian background, tout their credentials as true believers, slam their opposition as unChristian, et cetera.  

Nice try, but no cigar.  Splitting semantic frog hairs?  No True Scotsman, more like.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/29 12:01:43, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (dheddle @ Jan. 29 2011,08:31)
Apparently if you like what a Christian says--probably because it is dumb and is easy to attack--then that is what qualifies them as bonafide "representative."

I do not think it is possible for you to miss the point any more blatantly than this.  So let's try it again, shall we?

These people are Christians, yes?  (Even if they aren't True Christians by your reckoning, or aren't acting in an acceptably Christ-like manner by, say, John Kwok's reckoning.)

These people use their Christianity as a justification, rationale, and motivation for their heated rhetoric and inflammatory denunciations of the 'other'.

They are also popular to varying degrees (Phelps being an exception) whose pronouncements do not meet a storm of disapproval from pulpits (or at least no storm that is ever fully reported).  They are certainly not held up as shameful examples of excess by their crowds of adoring fans, who seem to hold the same shallow, silly, childish view of the world that they publicly espouse.  Quite the opposite.

That makes them a representative sample, whether or not you like it, whether or not anyone's officially asked that they become the public voice.  Your attempt to dodge your (collective) responsibility in this matter is pretty pathetic.


The MadPanda, FCD

Date: 2011/01/29 20:34:49, Link
Author: MadPanda, FCD
Quote (dheddle @ Jan. 29 2011,12:48)
Quote (MadPanda @ FCD,Jan. 29 2011,12:01)
   
Quote (dheddle @ Jan. 29 2011,08:31)
Apparently if you like what a Christian says--probably because it is dumb and is easy to attack--then that is what qualifies them as bonafide "representative."

I do not think it is possible for you to miss the point any more blatantly than this.  So let's try it again, shall we?

These people are Christians, yes?  (Even if they aren't True Christians by your reckoning, or aren't acting in an acceptably Christ-like manner by, say, John Kwok's reckoning.)

These people use their Christianity as a justification, rationale, and motivation for their heated rhetoric and inflammatory denunciations of the 'other'.

They are also popular to varying degrees (Phelps being an exception) whose pronouncements do not meet a storm of disapproval from pulpits (or at least no storm that is ever fully reported).  They are certainly not held up as shameful examples of excess by their crowds of adoring fans, who seem to hold the same shallow, silly, childish view of the world that they publicly espouse.  Quite the opposite.

That makes them a representative sample, whether or not you like it, whether or not anyone's officially asked that they become the public voice.  Your attempt to dodge your (collective) responsibility in this matter is pretty pathetic.


The MadPanda, FCD

The MadPanda, FCD

   
Quote
(Even if they aren't True Christians by your reckoning, )


Since I never, ever make a claim regarding who is a True Christian,--you can kiss my ass for implying that I do.

   
Quote
That makes them a representative sample, whether or not you like it,


Are you being disingenuous on purpose, or is this concept too difficult to grasp?

Once again: I didn't say they were not a representative sample, I said, they do not represent Christianity. They are not the same. There are an infinite number of groups that are representative of Christianity. They are not (duh) our official representatives.  Even though they are representative samples, they speak only for themselves.

   
Quote
whose pronouncements do not meet a storm of disapproval from pulpits (or at least no storm that is ever fully reported).


We are talking about abortion violence. Give me one example of, say, Palin supporting violence against abortion doctors or clinics.

And the standard, by the way, asinine. Reporters do not come in to garden variety churches and listen to whether someone like Phelps is denounced. If they did, they would in fact hear Phelps being denounced with regularity. (As an example, my previous church was threatened by Phelps because our pastor wrote a letter condemning Westboro Baptist.)

Have you heard a lot of reporting on the thoughts of common man-in-the-street atheists about whether they support some of Pete Singers more outrageous "ethics"? Have you seen reporting about whether the atheist next door thinks it is a good idea to desecrate a communion wafer and a Koran and to describe pictures of aborted fetuses as meat?

I haven't--but I'm not pinheaded enough to assume that the onus is on the typical atheist to make me fully aware--to my ever-changing standard of satisfaction-- that he is appalled by bad behavior from some fellow atheists. Nor do I assume, just because he hasn't told me otherwise, that just because some jackasses like PZ are famous--that  that means they are representatives of atheism.

(Yes I know, PZ would not claim that he is atheism's representative. Do you have a link where Sarah Palin announces that she is Christianity's representative?)

I see a coward who dodges the issue, abdicates his moral responsibility, and refuses to face unpleasant facts, all the while breezily insisting that anyone who disagrees with him doesn't understand the essence of his delusions.

You have been known to play the No True Scotsman card, sirrah, and to do so with abandon.  That you here indulge in semantic nit-picking of Kris-like proportions in order to avoid admitting it is not surprising in the least, but is very, very disappointing.

By the fruits of your bretheren, and their failure to own up to the consequences, we know you...all too well.

I invite you to stick your fat head into a barrel of overripe squishy pomegranates and whistle Dixie.


The MadPanda, FCD

 

 

 

=====