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Date: 2006/01/27 07:54:01, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Well, I personally can't seem to find any solid definition for IC that doesn't change on a weekly/daily/as necessary basis.  What gets me chuckling every single time the subject comes up though, is a picture of Mr. Behe sitting in a courtroom Oh-So-Seriously talking about some bacterium Self-flagellating while intoning something in Latin.  Think Holy Grail.  Yep, I need to grow up, but yep, it's funny.  How Judge Jones kept a straight face, I'll never know.

Date: 2006/01/27 08:05:35, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Oh, come on.  You know Carol.  If you want to know what she thinks, buy the book.  You know the one.  The one, single, holy, divinely inspired, has no errors, doesn't conflict with science, says the sun went round the earth backward, "kill every man, woman, child, and animal on that land because I'm giving it to my chosen people", translated by a fella she just happens to be doing business for book.

Date: 2006/01/27 08:19:17, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Wow, I've read a little on this at a couple of sites.  This is the kind of stuff that really gets my interest and attention.  Frankly, I don't give a rat's ass about the shuttle, the moon, mars, or our cute yellow star for any other reason than getting to these places is the first step in getting someplace interesting.  I'm waiting for the day I (more likely my grand or great grand children) can get on a star ship and GO to some other rocky planet and talk to the locals.  (My first question would be "excuse me, are you the intelligent designer?") Of course, they'll all speak English.
Seriously, before I die, I just want to go to one place where life has evolved other than Earth, just to see what it looks like.  Every discovery like this brings us one step closer to doing just that.

Date: 2006/01/27 14:31:09, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Just came across this article on
World without Pain is ####

So is the ID an Idiot or just an AHole?  Really.  What kind of being would supposedly do something like this to a child?

I'm finding a lot of sites that discuss what the genetic defect is, but not much dealing with research in fixing it.  Honestly, most of the technical stuff is over my head (I'm a carpenter, not a doctor, Jim! ) but the short version seems to be "he has a messed up gene".  I sort of get that this is an example of genetic mutation, right?  

Anyone want to dumb the science down for me?  What sort of research is going on that might hold hope for correcting such a problem?  Perhaps an explanation in English for this page- Oxford Journals ?

At the end of the Oxford Journal page, the author comments about developing a drug, but how would the drug work?  Is it a matter of somehow swapping out the defective gene, or getting some gene that's "off" to turn "on" or something?

Oh, and if it's ok, could we keep the "if you eat steak, you get cow DNA" type of nonsense to a minimum?

Date: 2006/03/08 09:20:52, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Well said, Julie.  All of the above are completely Irrelevent to science.  Light still travels the same speed, organisms evolve, and if I add two H's to an O, I still get water.  A person's god, gods, or godess (or lack thereof) are about as relevent as the tooth fairy.

I have recently come to the conclusion (because some bible thumper knocked on my door on a Saturday morning and asked me "well what are you?") that I am neither theist, nor atheist.  I hereby declare myself an irreleventist.  I give permission to anyone who cares to, to join the church of irrelevence, to spread the gospel, and snicker at everyone else, so long as they remember that I coined the phrase.  Ramen.

Date: 2006/03/08 09:55:21, Link
Author: Lou FCD
J.G. suggested that  "Having a real evolutionary biologist co-author will help you, er, avoid such mistakes."

So will a big stick to knock some sense in.

Date: 2006/05/25 05:06:02, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I see a slippery slope with the "x is ok, but 1.2x is abuse" thing.  I don't claim to know where to draw the line, but clearly a line must be drawn somewhere.

I am also an ex-fundy.  Before getting sucked in, I wanted nothing more in life than to be an astonomer and/or astrophysicist.  Once the hook was in, I withdrew from public school and paid my own way through christian high school, where most of the non-religion classes were comprised of material I learned in grade school.  I then attended Bob Jones University in SC.  At the end of the first semester, I was asked to leave Blow Job U. because I was asking too many questions and not liking the answers I got.  It was just the beginning of a long road of awakening from a drug-induced-coma-like state.

I then spent quite a few years drifting around through life, became an electrician by accident, and though I eventually tried to go back to college, I didn't finish.  Being a single dad, divorced, and working in a bar wasn't terribly conducive to getting an education.  I'm not whining, and I know it's certainly possible to do, but it's much harder than being 18 with support from home.  It's a situation I should never have been in, and indeed would not have been in, were it not for the creeps peddling this crap.

Look, I am personally 100% responsible for the choices I make and I make no bones about that.  But the fundgelical movement absolutely, positively caused harm in my case.  Though I have long since dumped most of the emotional baggage of fairy-tale bullshit, twenty years on I'm still feeling the effects and consequences of what I allowed those freaks to do to me.  And I'm still pissed about it.

Hard-core fundyism is child abuse, plain and simple, and should be stopped.


(After previewing this post, I see I have much more anger to deal with than I thought.  Yet, I believe my point still stands.)

Date: 2006/05/25 07:30:47, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Arden Chatfield concluded:


It'll have to be rammed through by corrupt judges and politicians.

And creationists with tire irons, apparently.

Date: 2006/05/27 07:24:44, Link
Author: Lou FCD

Just a quick drive-by.

Thanks for starting this topic, I believe it's a rather important and thought provoking subject.

While I've been chewing on this quite a bit, I'm still a little too angry to post anything substantive and sane just yet.  (I've really been pissed over this since you've brought it up, and it's a good thing strangely enough.)

Just to clarify something I said earlier, though, when I returned to college in the mid nineties, it was to a real University... Marshall U. in WV.  (This would probably not be a good time for any WVU folks out there to chime in, just in case the thought crossed your itty bitty minds.   :p  )

On second thought, let me throw this out there:

The fundy mantra goes along the lines of:

"If you don't accept Jesus in your heart as your Lord and Master and personal Savior, and ignore those scientists, with their 'man came from monkeys' and their 'billions of years' lies, Jesus will send you straight to he11 where you will burn in torture and torment for all eternity."

The preceding is (for anyone born and raised on some other planet who may never have heard this explicitly stated) neither parody nor caricature.

How is this not, by anyone's definition, child abuse?

The speaker has:
1. Invoked the ultimate, omniscient, invisible authority
2. Demanded unquestioned self-abasement and servitude to that authority
3. Insisted that irrational delusion replace observed reality which in turn can only harm the ability of the listener in question to function
4. Threatened not only harm, but eternal, unspeakable torture as the only alternative to #2 and #3 above

This is not even in the same ball park as "Billy do your homework or you'll work at McDonny's Booger Joint for the rest of your life".  Yes, I'm paraphrasing, and I admit I dropped the maternal suicide clause from the statement earlier in the thread.  I don't know that "Mommy will kill herself" is an oft repeated refrain, and in context I don't think Joe meant it was.

I have to insist that the fundy statement is orders of magnitude more detrimental than the Booger Joint statement, with or without the involuntary matricide clause.   (Maternal suicide or involuntary matricide - you be the judge)

Ok, "quick drive-by" evolved into "rambling diatribe" and "biting missive", so I'm off to experience and examine more internal (but hemorrhaging) anger.

Peace.  (I'm aware of the irony of that statement in this post, shut up.)


Date: 2006/05/27 08:49:54, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Haha...  I just took This Trip Down Memory Lane, which occured just after I began lurking here and at the Thumb proper.

I found the book at and it made a great impression on me.

A year later, it's still funny.



Date: 2006/05/27 09:38:54, Link
Author: Lou FCD

As you know, Sir Nastyness-Of-The-Lower-Appendages, I have a vested interest in this conversation.

Air it out on the abuse thread, if you would be so kind.



Seriously though, this definitely deserves mention over there.  And I'm really surprised there's not more conversation going on in that thread.  Maybe I dun skared 'em all off!

Date: 2006/05/27 10:30:43, Link
Author: Lou FCD
'tsall good, STJ.  

I assumed that anything relevent to that conversation would make it over there.  I'm just goofin' to blow off some steam, interjecting annoyances wherever I can, just to crack myself up.  This can freely be sent to TBW.  In fact, I don't believe I've ever been sent there.  Not once.  Hey, you're not somebody 'til you've been sent there.  Even Inspector Clouser's been sent there like a million times.  I've dreamt of saying something that gets sent there.  I'm obsessing.  I'm up at night.  I read TBW to get pointers on how to get there indirectly.  (Am I there yet?) (If not, what can I do better?) Lenny goes there all the time, and he even says stuff that makes sense.  Of course, it's OT cause he's responding to some nutjob who says something OT and they need a good verbal smackdown, but still.

How about:

Hey, if birds came from tyranosauruses, how come we still...



Date: 2006/05/27 10:43:39, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Yeah, but it's not the same as getting tossed there.  It's like cheating.  And I thought OT stuff from here got sent there, too.  There's probably a rule like Oldham's, too, where it doesn't work if you do it on purpose.


As far as "were you there?" arguments like Hovind's go, that's just dumb.  I wasn't there when men landed on the moon, but only an idiot  would suggest... oh wait.  Point taken.

Date: 2006/05/27 12:58:43, Link
Author: Lou FCD

I'd be lying if I said I'd never thought about any of what you've mentioned.  But honestly I see several problems/issues.

1.  I'm sure whatever statutes of limitations in place at the time have run out.
2.  There's no way this country is ready to see such things as child abuse.  Freedom of religion is still seen as freedom to be a christian, although I think there is a very gentle eddy in this stream that may one day become a full strength back-current.  Look at the soldier's widow still fighting to get a wiccan symbol on his tombstone.  Even if she succeeds, I am willing to bet that tombstone doesn't remain undefaced for more than a month.  "Can't have them evil devil worshiping symbols in our Christian Country's Military Cemeteries, you know.  Damage for Jesus."
3.  I'm much closer geographically to the previously mentioned Blow Job U than when I grew up, and have a genuine safety concern for my family.  I won't even put an FSM logo (man I want one of those) on my car here.  Humor and respect for others is beyond the comprehension of a fundy.  I'm not willing to be so publically "out" as it were, as an irreleventist.  (Seems to me, labeling me as an atheist is about as dumb and about as relevent as labeling me as an atoothfairyist.  Technically true, I suppose, but completely meaningless.)  I'm sorry if that sounds irrational or offensive, but I was there, and I know better than to put anything at all past a fundy.  There is simply no depth to which they will not stoop to achieve a complete theocracy.
4.  I don't know that I'm willing or ready to really revisit that whole part of my life just yet in that way.  I wonder if there's an AA analog somewhere for this.

So although it's probably too late to do anything legal in my case, I'd be thrilled to see it go to court eventually, when a case actually had a chance to win.

Since leaving all that behind, I've bumped into exactly one of the 23 other students with whom I graduated high school.  Turns out, she was the one girl I really had the hots for back then (in a purely platonic way, of yeah).  She was married when I bumped into her, couple o' kids, working as the school secretary.  Still very cute.  We were chit chatting and she even asked why I never asked her out.  She'd have said yes.  But I think I might have used a very slight profanity in the course of the conversation, at which time the conversation sort of faded out and I could see she was still all wrapped up in all that.  I don't hold out much hope for any of the others.  It's just not that easy to escape from.

As for actions, Nick, and please understand I hold you in the highest regard, this IS an action.  If witholding medication from a child because of some freak superstition is child abuse because it's physically damaging to a child, why wouldn't f'ing up their head because of some freak superstition be child abuse because it's mentally damaging to the child?

And as for STJ's question, I'd posit it's much easier (and more entertaining) to verbally body slam an obvious blockhead.  The conversation in this thread is much less simple, has genuine room for gray area, and is much more likely to tread on taboos that are still deeply head by our society.  It was a very long time after leaving all that before the little nervous wince went away that occurred whenever I uttered the g-d word.

Date: 2006/05/27 14:53:31, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I bet these guys would know:

Checked out their message boards...  Overrun with fundys ie..."America is a Christian Nation", "Ban the ACLU", "Christians are persecuted because we can't force our superstition on everyone else", "Bush has a brain", and other  such nonsense.

In 1876, the congress passed a bill that the Bible should be the standard for all morality. Our Laws are based on the 10 Commandments and the mosaic law. It is time for some lawmaker to introduce a bill to confiscate the properties of ACLU under the statutes of RICO. Please contact your cognressmen and senators over this. This is long due. We must get this done for the future of America.

I'm going to keep poking around there for a while, but there seems to be a stance of "this is what defines a cult...unless it's Christianity, in which case shut up and do what Pastor Bob says Jesus said."

There is rebuttal going on, but it's all beside the point of what I'm looking for.

This page at that site looks a little more promising.

Thanks for that link, STJ.

I'm not sure I really see a distinction between letting your child die for lack of medical attention because of your superstition, which is apparently legal in 44 states (unless I'm misreading what PennyBright says about the extent of the religious exemption), and shooting or blowing up a planned parenthood medical professional because of your superstition.  In fact, I would argue that the former offense is even more morally reprehensible than the latter.  In a backwards-logic-insane kind of way, at least the crazy with the rifle thinks that he's saving lives.

I agree with Nick that while such egregious abuses are permitted in the name of religion, there will be no censure for anything lesser.

I would agree with this statement, again because I think fundy christians get a pass on the whole cult thing.

Hey, is the proper spelling "fundys" or "fundies"?  I'm thinking it's the second, but I like the first.


Date: 2006/05/27 15:10:58, Link
Author: Lou FCD
No, actually they actually might be what they purport to be, it's just there's a large amount of fundy commenters on the christianity section of the boards, no real discussion about recovering from fundyism, or the harm it causes.

Instead of "Can christian fundamentalism be cultish, and if so, what should be done for victims?" there's a lot of "The Christian god is the one true God" and various agreement and rejection of that.

Date: 2006/05/27 15:34:41, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Relatedly, what's the difference between someone who can get out, and someone who can't?  I'm now wondering what made me different than anyone else.

Date: 2006/05/27 15:39:13, Link
Author: Lou FCD

Yeah, I wasn't going to deal with it online, I was just looking for information, and perhaps a lead.

And feel free to posit that I'm just really brilliant for a reason I managed to get out.  I'm pretty good with that one.


Date: 2006/05/27 15:46:43, Link
Author: Lou FCD
can you explain what you mean by can and can't get out?

did you mean forced coercion by use of some physical restraint?

Nope.  Physical restraint is unnecessary to keep the faithful in line.  That's the point of this thread, in a way, isn't it?

Date: 2006/05/27 16:08:08, Link
Author: Lou FCD
yes, but I'm still unsure how to answer your original question.

I don't think I was actually looking for a magical answer, rather I was looking for discussion on the broader principle, while using my self in particular as example.

What is the difference between someone who never leaves fundyism/cultism whatever, and a person who wakes up one day and says "hey, wait a minute..."

With that, I believe I'm off to bed.

I bid you all good evening, and look forward to continuing this discussion.   :)

Date: 2006/05/29 04:54:12, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Ok, I feel better.  A day at the beach will do that for a fella'.


I've been chewing on this, and so far we've been picking out random instances and saying "oh yeah, this is child abuse" or "I'm not sure that constitutes child abuse" but there doesn't seem to be any way to delineate what is or isn't.

I'm thinking maybe we should alter our methodology.  How about this.

Let's draw a scale for actions, from 0 to 100, where 0 is an action that amounts to no irrationality, and 100 is an action that results in the death of a child from extreme irrationality (witholding medication from a child for religious objections which results in the death of a child would be at or near 100, I'd say).  We'll divide the line exactly at 50 and say that a 49 is really wacky, but just short of child abuse, and 51 is just barely child abuse.

Let's further separate the high end of the scale with 51 to 74 being milder forms that might have some hope of recovery, and 76 to 100 being actions that would indicate it is necessary to remove the abuser from all contact with children (i.e. jail, abuser offenders list, etc.)

Back down on the other end, obviously there is no one who can honestly claim 0 type behavior in all instances, so let's reserve 0 to 24 for more innocuous behavior ("my favorite team wins when I wear my replica of their jersey" would fit in there somewhere) and 26 to 49 for stranger actions which are a bit more irrational, but wouldn't quite be considered abuse.  (Perhaps this might include things like inducing labor in a pregant woman so her baby won't be born on June 6.)

The locations on our scale corresponding to 25, 50, and 75 would be set aside for behaviors which are borderline between the actions on either side, and for which concensus simply cannot be reached.

I'm open to suggestions on this, what do you think?

In honor of the fella' who brought this topic up here and got me thinking about it, I'm going to name our scale the T.O.S.I.C.A., or Toejam Objective Scale of Irrationality and Child Abuse.


Date: 2006/05/29 15:27:33, Link
Author: Lou FCD

I'm thinking my TOSICA score for "there is a god" is a multi-part answer, and that answer is dependant on our definition of "god".  If, indeed, we say that there is no restriction or qualification on the word, just that there is some force or being, supernatural, that exists, then I would lean more towards Penny's score of around 28 to 30.  If we instead give this god more of an anthropomorphological (is that a word?) characteristic, "there is some guy looking out for us" then I'd raise that score to somewhere around a 40  to 45.  If we give him/her more of the Judeo-Christo-Muslim attributes, "He sees you when you're sleeping, and punishes you when you are bad", then I'd go even higher than Joe, and put this between 48 and 52.  Teaching a child that the literal God of Genesis exists is well above 50, and might well stray above the 75 mark.

I guess my point here is that we should be very exact when using the term "god".  Are we talking about "a god", "a God", "The God", or "The Christian God Who Sends People To #### For Ridiculous Reasons"?

Again, if we're just talking about a generic "a god", I would really rate that close to where Penny did on the TOSICA.


Although the topic has certainly tweeked my nose, in all honesty I'm not even remotely capable of rendering an unbiased opinion, synopsis, or review of anything on subject.  If I were in any way involved in the adjudication of a case involving this topic, I would have to recuse myself in all fairness.  I assume it's quite obvious why.  Of course, the fact that IANAL precludes my involvement in most ways anyway.  Hey, I'm just the son of a carpenter.

Date: 2006/05/30 00:54:05, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Shoot.  Does this mean I need to rename the TOSICA?


Groovy name.  I like it.  But you'll always be toejam to me.


Date: 2006/05/30 05:37:50, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Point taken, Ick.

I've begun looking for court cases etc. and will let you know what I come up with.

In the early course of this, I've just happened across Richard Dawkins' The Root Of All Evil on google video.  I highly recommend both parts.  In fact, he makes a strong case for radically raising the TOSICA score for "there is a god".  Good stuff, in any event.


Download Part 1

Download Part 2

Download the Google video player

Date: 2006/05/30 06:04:18, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Black Knight, indeed, Dave. I suggest you rent "Monty Python and the Holy Grail" to see how accurately we've characterized you.

"You yellow bastards!"

Date: 2006/05/30 12:40:38, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Hey Fross,

Thanks for joining the discussion.  The TOSICA sliding scale is one of irrationality, with innocuous and harmless stuff to the left near zero and increasing to the right as the stuff becomes more and more irrational, eventually culminating in actions that result in the death of a child due directly to irrationality.

As I noted above when I introduced the TOSICA, something as irrational yet basically harmless as "we have to wear our jerseys tonight so the Flyers will beat the holy snot out of the Devils" is on the scale, just way left of child abuse.  Obviously, there is no evidence that such behavior influences a hockey game, just as there is no evidence of god, God, The God, or The Almighty Christian God Who Commits Genocide When Heathens Don't Worship Him.

The TOSICA is just a starting place for our discussion on quantifying and catagorizing what does and does not merit the label "child abuse".

I sincerely wear my Flyers jersey whenever they are on TV down here in my adopted habitat (I guess I'm an invasive species here in NC), in the intellectually vapid hope that it might somehow affect a game in Philadelphia, but it's still irrational no matter how sincere I am...  Unless we kick the crap out of Jersey, in which case we all know that "a god", "a God", "The God", and "The Almighty Christian God Who Commits Genocide When Heathens Don't Worship Him" are all Flyers fans.

Date: 2006/05/30 15:18:06, Link
Author: Lou FCD
The whole multiverse idea is pseudoscientific nonsense because there’s no way to test it. There’s only one universe that can be observed, measured, and analyzed. Certain physical constants could have taken on a number of different values when the universe was picoseconds old. Minute variations in some of those would have made it impossible for life as we know it to exist. I take the fine tuning argument as an uninteresting given - the universe was evidently designed and only pseudoscientific infinite multiverse theories can begin to dispute it. -ds


Date: 2006/05/31 02:55:03, Link
Author: Lou FCD
On a related note, This Article from LiveScience makes for an interesting read.

Date: 2006/05/31 05:18:24, Link
Author: Lou FCD
That's funny, because reading his crap, I pictured him as about 14.

Date: 2006/05/31 09:45:09, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Help, we've just been attacked by the intelligent, educated segment of society!

We don't need no stinkin' edumakation.  Nolige is fo da devil!

--  Paraphrase of TinaBrewer

Date: 2006/05/31 12:03:23, Link
Author: Lou FCD

Date: 2006/05/31 13:47:49, Link
Author: Lou FCD

Date: 2006/05/31 13:53:15, Link
Author: Lou FCD
and I meant that in the politist possible way, of course.

Date: 2006/06/01 18:05:38, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Ved @ June 01 2006,15:49)
Can we talk about the flood yet Dave? Let me know when I can pull this out:
Quote ( @ ,)
The Ark, so decreed that great naval architect in the sky, was to be built entirely of Gopher wood, and its dimensions were to be 300 cubits long by 50 cubits wide by 30 cubits height (Gen. 6:14-15.) Although the perceived length of a cubit may vary4, based on an average length of 18 inches, that translates into 450 feet by 75 feet by 45 feet. This presented our farmer-turned-ship-builder with a daunting problem because the Ark would have broken apart with the first wave. According to Robert A. Moore (Creation/Evolution XI, vol 4, no. 1, pages. 4-5) there is an upper limit, in the region of 300 feet, on the length of a wooden ship. Beyond this a wooden ship is subjected to great stress and the hull cannot be maintained watertight. This is the major reason why the naval industry turned from wood construction to iron and steel in the 1850s. In that regard, the largest wooden ship ever built, the six-masted schooner U.S.S. Wyoming, measured 329 feet in overall length. It required diagonal iron strapping for support and leaked so badly that it had to be pumped constantly. It was declared unseaworthy and too long for wood construction. Yet the ark was deemed to be over 100 feet longer.

Just an interesting tidbit. Though, I guess if God is performing miracles for you it doesn't matter how flimsy your ship is.

Noah should have used Pykrete.

So if "The-Almighty-Christian-God-Who-Commits-Genocide-When-Nobody-Plays-With-Him" is in enough of a miracle mood to hold together the ark that couldn't possibly float without a miracle, why bother with the ark in the first place?

Just wonderin'.

Date: 2006/06/01 18:11:11, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I was once violated by a SLoT...



Date: 2006/06/02 02:01:03, Link
Author: Lou FCD
ooo ooo.... how about this:

The expansion of the universe is caused by the centripetal acceleration of the rotation of the universe around the earth!

Throw in some Newton's Second Law of Motion, F=ma, add in that funky little w guy, and a sin(theta) or two, maybe a half dozen gravitons, 32 references to Einstein, a tachyon for Nebogipfel, two egg whites, mix gently and bake at 449.81 k for 6,000 years.

Cool for 2 years to eliminate burns and any residual SLoT residue and Voila!

Jesus loves you.

Date: 2006/06/09 12:08:07, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I'm an Apatheist , which means i find the question completely irrelevant. For all practical purposes I am an atheist, except that I believe thinking about the problem enough to come to the conclusion that there is no God is a complete waste of time. In fact I am only posting on this thread because I consider myself an evangelical Apatheist, whos duty it is to dispassionately spread the principles of Apatheistc thought to those nonchalant enough to recieve them.

Concur absolutely, though I usually refer to myself as an irrelevantist, because it's funny to hear the fundies try to say it.


Date: 2006/06/18 12:42:27, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Uh-oh, smells kinda Mormony to me.  "Angel Moroni" and all that jizz.

Date: 2006/06/22 07:58:50, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Buh bye, fluff fluff

Date: 2006/06/22 08:48:58, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I'd like to know the percentage of those hits that are from us looking for some good comedy.

Date: 2006/06/22 10:27:23, Link
Author: Lou FCD
It's very DaveTardy.

Date: 2006/06/22 14:04:20, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Well that depends, PZ.  What was your SAT score?


Date: 2006/06/22 14:07:21, Link
Author: Lou FCD
For those not paying attention, See this thread to explain the SAT quip.

Date: 2006/06/23 02:43:49, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Some Logic For Davey:

Top Ten Signs You're a Fundamentalist Christian

10 - You vigorously deny the existence of thousands of gods claimed by other religions, but feel outraged when someone denies the existence of yours.

9 - You feel insulted and "dehumanized" when scientists say that people evolved from other life forms, but you have no problem with the Biblical claim that we were created from dirt.

8 - You laugh at polytheists, but you have no problem believing in a Triune God.

7 - Your face turns purple when you hear of the "atrocities" attributed to Allah, but you don't even flinch when hearing about how God/Jehovah slaughtered all the babies of Egypt in "Exodus" and ordered the elimination of entire ethnic groups in "Joshua" including women, children, and trees!

6 - You laugh at Hindu beliefs that deify humans, and Greek claims about gods sleeping with women, but you have no problem believing that the Holy Spirit impregnated Mary, who then gave birth to a man-god who got killed, came back to life and then ascended into the sky.

5 - You are willing to spend your life looking for little loopholes in the scientifically established age of Earth (few billion years), but you find nothing wrong with believing dates recorded by Bronze Age tribesmen sitting in their tents and guessing that Earth is a few generations old.

4 - You believe that the entire population of this planet with the exception of those who share your beliefs -- though excluding those in all rival sects - will spend Eternity in an infinite He11 of Suffering. And yet consider your religion the most "tolerant" and "loving."

3 - While modern science, history, geology, biology, and physics have failed to convince you otherwise, some idiot rolling around on the floor speaking in "tongues" may be all the evidence you need to "prove" Christianity.

2 - You define 0.01% as a "high success rate" when it comes to answered prayers. You consider that to be evidence that prayer works. And you think that the remaining 99.99% FAILURE was simply the will of God.

1 - You actually know a lot less than many atheists and agnostics do about the Bible, Christianity, and church history - but still call yourself a Christian.

Found Here

Date: 2006/06/23 10:32:52, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I spoke to the tooth-fairy today.  She told me she was tired of god and his little band of terrorists, so she kicked his ass and threw him in his own ####.

I know it's true because the tooth-fairy doesn't lie.

Date: 2006/06/23 11:34:39, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Actually, Ich, the thought had crossed my mind once or twice, but NOBODY could fake this kind of breathtaking inanity, if I may borrow a phrase.

Date: 2006/06/23 14:02:31, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Yeah, you seem to be having some issues with it there Eric.  We forgive you, though.


(I'm sure no one will hold it against you if you want to go back and edit, but don't feel obligated either.)

Date: 2006/06/23 15:26:45, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Poor fella has a 10 Year Woody

That's pretty much all I have to say about that.

Date: 2006/06/24 05:12:24, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I have to agree with Dave on the knowlege of the ancients.  After all, they invented the Stargates.

Date: 2006/06/24 05:15:43, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Ack!  I just figured it out!  Dave is a Prior of the Auri, spreading Origin!

Date: 2006/06/24 06:30:28, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Dear Prior Dave,

If you continue to try to spread Origin through this galaxy, we will be forced to contact the Asgard to assist us in locating Merlin's super-anti-ascended-beings weapon which will cancel you out, and you and your masters will cease to exist.


The Inhabitants of Reality.

Date: 2006/06/24 06:35:51, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Hey Plas,

I believe Ich invoked Godwin's Law a page or two back.  Nobody is responding because A.P. loses automatically.  The argument is over, A.P. is an idiot, life goes on.

Oh yeah, water is wet, the sky is blue, and women have secrets.



Date: 2006/06/24 10:12:59, Link
Author: Lou FCD
The  oldest story is logically ...(emphasis mine)

And herein lies the crux of the matter...

Date: 2006/06/24 13:30:47, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Ah, the hits just keep on comin'.

Johnnyb fired for being irrelevent

Misanthrope asks for a little substance for ID:

No, I’m only asking for more meat to the theory. Darwinian theory, and even the tangential abiogenesis theories, propose a pathway using known, witnessed processes with known chemical reactions, even though the specific pathways from A to B are unknown. At least the framework is intelligible and communicates something, as opposed to a theory about something which cannot, by its very nature, be specified. The need for causal specificity would lead one to favor an explanation with more, not less, specificity. ID proponents demand a complete explanation from the very first self-replicating molecule all the way to Greta Garbo, with every single variation and selection explained in toto, but they’ll readily accept that “the designer need not be specified, as long as we see the need for design?” I’ll take imperfect knowledge over a position that deliberately embraces unknowability.

propose a pathway using known, witnessed processes with known chemical reactions (italics original)

For which he gets the boot:

This is simply wrong and I’m sick of correcting you over and over about it. You are imagining chemical reactions that do not exist. Go find another blog. You’re done here. -dt

Yeah, how dare you ask HOW God er, I mean the Intelligent Designer designed!

Feel free to append "BBDT" (Banned By Dave Tard) to your handle.

Then SCheeseman expounds scientifically:

Blah Blah Blah... “God of the gaps?” Yeh, God owns those gaps and he’s getting mighty ticked off at those who deny the obvious when they stare it in the face. (Like denying that the genetic code is a code - then what the heck is it!?)

But NO!  ID is NOT about religion.  Nope, not at all.  I suspect that the code reads something like "Hey SCheeseDick, Stop putting words in my mouth!"

Dave Tards response?

Misanthrope is no longer with us for that and many similarly uninformed and unreasoned statements. I suspect he/she has been here before using a different name and was booted out then too for the same cause. -dt


I gave that bastard the boot because he keeps asking for an actual Theory of ID.

Date: 2006/06/24 15:11:55, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Ahhhhh, feeling the love today.  :D

Date: 2006/06/25 02:50:00, Link
Author: Lou FCD

Aren't you supposed to end all your posts with "Hallowed are the Auri" or something?

Date: 2006/06/25 03:27:59, Link
Author: Lou FCD

At first blush, I was going to call it projection.  Thinking about it, it's not even that.  The IDCreationismHoax doesn't even want a semblence of evidence any more.  Every time they try to use some fact or factoid, or some obfuscation thereof, they get called on it, exposed, and embarrassed to the point that even an uneducated carpenter's son like me (not to mention a highly educated biologist or federal judge) can see that they're all idiots following liars like lemmings.  

Their only reason for being these days is to spout religio/socio/political feel-good bullshit.  It's all about fear and power, always has been.  They are quite simply afraid of dying.  If it turns out that they can't prove that their god exists, then what happens when they die?  They can't wrap their little brains around the idea that they will no longer exist.  The power is about wishful thinking.  If they can force enough people to recite their mantra, maybe they can feel secure that their version of (un)reality will be true.  Then maybe they will turn out to be right, and they won't cease to exist.

It is not good enough for them to understand that whatever it is that makes up "ME" will someday be scattered to the wind, decomposing to provide fuel for the next generations of plants and animals, and eventually new stars.  It's recycling on a grand scale, and I think that makes them feel like yesterday's kitchen garbage.  Hence, whatever it takes, they must force people to believe in their version of (un)reality.

It seems a lot like a magician who uses smoke and mirrors to make a woman disappear, hoping that if enough of the audience believes, he really will make her disappear.

There's probably a doctor of psychology dissertation in there somewhere.  :D

</speculative rant induced by pain meds coupled with exasperation over willfull ignorance>

It would also seem that DaveTard's job is to bounce anyone who asks too many questions, like "What exactly is the theory of ID?"

Date: 2006/06/25 05:44:33, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I wonder if the bible is consistent with the Book of Origin?

Hallowed are the Auri.

Date: 2006/06/25 05:53:35, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (jeannot @ June 25 2006,10:51)
...the oldest being the first two dated at least at 3200BC...
How have they been dated?

Why, by the genealogies in the bible, of course.  Duh.

Date: 2006/06/25 08:04:33, Link
Author: Lou FCD
My apologies.


Date: 2006/06/25 08:12:58, Link
Author: Lou FCD
On the subject of spelling and fictional pseudo-mythologies, though, I'm pretty good at spelling Noah.


Date: 2006/06/25 09:32:31, Link
Author: Lou FCD
The same way it talks about the death of Moses in the past tense even though it was supposedly written by Moses?

It was revealed by the (thank you to Tacitus for correcting my spelling) Ori.

In a vision.

On a burrito.

Date: 2006/06/25 09:40:16, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Wow, that almost sounded lucid.

Date: 2006/06/26 03:08:32, Link
Author: Lou FCD
To be fair at least stargate gives a decent reason as to why the Ori need to be worshipped. I have yet to hear one for Christianity. Ps becuase you'll go to #### is not a decent reason.

You know, I find it funny that Stargate's (what would you call it - parallel? dark parody? allegory? I'm going with dark parody) dark parody makes more sense than the real thing.

And by applying Davie's logic, Stargate is The Truth because -

There really is a place called Egypt.
There really are pyramids in Egypt.
There really are other galaxies.
There are written records (10 years of weekly scripts written by many authors AND a screenplay, mind you).
Stargate SG1 has produced a spinoff, and is itself spun off from a deeper, more ancient wisdom starring Kurt Russell.
Once a week millions of people gather to hear all about it.
Some physics guy postulated wormholes.
There is no evidence that contradicts The Truth of Stargate.
If there is any evidence that contradicts The Truth of Stargate, it is wrong, misinterpreted, or can otherwise safely be ignored because it comes from Atheistic Scientists.
Some guy on TV was visited by aliens who probed his butt.
Jesus loves you.

Therefore the entire Stargate Universe has been proven.

Hallowed are the Ori.

(Don't even get me started on Battlestar Galactica and the twelve tribes...)

Date: 2006/06/26 03:23:21, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Chris Hyland @ June 26 2006,00:45)
Could someone let me know if Dave actually says something interesting or if he actually moves onto evolution.

Don't hold your breath.

Date: 2006/06/26 05:52:25, Link
Author: Lou FCD
He helped them overcome their crippling fear of evil spirits and taught them to love their babies instead of kill them.  He taught them how to live happy, productive lives full of music and laughter instead of sorrow and drunkenness.

Shame he didn't do the same for you.

Date: 2006/06/26 06:31:22, Link
Author: Lou FCD
The creationists believe the mechanism of creation is "Poof". How can you make that sound scientific?

The Poof Hypothesis?
Poof the Scientific Dragon?
Poof Membrane Theory?
Quantum Poofanics?
General Theory of Poofitivity?
Go Poof in Your Hat and Wear It?
Intelligent Design?

Date: 2006/06/26 06:36:04, Link
Author: Lou FCD
oooo...  Arden, we should have a poll!

I can't believe I missed "Poof Theory", though.


Date: 2006/06/26 06:41:18, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Steve, that's just classic.  Thank you.

Date: 2006/06/26 08:14:49, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Sorta like the military, Faid.  I didn't always understand every decision that came down to me.  But before I joined, I analyzed the military and decided it was overall a good thing.  I made the conscious decision to join and subject myself to its authority.  Similar deal with God.

The genocide of innocents is evil of the top tier and anyone engaged in it is morally bankrupt whether the order to do so came from a company first sergeant, battallion commander, President of the United States, or Jesus Fucking Christ Hisself.  It's still criminal.  Perhaps you missed the UCMJ.

And you are an idiot.

Date: 2006/06/26 09:34:26, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Ok, I thought I was done frothing at the mouth over Dave using the "but my commander (in this case God via Joshua) told me to kill all those children" excuse, but I'm not.

Suffice it to say that not only is such a lame and pathetic excuse disgusting, vile, and morally vacuous, it's also without legal merit.

The UCMJ (Uniform Code of Military Justice - which is the U.S. Military Law) specifically deals with such orders and states that not only is a member of the military not required to follow such orders, but is obligated to disobey them.  Anyone following such orders is subject to charges of murder and war crimes regardless of who gave the order.  Any slick-sleeved airman (or marine, soldier, seaman, or coastie) could tell you that.

It's one of the first things all members of the military learn in basic training, and for Dave to compare Joshua or anyone else's wholesale slaughter of women, children, and other non-combatants to the ideals or actions of the U.S. military is repugnant and offensive to those of us who served with honor.

Date: 2006/06/26 09:37:35, Link
Author: Lou FCD
substitute "god" for "dog",

Ack!  Are you suggesting the addition of information through mutation?????


Date: 2006/06/26 09:42:40, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (carlsonjok @ June 26 2006,14:28)
Quote (afdave @ June 26 2006,12:38)
On the one hand, you are talking about the Moral Absolute that "Individual humans are not to kill."  On the other hand you have lawfully instituted, God-ordained governments which are delegated the power by God to kill--capital punishment, war, A-bombs, etc.

Okay, I have to admit some degree of curiousity about this?  Are all governments God-ordained?

Shoot, and here I thought that governments derive their just powers from the consent of the governed.

Date: 2006/06/26 10:04:16, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Now here's a man who seems to follow an actual moral code (universal or not)... Unlike you, dave.

Thank you for the nod, Faid.

Interestingly enough, I didn't need some old collection of fairy tales about an invisible djin to arrive at that code.  So much for the "but if there is no Yaweh-as-depicted-literally-in-thishere-book, then there is no morality" argument.

In fact, I dare say my "moral code" became much less fluid when I left such silliness in my past.


When I was a child I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man I put away childish things.

Date: 2006/06/26 10:26:18, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Ok, I think if we begin reading at the last comment ON THIS PAGE I think we can justify adding 20 points to fundyism on the TOSICA.

'nuff said.

Date: 2006/06/26 10:32:46, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Arden Chatfield @ June 26 2006,15:30)

Yeah, how dare those rotten evilutionists actually expect us to do experiments.

Well, the IDers are in a bit of a bind -- it's not easy to replicate "Goddidit" in a lab.  :p

Sure it is.  Put a stick in a sealed terrarium, pray over it, and call me when it turns into a snake.

Date: 2006/06/26 10:40:44, Link
Author: Lou FCD

How about "Ezekiel forgot to mention that forever hasn't started yet.  It doesn't start until next Tuesday."


Date: 2006/06/26 11:01:54, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Although that idea was wacky, and Clouserbot's was really nutso, the relevent portion to which I was referring in AFDave's post was where he was saying it was ok to kill women and children if God told you to do it.  Then he somehow drifted off into a comparison to the U.S. military, intimating that if your superior tells you to, then it's ok because you were given orders to by a representative of the God-annointed government.

Man that boiled my blood.  Anyone who thinks it's ok to go around killing women and children simply 'cause God told you to belongs behind bars, and certainly has no business raising children.

Date: 2006/06/26 11:31:47, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (jeannot @ June 26 2006,16:14)
Then what are you doing on AFDave's thread?  ;)

AFDave's thread is purely entertainment (ok sometimes he just pisses ya' off, but mostly it's entertainment).

Sort o' like professional wresting.  Only funny.  And educational.  Oh and worth watching.  So it's nothing like professional wrestling.  Except Dave.  He's EXACTLY like professional wrestling.

"Hope that helps" (quoting the Gray Wolf here)


Date: 2006/06/26 12:34:10, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Geez, GoP,

That was rather uncalled for.

No need to be a pecker-head.  If you have a problem with something he actually said, say so.  You'll feel better, and we'll all laugh at you.  It's really a win-win situation.

Beatin' up on the muppets, though, that's just cheap.


Date: 2006/06/26 12:50:43, Link
Author: Lou FCD
You're still a butthead though, and will remain so until you issue a public apology to the muppets.


Date: 2006/06/26 13:11:12, Link
Author: Lou FCD
You're still a butthead.  Apologize to the Muppets.


Date: 2006/06/26 13:54:19, Link
Author: Lou FCD
If you get a chance, check out This article at Stanford Medicine Magazine.  It's worth a read, well written.  The comments are abysmal, though.  Larry Farfarman rears his head early.

Oh well, good article, though.



Date: 2006/06/26 14:02:31, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Whoops, forgot the hat tip to Dr. Phil Plait from Bad Astronomy for the link.

He's the REAL Dr. Phil.

Date: 2006/06/26 16:16:28, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Recognize this?

(1) The Bible says the Bible is true.
(2) Therefore the Bible is true.
(3) The Bible says God exists.
(4) Therefore, God exist.

I just read all 360 proofs of God's existence and was very amused at how many of them Dave has presented.

It's quite a chuckle, but I wouldn't recommend reading them all at once.

Date: 2006/06/27 01:52:33, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I thought Larry's brothers were Moe and Shemp.

Date: 2006/06/27 04:38:19, Link
Author: Lou FCD

The case of William Calley and W.O. Hugh Thompson is the exact case study provided to military personell to illustrate this in the UCMJ classes.  Every class I took and taught on the subject at Ft. Benning, GA used this case.

In the interest of accuracy and full disclosure, it's been a while (15 years) and I had to look up some of the details of what follows.  Wiki has a pretty good treatment of all this, and jives pretty well with what I recall, though it doesn't really stress the findings of responsibility by the courts which are arguably the biggest legal impact of the proceedings:

Calley maintained that his Commanding Officer, CPT Ernest Medina, gave the order to rape and murder the villagers and burn the village to the ground.  Although Medina was aquitted, Calley was convicted.  Whether the order was given by Medina or not was irrelevent to Calley's trial.  Calley was responsible for his own actions.  Likewise, so were his men.

Unfortunately, Calley was the only one convicted of over 20 officers and men alleged to have been involved in the massacre and subsequent cover-up.  He was originally sentenced to life imprisonment, but intervention by then President Nixon, and further appeals based on the fairness of the trial eventually led to Calley serving only 3 1/2 years of house arrest.  The other aquittals and charge dismissals were mostly based on evidence issues, not responsibility issues.

The Army courts however, made it perfectly crystal clear that soldiers are responsible for their actions, regardless of orders, or from whence those orders came.  Murder is murder no matter who told you to commit it.  A soldier is not only not required to obey illegal orders, but also is obligated to disobey those orders, report the illegal orders up the chain of command, and if necessary, forcibly remove the officer or NCO from command to prevent those orders from being carried out.  This was absolutely one of those cases.

Now, that's a big step for a young private or corporal to take, and s/he had better be goddamned sure those orders are illegal and warrant such an action, but failure to do so when necessary is a prosecutable offence.  "Cpt. Medina (Lt. Calley, the President, Yaweh, or Jesus H. Christ)  told me to" is NOT - I say again - NOT an acceptable excuse.

Warrant Officer Hugh Thompson and his crew are heros.  They had big balls, and common decency.  Sadly, Thompson died earlier this year of cancer.  His crew chief, Spec 4 Glen Andreotta was killed in action shortly after the massacre at My Lai.  His door gunner, Spec 4 Lawrence Colburn lives in Atlanta.  All three were later awarded the Soldier's Medal, the highest Army award for actions not under enemy fire (being engaged with the enemy is a requirement for awards such as the CMOH, the silver and bronze stars, etc.).

Last I heard (1990 or so), Calley still lived around Ft. Benning.  His name is Anathema.

Calley is a disgrace, and so is Dave.

Date: 2006/06/27 08:06:03, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Lou FCD...  

The UCMJ (Uniform Code of Military Justice - which is the U.S. Military Law) specifically deals with such orders and states that not only is a member of the military not required to follow such orders, but is obligated to disobey them.

The UCMJ was written in a different era, my friend, and is quite valid for today.  But in Joshua's day, God worked in a different way as I have already explained.  Also, if you love the UCMJ, how do you reconcile today's UCMJ with what we did to Hiroshima and Nagasaki?  What is your position on the women and babies that were killed there by our A-bombs?

A few things:

1. I am not now, nor have I ever been nor will I ever be your friend.  You disgust me in the same way as My Dearest Dr. ClouserBot.

2. You're Goddamned right it's valid today.  The principles which it espouses in this case were valid before it was written.  It is morally reprehensible to murder innocents now, and it was morally reprehensible to murder innocents 100 years ago, 1000 years ago, and 5000 years ago.  The question you were originally asked on 24 June on page 87 of this very thread was from Faid:
So, dave: If your God came to you, beyond any doubt in your mind, and told you you should kill babies in his name, because that is his will at the moment and he knows better, would you do it dave?

(emphasis in the original)

Now it might be reading too much into the question, but the last phrase was not "would you have done it", but rather "would you do it".  Seems to imply the present to me.  Your "what's moral now is different than what was moral then" argument is irrelevent to the question.  

You have both intimated and flat out stated that your answer is "yes".  That tells me you are dangerous.  You are a friggin' sociopath of the worst sort.  

Your moral relativity argument certainly does raise another question though, Dave.  Several, in fact.

Why was it ok then but not now?  What changed?
As I recall, your Holy Book claims that God is unchanging.  Why was it ok for Joshua to wipe out women and children for some land, but not ok for us to do it now?  I don't understand how you can believe that murder and rape were ok up until the end of Malachi, but then somewhere before Matthew that all changed for some mysterious reason.  Did God change his mind?  Was it a boo boo?

Anyway, back to your post of today.

Hiroshima and Nagasaki.  I knew you would ask this very question.  I've asked it of myself many, many times.  How do I justify it?  I don't.  I don't claim to know if Truman made the right call, and truth be told, I think he was wrong for exactly the reasons we've been discussing.  My morals don't change according to the amount of land involved, or what the Holy Spirit whimsically whispers in my ear today.

However, let me be perfectly clear.  Despite the much larger number of innocents involved, and despite the much more enormous consequences of President Truman's order, I do not equate his actions with Joshua's, or with Calley's.  President Truman was faced with two horrible choices.  Extinguish the lives of thousands of innocents in order to end a war we did not ask for and save the lives of thousands of soldiers on both sides OR continue fighting a conventional war which may have dragged on for years and claimed just as many or maybe more lives in the end.  It is a quandry I don't envy a President in such a position.  He had to make a choice between equally bad outcomes.  He did what he thought was right.

On the other hand, Joshua's orders from your God were to murder innocents for no apparent reason other than a land grab from the sinners.  "Them damned Jericho peeple was havin anal sex on land we wanted."  That's what it boiled down to, Dave.  And there is no gray area.  It was a despicable slaughter of innocents.  Period.  And you agreed it was ok because your invisible sky daddy said it was ok.  You are a sick individual.

Well, now you have me thoroughly confused.  So, is what you are a saying Paul believes that we should always obey the government (regardless of whether we agree or not) unless it directs us to disobey a Scriptural commandment, which would presumably include the Decalogue? And if that is correct, then doesn't it follow that Paul would have me refuse an order by my government to violate the Scriptural proscription against killing?

Wow, several posts while I'm piddling away here writing my diatribe.

Dave is entirely correct on the whole "Paul said obey the goverment unless it tells you to disobey God".  His Holy Book really does say that.  Of course, if you pick and choose which passages to believe in the first place, it's easy to to pick and choose which passages are contradicted by the goverment.

As for the proscription on killing...

Please don't ever for one minute take me for a christo facist apologist (Edit to add the truth of the matter is that I'm an EX Christo facist apologist, and I was a #### sight better at it than Dave will ever be. end Edit)

but -

A better translation of that passage might be "Thou shalt do no murder".  And it is definitely a different word than kill, IIRC.  (My Hebrew is quite a bit rusty so I don't recall the exact words in question, you can look it up if you care to be bothered with such ridiculous things.  Or you could ask my Dearest Dr. ClouserBot, I'm sure she'd be happy to expound on the perfect JL Publications translation.)  This is how christofreakazoids rationalize all sorts of things, from capital punishment, to physical gay bashing, to family planning clinic bombings.  "See, them ain't murder, because them there peeple was disobeyin' God.  That there is just killin'.  Difrent."

Don't ever let one of these freaks claim anything about a "universal moral code" or "unbelievers use relative morality".  They are liars and wouldn't refrain from genocide if they thought for one second they could get away with it.

Ok, this ain't perfect, but I don't want to wait for three or four more pages before I post it.

The gist is that Dave has the moral code of a pile of excrement from an large farm animal.

Date: 2006/06/27 09:04:34, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I note that parasite is pretty interchangable with creationist in that quote Norm.

That kinda takes all the fun out of it, though.

Date: 2006/06/27 10:43:47, Link
Author: Lou FCD
You know these threads used to be interesting, funny even.  AFDave's argument of "The Bible is true because the Bible says it's true which is true because the Bible is true" was amusing if only to see how long he could keep it up without getting so dizzy he passed out.

Now, not so much.

I have to hand it to you folks who can go 90+ pages of trying to engage him with logic, facts, and reality.  This thread is a huge testament to some truly epic patience.

Personally I have nothing left but venom and vitriol for him.  I apologize to everyone else who has to read through my rants of disgust.

Date: 2006/06/27 12:51:28, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Lou FCD @ June 27 2006,15:43)
AFDave's argument of "The Bible is true because the Bible says it's true which is true because the Bible is true" was amusing if only to see how long he could keep it up without getting so dizzy he passed out.

See above.

Date: 2006/06/27 12:55:55, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Oh and it looks like The People Have Spoken

Date: 2006/06/27 13:39:25, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Awww... PZ lost his sense of humor.  Oh well.  I've said repeatedly that you're not somebody at PT until you've been banished to the bathroom wall.


I feel all warm and fuzzy now.  Thanks PZ.

You don't actually think there is going to be any productive conversation on that thread do you?

Date: 2006/06/27 14:00:55, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Well I guess that answers that.  Guess I'll be looking for good spider science elsewhere.  I like my science with reason and humor.

Date: 2006/06/27 14:06:16, Link
Author: Lou FCD
dick waving PZ.

Date: 2006/06/27 14:20:41, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Lighten up, PZ.  You're quickly becoming the best argument against your own position.  A position, I will add, which I share.

Date: 2006/06/27 15:00:33, Link
Author: Lou FCD
####, Arden.  Just when I thought I had become somebody, now you tell me I have to go slumming over there and try to get at least one comment up before I get banned.  Yeah, that's gonna happen.

You're not even gettin' one post up, Lou FCD you commie atheist.  You're outta here before you get here. -dt

Date: 2006/06/27 15:05:27, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Does that mean the cheap shot bidding office pool is off???


Date: 2006/06/27 15:11:26, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I think I might have only made one dick waving joke.  What about me?  Can I claim injury and oppression?  Is there a three dick waving joke minimum or anything?

I can come back and make up the difference if you want, but somehow I don't think you'd see the humor.

Date: 2006/06/27 15:24:48, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Thanks Arden, that's actually the best laugh I've had all day, which is saying something considering the thread I got tossed from.

Ok, the gauntlet is thrown, and I choose to pick it up.  Of course, DaveTard reads all this, so I'll not be able to do it right away.

Hear that DaveTard?  The challenge is on for me to get one post up on your little fan club board before you catch me and ban me.

Maybe I'll sneak in and ban your Mama - LouFCD

Date: 2006/06/27 15:29:27, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Lighten up jujufruit.

And I like my choice of avatars.

Date: 2006/06/27 15:38:16, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (jujuquisp @ June 27 2006,20:08)
Lou FCD, what is your problem?  Would you please select an avatar and quit with the nonsense?  Oh, hi Lenny Flank.  Welcome to our leper colony.

But you're quite right, juju.  We should all be acting serious on a thread dedicated to the empirical observation and critique of Uncommon Descent.

Crap, I couldn't even type that with a straight face.

Date: 2006/06/28 02:10:46, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Well regardless of opinions about coddling or crucifying every theist in sight, I think this post by Lenny deserves to see the light of day in some place other than The Bathroom Wall:

Getting back to the subject, it should perhaps be pointed out that spider silk didn't originally evolve for making webs.  The group of arthropods from whcih spiders may (or may not have) evolved, the trigonotarbids, didn't have any spinnerets and presumably didn't have any silk.  One of the earliest known spiders, Attercopus, at 380 million years, did. Of course, one of the defining characteristics of spiders is that they have spinnerets.

Some of the most primitive of the existing spiders are the mygalomorphs, the group that includes the tarantulas.  Some living species of tarantula-like spiders still have segmented apparent in their abdomens, and they are probably very similar to the most primitive of spiders.  This group goes back to 300 million years in the fossil record.  And although they have spinnerets and produce silk, they don't make webs.  Their silk is used largely to make eggsacs, and to line the burrows that they live in.  A few species of trapdoor spiders use silklen lines to make a radiating pattern with their burrow at the center, which alerts them to passing prey.  It seems likely that prey-catching webs were a (much) later modification of that strategy.

There are also arboreal species of tarantula, which live in silken shelters that they spin high up in trees.  They too, however, don't make webs.  It seems a good likelihood that they adapted to an arboreal lifestyle in order to avoid monsoon rains which flooded their terrestrial burrows, and it seems likely that the modern orb-weaving spiders began with a similar lifestyle.

Spiders fascinate me, always have.

Date: 2006/06/28 02:15:20, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Similar brief on it at

Very neatoriffic.

Date: 2006/06/28 02:19:52, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Thanks for this, Steve.  I'll be keeping one eye on this thread.

If you get a moment, could you hit me with a little more detail on this:

And it is discussed that embryology was so hard and late to develop, that it played almost no role even in the Modern Synthesis in the 40's, which came as a surprise to me.


Date: 2006/06/28 02:27:23, Link
Author: Lou FCD
From Steve,

Superficially, he's not doing anything creationists haven't done here before. Make dumb arguments, misunderstand the very basic knowledge of the field, disagree with the evidence, imagine all the experts are deluded misinterpreters...

...yet he's the landslide winner for dumbest. What is it he does, which makes him so obviously dumber than Ghost and the rest? What's he doing differently?

And from Rilke's GD:

But Dave is genuinely stupid.  He loses every argument he starts, but he claims otherwise.  He's genuinely arrogant.  He loses very argument he starts, but claims otherwise.  Etc.

I think it's the combination of arrogance and genuine stupidity that's so amusing.

I agree with RGD, but I'm gonna add that most of the others throw around some math, a little philosophy, and various other smoke screens to hide the insanity a little.  AFDave is happy to just keep going back to "The Bible is True, because the Bible says it's True, and that's True, because the Bible is True".

He's just much more blatent.

Date: 2006/06/28 02:48:01, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Renier @ June 28 2006,07:32)
Silk worms of course also have silk (as does other worms). Now, it's a stupid question, but is this trait a seperate evolution path from spiders? I would think so.

Interesting, but here we call the tarantulas "baboon spiders". All in all, we have 3 dangerous spiders here, the worst being a light (beige) little spider with a dark mouth area and dark feet tips. Called a "Sakspinnekop".

There is also a very interesting spider called a "Roman". Red hunting spider. I read somewhere that they are closer related to scorpians than other spiders. It's mouth is totally different from other spiders and it has no venom. It will however kill a scorpian in "combat". They also have the habit of running from shade area to shade area, thus creating the impression they are chasing humans (running after moving shade). Girls don't like them :)

See this is good stuff.

I've been repeating the mantra since I was a kid that ALL spiders are poisonous, it's just that most spiders' bites aren't terribly harmful to HUMANS.  I've always been surprised at how many people I've met that think that there are about three poisonous spiders in the whole world, usually:

1. The Black Widow
2. The Brown Recluse
3. The dreaded Tarantula

Now I have to revise my statement.  I was seriously not aware that there were any spiders without venom.  I'll have to spend some time checking that guy out.

One of my favorite sports as a young fella' was chasing girls and making them squeal.  (Ok, that's still one of my favorite sports, but ummm... different.)  Any spider that gives the impression of chasing girls all by itself is pretty cool in my book.   :D

Date: 2006/06/28 03:24:33, Link
Author: Lou FCD
He dragged the thread right down into the sewer

Apparently you were reading a different thread than I was.  The one I was reading was off-the-wall, out of control, and a mass free-for-all for many reasons, in many ways, caused by many people and Lenny was no more responsible for that than you were. (or I was, for that matter)

It was fun, let's do it again sometime.

Date: 2006/06/28 03:30:28, Link
Author: Lou FCD
From the link you provided:

Male solifugids have hook-like flagella on the chelicerae

I wonder if that means they are irreducibly complex and intelligently designed?

They run their prey down and once they catch it they eat while the prey is still alive with vigorous ripping and cutting actions of the powerful jaws.


Date: 2006/06/28 03:36:03, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Oh, and to clarify,

IIRC violin spider is a common name for the brown recluse, because of the violin shaped dark spot on it's back.

Samey same.

Date: 2006/06/28 03:39:13, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I stand corrected.  Your violin spider looks different than our violin spider.

Date: 2006/06/28 03:44:50, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Ahhh... related....

From wikipedia-

The brown recluse spider is a venomous spider, Loxosceles reclusa, of the family Sicariidae (formerly of the family Loxoscelidae). It is usually between 1/4 and 3/4 inch (6.4-19.1mm) but may grow larger. It is brown and usually has markings on the dorsal side of its thorax, with a black line coming from it that looks like a violin with the neck of the violin pointing to the rear of the spider resulting in the nickname "fiddleback spider" or "violin spider". Coloring varies from light tan to brown and the violin marking may not be visible. Since the "violin pattern" is not diagnostic, it is far more important, for purposes of identification, to examine the eyes. Contrary to most spiders, which have 8 eyes, recluse spiders have 6 eyes arranged in pairs (dyads) with one median pair and 2 lateral pairs. Only a few other spiders have 3 pairs of eyes arranged this way (e.g., scytodids), and recluses can be distinguished from these as recluse abdomens have no coloration pattern nor do their legs, which also lack spines.

The brown recluse spider is native to the United States from the southern Midwest south to the Gulf of Mexico ([1]). The native range lies roughly south of a line from southeastern Nebraska through southern Iowa, Illinois, and Indiana to southwestern Ohio. In the southern states, it is native from central Texas to western Georgia. They are generally not found west of the Rocky Mountains.

Recluse spiders, which also include Mediterranean recluse spider (Loxosceles rufescens), build irregular webs that frequently include a shelter consisting of disorderly threads. Unlike most web weavers, they leave these webs at night to hunt. People get bitten when they unintentionally squeeze them in clothing and bedding.

Got the article on Brown Recluse Spider when I searched for violin spider.

However, note from the link you provided-

Loxosceles can be grouped into cavernicolous (cave dwelling) and savannah species. One of the three cavernicolous species,  Loxosceles parrami, associated with mining areas, has been artificially introduced into Gauteng homes and is responsible for many cases of human envenomations in the area. Loxosceles is uncommon within 20 - 50 kilometres of Cape Town and bites by this spider appear to be translocations.

Violin spider (Loxosceles sp.)

Loxosceles are free ranging and nocturnal using only a few strands of silk as a retreat in caves or under rocks. Its free-ranging behaviour is what distinguishes it from the Pholcidae that are web-bound. Loxosceles are small with a body length of about 8 mm and long slender legs about 18 mm long. The carapace is relatively flat and slightly longer than wide and most species bear the characteristic dark violin-shaped marking. The cylindrical /oval abdomen is either plain or marked with light and dark patterns. In some species sand particles adhere to the cuticle but not to the same extent as Sicarius.

Date: 2006/06/28 04:08:41, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Well there's the violin, three (I think) different species of black widow, the red widow, at least one whole genus of tarantulas I think (some of which use their legs to shoot irritating hairs at your eyes if you piss them off), scorpions, and if you count non-poisonous but disease carriers, a bunch of ticks.  PZ would probably be the one to ask for the exhaustive list.

Personally I worry more about poisonous two legged critters (read "fundies") over here, but YMMV.

Date: 2006/06/28 04:15:28, Link
Author: Lou FCD
New world tarantulas (those found in North and South America) are equipped with urticating hairs on their abdomen, and will almost always use these as a first line of defense. These hairs will irritate sensitive areas of the body and especially seem to target curious animals who may sniff these hairs into the mucous membranes of the nose. These hairs generally do not irritate the hands or other tough areas of skin. Some species have more effective urticating hairs than others. The goliath birdeater is one species known for it's particularly irritating urticating hairs. Old world tarantulas (from Asia) have no urticating hairs, and are more likely to attack when disturbed. Old world tarantulas often have more potent, medically significant venom.

From Wikipedia article on Tarantulas

Date: 2006/06/28 07:01:30, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Bug Wars the Movie

That's cool.  I'll keep my eyes open for the purple guy if I'm ever in your neck of the woods.  If it can kick all kinds of ass in those kinds of fights, I don't think I want it p.o.d at me.

Let me know what the tarantula tells you tonight.  I'm interested in his take on the whole old world/new world thing.

When I was in the army, we tended to put large bipedal mammals (us) into a box (bar), add alchohol (of choice) and watch them fight.  Bigger scale, same result.  The purple (most heavily bruised) guy was declared the winner in a backwards drunken logic kind of way.

Date: 2006/06/28 08:37:30, Link
Author: Lou FCD
1 In the beginning was the white page, and it was good.
2 And on the first page God created A Babe for You Escort service, and it was good.
3 But the Lord looked and sayeth unto the Escorts, "what troubleth thee and thy sistren."
4 The Escorts cried out with a loud voice and said "Lord of the great telephone book, Thou art great and mighty, for in one day Thou createst the telephone book and us to be therein.
5 In thy mercy.
6 Yet we are troubled, for Thou hast forgottenest to create for us someone to Escort."
7 And the Lord God of the Telephone Book looked, and lo they cried out to Him in truth.
8 So the Lord God looked and saw that His Book was incomplete, and vowest to doeth something about it.
9 And on the second day God created A Beasley's Bail Bonding Company, and it was good.  And then He created the ARBCO Manufacturing Corporation, and it was good.
10 And on the third day God went a little loco in la cabesa, and created Aakeith Eric, and Aaron Raymond and Nancy, and Aaron Sue, and all the people in the pages of white who there appear, yea even unto Zywicki Shaun.
11 And it was good.
12 And on the fourth day, The Lord God of White and Yellow looked upon His creation and realized that there was no Yellow for Him to rule over.
13 And the people of the White cried out "Lord, why hast Thou created only the White?  With whom shall we do business, other than with Thy Holy Escorts, and ARBCO Manufacturing?  Where the fucketh shall we buy our Pizza?
14 For our neighbor Lenny who hath not faith hath no pizza and starves?  Shew unto Lenny Thy greatness and create the Yellow!
15 In thy mercy."
16 And the Lord spake unto the people of the White and sayeth in a loud voice "New Testament."

Date: 2006/06/28 15:32:45, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (ericmurphy @ June 28 2006,19:07)
Did I need to consult the Bible at any point to perform this group of tests? No. Did anything I learned from the Bible in any way inform my methodology? No. If I had never heard of the Bible before, didn't even speak any language the Bible was written in, would I still be able to perform these tests? Yes. If the Bible had never been written, would I still be able to perform these tests? Yes.

Eric, you know I have a great deal of respect for you, but I must insist that you are wrong.  If you read the whole Bible as translated by JL Publications, you would see that in the original Hebrew:
Quote (Malakezaiah @ June 28 596 BC,19:07)

Malakezaiah 1

1 The word of the Lord unto His prophet Malakezaiah
2 In all things shalt thou praise his name Amen
3 In His mercy.
4 Yea verily I say unto you my prophet in thy times of need
5 If thou shalt go unto the board where thou commentest when the pub is not open any longer
6 And when thou surfest there there be no comedy nor foolishness
7 Yea if even unto three tries thou shalt not hear the words of the Prophet of the Spirit of Paley
8 First shalt thou go unto the wall plug and checketh that the power of my mighty spirit floweth through the plug.
9 If thou seest that my Spirit floweth go thou to thy keyboard and pingeth an IP address off thy Holy Network.
10 If thou canst not yet hear the words of the Prophet of the Spirit of Paley, neither canst thou hear the words of the Prophet AFDave, then shalt thou perform a DNS lookup of a site you have not visited in three months.
11 Then, shalt thou count to three. No more. No less.
12 Three shalt be the number thou shalt count, and the number of the counting shall be three.
13 Four shalt thou not count, nor either count thou two, excepting that thou then proceed to three.
14 Five is right out.
15 Once the number three, being the third number, be reached, then, lobbest thou thy Holy Hand Grenade of Antioch towards thy foe, who, being naughty in My sight, shall snuff it.'
16 Then shalt thou curse the ground, for the board where thou commentest when the pub is not open any longer, is also not open any longer.
17 Amen.

Admit you were wrong, and we can move on.


Date: 2006/06/29 03:27:33, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Louis @ June 29 2006,07:50)
Since we're discussing inane witterings of madmen,...

I believe I resemble that remark.

Quote (Louis @ June 29 2006,07:50)
If a man speaks in a wood, and there is no woman to hear him, is he still wrong?


My wife assures me that indeed, he is still wrong.  In fact, she is quite sure that the he need not even speak.


Date: 2006/06/29 16:39:28, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (jujuquisp @ June 29 2006,21:25)
I guarantee you, though, that my wife is more beautiful than his and my penis is longer and thicker than his.

Hey juju,

Just don't wave it in the Ron Numbers thread.

(somebody had to say it! )


(edited to clean it up a bit.)

Date: 2006/06/30 04:29:31, Link
Author: Lou FCD
edit: dammit, resident beat poet KE beat me to it.

Gotta be quick, Steve.

Date: 2006/07/04 09:19:35, Link
Author: Lou FCD


Date: 2006/07/06 17:27:46, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Uh oh.  Trouble in Paradise?



That’s a good point, but hang on. You seem to be assuming life as we know it. In order to rule out chance, don’t we have to rule out the chance of any possible kind of life? Do we know for an absolute fact that silicon or bzywhateverium can’t make life?

My old science teacher (the million year old bald guy) used to say “The universe is not only stranger than we imagine, but stranger than we can imagine”.

Aren’t they finding some pretty weird stuff down in caves and at the bottom of the ocean? Stuff that eats rocks and all? I’m not sure we can rule anything out just yet, can we?


Genetic engineers are a fact. We know that intelligent agents can manipulate genomes for fun and profit and if you care to disagree I’ve got a bag full of genetically engineered rotten fruit to throw at you. Presumably, according to the Darwinian chance worshippers, these intelligent agents with white lab coats and gene splicing machines arose through natural processes without any intelligent help. Point #1: intelligent agents capable of genetic engineering are a natural part of the universe. Next consider that DNA and ribosomes, the protein factory that exists in every living thing we’ve examined, is a digital program controlled machine. Instructions for manufacturing different proteins are *coded* onto the spine of the DNA molecule and the ribosome reads those coded instructions just like a computer reads instructions from a program. The machine then assembles a protein according to those instructions just like computer controlled machines assemble complex pieces of automobiles. DNA and ribosomes are digitally programmed robotic protein assemblers or *machines* in every sense of the word. Point #2: All living cells so far observed contain complex machinery. Next point. In every case where we observe a machine in nature and we *know* where the machine came from, we know it came from intelligent agency. Point #3: all machines where the origin can be determined come from intelligent agents..

Point #1: intelligent agents capable of genetic engineering are a natural part of the universe.
Point #2: all living cells so far observed contain complex machinery.
Point #3: all machines where the origin can be determined come from intelligent agents.

Now tell me why it’s unreasonable to consider it a strong possibility that the living machinery of life is the result of intelligent agency. If anyone can describe to me a plausible way for complex program code driven machinery on the level of DNA and ribosomes can assemble via chance interactions of chemicals with no forethought then I’ll reevaluate whether ID is the best explanation for where these machines came from. Until then, the best explanation is rather obvious unless you’ve got some kind of mental block that makes you refuse to believe it possible that intelligence existed in the universe before humans came along. -ds

Comment by janiebelle — July 6, 2006 @ 7:19 pm

For the benefit of the readers, various numbers have been floated around for the minimum number of parts of a self-replicating von-neumann automata (which is a necessary condition for life).

Something on the order of 1 out of 10^40,000 for probability was my inference from von Neumann’s writings. This is independent of the physical substrate of the automata, whether it is made of semi-conductor materials, DNA, amino acids, whatever…..

Because the architectures of the automata are recognized as independent (since we see partial constructs of it in engineering), and the specification was present before we knew much of the cell, it does not matter whether one defines life another way because what matters is we have found an artifact (life) matching an information rich independent specification (Turing machines and von neumann automata). They are even more information rich than Paley’s watch. Thus a design inference is reasonable even if we were to define life another way. After all, a complex machine is still a complex machine!

The von-neumann automata was mentioned in Dr. Albert Voie’s paper. I’d like to announce that possibly in a week or so, Dr. Albert Voie may visit our weblog!

The number 10^150 which I gave above thus one of the smaller numbers I had available. I invite my fellow UDers to give some of the numbers they are familiar with.


Comment by scordova — July 6, 2006 @ 7:38 pm

Ok, now I’m lost again. I’m gonna do what I said before, and we’ll have to come back to all that stuff.

Enjoy your weekend, Salvadore.


Comment by janiebelle — July 6, 2006 @ 8:22 pm

Easy, Dave, I’m not suggesting anything else.

I’m trying to understand how Salvadore and these guys prove mathematically that evolution isn’t true, or as Salvadore said earlier, that it’s mathematically nearly impossible for chance to explain life.

I’m just trying to see how we cover all the bases, so there are no holes for things to slip through.

I agree that it’s kind of dumb for them to say “we made this happen without intelligence”. If they made it happen, well, duh, there’s intelligence.

I’m just trying to understand this, it’s not really necessary for you to be rude and yell at me about mental blocks.

Sorry if I said something to P you O.


Comment by janiebelle — July 6, 2006 @ 9:54 pm

Aww, a spat.  How sweet.  She's on her way out.  Think she's really a plant?  She's a pretty good one, if she is.  Maybe she's really Dembski, testing the troops.

Date: 2006/07/10 18:06:01, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Arden Chatfield @ July 10 2006,21:43)
American fundies are like that -- kiss their asses and mouth their platitudes and they'll overlook anything you do in your personal life.

Well as long as you're not too public about it.  They were apparently slobbering all over Janiebelle right up until she was rumored to have announced she was sweating up the sheets with an allegedly girl Marine.

They're supposedly hypocritical bastards in theory who don't even believe their own hypothetical bullshit.  They won't rest until they allegedly run the world as apparent dictators.

Janie got banned from Uncommon Descent

Near as I can tell, DaveTard just don't like girls.  Have you read her stuff?  I think my wife's getting a little jealous...


Takes one to know one, homo.  Hey, wait.  ####. Now I have to ban myself.- dt

(edited to add appropriate disclaimer words to avoid lawsuits and the Wrath of Tard)


Date: 2006/07/10 18:20:32, Link
Author: Lou FCD
You can catch a "lack of sexual preference"?  Oh man I'm gonna force my wife to read the whole blog.


Date: 2006/07/11 01:50:18, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (guthrie @ July 11 2006,06:30)
because laying is immoral.

Oh well, I guess I'm going to he11. :D

You might want to adjust that.

Date: 2006/07/13 11:16:15, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Is this idiot scumbag still around?  I'd have thought he'd have been smart enough to go away by now.

Date: 2006/10/10 05:45:28, Link
Author: Lou FCD
You know, the whole time I was living under my self-imposed ban, I had craploads of stuff to say.  Now that I've been notified by email that it's ok that I return, I seem to have been afflicted with the deadly cat-tongue disease.

I guess I just want to start by saying "Thanks" to all our loyal fans, and reiterate my apology to Dr. Elsberry.  Sorry Wes.


Date: 2006/10/10 06:18:38, Link
Author: Lou FCD
The post in question was early on, Deadman.  It's title was "Message for Deadman" I think, and was in response to one of your Doubting Thomas type comments here.

As for the identity of the young lady in the picture, I'll not be revealing that, other than to say it was a friend of the family who found immense pleasure and untold amounts of humor in the whole thing.

Steve, please pass on my sincerest thanks to the governor.  I've missed this place, and it won't happen again.

guthrie, I really hope you're not as upset by the whole thing as you seemed to be with the instruction manual comment.

I'd hate to think I p'd you off.

Date: 2006/10/10 06:38:37, Link
Author: Lou FCD
And so the conquering hero returns in triumph to the mud streets of the leper colony, amidst an appreciative shower of flowers, confused cheers, and empty popcorn boxes...  :p

[slaps hands together] Okay! Let the punitive processing begin!

Never let it be said the Church Burnin' Ebola boys ain't forgiving...


Date: 2006/10/10 07:13:56, Link
Author: Lou FCD

She enjoyed having you there.  I couldn't hardly get her to stop giggling long enough to stand still so I could take the picture.

And Kayla was cracking up, which wasn't helping at all.  (The girls' niece is actually my daughter, btw.)


Thanks, and I guess I'll have to "bite".

How many?

(And, of course, were they really good?  Chocolate chip?  The girls LOVE chocolate, so they'd probably have bought a bunch if you'd've asked!;)

Date: 2006/10/10 07:21:15, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Hey Rich!

Don't you still owe the girls a guest post?

Date: 2006/10/10 07:26:02, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (stevestory @ Oct. 10 2006,12:22)
On the one hand, I think the P2P approach of things like OverwhelmingEvidence is smart, it gets around the court system. On the other hand, it's a case of middle-aged adults trying to act 'hip' and 'radical' to teenagers, so I'm not too worried it'll succeed.

Oh, I don't know, Steve.  Middle aged adults acting hip and radical and bisexual seems to work pretty well on middle aged autodidact polymaths with subscriptions to Scientific American and SATIQ scores of 85 billion....

Just so y'know.

Date: 2006/10/10 07:31:55, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Thanks, Deadman.  I'll raise one to all our fans myself tonight.  It was just a little challenge that grew into something with a life of its own.  Two lives, actually.

Funny that it never got a mention on UD after the girls "came out".  Not even a "those damned lying darwinists didn't fool ME!"  Wonder if that could be because even his mindless minions wouldn't be able to deny the OVERWHELMING EVIDENCE?

Sorry, couldn't resist.


Date: 2006/10/10 11:43:57, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Fair enough, guthrie.  Remember that Janie's a lit student, though.  There were intimations that she was going off to Oxford, though that was never explicitly said.  17 year old girls don't get into Oxford by being slouches.  And she HAD to be well above average in the noggin to do the job she was intended to do, which was ask embarrasing questions at UD.  She really didn't get much of a chance to do that, but by that time, things were quickly moving well beyond what was originally intended.

Well I wasn't a Marine, but I WAS in the service, which is why Kate knew the lingo to keep Davey interested.  Most military jargon transfers rather well for long periods of time, and with just a little help from some Marines around here, I could tweak it in a hurry.

I was rather proud of some of the posts, though.  "Kissing Corporal Kate", "My Mistress", "The Dreams", "Mom Please Don't Read This One", "My Lover is Freaky", and some of the others seemed to me to have some literary merit that I really enjoyed.  'Course I might be biased.

It was fun.  It wasn't meant to get so involved, it just sort of spun out of control.

Anyways, I'm glad you're not pissed, though I understand your discomfort.

Date: 2006/10/10 12:06:41, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I think we should take up a collection to send JanieBelle and Corporal Kate to the DI /CSC dinner.  What a hoot that would be!  I'm good for $20.

Janie and Kate would go "all breezy" under their dresses (we guys know this as going commando) and flashing Bill Dembski.

Jonathan Wells would come on to Janie, and Kate would probably whack 'em upside his head.  There might wind up being a naked jello cat fight somewhere along the line.  MorphoDyke Denyse would definitely be targeted with a large raw fish from the kitchen.

DaveScot would wind up being tied to a chair where he'd be videotaped and forced to tell his mama he was a homo.

Then they'd have to kick the girls out. Janie would leave peacefully but it'd take 3-4 security personnel to expel Kate.  She doesn't really take crap from anybody.

Date: 2006/10/10 12:11:37, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Y'know if I wanted to know something about biology, the first place I'd go is to the experts in the field...  the graphic artists.


Date: 2006/10/10 12:19:11, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (guthrie @ Oct. 10 2006,16:57)
Well, those bits were rather well written.  And you did hinit rather a bit that "she" was going to Oxford, although I can never remember if they take 17 year olds these days or not.  They sometimes used to.

Thanks, guthrie.

I didn't know if Oxford did or not, and was betting that 8 billion SATIQ Dave didn't either.

It was a pretty safe bet.

Date: 2006/10/10 12:30:32, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I'm thinking of going as two lesbians young girls without sexual preference....

Date: 2006/10/10 12:33:04, Link
Author: Lou FCD
What makes them useless?

Their creators, oddly enough.

Date: 2006/10/10 12:35:45, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Careful, Ved.  You never know what kinds of things go on in here....

Date: 2006/10/10 12:43:39, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Hey, while I was hiatus from AtBC, I read something about spiders having silk glands in their feet, too!

I lost the reference, anyone else see that?

Date: 2006/10/10 20:53:33, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Thanks, Rev.

Date: 2006/10/11 09:50:28, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Cedric Katesby @ Oct. 11 2006,13:53)
The rule is "whatever works baby".

Can I be so bold as to amend that to read

The rule is "whatever works for the moment baby".


Quote (Occam's Aftershave @ Oct. 11 2006,14:34)
It’s your continued pattern of lying to others that’s so unchristian and disturbing.

Oh, I don't know OA.  From what I can tell lately, that's VERY christian and disturbing.

Date: 2006/10/11 09:58:14, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Oh, Lookie Here!

A newly discovered species of bird.  One more to add to your list of critters to be squeezed into the ark, Davey.

Appropriately enough, it's a new kind of finch.


Date: 2006/10/12 03:08:05, Link
Author: Lou FCD

Date: 2006/10/12 07:24:44, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (bourgeois_rage @ Oct. 12 2006,11:04)
Quote (Lou FCD @ Oct. 10 2006,17:30)
I'm thinking of going as two lesbians young girls without sexual preference....

Would that really be a costume? :D

I'm not even sure anymore!


Date: 2006/10/12 07:28:19, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Richardthughes @ Oct. 12 2006,10:51)
Quote (Aardvark @ Oct. 11 2006,20:35)
Quote (Richardthughes @ Oct. 11 2006,14:49)

I love it so!

Whack that mole!


This is now a great read...!

I wonder if Dr. Dawkins would like to borrow the Big Green Marker....

Date: 2006/10/12 08:20:56, Link
Author: Lou FCD
No, it was an unknown intelligent designer who may well have been a space alien.

Date: 2006/10/12 08:30:07, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Arden Chatfield @ Oct. 12 2006,13:25)
Looking over the fiasco at, I'm starting to think that this may be JAD's problem.

Or ONE of them, at least.

Holy Crap.  That should have DAJ's picture in the definition!

Date: 2006/10/17 06:51:24, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I hope they all eat the cake AFTER they piss on it...

oh.  analogy.  right.  I knew that.

I still hope they all eat pissy cake.


Date: 2006/10/17 06:55:36, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Joseph, comment 78...

As John Davison once posted:
“‘Of course evolution is the cornerstone of biology. That does not mean the Darwinian version of the process has any validity.”

There's something EXTRA Tardilicious about quoting DAJ to back up a point about ANYTHING.

He needs a Special Tard Award.

Date: 2006/10/19 02:18:48, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Y'all will have to forgive me, I'm just the son of a carpenter, but...

If Eve was made from Adam's rib, wouldn't that make her a clone, and thus have exactly the same genes etc as Adam?  Wouldn't that mean they were homozygowhatsits?

If so, wouldn't that cut the available genetic material in half?

Just wonderin'.

Date: 2006/10/19 02:50:33, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I don't know.  Seems to me that this whole "fine tuning" thing rests on the assumption that this is the only way it could possibly work.

"Why is the universe the way it is?" is a lot different than "Why is the universe in the only possible configuration in which it could be?".

Again, I'm just the son of a carpenter.  I didn't even finish my physics degree, so my tuppence is worth exactly what you just paid for it.

Date: 2006/10/19 04:57:12, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (afdave @ Oct. 19 2006,08:28)
Lou FCD...    
If Eve was made from Adam's rib, wouldn't that make her a clone, and thus have exactly the same genes etc as Adam?  Wouldn't that mean they were homozygowhatsits?
No I don't think so. My understanding is that ....

I have no idea if you're right or wrong about this, but you'll forgive me if I don't defer to your understanding of Jack Squat.


My question is whether Adam and Eve could have had different genes.

Improvius' comment answered my question.

So.  My next question is can two people be clones, have the same genes, and be different genders?

Seems not.  Otherwise you could have identical twins of different genders, right?

Date: 2006/10/19 09:10:12, Link
Author: Lou FCD
And lo, Jesus spake with a loud voice unto Argy and saith, "Taketh thy alleles and sticketh them in thine own jeans... the back part."

Date: 2006/10/19 11:35:09, Link
Author: Lou FCD
That SLOT argument keeps coming back like Freddy Krueger...

and it's just about as real.

Kinda scary though, in its own way.  I mean, can people really be THAT stubborn and THAT stupid?


It's Nightmare on Discovery Institute Street.

Date: 2006/10/19 12:19:18, Link
Author: Lou FCD

(I don't even remember what I was laughing at, but it was really f'ing funny!;)

Date: 2006/10/19 12:34:29, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Chris Hyland @ Oct. 19 2006,17:30)
Is it just me or does that sound dirty?

Only if you're doing it right.


Date: 2006/10/19 12:46:01, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Myeh... it ain't bamagin' yer drain 'til you're impersonatin' a fire engine like Catherine Eddows on Gin.

Date: 2006/10/20 02:26:11, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (carlsonjok @ Oct. 20 2006,06:50)
Quote (Crabby Appleton @ Oct. 20 2006,02:37)
Hey Davey, why hasn't an archaeologist, anthropologist, biblical scholar or anyone else for that matter, ever found human remains that show the wear of 900 years of living (or 500, or 100)?

It'd be pretty hard to hide that kind of wear and tear on a human skeleton even if they were "genetically rich"! Don't wave your hands or diddle your nose. 'Splain please.

Don't mean to butt in here, but I found this explanation.

Hope that helps.

Oh, well that settles it.  I'm converted.

Date: 2006/10/20 11:42:10, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Altabin @ Oct. 20 2006,15:18)
Quote (improvius @ Oct. 20 2006,22:15)
Quote (Altabin @ Oct. 20 2006,16:10)
Oh, come on, hereoisreal is just one of you guys f#cking with us.  Really.  I'm onto my third glass of rare Sicilian blueberry amaro and this still doesn't make any f#cking sense.

No.  He's been doing this bit for at least over a year.  Maybe this is the first he's been on AtBC, but he's been around for a while.  If it's a spoof, it's an extremely long-running one.

Has Lou FCD ever been seen in the same room as him?

Um... I might resent that.

I at least had style!

Date: 2006/10/20 11:45:12, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Not to mention I Janie can spell, and I she makes sense...

I hope.


Date: 2006/10/21 02:26:51, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Ichthyic @ Oct. 21 2006,05:40)
What is this world coming to?!

a preference for wood paneled floors?

I'm sure that's where the attraction to basketball comes from.


Exactly.  EVERYONE knows that the best floors are made of ice.

Date: 2006/10/21 08:35:55, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (afdave @ Oct. 21 2006,12:13)
I'm interested in YOUR response to MY statements, not a big list of links, the content of which, you probably don't even comprehend.

Deadman: Now stand aside, worthy adversary.
AfDave: 'Tis but a scratch.
Deadman: A scratch? Your arm's off.
AfDave: No it isn't.
Deadman: What's that, then?
AfDave: [after a pause] I've had worse.
Deadman: You liar.
AfDave: Come on ya pansy.
(Deadman cuts off other arm)
Deadman: "Look, you stupid Bastard. You've got no arms left."
AfDave: "Yes I have."
Deadman: "Look!"
AfDave: "It's just a flesh wound."
(Deadman cuts off one leg)
AfDave: "Right, I'll do you for that!"
Deadman: "You'll what?"
AfDave: "Come here!"
Deadman: "What are you gonna do, bleed on me?"
AfDave: "I'm invincible!"
Deadman: "...You're a loony."
(Deadman cuts off AfDave's last leg)
AfDave: "Okay, we'll call it a draw."
Deadman: "Come, Jeannot."
(Deadman and Jeannot ride off)
AfDave: "Oh! Had enough, eh? Come back and take what's coming to you, you yellow bastards! Come back here and take what's coming to you! I'll bite your legs off!"

Date: 2006/10/21 11:40:20, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Ichthyic @ Oct. 21 2006,15:26)
Exactly.  EVERYONE knows that the best floors are made of ice.

oops, except that much of the time those nice ice floors are covered by parquet floors, again showing the preference for nice wood flooring.

how many hockey arenas do you know that host basketball venues, instead of vice versa?

B-ball rules!

I wonder how long this little bit of OT will go...

Well, if Easterbrook writes for ESPN, then it's only tangentally off topic, right?  Plus,..

Well, I can't think of another reason why this isn't off topic, but any Intelligently Designed floor would be set up for hockey since hockey is the greatest sport in the 6,000 year history of the universe, and hockey can be played on both wood and ice.  Can you imagine playing roundball on ice?  I thought not.

I win.  (AFDave style.)

Date: 2006/10/22 09:16:34, Link
Author: Lou FCD

"Oxymoron".... mostly without the oxy.

Date: 2006/10/22 09:26:52, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Nah... AFDave is every bit as stupid as he appears.

Whether he is a fake or real troll is irrelevent.

Date: 2006/10/23 01:12:47, Link
Author: Lou FCD
His "logic has no place in science" comment has to make it on his All Time Hits list.  Classic.  Explains a lot about DAJ, too.

Date: 2006/10/23 09:44:46, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Steviepinhead @ Oct. 23 2006,14:19)
... in which your positions have been reduced to smoking carnage).

While you turn a lovely phrase Steviepinhead, I'm not sure "smoking carnage" is really appropriate, as it seems to imply the wreckage of something substantial that once stood.  Perhaps I might suggest "ephemeral ashes of a small paper house set alight by a cheap bic lighter" to connotate the fragility of the original structure of Dave's "hypothesis", and the ease with which it is destroyed.

Date: 2006/10/24 03:07:19, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote ("Rev Dr" Lenny Flank @ Oct. 23 2006,20:25)
I'm sticking with the "Freeloader Hypothesis".

Alas, I'm not typing it all out here.  So you'll have to do a search for it over at the PT if you want to see it.   :)

Here's the link to the comment at PT for The Freeloader Hypothesis, put forth by the Good Reverend Doctor.

If I may, just for reference...

Quote ("Rev Dr" Lenny Flank @ Apr. 20, 2006,18:37)
Re: the “Mars” hypothesis of religion:

I’m more of the “Freeloader” hypothesis of religion. It goes something like this:

In most nonhuman primate societies, the Big Cheese, the guy in charge (and it is invariably a guy), is able to run things because he can beat up all challengers (or, in more socially-oriented nonhuman primate societies, he can build an alliance of others that will support him and beat up all his challengers). In the earliest human societies, that was probably true as well.

Alas, ruling by raw intimidation is, uh, kind of wasteful of energy, time and (once you develop effective weapons) members of the social group. So it’s an enormous advantage to coerce social members without using physical methods to do it. Enter “religion”.

It’s a given that all the members of the early human social group were frightened, awed and (most importantly) unable to explain or control the forces of nature. Enter the “shaman”, the guy with the “special ability” to understand and even control (or at least appear to) the unseen and incomprehensible supernatural forces (aka THE GODS). The Big Cheese, meanwhile, sees a powerful ally, and … voila. Organized religion. The Big Cheese is the Big Cheese not just because he can beat up anyone who challenges him, but he also has the shaman on his side — and that means he also has THE GODS on his side, who can REALLY REALLY beat up anyone who displeases them.

Oh, and by the way, social group members, we priests/Big Cheese are terribly busy all the time with this “communing with THE GODS” thingie (you don’t want THE GODS to send another drought like they did *last* year, do you?), so you can’t possibly expect *us* to, uh, you know, WORK or anything. We’ll leave that all to you wonderfully loyal social members, who will therefore please THE GODS and make them happy by doing whatever the shaman/priests tell you THE GODS want you to do. Such as, oh, give a portion of everything you produce to us – uh, I mean, to THE GODS. And if you don’t, by golly, THE GODS will beat you up really really bad. Just you wait and see.

Oh, and by the way, THE GODS want you to invade that tribe’s territory over there because I want its fruit trees — uh, I mean, THE GODS want us to punish that tribe for its sins, and THE GODS have graciously given us their land. So get to it. Me, I’ll be here with the priests, communing with THE GODS on your behalf.

And indeed, organized religion has been a tool of the political/economic ruling elite ever since. Heck, in the case of most ancient societies, it WAS the ruling elite.

And you know what? They STILL don’t do any work for their living.

Just thought I'd help.

Date: 2006/10/24 03:15:01, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Awe, come on, guthrie!  The North Atlantic can't be too cold to swim if there's BEER involved!

Date: 2006/10/26 03:59:18, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote ("Rev Dr" Lenny Flank @ Oct. 25 2006,19:11)
Quote (Kristine @ Oct. 24 2006,22:31)
Being that I am a belly dancer

Come on, you can't post something like THIS to a bunch of socially-challenged science geeks crowded around their computer keyboards, without posting a couple URL's to some **photos*** . . . . . .


Whilst I have no urls for pictures for ya' Rev, you can find Kristine's blog at

You might get a more prompt response there.  Great blog, highly recommended by both myself and the girls.

Date: 2006/10/26 04:05:33, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (stevestory @ Oct. 26 2006,01:32)
Crikey. K.E.'s posts are starting to make sense to me.

I'm spending too much time on this damm site.

Uh-oh.  I had that exact same thought yesterday...

Date: 2006/10/26 04:31:59, Link
Author: Lou FCD
AFDave's however, are a different story.


Date: 2006/10/26 04:49:29, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Jason Spaceman @ Oct. 26 2006,06:56)
The signers are anthropologists, biologists, chemists, geologists, physicists and psychologists.

What?  No LAWYERS?  No ENGINEERS?  No Ex-Dell putter-togetherers?

What kind of science and biology statement is THAT?????

Date: 2006/10/26 04:54:57, Link
Author: Lou FCD
We interupt this thread for a very important Public Service Announcement:

Children, this is your brain on crack.  Don't do drugs.

Now back to your regularly scheduled thread of IDiot hilarity.

Date: 2006/10/26 05:03:16, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (afdave @ Oct. 26 2006,09:57)
OA ... you are beginning to be a little more intellectually honest, [snip]

What would YOU know about THAT?

Date: 2006/10/26 05:07:12, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Shirley Knott @ Oct. 26 2006,09:57)
no hugs for thugs,

And no kisses for thugs.







Date: 2006/10/26 05:12:26, Link
Author: Lou FCD

No lips for drips!

How 'bout that?

(Sorry, Shirley, I get a kick out of it every time you say that!  Consider it an homage?)

Date: 2006/10/26 05:29:48, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Thanks, Steve.  I was in the process of posting such a request in the UD thread when this crap disappeared.

I for one appreciate it.


Date: 2006/10/26 05:34:36, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Woo Hooo!!!  ID is SCIENCE!!!  DAWKINS SAYS SO!!!

Looks like O'Leary is throwing a party.

Ok, well, it's false science, but hey, it's a step in the right direction, right?


Too funny.

Date: 2006/10/26 06:08:41, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (k.e @ Oct. 26 2006,10:58)

I'm trying to work out if that is a good sign or a bad sign :)

...not to worry ...they make perfect sense to me...snicker.

So are we.


Seriously, some of the stuff you come up with is an obvious reference to something, I just have no idea what.  I figure I'm pretty well-read, for a Christian high school gradidigiot, but apparently not well-read enough.

Some of the other stuff you come up with is like the lingering after-effects of a really good acid trip.

Some of the other stuff just totally loses me.

Lately, however, I've understood a much larger percentage of what you say, and more importantly, what you're driving at - your point, as it were.

So either you are becoming more lucid, or I'm becoming more educated...

Or I'm becoming less lucid.

It's the third option that scares me.


Date: 2006/10/26 06:54:16, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Ok, look hero.

UD stuff goes in this thread.  Mad ramblings of a crack addict go in the hereoisreal thread, which you yourself started.  That way, if anyone is interested in reading about UD, they can come here and not have to wade through a bunch of crap they're not interested in.

Admittedly, we all get a bit off topic from time to time.  I'm probably as bad about that as anyone here.  Worse, probably.

But you have an entire thread dedicated just to you.  Please use it.
I suspect both of you are telling me where to go.

You suspect correctly.  Go HERE, the Hereoisreal thread

You are not being silenced, you are being catagorized, so please don't play the martyr card.

Date: 2006/10/26 07:14:45, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (stevestory @ Oct. 26 2006,12:07)
Hereoisreal, don't make me laugh by comparing this site to UD. Now, if you have something to say which is relevant to UD, put it in this thread. If you have extensive numerology or anecdotes to share, which aren't related to UD, put it in your own thread.

Right, because if this were UD, you'd probably have gotten one of these by now.

Quote (DaveScot @ Oct. 26 2006,11:03)


There has been debate among the moderators whether to ban you. I defended you. However, given your uninformed comment that ID claims the designer is God I’m going to admit an error and correct it right now. You’re history.

Date: 2006/10/26 07:21:20, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Same Thread

Quote (jerry @ Oct 26th 2006,11:32)


Ban me too. I took no offense at Phil Vaz’s comment about the designer being God. I would guess that a very large majority of the pro ID people here explicitly believe the designer is God. Challenge him on it instead of banning him.

Certainly Dembski and Behe personally think it is God who is the designer and I am sure most of the others who are pro ID think so too.

When the discussion trespasses into discussions of God nearly all the time, it is hard not to associate the designer with God. This is not really a site about science but more of a venue for people to espouse their personal philosophies. So demanding that Phil Vaz’s comments be kept to the science of ID alone given the threads of the last few days is ludicrous.

Yep, a venue for people to espouse their personal philosophies blog all about the science of ID.

Date: 2006/10/26 07:23:51, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Crap.  Gotta be quick around here.

Date: 2006/10/26 07:27:15, Link
Author: Lou FCD
####, Rich.  I can't even seem to arrange that for MYSELF!

('course, my wife would have my head if I even TRIED!;)

And I'm not really sure the girls ever really ruled that out, anyway.

Just so y'know...

Date: 2006/10/26 07:30:37, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (stevestory @ Oct. 26 2006,12:25)
LOL. I'm waiting for the day when, in a fit of pique, Dave reads one of his own comments and bans himself before he realizes what's he's doing.

Hmmm!  Now that WOULD be classic.

Date: 2006/10/26 07:33:03, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (ericmurphy @ Oct. 26 2006,12:31)
Quote (afdave @ Oct. 26 2006,12:22)
I like JohnW's new tack on the info thing ...

I think I'll throw my own new tack in for grins ...

Churchill Speech = Maximum Info

FDR Speech = Minimal Info

Bill Clinton Speech = Zero Info

By the way, "Bush speech = negative info."

Of course, I could generalize that to "AF Dave post = negative info," too, and for the same reasons.

And in the meantime, did you kind of skip over the "redundancy" part of my bullet points, Dave?

I hate flood control.

Date: 2006/10/26 07:42:43, Link
Author: Lou FCD

I know I said this a few months ago, but I really feel the need to reiterate.

Anecdotally, I think I can safely say that folks like AFDave bump religious fundyism a few points on the TOSICA.

Watching him over the past few months has really been enlightening.  (AFDave, that's BAD news for you, not good.)

The extreme denial of reality at all costs can't be good for kids.  It has to stunt their education horribly.

[EDIT for spelling]

Date: 2006/10/26 07:50:38, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (carlsonjok @ Oct. 26 2006,12:41)
Quote (Lou FCD @ Oct. 26 2006,12:14)
Quote (DaveScot @ Oct. 26 2006,11:03)


There has been debate among the moderators whether to ban you. I defended you. However, given your uninformed comment that ID claims the designer is God I’m going to admit an error and correct it right now. You’re history.

Holy Reformation, Batman!  One of the regulars (jerry) is starting to rebel.

Yeah, he's on his way out....

ID ain't about religion no matter what Dembski, O'Leary, and Cordova say!  You're outta here, HOMO! - dt

Date: 2006/10/26 07:55:49, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (hereoisreal @ Oct. 26 2006,12:52)
I got it. Two weeks ago.

Bill pushed the button, but he said to the mods,
" I'll recend if the majority wants him back."

I have the E.

I have never tried to post again.


The point of that was that you haven't gotten it HERE, despite your arcane, illogical, and off-topic comments in this thread.

Date: 2006/10/26 08:06:47, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Glen Davidson @ Oct. 26 2006,12:55)

It just seems that this should be said ever so often.

Glen D

Agreed, Glen.  Insight that needs to be mentioned every now and again.

And yet...

Quote (Glen Davidson @ Oct. 26 2006,12:55)
What is unusual is how many losses he is willing to take.

I wonder if AFDave's willingness to take on so many losses is a sign of his utter desperation, and thus a sign that he secretly doesn't accept all that he espouses.  Are his ridiculous attempts here just a manifestation of his fear, his knowing that when he dies he will not be rewarded in heaven?  Is it possible that this is a desperate search for any point, just one, that will ease his aching doubts?

Whereas other creationists are content to swallow the bullshiite whole and relax, is this thread in itself proof that AFDave WANTS to believe, but deep down doesn't?

Date: 2006/10/26 08:32:03, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (carlsonjok @ Oct. 26 2006,13:11)
Maybe. Maybe not.  I think the recent revelation that he has a meeting at AIG in November has more to do with it.   He may just be building his street cred as a culture warrior.

Quote (Glen Davidson @ Oct. 26 2006, 13:14)
You may certainly be right about that, Lou.  He seems to be fighting off "the devils" afflicting him.  However, it may be his perpetuum mobile, his Sisyphean punishment for denying the sense and senses of human perception.

Glen D

Hmm... I'm not sure these are mutally exclusive.

After a few minutes reflection, I believe that my comments may have been more self-referential than I would have cared to admit.

I believe I've mentioned that I was involved in fundyism when I was a teenager, and though I hate to give Dave the "You were never a Real Christian" opening, I have to say that my comments above were truly reflective of myself at the time, though I would never have admitted that.  Not even to myself.

It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of a living god.

It is an even more fearful thing to realize that when you die, there may be no "I" any more.

Date: 2006/10/26 08:35:29, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Hurry!  Quick!  Somebody post something about Judge Jones, before the masses notice!  Wipe the thread!  Wipe the Goddamned thread!!!!!

Date: 2006/10/26 08:45:05, Link
Author: Lou FCD

16. franky172  // Oct 26th 2006 at 1:24 pm


We don’t know the designing agent can not be a strictly physical being,

You may be right, but I think that Dr. Dembski appears to disagree with you, at least in this essay:

“no intelligent agent who is strictly physical could have presided over the origin of the universe or the origin of life.”

and we don’t know the universe was designed. I pointed out in another thread that the assertion of the design of the universe is a currently unsound application of design theory.

The Discovery Institute also appears to disagree with you:
The theory of intelligent design holds that certain features of the universe and of living things are best explained by an intelligent cause, not an undirected process such as natural selection.

Of course we are not limited in our understanding to Dr. Dembski’s or the Discovery Institutes claims, and I may be misreading those claims as well; please correct me if I am. But it seems like the main proponents of ID seem to feel the universe *itself* shows signs of design.

Comment by franky172 — October 26, 2006 @ 1:24 pm

Date: 2006/10/26 08:49:59, Link
Author: Lou FCD
bj, the agnostic christian....

17. bj  // Oct 26th 2006 at 1:36 pm

I don’t have many doubts that most of the contributors and lurkers here believe that the designer was God, particularly the Christian God. And honestly, that is one of the reasons that attracted me to the site.

Yet, other options exist. All that is required as a minimum belief is that some form of intelligence is present in the universe and in living organisms. There are a number of ways to flesh this out short of full-blow theism. Or one can, like myself, believe that there is something beyond matter and energy, like intelligence, but be agnostic about it true nature and origins.

Comment by bj — October 26, 2006 @ 1:36 pm

(bold mine)

Date: 2006/10/26 08:53:01, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Henry J @ Oct. 26 2006,13:48)
Re "What?  No LAWYERS?  No ENGINEERS?  No Ex-Dell putter-togetherers?"

Ya forgot mathematicians. ;)


I did indeed.  How shameful of me....

Please pardon my omission.


Date: 2006/10/26 08:57:34, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Richardthughes @ Oct. 26 2006,13:52)

It is plain for all to see
there's a cancer at UD
Keep the desinger's name well hidden
Just don't ask 'who?' - it's forbidden!
though you might have found it odd
that our leaders think it's 'god'
don't confront us with that fact
Or our banning Tard will act!

It's got a great hook, Rich.  Put it in the key of G and I think you've got a winner there!

Date: 2006/10/26 09:34:57, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Richardthughes @ Oct. 26 2006,13:58)
There is also a clever, equaly vaild counter-argument, RIGHT!

Yes, I believe that one was pioneered in the sixties and seventies by Chilly Philly Homeboy, Bill Cosby, and interestingly enough, he was parodying Noah...


Date: 2006/10/26 10:32:34, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Our Pal Sal

Quote (Our Pal Sal @ October 26, 2006 @ 8:45 am

Whatever theories we may hold, science should welcome skepticism and even be willing to ponder outrageous ideas.

An Old-Earth view of physics and geology is in light years better shape than Darwinian evolution, however, it still should not be given a free pass. Skepticism is a good thing.

The question Jerry poses are reasonable, but one might look at Sullivan Mountain in Walter Brown’s writings and the bent sedimentary rocks with marine fossils embedded in the sedimentary rock and decide whether Brown has a better explanation for bent sedimentary rock than someone else.

I also pointed out basic thermodynamics is at variance with prevailing explanations for volcanoes. This is well documented in peer review. I encourage the reader to see my debate with Darwinist Geologist Joe Meert.

That said, the topic of this thread was Old-Earth Creationist Richard Smalley. I would appreciate a few more comments on him as this thread is in tribute to him.


(bold mine)

Well, that's one I hadn't heard before...

Date: 2006/10/26 10:40:10, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (ScaryFacts @ Oct. 26 2006,13:38)
Quote (Lou FCD @ Oct. 26 2006,14:32)
After a few minutes reflection, I believe that my comments may have been more self-referential than I would have cared to admit.

Great post Lou.

One of the things that amazes me about the people here is their openness and honesty.  It's refreshing.

Well thanks.  I wish I could claim some sort of moral high ground here, but the truth is that the girls (Kate in particular) have made it abundantly clear that anything short of complete honestly would reflect badly on them, for which I would get my ass kicked.


Date: 2006/10/26 10:57:36, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (deadman_932 @ Oct. 26 2006,15:48)
Yes, I believe that one was pioneered in the sixties and seventies by Chilly Philly Homeboy, Bill Cosby, and interestingly enough, he was parodying Noah

Good Googly, I recall that album. That was the one that also included the bit on shaving:  "tiny li'l hairs that grow out muh zop zip, I've been cut to ribbons"
I heard that right after the Cheech and Chong ones came out. Then I listened to Lenny Bruce and The Goon Show, found Monty Python and topped it with Pink Floyd and LZ to create a frontier that I never stopped exploring.

Interestingly enough, I had that on vinyl (the greatest hits, though).  One of my very first albums of my own (that didn't involve muppets, that is).  I was thinking about it the other day, my kids had no idea what I was talking about, so I went to Wal-Mart online and downloaded the whole album....

and actually PAID for it.

Perhaps I should host the files somewhere, just for fun...

"Old Weird Harold was six-nine, weighed 50 pounds..."

It's the LORD, Noah.


Date: 2006/10/26 12:01:53, Link
Author: Lou FCD
really rather interesting"

This has to be the funniest headline I've seen at

(It's currently the second of the three revolving headlines on the home page)

Oh, and the link to the story itself is

It's good to know that scientists and science reporters have a sense of humor.

I have a 12 year old son, so my potty humor is in its Renaissance.

Of course that sheds new light on this quote from the article...

Showalter of the SETI Institute also has been observing Uranus with Hubble

Date: 2006/10/26 12:05:05, Link
Author: Lou FCD
There is a reason for the recent spate of activity on Uranus.

Just so y'know.

Ok, I'm in tears, I have to go for a while and compose myself before family science night at the middle school...

Date: 2006/10/26 14:11:10, Link
Author: Lou FCD

“Being taught about #### - being taught that if you sin you will go to everlasting damnation, and really believing that - is going to be a harder piece of child abuse than the comparatively mild sexual abuse.”

This Dawkins guy seems absolutely mad! What would happen if the above quote was said by a Meyer, or Dembski, or Wells? There would be outrage. Everything I read from Dawkins makes me shake my head in disbelief. How on Earth he maintains a job when he’s constantly making these nonsensical statements in public is a mystery. On the bright side though, if there was a way to build a cyborg whose purpose was to turn people in the direction of ID without using hard science, its name would be Richard Dawkins.

"What?  An atheist that doesn't beleive in He77 and thinks you shouldn't terrorize children?  He's nuts!  That's NONSENSE!  How can he worship Satan, if he doesn't believe in He77? ? ? ? ? ? "

Date: 2006/10/26 14:15:13, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I'm with ALF, because quite simply, ALF rocks.

Date: 2006/10/26 14:25:26, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (shaner74 @ Oct 25th 2006,9:19 pm)

Nightlight brings up a good point concerning quantum physics, and its decidedly non-deterministic nature. I believe many people that visit this site and others like it are versed in QP, yet nobody ever seems to bring it up. There are many interpretations of it, but most seem to point to “mind” existing outside of matter. It just seems odd to me that physicists are dealing with this stuff called matter that is anything but “material” and can be called just plain weird, while Darwinists like Dawkins are still acting like atoms are solid things bumping around aimlessly in space.

Comment by shaner74 — October 25, 2006 @ 9:19 pm

(my bold)

Well, Shaner, given their expertise in biology, thermodynamics, geology,....

Date: 2006/10/26 14:48:09, Link
Author: Lou FCD
A state of denial that would make Laura Bush proud.

I wonder if the first lady is secretly AFDave's mom...
"Absolutely I think that is wrong," Bush said in an exclusive interview with CNN Wednesday. "Of course, the president has been frank from the very very first speech he gave to the country after the September 11 attacks, talking about this is a long war, this is a very difficult war.

"It's a different war than our country has ever faced. The enemy can make a big show on television like they did for the bloody last month we had in Iraq by blowing themselves up a lot of times along with other people. But our success is not so easy to see. But the fact is that we are succeeding."

Date: 2006/10/26 15:06:02, Link
Author: Lou FCD
huh.  I'm just wonderin'.  Besides being the leader of the IDEA club, does anyone have any idea what Sal actually does?

I mean, I've never really heard anyone say that he was an actual working engineer, or a teacher, or even mention much about his being a student.

Does he actually do anything besides entertain us?

Date: 2006/10/26 15:17:46, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Link to the LiveScience blurb is in the quote...

"This is the oldest known bee we've ever been able to identify, and it shares some of the features of wasps," said lead author George Poinar, a researcher from Oregon State University. "But overall it's more bee than wasp, and gives us a pretty good idea of when these two types of insects were separating on their evolutionary paths."

100 million years old, in a mine in the Hukawng Valley of Myanmar, trapped in amber.

Very cool.

EDIT TO ADD:  Here's the link to the Science article which also talks about the genome sequencing, as a bonus.

Date: 2006/10/27 02:53:50, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (k.e @ Oct. 26 2006,23:43)

To paraphrase Alexander Pope

'To project is human, to reflect divine'

So that means I'm GOD, right?  :)

(Actually, in a manner of speaking, since god was created in man's image, I guess that statement is true!  Now where did I put those lightning-bolts-for-striking-down-lying-AFDave....)

Seriously, after months of watching AFDave lie, cheat, and steal, and never once even attempting to posit evidence for his actual "hypothesis" (sort of makes this whole thread off-topic, right?), I'm finding this conversation much more interesting than AFDave.  Funny that discussing AFDave is more productive than discussing WITH AFDave.

Quote (k.e @ Oct. 26 2006,23:43)
It's funny you say that but I have come to the same conclusion several times when replying to AFD. And have had to catch myself and re-do some comments.

I'm almost ashamed to admit that reading his blather reminds me of myself back in the mid-eighties.  Though I have to say that I'm pretty sure I never went to quite this extreme to deny reality, I'd be lying if I said I wasn't close.  This whole thread regularly brings up memories that make me quite uncomfortable.  It's a hard thing to be constantly reminded of the most embarrassing moments years of your life.

Nevertheless, I sometimes choose not to go back and remove the things I (moments later) realize are as much painful memories as comments on AFDave.

Quote (k.e @ Oct. 26 2006,23:43)

AFD's programming has made him completely immune to world views outside his cult.

I've noticed this before in religious cults, the programming is actually REINFORCED by pressure from outside agents to change their view. "Thou will be greatly strengthened by challenges to your faith" etc. etc.

Quite.  And that is, after all, the POINT of the programming which takes place.  A believer who looks behind the curtain to see the broken down wizard doesn't cough up their 10% anymore.

Quote (k.e @ Oct. 26 2006,23:43)

In the end IT IS ALL projection, as BWE's quote of Blake  shows. A consequence of mans ability to 'read minds', a necessary mechanism for social animals. Your dog can read your mind..right? I had my daughters pet rabbit (which she abandoned) playing games  and doing tricks I could read its 'mind'. Any horse person will tell you the same. Those animals are all social animals.

So by 'projection' what do I mean, it is NOT the ability to see into another mind, that is actually empathy, the projected image of the other persons mind inside our mind is only the reflection of our own mind that is self generated and is limited by intelligence,values and experience .  AFD will say he is completely unaware of that (the consummate politician/liar), he honestly believes his mind is bigger than his brain (god for him) and is able to control those with weaker minds around him (to perform god's wishes)

AFD's god is his projected 'intelligence' which unfortunately for those around him, makes them stullifyingly stupid.

Indeed.  While not a terribly good device for valid arguments, the "I'm rubber, you're glue" defense seems to be rather efficient in keeping the sheep in the fold.  And the nacissistic projection of god as one's-self-only-bigger can be rather self-satisfying, I guess.

Case in point:

Quote (AFDave @ Oct. 27 2006,06:38)
So what's happening is that YOU are staying up late and the truth apparently is bothering YOU, yet you live in "Opposite Land" so you pretend that I'm the one staying up late being bothered by the truth.

While it may be true that "It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of a living god", it would also be true that "It's a less fearful thing to fall into the hands of a living god that thinks just like me."

Date: 2006/10/27 03:00:04, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Bebbo @ Oct. 27 2006,07:36)

I thought it was a reasonable question that if one of the founder's of the ID movement says the designer is God why is it surprising that others think that too.

I think we're all pretty clear that reason has absolutely no place at UD.

Quote (Bebbo @ Oct. 27 2006,07:36)

The amazing thing is that I didn't get banned for asking.


Date: 2006/10/27 03:37:02, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Today's thought for the day from LiveScience's Today in History page...

“The man who does not learn is dark, like one walking in the night.''

— Chinese proverb.    

Appropriate, I think.

Date: 2006/10/27 04:41:59, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (k.e @ Oct. 27 2006,09:17)
So that means I'm GOD, right? ;)

The Hindu greeting is to clasp together their open hands (as if to pray) point them to the guest, bow and say 'Namaste'

'I greet the god in you' ;)

In one word that sums up the difference between Western and Eastern Religion.

There is a cave somewhere in India (Joeseph Campbell talks about it in one of his talks) where there is a painting of 'god'(a symbolic represenation to be taken subjectively). It has a head with a male face pointing to the right and a female face pointing to the left, one wonders if Picassso was inspired by that. Several of his paintings repeat that theme, "The Dream" by him recently in the news has the male and female face kissing on the one female body, his sleeping mistress in this case.

I grok god.

Date: 2006/10/27 06:18:08, Link
Author: Lou FCD

Quote (Ekstasis @ Oct 27th 2006,06:41)

Another quick note on Atheists. When Barbara Walters did her interview on Heaven and it aired on network tv (more on:

She interviewed Atheists, and even attended and filmed one of their “events”. Oh yes, they had a retreat and picnic, made to look like your standard church retreat. As if to say, we can have that fun and fellowship as well.

The thing that struck me is that, as hard as they worked to gin up a sense of joy and frivolity, it just came across as pathetic. As if they, particularly the kids, were trying so hard to experience joy, but not quite getting there. It was painful to watch, I just felt a sense of sorrow.

Yes, even Babs Wawa knows there is no joy without Jeezus.

Grok some fracking coffee, moron.

Date: 2006/10/27 06:37:52, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Reciprocating Bill @ Oct. 27 2006,06:44)
"CSI" apparently refers to "Christ Scented Indignation,"...

Can you stick that to a Christmas Tree shaped piece of cardboard and hang it from the rearview?

Sell it to the rubes and make a buttload of cash...

Date: 2006/10/27 06:51:41, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (ericmurphy @ Oct. 27 2006,11:33)
Who was it who said that basically this entire thread is off-topic? That was a good one.

<blush>  Thanks.

Page just before this one.

I'd like to thank the acadamy... and my mom...

Seriously, though.  There is no scientific theory of ID, and there is no UCGH.

Far as I can tell (and again, I'm just the Son of a carpenter), AFDave hasn't even attempted to present evidence.  He's just rambled on and on about stuff about which he quite obviously knows nothing, been shown to be ridiculous, waits for the page to turn, then spouts gibberish about some more stuff about which he knows nothing.

Occasionally he copies and pastes some irrelevent bullshit from AiG, and just for fun he occasionally c&ps some actual science (invariably still irrelevent to the UCGH) which says exactly the opposite of what HE just said.  (Aside from The Red Dot Incident, that's the funniest part, IMHO.)

So truthfully, this whole thread and its predecessor are just larger versions of The Bathroom Wall.

Scribble at will.

Date: 2006/10/27 09:36:11, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Science.  There be dragons.

Date: 2006/10/27 10:27:01, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (BWE @ Oct. 27 2006,15:14)
Either he is terrified or he is intentionally learning to mislead people.

Or both.

Date: 2006/10/27 10:34:11, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Richardthughes @ Oct. 27 2006,15:05)
Subject, "Overwhelming Evidence" date of death October 27th, 2006.

It's a shame, so young yet so crap..

Well now I'm just Overwhelmed with grief.


Date: 2006/10/27 11:02:59, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Janie is ALWAYS down with the Big O.

Just so y'know.

Date: 2006/10/27 12:19:27, Link
Author: Lou FCD
J is the first letter in Janie
Janie has 5 fingers on each hand
There is no O in Janie Belle McKnight
There is no God because there is no O
Janie likes the Big O
She's down with that
She goes down 4 that
D is the 4th letter
Janie is JOD.

Date: 2006/10/27 16:46:54, Link
Author: Lou FCD
The girls think you're an awesome and sexy moderator, and they would like to know why you're putting firecrackers in cats' butts.  They're dog lovers, but still a bit upset about that.

I myself am also a dog man, and don't really care what you stick up a cat's butt.

Just so y'know.

Date: 2006/10/28 01:14:41, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Ichthyic @ Oct. 28 2006,02:16)
I do wonder why Stevestory invited "0" back for another spin at the wheel of insanity.

did he forget 0 did the same thing here about a year ago?

I also wonder why you all find folks that have obviously gone completely off the deep end amusing.

Oh, Zero is well off his nut, I agree.

Perhaps Steve Story has partially answered your question with this comment over on the UD thread.

As for the fascination, I'm not sure.  Maybe it has to do with rubbernecking.  You know how drivers break their necks to look at a car accident as they pass by?  Well, maybe we've all been rubbernecking at the disasters of Ghost of Idiocy and FarceDave for so long that we've just become annoyed with them, and need a new wreck at which to gawk.

Zero is a wreck, but at least he's a fresh wreck.

(I've only been poking around here for about a year, so I don't really remember his first go round.)

Date: 2006/10/28 03:27:48, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Reciprocating Bill @ Oct. 28 2006,07:46)
[snip rather funny DaveTard parody]

And if you were really me, you'd be using boldface type, homo.  You're outta here. - dt

Date: 2006/10/28 04:20:45, Link
Author: Lou FCD
A lecture on common sense from a guy who believes in an invisible, all-seeing, all-powerful, genocidal sky-daddy who's trying to trick us all into believing the universe is old, and torturing for all eternity anyone who falls for the gag.

I gotta put my boots on.

Date: 2006/10/28 16:04:17, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Myeh, Lenny's right, ID is dead and we're all just bored while we wait for the next search/replace job.

Date: 2006/10/30 01:06:19, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Nonsense.  If humans came from bricks, why are there still bricks?

Date: 2006/10/30 01:09:35, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (katanoese @ Oct. 30 2006,04:51)
Am I reading this right? Is this as ridiculous as it looks to me?

Yes.  and um... yes.

Date: 2006/10/30 01:56:54, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Louis @ Oct. 30 2006,07:47)
Vidi vici veni

Kate rather likes this one...

Date: 2006/10/30 02:25:49, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Vidi, vici, venis?


Date: 2006/10/30 02:34:55, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Louis @ Oct. 30 2006,08:30)
Perhaps veni vidi membrum virilis?


I just ran that through the crappy latin translator I used above (first one I found on Google, no idea how good it is - I never took Latin) and here's what it just spewed back...

to come vidi thin skin manfully

[EDIT - I was actually going for "I saw, I conquered, she came."]

Date: 2006/10/30 02:39:14, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (oldmanintheskydidntdoit @ Oct. 30 2006,08:34)
Now just go away and read your bible.

...or I shall taunt you a second time....

Date: 2006/10/30 03:55:04, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Thanks.  The coffee is everywhere.

Date: 2006/10/30 14:49:50, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Ichthyic @ Oct. 21 2006,23:10)
spiked cleats.

round ball's in your court.



I used to like you.


Date: 2006/11/02 02:36:29, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (joel the hoohoo boy @ Oct. 31 2006,Satan's Day,4:48 pm,7 hours 12 minutes before the evil hour)
 The church’s silence has not only affected sex before marriage – it has found its way into the bedroom.

Yes, Christians are getting divorced because the church hasn't butted into the bedroom enough yet.  Our pastors have not done enough to tell us how we should and should not have sex.  There should be more intervention in the bedroom from the man behind the pulpit.  In fact, once I'm the preacher, I'll make visits to all your bedrooms and give you a little hands-on instruction.  Truly, by allowing me to demonstrate the proper techniques on your wife's hoohoo, you'll be saving your marriage.

No, really!

Date: 2006/11/02 03:05:18, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (ericmurphy @ Nov. 01 2006,14:15)
Stands of 4,500 year old trees didn't survive the flood as seeds, and they didn't get from Mt. Ararat to the west coast of the U.S. via FedEx.

Dear eric,

You are quite demonstrably wrong.  During this year's Superbowl, it was quite clearly shown via fossilized videotape that FedEx did in fact exist alongside cavemen and dinosaurs, which makes this hypothesis viable.

Video Evidence of Cavemen, Dinosaurs, and FedEx

Date: 2006/11/02 03:09:19, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (bourgeois_rage @ Nov. 02 2006,08:53)
Bring Janie and Kate, Lou. :p

Wouldn't dream of showing up without my lovely assistants deacons.


Date: 2006/11/02 03:38:06, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (improvius @ Nov. 02 2006,09:31)
Ah, but the caveman states quite clearly (assuming the translation is correct) that FedEx doesn't exist yet.  Now, it is certainly possible that there was an error in translation - or that perhaps a later scene proving the existence of FedEx at roughly the same time period had been edited out.  But the current copy of the commercial does not support your YECFedEx hypothesis.

Oh, FedEx did in fact exist at the time.  The use of the word is proof in itself.  That caveman was just a FedEx atheist. (a-FedEx-ist?)  Either that, or the video was shot just pre-flud, and FedEx was created just post-flud from the pidjin-kind.  I bet you didn't know that the pidjins dun had a FedEx allele, didja?

Date: 2006/11/02 10:33:57, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (ericmurphy @ Nov. 02 2006,11:20)
God, Lou. I'll try to say this tactfully…you know how Dave often will post a quote that actually undermines his argument? Uh, well, this video you posted…um…

Yeah.  ####, I shoulda looked at the whole thing again, I had forgotten that "doesn't exist yet" line.

Funny how AFDave-like that is, though.  Exactly an AFDave move, and I stand as humiliated and ashamed as he should, but doesn't.

it was still funny, though.

Date: 2006/11/02 13:45:50, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (jeannot @ Nov. 02 2006,17:45)
I would imagine that our low pilosity is somewhat linked to our clothes, but it doesn't seem to fit with those who don't wear any (maybe their ancestors?).

Maybe being naked just has its advantages... so to speak...


Date: 2006/11/03 02:04:10, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (stevestory @ Nov. 02 2006,22:49)
Hey Denyse, you're new over there, so let me fill you in. You know your friend Davetard, the guy who called you a transsexual lesbian hermaphrodite, or whatever it was? That guy who referred to you as "it"?

Do you mean when he called her "MorphoDyke" like here, or just when he called her a "Canadian Cross-Dresser" like  here?

(In all fairness, though, it was Janie who originally hung that appellation around O'Leary's neck Right here.  Dave is just a bandwagon MorphoDyker.)

Date: 2006/11/03 04:17:07, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Occam's Toothbrush @ Nov. 03 2006,08:33)
Dave is just a bandwagon MorphoDyker

One of my fondest ID/Evolution-related pleasures is imagining the disgust in D'Tard's soul when he reflects on all the times he pleasured himself while fantasizing various arrangements with Janie and Kate Lou FCD.

Speaking for all three of us, we're always happy to spread the pleasure around.


Date: 2006/11/06 08:28:23, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Kristine @ Nov. 06 2006,13:15)
DaveScot came to my blog to say Hi. (Actually, he called me a "potty mouth freak.") :D

That was cute.  I was really impressed when he referred to me as "lesbians trapped in a man's body"...

and meant it as an insult.

Anybody who likes girls is a homo - dt

Date: 2006/11/07 09:49:04, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (k.e @ Nov. 07 2006,08:22)
Besides, some of you out there who share my ideas about origins certainly believe snakes once had legs!

And of course they were able to speak. <snicker> the Queen's English, no less!

Date: 2006/11/07 09:56:18, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (blipey @ Nov. 06 2006,15:27)
Quote (Kristine @ Nov. 06 2006,13:15)
DaveScot came to my blog to say Hi. (Actually, he called me a "potty mouth freak.") :D

I don't feel so special anymore.  I was sure (no, really) that DaveTard only had special feelings for me.

He doesn't say hi to anyone, though he does state clearly that he will not skip out on my visit to Austin.  I'm looking forward to meeting will be a high (low?) light.

DaveTard is just jealous that AFDaveTard is providing us with more pages of entertainment.

DaveTard won't take kindly to playing second fiddle to AFDaveTard, so he's getting desperate for some of that old time attention!

AFDaveTard is a homo so I need to be on top of him - dt

Date: 2006/11/08 12:04:18, Link
Author: Lou FCD
As DaveTard's been spreadin' the love over at Kristine's place, (yapping about competence, believe it or not!;) the girls thought it would be fun to hold an election.

Who Is "The King of Falsified Evidence"?

DaveTard and his Praying Marines photo?

or AFDaveTard and his Red Dot graph?

(We're holding it over at our place since we'd rather not find ourselves back in the doghouse.)

Date: 2006/11/08 14:56:05, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (bourgeois_rage @ Nov. 08 2006,14:04)

Lou, I was just reading through old posts on UDoJ, and I came across this gem where DaveScotDell needs help uploading his avatar.

<snip 'til below>
On another note, it is quite weird to read the stuff we wrote under the assumption that you were a 17 year old female. Too funny.

Yeah, BR, I was just visiting Page 149 of the UD thread here, myself.  Ahhhh... those trips down memory lane.

Some really good stuff there and here.
Quote (bourgeois_rage @ Nov. 08 2006,14:04)

Humorously, he's still using that avatar to this day. In a way he still is carrying around a mark of his idiocy.

Despite it's color, I think we should call it "The Scarlet Headgear".


One of my favorite moments at UD.

Date: 2006/11/08 16:18:55, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (jeannot @ Nov. 05 2006,23:59)
What does JAD's PEH have to say about it?

God dun it.

Then he died.

Date: 2006/11/08 16:36:49, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (steve_h @ Nov. 08 2006,16:32)
Soccer (which we call "cricket" in England) seems to crop up quite often. God must be a fan.

I'd love to see a soccer match played with cricket bats...

Like Hockey, but with more blood.


Date: 2006/11/08 21:25:53, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Occam's Aftershave @ Nov. 08 2006,18:02)
It's called Hurling, and is played mainly in Ireland.

Not to be confused with 'hurling' (small h), another Irish pastime practiced at 2 A.M. outside most pubs.  ;)

I need to see more of that on ESPN!

uh... both varieties, if possible.


Date: 2006/11/09 08:36:53, Link
Author: Lou FCD
This is kinda cool.

The short version in Science

The Abstract from PNAS.

The PDF of the paper (also from PNAS).

The long and the short of it seems to be that the gene microcephalin, which is thought to be involved in regulating brain growth, popped up like a million years ago, but only showed up in modern humans about the same time that Neandertals died out.

From what I can gather, the gene does something to give us a bigger brain (apparently I'm not one of the 70% of the population that got it).

So it ain't proof positive that Homo neanderthalis and our direct ancestors were gettin' freaky, but the motel bed is smokin' and there are only two naked people in the room, "if you know what I mean and I think you do!"

Date: 2006/11/09 11:10:28, Link
Author: Lou FCD
k.e., old chap, I believe you may need Restoration

See me after class in the massage room....

Date: 2006/11/09 12:05:59, Link
Author: Lou FCD

Any time, glad I could help!

Crap, Rich.  

For a minute there, I thought I kinda looked smart.

Date: 2006/11/10 10:57:07, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Just want to add The LiveScience story to DQ's post.


Date: 2006/11/10 11:08:59, Link
Author: Lou FCD
In his PJs

Date: 2006/11/10 11:12:07, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Possibly This Guy

Date: 2006/11/13 12:15:37, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Occam's Toothbrush @ Nov. 13 2006,12:06)
I would imagine trying to reason with retards has limits.

Apparently you're not familiar with the AFDave thread.


That is truly some funny shiite.

I actually popped in to share some Good News on the fundy idiot front Jesus Camp Bites the Dust, (I was gonna stick it in the UDoJ thread) and thought I'd see what was going on in this thread first.

Glad I did.

Thanks for that, OT.

Date: 2006/11/13 16:57:08, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (stevestory @ Nov. 13 2006,15:43)
It's just weird to me, this claim they love making that they're all psychopaths, restrained from raping (snip)... me only by the written commands of a very powerful overseer.

Well, you can hardly blame them, Steve.  You come across as so damned sexy you're hard to resist.

Date: 2006/11/14 08:28:56, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Janie and Kate six and nine it, respectively.


Date: 2006/11/16 07:18:47, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Zachriel @ Nov. 16 2006,06:42)
Quote (Dembski @ sometime in the recent past)
If the evidence for Darwinian theory were so great, why keep slamming ID? Just present it!

Well, he could start with the blurb, Here, or the .pdf of the whole news article Here,  or move right on to the .pdf of the full paper, Here.

(New Science paper on Neandertal genome sequencing, and it's similarity to the modern human genome, and the divergence of the two.)

If I were a biologist mathematician who thought he had a revolutionary new insight into biology, I'd probably do some research to investigate.

Now, granted, I'm just the unedumakaded son of a carpenter, but if I wanted to know about biology, I'd go ask a biologist, or at least go read his freely-available-to-anyone-who-cares-to-read-it research paper.  Seems pretty straightforward.

Just sayin'.

Date: 2006/11/16 08:02:54, Link
Author: Lou FCD

I posted these in the UD thread a little earlier, but here are the related links for the paper in Science...

Here is the quick blurb

Here is a .pdf of the full news article.

Here is the .pdf of the full paper.

Not that AFDave will ever bother, but you might be interested.

On a related note, an election update:

With eleven precincts reporting, AFDave leads DaveScot by a 9-2 margin in the race for King of Falsified Evidence.

Date: 2006/11/16 10:57:40, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (afdave @ Nov. 16 2006,10:46)
ToE advocates discount the historical record of the Bible and call it a myth.  Thus, they have only their wild imaginations as starting points for their Origins Models.

Well, that and biology.  And physics.  And chemistry.  And writings of other civilizations through the flood period.  And genetics.  And geology.  Y'know.  Science.

Quote (afdave @ Nov. 16 2006,10:46)
Creationists have a high regard for this historical record of the Bible and use the various accounts as starting points for their Origins Models.

This explains a lot.

Indeed it does.

Date: 2006/11/16 12:40:00, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Kristine @ Nov. 16 2006,12:17)
May I ask this: am I the only woman posting at AtBC? Just wondering.

Nah, Shirley "No hugs for thugs" Knott pops in from time to time for one.

Date: 2006/11/16 18:51:51, Link
Author: Lou FCD

You should acquaint yourself with the Big Green Marker.

Hours of fun.

Date: 2006/11/16 18:56:42, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Richardthughes @ Nov. 16 2006,15:53)
It's almost like he's been duped recently, like he was flirting with a 'girl' and it turned out to be a ruse. Now he feels guilt / anger at freeing his 'little republican swimmers' to the cooings of Lou FCD.

Are you trying to say he might be a little "gun"-shy?


Date: 2006/11/17 15:36:43, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Richardthughes @ Nov. 09 2006,12:19)
(Not Kate though, she scares me)

####, Rich, she scares ME!

Date: 2006/11/18 07:38:40, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Anyone know if the clip of Bill Buckingham is online?  I'd like to borrow the clip of him saying that he wants an alternative to Darwin, such as creationism, taught.

I can't seem to locate it anywhere.  I've tried YouTube and Google Video, and I've looked for links to it here, at the Thumb, NCSE, ACLU, PA Citizens for Science blog, everywhere I know to look, and I'm out of ideas.

Janie has a little project going.  She's soooooo creative.

Date: 2006/11/18 08:09:52, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Ok, found it.  Nevermind.

Here's the link, in case anyone else is interested....

Thanks to the York Daily Record (I don't know why I didn't just start there in the first place.)

Buckingham Seesaws on the Stand

Date: 2006/11/18 14:11:08, Link
Author: Lou FCD
So is Janie's video.


I'm sure she'd appreciate any feedback....

Date: 2006/11/18 17:05:25, Link
Author: Lou FCD
And here I always assumed a petard was another word for pecker...

I like my version better.

Date: 2006/11/19 07:05:55, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Hi Wes.

Not sure why it didn't come up, but no.  It's been tweaked a little now and it's called "Priceless, the Director's Cut".

Here's the direct link to the YouTube video...

The UDoJ link again...

And the link for Channel UDoJ on YouTube, where all Janie's videos can be found...

One of those is bound to work, unless YouTube is having a problem (which it sometimes does).

Date: 2006/11/19 07:31:59, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I guess this really should have been posted here, so I'm copying it from the Bill Buckingham Video thread...

Janie's Dover Video.

It's been tweaked a little now and it's called "Priceless, the Director's Cut".

Here's the direct link to the YouTube video...

The UDoJ link again...

And the link for Channel UDoJ on YouTube, where all Janie's videos can be found...

One of those is bound to work, unless YouTube is having a problem (which it sometimes does).

She um... borrowed... some of the photos from the Thumb.  Somehow, I think they'll be ok with that.

I hope.

Date: 2006/11/19 08:07:57, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Wow, is the new server up and running now? ... because this place (and PT, too) is F'ing ROCKIN'.

It hasn't even thought about balking this morning.

('Course it's Sunday morning, but still it's quick, slick, and something else that should rhyme with quick, but I can't think of nuthin.)

Anyways, I know y'all probably always hear the bad stuff, I thought you should hear an "Attaboy".

Date: 2006/11/19 14:26:06, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Zachriel @ Nov. 19 2006,07:01)
Any professor with intellectual integrity would , I think, grab the bull by both horns yet many clearly do not understand that one need not multiply it into something caused by a deity. The Ockhamistic informationists (vs, the anti-informationists), can live with the notion that life is brought about by an unidentifiable, supersensible intelligence.

That's right. It's not a deity. It's an unidentifiable, supersensible intelligence.

(Notice that the commenter chose the phrase "unidentifiable" rather than "as yet unidentified", even though he has already assigned this agent characteristics, that of being a "supersensible intelligence".)


I was still working with "Disembodied Telic Entity"!

Who the heck is in charge of getting out the MEMOS????

Date: 2006/11/19 14:29:45, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (VMartin @ Nov. 19 2006,13:37)
I do not see what is this thread is about - I see no arguments only "jokes" missing any meaning.

This thread is about DAJ, so that's rather appropriate, doncha think?

Date: 2006/11/19 14:34:16, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Russell @ Nov. 19 2006,08:13)
I'll start to be concerned when I see the first YEC paper appear in a serious journal.


Jack Chick ain't serious enough for ya? ? ?

YEC will never submit to your pathetic level of peer review.

Date: 2006/11/19 17:46:10, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Wait.  This from Dave?  Hold on.  Lemme think...

Oh yeah, here it is....

Dave on racism at UDoJ

I called the authors of the bible "lice ridden beduins" on Uncommon Descent. It really set Josh off. And it's true. I thought everyone knew that Arabs do their camels. It's not racist. It's a simple fact. But hey, if you don't want disparaging remarks about terrorists that want to kill everyone in the U.S. and/or make us all stick our ass up in the air opposite Mecca to worship Allah then I guess that's your call. Is that what you're saying?

Very next comment...

ou should read this whilst keeping mind that Jordanians are Arabs. I'm not making this up. Arab men are pigs, dear. Misogynous pigs at that. At the least you should know who you're defending and ask if they deserve it. Arab isn't a race, by the way, it's a culture and a part of the world centered on the Middle East, so it's really not possible to be racist against Arabs. That would be like being racist against Canadian morphodykes - non sequitur.


Davey?  Are we being a bit umm....

dishonest?  hypocritical?  or just stupid and inconsistant?

Date: 2006/11/19 18:11:44, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Thanks, Zachriel.  I forgot that the H word was in that link, which of course gets edited out by the AtBC software.


Date: 2006/11/19 19:18:33, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Ahhh yes.  DaveTard.

Paragon of Parity.

Epitome of Equality.

Father of Fairness.

All around nice guy.

Date: 2006/11/19 19:21:30, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (jeannot @ Nov. 19 2006,16:01)
"God 'dun it, then he died."


'Got that, and wrote that down.  :D

It's hard to believe, isn't it?"


Date: 2006/11/20 08:54:36, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Altabin @ Nov. 20 2006,08:37)
Quote (Lou FCD @ Nov. 08 2006,21:56)
One of my favorite moments at UD.

Fercrissake, you flirted with Sal Cordova.  Even just for pretend.  I think I have to lie down for a moment.

Well someone always has to do the dirty work y'know.  Tara sticks her arms up cow butts, I Fxxk with the fundies.  It's a gift.

Quote (Altabin @ Nov. 20 2006,08:37)

But honestly, UncommonDescent gets visited by a bubbly 17-year-old lesbian (um, undecided) young woman who happens to have no sexual preference thankyouverymuch, sprinkling her trenchant criticism of ID with stories about holding hands with her (female) cheerleading coach.  WHY did it take so long for us to figure it out!!??

I fixed that for ya.  Janie gets a little upset if she feels like she's being defined by one aspect of herself.

Quote (Altabin @ Nov. 20 2006,08:37)

By the way, it seems that someone has been trying to janiebelle Pharyngula.  My money's on DT, out for revenge (oops, can he sue me for that?)

He's a poser.  You're probably right.  Looks to me like DaveTard.

You may have coined a new term, though.... I like it.


Date: 2006/11/20 11:06:34, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Hey, not that this is all about me or nuthin... ok, it IS all about me...

Did y'all see that Ed Brayton posted my Janie's video up at Dispatches from the Culture Wars?

I just wanted to brag a little.

You can go back to bashing DaveTard now.


Date: 2006/11/20 11:09:58, Link
Author: Lou FCD
He's afeared o' Kate, though.

but then, so am I.


Date: 2006/11/21 18:23:30, Link
Author: Lou FCD
No, it's even worse than that.

Conversations with DAJ go something like this....

DAJ: blah blah PEH. (quotes self repeatedly)
AnyoneElse: here's evidence that refutes your hypothesis.
DAJ: No one even dares to face my heresies! (quotes self repeatedly)
AE: Um, DAJ, I just DID.  If you think I'm wrong, explain why.
DAJ: EnyoneAlse has banned me like everywhere else!  I'm banned!  Dilliam Wembski sucks.  Elsy Wesberry sucks!  I'm the heretic that will be proven right someday! (quotes self repeatedly.)
AE: DAJ, you're not banned, could you just address my point?
DAJ: I am unrefuted!  Nobody dares print my heresies!  Spravid Dinger is the wart on a donkey's ass!  Your mother probably did him for pity!  (quotes self repeatedly)
AE:  Dr. Davison, you have said something in your PEH for which I've shown contrary evidence.  Could you please stop calling names and address the issue?
DAJ: Why you little mental midgets!  I knew you couldn't refute my PEH!  Elsey Wesberry and Spravid Dinger are probably f@#$ing each other right now!  You should join them, you're a ^&*%%$ and you probably $*(%$#@!, you blah blah blah....(quotes self repeatedly)
AE: Ok, you're gone, #######.
DAJ on ISCID: See?  Enybody Alse banned me for my heresies!  They are just like Spravid Dinger and Esley Wellsberry! They can't refute my PEH, so they ban me so the truth can't be told! (quotes self repeatedly)

Date: 2006/11/21 18:26:56, Link
Author: Lou FCD
With all due respect to the good Rev. Dr....

There's no WAY DAJ could go that long without quoting himself three or four times in one post.

Plus, he hasn't mentioned f'ing or reversed the letters in anyone's name.  He hasn't insulted Wes, DaveScot, or Dembski.  DAJ can't go two sentences without doing that.

And this quote...

He is no way I dare say so arrogant as darwinists and communists to call his facts and very originally thoughts to be "scientifically proved".

Clinches it.  If it were DAJ, he'd be screaming about having PROVED whatever it is he's yammering about.

Date: 2006/11/22 09:02:53, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Own Goal O'Leary Scribbles

O'Leary  // Nov 22nd 2006 at 7:26 am

Esssentially, the Darwinists cannot find enough fundie whackos to discredit the idea of design in nature, so they are compelled to impersonate them.

Is it me, or did Own Goal O'Leary just call anyone trying to sneak ID into science classes a "fundie whacko"?

Date: 2006/11/22 10:35:32, Link
Author: Lou FCD
It's about time that you owned up to the fact that everyone over at UD is really just one of your sock-puppets, Steve.

Nobody could be this funny by accident.

Date: 2006/11/22 22:19:06, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Lou FCD @ Nov. 22 2006,09:02)
Own Goal O'Leary Scribbles

O'Leary  // Nov 22nd 2006 at 7:26 am

Esssentially, the Darwinists cannot find enough fundie whackos to discredit the idea of design in nature, so they are compelled to impersonate them.

Is it me, or did Own Goal O'Leary just call anyone trying to sneak ID into science classes a "fundie whacko"?

A few comments later,

GilDodgen  // Nov 22nd 2006 at 7:18 pm

You have a special way with words Denyse. I love it.

Comment by GilDodgen — November 22, 2006 @ 7:18 pm

Yeah Gil.  Me too.

Date: 2006/11/22 22:26:35, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Yeah, I guess I had on my Sunday Morning Rose Colored Glasses.

I'll be chippin' in.  It's still choking, but not nearly as much as before.  That's somethin'.

Date: 2006/11/22 22:40:41, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (k.e @ Nov. 22 2006,22:24)
Another fine day for Xtian apologetics, next they will be hanging up their bikes, white shirts and bibles then drinking beer and dancing.

OT, but speaking of which, did anyone else catch this video via Pharyngula of the atheist guys in Salt Lake City that dressed up like Mormons, hopped on their bikes, and went door to door evangelizing for atheism?

Apparently, Mormons don't really like it when you do it to THEM.

Too funny.

Date: 2006/11/23 19:48:21, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Well, the English is definitely improving mysteriously in bursts, and we can all agree this person isn't what is presented here...

It IS pretty unlikely that anyone on earth really buys DAJ's bullshiite...

The childish arrogant attitude is certainly surfacing...

neodarwinists mantras can satisfy only worshippers of chance and selection.

Sounds DAJiesque enough...

And yet....

DAJ NEVER actually attempts to defend his PEH.  He just insults, swears, and babbles on about what a martyr he is.

He NEVER actually discusses biology, even remotely.

While I've backed way off my previous certainty that this isn't DAJ, I still don't think so.

Smells more like Paley to me.

Date: 2006/11/24 09:42:48, Link
Author: Lou FCD
When I was very young, 7 or 8 maybe, I was at my grandmother's knee listening to stories she was telling about my grandfather's family.

She told me how my grandfather's father was the youngest of seven children, and that the first three were born in England, the next aboard ship while crossing the Atlantic, and the last three in Fulton, upstate New York.

I was both amazed and surprised by this.  I had never heard this account before, and I said something to the effect that I had always thought we were Americans from way back, that my ancestors had fought in the Revolutionary War.

To which she replied, "They probably did, honey.  But their coats would have been red."

It took me several seconds to get what she was driving at.

A few years ago, I began more serious investigation into my family history, and discovered that my grandfather's mother's family were mostly Quakers, and had been in Pennsylvania since at least the Revolution, and at least some had had their land and possessions taken for refusing to participate in the war.  At least one was dismissed from the local Meeting because he signed the petition of loyalty to the colonies or whatever it was called.

My mother's family traces back on most lines to early Ohio settlements, and then to the Virginia, Pennsylvania, Rhode Island and Massachusetts Colonies, and for some of them I have even found war records for the Revolution, as they fought on the side of the colonists.

All that to say this:

While my first instinct was to taunt good Louis here with something akin to

"Yeah, but we kicked your ass",

the truth of the matter in my case is

"We kicked our own ass".


Date: 2006/11/26 11:13:37, Link
Author: Lou FCD
With apologies for not firing per se in the beginning of this war, I have to be honest and say I'm not sure to which side I belong.

Yep, I think people have the right to believe whatever silly thing they want.

Yep, I think religious ideas are silly and belong in the 13th century.

Nope, science (indeed most of the world outside of my home and UDoJ) "doesn't give a flying fig about my religious opinions".  (That's a Lenny quote, for the one person on earth who may not have recognized it.)

I certainly see the value of the position of Ed Brayton et al. that knocking a religious person over the head with a biology textbook will probably not have the desired effect.

Personally, as long as the superstitious don't bother me or the education of my children or the law of my country, I don't give a flying fig what they believe.

Herein lies the crux of the matter.

They do.  At least a certain very vocal subset of them do.  They absolutely refuse to leave me alone, they absolutely insist on mucking about with my children's science education trying to force their superstitions on my kids, and they absolutely demand that my freedoms and the freedoms of the rest of the country (and the world) be restricted according to their superstitions.

Because they are so very vocal, these folks have come to be seen as the representatives of religion in this discussion, for better or for worse.

And so while I would in theory like to be a part of the Brayton camp, wherein reason and kindness and logic and evidence are used to simply persuade the religious to not enforce their religion on me, as a practical matter I often find myself in the Dawkins/Myers camp, chagrined that I feel forced to be less amicable.

I read an article by Ed, and I agree.  Then I read a counter-argument by PZ, and I agree.  I suppose I am hopelessly agreeable.

I suppose I often feel like a man without a country within the ranks of the godless and rational.

I am, however, very distressed by this endless war amongst our own.  We are the sane, the rational, the logical.  Yet we are human, and we are passionate.  It just seems that this debate would be better served by our former set of attributes rather than our latter set.

Let us not allow the religious extremists to define the terms of our internal discourse any longer.

And yet upon review of this comment, I must again apologize, for this lengthy answer is not an answer at all, it would seem.

Date: 2006/11/27 02:48:17, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Wow, stepped away to watch a movie and then watch the Colts kick the crap out of the Eagles (fell asleep late in the fourth quarter) and all sorts of stuff gets posted here.

Who went and decided it was ok for you guys to voice opinions without my permission?  Bastards.

Ok lemme start at the top....

Quote (Louis @ Nov. 26 2006,12:07)
I hope people understand what I'm driving at there).

I think you and I are on the same page, Louis.  Not surprising as we share such a great name.

Quote (Louis @ Nov. 26 2006,12:07)
P.S. Liked the Lenny quote

I doubt one can ever go seriously wrong quoting the good Rev. Dr.

As for snakes...  snakes are very cool, but ever since the incident wherein one decided in the middle of the night to share my sleeping bag whilst I was on military maneuvers, I confess that I prefer them on the other side of some very thick glass.  You will, I hope, forgive me this small idiosyncrasy.

Quote (Kristine @ Nov. 26 2006,12:08)
They followed me to a certain extent into freedom because they were drawn to my joie de vivre, if I may say so myself, but then wanted me to settle down and sit in church and give up this and that part of my individuality until I ended up looking like every other church lady.

Always good to see your smiling face, Kristine.  Please don't ever become a church lady.  I fear we godless bastards would stand no chance against you.


Quote (Stephen Elliott @ Nov. 26 2006,12:39)
Religion is the root of all evil? Bollocks! Just about everything mankind has come up with has been used for both bad and good.

While religion may not be the Root of all evil, it is certainly the kludge of a great many evil doers.  A disproportionately large amount of them, I dare say.  That being said, let me reiterate my contention that I don't give a flying fig about anyone's religious opinions, so long as they are not being pushed on anyone else.

Again, the heart of this particular fight is that they are being pushed on everyone else.

While I have no problem with saying "Science has nothing to say about your supernatural god fellow," I do see a problem with "Science can accommodate your supernatural god fellow".  That shoe is on the wrong foot.

Quote (Kristine @ Nov. 26 2006,14:31)
My father believed that everyone who didn't accept Jesus Christ as his/her savior didn't go to heaven. My uncle told me that if I believed in evolution I was going to ####.

Kristine, I don't wish to upset you in any way, but tangentially, it seems to me that going around threatening children with everlasting torture and pain if they don't think along the party lines is abusive.  But that is another fight, which has been taken up in this AtBC thread, a while back.

Quote (someotherguy @ Nov. 26 2006,15:05)
I'm glad to know that I'm not the only one that's bothered by this massive cluster fuck of an argument.

Indeed you are not.  Take comfort in that.

Quote (Russel @ Nov. 26 2006,15:36)
Wanna know my opinion?
Of course you do! Who wouldn't?

Yes, of course we do!  Seriously, an interesting proposal, and one which I shall keep in mind henceforth.  Thank you for that.

Quote (the egregiously misnomered skeptic @ anytime he has ever said anything, it's really all the same shit repeated ad nauseum)
blah blah blah

Please do not construe my policy of ignoring your comments in their entirety to in any way be related to the fact that you are religious.  It is not.  It is, however, a direct result of the fact that you are an unentertaining idiot.

Quote (Stephen Elliott @ Nov. 26 2006,15:45)
I am arguing that people should be judged on their actions and not beliefs.

Quite.  It is the actions that matter.  In this case, it is specifically the actions of people who would see their superstitions taught in my children's science class.  I'm also vehemently opposed to being forced to live my life according to those superstitions.  Different fight, same enemy.

guthrie, you begin your comment with
Quote (guthrie the first part @ Nov. 26 2006,15:46)
I cant come up with any particular sensible thing to say about this.

and yet you say

Quote (guthrie the second part @ Nov. 26 2006,15:46)
HHMMmm, so maybe the two sides are really going to get married and live happily ever after?  
I doubt it.  But it seems to me that there is a similar amount of talking past each other going on here.  

which is rather sensible from my seat here by the light of my brand new flat LCD monitor.  (I just had to brag on my wife who bought me a new computer!;)

Further, you mentioned

Quote (guthrie in conclusion @ Nov. 26 2006,15:46)
I think in MY ideal world, I would have teleported into the rooms that the people who are involved in this are in, and slugged them with some "perspective juice" to bring them down from their hobby horses.

I do hope you would include me in such an adventure.

As this comment is getting boringly long and it is now nearly 4AM, I suppose I shall finish (for now)with this...

Quote (The Good Reverend Dr. Lenny Flank @ Nov. 26 2006,16:04)
Quote (Lou FCD @ Nov. 26 2006,11:13)
Personally, as long as the superstitious don't bother me or the education of my children or the law of my country, I don't give a flying fig what they believe.

Herein lies the crux of the matter.

They do.  At least a certain very vocal subset of them do.
THAT is the crux of the matter.

It is indeed a very small subset.  And indeed, most of the theists in the US are helping us *fight against that small subset*.

Do we welcome their help, or do we refuse to associate with people whose religious opinions we don't like.

I welcome their help and am happy to fight alongside them against our mutual enemy.

Others simply can't tolerate having a theist of any sort anywhere within smelling distance.

And that is what the whole "fight" is about.

While I admit to a certain immodest penchant for "hearing" my own "voice", it is a special occasion to be quoted by the esteemed good Dr. and I freely admit a large cranial swelling occurs in such rare instances.

But if I may, please allow me a small addendum to your comment.  There are, in fact, some of us who are simply rubbed the wrong way when we feel like we have been shoved behind the curtain to make room at the public lectern for a theistic ally.  It does seem sometimes that the stage becomes inexplicably small at their arrival.

My utter lack of scientific qualifications notwithstanding, is there truly no room for me upon the stage?

More plainly, I believe that at least some of this internal dispute might be resolved if the likes of Drs. Dawkins and Myers weren't made to feel that they were unceremoniously dismissed to allow for the dog and pony show of the likes of Dr. Miller.

I cast no dispersion on the qualifications of Dr. Miller, and certainly not based on his theism.  I certainly welcome his help, his voice, which carries much more weight than my own.  Indeed that is the point.  But in our efforts to reason with the reasonable theists and say "Hey lookee here, you can be a scientist AND a theist", it does seem that Drs. Dawkins and Myers sometimes get treated as our "dirty little secret".  Perhaps this is the source of at least some of their rancor.

So yes, Lenny.  Of course I personally welcome Ken Miller's help.  I just don't want Richard Dawkins to be shoved away in the process.

Date: 2006/11/27 03:13:32, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Richardthughes @ Nov. 27 2006,01:22)
Didn't you D*mbski a 'fundy' and Denyse 'Morphodyke', Dave?

Ahhh Sir Richard, your memory serves you well.

Though I don't recall the specifics of the first part, as to the second part of your querie...

Dave picks up Janie's pet name for O'Leary  (Originally coined here)

Quote (DaveScot @ July 29 2006, 6:29AM)
On 7/29/2006 06:29:44 AM, DaveScot waxed damned near poetic whilst opining...


   A lot more has been made of what transpired on UD than what really transpired on UD. I was tired of moderating and sick of the evo/id controversy. It just goes on and on, the same things are said over and over, and people rarely change their position on it. So, me not being a quitter and Bill not being a firer, I gave him a public ultimatum that challenged his authority on his own blog with the choice of let me have my way or find someone else for the job. I suspect we both got what we wanted (I know I did). The only surprise was Morphodyke. I'd thought one of the existing editors would take over for me.

   I bet Bill was a bit taken back when Morphodyke brought Davison back in the fold. Bill thinks Davison is a nut. Those are his exact words - a nut. He humored me with Davison, not saying a word about it until I figured it out for myself, and now he's in the position of having to humor O'Leary while she goes through the same exercise.

Humorously, it's been repeated even at Uncyclopedia...

William Dembski


- One of Dembski's favorite blog lapdogs is a discharged combat marine named DaveScot. DaveScot is a self-confirmed multimillionaire megagenius with a self-documented IQ well beyond 150, which was confirmed via SAT scores in 1974. His high IQ is also doubtless the reason why DaveScot is kept busy by legions of women who regularly beg him to sire their children. DaveScot is the "Darth Maul" to Dembski's "Emperor Palpatine". He will regularly terminate the privileges of the subhuman blogtards that fester on Dembski's blog, thus providing the blog site with a purely intellectual and untainted venue for discussing the revolution that is intelligent design. Denyse O'Leary, aka Morphodyke, has been designated Dembski's right-hand androgynous blog partner. She and DaveScot have not played nicely in the past due to DaveScot's jealousy of her rapid ascent to replace DaveScot as Dembski's favorite. Since no one has ever seen a verified picture of DaveScot, some conspiracy theorists have speculated, based on the discharged-Marine look sported by O'Leary, that they are one and the same person.

The emphasis is of course, mine in all instances above.

Date: 2006/11/27 08:12:11, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Alas and alack, I'm afraid I can be a bit fuzzy of thought at 4AM, not to mention cantankerous, especially when I'm in rather a lot of pain (which is usually the case if I'm up at 4AM).

Sorry 'bout that Stephen, I believe I was drifting back and forth between the fight I feel needs to be continued and the one I would like to see ended.

A few things from ericmurphy I'd like to take a moment to address:

Quote (ericmurphy @ Nov. 26 2006,20:21)
Now, I don't particularly mind if someone thinks I'm wrong about something. It wouldn't be the first time I was wrong about something. But this need to correct my worldview is where I run into problems with religious people. I frankly couldn't care less (my arguments with AF Dave notwithstanding) if a religious person thinks God created the universe 6,000 years ago, a global flood wiped out almost all living creatures 4,500 years ago, and that God personally cares whether I masturbate or not. That's fine; they're certainly entitled to whatever goofy beliefs they want to have.

But when they try to enforce that belief system on me (and by extension, the rest of whatever society they happen to live in), that's where the sparks fly. The only reason Intelligent Design was ever a problem was because it was an attempt to circumvent the courts and get the fundamentalist Christian worldview forced down the throats of unwitting schoolchildren.


Quote (ericmurphy @ Nov. 26 2006,20:54)
Really? I think the Sex Pistols are better than the Clash.  Does that somehow imply that everyone who thinks t'other way around must be forcibly re-educated to my point of view?


Quote (mcc @ Nov. 27 2006,04:20)
So... I might be about to ramble a bit here, please bear with me if so:

Ramble on, brother.  I do.

Quote (Altabin @ Nov. 27 2006,06:36)
I'm coming to this late, and find myself agreeing with many of the positions expressed here - at least the moderate ones, and particularly LouFCD's first post.

Man, I love it when people agree with me.  That means they're right.


After reading the rest of your comment, I'm reminded of the great beauty of Westminster Abbey, and I am inclined to concur.  Surely the world would be a lesser place for the lack of such architecture.  And I'm also reminded of the Natural History Museum in London.  The world would be a lesser place for the lack of that architecture.

And then I'm reminded of the Tate Modern, set up in an abandoned electrical power plant.  Not so much.  Although I was there before the slide exhibit opened, so perhaps that would have improved my review of the architecture.


Date: 2006/11/27 16:43:01, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Arden Chatfield @ Nov. 27 2006,15:52)
Hey, be nice to Gil. He appears to have designed this program, which certainly marks him as Steven Pinker's intellectual superior.  :p

Yeah, plus I have a special place in Gil's heart, so quit pickin' on him!

Date: 2006/11/27 16:52:34, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (keiths @ Nov. 27 2006,15:49)
I just popped over to Josh's website to see what he's been up to, and found this great "they all look the same to me" comment:
The first fime was REINCARNATION- a muddled Japanese horror film that wasn’t horrorific in any way. It was a mind-numbing mixture of nonsense and the same tired “scare” over and over again. Frankly, as an American of European descent, I couldn’t for the life of me tell the girls apart. The girl would start talking, and I’d ask myself- wait, is this the main character or someone else? Let’s be honest- it’s just hard to tell between the girls. They all have the stereotypical Japanese look- very thin, long straight black hair, seemingly unable to take care of themselves without the help of a male figure who holds their hand everywhere they go (figuratively, that is.)

Holy Crap.  Looks like he forgot to point out her "slanty eyes".

I'm guessing it was part of the original comment about her "stereotypical Japanese look", but it then got changed in edit to the whole "unable to take care of themselves" thing.  He just forgot to amend the "look" part of it.

But I'm just guessing.

Date: 2006/11/27 18:02:23, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Thoughtful and insightful post, Bill.  I for one, appreciated it.

Quote (Reciprocating Bill @ Nov. 27 2006,17:45)
From where I sit, the most crucial driver behind questions of religious belief pertain not to origins, but rather to the severe human dilemma presented by the inevitability of one’s personal death.  Although I happen to believe that oblivion will follow my own death, and indeed all deaths, I would be lying if I denied sometimes bolting upright in the middle of the night with the full realization of that reality, accompanied by a very cold fear.  Although this quickly passes, and indeed I cannot reproduce this feeling at will (psychological denial and intellectualization quickly reassert themselves, I suppose), it seems clear that this is really the central human dilemma.

The truth laid bare.  Perhaps you and I might start a support group.

Personally, I find some comfort (and indeed awe) in the thought that when I kick the bucket, whatever energy that was once used to fire the neurons in my brain will be assimilated back into the universe from whence it came.  My stinking, rotting corpse will become the fertilizer which feeds the grass, which feeds the animals which will shit on my grave.

It's the circle of life, baby.

(Ok, on those nights where I'm in the described predicament, I construct these thoughts with a fair amount less snark, and there are flowers and small children playing in the park, but you get the idea.)

Date: 2006/11/29 09:05:01, Link
Author: Lou FCD
It's pretty freakin' funny that Denyse Come O'Lately made the list, but Davey didn't.

Date: 2006/11/29 10:49:36, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (steve_h @ Nov. 28 2006,21:14)
Wasn't that Phillip E. Johnson using the battleship Titanic metaphor, Lou(*)? (How to sink a battleship)

* or whoever.

Um... Steve.  Are you quietly asking if Kristine is one of my sockpuppets?

That's too funny, and you're paranoid.  My two girls don't post here, although they're big fans.

Janie once wondered why that is, btw.  After all, SHE didn't break any rules, I did.

Kinda hard to argue with her point...

Anyways, Kristine is quite real.  Well, at least as real as anyone else on the web.  I've certainly never had cause to doubt that she is who she says she is.  Her very lovely blog, Amused Muse, can be found here.

My girls send their love, though.

Date: 2006/11/29 20:14:27, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Well, you got me thinking, so I did some digging and googling, and if Kristine is not who she says she is, she's done a #### of a lot bigger and more convincing job than I EVER did with Janie.  She's got several blogs, her own top level domain name, shows up pretty solidly in several community activity type sites around her home town, etc. and each one links to another piece of her online persona, and eventually you wind up at Amused Muse....

She's also a regular commenter at PZ's place, and has been for quite a while (like over a year).

I'm willing to bet the farm that Ms. Kristine is exactly who she says she is.

All her pertinent information can be found if you look for it, rather easily enough.  I hesitate to collect it all here in one place for privacy reasons, and out of respect for someone who has come to be a good friend of the girls.

Just so y'know.

Date: 2006/11/29 20:33:10, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Oh, and PZ's met her in the flesh.

That pretty well settles that.

Date: 2006/11/30 09:31:39, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Kristine, don't let Skeptic bother you.  He's proven himself to be an idiot on several other threads.

Your "Sockpuppets All The Way Down" hypothesis certainly deserves consideration, though.  Write a grant proposal.


Date: 2006/11/30 09:44:13, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Ask Ms. Dewey about herself, it's rather funny.

(Ok, you know I HAD to ask...)

Ask her to remove her clothes...

I'm pissing myself laughing.

Date: 2006/11/30 09:51:18, Link
Author: Lou FCD
HAH!  I just asked her what she knew about "intelligent design", to which she replied

"You seem downright flummoxed".  Too funny.

Then I asked about the missionary position...

"I tried that with three friends once.... Let's just say my memoirs will fetch a million..."

She's more fun than a barrel of Intelligently Designed monkeys.

Date: 2006/11/30 10:00:32, Link
Author: Lou FCD
OK, just one more.

I asked, "What is the orbital distance of Saturn?"

Ms. Dewey replied, "In business, my philosophy is simple - Leave a little something on the table.  Of course, if he's cute enough, I'm the little something."

I'm not sure what that has to do with Saturn, but it was funny.


Date: 2006/11/30 11:31:56, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Kristine @ Nov. 30 2006,11:20)
Lou, did you see what your Ms. Dewey said about me?

Oh, you should have heard what she said when I asked her where she was coded...

"I think somebody needs to get a hobby.  Like... something interesting..."

and when I asked again...

"Ladies and gentlemen, in this corner weighing 157 pounds, the world's loneliest man!"

and again...

"Ones and zeros, ones and zeros... All the useless coding, underwear on your head, and you still couldn't create the woman of your dreams.  Poor you."

I like her.

Date: 2006/11/30 11:44:21, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I have to go now.  I just made a rather graphic offer to Ms. Dewey, to which she replied,

"Hey.  If you can get inside your computer, you can do whatever you want to me."

See ya'.

Date: 2006/11/30 16:10:55, Link
Author: Lou FCD
No apology necessary to me, steve.  I suppose I've gotten everyone jumping at shadows, so it's really my fault.

If anyone owes an apology here, it's me, and I humbly offer it.

Kristine, I'll speak to Ms. Dewey and see if I can sort out the problem.  Perhaps if you offered to teach her to belly dance, the two of you could bond.

Date: 2006/11/30 16:25:38, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Maybe you're just too good to be true?

Date: 2006/11/30 18:04:01, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Well I for one will miss you Lenny.

The girls will also miss you, of course.  After all, it was your "dick waving" comments and my response that got the two of us sent to the bathroom wall, which in turn sparked the conversation between Arden and myself, which in turn gave birth to the idea in my head which grew to be JanieBelle and Kate.

In a way, you're kind of their grand dad.

One quick question, if you're still around to answer.
Janie would like to know what color thong a buddhist atheist evolutionist church burnin' ebola boy wears.

Feel free to drop by UDoJ if you'd rather answer there.

Date: 2006/12/01 07:34:02, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote ("Rev Dr" Lenny Flank @ Nov. 30 2006,18:19)

I'm not planning on leaving ATBC.

Well, I'm glad of that.  Some things just really benefit from your touch.

Quote ("Rev Dr" Lenny Flank @ Nov. 30 2006,18:19)

We, uh, don't wear undies.    :)

The girls do that sometimes. They refer to that as "going all breezy under our dresses".

I'm sure they'll think of you when they do that from now on.


Date: 2006/12/01 10:04:14, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Arden Chatfield @ Dec. 01 2006,09:19)
I thought the phrase was 'going commando'!

Well that's what I've always called it, but I got overruled (as usual).

Date: 2006/12/01 12:52:09, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (stevestory @ Dec. 01 2006,10:51)
Quote (phonon @ Dec. 01 2006,11:15)
Quote (Own Goal O'Leary @ whenever)
I would love to help write the screenplay for a film about the ID community.

"An epic retelling of creationism's most tragic blunder,the movie meticulously depicts the ambitious plan which resulted in more Discovery Institute casualties than the entire Edwards vs Aguillard trial. Painstakingly recreated on actual courtroom and shortbus locations and boasting a remarkable all-star cast, the film accurately recaptures the monumental scope, excitement and danger behind one of the biggest political gambles in history. You'll never forget the look on the Discovery Institute faces when Bill Buckingham swallows a bunch of pills and heads for the microphones...the moment they realized they had gone...


It's already been done as a short, but if she wants to do a full-length feature, I certainly hope she doesn't forget to at least include this clip of ol' Bill.

Oh, and I expect a credit in the end titles....

Date: 2006/12/01 13:11:47, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Reciprocating Bill @ Dec. 01 2006,12:36)
I'm sorta speechless.  This must be the ID movement's soundtrack.

It simply drips with dumb.


Enya and Prodigy?

Date: 2006/12/01 14:07:01, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Richardthughes @ Dec. 01 2006,13:44)
Quote (Lou FCD @ Dec. 01 2006,13:11)


Enya and Prodigy?


Ah, 'smack my bitch up', happy memories*

*happy evilutionists moral-relativism Darwinistic orthodoxoy memories.

Alas, Rich.

Turns out I never did get your link to work.

Truth is, I read the link target.

Quote (stevestory @ Dec. 01 2006,13:45)
Atom the Immortal has a myspace page, btw.

So does my daughter, KaylaFace, and by extension so do I (to keep an eye on things of course).

But JanieBelle doesn't.....


Date: 2006/12/02 06:48:31, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Jason Spaceman @ Dec. 02 2006,03:43)
Evolutionary scientists are increasingly arguing against ID in reputable journals such as Science and Nature, biological philosopher Paul Nelson of the Discovery Institute said Friday.

Read it here.

"Yeah, there's more people than ever showing us to be idiots and con-men, so we MUST be almost legitimate."

Date: 2006/12/02 06:51:47, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Altabin @ Dec. 02 2006,02:35)

You just destroyed some of my happiest memories of adolescent masturbation.

Thanks, man.  That's just wrong.

Agreed.  That's like heresy or something, I'm sure of it.

Date: 2006/12/02 10:37:19, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote ("Rev Dr" Lenny Flank @ Dec. 02 2006,08:35)
The only alternative is for the US to give up its global domination, to be Cincinnatus instead of Caesar, and to transform the entire global political system into a democratic one where **no** nation dictates or dominates the others, and where international economics and relationships are set democratically by *all nations* with their consent, and are not unilaterally imposed by this or that dominant military power acting in its own self-interests.

A pipe-dream, Lenny.  But a worthy one.

Date: 2006/12/02 13:20:50, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Not to mention this...

Davison vs. Godzilla google fight

Davison vs. Godzilla blog fight

Date: 2006/12/02 13:55:26, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Has anyone done John A. Davison vs. DaveScot before?

That's gotta sting.

Date: 2006/12/02 16:49:22, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Ichthyic @ Dec. 02 2006,14:40)
Quote (Jason Spaceman @ Dec. 02 2006,03:43)
By Laura Hancock
Deseret Morning News
OREM — "Intelligent design is a hoax, give us your money," shill Paul Nelson of the Discovery Institute said Friday.

Read it here.

there, i corrected some errors in the copy and made it more accurate.

I abbreviated.

Date: 2006/12/02 16:59:15, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quite right, Zach.  I stand corrected.

Date: 2006/12/03 05:48:48, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Zachriel @ Dec. 02 2006,19:18)
Quote (Lou FCD @ Dec. 02 2006,16:59)
Quite right, Zach.  I stand corrected.

You're not doing that right. Next time try one of these chestnuts instead.

 DaveScot: And I’ve grown weary of your silly replies. Adios.

 DaveScot: Get lost. And stop taking up space in the spam bucket.

 DaveScot: Get lost Zachriel. I gave you a second chance to mend your ways but you’re still running about on the net posting trash talk about our site here.

Your mama says I was doing it right last night, homo. - dt

How's that?

Date: 2006/12/03 10:08:10, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Arden Chatfield @ Dec. 02 2006,13:59)
Quote (Lou FCD @ Dec. 02 2006,13:55)
Has anyone done John A. Davison vs. DaveScot before?

That's gotta sting.

Is this good news or bad news, Lou? :p

Well, I suppose that depends on which one of us you ask....


Taking Zachriel's advice,

This would be more accurate but still fails to answer your question.

Date: 2006/12/03 11:16:44, Link
Author: Lou FCD
This would be a little more fair, Falan

Date: 2006/12/04 07:15:17, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Richardthughes @ Dec. 03 2006,13:47)
Or maybe he's advoacting..

Rich, you might be in trouble with Kate....

Date: 2006/12/04 07:18:46, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Kristine @ Dec. 03 2006,23:08)
...I love it so! [But what "it" is, I'm not quite sure.]

His peepee, of course.

Date: 2006/12/04 18:54:02, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Church Burnin' Ebola Boy.  No g, get it right.

Date: 2006/12/05 20:18:31, Link
Author: Lou FCD
You guys are all just bandwagon Martin=GOPs.

I was there when the idea wasn't popular.



Date: 2006/12/05 20:34:19, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Thanks Steve.  Well written and well worth the read.

Date: 2006/12/06 13:05:56, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Kristine @ Dec. 06 2006,10:37)
Gaaa. In other words, no matter what Kristine would study there (just hypothetically, people) she would in all likelihood be tutored at no extra charge in The Female Hate Stare 101.

Yep, Kristine.  Women go to colleges like that to get their Mrs.* Degree (as we used to say when I attended Blow Job Bob Jones U.)

They weren't really encouraged to learn much, and most of the ones I knew never bothered to continue once they hooked their man.

They were well versed in setting the table, however.

Out of the four women I actually "dated" (that consists of supervised visitation in the student center and writing love notes through the campus mail) whilst there, none graduated, and none continued more than a semester past their engagement.  (One of those engagements was to me, though it ended badly a few months later.)

*Oh, that's pronounced "Em Ar Ess" just FYI.

Date: 2006/12/06 16:08:17, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Hey kids.  Sorry, I was watching the NASA TV update on the water on Mars thing....

Yep.  I was a student at Blow Job U....

for exactly one semester, wherein I apparently asked too many questions and refused to accept the answers I got, and just shut up about it.

I was given a personal, face to face invitation to exit the campus at the end of the semester by Dr. Bob III.

It was the beginning of the end of my fundyism.

Soon after, I got laid.

'nuff said.

Date: 2006/12/06 23:52:01, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (skeptic @ Dec. 06 2006,23:26)
I didn't really give them a second thought

No doubt.

Date: 2006/12/07 08:36:42, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Louis @ Dec. 07 2006,04:50)

You got booted from BJU after one semester for thinking? Shortly after which you engaged in the game of horizontal table tennis?


Oh dear, I think I've just pissed a kidney laughing! That HAS to be the funniest thing I've read since what Kristine said a post or two ago. You guys cracketh me up.


True story.  Sucky part of that for them is that I was one of the faithful.  I really just wanted to reconcile what the Bible was teaching, I wasn't in any way questioning my faith... until I got the run-around.

I was a damned good preacher-boy, too.

It all started with a conversation about the classic "where do babies go when they die?"

I couldn't reconcile "God is Love" with "No man cometh unto the Father but by me".  The short answer is they go to ####.  There is no "Age of Accountability" in the Bible.  That's a feel-good church doctrine to appease the masses.

It was only the first of a list of questions.

It was also the beginning of several years of internal turmoil (not to mention the beginning of the end of my BJU career), for which I am now grateful, but wish never to repeat.

Date: 2006/12/07 12:48:48, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (k.e @ Dec. 07 2006,11:33)
LouFCD ( he's not the messiah, he's just a very naughty boy)

and two VERY naughty girls...


Date: 2006/12/07 16:54:51, Link
Author: Lou FCD
ScaryFacts, I (or more probably the girls) will be sure to make it 'round your place.  They keep me hoppin', though.  I'm interested in your experiences.

Quote (Kristine @ Dec. 07 2006,14:34)
Bad hair day?

No, not at all. Why?  :p

I think maybe some church lady might be giving my comment the hate stare.

"Let her comment, Denyse, let her comment, we'll just ignore her. Shhhh. Then when she leaves the table to go to the ladies' room, everyone leave! And stick her with the bill (not that Bill). Wah-ha-ha-ha!"

I'll just put it on my NASA charge. Billions of $$ worth of baby back ribs. ~smack!~

Kristine, I don't know what it was about that, but it absolutely tickled my funny bone.  Thank you for that.

Quote (keiths @ Dec. 07 2006,15:41)
Ah, the fundies stole his adolescence, so now he's reliving it through JanieBelle and Kate.

Hmmm... You may be on to something.  I got sucked in about the middle of 10th grade or so, just when the pimples started easing up enough to make girls an option.

Quote (keiths @ Dec. 07 2006,15:41)
I visited BJU in the 80's.  Highlights of the trip:  
1) The "dating lounge", where prim couples held hands on sofas under the watchful eyes of chaperones, and
2) The chain-link fence surrounding the campus, topped with strands of barbed wire.  You'd have expected the barbed wire to be canted outward to repel intruders, but no, it was canted inward, as if BJU were a prison (which I suppose it was, for people like Lou).

Coincidentally enough, that's when I was there.  Fall '85.

Ahh.. the memories.  Beautiful fountain out front, I think they called it the "Bridge of Nations" as I recall.

The dating lounge - you weren't technically allowed to hold a girl's hand ANYWHERE on campus, but with the right monitors on duty there, you might get lucky and get away with it.  We weren't allowed to mingle with girls after dinner, except in specified places (the dating lounge may have been one of them - forgive me, it's been a while).

Dinner was a formal affair, and you weren't allowed to miss that.  Afterwards, you were allowed to walk a girl back to her dorm (just to the intersection in the sidewalk out front), but you couldn't hold her hand, kiss her, or stop moving.  Everyone learned to walk very, very, very slowly, to extend the amount of time you could spend with your sweetie.  That was nicknamed "The Snail Trail", and was supervised all along the way.

Freshmen weren't allowed to leave campus, except for church or for outreach extensions supervised by upper-classmen.  An off-campus date was unthinkable.

The story with the fence was that it was to keep out the criminal element, but I don't think that fooled very many of us.  We knew what it was for.

Well, keeping us in and keeping out the Furman students who would dress up like BoJos (that's what we were called) and try to sneak on campus to raid our weemens.  (You always knew a BoJo by his haircut, slacks (usually navy or tan, but never jeans outside the dorm), white dress shirt, and red or yellow tie.)  Bastards.  They probably thought that was funny.


But for all that, at least two girls I knew (and their paramours) got booted in the semester I was there because they were caught in the bushes around the side of the big Vespers hall.  Another girl I knew of but didn't really know personally wound up pregnant and left in shame.  She never did divulge the name of her beau, as far as I know.  Immaculate conception, maybe.

Date: 2006/12/07 18:10:10, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (lkeithlu @ Dec. 07 2006,17:27)
This was a college????
I cannot imagine treating minors in this manner, much less

Not only that, but I volunteered to go there.  What the #### was I thinking?

Now, ya wanna know something REALLY F'd up?

The members of my church were sadly disappointed that I would go to such a liberal college as BJ.

That's not a typo.

Date: 2006/12/07 18:25:46, Link
Author: Lou FCD
um... I seemed to have hijacked the thread.

Please return to your normal heckling of UD at this time.

Further discussion should probably be taken up elsewhere, should anyone remain interested.

Probably off-topic for this forum, so we can take it to Crowded Head, Cozy Bed if anyone wants.

Date: 2006/12/07 20:03:03, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Arden Chatfield @ Dec. 07 2006,18:22)
Quote (Lou FCD @ Dec. 07 2006,18:10)
The members of my church were sadly disappointed that I would go to such a liberal college as BJ.

I'm scared to even ask, but what colleges did they view as 'not liberal'?

One last comment, just to answer Arden's question...

Fairhaven was the highest, bestest, most goodest college.

That link is to the church, the college is on the same site.

Pretty campus, though, as I recall.

Date: 2006/12/07 20:41:22, Link
Author: Lou FCD
STS 116 launch was just scrubbed for the day, if anyone's interested.

NASA TV is the page with the feed links.

Date: 2006/12/13 16:12:18, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Don't hate me, but I have to give Larry Farflungdung a tip o' the hat for this...

York Dispatch article on the "plagiarism" bunk.

The article tries to be fair, but you can't help but wonder how long it took to write this article in between fits of laughter.

The money quote...

An ACLU official calls the Institute's report a stunt.

"They're getting no traction in the scientific world so they're trying to do something ... as a PR stunt to get attention," said Witold Walczak, legal director for the ACLU of Pennsylvania and the ACLU's lead attorney on the case.

"That's not how scientists work," he said. "Discovery Institute is trying to litigate a year-old case in the media."

Walczak said the Discovery Institute staff is not, as it claims, interested in finding scientific truths; it is more interested in a "cultural war," pushing for intelligent design and publicly criticizing a judge.

"Why don't these guys go back to their 'labs,' and do something meaningful?" Walczak asked. "Oh, wait. They don't have labs. Silly me."

(UD's been pretty boring for a while, so forgive me if someone's already pointed this out.  I hadn't noticed.  Janie's been flitting about the blogoverse seeking whom she may devour.)

Date: 2006/12/13 17:13:51, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Steverino @ Dec. 13 2006,17:01)
just and emotional desire.

you fergot Jesus.

Date: 2006/12/13 17:26:40, Link
Author: Lou FCD

No matter how many times you tell them, they just can't keep their freakin' mouths shut about the religion.

I'm guessing all the "scientists" there sit around all day playing video games.

Unreal Tournament (the classic, of course) -

The player is Jesus and all the bots are custom Dawkins bots.

"Take that you dirty atheist! Pwnage!"

Date: 2006/12/13 18:12:39, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Great AV, Louis.

Date: 2006/12/14 19:53:45, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Well, it's done if anyone's interested.

U Dream Of Janie has moved to WordPress.

It was a huge pain in the butt to get all the posts and comments imported over, but Janie just finished.  Now she has to do a bunch of clean-up and reformatting and such.

Hated to do it, but Blogger was down all the time, and was slowly but surely forcing all its residents to move to the new and much suckier Blogger Beta.

You can now find us at

Drop by and say hello.

Date: 2006/12/18 13:12:16, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Big news for Janie.

She got cited by Dr. Phil Plait aka The BadAstronomer on his blog last night.

She also got an email from Jeff Medkeff, who's a former editor at Sky & Telescope magazine, asking if he could quote from her post, The NSTA Is Feeding Us A Line for his podcast science program, Blue Collar Science

Of course, I emailed him back to explain Janie's "situation" so that he didn't get blindsided.

I haven't heard back yet, so I'm not sure how he'll react.

Or perhaps the silence is indicative of that reaction.

Just so y'know.

Date: 2006/12/21 06:38:14, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (deadman_932 @ Dec. 21 2006,05:58)
"Knowing their thoughts" need not mean mind-reading ( or heart-reading ) . They could have been doing a great many things that conveyed their shock or horror or incredulity or disbelief.

I gave him the finger.  Is that unpardonable?

Just wonderin'.

Date: 2006/12/21 07:13:50, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I agree, Stephen.  JAD can't even cut and paste, even though the concept has been explained to him in little bitty words.

Ditto making a second thread on a blogspot blog.

JAD doesn't read for comprehension, it doesn't surprise me that he may have read OA's comment and responded to it like he did.

juju may have just the fella.

I can definitely see the bored UberTard doing VMartin for kicks.  From his perspective, he'd be f'ing with us and with JAD at the same time.

Two birds, one stoner.

Dave once pointed Janie to an anonymizer by email.  It uses a limited number of IP addresses and locations, which I would be happy to provide for comparison to VMartin's IP address if anyone's bored enough to care.  Dave may be rich and have a bazillion IQ as measured by SAT scores and SciAm subscriptions, but he's also lazy.  He still uses the same one to visit UDoJ.

I'm not ruling out Paley, though, either.

Just so y'know.

Date: 2006/12/21 07:18:32, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Faid @ Dec. 21 2006,07:11)
So! O'Leary- WTF is she talking about? Anybody have a clue?

She obviously doesn't.  And if she doesn't, how the #### would anyone else?

Date: 2006/12/21 08:53:12, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Yeah, but Davey only uses one on a regular basis.

Like I said, he may be a super duper whiz bang genius according to his SAT scores, but he's as lazy as the rest of us.

For the record, Janie didn't use it on the few (three, I think) occasions when she posted here.

She just drove over to KaylaFace's friend's house (the same friend whose legs feature in those pics addressed to you!;) and posted from there.

Date: 2006/12/21 09:05:32, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (MidnightVoice @ Dec. 21 2006,08:54)
On another board I met a teenager who said that his last science education was in 10th grade, and he knew enough science to know that evolution was wrong and creationism right.  Made me wonder why I bothered to get all those pointless degrees in biology :D

Wow, I was thinking about going back to college (would be my third attempt at it) for a degree in physics.

Guess I won't bother now.


Date: 2006/12/21 09:12:06, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote ("Rev Dr" Lenny Flank @ Dec. 21 2006,07:40)
Does anyone else find it odd that the professional whiners over at the DI's Ministry of Propaganda haven't said a word about their latest loser in Cobb County?


[EDIT: #### preview button is on the wrong #### side!  I HATE that.]

They need a few weeks to figure out how to spin it.

Date: 2006/12/21 11:19:18, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Arden Chatfield @ Dec. 21 2006,09:34)
I'm bored enough. :p


Dallas, TX

That's one.  It's being a little schitzy today.

Off the top of my head, there's one from Bankok and one from London Ontario Canada.

I'll try again later.

[EDIT: ooo.. new version... didn't see that at first...I'll have to check this out later.]

Date: 2006/12/21 21:39:53, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Arden Chatfield @ Dec. 21 2006,12:51)
Quote (Zachriel @ Dec. 21 2006,11:52)
DaveScot blogs on Parthenogenesis in Komodo Dragons.

Atom wonders,      
I was wondering if anyone had noticed that story…

I wonder... Those darn scientists always hiding their discoveries in plain view.

So let's recap the TardLogic.

The virgin birth could be considered an example of parthenogenesis in a 'higher animal'.

Parthenogenesis occurs in Komodo dragons.

Komodo dragons are a 'higher animal'.

Therefore this proves the Virgin Birth was totally possible.

Therefore Darwinism is wrong and Intelligent Design [which has nothing to do with religion] is right!! USA! USA! USA!

Aw, Dave, we love you so much, man.  :p

So wait.  The Virgin Mary was a Komodo dragon?

That's pretty cool, but what does that say about Joseph?


Date: 2006/12/21 21:43:48, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Philthadelphia, born and raised in the City of Brotherly Shove.

Good hunk of my adult life in Huntington WV.

Last two + years in Jacksonville, NC.

Date: 2006/12/23 06:02:33, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote ("Rev Dr" Lenny Flank @ Dec. 22 2006,17:49)
Quote (Lou FCD @ Dec. 21 2006,21:43)
Philthadelphia, born and raised in the City of Brotherly Shove.

Ha, we Allentownians also refer to it as "Filthy-delphia".   ;)

And we Philthadelphians refer to Allentown as "Dorney Park".


Quote (The Wayward Hammer @ Dec. 22 2006,18:25)
Lou FCD - Huntington, WV?  My two year sentence to WV was spent in Milton.  Huntington was OK for, as a co-worker once told, "a one horse town that shot the horse twenty years ago and was still in mourning."

Yeah, they're still smarting over that whole mall fiasco.  Idiots.

I wound up there because my wife was from there and Louisa, KY.  (I met her in Columbus, OH)

On the bright side, I spent a year and a half at Marshall working on a physics degree during the years we were divorced (we're re-married now).  

On the down side, working at a bar (Mulligan's on 3rd Ave.) to pay my way didn't do wonders for my college education and I dropped out.

Date: 2006/12/23 06:11:14, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Big, long, wet tongue kisses from JanieBelle, Kate, and The Boy.

Hope you're looking back with fond memories as all those new trackbacks come through from our old posts as we clean up our new home on WordPress.

We know we are.


Date: 2006/12/23 19:33:03, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Hey look!  Billy D's other little buddy had a book written about her:

Brainless: The Lies and Lunacy of Ann Coulter.  That's the link.  I thought it was a joke at first, but I guess not!


(Hat tip to bjm at The Thumb)

With sincerest apologies to Amazon, I have to paste the whole review:

Quote ( Editorial Review @ October 10, 2006)
Book Description

She is an uncompromising apologist for the right and a hater of all things left. Is there anything she won't do or say to further her agenda? The answer is no.

Brainless: The Lies and Lunacy of Ann Coulter is an unbridled look at a woman who twists the truth, misleads, plays loose with facts and allusions, and has been accused of plagiarism in hammering home her logic-defying arguments.

Brainless illustrates the dangers, ironies, and hypocrisies of the Mistress of Malice. She spews her venom generously across the spectrum. Democrats and Liberals are just the beginning. If you're a woman (you shouldn't vote), gay (you're going to ####), a 9/11 widow (dancing on your murdered husband's grave) or Bill Clinton (slurs and charges too numerous to mention here), you will find yourself the object of her ire.

Now it's time to turn the tables and take a good hard look at the High Priestess of Hypocrisy. Journalist Joe Maguire takes apart her arguments, picks apart her agenda, and gives us a look at the psychology and background of the woman who has reduced public political and cultural debate to browbeating and name-calling.

Diligently researched (with source notes you can verify!;), Maguire separates fact from myth and gives us an unvarnished look at the REAL Ann Coulter.

Let's face it. You don't ever want to read a book by Ann Coulter. Read this so you don't have to!

God, that's fucking funny.

Date: 2006/12/23 21:16:26, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Richardthughes @ Dec. 23 2006,20:17)
Hey, we need a messenger for our Kitzmass card. Who isn't banninated?

Kristine is still not banned I think.

I believe it's the shimmies....

Date: 2006/12/23 22:27:44, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I've delivered the message, but y'all are perfectly capable of visiting her blog, y'know.

And juju, I'm not real sure how she's going to take the "harpy" comment, but do the words "run for your fucking life" mean anything to you?

Just a suggestion.

[EDIT:  All better, thanks Rich]

Date: 2006/12/23 22:36:48, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Fixed.  Thanks, Rich.  

Kate said "that was foreplay, sissy".  She's got this evil grin and a hungry look in her eye....

Remember what I just told juju?

Run Rich, run.


[EDIT:  Here's the link to the thread where I gave Kristine the heads up.]

Date: 2006/12/24 07:32:02, Link
Author: Lou FCD
13)  SciAm is a peer-reviewed science journal, even the ads.

Date: 2006/12/24 07:41:58, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (skeptic @ Dec. 24 2006,07:33)
Fascism bears no resemblance to any modern right-wing philosophy

I'm just curious.  Did you say that with a straight face?

Date: 2006/12/24 08:06:49, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (jujuquisp @ Dec. 24 2006,07:50)
14)  If you can't win an argument or find that you are "in over your head", dig up some personal information (such as real name, career, ip address, city of residence, etc.) on your opponent and post it on the thread in an intimidating manner.

Addendum - You forgot the boldface insult with "homo" at the end, homo - dt


Date: 2006/12/24 10:01:53, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (stevestory @ Dec. 23 2006,23:26)
Quote (Lou FCD @ Dec. 21 2006,10:05)
Wow, I was thinking about going back to college (would be my third attempt at it) for a degree in physics.

If you need any help, let me know.

Will do, Steve.  Thanks.

Teaching is perhaps the only productive thing I might do given my age and physical issues, so I'm sure I'll be looking for help with the "Ed." part, too.

Perhaps I can at least contribute to society by helping to ensure our youth are better educated in science than young Josiah.

(Not that Janie and Kate aren't contributing to society as a whole, but that's a wholly different thing...)

Date: 2006/12/26 11:05:00, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Occam's Toothbrush @ Dec. 26 2006,04:30)
I suspect that a good underatanding of ID will allow us to predict exactly when the world will end.

I suspect that a good understanding of ID will allow us to understand why a dropped piece of toast always lands buttered side down.

"God has a grade-school sense of humor"?

"God hates butter"?

"God is without sexual preference, and wants us to butter both sides of his toast"?

"God is an incompetent designer, and did a piss-poor job of designing buttered toast"?

"God is a masochist and wants us all to eat dirty toast"?

The mind reels at the possibilities of the explanatory power of ID.

Date: 2006/12/27 10:27:06, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Roland Anderson @ Dec. 26 2006,16:51)
One thing that interests me is how old people are.

39 (or as I like to think of it, about to turn 19 for the 22nd time in a row)

Quote (The Good Reverend Doctor @ Dec. 26 2006,18:18)
But I've always *acted* like I was still 19.  And hope I always will.

I'll echo that sentiment.  (I guess I just did.)

Quote (ScaryFacts @ Dec. 26 2006,19:04)
I'm also interested in what everyone does professionally.

I was an electrician before my involuntary career change.  Now I'm just a cripple with way too much time on my hands and high speed internet access.  A Scary Fact, as it were.


Date: 2006/12/27 12:38:20, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Thank you, Steve.  Let him post his inanities where we don't have to sift through them to get to the actually funny stuff at UD.

Your humble servants,


Date: 2006/12/27 22:39:10, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (stevestory @ Dec. 27 2006,21:31)
Intelligent Design Tries to Rally Its Base

Unfortunately, all their base are belong to Judge Jones.

I think I just pissed myself laughing.


Date: 2006/12/30 12:01:13, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Holy crap, you guys have been busy!  Pages and pages of Tard.  I'm a little overloaded.

Quote (Kristine @ Dec. 28 2006,15:54)
Bill the Baptist would merely reply that only squares get into the square of the hypotenuse equalling the sum of the sides' squares. Here's one for JanieBelle:
Let A = red pigment
Let B = blue pigment
Let C = A + B

C = ...

A or -A?
Hurry up and figure it out Joseph, and report back so we can know what to wear to the square dance tonight. *shimmy* *fart*

Janie says that C = purple, which swings both ways.  She's a big fan of purple.

Quote (Kristine @ Dec. 29 2006,13:52)
Oh, dear innocent little Bill. He apparently doesn't know about drinking games, and...and...strip poker!

Let A = drinking games
Let B = strip poker
Let C = A + B

C = Janie and Kate causing fundy heads to explode.

Just so y'know.

(I was going to mention something about Dinosaur Adventure Land underpants, but thought that might be a bit over the top.  God The Intelligent Designer The Disembodied Telic Entity Don't Ask Don't Tell Critical Analyzer of Evolution God only knows what would happen were I to be sent to the bathroom wall again.)

Date: 2006/12/30 12:30:52, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Malcolm Muggeridge @ Sometime before he died, lo those 16 long years ago)
Posterity will marvel that so very flimsy and dubious an hypothesis could be accepted with the incredible credulity it has.

As a member of posterity, I am indeed marveling that so very flimsy and dubious an hypothesis as The Intelligent Design Creationism Hoax could be accepted with the incredible credulity it has.

Date: 2006/12/30 13:02:50, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I can't play much anymore because of my neck, so my babies collect a lot of dust, but I can't bear to part with them.

Sorry 'bout forgetting to set the date on the camera.  I do that a lot.

Date: 2006/12/30 14:25:17, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (phonon @ Dec. 30 2006,13:59)
Then Cordova seems to have let that one in one ear and out the other. Must have had a banana in it.

Wait.  I thought the banana was designed to fit in the hand...

Why do I never get the damned memos?????

Date: 2006/12/31 04:25:54, Link
Author: Lou FCD
"Fundies Say The Darndest Things."

and a whole website to prove that.

This particular one that I linked ain't one of the girls' trolls, but I believe y'all will really like it.  It involves evolutionists, apes, dinosaurs and aliens.

What more could you ask for?  It's like the Grand Unified Theory of Tard.

Date: 2006/12/31 04:43:04, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Does the phrase "so open your brain falls out" come to anyone else's mind here?

Date: 2006/12/31 05:07:32, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote ("Rev Dr" Lenny Flank @ Dec. 31 2006,01:56)
Quote (keiths @ Dec. 30 2006,23:20)
As a result of this undeserved regeneration, he now understands the Bible in a way that is inaccessible to us, the unchosen.

How the #### does Heddle know that he's one of the Chosen Ones, anyway?  Did God mail him an advance prepaid ticket to Heaven, or something?

Or is Heddle just arrogant, self-righteous, pride-filled and holier-than-thou (literally) enough to simply assume that he MUST be one of the Chosen Ones, since he is so, ya know, holy and all . . . .?

EMail from maybe?

Date: 2006/12/31 21:14:41, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Just popped in to say goodbye and good riddance. I found AFDork in this thread fascinating for about 2 pages (in the car-wreck-with-mulitple-decapitated-bodies kind of way), funny for two more, stupid for pretty much the rest, as far as AFrackinmoronDave is concerned.

Good science in here by pretty much everyone other than Davey Doodles on just about every topic one could ever want to know anything about and then a few, but after a while even seeing the same fascinating science over and over and over gets boring.

I can't even tell you how long I've been ignoring this waste of bandwidth.

I wouldn't have even known this train wreck was closing, but for the fact I read it on another thread.

My only hope is that AFDork isn't allowed to mess up all the other threads with his complete lack of lucid thought, or his deformed version of religious apologetics.  He's already begun dipping his toes in the water, trying to derail at least one.

After 11,000 comments all about his "hypothesis" (or lack thereof, more like), he can't cry censorship in any reality but his own.

Let him bring preach at his own blog, if it's so damned important.

Buh bye, Fluff-Fluff.

Don't let the door....

well, y'know.

Date: 2006/12/31 21:22:48, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I'll second (or third or whatever) that, Steve.

Eric's patience and tenacity for as long as I followed this nonsense is possibly only matched by Zachriel's with the various Tards he tries vainly to educate.

Janie gets bored with them much more quickly, and Kate would have just throttled them all by now.

Kudos to Eric.

Date: 2007/01/01 11:09:16, Link
Author: Lou FCD
One more post to this thread, for three reasons:

1. To hurry along the execution.

2. To apologize for perhaps being more than a little cranky when I posted on the last page. (I've had to do that rather frequently, lately.  Sorry, UDoJ's been breaking out in a rash of TardTrolls, so blame them.  I refuse to accept responsibility for things that are clearly my own fault.  Goddidit.)  Seriously, I was a jerk (again), I admit it, I apologize, I'll try not to be a jerk again soon.

3. To re-emphasize something that may have gotten lost in my five-year-old-child-like tantrum.  Mucho Goodo Scienceo in this thread, if one takes the time to wade through the AFDaveTardosity.  I really have learned some neat things about all sorts of scientific topics.

Date: 2007/01/01 12:48:54, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (afdave @ Jan. 01 2007,12:41)
Wordiness does not a scientist make.


Date: 2007/01/01 13:04:17, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Kristine @ Jan. 01 2007,12:58)
(unless people want to visit Minnesota? Huh?)

It's currently 68 degrees and warming here on the North Carolina coast.

Not a snowball's chance in ... well... North Carolina on New Year's Day, Kristine.

Date: 2007/01/01 14:46:57, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Arden Chatfield @ Jan. 01 2007,14:09)
Seems a little pervy, if you ask me.  ;)

You say that like "pervy" is a bad thing....

Quote (Kristine @ Jan. 01 2007,14:02)
The colder the weather, the warmer the evo-shimmies!

While shimmying is obviously a good thing, after having been raised in Philly, lived in Ohio, Kentucky, and West Virginia, I can honestly say that the only snow I ever wish to see again is once a year, on Christmas morning, on TV.

Each Christmas morning, I'd like to turn on the boob tube, flip to the weather channel, say "Look, it's snowing in Philly! HAHA!", turn it back off, and call my buddy Mikey to torment him about it.

Date: 2007/01/01 14:54:12, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (stevestory @ Jan. 01 2007,14:48)
"...the majority of scientists pointed out that they don't much care for theories which are less detailed and accurate than an episode of Captain Caveman."

Crap.  Sorry to hear that.

I was going to publish a book called "God Took A Leak", which would be just as supported by the evidence as AFDave's "hypothesis" AFAICT.

That Captain Caveman quote is priceless, and needs to be repeated everywhere.

Date: 2007/01/01 15:04:30, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (MidnightVoice @ Jan. 01 2007,13:55)
I knew it - there had to be a reason I enjoyed my youth so much - it is because I am a LIBERAL

the liberal model, which is defined by sin and perversion

Unfortunately, I missed out on all the good stuff when I was a youth.

Fortunately, as I believe Arden has pointed out, I'm making up for lost time through the girls.


Hey.  Will I go to Heck for the girls' sin and perversion?  What effect does their activity have on the destiny of my immortal soul?

If one is an avowed Atheist, but the other defines herself as "christian - other", but they both believe that a few valuable lessons can be learned from the New Testament despite the overwhelming majority of biblical content being genocidal insanity and fantastical ravings, does that help or hurt my chances of getting to wipe the Almighty's butt for eternity?

What if one accepts Jesus into her heart, but the other doesn't.  How does God choose?

Just wonderin'.

Date: 2007/01/01 15:16:55, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Steve, get your own domain name - Stevepedia, where you paraphrase Wikipedia to get down to the brass tacks.

People would pay good money to support such a thing.

I'd love to see your article on DaveyDoodles here.

Date: 2007/01/01 15:25:52, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (deadman_932 @ Jan. 01 2007,15:13)
Lou: I don't think you were cranky at all earlier. "Cranky" was eric lodging his boot in Dave's upper digestive tract day after day. Plus it was funny.

Well thanks, but I was feeling rather uncharitable (to understate reality shamefully) at the time.

I'm glad you found it funny.  I gotta play to my strengths, and the actual scientists + eric in this thread outshine my scientific knowledge by orders of magnitude.

Wise cracks, I can do.  (Well, I crack myself up, anyway.)

And now that this thread is gasping its last, desperate breath, you all have re-addicted me.


Date: 2007/01/01 15:36:33, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Arden Chatfield @ Jan. 01 2007,15:29)

It's the Dembski part that makes it a twisted thing in this case.  :O

It's a chick thing involving pirate costumes, a mainmast, and a long piece of rope... uh.. not that I'd know anything about that...

Quote (Arden Chatfield @ Jan. 01 2007,15:29)
You mean like this?

EXACTLY like that, Arden.  He's a HUGE Simpsons fan.

Date: 2007/01/01 15:52:08, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Richardthughes @ Jan. 01 2007,15:31)

Quote (cranberrybrains @ Jan. 01 2007,15:27)
3. crandaddy // Jan 1st 2007 at 3:27 pm

Forrest won’t debate you, Bill, and the reason is quite ironic–She’s a COWARD! Please do take every opportunity to hang it over her head. Perhaps even a counter on the front page would be appropriate.

Comment by crandaddy — January 1, 2007 @ 3:27 pm


Crandaddy is like Raiiieeeeiiiiiin, on my wedding day.

As I recall, Bill and Barbara both showed up for her deposition, but wasn't it like four days later that ol Billy Dumbass pulled the Houdini?

Ah yes.  Here it is...

Quote (Barbara Forrest @ The "Vice Strategy" Undone)
Dembski already knew that such a day of legal reckoning was approaching. Exactly one month later, on June 6, he sat across from me when I was deposed as an expert witness for the plaintiffs in the first ID legal case, Kitzmiller et al. v. Dover Area School District. He attended my deposition as the adviser to the lead defense attorney, Richard Thompson of the Thomas More Law Center, and was scheduled to be deposed himself on June 13 as a defense witness. Besides being on opposite sides, there was another big difference between us: I showed up for my deposition. Dembski “escaped critical scrutiny by not having to undergo cross-examination” when he withdrew from the case on June 10

The "Vise Strategy" Undone

Date: 2007/01/01 17:42:00, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (ericmurphy @ Jan. 01 2007,16:42)
All of the insects were gone after a year immersed in a mile of water. All of them. Unless they were on the ark. If you can find me an insect that can live for a year underwater with no food, then you're entitled to say that insect could have survived the flood. Which species of beetles can survive a year underwater and without food, Dave? There are 300,000 species of beetles today. How many were on the ark? 3,000 "kinds"? Because even if there were, each one would have to radiate into a thousand species today. Did Noah spend all his time collecting beetles?

How about butterflies, Dave? Can butterflies live underwater? Maybe they can stay aloft for a year without food? You do know what butterflies eat, right, Dave? Were there flowers growing up through a mile of water? There are eleven thousand species of butterflies and moths today. How many were on the ark?

Ants, Dave. 12,000 species of ants in existence today. How many of them can live a mile underwater for a year? Or were they doing the backstroke for a year with no food? How many different "kinds" of ants were on the ark, Dave?

I could go on and on. Since you've never been able to answer whether the "flood" waters were freshwater or seawater, I'll answer that one for you. It was fresh water, Dave. It fell as rain, right? Have you ever seen saltwater rain? So a mile-thick layer of fresh water dilutes the oceans' salinity by, say, 30%. That would sterilize the seas, Dave. There are 30,000 species of saltwater fish in existence today. How many of them could have survived a year in water only 60% as salty as it is today? How many of them were belly-up after a year of living in barely brackish water? Or maybe Noah kept a few onboard, and kept the penguins from eating them.

What about all those marine invertebrates? How many coastal molluscs (70,000 species) do you think survived being a mile deeper in water than they're adapted to? Fresh water, Dave. An extra mile of it. How many clams were there on the ark?

Lobsters, Dave? Or the other 40,000 species of crustaceans? Do you think Alaskan King Crabs could live a mile deeper in (fresh) water than they were adapted to?

How do you think those reptiles survived a year underwater, Dave? You do know that, e.g., crocodiles are not deep-sea reptiles like sea turtles, don't you? Do you think a crocodile could survive a year at sea? There were no intertidal zones, no rivers, no lakes, nothing but deep blue-water ocean over the entire planet.

How about land plants, Dave? You wikipedia chart doesn't even list plants. How many land plants can survive a year's immersion in a mile of water, Dave? How many of the more than a million species of plants survived the flood? How many of them were on the ark? Where did Noah store all those seeds? And where did he plant them? He managed to get coastal redwoods and sequoias planted on the west coast of the United States? How did manage that, with North America rushing away from the Middle East at hundreds of miles an hour?

Further, your list includes only identified species, Dave. The actual numbers are undoubtedly much higher. How many of the organisms (probably millions of individual species) that are adapted to life in equitorial rainforests could survive a year at sea with no food or water? Do you think O. sumatra can live for a year at the bottom of the sea?

Dave, your "flood" was a slate-wiper to make the comet at the K/T boundary look like an isolated brush fire. Virtually everything would have died. Probably almost everything on the ark died. You think Noah had room for a few thousand "kinds," many of whom eat very specialized diets, plus a year's supply of food for them? Noah would have been pitching dead critters over the side every day, for the entire year. It's unlikely even 5% of them could have survived the year.

It's still millions of species, Dave.

And you still haven't explained why 4,500 years is more time than 4,500,000,000 years. You still haven't explained why 4,500 years is more than enough time to get from 2,000 "kinds" to millions of species, but a million times longer isn't remotely enough to get from thousands of species to millions of species.

It's a simple question, Dave. But you're utterly, desperately clueless as to how to answer it.

But the truth of the matter is, even getting from 2,000 "kinds" to 23,000 species is still impossible. 4,500 years isn't remotely enough to have biodiversity increase by a factor of ten. You have absolutely zero evidence that biodiversity is any higher now than it was 4,500 years ago, or at any time since.

And—and here's the kicker—your own "hypothesis" predicts massive die-offs in the intervening time as complex genomes degenerated, driving most complex eukaryotes to extinction in as little as 300 generations, or less than 500 years!

Here's a question.

Just for argument's sake, lets say all the species of plants and animals alive today actually did find some means to survive the flood.

That's a great big gimme for ya' Davey.

Well then, what was the fucking point of the flood in the first place then, and why was the ark necessary?

Just wonderin'.

Date: 2007/01/01 17:47:17, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote ("Rev Dr" Lenny Flank @ Jan. 01 2007,16:35)
Quote (Lou FCD @ Jan. 01 2007,14:46)
Each Christmas morning, I'd like to turn on the boob tube, flip to the weather channel, say "Look, it's snowing in Philly! HAHA!", turn it back off, and call my buddy Mikey to torment him about it.

I call my sister in Pennsylvania once in a while during winter and ask her what the temperature is up there.  "38 degrees", she says.  "Geez, it's warmer than that in my REFRIGERATOR", I point out.  

Then I tell her I gotta run -- I'm off to sit on the beach all day.     ;)

Sweet.  I hadn't thought of the 'fridge angle.


Date: 2007/01/01 17:53:13, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Richardthughes @ Jan. 01 2007,17:25)

Estimated Time to Deletion?

That's worth saving so just in case:

Quote (Jud @ Jan 1st 2007,6:14 pm)

6. Jud // Jan 1st 2007 at 6:14 pm

DaveScot said that Carl Zimmer’s article supported the notion that genotype and phenotype are “increasingly at odds” with regard to proper characterization of the ancestry of various animals. I disagreed, noting Zimmer’s article actually illustrated the coming together in agreement of biologists championing phenotype with those researching primarily in the area of genotype.

DaveScot quoted a portion of Zimmer’s article in support of his statement. In support of my interpretation of what the article says, let me quote another segment of it. Apologies for the length, but I feel it’s necessary:

“At the time, molecular phylogenies were still a novelty. The computational methods for calculating them were relatively new, and scientists could only use them to compare a few gene sequences of whales and other mammals. But the conclusions from these few studies were the same: the closest living cousins of whales are hippos.

“This may not seem like a big deal. It certainly didn’t seem to bother the scientists who carried out the studies. They were just analyzing digital code, abstracted from the animals that carried it. The results spoke for themselves. Nevertheless, they gave paleontologists and mammalian systematists conniptions.

“Here’s why. Hippos are artiodactyls (also known as even-toed ungulates). Other artiodactyls include cows, camels, and pigs, and goats. Zoologists have long recognized a number of anatomical features that unite artiodactyls in their own group, distinct from other hoofed mammals such as horses and rhinos. One of the most obvious hallmarks was a bone in the ankle, the astragalus. The artiodactyl astragalus has a unique double-pulley shape that allows the artiodactyl hoof to swing back and forth in a distinctive way.

“In the 1990s paleontologists found a number of spectacular early whale fossils, but they had yet to find bones from the whale ankle. The bones and teeth they did find suggested that the closest relatives of whales were an extinct group of mammals called mesonychids. Mesonychids were hoofed mammals, but they did not have a double-pulley astragalus. Therefore, paleontologists concluded, they were probably not artiodactyls. And if mesonychids were not artiodactyls, then whales could not be either. And that meant that the whale–hippo link had to be wrong.”

* * *

“Subsequent studies on mammal DNA continued to support the whale–hippo link. And meanwhile paleontologists discovered more fossils of ancient walking whales. In 2001 Phil Gingerich and his colleagues from the University of Michigan and from Pakistan described a skeleton of the seal-like species Rodhocetus. Among its bones, they found an astragulus—the first whale astragulus ever discovered. And lo and behold, the astragalus had a double-pulley shape [citation omitted]. The DNA, it seems, had been right all along.”

So biologists started out in disagreement - DNA indicated artiodactyls, the fossils seemed to point to mesonychids. However, later fossil finds confirmed whale ancestors were artiodactyls, the same line from which hippos came. Thus, Zimmer’s article points out that phenotype was found to agree with genotype.

Therefore, I can’t agree that Zimmer’s article supports the notion that genotype and phenotype are “increasingly at odds.”

Comment by Jud — January 1, 2007 @ 6:14 pm

Date: 2007/01/01 21:36:39, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Wesley R. Elsberry @ Jan. 01 2007,20:21)
Did no one notice Prof. Steve Steve in the Brazos Barbecue picture?


Totally missed him, Wes, he just blended in.

I didn't know anything about pandas evolving the ability to camouflage themselves in front of local Barbecue joints.

I love this place, you're always learnin' somethin' new.

(Anyone got a link to a paper on this?)

Date: 2007/01/01 22:30:17, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (keiths @ Jan. 01 2007,22:02)
In one of his [L. Ron Hubbard's] first pioneering experiments on the subject, he employed a sound wave measuring device called a Koenig photometer. Two students read poetry from extremely different languages – Japanese and English – into the device. He found that the device identified the speech as poetry regardless of language. When haiku was read in the original Japanese, the wavelengths produced by the Koenig photometer were the same as those produced when English verse was read.

Here, then, he concluded, was scientific evidence that people were not so different as he had been led to believe, that there was indeed a meeting ground, and all minds did in fact respond identically to the same stimuli.

Japanese poetry, one reading.
English poetry, same reading.
Japanese haiku, same reading.
English haiku, same reading.


I wonder if it would have given the same readings if it "listened" to the sound track from a bad '70s porno.

Perhaps he was unaware of the three most important words in the English language...

"Batteries Not Included"

Date: 2007/01/02 07:42:17, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I believe the Davey Doodles thread has sprung a leak.

Could somebody put a cork in it?

Date: 2007/01/02 09:55:25, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (stevestory @ Jan. 01 2007,23:42)
Anyway, I don't even have so much as a blog. Reason is, I just don't have anything to say. I don't have any particular expertise in any area, ...

I disagree.  I think you have plenty of good stuff to say.

Quote (stevestory @ Jan. 01 2007,23:42)
...the reason I follow ID Creationism daily is because it's emotionally rewarding. Seeing low IQ, arrogant, wholly uninformed people like Davetard and Troutmac and Salvador put their lab coats on backwards and pretend to do science is hilarious to me. The Discovery Institute people are theocratic jerks who think they came up with a brilliant plan to drag us back to the middle ages. Their brilliant plan had multiple fatal birth defects, and bystanders like me get to revel in both Schadenfreude and righteousness as it flatlines. That is some emotional satisfaction. Also, I love that shocked feeling you get when, once every few months, a creationist says something so idiotic, something wrong so many ways, that you feel like your brain rebooted on you.

When Salvador did that whole "evolutionary algorithms really prove ID because a human designed the computer" thing, I was positively punch-drunk.


BTW, are you going to The 2007 North Carolina Science Blogging Conference?

I may try to make that.

Date: 2007/01/02 12:53:24, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (ScaryFacts @ Jan. 02 2007,11:18)
If Dave "won" all those other arguments, why didn't he create a Portuguese avatar or a dog avatar or a Grand Canyon avatar?

'cause he doesn't know how to draw a Portugese Dog?

Date: 2007/01/02 14:12:10, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (ScaryFacts @ Jan. 02 2007,13:02)
Quote (Lou FCD @ Jan. 02 2007,13:53)
'cause he doesn't know how to draw a Portugese Dog?

I will at least say this:  The avatar makes his point pretty clear--clearer than anything else I've seen.

You gotta give him kudos for that.

Well it is certainly the clearest and most concise point from Dave, but I believe that the clearest and most concise point about Dave was this:

Explanation of AFDave

Date: 2007/01/02 14:40:26, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I'd like to see the referral stats, and what percentage are from here, the Thumb, etc.

How many of those page views are us laughing at them, and how many are from the remaining 20 commenters?

Date: 2007/01/02 16:54:01, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (ericmurphy @ Jan. 02 2007,16:10)
You didn't dispute that assertion; you merely ignored it.

color me shocked.

Date: 2007/01/02 20:31:04, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (deadman_932 @ Jan. 02 2007,16:30)
Oi, man. Where to begin.

How about here?

Date: 2007/01/02 20:55:50, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote ("Rev Dr" Lenny Flank @ Jan. 02 2007,20:42)
Think carefully before you answer.

After 11,000+ (let's not forget the original "Creator God Hypothesis") comments, what on this green earth makes you think he'd start now?

Date: 2007/01/03 07:25:48, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (DenyseWhoOwnethNotAMirrorABrainAClueOrAHintOfJournalisticTalent @ Wednesday, December 27, 2006,On her blog "Post Consciousness")
Recently, ID math guy con-man Bill Dembski put up a fairly raucus spoof on complete failure of an attempt at hip juvenile humor about Judge Jones in the Dover case depending so heavily for his opinion on the ACLU  - and the First Amendment to the Constitution of the United States of America and as pointed out by the ACLU in turn on a variety of anti-ID figures scientists who do actual science. I blog with Dembski because he's the only person on earth who will pretend to take me seriously, and I must say, I never had an original thought and am only calling the "fart-fest" a bit over the top now that I realize it's not popular even with our brainless sheep. But just as I was casting about for a tactful way to frame my objection someone who could articulate a coherent thought and implant it into my brain (which I knew would be unpopular damned near impossible when the young guys marks were having such a good time), a vast cackle of drag queens and male old ladies group of five young men from a TV show called "Queer Eye for the Straight Guy" bustled into my home, squealing outrage at the sins I daily commit against the gods of good taste and appearance and swooning at thoughts of Deadman and Rich. Well, that put me off, because I am a real live uptight Irish Catholic old lady myself, which means that I certainly cannot be seen with them!

Fixed that for ya, D.  You really should have me proof-read your copy before you hit the publish button.  Good job with the last sentence, though.


Date: 2007/01/03 07:30:02, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (deadman_932 @ Jan. 02 2007,22:29)
Quote (Lou FCD @ Jan. 02 2007,20:31)
Quote (deadman_932 @ Jan. 02 2007,16:30)
Oi, man. Where to begin.

How about here?

I hate you, Lou. Hate, hate, hate, hate.  :angry:  :angry:
But I luuuuuuuv Janie and Kate. Luv, luv, luv, luv   :p  :p

Well they'd like to know why, if that's true, you never come calling anymore.


Date: 2007/01/03 10:41:55, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (dgszweda @ Jan. 03 2007,10:03)
The potential of the universe to cause itself into existence at the same instance that it is caused is impossible to believe and even more impossible to explain.  It cannot cause itself before it's existence.

The fact that it hasn't been explained yet does not mean it's impossible.

That would be why scientists have jobs.

Date: 2007/01/03 10:57:54, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Kristine @ Jan. 03 2007,10:16)
Does anyone have any personal information on Denyse?  Has she ever been married?  Does she have kids?  

Here's the shimmy, I mean, the skinny. (Arden merits a shimmy.)  ;)

Second paragraph -

Quote (N.J Lindquist @ June 22, 2004)
It was a logical step. In her family, “the ability to express oneself easily and well was highly valued.”

Oh, the disappointment in that household...

Quote (N.J Lindquist @ June 22, 2004)
In the years since, she has written for a variety of publications including the Globe and Mail, Canadian Living and a magazine for truckers.  She has written about automotive issues for the Toronto Star and about cats for a magazine called Hi-Rise.

Ah.  Science ad Peterbilt.  Oh, a cat magazine!  That's just like Science or Nature.

Quote (N.J Lindquist @ June 22, 2004)
“The Yukon affected me more than any other place.

Say it with me -

Brain Freeze.

Quote (N.J Lindquist @ June 22, 2004)
“I was one of the last generation of students who were taught grammar. I knew for sure whether a given sentence was correct.

The content of a sentence however, was an entirely different thing...

Quote (N.J Lindquist @ June 22, 2004)
Denyse had always been interested in nature and science issues. In 1996, a Toronto professor suggested they co-author a book on cloning. Denyse began gathering information.

...from her vast collection of Jack Chick tracts....

Quote (N.J Lindquist @ June 22, 2004)
The little girl who looked at the Yukon landscape and searched for words to express her feelings has successfully made the transition to the woman who analyzes the world through the lens of her faith and reaches for a keyboard to record her impressions.

Unfortunately, the lens is broken, and the church organ isn't plugged in.

Date: 2007/01/03 11:04:51, Link
Author: Lou FCD

Hey, when this gets down to a hundred, can we just start singing "A hundred bottles of beer" or something?

Maybe an AFDave version...

Date: 2007/01/03 13:05:36, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Are we really going to do this again for another 11,000 comments?

Just wonderin'.

Date: 2007/01/03 14:40:20, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (afdave @ Jan. 03 2007,14:34)
Very little.  Sorry.

Almost 11,000 comments and I believe this is the first honest thing I've seen from you.

Date: 2007/01/03 15:51:25, Link
Author: Lou FCD
He doesn't have the balls to come here, Rich.

There's no one here to protect him from those mean ol' reality based folks who won't accept Jesus into their hearts and do as they are told.


EDIT:  Crap, I'm on a tear again.  Sorry.

Date: 2007/01/03 17:31:41, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (deadman_932 @ Jan. 03 2007,16:25)
Quote (Lou FCD @ Jan. 03 2007,07:25)
a vast cackle of drag queens and male old ladies group of five young men from a TV show called "Queer Eye for the Straight Guy" bustled into my home, squealing outrage at the sins I daily commit against the gods of good taste and appearance and swooning at thoughts of Deadman and Rich.

And well they SHOULD:(snip the pic just for Occam's Dental Implement) You're just jealous, Lou.

I am indeed jealous fellas. I went to the doctor today and the pretty young nurse of course made me get on the scale.

Thirty frickin' pounds heavier than before I got hurt.

That sucks.

It's no wonder the girls have all the bloggin' mojo.  They get all the blog traffic, all the fun fundy trolls, all the interesting conversations, and all the hot sex.

I get an ever widening ass.


Date: 2007/01/03 18:15:52, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (ScaryFacts @ Jan. 03 2007,18:02)
Quote (Lou FCD @ Jan. 03 2007,18:31)
I am indeed jealous fellas. I went to the doctor today and the pretty young nurse of course made me get on the scale.

Thirty frickin' pounds heavier than before I got hurt.

That sucks.

It's no wonder the girls have all the bloggin' mojo.  They get all the blog traffic, all the fun fundy trolls, all the interesting conversations, and all the hot sex.

I get an ever widening ass.


I know a hawt chick in Philly who's into big butts.  I'll PM her number to you.

Thanks for the offer, Scary!  You're a real pal!

I'm afraid there's a few problems with my acceptance, however.

1) I now live about 500 miles south of Philly.
2) My wife would kill me, you, and the big butt chick.

Mostly I'm kinda not down with #2.

Date: 2007/01/03 19:04:16, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (stevestory @ Jan. 03 2007,18:51)
I can't find that list of pseudoscience points. You know, how many points your get for comparing yourself to Galileo, etc. Anybody know what I'm talking about?

Crackpot index

EDIT:  Argy,



EDIT EDIT - Argy, ttthhhhhhbbbbbbbbbbbb!

Steve, I wouldn't have said a thing, honest!

okimlying.  zippin' my trap and watchin' from here out.


Date: 2007/01/03 19:09:01, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Arden Chatfield @ Jan. 03 2007,18:57)
All serious male bloggers have big wide butts. It's a sign that you've truly arrived.  :p

Again?  How come I keep arriving, but never leaving?

First I thought the bathroom wall thing, then the JanieBelle wrecking the UD world thing, now it's the big fat ass thing.

I think I'm tired from all the arriving.


Date: 2007/01/03 19:24:38, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (ScaryFacts @ Jan. 03 2007,19:13)
At least he didn't do what usually happens when I get around fundies--they usually tell me I'm going to ####.

He just hasn't gotten 'round to that yet.  Give 'em time.

Date: 2007/01/03 19:40:39, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Not guilty, Stevie.

That place is a little too um... stiff.... for the girls, though they do read there from time to time.


Which thread, though?  We've not been 'round there since about Christmas.

EDIT:  Ack!  Definitely not the girls.  They may be oversexed and slutty, but they've got a little more class than that!

Date: 2007/01/03 19:48:42, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (ScaryFacts @ Jan. 03 2007,19:28)
Quote (Lou FCD @ Jan. 03 2007,19:15)
2) My wife would kill me, you, and the big butt chick.

Oh, uh, tell your wife my butt loving friend is, uh, a physical therapist, yeah, that's it, and, uh, I was just, uh, thinking she could help you with your, uh, pain.  Of course I, uh, thought your wife would, uh, be there as well, you know?  I mean, that was all I was, uh, saying.

I mean, uh, your wife doesn't own firearms, uh, does she?

Did I say that I've moved from Knoxville?  Yeah, really far away, I'm, uh, doing research in Antarctica.  Yeah, that's it.  I'll send you a card.  Yeah.


we're dead meat.

Date: 2007/01/03 20:12:39, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (stevestory @ Jan. 03 2007,19:59)
"LouFCD? I'm ScaryFacts aka Chris Hansen. Big Butt Chick is 17. So uh, what are you doing here? Why don't you take a seat over there."

"Well ya see there's this girl named JanieBelle, right?  And she's 17 too, and...

Nevermind, just give me the cuffs and I'll put them on myself."

Quote (Arden Chatfield @ Jan. 03 2007,19:50)
On a more serious note, I'm sorry to hear about your medical stuff!

Thanks for the sympathies, Arden.  It's a sucky situation, but there's no helping it.

I was 50 pounds heavier about a year ago, but I had managed to get it down to about 10.  Now I'm goin' the wrong direction again.


On the upside, my being crippled gives the girls a lot of time to wreck stuff.


Date: 2007/01/03 21:53:40, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (ScaryFacts @ Jan. 03 2007,21:39)
Quote (stevestory @ Jan. 03 2007,19:59)
"LouFCD? I'm ScaryFacts aka Chris Hansen. Big Butt Chick is 17. So uh, what are you doing here? Why don't you take a seat over there."

17 is 1 year over the age of consent in Tennessee.  Just a thought.

(I can't sleep so I might as well make meaningless posts)

North Carolina, too, but I think they have one of those rolling age of consent things here.

As to why I know that, I swear it really was research for JanieBelle's conception.

Quote (Kristine @ Jan. 03 2007,21:44)
And while I knew about your injury, Lou, sorry to hear it still troubles you. What a prescription drug maze! ??? Take care.  *Shimmies*

Thanks.  I'd shimmie back, but that'd put me in traction for weeks.


Plus, with the extra 30 pounds, it wouldn't be pretty.

Thanks for the chuckle, Steve!  That one cracked me up.  I'm not sure if it's the new meds or not, but does it really matter?


Date: 2007/01/04 10:40:00, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Kristine @ Jan. 04 2007,09:54)
Meanwhile, an incredible mass of stagnation is approaching our starship from the UD galaxy at an increasingly ho-hum rate. So say hello to Shalini, who gives ID a bang-up job herself. (They must be tired from partying so much.)

JanieBelle BBWAD just popped over to introduce herself to Shalini BBWAD.

Thanks for the heads up, Kristine.

Date: 2007/01/04 11:27:09, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Ok boys, break it up.  Don't make me get the girls on you.

Aren't we supposed to be making fun of Bill "The Flatulence Becomes Me" Dembski and company in this thread?

I guess we're all bored, because there hasn't been a new post over at the Random Comedy Generator for a few days.

C'mon, Bill.  Say something funny.  DO IT FOR US!

Date: 2007/01/04 11:47:24, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Richardthughes @ Jan. 04 2007,11:30)
I'd like Janie on me, then Kate on me, then both on me.


I'll be sure to let them know, Rich, as soon as they come out.  They've locked themselves behind a door and I can hear them whispering and giggling, but I can't hear what they're saying.

They're up to something, but I don't know what.

I have a suspicion it may have something to do with this but I can't be sure....

Date: 2007/01/04 12:44:15, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Wesley R. Elsberry @ Jan. 04 2007,12:17)

I appreciate your concern for accuracy in encyclopedias.  I too desire all scientific information in encyclopedias to be accurate.  This is in the interest of us all.  But to say that an article in Wikipedia, which is based upon information from arguably the world's most important cell biology textbook, The Molecular Biology of the Cell by Bruce Alberts, seems desperate, if I may use the terminology of someone famous.  I would also ask, "Have you have voiced your concerns about accuracy to the editorial board of Encyclopedia Britannica?"  My understanding is that they typically employ PhD's who are specialists (such as youself) in their respective fields to author the various technical articles.

Funny, usually when somebody like Hawkins has an ace authority, a quote is provided. No quote here. The question is, was Hawkins too tired to provide the quote, or did he not provide the quote because that would bust his bluff?

I don't have an Encyclopedia Britannica handy, so I don't know whether or not they make the same error that Wikipedia had. Therefore, I have not contacted them.

I have a set, and just for fun I'm looking it up now...

Stay tuned.

[EDIT:  I'm not finding any such assertion in any of the articles on genetics in either the macropedia or the micropedia, near as I can tell.  I have an older edition, though.  '94 limited anniversary edition, leather bound, gilded trim, very pretty.  :)  Just so y'know.)

Date: 2007/01/04 15:22:27, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Good for Elfstar!  I hear there's lots of great indiscriminate sex in those things!

P.S.  Did Mr. Chick happen to give a phone number for this cult?

Just wonderin'.

Research, I swear promise assert lie.

Date: 2007/01/04 18:20:05, Link
Author: Lou FCD
As an aside for the folks in Seattle...

Dr. Phil Plait of BadAstronomy will be in Seattle giving a moon-hoax talk on Sunday, January 7.

Heads up.

Date: 2007/01/04 21:12:07, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Wordpress, Steve.  I'm telling ya' it's better than Blogger, and it doesn't go down all the time.

If you host your blog on, it does all the work for you.

The single real drawback that I can find is that javascript is not allowed.

But that's an inconvenience more than a flaw.  Turns out javascript is one big way Blogger and some others get hacked, so it's shut off by for security reasons.

If you host it somewhere other than, Wordpress is very configurable, and you can do pretty much anything you want.

You know I have plenty of time on my hands, so if you'd like, I'd be happy to do the setup for you.

We could even set up a dummy blog for you to try out for a while, if you want.  Testdrive kinda thing.

(EDIT: Hosting by is free, Scary.  I paid an extra $15, just to be able to change the font size and link colors and such.  Still can't edit the template, but there are a pretty good handful to choose from.

Nice call, though.  Your prediction was much better than any of Pat  Robertson's!;)


Date: 2007/01/04 21:16:28, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I'm a boot licker, what can I say?


(Plus, I once did it for DaveTard, I have pennance to do for that)

Date: 2007/01/04 21:28:49, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (ScaryFacts @ Jan. 04 2007,21:20)
If wordpress is free then I reluctantly agree with Lou--it's your best option.  (durn it.)

Of course you do.  I'm always right!


To be clear, that fifteen smackers is a once a year thing, and it's just to edit the css, not the template itself.  The template can't be edited, again for security reasons.

If you absolutely have to tweak the template, you can use Wordpress and have it hosted elsewhere.  I thought I might do that sometime down the line, but I'm pretty happy with things as they stand.  I doubt the few little things that bug me will cause me to change hosts.

Quote (ScaryFacts @ Jan. 04 2007,21:20)
you're still a boot licking suck up.

It's a tough job keeping the boss happy and distracted so you guys can do your thing....


Date: 2007/01/05 06:19:20, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Louis @ Jan. 05 2007,03:36)
Any hints, tips, pointers, calls to get a fucking life?


Docs for Wordpress is where the latest software and instructions can be found, while is the hosting site.

Just to make that clear up front.  Lots of folks seem to miss that, so I'll just point that out.

Basically, all you are going to do is download the latest version (2.0 recently came out, so if you have an older version, can it and get the fresh goodies), and then upload it to a folder on your webspace.

Run the set up, which should take like 5 minutes or something, and go.

If it looks like more than you want to fool with, there's a group of volunteers from the wordpress forums who will even do the installation for you for free.

How much better can it get?

Quote (Alan Fox @ Jan. 05 2007,06:05)
So, as I have a website for business with loads of spare bandwidth, could I move my blog to my business domain, and is there any advantage in doing so? I use FrontPage.

Assuming that your web host meets the requirements (and most all of them do), yes.  Your blog will exist in a separate folder from your static pages, so it wouldn't matter what software runs those.  You'd even be able to tweak your blog template to compliment your static pages.

Advantages?  Mostly that you can do about anything you want with the template.

Other than that, Alan, the only real advantage for moving your current blog would be that Javison would quit complaining that you're blocking him from commenting from time to time when blogger's down.

The comedy value of that argues for staying put, IMHO.


Date: 2007/01/05 07:31:53, Link
Author: Lou FCD
{Inserts obligatory howls of outraged, semi-knowledgeable computer owners/disabled electricians}


Date: 2007/01/05 08:53:11, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Alan Fox @ Jan. 05 2007,07:48)
That's odd. I posted "thanks Lou, that was quick..." but on checking back no trace!!! It must be that evilutionist SteveStory blocking me again.

BTW Lou, semi-seriously, are you available for the odd bit of consultancy? There are some great spa therapy centres round here, hot seaweed wraps, that sort of thing, if you ever get over this side of the pond.

All you have to do is ask, Alan.  Happy to help any time I can.

I was in London on my honeymoon in July of '05, and we took the kids there this past August.

The wifey wants to see Paris or Ireland, should we ever be able to afford to travel again (not likely any time soon, but who knows?) so I'll keep that in mind.

I'd be happy with a trip to the West Riding.  I've traced my paternal family back to Wadsworth, Halifax through Denholme, Bradford just after the turn of the 19th century, and I'd like to do some hands-on research to see if I could push it back a little further.

There is a historical society in Hebden Bridge that has boxes of documents I'd like to look at, but only the index and a few abstracts are online.

We only swung it the first two times because the Worker's Compensation insurance company paid me a small hunk of "fuck off and die and don't bother us any more" change.

Quote (ScaryFacts @ Jan. 05 2007,08:31)
One key element you need for Wordpress is MySQL.  Not all hosting accounts have that as an option so make sure to ask.

Scary's right, Louis.  MySQL is a database program that WordPress uses and it's necessary.  I've had a few hosted sites (mostly defunct now), and they've all had it installed already, but there are some out there that don't.

Date: 2007/01/05 12:03:35, Link
Author: Lou FCD

I'm being quoted in a siggy.  I think I've just arrived...

Yet Again.

Date: 2007/01/06 15:20:54, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (afdave @ Jan. 06 2007,14:30)
Faid ... what can I say, my friend?  Your logic is too hard to follow, so I won't try.

Well that pretty much says it all, doesn't it?

#### you, Faid!  #### you and your Damned logic and stuff!

Date: 2007/01/13 07:45:21, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Y'know, I take a couple days off, and the tard just overflows.  My toilet runneth over.

The worst thing DaveTard could have ever done for his image was post image.


Date: 2007/01/14 08:51:53, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (GCT @ Jan. 14 2007,08:19)
The more I look at DaveTard's picture, the more I wonder whether he's actually wearing a straight jacket in that photo.  It would explain a lot.

nah, we know he has both hands free because he uses one to operate the computer while he reads at my girls' blogs.


Date: 2007/01/14 09:18:09, Link
Author: Lou FCD
As a further addendum, allow me to also point out that even after all that, Dave is still permitted to eructate his same old bull all over the time-honored tradition of The Bathroom Wall.

He's plastering Jeebusdunnit stickers over perfectly good graffiti.  It's has already become "AFDave's Updated Creator God Hypothesis III" and I find that continually offensive and demeaning to the classic artwork found there.

Further, the girls are quite pissed off that he's being allowed to smear his feces all over their cradle.

Just so y'know.

Date: 2007/01/14 10:34:05, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (blipey @ Jan. 14 2007,09:54)
Quote (Arden Chatfield @ Jan. 14 2007,09:36)
Quote (blipey @ Jan. 14 2007,00:16)
Quote (jujuquisp @ Jan. 12 2007,22:32)
When are you going to meet him in Austin?

Don't have my Texas swing finalized (the booking agent only finalizes schedules a week in advance), but we're in the area in March.

What will you do if he calls you a maggot and tells you to drop and give him twenty?

Look for the intelligent designer that created the sound system that would be piping in an actual drill sargeant's voice.

Are you thinking that he's got one of those high squeeky little kid voices too?

I am.

Date: 2007/01/14 10:41:55, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Stephen Elliott @ Jan. 14 2007,10:18)
A quick apeal here to the people responding to AFDave.

Could you please take steps to avoid turning the BathroomWall into AFDaves UCGH III?

Funny.  Exactly one hour to the minute before you posted this, I posted a very similar thought in the civility thread.

Quote (Lou FCD @ Jan. 14 2007,09:18)
As a further addendum, allow me to also point out that even after all that, Dave is still permitted to eructate his same old bull all over the time-honored tradition of The Bathroom Wall.

He's plastering Jeebusdunnit stickers over perfectly good graffiti.  It's has already become "AFDave's Updated Creator God Hypothesis III" and I find that continually offensive and demeaning to the classic artwork found there.

Further, the girls are quite pissed off that he's being allowed to smear his feces all over their cradle.

Just so y'know.

Too weird, Stephen.

Date: 2007/01/14 13:13:32, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Louis @ Jan. 14 2007,12:41)
You wanker!

Only if there's nobody watching.



Free your body, free your mind.  Head for Leicester Square and do it there.

Date: 2007/01/14 13:33:07, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (stevestory @ Jan. 14 2007,11:06)

The Bathroom Wall is not AFDave's new home. He's been told to move along, and he's had more than enough time to do so, and not doing so is becoming annoying.

Amen, brother Steve, and thank you.

Quote (Stephen Elliott @ Jan. 14 2007,10:41)

It aint that weird. There is a chance that I read your post before posting here.

Stephen, as contentless as most of the cracks I make here are, I hadn't even considered that you may have read that.



Quote (Stephen Elliott @ Jan. 14 2007,10:41)

Anyway, I doubt that we are the only people anoyed that this is turning into AFDave 3. BTW I have no problem with the people that respond to the troll. It is difficult to see lies written in an area you know something about and not respond.

Personally I spent ages responding to ThorDaddy and LarryFaffarman's mad posts. It was all pointles of course but it is so irritating to see posts that you know are untrue to go uncontested.

I know what you mean about responding.  It's definitely difficult to just ignore the stupidity, and with all the posters here at AtBC, there's virtually no chance that every single one of us will be able to ignore an ignorant bastard like AFDave all at the same time.

I think he counts on that very likelihood to continue receiving the attention he so desperately craves.

Quote (Louis @ Jan. 14 2007,12:01)


Could you translate that into Yank?  What the #### is an "eggy"?

Ved, thank you for sharing.  I believe the girls are feeling a bit better since that might move things back towards normal.

Date: 2007/01/14 16:04:57, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Louis @ Jan. 14 2007,14:44)

An "eggy" is a childish, twee, and thoroughly annoying word that a vile subspecies of the British middle class who read the "Daily Mail" seem to think is an endearing way of describing an egg.

They deserve death by serial bison buggery. And that's just for reading the "Daily Mail".


Ack.  We'll take the creationists back, if you agree to keep that over there.

But I think video of the serial bison buggery should go up on YouTube, don't be stingy!

Date: 2007/01/14 21:32:30, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Louis @ Jan. 14 2007,14:37)

I did that once. How do you think I met my wife?


Adds a new meaning to the phrase "trolling for chicks", doesn't it?

Date: 2007/01/16 17:50:23, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Kristine @ Jan. 16 2007,16:57)
Kristine is a foul mouthed, tone lowering, hip shaker who's much worse than Joe G.

Now that's more like it. :p

The only thing keeping Kate from stooping to Joe's level and giving him a permanent stoop is Janie.  Janie wants her to finish the porn story first.

He needs to back up off Kristine for his own good.


Date: 2007/01/18 19:58:46, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Richardthughes @ Jan. 18 2007,16:29)
Boo! just as it was kicking into overtard, the comments broke on UD. Get "I can write code flawlessly but need Lou FCD / Janiebelle's help to add an avatar" DaveTard to write a patch, pronto!

*edit* Fixed - GREAT WORK, DAVETARD.

That was soooo funny from here, Rich.  I had to explain it to him like three times, why I wanted him to do it (it was his spoof that prompted me to do it in the first place, no less), and then a few more times how to do it, and then once more explain it to him that it would only work if he did what I told him to do in the first damned place.

Software engineer my ass.  He stuck the Dells in the box and taped them closed.  I doubt they even let him stick the mailing labels on.

Date: 2007/01/23 19:49:14, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (BWE @ Jan. 19 2007,12:13)
Quote (ke @ a,a)
I’d rather have a great meal and sex,
Duh. Who wouldn't? :)

Me.  I'd rather have a meal and great sex.

But that's just me.

...and the girls, so I guess that's just us.

Date: 2007/01/26 05:44:09, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (2ndclass @ Jan. 25 2007,12:02)
In spite of the evidence for it, I'm having a hard time believing that Kazmer is for real.  Has anyone seen him and Lou FCD in the same place at the same time?  No?  According to my Super Premium Explanatory Filter, this proves that Kazmer was designed by Lou.

Not mine.


Actually the girls have been keeping me busy writing smut.

I wasn't going to pimp the girls' blogs about this here, but since you brought it up...

Check out The Itch by Janie and Quiet The Hum by Kate.

Just so y'know.

Date: 2007/01/26 06:01:44, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I brought this up in the UD thread, but I guess it really belongs over here.

The girls have been doing some Definitely Not Safe For Work creative writing.  (i.e. smut - Kate tends to be a little more graphic - just so y'know)

The Itch, Part The First by JanieBelle

Quiet The Hum, Part One by Kate

Same story, each one telling it from their point of view.


Date: 2007/01/26 10:39:21, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (slpage @ Jan. 26 2007,09:31)
I suspected that he was not in a combat arms unit when he mocked me for being a paratrooper - the wannabe effect and all that...

Yep.  He was a nasty dirty leg that smelled like goat.

In the rear with the gear, as it were.

Date: 2007/01/27 21:19:24, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Richardthughes @ Jan. 26 2007,22:51)
When do we get the movie version?  :p

As soon as you guys all kick in for some stand in models...


I'm just the writer, who wants to do the casting?

Date: 2007/01/29 07:53:23, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Just make sure to forward the video of the sessions.

As the creator and writer, I really should at least get the final Ok, y'know.


Date: 2007/01/29 07:58:30, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Altabin @ Jan. 28 2007,15:04)
Every time I think I'm out, they pull me back in again.

It's like crack that way, ain't it?

Date: 2007/01/29 08:17:34, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Kristine @ Jan. 28 2007,21:02)
Well, I'll say it anyway: I knew those dudes were weird about women. I told you so. Heh. :D

Well any dude that bans Janie just ain't right.

That's all I'm gonna say 'bout dat.


Date: 2007/01/30 11:14:11, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Louis @ Jan. 29 2007,09:05)
...all I'm saying is that I have to regularly smack myself about the head and neck with my conscience and marriage certificate to prevent me doing it.


Louis, I am totally there.  In fact, I'm thinking of having a copy of my marriage certificate mounted on an iron skillet, just to be sure to drive the point home some nights.


Hmmm.. I'm thinking my wife might be tempted to use it on me occasionally though, so maybe not such a good idea.

Date: 2007/01/30 11:23:05, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Kristine @ Jan. 30 2007,10:00)
I was not created from Lou's rib, okay?:D

Not that there's anything wrong with that...

(Unless it's the one I broke a few years ago.  It never healed right, and it sort of sticks out about an inch.  I can make it move, and the kids call it my "Alien".)

Quote (Louis @ Jan. 30 2007,11:09)
{Irish voice, rather like that of a curious Craggy Islander asking Father Ted about a film called "The Passion of St Tibulus" or something like that}

Excuse me, Father. Would those be the nudey type of photos, Father? Ah we all like them nudey type of photos , Father.

{/Irish voice, rather like that of a curious Craggy Islander asking Father Ted about a film called "The Passion of St Tibulus" or something like that}

Interesting that you bring up confessions, considering the stories the girls have been writing...

Is there something on your mind, Louis?

Date: 2007/02/02 18:17:59, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I come here with my hat in my hand, asking for all of your assistance.

The girls have been internally de-listed by WordPress on a whim, and can no longer be found on WordPress' category pages or even via the opt-in only Friend Surfer built into WordPress.  It's a service that lists recent posts by bloggers specifically selected by the user.

They are being censored, and I need to cause as much of a stink as I can to get them re-listed.

The supposed reason, as stated by WP support by email (after Janie asked - no notice before that)

Quote (Mark from WP @ February 2, 2007, 11:12 AM)
Your blog contains material that is not suitable for a younger audience, people who may be using their work computer and people who do not wish to read about such adult topics.

Yet other similarly themed blogs remain listed.

Janie has posted several times about what is going on, as has Kate, and as have I (though my blog has not been de-listed).

Censorship At WordPress

This is the first of several posts about it.

Unfortunately, since other WordPress bloggers will not see their posts listed, the girls have been effectively silenced and can't even stand up for themselves.

A fellow blogger has come to their defense, starting a new blog called "Censor This" with an URL of "".  The blogger (Joseph McCarthy) posts about the Terms of Service, and how the girls violated none of them, and then posts an open letter and emails WordPress Support.

Censor This

I'm asking each of their fans to comment on UDoJ, KissingCorporalKate, CrowdedHead, and/or Censor This and express your support.

Also, an email to Wordpress support at would help.  Perhaps if WP is deluged with protests, the girls will be re-listed.

Thank you for your support.

Date: 2007/02/03 11:57:30, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Bounced to The Bathroom Wall.

I'm a little busy, the girls having been de-listed by some jerk at WordPress, but I'm sure I can come up with something devious later....


Date: 2007/02/03 18:51:29, Link
Author: Lou FCD
In the ongoing saga, Mark (the apparent head of WordPress' McCarthy Censorship Board) has now de-listed my blog.

Not for "mature content" - there is none.

But for bitching about his treatment of the girls.

Censorship worthy of a Bush Administration appointee.

I now officially retract all the good things I have ever said about WordPress.

Date: 2007/02/04 13:25:08, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Richardthughes @ Feb. 04 2007,12:28)
Don't forget the hard sci-fi.

Nah, too easy.  I'll just let that one go by, Rich.


Does give me an idea for my next bit of story telling, though.


Date: 2007/02/04 13:32:04, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (carlsonjok @ Feb. 03 2007,15:49)
JanieBelle:  Your blog,, is worth $20,323.44

Well isn't that special?  I'm a little broke right now, how do I go about...

Uh-oh.   Kate's giving me the badeye...


That thing's obviously a load of crap.  UD ain't worth a plugged nickel, near as I can tell.

Unless of course they're considering the comedy angle...

Date: 2007/02/04 13:45:26, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Ichthyic @ Feb. 03 2007,21:00)
Your blog contains material that is not suitable for a younger audience, people who may be using their work computer and people who do not wish to read about such adult topics.


Not to mention the large percentage of UDoJ's traffic that came from WordPress' "sex" tag.

These were not people who accidentally stumbled onto our blogs while looking for Disney memorabilia.  

I posted at CHCB this morning with a graphic of my stats showing before, during, and after the uproar, which shows pretty well the effect of WordPress' censoring of my blog which has no "mature content" on it at all, but where I was posting about my displeasure with the censorship policy as enforced on UDoJ.

I understand that it's their site, but if you're going to advertise yourself as a place where you "strongly support the freedom to publish" and all that free speech stuff, it's rather disingenuous of you to be doing it while selectively censoring blogs from the view of that community.

Date: 2007/02/04 13:55:56, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (BWE @ Feb. 04 2007,13:33)
Quote (Richardthughes @ Feb. 04 2007,12:28)
Don't forget the hard sci-fi.

That's hard-core sci-fi, right?

There you go lou, fodder right there.

Well, if you insist...

Quote (StarVixens vs the Tards @ stardate 94371.6)
DaveTard struggled to free himself, but the force field wouldn't give.  Sweat trickled from his naked body although the temperature on board was an ever constant 18 C.

The click of Kate's boot heels on the steel decking echoed through the halls of the ship, and as she raised the laser whip for the first blow, Janie's voice cracked over the com.

"Kate, get up here!  It's the Starship Dumbskass, and she's closing fast!  I need you at weps!"

Kate's eyes narrowed at DaveTard.  "Don't go away."

Date: 2007/02/04 14:24:23, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Bing @ Feb. 04 2007,14:17)
Sweat trickled from his naked body although....
I normally hate to interfere with the creative process, but don't you think it would be more realistic to say something like?

Sweat trickled into the folds of his pale soft skin; folds created by an avoidance of actual work and his consumption of bags of Cheezy Poofs to numerous to count.  The smell of intertrigo hung heavy in the air.

It was a first draft.

Date: 2007/02/05 06:29:38, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Kristine @ Feb. 04 2007,18:27)
"Kate, get up here!  It's the Starship Dumbskass, and she's closing fast!  I need you at weps!"

Kate's eyes narrowed at DaveTard.  "Don't go away."

Oh, come hither, Starship Dumbskass. Thaaat's right. Come to Kristine. ;)

I'm in this story, right? (In between slaving over my schoolwork? *Rattles chains*) :)


You'll spoil the ending!

Maybe we could take a poll of who should be in the story.

Date: 2007/02/05 06:55:34, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Ichthyic @ Feb. 04 2007,18:21)
which has no "mature content" on it at all


well, after reading that story with the "twins" and the good father, I didn't need to buy a copy of Penthouse forums, that's for sure.

Glad I could save you a couple bucks.


Quote (Ichthyic @ Feb. 04 2007,18:21)

but of course, it's entirely beside the point as to why you were detagged to begin with.

looks like you are making a little headway though; back on the "friends" list thing, right?

A little bit of headway.  A small victory, but a victory.

Quote (Ichthyic @ Feb. 04 2007,18:21)


oh, wait, you were talking about the other blog; the one with your name on it.


Right.  Sorry, I should have been more clear.  The only way I can keep things straight is to really think of the girls as separate people, and their blogs as "Janie's blog" and "Kate's blog", so CHCB is "my blog".

The line is pretty fuzzy sometimes.  You might find this example pretty enlightening.

Quote (Ichthyic @ Feb. 04 2007,18:21)

yeah, obviously the reason he detagged you there was because he saw it as simply a challenge to his authoritah.

I'm glad my coffee was on the desk when I read that.

Y'know, I've been referring to The McCarthy Censorship Board, but now I think I'll start calling it The McCartman Censorship Board.

Date: 2007/02/05 07:59:16, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I soooo did not ever need to see that picture, Fractatious.

Nightmares tonight, I'm sure.

Date: 2007/02/05 10:36:28, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I’ve been reading Scott Adams’s blog daily for over a year, and he does not come off to me as someone who is biased in favor ID. He seems to be the opposite to some degree. But Adams seems open to it, if that’s where the evidence leads.

(emphasis mine)

I think we're all open to it, "if that's where the evidence leads".

That's the rub, bub.  That's not where the evidence leads.

Date: 2007/02/06 07:38:46, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (jujuquisp @ Feb. 06 2007,06:28)
Can anyone here decipher O'Leary's newest post at UD?
6 February 2007
O’Leary remains skeptical: Does Richard Dawkins really exist?

I cannot figure out what the f*ck she is getting at or what her point is.  I've been up all night, so that might be part of the problem.  Is it supposed to be lightly comedic?  Is it supposed to be a witty satire?  Is it a violent verbal assault?  What is it?  What does it mean?  Do I need to ingest shrooms to understand it?

That ain't terribly unusual, juju.  Half the time I think she doesn't even know her own point.

She is without exception the single worst "writer" on the planet.  She's a journalist about the same way Larry's a lawyer or Dembski's "The Isaac Newton of Information Theory".

Just scratch your head and laugh.

Date: 2007/02/07 06:21:34, Link
Author: Lou FCD

From the girls:

Our Dearest RichTard,

Congratulations.  We are impressed and humbled by your manliness.  The pheromones are wafting all the way through teh interwebs, and we now have an uncontrollable hum.

At this moment, we can think of nothing but spending eternity serving your every desire in Heaven The Intelligent Designer's Workshop.  We are much better than 70 virgins any day.

Just so y'know.

Please take a moment out of your busy schedule of taking over the world and smashing Darwinoids to come and visit us.



P.S.  Unzip your fly before you come over.

Date: 2007/02/07 06:51:08, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Ichthyic @ Feb. 06 2007,19:22)
didn't we have someone volunteering for dangerous undercover assignments a little while back?

...or ask Lou to do it.

Hey.  I only have two hands with which to type (sometimes one).

I'm currently tied up (that damned Kate!;) with fighting an evil empire and writing Sci-Fi smut.

You'll have to make an appointment.  Have your peeps call my peeps, we'll do lunch.


Date: 2007/02/12 13:42:18, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (J-Dog @ Feb. 12 2007,12:44)
Send $29. 95 now for these and many other answers to YOUR questions!  Act now and receive absolutely FREE your guaranteed angel wings!  Just glue angel wings to your back, jump off the grand canyon walls, and you will see The Lord!

Thanks, but we've got our wings already.  Funny though, where we got them, they came with a complimentary set of horns...

Date: 2007/02/12 15:20:54, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I guess this is as good a spot as any for this.

I found a YouTube version of this at The Bronze Blog, it's a very very cool animation of some biologicamal cells and crap.  But the original flash version at Studio Daily is much higher quality (kinda big, but do it anyway):

Cellular Visions: The Inner Life of a Cell

Worth your time this Darwin Day.

Date: 2007/02/12 15:34:41, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Richardthughes @ Feb. 12 2007,15:21)

They forgot the part where all the teenagers are fortyish copy/pasters from UD.

Date: 2007/02/12 16:32:30, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Richardthughes @ Feb. 12 2007,16:26)

Darwin and his worshippers will burn in ####...

And I will laugh at them for all eternity as they scream in horror and pain like the stupid ape wannabes they are...

When their religion collapses for all the dumb sheep to see. Their atheist and evolutionist overlords will deserve social, economic and legal destruction for the soul-destroying lies they perpetrated.


It's all about the science, baby!

Date: 2007/02/12 17:57:04, Link
Author: Lou FCD
It's that whole "Tsunami Of Ignorance" thing he has going on.

Date: 2007/02/12 18:11:45, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Y'know every time I see the two of you in one thread I consider changing my name to "Occam's AssHair Remover".

Would that be over the top?


Date: 2007/02/12 18:21:50, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (stevestory @ Feb. 12 2007,18:17)
Sigh. Why the f$%& do I even go to work? We know the tard-talk just as good or better than Salvador or Casey. Why haven't we started unlocking shareholder value here? Why aren't we renting video cameras, filming a few of the nitwits who got PhDs yet still believe in gibberish, putting trailers up on YouTube, emailing churches about how our DVD shows that science proves the bible, etc?

Because we're lazy, that's why.

Y'know, I was kinda hopin' it was a moral thing...

Then I remembered that we can't have morals without God The Intelijunt Deziner.

Date: 2007/02/13 06:09:13, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Hey!  Who knew DaveTard was into gay S&M?

From Alan Fox's Crib:
The TardMaster General said:


Translation -

"I came, I saw, I conquered Homos."  In that order?

(What comma?  I didn't see no stinkin' comma!)

Sounds like Davey's finally out of the closet.  Funny how the biggest bigots against homosexuality are themselves homosexual.

Haggard and Dave Tard sittin' in a tree,
F - U - C...

Ok, I'll stop there.  I haven't the faintest clue what he was on about with the high school Latin thing, I just got a really good chuckle from that last night, and wanted to share.

Date: 2007/02/13 06:24:52, Link
Author: Lou FCD

Janie aims her Binford 3000 nuclear powered laser AntiTard Cannon directly at UD...

...and fires.

I guess you could call this one "hard sci-fi".  :D


Date: 2007/02/13 12:41:40, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Richardthughes @ Feb. 13 2007,10:07)
Dave is getting a slap down from the regulars. Here comes the binge eating again..

I hear stock in Cheesy Poofs just went through the roof...

Date: 2007/02/13 12:45:37, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Kristine @ Feb. 13 2007,10:42)
So, if God farts in the forest, but there is no one there to hear, does it make a sound?  Does it still smell?  And how many #### angles CAN dance on the head of a pin?  These, my friends, are the eternal questions that The Science Of ID can answer!

In the beginning was the word. And the word was with God. And the word was, “Wasn’tme!”

And then God created the heavens and the earth to blame it on.

Thank you. I’ll take my Templeton Foundation $$ now. So fork it over. :)

####.  I thought it was just dogs God created to blame it on.

I gotta think bigger.

Date: 2007/02/13 12:52:23, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I have to believe with this crowd that somebody here has the potential to win the Skepchicks' "Combine Darwin and Valentine and Submit a Pick-up Line" contest.

Contest Page

Date: 2007/02/13 13:46:04, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (carlsonjok @ Feb. 13 2007,13:32)
Quote (J-Dog @ Feb. 13 2007,13:25)
So.... Is this... The Worst Day Ever To Be DaveTard?

I don't even want to speculate, however I would note that:

 5.  The Day he predicted Victory in Dover.

is immortalized in the Epilogue of "Monkey Girl."  So, in addition to being enshrined in the Patent Office, he is now immortalized in the Library of Congress.

Anyone taking bets on how often that gets mentioned in his list of self aggrandizing accomplishments?

Date: 2007/02/13 14:37:47, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Arden Chatfield @ Feb. 13 2007,14:05)
I can't believe you guys are picking candidates for Dave's Worst Day and you've all forgotten the day he fell for the ACLU/Marine Corps urban legend. Hang your heads in shame.

J-Dog hit that in the original list on the last page, Arden.

Pay attention or find yourself on the end of my boot, Homo -dt

Date: 2007/02/16 06:53:22, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (stevestory @ Feb. 15 2007,21:14)
PZ kicks the crap out of Jonathan Moonie. I mean Jonathan Wells.

Thanks for pointing that out, Steve.  I've been rather busy, and sick (a depressing combination), and hadn't been doing a lot of visiting to other blogs (or even AtBC) the last week or so.

I'm afraid I would have missed that, which would have been a shame.

In the process of destroying Wells' strawman, PZ really goes to town on some fascinating stuff about developmental biology and embryology and several other ologies.

I can't even tell you how many times I had heard the term "gill slits" and until PZ's article had no idea how that whole thing worked.

Seriously good science education going on there for me.

Date: 2007/02/17 18:14:58, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Ichthyic @ Feb. 17 2007,16:35)
sounds like a most excellent day.

can i skip the mullet, though?

Sorry, Ich.  I'm pretty sure that's specified as a requirement in the handbook.


Date: 2007/02/20 19:50:49, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Kristine @ Feb. 20 2007,13:20)
The cosmos ain't big enough for the two of 'em. (Go here first.)  :D

Me: How many cheesypoofs can DaveTard eat in a day?
God: More than you can imagine.

You heard it here first.

Date: 2007/02/22 18:12:14, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (k.e @ Feb. 22 2007,17:49)
DT- take a pill, your stupidity is expanding the tardi-verse

Simply classic.

Date: 2007/02/24 14:16:43, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (wintermute @ Feb. 23 2007,14:35)
OK, I've fixed a couple of bugs (quotation marks or apostrophes in the poster's name would break it; if the final comment was by a moderator, it wouldn't get the link), so those of you who have been kind enough to be early adopters ought to update.

If anyone finds anything they think could improve it, please let me know.

LOVE the "Tard alert"!

Date: 2007/02/24 14:36:35, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Random Tard Test:

Michaels7 is a tard  

Mozart and Tyson are both evidence of nuture, or lackof nurture. Love, training, caring, forming a mind into a virtuoso and composer, or a killing machine and helpless man needing others to manage him.
Our minds are filters of information. Given bad input, we drift into more bad areas of input, falling into darker areas. It is rare the individuals who can overcome such bad lives.
America happens to be one of the best places for people born in failed areas to overcome and start new lives. This does not happen in closed societies like the old Soviet Union of conformist ideologies, where challenging status quo is not allowed under any circumstances. This is why Cuba, Russia and for a long time China turned out rubbish.
Jack Krebs would have our public schools teach robots and conformist ideology in biology. Instead of opening their minds and allowing healthy debate on real issues.

If this had been an actual Tard...

Oh wait.

Date: 2007/02/25 15:56:30, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Occam's Toothbrush @ Feb. 25 2007,10:38)

Perhaps too much "E" would indeed explain that Christian rapper guy that was floating around UD a while back.  GAWD he was awful.


Date: 2007/02/26 06:55:39, Link
Author: Lou FCD
DO'L foams at the mouth

Quote (DO'L 2006 Winner of The World's Worst Writer Award @ 26 February 2007)
The new “anti-God” crusade: Further evidence of materialism’s failure?

O’Leary looks at the spate of anti-God books and other promotions for the new Church of Atheism, and suspects that atheism was way more fun in the days when it was just a quiet, Godless Sunday at home.

The world's biggest hack refers to herself in the third person (it's so creepy when she does that), and begins to rant about ID vs. Atheism.

Once again we see that ID is all about the science.

She writes a series of sub-headlines, then a few sentences for each that basically just all say "Atheism bad, God good" without even so much as an attempt at backing up a single statement.

I guess we're all just supposed to smack our foreheads in a moment of epiphany and say "WOW!  I guess science sucks because the Witless Wonder said so!"

It really does just boil down to her conclusion:

Put another way: Once you do think that materialism is not true, Darwinism is not true either. That raises the question of why any clergy should feel the need to sell “evolution” to their congregations, as part of their ministry.

Yes, once you've closed your mind and started out with the conclusion, there's really no need to think any further about it, so STOP DOING IT!

Date: 2007/02/26 06:59:09, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Stephen Elliott @ Feb. 24 2007,19:55)
That is not an action that I would use. Main reason being, it would involve me having to lie. That is not an option that I am willing to do.

Stephen, it's only a lie if you don't really have the pentagram, candles, and chicken.

Just a thought.


Date: 2007/02/26 07:04:30, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote ("Rev Dr" Lenny Flank @ Feb. 25 2007,16:03)
I had him for years, fed him, cleaned him, cared for him like a child -- and he still bit me every chance he had.

Sounds like my kids.

Just sayin'.


Date: 2007/02/26 08:12:48, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Occam's Toothbrush @ Feb. 26 2007,08:09)
I think there's more to D'OH!'s post than you realize.  I applied my handy Explanatardy Filtard to this passage and found an intriguing pattern:
The new “Anti-God” cRusaDe: FurTher evidence of mAteRialism’s failure?

O’Leary looks at the spate of anti-GoD books and oTher promotions for the new Church of Atheism, and suspects that atheism was way moRe fun in the Days when it was just a quiet, Godless Sunday at home.

Coincidence?  I think not.

I gotta get me one o' them.  Who knew she was so full of depth?

Ok, I couldn't even type that with a straight face.


Date: 2007/02/26 19:38:18, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (stevestory @ Feb. 26 2007,17:47)
Denyse O'Leary says evolutionary psychology is bunk because...

...a bunny rabbit chased a snake up a tree.

No I'm not kidding.

Y'know, I thought I'd point and laugh at this one, but when my jaw dropped, no sound came out.

as in "Jaw-droppingly Stupid".

I gotta go with Steve on this.  300 million people, and this is the cream of the crop?

Think about that.  THREE HUNDRED MILLION PEOPLE, and this is the best they can do.

Date: 2007/02/26 19:48:57, Link
Author: Lou FCD
And the Tard flows freely

People who argue specifically against ID are ID friendly.

My head hurts.

Date: 2007/02/26 20:07:39, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Reciprocating Bill @ Feb. 26 2007,19:51)
Quote (Lou FCD @ Feb. 26 2007,19:38)
Quote (stevestory @ Feb. 26 2007,17:47)
Denyse O'Leary says evolutionary psychology is bunk because...

...a bunny rabbit chased a snake up a tree.

No I'm not kidding.

Y'know, I thought I'd point and laugh at this one, but when my jaw dropped, no sound came out.

as in "Jaw-droppingly Stupid".

I gotta go with Steve on this.  300 million people, and this is the cream of the crop?

Think about that.  THREE HUNDRED MILLION PEOPLE, and this is the best they can do.

300 million people and they they had to go to Canada to find her.

Good point.  I was blinded by the Tard.

Doesn't say much for their American supporters (all 12 of them left) though, does it?

Date: 2007/03/02 17:29:02, Link
Author: Lou FCD

I just went exploring there at Fundipedia myself.


Something pretty funny I found

Date: 2007/03/02 17:31:57, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I thought we were on "Criticisms of Evolution" now.


Date: 2007/03/02 20:30:29, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (argystokes @ Mar. 02 2007,20:10)
Funniest post on OE yet.

I'll withhold further comment.

bob obviously doesn't read UD.

Date: 2007/03/03 15:12:27, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Reciprocating Bill @ Mar. 03 2007,12:53)
Does this really fit?  I mean, DS is much larger on the outside than he is on the inside.  And his chameleon circuit is clearly working.

So he's an inside-out TARDIS.

Does that make him a DISTARD?

Date: 2007/03/03 15:15:50, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Zachriel @ Mar. 03 2007,14:18)
Observation-> hypothesis-> testing-> inference. It is as sound as any ’science’ the NDE offers.

ID takes the data, looks at the options, compares the data to those options and makes the best inference accordingly.

Look closely. ID takes observation and infers, but fails to propose testable hypotheses, much less actually subject them to falsifiable tests. According to Joseph, ID fails to conform to the scientific method.

Holy Crap, Zachriel.

That boy Joseph picks up a hammer, aims it squarely at the ToE, and smacks himself right in the head with it.


Date: 2007/03/03 18:23:45, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (keiths @ Mar. 03 2007,16:33)
I hate to say this, but I don't think you love Bill any more.

Bite your tongue!

That would totally wreck the plot of Janie's story!

Date: 2007/03/03 18:27:41, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote ("Rev Dr" Lenny Flank @ Mar. 03 2007,17:23)
The alternative would be for the angry white fundie nutters to seize power undemocratically, without elections.  I do not dismiss that possibility.  Indeed, I think open fascism in the US (as compared to the fig-leaf fascism that we've recently had under Republicrat single-party rule) is a very real option.

And that sir, scares the shit out of me.

It is a very real option for them.

Date: 2007/03/04 06:50:09, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Speaking of the Harpy...

The latest slime to ooze from her pig-pleaser:

“I was going to have a few comments on the other Democratic presidential candidate, John Edwards, but it turns out that you have to go into rehab if you use the word ‘faggot,’ so I’m - so, kind of at an impasse, can’t really talk about Edwards, so I think I’ll just conclude here and take your questions,” said Coulter, whose comment was followed by applause.

Seems to me she's a fine and accurate spokesperson for the right.

Date: 2007/03/04 10:06:28, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Linked from the evolution article at Fundipedia, a whole passel of quoteminey goodness at CreationWiki.

Lots of fun.

Date: 2007/03/04 14:51:40, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (stevestory @ Mar. 04 2007,11:54)
Quote (O'Tardy @ March 4 2007)
Not only did ID not die out after various court cases in the United States, but it is now pretty much an international thing - contrary to many predictions.

"Yes, now it's an international thing!  It's a thing all over the world, like in Turkey!  And that one little country in Europe!  It's a thing there, too!"

Journalist my ass.

Quote (stevestory @ Mar. 04 2007,11:54)
Quote (O'Tardy @ March 4 2007)
It is no accident that so many of the ID guys are in math, information sciences, and biochemistry, bioinformatics, etc.

I don't doubt that for a second.

Date: 2007/03/04 18:05:56, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (skeptic @ Mar. 04 2007,17:31)
namely that you're the only smart people in the room and the only voices that deserve to be heard.

Standing in a room with you and Coulter, that's a pretty fair statement.

Date: 2007/03/05 10:21:50, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Jake @ Mar. 05 2007,08:28)
(I don't go to UD much anymore, it seems to have degenerated a lot recently).

Just when you thought it couldn't get any tardier...

Date: 2007/03/07 05:50:27, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote ("Rev Dr" Lenny Flank @ Mar. 06 2007,18:01)
I don't care what y'all say --- I'd still do her.  She'd be a bleeding-heart liberal within a week, and be quoting Herr Doktor Marx within two weeks.

Ever heard of a "bedroom conversion" . . . . . . ?


Jebus H, Rev.   Talk about taking one for the team...

Date: 2007/03/07 11:40:55, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote ("Rev Dr" Lenny Flank @ Mar. 07 2007,07:00)
Quote (Lou FCD @ Mar. 07 2007,05:50)
Quote ("Rev Dr" Lenny Flank @ Mar. 06 2007,18:01)
I don't care what y'all say --- I'd still do her.  She'd be a bleeding-heart liberal within a week, and be quoting Herr Doktor Marx within two weeks.

Ever heard of a "bedroom conversion" . . . . . . ?


Jebus H, Rev.   Talk about taking one for the team...

Buy me lots of beers, and I'd take on Denyse, too.

LOTS of beers.



That is just wrong on so many levels...

I could never, not in a million years, in good (or even bad) conscience ask you to do that, so to speak.

Date: 2007/03/07 11:43:58, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (k.e @ Mar. 07 2007,06:39)
Quote (Lou FCD @ Mar. 07 2007,13:50)
Quote ("Rev Dr" Lenny Flank @ Mar. 06 2007,18:01)
I don't care what y'all say --- I'd still do her.  She'd be a bleeding-heart liberal within a week, and be quoting Herr Doktor Marx within two weeks.

Ever heard of a "bedroom conversion" . . . . . . ?


Jebus H, Rev.   Talk about taking one for the team...

Aw come on Lou, you of all people.

WWJD with DT? <snicker>

Hey, we may be easy, but even we have some standards!

EDIT TO ADD:  Kate just stormed out yelling.  I didn't catch it all, but it had something to do with plane tickets, kangaroos, forehead tattoos and the end of her boot.

You might want to consider an emergency vacation to Siberia or something.


Date: 2007/03/07 16:55:59, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Steverino @ Mar. 07 2007,14:04)
One has to remember, Coulter is professional pundit.  She has to keep her name in the press or be forgotten.

There are so many right-wing pundits competing for time on the Faux News channel that unless she distinguishes herself from the mealy pack, she will fall by the way side.  So,it’s to her benefit to open that pie hole sitting upon her Ichabod Crane body and spew forth her wisdom.

On the plus side, she is polarizing.  She is one of those people that you either love or hate...and those who hate her, will never be convinced to like her or be moved to accept her position.

She is what Dice Clay would have called, a Snapper-head.

Quote (Arden Chatfield @ Mar. 07 2007,15:00)
I agree. The market for loudmouth rightwing crazies is so glutted in America now, that for one to stay financially viable, one has to continually crank up the nuttiness to higher and higher levels. It's essentially become a game of out-crazying all your rivals, since if you fall behind there are SO MANY others to take your place in an instant. So basically, the sky's the limit for wingnut rhetoric.

The penultimate frontier was explicitly calling all liberals homosexuals. The final frontier was calling for liberals and non-Christians to be killed. Both of these limits were reached and breached some time ago. They're now common place.

Exactly.  And perfect imagery, Steverino.  Snapper-head with pie hole sitting upon her Ichabod Crane body indeed.

Quote (Stephen Elliott @ Posted on Mar. 07 2007,14:18)
Go on. I double dog dare you. I demand photographic evidence though. Should you succeed I will buy you a copious amount of really good beer in the British pub of your choice.

I hereby nominate you to inspect the evidence.  I doubt many others (including myself) would have the stomach for it.  Let us all know how that works out.  I'm willing to chip in for the brew.


Date: 2007/03/07 17:05:56, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Arden Chatfield @ Mar. 07 2007,14:52)
Okay, let's run down the Tard Checklist, shall we?

1) tard - check
2) tard - check
3) tard - check
4) tard - check
5) tard - check
6) tard - check
7) tard - check
8) tard - check
9) tard - check
10) tard - check
11) tard - check
12) tard - check
13) tard - check
14) tard - check
15) tard - check
16) tard - check
17) tard - check
18) tard - check
19) tard - check

and finally, the money shot:

20) tard - check

DANG, this Doug guy is GOOD.

Yeah, but he forgot Newton and Einstein.  If it were one of us, we would NEVER have forgotten that!

Date: 2007/03/07 18:31:48, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Joyfully Ignorant @ Telic but Thoughtless)
It takes our processors awhile to forward-feed the product to consciousness. IOW, there's a real-time delay, and I attribute this to the processing functions. They're really fast, but not instantaneous (beyond global entanglement of the processors themselves). Cross-connections and analysis using biochemical triggers proceeds in nanoseconds, but that includes further subprocessing).

Translation of equal scientific value:

The gene expression of the boxnard of lictberger poof themselves into existential premonitive horse bologna by circumscribing the poofiness of the tardmongering xprlegefargs.  IOW Einstein and Newton firmly belugavate the asparagus roots by equations of semiconductor states, but frakkenfeld their motorized follicles in nanometric Schroedinger Time.

Date: 2007/03/07 21:02:44, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (J-Dog @ Mar. 07 2007,19:23)
Quote ("Rev Dr" Lenny Flank @ Mar. 07 2007,18:05)
Well, SOMEBODY would have to.  After all, I'd be too bloody drunk to remember any of it.    

Heck, I'd probably be too bloody drunk to . . . well . . . ya know . . . anyway.    :)

It's just nature's way of protecting you from yourself...

Geez, I'd hate to ponder the reason for that evolutionary advantage!

J-Dog, is this the reason your commercials never show your sistren?


Date: 2007/03/07 21:09:56, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Glen Davidson @ Mar. 07 2007,20:18)
something that Denyse is at least able to put into some decent prose.

Now you're just being patronizing.

Denyse couldn't write her way out of kindergarten if you gave her a box of 64 crayolas and filled in all the blanks for her.

Date: 2007/03/08 07:34:47, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (k.e @ Mar. 07 2007,22:29)
Should we slow down for a Tard stop?

Date: 2007/03/08 08:25:58, Link
Author: Lou FCD
No. Infinite regression is a cop-out. It is closely akin to circular reasoning, except that the line of reasoning is not so much a circle as a spiral, into the infinite past or at least through an infinite number of prior steps. For example: How did life originate on earth? It didn't--it couldn't have. So where did it come from? Did God create it? No--no God-talk in scientific circles. (Francis H. Crick once wrote a nasty letter to Winston Churchill suggesting that a brothel would be just as appropriate as a chapel at Oxford University.) Therefore, life was deposited on earth from the outside. How? By a ballistic missile or a comet's tail. Where did that life come from? From another planet. But how did life arise on that other planet? It didn't--couldn't have--too much information. Did God create life on that other planet? Oh, no. Therefore life was deposited on that planet as well. Where did that life come from? From another ballistic missile. And so on, and so on, for an infinite number of steps.

Am I the only one who recognizes such a line of reasoning as absurd? And not merely absurd, but self-serving of the interests of those seeking to deny God's existence and His role as Creator. It is a very travesty of logic, and that is why I sought to classify it as a logical fallacy.

Why, then, is it not a logical fallacy? Can an infinite regression ever exist in nature? I'm waiting for the evidence.--TerryH 23:40, 6 March 2007 (EST)

Is infinite regression ever valid

Which I happened across by clicking from the subheading two below Special Pleading on the logical fallacy page.

The irony is strong with this one, my Master.

Date: 2007/03/08 08:41:50, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Well that's us, always lookin' out for the little defenseless guy.

Besides, I think Spokane County has laws against canned trophy hunts.


If it's ok, the girls would like a cucumber with the banana.  We're not in Alabama, so it's legal here.

Date: 2007/03/08 08:51:43, Link
Author: Lou FCD
hubba hubba!

Nice addition for International Women's Day!

Date: 2007/03/09 18:35:20, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Skeptic should be ass raped by a large farm animal.

I don't really mean that, I just wanted "to piss you off and satisfy that segment on my side that is also pissed off.  IMO, it's all about emotion."

I suppose I've made my point?

Date: 2007/03/10 16:17:54, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (GCT @ Mar. 09 2007,21:28)
Quote (Lou FCD @ Mar. 09 2007,19:35)
Skeptic should be ass raped by a large farm animal.

I don't really mean that, I just wanted "to piss you off and satisfy that segment on my side that is also pissed off.  IMO, it's all about emotion."

I suppose I've made my point?



And yet,

Quote (Bricks4Brains @ immediately thereafter)
And no, Lou, you didn't make your point because you didn't make any sense.  You didn't piss me off and my involvement with farm animals has no relavance to this or any other discussion.

Pearls before swine, to continue the farm animal imagery.

Date: 2007/03/12 16:30:22, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (stevestory @ Mar. 11 2007,20:37)
I was at the Dead Mule Club today getting liquored up and watching the NC State / UNC game for the ACC championship, (sniparooni of irrelevant-to-this-reply stuff)

Go Pack!

crap.  Goddamned 'Heels.

(Disclaimer:  I am required to be a Pack fan 'cause my cuz went there and I have a State hat.)

Date: 2007/03/12 16:57:12, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (The Ghost of Paley @ Mar. 12 2007,15:08)
Eh....out of time. Will pick up.

Ah, that old familiar tune...

Date: 2007/03/13 17:03:40, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (heddle @ Mar. 13 2007,15:58)
Steve S,

Well, my gut instinct based on the scenario you described is that Mary was a Christian who slid into despair, killed her kids, and committed suicide, and died a Christian. Christians are not immune from depression, mental illness, or committing heinous crimes.

Of course, as with the case with Hitler I couldn't say for sure--nor could I say for sure with anyone I know. I only know that we are supposed to judge, but are not promised that we'll get it right.

Is that the "Maybe a true Scotsman" fallacy?

Date: 2007/03/13 17:52:19, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Arden Chatfield @ Mar. 13 2007,16:40)
Okay, this just clarifies the original thing you said but doesn't address the problems with it. I assume this must be some arcane point of Calvinist theology I've never heard of.

But: Is it therefore your assumption that if a person is a apparently a Christian for the first half of their life, but later in their life either switches to another religion, becomes an atheist, or does some behavior horribly unbecoming of a Christian, then that proves the person was never a Christian to begin with?

Or, is it that they're 'still a Christian' in some way they can't detect, even if they think they're now an atheist or a Muslim? Or is it that no matter what turn they make they're still 'saved'?


Eternal security is a doctrine of most fundy protestantism, not just Calvinism.

One of the things that separates Calvinism from the rest is that God decides if you will be a Christian or not before you're ever born.  (Predestination - The "P" in the TULIP)

So if you get tossed in the #### pile, it doesn't matter what you do or believe, you still get fried.  If you get tossed in with the Christians, it still doesn't matter what you do, you get to go to Heaven.

They just do the verbal tapdance:

"By their works ye shall know them" so if you commit mass murder after having led 80 years of Christian life, it just means you were only faking it all that time.

Perhaps a bit of hyperbole for purposes of illustration, but that's the gist of it.

Date: 2007/03/13 19:54:10, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (heddle @ Mar. 13 2007,17:16)
Lou FCD,

No, predestination is the ‘U’ in TULIP (Unconditional election), not the ‘P’, which is "Perseverance of the Saints,” i.e. eternal security.

Quite right, Heddle.  My mistake, it's been a few years and I never could remember the U and P in that TULIP thing right.

Quote (heddle @ Mar. 13 2007,17:16)
It is not a doctrine of fundamentalists, not universally. Many fundamentalists despise Calvinism, and certainly teach that you can place your salvation at risk if you don’t behave a certain way.

Eternal security most certainly is a characteristic of most fundyism.

There are only a handful of sects that believe in the loss of salvation.  Pentecostals and the other charismatic movement churches, off the top of my head.

It is true that many fundies hate Calvinists with a passion, though.  Easy whippin' boy syndrome.

Quote (heddle @ Mar. 13 2007,17:16)
Needless to say your characterization of Calvinism is wrong—although it does sound exactly how Jimmy Swaggart characterizes it—but this is not the place to defend Calvinism.

I wasn't raised Calvinist for the most part, although I was involved with it for a short time.  My characterization of Calvinism was what I learned from Calvinists in a Calvinist church, so you can take that up with them.

And as far as Swaggart goes, pretty much all the churches I attended growing up, the Christian High School I attended, and Bob Jones U. where I first attended college all called him a liberal apostate right up there with Pat Buchanan and Pat Robertson and Billy Graham.


Date: 2007/03/13 20:05:08, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Kristine @ Mar. 13 2007,18:47)
B'lieve me. Lou knows what I really want to do to the guy. ;)

I'm all over it.  Janie's tied up right at the moment though (figuratively this time) with some research into human trafficking.

Hopefully she'll get back to The Lilith Quotient over the weekend.

Date: 2007/03/14 08:35:16, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (heddle @ Mar. 14 2007,07:28)
I don’t believe you

Don't really care, Heddle.

It is what it is, and once you strip away all the verbal tap dancing, that's what's left.

Date: 2007/03/14 09:43:12, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Calvinists Themselves @ Center for Reformed Theology and Apologetics)
Unconditional Election

Unconditional Election is the doctrine which states that God chose those whom he was pleased to bring to a knowledge of himself, not based upon any merit shown by the object of his grace and not based upon his looking forward to discover who would "accept" the offer of the gospel. God has elected, based solely upon the counsel of his own will, some for glory and others for damnation (Romans 9:15,21). He has done this act before the foundations of the world (Ephesians 1:4-8).

This doctrine does not rule out, however, man's responsibility to believe in the redeeming work of God the Son (John 3:16-18). Scripture presents a tension between God's sovereignty in salvation, and man's responsibility to believe which it does not try to resolve. Both are true -- to deny man's responsibility is to affirm an unbiblical hyper-calvinism; to deny God's sovereignty is to affirm an unbiblical Arminianism.

The elect are saved unto good works (Ephesians 2:10). Thus, though good works will never bridge the gulf between man and God that was formed in the Fall, good works are a result of God's saving grace. This is what Peter means when he admonishes the Christian reader to make his "calling" and "election" sure (2 Peter 1:10). Bearing the fruit of good works is an indication that God has sown seeds of grace in fertile soil.

(My bold.)

Center for Reformed Theology and Apologetics

Date: 2007/03/14 16:59:10, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Kristine @ Mar. 14 2007,12:29)
They reinstated the poetry contest over at UD, didn't they? I can't wait for the Designer to read his work at the poetry slam.

Speaking of which, have you voted in the UDoJ contests yet?

Date: 2007/03/15 06:56:07, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Arden Chatfield @ Mar. 14 2007,22:50)
Quote (Kristine @ Mar. 14 2007,20:05)
Lou and y'all, check out this. JAD is claiming that PZ's taking down the Molly thread so that he can't see it. :D

I see that 'Brainstorms' has devolved into a slow-motion stroke session between Borat Martin and Javison. I was wondering what was up with the senile old fuck these days...

You beat me to it, Arden.

Quote (Richardthughes @ Mar. 14 2007,22:20)

Ha ha Fundies:

I liked this quote from the CNN article:

Quote (FundyWhackJobs @ In a letter to hellbound apostate bastards who won't kneel before DaveTard's global warming expertise)
But Dobson and the other signatories of the letter to the National Association of Evangelicals board said evidence supporting global warming was not conclusive and that the organization "lacks the expertise to settle the controversy."

"The issue should be addressed scientifically and not theologically," they said, calling on the group's board to either rein in Cizik or encourage him to resign.

So something as plain and straightforward as "the temperature is going up, here's a graph" they don't have the expertise to "settle", but when it comes to biology they know more than 150 years worth of research by thousands of biologists.

Talk about picking and choosing!

Am I missing something?

Date: 2007/03/16 11:00:14, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote ("Rev Dr" Lenny Flank @ Mar. 15 2007,20:35)
A history lesson for you -------------->

Why were so many private Christians schools formed in the South after 1954?

Extra credit:  What year did Bob Jones University finally allow blacks as students, and why?

Extra Extra Credit:  What year did BJU finally stop banning interracial dating amongst its students, and why?

I know the answers to all three, but that's sort of unfair.


Date: 2007/03/16 11:09:14, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (k.e @ Mar. 15 2007,21:13)
If this has already been posted please ignore
This is a dazzling debunking of climate change science. It is also wildly wrong

I found this tidbit rather familiar, though I can't quite seem to remember why...

Quote (George Monbiot @ Tuesday November 14, 2006)
The author of this "research article" is Christopher Monckton, otherwise known as Viscount Monckton of Brenchley. He has a degree in classics and a diploma in journalism and, as far as I can tell, no further qualifications. But he is confident enough to maintain that - by contrast to all those charlatans and amateurs who wrote the reports produced by the UN's Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change - he is publishing "the truth".



Date: 2007/03/16 18:07:11, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (BWE @ Mar. 16 2007,12:24)
Let's see...

1) 1954. Wasn't that the year that god commanded the creation of religious schools? It's in the bible.
2) BJU let the first black in the same year that the first black applied for admission.
3)BJU has never allowed dating of any kind.

(Am I close?)

(hint: follow the money)

Date: 2007/03/16 18:11:04, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote ("Rev Dr" Lenny Flank @ Mar. 16 2007,16:56)
I also put out the argument that learning foreign languages was sinful and anti-Biblical, since God specifically created different languages at the Tower of Babel so we humans couldn't all talk to teach other.  Not only were the fundies utterly unable to make any coherent argument against that, but I actually made a convert to my point of view.

They are idiots, all.

Thank you Lenny, that's the best laugh I've had all week.

Date: 2007/05/12 00:06:48, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Henry J @ May 11 2007,22:36)
How would a group blog differ from simply starting threads here on AtBC or the other forums on the AE BB?


It could be sexier.  I happen to know these two girls...


Date: 2007/05/12 00:41:20, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Albatrossity2 @ May 11 2007,16:37)
It's clear that the lights are burning pretty dimly over there.

Every time I visit there, I have Robert Palmer in my head...

"The lights are on,
but you're not home,
Your mind,
is not your own..."

We're gonna have to face it folks, we're addicted to Tard.

Date: 2007/05/12 22:05:55, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Arden Chatfield @ May 12 2007,00:55)
Hey, welcome back Lou!

Thank ye, Arden, thank ye.

I guess I'm back sorta.  Nice to be missed.

The image of Robert Dembski and the Denyse O'DaveTard girls was awesome, RB.  That's the kind of thing I missed about this place... That and Richard Tard Hughes' Dave impressions.

Date: 2007/05/12 22:21:21, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Wesley R. Elsberry @ May 12 2007,20:33)
This is just a test.


Date: 2007/05/12 22:23:27, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Richardthughes @ May 12 2007,22:16)
Quote (Lou FCD @ May 12 2007,22:05)
Quote (Arden Chatfield @ May 12 2007,00:55)
Hey, welcome back Lou!

Thank ye, Arden, thank ye.

I guess I'm back sorta.  Nice to be missed.

The image of Robert Dembski and the Denyse O'DaveTard girls was awesome, RB.  That's the kind of thing I missed about this place... That and Richard Tard Hughes' Dave impressions.



You can please some of the people some of the time, blah blah blah...

Don't make me talk to Kate.

Date: 2007/05/14 13:13:43, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (oldmanintheskydidntdoit @ May 14 2007,12:49)
Larry Fafarman says
It is ironic that after making such a fetish over “peer review” in falsely claiming that there are no peer-reviewed papers about intelligent design, the hypocritical Darwinists would urge the denial of tenure to a pro-ID professor whose number of peer-reviewed papers — 68 — vastly exceeds his university’s benchmark of 15 peer-reviewed papers normally expected of candidates for tenure.

Can anybody spot his deliberate error?

None of his published papers had anything to do with ID?

Date: 2007/05/14 13:28:55, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Lou FCD @ May 14 2007,13:13)
Quote (oldmanintheskydidntdoit @ May 14 2007,12:49)
Larry Fafarman says
It is ironic that after making such a fetish over “peer review” in falsely claiming that there are no peer-reviewed papers about intelligent design, the hypocritical Darwinists would urge the denial of tenure to a pro-ID professor whose number of peer-reviewed papers — 68 — vastly exceeds his university’s benchmark of 15 peer-reviewed papers normally expected of candidates for tenure.

Can anybody spot his deliberate error?

None of his published papers had anything to do with ID?

Also, is that the correct number of papers?  I thought I saw the number 55 bandied about somewhere...

(Not that it makes a huge difference I guess, since the number of published papers is probably not an automatic guarantee of tenure...)

Date: 2007/05/14 14:51:29, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (oldmanintheskydidntdoit @ May 14 2007,13:35)
Quote (Lou FCD @ May 14 2007,13:13)
Quote (oldmanintheskydidntdoit @ May 14 2007,12:49)
Larry Fafarman says
It is ironic that after making such a fetish over “peer review” in falsely claiming that there are no peer-reviewed papers about intelligent design, the hypocritical Darwinists would urge the denial of tenure to a pro-ID professor whose number of peer-reviewed papers — 68 — vastly exceeds his university’s benchmark of 15 peer-reviewed papers normally expected of candidates for tenure.

Can anybody spot his deliberate error?

None of his published papers had anything to do with ID?

yeah, that's what I had. What do we win?  :D

But it's always so much fun playing the "WTF Was Larry Thinking?" game because you're never sure how much of what he says is deliberate misrepresentation and how much is because he's just completely off his nut.

Quote (Tracy P. Hamilton @ May 14 2007,14:02)
Well, I looked up Gonzalez' published record in Web of Science, at least what pops up with Iowa State and Gonzalez, G*

First of all it doesn't matter how many papers you SUBMIT.

What matters is number of papers published since you came to the University, and their quality.

The record is poor.

In reverse chronological order are:

(paper, paper, pretendpaper, maybeapaper, couldbeapaper, paperheprollyhadlittletodowith, paper, yourekiddinright? blah blah)

Total of 18, of which a number would be PhD and post-doc work, some not peer reviewed, some abstracts, some reviews.

Whoa, way more effort than I was willing to put into it - kudos!

Quote (Arden Chatfield @ May 14 2007,14:16)
This discussion probably would work better in the actual Gonzalez thread...

Yeah, probably, but sometimes I just gotta break the rules.


Date: 2007/05/15 15:29:13, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Denialism Blog's post on the subject.

Just thought I'd share.

Date: 2007/05/17 09:44:41, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Louis @ May 17 2007,05:44)
Ask yourself this question: America is not the only religious country on the planet, and certainly not the only one to have its infants exposed to the "soft creationism" you describe in early years. Why then is America the most conspicuous first world nation with such a vocal, politically motivated  Christian creationist antiscience lobby? This problem is almost nonexistent in Europe or Australia, it EXISTS but in no way near the same extent, and if we kick the UK and Australia out of the picture and just focus on continental Europe, it's practically not there at all.


Perhaps it is our lack of collective societal memory of the church's control over politics?  Poor history education?  Arrogance and hubris?

It's an interesting question.  My first impulse was "Too many fundies", but after all is said and done, that's rather circular.  Too many fundies because of too many fundies.

Does it begin all the way back in Plymouth and Jamestown etc. (Europe exporting all the real whack jobs to here), or is it more a reflection of the late 19th / early 20th century fundimoronigelical movement?  If the latter, what caused it to gain such a foothold?

Date: 2007/05/17 11:02:48, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (CNN via Jason Spaceman @ May 17 2007,04:09)
...the Greensboro, North Carolina-based National Council on Bible Curriculum in Public Schools...

Um... by it's very name, this organization exists for the purpose of violating the Constitution.  

I find that interesting.  I wonder how they'd feel and what they'd say about an organization called The National Council on Repression of Christianity...

On second thought, no I don't.

Date: 2007/05/17 17:55:46, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (skeptic @ May 17 2007,12:59)
This term, FC, is just too broad to work for these purposes unless you do think that the majority of the population is made up of moronic fundamentalist creationist (Lou).

Did you just call me a moronic fundamentalist creationist, pard'?  Em 'er's fittin' words, Credulous Boy!

Seriously though, while I wouldn't argue that "the majority of the population is made up of moronic fundamentalist creationist", ya sure do bump into a bunch of 'em these days.  More than is healthy, I think.  Geez, ya' can't even enjoy a virtual beer after the damned bar closes with the boys without steppin' on one of the little toad(ie)s.

Just sayin'.

I am curious however, why the (bowel) movement gained such traction.  Given my history, I don't think I can speak very objectively about it.  I'm sure the answer lies in the muddled wasteland which is left of my brain after my own experience with fundymorongelicalism, but that's an ugly place I try to keep locked up tight.  I don't like looking at that mess too often - it's rather scary.

Anyways, the long and the short of it is that the pastor who "raised me up" once told me that the average member of our church was only a member for about two years.  If that's the case, you'd think eventually the movement would starve, but it just never seems to lack new blood.

Do we all have our moments (years) of braindeadedness that we have to work through?  What makes person A more susceptible to get sucked into the pit than person B?  Why does person A wake up from the nightmare after two years, while person C is stuck there forever?  And why the hell would seemingly intelligent person D give person C the time of day, given the absolute gibberish that person C is spouting?

And what's up with person E's socks?  Why is one blue and one red?

Date: 2007/05/17 18:08:04, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (silverspoon @ May 17 2007,17:58)
Of course Gonzalez could end all the speculations about why he was denied.  ISU’s policies require them to inform him in writing the reasons for his denial.

The negative publicity he’s receiving from all the whining the DI is doing must outweigh any prospects of future employment in his book.  Very strange, coming from such an intelligent fellow.

Playing the martyr is much more conducive to filling the offering plate than doing actual research.  Especially when you know ahead of time that there's no research to do.

Date: 2007/05/18 07:38:11, Link
Author: Lou FCD

Now wait a minute, I supply evidence and the actual evidence is dismissed because it contradicts the opposing point.  Who does that sound like?  In fact, that actually sounds like a republican talking point, "Polls done by the mainstream media are inherently flawed and poorly worded."  Who am I talking to?

But seriously, you can also look at the Don't Knows that increase dramatically from one question to the next.  What does that mean?  We have to use the available data or present alternate data.  That's the best we can do.

Skeptic, have you learned absolutely nothing in your time here?  If the best evidence we have is worthless crap, then it's worthless crap.  You still can't call it evidence just because it's the best we have.

If I say that I asked a bunch of people if they believe Skeptic has hair and 72% responded "Yes", that's crap.  We don't know how many people I asked, the question is not specific enough, and we aren't even sure if any of them even know who Skeptic is.  The question is crap, the data is crap, and the conclusion that "Skeptic has hair" is crap, and even the conclusion that "72% of people believe Skeptic has hair" is crap.

Yet it's the best we have.  Do we use it anyway, just because it's the best we have?

(Here's a little hint:  The answer is no.)

Quote (skeptic @ May 17 2007,19:19)

Lou would you consider yourself a radical atheist?  I have a mind to use you as an example in an upcoming debate Louis and I are going to have.

Depends on what day you ask me.

I think asking whether or not I'm an atheist is about as intelligent a question as asking whether or not I believe in the Tooth Fairy.  It's sad that the question need even be asked of anyone over the age of five.

That said, I prefer to be in the "Kinder, Gentler Lenny Flank Atheist Camp ™ ", in that people should be allowed to believe whatever ridiculous fairy tale they choose, so long as they don't try to push it into schools, pass it off as reality or science, or govern my country by their version of that fairy tale.  Mostly, if you want to believe that invisible people live in the sky and whisper in your ear, have at it.  Just don't expect me to share your delusions.

The problem is that Fundymorongelicals do try to push it into schools - and wherever else they can - in an attempt to force the rest of us into their Holy Theocracy.  They also continue to dupe the ignorant and the downtrodden out of their money and those two things tend to piss me off and I drift more towards the "Fuck the Stupid Bastards PZ Myers Atheist Camp ™ ".

(Now I've obviously hyperbolized the "Atheist Camp" situation for demonstration purposes only, just for the official record.  It is not my intent to misrepresent anyone on that score.)

I look forward to watching the aforementioned debate.  It should be pretty funny.



Date: 2007/05/18 07:43:48, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote ("Rev Dr" Lenny Flank @ May 17 2007,19:56)

(What the heck is the code for strike-out letters . . . . ?)

It's been a while, but I think it's just an "s".

strike this sentence


Date: 2007/05/18 10:41:31, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (skeptic @ May 18 2007,09:48)
Duely noted Lou, from here forward I'll remember that polls conducted by Newsweek are crap.  As for the rest, I'll take that as a yes for demostration purposes only.


Date: 2007/05/18 10:52:32, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Hehe.  She just paid a visit to UDoJ.

This should get interesting.

Date: 2007/05/18 11:26:14, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Louis @ May 18 2007,10:59)

Oooooh Skeptic and Lou both have the same number of posts. It's evidence of a creator I tells ya! Teleology! Teleology!

We now return you to your regularly scheduled programme.


It ain't the quantity, bubba.  It's the quality.  Or perhaps the entertainment value, I'm not sure.

I suppose this:

Quote (Skeptic @ May 18 2007,09:48)

Duely noted Lou, from here forward I'll remember that polls conducted by Newsweek are crap.  As for the rest, I'll take that as a yes for demostration purposes only.

Answers this:

Quote (Lou FCD @ May 18 2007,07:38)

Skeptic, have you learned absolutely nothing in your time here?

Date: 2007/05/18 18:33:59, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote ("Rev Dr" Lenny Flank @ May 18 2007,17:44)
Quote (Lou FCD @ May 18 2007,07:43)
Quote ("Rev Dr" Lenny Flank @ May 17 2007,19:56)

(What the heck is the code for strike-out letters . . . . ?)

It's been a while, but I think it's just an "s".

strike this sentence


Doh, well that makes sense, doesn't it . . . ?


de nada.

Date: 2007/05/22 11:05:51, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (phonon @ May 22 2007,06:54)
Agnosticism? What can you do in the name of agnosticism?

As you blow yourself up in a market, is your battle cry "I DON'T KNOW!!!"

No, it's "God might be great.  Or not.  Boom!"


Date: 2007/05/23 11:24:05, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Ichthyic @ May 22 2007,15:42)
I could easily, and with much evidence, draw a line at "supporters of ID on Uncommon Descent", and I haven't seen ANY good coming out of that camp.  Nothing but lies, misinformation, ignorance, quotemining...

Oh, I dunno, Ich.  There's the comedy...

Date: 2007/05/23 18:44:27, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Glen, dude, seriously.  Decaf.  Don't have a cow, man.

Steve's comment was on the mark.  There's so much bickering and crap flying on PT that it's really not worth the effort to try to find the one or two intelligent comments in the pile of cow patties.  Even the humor has moved on.

And for the record, I find that regrettable, as the posts themselves can be very informative.  Of course they usually contain the "continue reading at my blog" link these days.  It's easier to just visit those blogs I enjoy individually and skip the bullshit.

I guess the question really boils down to "Why does PT even exist anymore?"

It's little more than a place to hurl insults at each other, and that's a shame.

By the way though, just out of curiosity, does the Clouserbot still pass through the gates?  I might be persuaded to stop by PT every now and again if I can hurl some insults at her, but that's about it.


Date: 2007/05/23 18:48:37, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (GCT @ May 23 2007,18:29)
2)  Isn't the computer itself designed?  So, therefore, this is really a test of ID.  So, if the internet, et. al. don't arrive, isn't this just showing us that ID didn't produce those things?  Or, are they tacitly admitting that one can make a GA that is not a demonstrator of ID?

What a tard.

My head hurts now.

Date: 2007/05/23 19:43:06, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (stevestory @ May 23 2007,19:04)
I don't have anything to say here, except that if anyone thinks I'm creating an atmosphere where people feel the need to suck up to me, that's unhealthy for the board and you should contact this guy and voice your concerns.

I don't feel the need to suck up.

I just have the hots for ya'.


This place is much more interesting, much more entertaining for me.

I'd like to see PT post more science and less "Philosophy 101", but I don't see that happening any time soon.  Again, most of the time the interesting posts have the "continue reading this post at my blog" link anyway.

Plus, if you ask a question at PT you usually get ignored, bodyslammed, or told to look it up yourself.  It's just not a very friendly place anymore.

Quote (The good Rev. Dr. Lenny to whom I also enjoy up-sucking @ May 23 2007,19:00)

Well, it USED to exist to fight the ID movement.

Now that the ID movement is . . . well . . . dead as a mackerel, PT seems to exist because some people with huge egos like having an audience while they fight with each other.

I've seen you make this point before, and I think there's quite a bit of evidence to support the contention.

So if the science stuff is at other blogs, it's not terribly layman-friendly on the science questions, the only thing left of the ID movement is the comedy at the moment, Clouser's not there at which to hurl insults, and Lenny and PZ aren't getting into dick waving contests, what really is the point of PT for me?


OK, Glen's rage got pointed at me whilst I wrote this, so before I hit add, allow me to reply.

Sure, the lies and snipes don't bother you.  

Just pile on, you have nothing substantive to add.

Piss off.  I was offering a bit of friendly conversation.  You're fucking insane over a comment made about PT in general.  Take your meds, asshole.

Your contribution to the conversation has been bile and vitriol pointed at whoever happens by.  I wouldn't call that "substantive".


Let's see, this has what to do with anything?

It bears directly on Steve's comment.  Read for comprehension.

OK, you've made your point, you have nothing but scattered irrelevant points to make, plus you're with the herd.  No doubt that puts you where you want to be, without meaningful points to make, but kudos for being a "team player."

And you've made yours.  You're a paranoid douchebag.

I guess a place as given over to churning the ancient responses to IDiocy wouldn't be likely to have anyone who could make a substantive point, or who'd actually oppose the dishonest posts of Wynne, Steve, and Elsberry.  Without any real commitment to honesty, and only the desire to pounce on those who find bullying and dishonesty to be distasteful, most of you guys really have hit bottom.  

Their posts weren't dishonest, you're out in Never Never Land.  What?  Anyone who disagrees with you is a bully and a liar?

You're an arrogant prick.  A windbag of the first order.


Yeah, I know, chill out, what's the problem with dishonesty, when you've got each other to count on to support your dishonesty?  UD with another point of view, that's all.

Funny you should say that considering how much you remind me of DaveScot.

Date: 2007/05/23 19:50:25, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Speaking of anger management...

Glen, you are a short man.

Date: 2007/05/23 20:21:48, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (stevestory @ May 23 2007,20:05)
Quote (Lou FCD @ May 23 2007,20:43)
Quote (stevestory @ May 23 2007,19:04)
I don't have anything to say here, except that if anyone thinks I'm creating an atmosphere where people feel the need to suck up to me, that's unhealthy for the board and you should contact this guy and voice your concerns.

I don't feel the need to suck up.

I just have the hots for ya'.

And who could blame you?

By the way, I do think there's too much sniping and mockery, and not enough original content here. And I'm trying different ideas to solve it. I floated the idea of creating a group blog here for new content. And last night, for instance, I started 4 new threads, on Plantinga, a new Scienceblog, the Economist, and Stanley Miller, hoping to jumpstart some discussions. The sniping and mockery is a fundamental part of the culture here, and Official UD Thread is chugging along fine, but there's also talk and energy put into creating original content. And we're still trying new things and experimenting.

bah, always trying to be part of the solution.  I may have the hots for ya', but I'm losing respect for ya' right quick.

I like the idea of a group science blog.  Were I qualified, I'd happily contribute.

Alas, I am a waste of oxygen as Glen so pointedly pointed out pointedly.

Date: 2007/05/23 20:27:03, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Found this on the local forum and didn't know where else to stick it.


Date: 2007/05/23 20:53:07, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Oh, that is way too funny.  I am so posting a link to that on the ENC forum and taking all the credit.

Date: 2007/05/24 12:11:12, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Richardthughes @ May 24 2007,10:46)
[Dembksi On]

Is this an ID paper?

[Dembski Off]

Man, you just gotta love that guy's deft use of Okkam's Razor.  I'm convinced.

Date: 2007/05/24 12:13:05, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Kristine @ May 24 2007,09:10)
I had a time making him my zombie. :)

well, I never saw him [Falwell] on the Viagra ads.
Never had to. Get me? ;)

Irreducible eye of newt is good for getting caramel out of one's bikini line. :p

I'm much more interested in the story of how the caramel got in one's bikini line myself...

Date: 2007/05/24 12:58:54, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Louis @ May 24 2007,12:23)

I can help you there.

Take one frisky girlfirend and one Mars bar.....


(img snipped)

....and then she said "But Your Reverence"...


....You should at this point bring out your rotary whisk and a selection of eels...


(img snipped)



Hmmm.. Were there mřřse involved in a sacking?

Date: 2007/05/24 17:04:36, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Richardthughes @ May 24 2007,16:28)

No, she said that OE was "Such a big suck fest".

Clean out your ears.

Date: 2007/05/25 03:21:00, Link
Author: Lou FCD
The CNN article

BANGOR, Wales (Reuters) -- Dolphins living off the coast of Wales whistle, bark and groan in a different dialect from dolphins off the western coast of Ireland, scientists have discovered.

Different physical environments might have contributed to the mammals developing distinctive sets of vocalizations or "dialects", said Simon Berrow from the Shannon Dolphin and Wildlife Foundation.

A better article from the Shannon Dolphin and Wildlife Foundation.

As part of a recent research project, student Ronan Hickey digitised and analysed a total of 1,882 whistles from the Shannon dolphins and those from bottlenose dolphins in Cardigan Bay in Wales. He separated them into six fundamental whistle types and 32 different categories. Of the categories, he found most were used by both populations of dolphins, but eight whistle types were only produced by the Shannon dolphins.

The new paper is Berrow, S.D., O’Brien, J. & Holmes, B. (2006) Whistle production by bottlenose dolphins Tursiops truncatus in the Shannon estuary. Irish Naturalists' Journal 28(5), 208-213.

I poked around a bit, but didn't locate an online copy of the paper.

An earlier, related paper:

Hickey, R. (2005) Comparison of whistle repertoire and characteristics between Cardigan Bay and the Shannon estuary populations of Bottlenose dolphins (Tursiops truncatus) with implications for passive and active survey techniques. School of Biological Sciences, University of Wales, Bangor

Just cool stuff.

Date: 2007/05/25 03:27:13, Link
Author: Lou FCD
One for Arden:

New Scientist article

Young babies can discriminate between different languages just by looking at an adult's face, even if they do not hear a single spoken word. And babies who grow up bilingual can do this for longer than monolingual infants. The work suggests that visual information helps to tell languages apart.

"This supports the idea that infants come prepared to learn multiple languages and to discriminate them both auditorily and visually," says Whitney Weikum from the University of British Columbia in Vancouver, Canada, who discovered babies' keen eye for speech. "Looking at a face may help identify speakers of your native language."

I'm feeling a bit constructive at 4 AM.  Perhaps I should lie down until it passes.

Date: 2007/05/25 03:46:36, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Science Blurb on the same discovery

Mother tongue, other tongue--they may all sound like gobbledygook to babies, but new research shows that infants can tell if someone switches to an unfamiliar language just by studying the speaker's face. The babies apparently rely on how the face moves, not just the sound of the words, to pick up on a foreign language. Further, scientists found, infants will likely lose that knack before their first birthday if they're not in a bilingual family that constantly exposes them to language switching.

Date: 2007/05/25 04:10:03, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Full Text @ Nature

The abstract:

We report a high-quality draft of the genome sequence of the grey, short-tailed opossum (Monodelphis domestica). As the first metatherian ('marsupial') species to be sequenced, the opossum provides a unique perspective on the organization and evolution of mammalian genomes. Distinctive features of the opossum chromosomes provide support for recent theories about genome evolution and function, including a strong influence of biased gene conversion on nucleotide sequence composition, and a relationship between chromosomal characteristics and X chromosome inactivation. Comparison of opossum and eutherian genomes also reveals a sharp difference in evolutionary innovation between protein-coding and non-coding functional elements. True innovation in protein-coding genes seems to be relatively rare, with lineage-specific differences being largely due to diversification and rapid turnover in gene families involved in environmental interactions. In contrast, about 20% of eutherian conserved non-coding elements (CNEs) are recent inventions that postdate the divergence of Eutheria and Metatheria. A substantial proportion of these eutherian-specific CNEs arose from sequence inserted by transposable elements, pointing to transposons as a major creative force in the evolution of mammalian gene regulation.

In English @ Science

By Elizabeth Pennisi
ScienceNOW Daily News
9 May 2007
It may lack the charisma of a koala or a kangaroo, but the gray short-haired opossum has now earned its place in history as the first marsupial to have its DNA deciphered. One of a few creatures that gives birth to highly immature young that then are nourished--often in pouches--outside the womb, the opossum stands in sharp contrast to the other mammals--such as human, mouse, chimpanzee, and macaque--with sequenced genomes. Although its 3.4 billion bases reveal some differences with placental mammals, the opossum's immune system is surprisingly sophisticated, an international team reports today.

Unraveling the genomes of dozens of animals with varying degrees of relatedness is key to learning how humans evolved. Researchers decided to sequence this opossum, Monodelphis domestica, in part because marsupials branched off the mammalian evolutionary tree 180 million years ago. In addition, this species is used in immunology, developmental biology, and biomedical research.

The marsupial's genome holds some surprises. Reporting today in Nature, a team led by Tarjei Mikkelsen and Kerstin Lindblad-Toh of the Broad Institute of the Massachusetts Institute of Technology and Harvard in Cambridge, Massachusetts, shows that of the marsupial's 19,000 or so genes, more than 15,000 clearly correspond to human genes, including an unexpected number important to the body's defenses. That's intriguing, the researchers say, because the marsupial immune system is supposed to be primitive.

The Science article was rather good and worth reading in full.  Lots of good material in there for gratuitous cheap shots at Behe's Folly.

Date: 2007/05/25 12:38:27, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Richardthughes @ May 25 2007,12:14)
God created the integers. Until we find His way of creating the integers or primes, we will not truly know what is a prime or God

This is quantum Tard. Someone will have it in their sig. soon, I suspect.

Not me, Baby.  The siggy line is prime real estate for blogwhoring.  I'll let you guys feed me my daily dose of Siggy-Worthy Tard.

Date: 2007/05/25 12:40:14, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Henry J @ May 25 2007,11:57)
So babies should learn to watch their language? :)

In shame I must admit, I never saw that one coming.  I must be senile.

Date: 2007/05/25 14:37:38, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Wow, great link Paul.  Stills, video, the paper, the works.

Thanks for that.

Date: 2007/05/25 16:58:19, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Wesley R. Elsberry @ May 25 2007,16:34)
I'd have to see the methods to be sure, but the odds are that any study that discusses using whistles alone to establish differences between populations is way over-hyped. Whistles get a lot of attention because you can collect some fraction of them with ordinary audio gear. Dolphins, however, produce a stunning variety of click-based sounds that are not whistles, with frequency content that goes from a few hundred hertz to several hundred kilohertz. Typical audio equipment, at best, delivers a part of the 20 to 20 kHz range that is the canonical human hearing range. It has only been in the past few years that mass-market equipment has become available with technical specs that improves upon the 20 kHz high end.

There is a lot more to dolphin sound than whistles...

Oh sure.  I finally do something vaguely resembling productive around here, something I found incredibly interesting and unexpected, and then you just show up and suck all the air of it by pointing out facts and scientifical stuff.

Thanks.  I'm going back to snark and sniping now, so I can be appreciated.


Seriously though, an extension of this study involving the rest of the dolphin "vocabulary" (is that the right word for it?) would be fascinating to compare.

Date: 2007/05/25 17:00:08, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Wesley R. Elsberry @ May 25 2007,16:44)
Now, Steve, that's hardly fair... where can I get a picture of you?

The bar?

Date: 2007/05/25 17:15:18, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Hmmm... I just saw a TV commercial for some cell phone company where a guy jokes with his future father-in-law and then the call gets dropped so he hears nothing on the other end...

How appropriate.


Date: 2007/05/25 17:43:04, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Ichthyic @ May 25 2007,17:20)
This supports the idea that infants come prepared to learn multiple languages


I wonder what that does for biblical literalists and the story of Babel?

Ok, now how does one differentiate between generalism vs. multiple specificity?

IOW, are babies "prepared" to learn say, english or french or spanish, etc., or are they just prepared to learn any kind of general ability to communicate via motion and sound.

am i being clear?

I think I get what you're getting at.

Tangential anecdote:

When my wife was pregnant, I would lay my head on her belly and read Dr. Seuss or Disney books or whatever.  I have no idea if that would affect the outcome of the study or a study of your question, but each of my kids seemed to respond to my voice better than the voices of the hospital staff or even my wife.  Both of them were instant screamers, but would quiet down for as long as I held and spoke to them.  Nurses couldn't do a thing with either of them.

Again, anecdotal, subjective, and certainly not scientifically rigorous, but I'd be interested to see the effects of that on the outcome of this type of study.  Would it have a different effect if I had read to them in multiple languages?  (As it happens I read only in English - don't know why, I guess I just never really thought about it at the time.)

Date: 2007/05/25 18:11:40, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote ("Rev Dr" Lenny Flank @ May 25 2007,18:03)
Quote (Lou FCD @ May 25 2007,17:43)
Both of them were instant screamers, but would quiet down for as long as I held and spoke to them.  Nurses couldn't do a thing with either of them.

When I used to babysit my sister's kids and they screamed like that for me, I'd spike their milk with Jack Daniels.  That always quieted them down.


I'm ONLY KIDDING !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  

Actually, my sister's kids all adore me, since I let them get away with all sorts of things that their parents would never have approved of.

Heh heh, Mr. Daniels works well rubbed on teething gums.  That's all I'm gonna say 'bout that.


My kids really love their Uncle Kev (my brother), and I suspect it's for very similar reasons...

Date: 2007/05/26 12:28:54, Link
Author: Lou FCD
My fellow Eastern North Carolinian disappointingly cites WorldNutDaily as a credible news source.

I have attempted (though I'm sure it was in vain) to disabuse him of that notion.

I found it both tragic and funny, and thought I'd share.

Date: 2007/05/26 14:18:28, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I guess I start crap wherever I go

I'm just destined to be a shit-starter, I guess.  Maybe Janie and Kate should pay a visit...

Date: 2007/05/26 14:22:00, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Arden Chatfield @ May 26 2007,13:19)
Quote (Lou FCD @ May 26 2007,12:28)
My fellow Eastern North Carolinian disappointingly cites WorldNutDaily as a credible news source.

I have attempted (though I'm sure it was in vain) to disabuse him of that notion.

I found it both tragic and funny, and thought I'd share.

Leave it to California. Land of fruit and nuts! This is unbelievable!

By Bob Unruh

No offense, but as a 3rd-generation northern Californian, Bob Unruh can suck my dick.

California is just out-there.

So can Optimus Prime.

Shall I pass along your sentiments?

I'm picturing cheesy-poof stuffin' keyboard commandos.  There seem to be quite a few DaveScot wannabes in the crowd, although there seem also to be a few folks with brains inhabiting the place as well.

I doubt they're as good as the UD crowd for comedy value, though.

Date: 2007/05/26 15:50:19, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Arden Chatfield @ May 26 2007,15:24)
That board really is infested with pompous wingnuts, isn't it?


Besides being the Buckle of the Bible Belt, remember that Eastern North Carolina boasts Camp Lejeune (the largest USMC base in the world, I'm told), Cherry Point (another major Marine Corps base), and Fort Bragg (home of the Army's Special Forces), which tends to shift the politics even further to the right.  Notice how I was immediately asked if I had ever "put on the uniform", (EDIT-in the other thread)a statement immediately followed by "liberals have no clue about patriotism" or however double douchebag phrased it.  It just never occurred to him that a member of the military could be anything but a right-wing nut job of his own ilk, and the revelation that that wasn't the case sent him into a foamy-mouthed conniption.

I think that his assumption, and the fact that it apparently has gone unchallenged to this point, is rather telling.

Date: 2007/05/26 16:59:54, Link
Author: Lou FCD

Date: 2007/05/26 17:20:39, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I don't think this one really needs further commentary...

Date: 2007/05/26 17:57:30, Link
Author: Lou FCD

Date: 2007/05/26 18:20:04, Link
Author: Lou FCD

Date: 2007/05/26 18:35:48, Link
Author: Lou FCD

Date: 2007/05/28 08:26:58, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (afdave @ May 28 2007,07:17)
Have a look at my new blog article at

Rather pointless to have a blog if you're afraid to turn on the comments, isn't it?

I was going to point out the pointlessness of AFDave's blog, then realized how pointless that was.

I think I've made my point pointedly.

Date: 2007/05/28 15:50:27, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Davey, if you'll open comments, I promise not to make a single comment on your blog.

How's that?

Date: 2007/05/28 17:12:15, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (stevestory @ May 28 2007,16:46)
And of course the babbling of his nitwit co-bloggers doesn't exactly bathe him in reflected glory.

Rectumfied Glory perhaps.

Date: 2007/05/28 17:40:35, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Ichthyic @ May 28 2007,17:14)
And of course the babbling of his nitwit co-bloggers doesn't exactly bathe him in reflected glory.

I wonder if WD40 is far gone enough at this point, that he actually thinks it does?

FWIW (nuthin' probly), I figure he's playing to the crowd.

He knows he's full of it, but as long as the rubes keep shellin' out the bucks...

And what incentive does he have to retract his BS, really?  It's not like his reputation would ever recover, he'll be laughed at for the rest of his life, blah blah blah.

His only real choice is to do what he's doing for as long as the money flows, which will be forever.  There will always be people willing to pay to hear what they want.

That's not to defend him, he's still a sheister.

DAJ, on the other hand, is just in need of serious medical attention.  Whole 'nuther thing.  The funny thing is that as nuts as DAJ is, he's still one up on WAD.  At least DAJ was a respected scientist at one time.  Better to be a has-been than a never-was.

Myself, I'm a late bloomer.  I'm waiting 'til just before I die to release my world-changing science, so I can go out on top.


Date: 2007/05/28 17:43:08, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (ScaryFacts @ May 28 2007,17:30)
Haven't you guys heard of the Reef of Babel?  It's in the Bible--God confused the language of dolphins to prevent them from completing the Reef of Babel.

Why even bother researching variety in sea mammal language when God has already told us in His inerrant Word?  Research to find answers we already know is just a waist of money we could be using to build a $27 million underwater creation museum to show the Truth to dolphins everywhere.

Geez, I come back after months of silence only to find you guys have completely given up your religion.

Hey, I thought you were going computer-less for ten days or some such.  I think you're an addict.


Date: 2007/05/28 17:47:50, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Ichthyic @ May 28 2007,17:18)
I meant wise guys like Lou.

Nyuk Nyuk.

I'm tryin' to come with a good Stooges reference, but I got nuthin'.  I'm off my game lately.  (or always, maybe...)

Date: 2007/05/28 22:00:38, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (ScaryFacts @ May 28 2007,21:07)
Plus I must be right because Lou says I'm write (see my siggy.)  You can't overlook my clear endorsement from Lou.

"Lou said it, Scary believes it, that settles it."


Date: 2007/05/28 22:09:41, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (stevestory @ May 28 2007,22:06)
JanieBelle said it, Corporal Kate spanked her for it, that settles it.

Y'know the girls haven't had a good spankin' post in a while, I think they're due...

Date: 2007/05/28 22:17:38, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (stevestory @ May 28 2007,22:10)
How you managed to pull off a hoax involving an underage bisexual girl cohabitating with a bisexual marine girl and obsessed with Intelligent Design, and actually fool many people, I'll never know. Your skills at inhabiting fictional characters is impressive, that's for damn sure.

I dunno either, Steve.  If you could have seen the (quite literally) thousands of emails that flew between me and my Karl Rove over the course of that, and how much planning went into every little thing, and how much went totally wrong, and how much scrambling to deal with that there was, you'd have to just shake your head and be as baffled as I am.

What's even more amazing is that I can still suck in the odd idiot from time to time.

Oh, and I believe I still owe you a beer on my next trip up yonder.  I haven't forgotten, I just haven't been up that way.

Date: 2007/05/29 09:24:24, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Richardthughes @ May 29 2007,09:13)
Quote (Albatrossity2 @ May 29 2007,09:07)
Quote (Richardthughes @ May 29 2007,08:57)
In other news, FtK and I are going to make out in the bus. The whole back seat is off limits, people.

No problem, man. I'll be on sedatives, so nothing, not even you and FtK making out (shudder) will disturb me...

She clearly needs kissing lessons. She does "the washing machine". Tongue twirls clockwise for 5 mins, then reverse cycle kicks in and it twirls anti-clockwise for 5 mins.

But man I hate it when she hits the spin cycle.

I almost lost a tooth once...

Date: 2007/05/29 09:28:23, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Richardthughes @ May 29 2007,09:18)
Quote (franky172 @ May 29 2007,09:14)
KairosFocus and Phevans are going at it over on the "Sewell's law" (snicker) thread.

KairosFocus would like to argue points that aren't being discussed.  A new prince tard?

Ah, "design of the gaps" - retreating backwards as each point is refuted.

Quick, somebody grab the goalposts!  They're headed for the parking lot!

Date: 2007/05/29 16:16:35, Link
Author: Lou FCD

Date: 2007/05/29 17:06:04, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Ichthyic @ May 29 2007,16:54)
perfect, except you forgot the "purse".

damn, this thread is showing some fine creativity.

Crap.  It was just the first image facing about the right direction I found.  Didn't even occur to me that the purse might be absent.

It was quick and dirty anyway, I guess now I'll have to do a refined version, just for fun...

Date: 2007/05/29 17:23:41, Link
Author: Lou FCD


Date: 2007/05/29 17:40:05, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Backin' up a bit, y'all both have some purty pics.  I'd eventually like to step up from my Kodak Onsaleacrome, but it's a ways down the priority list...

Date: 2007/05/29 17:42:19, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Does Kristine weigh the same as a duck?  Has anyone checked?

Date: 2007/05/29 17:54:56, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Thanks, Ich.  My Pop's got an SLR with a dozen or so lenses and filters and such.  It's from the 80s or so, but it still takes really nice pics.

I keep waiting for him to "go to California" (as we say in our family now*).  He'll probably out-live me, though, bastard.  Good thing I like the old fart.

*See here for details if you're really interested.

Date: 2007/05/29 18:39:34, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Ichthyic @ May 29 2007,18:37)
And I'm not sure where he got the 100% figure

he has a VERY large rectum.  fits both all the information he posts on UD, as well as his oversized head, with room to spare.

LOL, thanks for that.

Date: 2007/05/29 19:14:51, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Could ya make that a little bigger, Louis?  It's kinda small and hard to see...

Date: 2007/05/29 19:26:15, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I found this on the beach here in NC a few years ago, and I've had it sitting on my desk since then.

I keep meaning to take it with me when I visit the aquarium, but always manage to forget (blamin' the pain meds as usual).

Any ideas on what it is?  I think it's a vertebra from some rather big critter, 'cause it's a little over 4" across.

Date: 2007/05/29 19:27:37, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Sorry 'bout the post title, I seem to have had a cut and paste accident all over the title.

Date: 2007/05/29 19:37:33, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Thanks for cleaning up the title for me, Steve.  Sorry to add to your workload.

That's kind of what I was thinking, but I'm not finding pictures on the web of anything quite like it.  It's got a pretty cool shape to it.

Date: 2007/05/29 20:44:37, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Ichthyic @ May 29 2007,20:11)
all I'm sure about is that it ain't from a fish.

definetely a large mammal of some kind.

yeah, real helpful, I know.

looks too big for a pinniped.

the dorsal looks like an .... angel.

don't show it to a creationist; they might claim it as a holy relic.

hmm.  no vertical dorsal projections.  that might narrow it down some.

here, for a comparison, is the vertebra from a humpback whale:

(snip image)

note the very large vertical protrusion (forget what it's called now).

maybe what you have there is a neck vertebra?

look at this picture of a horse skeleton:

(snip image)

note the vertical protrusions on all vertebrae but the neck.

Actually, knowing that it didn't come from a fish is quite helpful.  That really does narrow it down quite a bit.  I'll concentrate on other things.

So far as I can find on teh interwebs, it's also not a whale or dolphin.  The "angel wings", the protrusions on the sides have a very definite curve to them that I haven't seen in any images of marine mammals.  I've been searching equine vertebrae images, as there is a population of feral horses on the islands around Cape Lookout, which is just offshore here.

I'm having a spot of trouble finding some good close-ups, however.  Mostly I'm finding logos for "horse chiropractors".

I think I'm going to make a rule where no one is allowed to use the interwebs anymore for junk I'm not looking for.  It's damned hard to sift through all the crap to find what I want, and it's getting annoying.

As for the lack of dorsal projections, beings that I ain't a biologisticalist, I haven't ruled out anything based on that, because I'm not for sure that such a projection hasn't just been lost in oceanic meanderings.  Doesn't seem like it could have been meandering too long though, given that the curly "angel wings" are still there.  Seems like an extended bounce-around in the water would have busted them off.

Date: 2007/05/29 21:12:59, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (ScaryFacts @ May 29 2007,21:09)

You have found conclusive proof of the UNIVERSAL TRANSITIONAL FOSSIL


Yeah, I've been tossing around the idea that I've found a completely new species of animal.  I think I'll call it "Louicus Cantfuckingfinditicus".  It's closely related to the common Snuffleupagus.

Date: 2007/05/29 21:15:54, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Maybe I'll give Ken Ham a call...

Date: 2007/05/29 21:22:47, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Unhelpful, but funny.

Came across it whilst looking for my bone...

um... yeah.

Date: 2007/05/29 21:45:31, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (ScaryFacts @ May 29 2007,21:37)
Quote (Lou FCD @ May 29 2007,22:22)
Unhelpful, but funny.

Came across it whilst looking for my bone...

um... yeah.


You have something all over your hands.  What is that?  It looks like...too much time.

Truer words may never have been spoken...

Date: 2007/05/29 21:51:47, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (ScaryFacts @ May 29 2007,21:46)
The question is like the classic:  "When did you stop beating your wife?"

Or more to the point, "When will she stop beating me????"

Date: 2007/05/29 21:59:26, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Dr.GH @ May 29 2007,21:56)
You have favored one view.  I think, but can't tell, that it could be the rear part of a skull of a rather small mammal.  (The ruler is in inches)?

Could you vary the view?  Dorsal, ventral, lateral, proximal, distal:  (top, bottom, side, "fore and aft").

Sure, hang on a sec...

Date: 2007/05/29 22:11:04, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Yes, in inches.

Date: 2007/05/29 22:18:11, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Ichthyic @ May 29 2007,22:12)
hmm. I think Gary's right.

I thought the cross section looked odd, but thought it might just be wear.

those "wings" do kinda look like they might be orbital bones.

oh, yes those new pics are much clearer.

yes, it does indeed look much more like a skull now.

it looks like the beginning of the vertebral column is sticking out of the top in the second photo.

the cross-section looks like a saw blade cut through the skull.

Oh yeah, I'm kinda seein' that...

Date: 2007/05/29 22:25:12, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Kristine @ May 29 2007,22:17)
It's William Dembski's funnybone. He sure ain't using it.

I'm trying to read the calendar on your desk, actually. Does it say that your basketball team beat Christ the King?  :p

It's from "The 365 Stupidest Things Ever Said" calendar that my Aunt buys for me every Christmas.  Sometimes I get such a kick out of one that I don't change it for a while.

It's the gift that keeps on giving...

Date: 2007/05/29 22:34:35, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Dr.GH @ May 29 2007,22:17)
Yep.  The left auditory bula is missing as is the front to the critter.

I dug out my Mammalina Osteology.  If you could get a shot of the top of the skull from the rear with the squiggly lines (sutures) between the parietal and occipital bones in good focus, there is a 1 in 5 chance of guessing the genus, or family.

Okee Dokey, lemme see if I can translate that into crippled former electrician.  Which is the front again?

(Just kiddin'.  I think I can figure it out, but I aint apromisin' nuthin'.)

Ok, top of the skull, from the rear, looking at the sutures, steadied on the desk, and Shakespeare (my golden retriever) has given up trying to eat the bone for the moment.

Let me know if you need a lower angle...

P.S.  Forgive the towel, I'm trying to minimize distraction and reflection from my cluttered desk.  Plus my Kodak Onsaleachrome takes really crappy flash pictures...

Date: 2007/05/29 22:35:55, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Dr.GH @ May 29 2007,22:27)
The photo above is of the back of the skull with the skull upside down.

I need on like that, only flipped over rightside up, and from slightly above the medial plane.

Lower angle then?

Date: 2007/05/29 22:43:00, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Lou FCD @ May 29 2007,22:35)
Quote (Dr.GH @ May 29 2007,22:27)
The photo above is of the back of the skull with the skull upside down.

I need on like that, only flipped over rightside up, and from slightly above the medial plane.

Lower angle then?

Wait, the pic you pointed out - I thought that was from the front.

Date: 2007/05/29 22:45:43, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Dr.GH @ May 29 2007,22:42)
Try a little higher, and one about the same.

This is fun.

I once cleared a homicide over the phone. The poor investigator had a fetal calf's L. paraital and a partial occipital.  It looked to the CI like a child's skull.

If we had digital photos it would have only taken a few minutes.

A little more angle?  Ok hold on.  I'm a little turned around, I think.  Plus my batteries just died.  Gimme a minute.

(And yeah, it's pretty fun doin' it like this.)

Date: 2007/05/29 22:51:48, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Ok, as I'm picturing this in my head, this picture would be looking right into the critter's face, right side up, and you need to see from exactly the other direction, right?

Date: 2007/05/29 22:53:02, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Ichthyic @ May 29 2007,22:50)
also, if a saw really was used to cut through the skull, like it appears in the last pic in the series, that might also suggest it isn't a marine mammal, but maybe a discard from some slaughterhouse?

just to be clear, I think this is the right orientation.


Well that would explain why I'm all boogered up, then.

Date: 2007/05/29 22:59:28, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Ok, from the rear, right side up, my head out of my butt, and with sutures in focus...  I think...

Am I getting warm yet?

Date: 2007/05/29 23:09:33, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (deejay @ May 29 2007,23:02)
Hi Lou-

The last picture of your original post has a nice view of the floor of the skull from above.  The bone that makes up a good chunk of the floor of the skull is the sphenoid bone.  Click on image "sphenoid bone, upper surface" in the wikipedia entry for a decent look at this bone in humans.  The holes on either side above this bone are where the optic nerves come in, and the holes on either side below this bone are where the internal carotid arteries come in.  In the very center of this bone is a depression where the pituitary gland sits, called the fossa hypophysea in the wikipedia entry.  Your skull has a prominent dorsum sellae, the wall right behind the depression.

The very top center of this same photo is the ethmoid bone, where the olfactory nerves come in.  The big hole in the very center of your last entry on the first page is the foramen magnum, where the spinal cord leaves.  

Hope this helps you with some of the orientation and function.  I only know human anatomy, not comparative anatomy, and it was a fun exercise for me to wrestle with the homology.  All description guaranteed accurate or your money back.

Thanks, DeeJay.  The one part I had figured out was where the spinal cord goes.  Other than that, I was lost.  Once Dr. GH got me to the skull rather than a vertebra, I was trying to orient to the human skull, but hadn't quite made the connections.  Your quick tour and Ichthyic's labeled picture really helped.


Date: 2007/05/29 23:29:49, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Man, the Onsaleachrome simply does not wish to focus up close...

The edge is relatively smooth, and as indicated in one of the pics, there is a straight ridge, and being a guy who occasionally works with wood, I can tell you it sure resembles a saw mark, where somebody changed angles a bit with a saw.

Date: 2007/05/29 23:36:25, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Dr.GH @ May 29 2007,23:28)
I only have a few skulls in reach, and I don't feel like going out to the storage shed to any more tonight.  I am leaning toward a young cat that was killed with a sharp edged weapon.

If there are kirf marks (ridges on the surface of the bone defect) then there is more to learn.  (And the weird moves up a notch).  I had a case in Tennessee where I got to saw and chop a lot of bones in order to prepare comparitive material for the damaged bones of a young woman.  I even was going to smash some goat heads with a baseball bat, but the guy confessed.  (He used a bat)

I really do appreciate all your help.  Though I'm a little disappointed that it isn't something cooler like a shark vertebra, I'm having a ball trying to get the right shots to help you guys figure this out.

It's like AtBC meets CSI Jacksonville.


Date: 2007/05/29 23:39:53, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Ichthyic @ May 29 2007,23:30)
but isn't the skull in Lou's pics too large to be a kitten's?

or does the lack of a ridge proceed all the way until full adulthood?

I guess I don't want to believe someone would chop a cat's head up with a saw.

If it's a cat skull, it's fully grown or it's a newborn tiger.  We don't get a whole lot of those in Eastern North Carolina, though.

It's too big to be a kitten.

Date: 2007/05/29 23:41:37, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Dr.GH @ May 29 2007,23:39)
Do you have otters back in NC?  I lived in Georgia for a while, and there were (IIRC) river otters in the Savana River.

That's a very good question, and one to which I do not know the answer.  I've been here a few years, but I'm a transplant from Philly.

I'll have to look that up for ya' Doc.

Date: 2007/05/29 23:45:02, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Ichthyic @ May 29 2007,23:40)

It's just been too long since I've done any comparitive anatomy (about 20 years, at least with anything other than fish).

I found this for you, which might help you out:

Hey thanks!

Kinda resembles a small version of this guy a little:

Date: 2007/05/29 23:54:28, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Ichthyic @ May 29 2007,23:46)
hmm. what about a juvenile racoon skull?

I'd bet you have a lot of those in NC?

look at the juvenile skull on the right.

I could also imagine that as being an animal someone might cut up, if they considered it a pest, maybe?

I think my guy is missing the curly thing behind the eye socket, and the "angel wings" on my guy stick way out.  And yes, "curly thing behind the eye socket" and "angel wings" are the proper scientifical names for them.

Plus, I think that there are still folks that eat 'possum here.  The pic I put up seems to have more curves in common with my hunk o' skull than the raccoon, I think.

If that makes any sense.

Date: 2007/05/30 00:03:44, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Ichthyic @ May 29 2007,23:59)

but the pic you displayed (is that the possum?) looks like it has a prominent ridge on top, which the one from the beach doesn't.

again, could be a juvenile, maybe?


I give.

Gary will probably figure it out tommorrow.

Yeah, my guy doesn't have that ridge.

It does have a short version, though.  Like you say, maybe it's a juvenile?  Or a different species?

Seems like we're homing in on big fat rat-like critters, though.

I give, too.  I'm tired o' thinkin' all serious like.

Date: 2007/05/30 07:38:44, Link
Author: Lou FCD

Date: 2007/05/30 07:46:14, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Looks like someone is having a bad day.

Date: 2007/05/30 09:28:21, Link
Author: Lou FCD
It's funny that after all this time, she still doesn't get that nobody gives a crap about what the bible has to say about science in any translation.

It always goes something like this:

PTPost: Cool science thing.
Clouser: The bible doesn't disagree with science.  Buy Landa's book.
PTComment:  Yes it does.  Landa is irrelevant.  Stop shilling.
Clouser:  I'm not shilling, I just came across this book...
PTComment: which you just happen to have a vested interest.
Clouser:  The Jews invented science.
PTComment:  You're an idiot.
Clouser:  They did!  Buy Landa's book!  You'll see!
PTComment:  Landa's an irrelevant idiot.
Clouser:  Anti-Semite!  Bigot!  The bible clearly states (if correctly translated as Landa has done) that...
PTComment:  Nobody cares if the bible says the moon is made of blue cheese.  It's simply not a science textbook.  Lemme demonstrate - The bible says the sky is green.  It obviously isn't.
Clouser:  No, anyone who thinks the bible says that hasn't read Landa's book.  In ancient Hebrew, "green" actually means a distinct shade of azure blue.
PTComment:  You're an idiot.
Clouser:  I'm on your side, and so is the bible!  Just buy Landa's book!
PTComment: Please switch sides.
Clouser: I'm not talking to you anymore.  Besides, I have clearly proven that the sky is green and the moon is made of blue cheese, just like the bible says.
LouFCD:  I think I just pissed myself.

Date: 2007/05/30 09:33:47, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Runolfr @ May 30 2007,09:31)
Had to register just to have a go.

Good start!

Date: 2007/05/30 10:06:49, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Now that sir, is classic.

Date: 2007/05/30 10:08:29, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Arden Chatfield @ May 30 2007,09:37)
What I'm impressed by is Carol's psychic ability to tell when there's a PT thread where interpretation of the Bible is mentioned. She can be completely silent for 4 months, and all we need is one thread where the subject of the wording of the OT is mentioned, however tangentially, and boing! up she pops, and by the way, Judah Landa has written this great book!

PS: Maybe we should invite Carol here? Things have gotten a little slow since GoP was banned and FTK went away...  :p

I wonder if she runs a search every hour on the hour...

As for inviting her here, I think she made a short-lived foray into the bar at one point.  She didn't care for the humor, IIRC.

Date: 2007/05/30 10:10:41, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Carol @ AtBC

Date: 2007/05/30 10:47:02, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Utterly OT (which is highly appropriate for a thread about FtK's nonsense, oddly enough):

Louis, gotta tell ya'.

I'm really missin' the Penn Jillette avatar.

Just sayin'.

Date: 2007/05/30 10:57:43, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Louis @ May 30 2007,10:52)
For you Lou. It's all yours.


Thank you, Louis.  A true gentleman you are.


Date: 2007/05/30 11:12:56, Link
Author: Lou FCD

Date: 2007/05/30 13:01:20, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Coolio.  Lookin' forward to it.


Date: 2007/05/30 13:11:48, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Rev. BigDumbChimp @ May 30 2007,11:44)
[quote=Lou FCD,May 30 2007,11:12]
Lou, where are the dinosaurs. Lets be historically accurate at least.......

It was a rush job, I had some errands I hadda run.  Might fix that later, just for you.

Date: 2007/05/30 13:22:26, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Dr.GH @ May 30 2007,13:15)
Quote (Lou FCD @ May 30 2007,13:01)
Coolio.  Lookin' forward to it.


I am stumped without have the thing in hand to directly match with my comparative collection.  I have racoons, skunks, possum, coyote, weasel, bobcat, and domestic cats and dogs.  My interest was their dental works because I used them to match their teeth with marks on human bone.  I don't have otters or seals since they are not likely to have chewed on people.  (I do have several species of shark but those are not relevant here).

Sounds like you've got quite an interesting job.  Forensic pathologist or something (if you don't mind my asking)?

Grissom?  Is that you, Gil?


Date: 2007/05/30 13:25:20, Link
Author: Lou FCD
btw, please allow me to extend my gratitude to you both.  I've truly been enjoying this little exercise.

Date: 2007/05/30 13:28:06, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Ichthyic @ May 30 2007,13:21)
most of us are too lazy to use them, but I imagine she uses the RSS feeds, and then has a filter that scans for particular buzz words.

...and I doubt she has this set up for just PT.

Indeed.  I, for one, am way too lazy to be that lazy.

Reminds me of the Lazarus Long tale about the man who was too lazy to fail...

Date: 2007/05/30 16:32:37, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (stevestory @ May 30 2007,16:31)
Quote (blipey @ May 30 2007,17:28)
Or perhaps you have to slam the remainder of your tumbler anytime she makes a lucid point.  Not much fun, but a lot healthier.

That wouldn't be a drinking game. It would be a sitting next to alcohol game.

I don't like the sound of that game.

Date: 2007/05/30 16:43:01, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Dr.GH @ May 30 2007,13:35)
I am an archaeologist, but about 17 years ago I started working on how bone is modified after death.  That evolved into a specailty in forensic thaphonomy.  I don't do much anymore.

Very cool, very interesting.  Was there a particular thing, moment, event that put you down that road, or was it one of those things that just sort of evolved from the archeology?  Just curious.  (That'll get me killed one of these days, I know.)

(Btw, I'm having an all too increasingly frequent smack-myself-in-the-head moment for not putting the Dr.GH thing together.  "Doh!"

Just so y'know.)

(P.S. - I'm blaming the pain meds yet again for that.)

Date: 2007/05/30 17:01:18, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Via Dizzy @ PT,

I Believe In Evolution, Except For The Whole Triassic Period

I love The Onion.

Date: 2007/05/30 17:13:13, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Y'know he's got yet another one-post blog?  Tenacious that guy.

Date: 2007/05/30 18:41:08, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Dr.GH @ May 30 2007,18:23)
Funny story:  I have a neighbor who is a movie director and editor.  He mostly does horror flicks.  He was doing the screams for a scene in one of his movies, and played differnt versions over and over.  Another neighbor freaked- she thought he was killing some woman- and came to get me to make him stop.


HAHAHAHA!  Too funny.

Date: 2007/05/31 06:47:57, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (oldmanintheskydidntdoit @ May 31 2007,02:59)
Jehu sounds pissed! Good.
True but the Darwinist budget is probably in the billions if you consider almost every researcher in the fields of biology, molecular biology, astronomey, astrophysics, geology, paleontology, and evolution at every university world wide and the secular media that makes huge fanfare out of any piddling discovery.

How many piddling discoverys have the ID camp made lately Jehu? Big fat zero.

That's a rather telling pair of phrases that I've bolded.

Date: 2007/05/31 07:29:59, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (afarensis @ May 30 2007,19:24)
It looks like a young (sutures are still fairly prominent and not obliterated) white tailed deer to me...a picture looking down on the top (as pointed to in Ichthyic's picture) would be helpful

Hello Afarensis,

I'd be happy to accommodate your request, but it seems I have misplaced my camera.  That statement is usually equivalent to "One of my kids borrowed it without informing me and has failed to return it."

I carefully ventured a bit into the two wastelands which are their bedrooms, but quite honestly I got scared and ran away.  I don't like the thought of being eaten by what might live there.  I'll have to wait until they're home from school and ask them.

I hate teenagers.  Is it really illegal to beat them, or is that just a friendly suggestion from the government?

Nevertheless, allow me to drag up an earlier shot of the top (which is more to remind me to ask the kids about the camera than anything):

Date: 2007/05/31 07:56:32, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Sure looks like it.  ('course my insight and a buck will buy you something off the value meal board at Wendy's)

For comparison:

Crap.  I was going to use PaintShop to highlight some of the things I noticed that matched up really well to the picture above, but I'm now being told by Mr. Gates' Demon that PaintShop doesn't feel like coming out to play right now.

This is so not gonna be a good day.

Date: 2007/05/31 08:03:06, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Hang 'em High his balls.

I hate spammers.

Date: 2007/05/31 08:47:38, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Ok, since PaintShop wasn't co-operating and since I really didn't have anything better to do, and because "The only thing we have to fear is fear itself", I put on my jungle hat, armed myself with an elephant gun, a tazer, and an M72A1 LAW rocket, loaded up on dry food stuffs and water, adjusted my night vision goggles, and headed in.

After a harrowing adventure involving cannibal pygmies and a large hairy creature that seemed to be a cross between bigfoot and my son, I located the camera and ran for my life.

How're these?

Date: 2007/05/31 10:29:43, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Ichthyic @ May 30 2007,13:21)
oh, and, nice summary of the Clouserbot's interactions on PT, Lou.  Pretty much dead on.


I kill me.


Date: 2007/05/31 10:34:53, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Emanuel Goldstein @ May 31 2007,08:45)
blah blah blah ... Evil Atheist Conspiracy... blah blah, whine, blah blah commie bastards... blah blah ... projection remark...blah blah... play martyr card....

...speaking of spammers...

Date: 2007/05/31 11:09:26, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Y'know what'd be cool?  If someone took the time to make creobot skins for the bots in Unreal Tournament (UT '99, coz 2003 sucked, and though I like the new game types in 2k4 (Onslaught RULZZZZZZ!!!!!11one11one), it plays like 2k3 unfortunately.  '99 is still the shitte.  Lookin' forward to 2k7.)

Just sayin'.

Date: 2007/05/31 15:41:56, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (guthrie @ May 31 2007,11:41)
Now now, why stoop to their level?  I mean they only produced that game last year in which you could run around killing unbelievers.

Can any comic genius come up with a Princess Bride one?  I'm thinking the Sicilian saying something superficially intelligent.

As it happens, UT bots are very customizable, and I do in fact have one that uses a voice pack of clips from The Princess Bride, so when he kills someone he taunts them with "Never go in against a Sicilian when death is on the line" or "My way's not very sportsmanlike" or one of several other clips.

Interestingly enough, that particular bot's name (out of the box, I didn't change it) is Ichthys.  Hmmmm...

I also have various and sundry models, skins, and voice packs of Buffy, Yoda, Picard, Data, Worf, MP & the Holy Grail, etc. that clever little fans have made and shared.  It's quite the menagerie upon which to release my stress from time to time.

I confess, I really enjoy ultra-violent first person shooter type video games if they're done well.  I suppose I have to hand in my PeaceLuvinHippie ID Card now don't I?  Bummer.

(Now where did I put that Doom CD?)

Date: 2007/06/01 06:29:13, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (PennyBright @ May 31 2007,20:04)
it's been tainted by tard.

What a lovely phrase.  Sorta just rolls off the tongue.

Date: 2007/06/01 13:53:36, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Please allow me to interrupt this discussion of hot sauce for a moment, just to say thanks for all the time and effort put into identifying my bone (snicker).

Ichthyic, Dr. GH, afarensis, you three especially.

Thanks, I really enjoyed and appreciated it.


I now return you to your hot sauce discussion.

Date: 2007/06/01 14:34:14, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Alan Fox @ June 01 2007,14:03)
Apparently they were both invented in England

I heard the Portuguese (who also had a hand in inventing the French language, along with the Spanish) came up with vindaloo as a way of preserving meat. Incidentally, the marinade of chillies, garlic, ginger and onion, pounded to a paste with vinegar, is very similar to the basic ingredients for jerk chicken.

BTW Hi Lou, glad to see you back.

LOL.  That cracked me up.  Good to be back.

Quote (PardonMe Chatterbox @ June 01 2007,14:27)
Lou, are you implying that my dick jokes and observations about hot sauce were not helpful??

Heaven forbid!

Date: 2007/06/01 18:40:33, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Born Defective 77 Times and Counting @ June 01 2007,sometime today)
... details of Big Bang Cosmology, that were revealed just last year ...

Doesn't get out much does he?  Maybe if he spent a little less time reading the tripe at UD and a little more...

Oh to hell with it.  Why bother?

Date: 2007/06/01 19:07:34, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Born Defective 77 Times and Counting @ 05/31/2007, 4:11 pm)
I believe the ID concept of “front loading” explains the adaptability to varying climates and selection pressures a lot better than the RM/NS scenario does.

Well, I for one feel much better about global climate change, then.  We've been front-loaded to adapt, so why worry?

I'm buyin' a big honkin' SUV tomorrow morning.

Date: 2007/06/02 15:10:23, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (stevestory @ June 02 2007,15:06)
Wouldn't you pay money to watch her try to argue with Heddle that ID is in fact science? I would. I'd buy a ticket. The hubris in that woman is amazing.

*raises hand and waves it around*

I'd pay.

Date: 2007/06/02 22:12:34, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Arden Chatfield @ June 02 2007,20:34)
Ooh, check out FTK's inane PT comments on this!:

Maybe he wasn’t up to par, but it doesn’t matter.

No matter WHAT he did, after he became associated with the ID movement he was finished.

Who ya kiddin?

Translated: "okay, I admit there were loads of totally valid reasons not to tenure him, but you STILL discriminated against him because you don't like ID!"

Wow. Just, wow.

Y'know my first thought about that was:

"Yeah, but it could have been a real bunch of Marines prayin' like that."

Date: 2007/06/02 22:30:02, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Ftk @ June 02 2007,22:25)
Good God, Steve, I think the lab is quite new...patience, hon.  I'm sure we'll hear more soon.

I await the ID research with baited breath and my heart all aflutter, personally.

Date: 2007/06/04 09:28:28, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Does "Damned near died laughing" count as a Near Death Experience?

Date: 2007/06/04 21:03:24, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Y'all hear about this?

Bunch o' Letters found in a laundry room

Heard a snippet 'bout it on NPR this morning.  Besides the ones mentioned in the CNN story, some of them were from Isaac Newton (the real one, not the clown across the alley there).

Wanted to post this earlier, but my 'puter's been locking up repeatedly.  Think my second HD is taking the long walk...

Date: 2007/06/05 08:18:16, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Oh it's just frakkin priceless that the example he uses throughout the book as "ooooo it's so complex, godmustadunit" is the perfect counterexample to his IC horsecrap.

Like rain on your wedding day, baby.

Date: 2007/06/07 11:29:23, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Oh thank the FSM.  I was having withdrawal symptoms.

Good that The Bar is back.

Date: 2007/06/07 11:35:48, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (snoeman @ June 06 2007,00:40)
Quote (afarensis @ June 05 2007,22:34)
If he is under your control and you force him to learn some routine for a box of candy, he must comply - whether you are operating a circus act or a lab. But beyond a certain point, it all sounds like cruelty to me.

Apparently, the woman has never dealt with primates before, they are never completely under our control and if the don't want to comply, they don't.

Thanks.  This fully explains my daily exasperation with my kids (4 1/2 yro and 2 1/2 yro).   :p

...and my pair of teenagers, as it happens.


Date: 2007/06/08 07:38:19, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Wesley R. Elsberry @ June 08 2007,07:14)
I suppose people don't look at the rest of the fora here.

You mean there's MORE than AtBC???????

I never get the memos...

Date: 2007/06/11 09:32:33, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I wrote this at another board, and kinda liked it.  Thought I'd share...

Yea verily, hie thee hence to Uncommonly Dense, for therein lies a covey of blind men bloviating upon the beauty of the midday's sunset, and forevermore shalt those with eyes to see and ears to hear snicker at thy "wisdom".

Date: 2007/06/11 11:26:40, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Oh lookie!  He's got some Canadian Competition!

Date: 2007/06/11 15:15:59, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (phonon @ June 11 2007,14:37)
The whole point of the post was...

The idea that she even had a point, and that someone was able to discern what it might have been is in fact a huge evolutionary step forward for Denyse.

Next thing you know someone might accuse her of developing a brain...

or not.

Date: 2007/06/11 15:57:35, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Dr.GH @ June 11 2007,15:48)
Quote (phonon @ June 11 2007,14:37)
bornagain77 makes sure the tard is just right.
Thanks Denyse,
You woke me up to the fact that all the weight of historical evidence points to the fact that something profound happened within the last 10,000 years to the Human species. I was giving more weight to the mtDNA studies which showed “Eve” originated, I believe the estimate was/is, 100,000 years ago. Thus I was giving more weight to the highly speculative molecular clock presumptions of DNA analysis than I was giving to actual history of humans as revealed by archeology. I wonder what was this profound event? Could it actually be true that humans were only created within the last 10,000 years as the historical evidence or Did humans wander around in caves for a hundred thousand years before coming together in societies?
Since I assume, based on nothing, that humans have only been around for 10,000 years, then all that genetic data must be false. Forget the evidence of humans wandering around from cave to cave long before 10,000 years ago. And then we should definitely assume that since history started about 10,000 years ago (which it didn't) then humans also started about then. Makes sense, no? No.

The whole point of the post was to minimize the connection between ID and creationism, although ID is merely a breed of it. So bornagain again sets the record straight.
The debate over the timing of Humans aquisition of profound knowledge is really besides the point. The main point that matters is “Was Man created or did he evolve?” I think an unbiased examination of the fossil record shows, as Richard Leaky has stated “An abrupt arrival of Man in the fossil record rather than the gradual process of evolving.” As well the principle of genetic entropy has sealed the fate of the RM/NS scenario. So in answer to the question of Man’s origins we can say, with a high level of scientific integrity that the fossil record and primary principles of molecular biology, that all empirical evidence not weighted with suggestive presumptions point to the sudden creation of Man as predicted by the Theistic philosophy.

It burns my eyes!

Let me make just a few observations (I'll make them anyway so you might as well "let" me);

1) There are ideographic artifacts from H. erectus burials  (these burials might merely be where an erectus fell into a hole while holding on to some of their stuff).

2) There are more ideographic artifacts from 75,000 yreas ago,

3) there is lots of ideographic stuff from 35,000 YBP and onward.

The invention of writing around 8,000 YBP,

Schmandt-Besserat, Denise
1992 Before Writing Volume I:  From counting to cuneiform Austin: University of Texas Press

made the first technological "memory" which could be taught generally.  Even the most ancient "narrative" artifacts (see Alexander Marshack,  The Roots of Civilization  1991, Singapore: Palace Press and Alabama: Books International) would have required a superior oral tradition to be employed.

The development of writing followed the first known agriculture by thousands of years (figs domesticated about 11,500 YBP, or if you like dogs, about 20,000 YBP).

Mitochondrial Eve- ~180,000 to ~200,000 YBP based on "mollecular clock" arguments.  Y chromosome Adam clocked in ~ 80,000 YBP by "mollecular clocks."  (Note:  I don't count on mollecular "clocks" for much at all beyond any relative dating scheme).

The notion of people "wandering from cave to cave" is merely an accident of preservation- open air sites are difficult to find even when they did survive erosion, and very unlikely to obtain dating samples.

The rest is manure too rich to be spread in the field.

Dear Dr. GH,

You obviously miss the point.  She very clearly qualified her treatise on the supercool mysterious Goddunnit thing that happened 10,000 ybp with "Apart from wordless outliers like the Willendorf Venus and the Cave of Lascaux," which loosely translated from DenyseWorldeese means "If you ignore the humongous mountains of evidence to the contrary..."

Therefore, she is correct.

I hope I have been of some service,


Date: 2007/06/11 16:06:08, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (stevestory @ June 10 2007,22:25)
Woodward closed by setting the date for the end of Darwinism’s reign as the dominant paradigm at ...wait for it...2025.

When will this annoying 'wait for it' meme die?

It'll be over... wait for it... never, apparently.

Date: 2007/06/11 19:18:25, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Thanks for all that, Ich.  Do continue.

I was about ten when I saw Jaws at the drive in movies.  That sucker was huge.

With that permanent scarring in mind, here's my thing about sharks...

Sharks come in two basic flavors:

Hammerheads, which look really cool but want to eat me for lunch.

All the Rest.

The "All the Rest" flavor can be broken down into two subflavors...

The kinds that want to eat me.


The other kinds that want to eat me.

They are very cool to look at as long as they're behind the aquarium glass, but in case I haven't made it clear, I'm afeared o' sharks.  They want to eat me.

Date: 2007/06/11 19:59:37, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Thanks Ichthyic.  I've actually been told most all of that before by other folks who also know what they're talking about.

I really appreciate your efforts, but my fear of sharks has nothing whatever to do with reality or reason.  I'm perfectly aware of that, as well.  They still want to eat me, though.  I can see it in their soulless black eyes.

Sometimes that shark he looks right into ya. Right into your eyes. And, you know, the thing about a shark... he's got lifeless eyes. Black eyes. Like a doll's eyes.

When he comes at ya, doesn't seem to be living... until he bites ya, and those black eyes roll over white and then... ah then you hear that terrible high-pitched screamin'. The ocean turns red, and despite all the poundin' and the hollerin', they all come in and they... rip you to pieces.

You know by the end of that first dawn, lost a hundred men. I don't know how many sharks, maybe a thousand.

I know how many men, they averaged six an hour.

On Thursday morning, Chief, I bumped into a friend of mine, Herbie Robinson from Cleveland. Baseball player. Boatswain's mate. I thought he was asleep. I reached over to wake him up. Bobbed up, down in the water just like a kinda top. Upended. Well, he'd been bitten in half below the waist.

Noon, the fifth day, Mr. Hooper, a Lockheed Ventura saw us. He swung in low and he saw us... he was a young pilot, a lot younger than Mr. Hooper. Anyway, he saw us and he come in low and three hours later a big fat PBY comes down and starts to pick us up.

You know that was the time I was most frightened... waitin' for my turn. I'll never put on a lifejacket again. So, eleven hundred men went in the water; 316 men come out and the sharks took the rest, June the 29th, 1945

Date: 2007/06/11 20:17:19, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (J-Dog @ June 11 2007,20:02)
Remember that scene in Jaws, when Quint was describing the fate of the crew of the Indianapolis?  Yeah.  I thought so; one of the best scenes in the movie.  

From the Jaws Trivia Page:
Quint's tale of the USS Indianapolis was conceived by playwright Howard Sackler, lengthened by screenwriter John Milius and rewritten by Robert Shaw following a disagreement between screenwriters Peter Benchley and Carl Gottlieb. Shaw presented his text, and Benchley and Gottlieb agreed that this was exactly what was needed. Whoever was responsible, Quint got the date of the sinking wrong, claiming it was June 29, 1945, when in reality it was 12:14 am on July 30th, 1945. Universal has toyed with the idea of making the "Indianapolis" incident into a film, using a young Quint as the lead, ever since. Note that June 29, however, is the date (in the film) that the young boy was eaten by the shark, as can be seen in the hand-written "reward" notice.

Heh, I was just reading a web page about the real story.  Interesting stuff.

And I'd say that that's one of the best scenes in movie history.  Shaw did an awesome job with that.  Oddly enough, Jaws is one of my favorite movies EVAH.

Date: 2007/06/11 20:22:25, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Albatrossity2 @ June 11 2007,20:15)
Shark fear is an interesting and perhaps primal fear, if my youngest daughter is any indication. When she was about 2 years old, I attended a Biophysical Society meeting in Baltimore. We had a chance to visit the then-new Baltimore Aquarium, which has a large circular tank with sharks and a spiral ramp down the middle of the tank. So the sharks basically circle you in the tank as you walk along. My daughter was excited about most of the interesting fish that swam by, but would recoil and cling to me every time a big shark came by. I always wondered if anyone knew any more about this sort of reaction.  When (at what age) does it kick in?  Is it universal?  Who knows?

Very cool, though.  There's a tank with sharks at the aquarium in Wilmington (just south of here), and last time I was there there were two divers in the tank.  Their scuba gear was wired up so they were giving a talk to some elementary school kids who were all sitting on the carpet in rapt attention.

I had to stop and listen, and the kids got to ask some questions of the divers.  Really good questions, too.  It was neat.

Date: 2007/06/12 06:13:52, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (skeptic @ June 11 2007,20:57)
...and I don't recall her ever inferring she could...


Please learn the difference.  Perhaps when you figure out if you're coming or going, you'll have a better shot at understanding a conversation.

Oh, and you might skip the Larry "I only read one third of the text before I open my yap" Faroutman School of Reading Comprehension next time as well.

Date: 2007/06/12 10:42:36, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I think it's just all those nasty looking teeth.

And the fact that they're (for all intents and purposes) invisible... until they eat me.

I'm not so scared I don't go to the beach or swim in the ocean, but I'd have serious doubts about taking a swim from a boat on the ocean, even if I could see the shore line.

Date: 2007/06/12 11:24:14, Link
Author: Lou FCD
The girls send their thanks for that.

Date: 2007/06/12 14:42:51, Link
Author: Lou FCD
The full article is @ LiveScience

Paleontologists have discovered a new small gliding reptile in 220 million-year-old sediments of a quarry on the Virginia-North Carolina border. The new creature is named Mecistotrachelos apeoros, meaning "soaring, long-necked" and is about the size of a blue jay from head to tail.

"One of the really neat things about the new glider is the feet,” said Nick Fraser of the Virginia Museum of Natural History, who discovered the two fossils. “They are preserved in a hooked posture which is unusual and strongly suggests a grasping habit. I'm convinced it was using its hind limbs for grasping branches."

Fraser noted that the Triassic Period reptile probably fed on insects, scuttling up tree trunks and foraging on the way, before gliding onto neighboring trees. Two other reptiles with similar gliding membranes are known from the Triassic, but Fraser noted that they have much shorter necks and therefore are more like modern gliding lizards.

The findings are detailed in the latest issue of the Journal of Vertebrate Paleontology.

Date: 2007/06/12 14:53:40, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Ichthyic @ June 12 2007,14:48)
I have several stories of diving with sharks I could share, if you want.

Please do..

As for scuba diving, I'm afraid that although I always wanted to take a proper course and take it up, I waited too long.

My spinal issues would never let me do that now.

Date: 2007/06/12 14:56:59, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Older story I missed, also via LiveScience

The rise and fall of species on Earth might be driven in part by the undulating motions of our solar system as it travels through the disk of the Milky Way, scientists say.

Two years ago, scientists at the University of California, Berkeley found the marine fossil record shows that biodiversity—the number of different species alive on the planet—increases and decreases on a 62-million-year cycle. At least two of the Earth’s great mass extinctions—the Permian extinction 250 million years ago and the Ordovician extinction about 450 million years ago—correspond with peaks of this cycle, which can’t be explained by evolutionary theory.

Now, a team of researchers at the University of Kansas (KU) have come up with an out-of-this-world explanation. Their idea hinges upon the fact that, appearances aside, stars are not fixed in space. They move around, sometimes rushing headlong through galaxies, or approaching close enough to one another for brief cosmic trysts.

In particular, our Sun moves toward and away from the Milky Way’s center, and also up and down through the galactic plane. One complete up-and-down cycle takes 64 million years— suspiciously similar to Earth’s biodiversity cycle.

Probably should read the rest of the blurb at the link above to get the full gist of it.  I didn't want to paste too much of it...

Date: 2007/06/12 16:08:52, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Okee doke.  I have a few questions...

Is that blood hanging out of her nostril looking thing?  (And what is that structure?  Since they don't breathe air, it seems like there wouldn't be much need for a nostril per se, unless that's their super duper sniffer thing that lets them smell Lou FCDs in the water from miles away... in which case it would seem that sniffers evolved quite a little while ago, seeing as how they have them on the front of their face, just like us mammal types.)

That red stuff in between her teeth is suspiciously reminiscent of the mental picture I have of my own large intestine.  Is that chum or do they always look like they just ate somebody?

What's up with that bite mark looking thing back by where I would guess her gills are?  Is that normal looking, or is that some sort of injury?

How do you know she was a she?  Are reproductive organs that noticeable on sharks?  Or is there some other obvious characteristic of sharks that identifies gender?

Date: 2007/06/12 16:17:29, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (PennyBright @ June 12 2007,16:03)
Hmm.... googling in another tab, I find that what I remember as the boston aquarium is now called (maybe always was) the New England Aquarium.   And they've got a webcam, on which I have just watched a shark swim past.  - the static cam I can use with my dinky dialup connection. - the static and streaming cams.

Oh, thanks for that.  I just saw a shark, too!  Creepy.

I recommend broadband if for no other reason...

Date: 2007/06/12 17:00:23, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Ichthyic @ June 12 2007,16:28)
possibly, she recently fed so there might have been some "backwash"


you are correct; sharks have nares (nostrils).  also one of the best senses of smell you're likely to find.  can 'smell' blood at the parts per million level.

I thought I had heard that somewhere, and wondered how accurate that was.

Quote (Ichthyic @ June 12 2007,16:28)
as to why they are located where they are, it's very much like why you eyes are located on the front of your head; essentially they have "stereoscopic" smell, which allows for better directional location of source.

Well that makes sense (no pun intended).  So is that a trait passed down from our common ancestor, or is that something that we and they evolved in parallel?  (I can't put my finger on the real biology term at the moment.  Pain killers.)

Quote (Ichthyic @ June 12 2007,16:28)
this one had indeed recently just fed, as noted above.  they don't normally look like that.

I see.  After thinking about it, it also makes sense seeing as how they tend not to use napkins and such.  Barbarians.

Quote (Ichthyic @ June 12 2007,16:28)
excellent observation.

Thanks.  **sticks chest out proudly**

Quote (Ichthyic @ June 12 2007,16:28)
It is indeed an injury.  The critters these guys commonly feed on (elephant seals), are rather large and nasty in and of themselves, and most white sharks have scars from where their prey items have managed to get a hit or two in (typically, you will see parallel lines where the claws from the seal dragged across the skin, or puncture marks near the jaw area from bites).

Oww.  It's a rough world out there, ain't it?

Quote (Ichthyic @ June 12 2007,16:28)
some of the scars are possibly also scars from other white sharks, either from rare scuffles, or mating scars from where males have bitten them to hang on (note that this has not been observed directly in white sharks, but it has for other species).

Geez, talk about rough sex...

Quote (Ichthyic @ June 12 2007,16:28)
yes, mature males have what are known as claspers:

which are modifications of the pelvic fins which act as essentially double-jointed penises.  they only use one at a time, however.

Y'know, if I... nevermind.

Quote (Ichthyic @ June 12 2007,16:28)
oh, btw, yeah, sharks all have internal ferilization, though there is quite a large variability in gestation styles amongst the different species.  some are oviparous (lay eggs), some are ovoviparous (hatch egs internally, and give birth to live young), and some are essentially viviparous, much like mammals, some even with what amounts to a placental system.

IIRC, white sharks are ovoviparous, and they also exhibit what is known as "intrauterine cannibalism", meaning that the embryos tend to munch on each other in the womb.

dog-eat-dog from the get-go, basically.

here's a blurb on it:

Holy cannibalism, Batman!

Again, thanks for sharing.

Date: 2007/06/12 17:31:45, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Ichthyic @ June 12 2007,17:23)
but, yes, they did indeed separate hundreds of millions of years ago, and while sharks really haven't changed tremendously since (and not much at all in say, the last 140 million years or so),

Well, when you're at the top of the food chain in your ecosystem...

"Don't mess with success" and all that.

Date: 2007/06/12 18:14:59, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Better than a hat tip, I think!


Yeah, I wouldn't take every word as gospel (heheh), but it's striking nonetheless.

Date: 2007/06/12 18:17:23, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Apparently, Apollos doesn't actually read UD...

Date: 2007/06/12 18:45:23, Link
Author: Lou FCD
But this

Also, try to avoid reducing ID to a theological conundrum, and deal more directly with the scientific issues, and I think you might enjoy your time there.

is what leads me to believe he can't possibly read UD.  They are their own worst enemy on that score.

Maybe he comments with his eyes closed or somethin'.

Date: 2007/06/12 18:47:51, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Ichthyic @ June 12 2007,17:39)
it's covered under the heading:

evolutionary stasis.

here's an example:

I think Wes has dabbled in this area as well.

I'm wading in...  I'm sure I'll be back with questions...

Date: 2007/06/12 18:51:45, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Fish heads, fish heads. Roley Poley fish heads.

Y'know, back in my fundy days, I was very much of the "Catholics aren't real Christians" crowd.

Now I find that whole thing hysterical.

Date: 2007/06/12 19:57:12, Link
Author: Lou FCD
JanieBelle defends the ToE in the comments at her YouTube channel.

Some clown just commented "Evolution too,is still a theory..."

Did she do good?

Date: 2007/06/12 19:58:09, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Kristine @ June 12 2007,19:47)
ROTFLMAO! *Claps* And that's my favorite episode of Robot Chicken BTW.

*Slaps head* Hey! I've got an idea for a testable hypothesis!

Let's flood the Creation Museum with water for 40 days and 40 nights, and see if the exhibits sort themselves according to the strata that we see in the fossil record, with the paper mache trilobites below the dinosaurs and the flowering plants above the trees.

You telling me there isn't any Flood-themed water park in the joint? What a rip-off! :)

Now there's a science experiment I'd love to see...

Date: 2007/06/12 20:16:59, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Thank you.  (uh, I mean she thanks you...)


Date: 2007/06/12 22:08:27, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Janie might have to add him to the cast of The Lilith Quotient.  She's already mentioned Pope Albert and Co.'s freakish obsession with bad Latin, so he'd fit right in.

Date: 2007/06/12 22:51:54, Link
Author: Lou FCD
via CNN

The beginning of the article:

LOS ANGELES, California (AP) -- Don Herbert, who as television's "Mr. Wizard" introduced generations of young viewers to the joys of science, died Tuesday. He was 89.

Herbert, who had bone cancer, died at his suburban Bell Canyon home, said his son-in-law, Tom Nikosey.

"He really taught kids how to use the thinking skills of a scientist," said former colleague Steve Jacobs. He worked with Herbert on a 1980s show that echoed the original 1950s "Watch Mr. Wizard" series, which became a fond baby boomer memory.

In "Watch Mr. Wizard," which was produced from 1951 to 1964 and received a Peabody Award in 1954, Herbert turned TV into an entertaining classroom. On a simple, workshop-like set, he demonstrated experiments using household items.

"He modeled how to predict and measure and analyze. ... The show today might seem slow but it was in-depth and forced you to think along," Jacobs said. "You were learning about the forces of nature."

Date: 2007/06/13 00:29:59, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Kristine @ June 13 2007,00:13)
They say 2025, party over, oops, outtatime...

So tonight I say we party like it's 1999:

I was drinking when I wrote this, so sue me if it goes astray.

I'm glad I checked this place one last time before I went to bed.

Drunken Kristine channeling Prince was definitely worth it.

Date: 2007/06/13 07:12:04, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Oh, that's awesome.

Every time ftk speaks, all you have to do now is -

Date: 2007/06/13 07:15:20, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Crap, she's moved on to the micro/macro thing already, and there's no card for that yet.  She's a slippery one...

Date: 2007/06/13 07:37:42, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Ichthyic @ June 13 2007,02:17)

that post had style, substance, and wit.

dead on point too.

I give it a 9.5

my only complaint is that there was a slight stretching sensation going from Denyse to Dembski, even with the very apt use of poetic ala Prince.

I woke up this morning with it in my head.

The post that keeps on giving.

9.0 - only because Kristine needs to finish at least a few verses.

Date: 2007/06/13 08:03:20, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Darth Robo @ June 13 2007,06:41)
Heard of this before.  As the sun wobbles through the galaxy like a drunk, asteroids may also be disturbed and get thrown our way.  (I think it was on that Sam Neill 'Space' documentary.)

I rather enjoyed that documentary.  We live in an effin shooting gallery, that's for sure.

Now add the motion of our galactic orbit which takes us closer to the bow shock every 64 million years where we're less protected from the extra-galactic cosmic rays as presented by these guys.

There sure is a lot of stuff out there trying to kill us.

Oh, and Ichthyic's super volcanoes.

...and comets from the Kuiper Belt and the Oort Cloud.

...and NEOs that we haven't discovered yet.

...and CME's that our own sun keeps spitting at us.  Traitor bitch.  I bet she thinks that's funny.

...and we can't forget supernovas and gamma ray bursts that could fry the atmosphere clean off if they occur too close.  (**casts a suspicious eye around our stellar neighborhood**)

...and the big honkin' "oh I think I'll eat a few million stars today" black hole at the center of the galaxy.  I don't care what they say, I don't trust that guy.  He's kinda shady lookin'.  (or shady not-lookin', I suppose)

...and the Andromeda galaxy which wants us to stop by and say hello, up close and personal.  I tried to turn that invitation down once, but that place has a certain pull to it...

...and psycho humans with WMDs - like Dubya fer instance.

...oh, and sharks.  Ichthyic assures me that they mostly have no interest in eating me, but I'm in denial on that one.  :)

Date: 2007/06/13 08:17:31, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Hello there, Spags.  Welcome.

I think you'll find the moderation here quite sane and rather forgiving.

I for one am glad to be rid of that train-wreck that is AFDave.  Thousands of comments without a single coherent thought or argument AFICT.  He had plenty of time and space to make his case here.  He didn't.  Not one single time on one single point, to the best of my knowledge.  He may in fact hold the world record for most consecutive incorrect statements.

And his abuse and torture of the English language to try to make his various arguments was well nigh criminal.  Good riddance.  And let's not even go into what he tried to do with Portuguese...

Again, welcome.


Date: 2007/06/13 10:23:24, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Kristine @ June 13 2007,09:42)
I was dreamin' when I wrote this, so sue me if it goes astray -
But when I woke up this morning, could’ve sworn it was
Fudgement Day!
The sky was all people flying up with the Rapture –where?
Up to God for jelly doughnuts – you know I didn’t even care!
They say 2025 evo over, oops, outtatime –
So tonight I’m gonna party like I never evolved no spine!


If you likey poem you see,
You gets a shimmy-shimmy from me. :)

Here to collect my shimmy!

(I liked "drinkin" better in that first line, though)

Speaking of poems, you have one vote in the poetry contest @ UDoJ, and Rich has none.  Neither of you have voted yet, and voting closes tomorrow night...

Date: 2007/06/13 10:34:44, Link
Author: Lou FCD
It was more like "when this happens..."

There was one on the other night (I had stuff I had to attend to and missed the middle part, damnit) that was like The Top Ten Threats To Life On Earth or something.  Similar premise, and also well done, from what I saw.

Neil deGrasse Tyson was on it a couple of times.

I love that guy.

Date: 2007/06/13 10:40:22, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (SpaghettiSawUs @ June 13 2007,10:01)
Hey Shirley,
hugs in return (aww shucks, my first Shirley hug, things really are looking up).

The coolest kick in the teeth on this here interweb thingy is when Shirley signs off with

"No Hugs For Thugs"

That's when you know someone is f'd up.

Something about her sparing use of it perhaps, that magnifies the impact.

JanieBelle's been working on an homage, but can't quite find the best word...

"No Kisses for ___"

Date: 2007/06/13 14:21:43, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Ichthyic @ June 13 2007,13:53)

...oh, and sharks.  Ichthyic assures me that they mostly have no interest in eating me, but I'm in denial on that one.

oh, did I forget to mention the giant, planet-eating space sharks?

I did, didn't I.


Crap.  Just when I thought it was safe to go back in the vacuum...

Date: 2007/06/13 14:22:38, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Ichthyic @ June 13 2007,13:53)
Quote (Darth Robo @ June 13 2007,08:36)
"I rather enjoyed that documentary."

So did I.  I thought it was quite funny that in nearly every episode, he was like "And if (such and such) happens, we're all gonna DIE."


Yousa peoples gonna die?

We am if we don't get off this frickin' rock soon...

Date: 2007/06/13 14:57:41, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (J-Dog @ June 13 2007,14:40)
Quote (stevestory @ June 12 2007,21:08)

For your viewing pleasure, the link is to some great comments by real scientists trashing Behe's book at Amazon.

Holy crap, Dude is getting whooped on the science and of course falls back to Hitler, communism, planned parenthood, Jesus, Satan, the whole enchilada, in one comment!

Date: 2007/06/13 15:11:32, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Man, O Son.  That was like a Tard Burrito.

Date: 2007/06/13 17:17:51, Link
Author: Lou FCD
On the AP wire

BEIJING (AP) -- The remains of a giant, birdlike dinosaur as tall as the formidable tyrannosaur have been found in China, a surprising discovery that indicates a more complicated evolutionary process for birds than originally thought, scientists said Wednesday.

Fossilized bones uncovered in the Erlian Basin of northern China's Inner Mongolia region show that the specimen was about 26 feet long, 16 feet tall and weighed 3,000 pounds, said Xu Xing, a paleontologist at the Institute of Vertebrate Paleontology & Paleoanthropology in Beijing.

The height is comparable to the meat-eating tyrannosaurs. But the dinosaur, called Gigantoraptor elrianensis, also had a beak and slender legs and likely had feathers. It was 35 times larger than its likely close relation, the Caudiperyx, a small, feathered dinosaur species, Xu said.

That puts the Gigantoraptor's existence at odds with prevailing theories that dinosaurs became smaller as they evolved into birds and that bigger dinosaurs had less birdlike characteristics, he said.

More at the link.

Date: 2007/06/13 17:21:36, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Also on the AP wire

MIAMI (AP) -- The fossils of feathered dinosaurs whose discoveries helped firm hypotheses on the origin of birds will be exhibited publicly in the U.S. for the first time this weekend.

The roughly 120-million-year-old remains being displayed at the Miami Science Museum starting Saturday were all found in northeastern China beginning in 1998 and helped quiet - though not totally muffle - decades-old debates on the link between dinosaurs and birds. Most have never been seen outside China.

"For 150 years, people argued over the origin of birds," said Matt Lamanna, a paleontologist at the Carnegie Museum of Natural History in Pittsburgh and an adviser to the "Dinosaurs of China" exhibit. "This debate was still raging in the middle of the 1990s and then somebody went to China and found these fossils."

More at the above link.

Date: 2007/06/13 17:48:17, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Ichthyic @ June 13 2007,17:37)
timely post, give the recent discovery posted on Pharyngula today, which I see you also noticed.

mind if i steal the link?

(too late, I took the liberty.)


you might want to join in on the thread over there too.

Wait.  I don't think I've been to Pharyngula today...

I don't think I have, but I do see the post there.

Of course I wouldn't have minded anyway.

On may way over there in another tab...

Date: 2007/06/13 18:01:22, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Ok, now my brain has caught up with my fingers.

I'm all good now, perhaps I can read for comprehension.

Date: 2007/06/13 18:27:38, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Funny.  He told me that there used to be a Steve, but now he's dead and moderation has stopped.

Date: 2007/06/13 18:37:52, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Descendants of research monkeys are on the loose in Puerto Rico and are eluding capture by farmers, trappers, and scientists.

SAN JUAN, Puerto Rico (AP) -- Authorities in Puerto Rico are using cages and mangos to try to trap hundreds of marauding monkeys - descendants of escaped research animals - and hope to send them off to sanctuaries or labs, or to kill them.

Since the first eight government traps were set out two weeks ago, the primates have snatched the bait and eluded capture - drawing ridicule from local farmers who blame the monkeys for devastating melon, pepper and pumpkin crops over the last decade.

Some more from the article that I found interesting...

The Rhesus monkeys, native to Pakistan India and Nepal, and lightning-quick red monkeys from Central Africa were brought to this Caribbean island 30 years ago to be part of scientific experiments.

Their feral population has since ballooned from about 100 to an estimated 1,000 - prompting growers in the southwestern town of Lajas to switch to raising hay, which the animals do not eat, said Georgie Ferrer, leader of the local farmers' organization.

Ferrer also said the animals threaten bird populations by eating eggs, and some carry the Herpes B virus, which can be fatal to humans. Fears that they could transmit the disease intensified after a farmer bitten two years ago in Lajas died of unknown causes, he said.

So um... one cannot help but wonder what he was doing when he got bitten... if indeed he was bitten.  How likely is that that he got his "unknown causes" from a bite, as opposed to the uh.. regular.. way?

Date: 2007/06/13 19:26:03, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Ichthyic @ June 13 2007,19:04)
btw, I mentioned Sean Van Sommeran earlier.

well, Jeff Corwin paid a vist a while back, and I think that episode just so happens to be airing right this very instant on the animal planet channel.

5pm pacific time.

he's in South Africa in the beginning of that episode, but IIRC, he ends up right where we were working in CA.

Heh.  "Planet Earth"?  I happen to be watching it, purely coincidence.  I missed the first few minutes of it, though.

Mama whale is starving at the moment.  :(

Date: 2007/06/13 19:29:01, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I hear you have to watch out 28 weeks later, as well.

Date: 2007/06/13 19:46:54, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Ack, it's that east coast west coast satellite thing.  I'm watching Planet Earth on Animal Planet and a great white shark is currently eating a seal about four or five feet above the water's surface...

Date: 2007/06/13 19:59:26, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Mama and baby humpback made it safely to the Arctic and are feeding like MAD WaLEzzzz on krill.  FYI, in case anyone was worried about them...

Date: 2007/06/13 20:01:57, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Ichthyic @ June 13 2007,19:54)
fascinating coincidence.

Indeed.  They just replayed in slow mo the shark breaching the water with the seal in its mouth.

Cool shot.  It took them a month of shooting to get that shot.

Date: 2007/06/14 07:52:46, Link
Author: Lou FCD
In other shark news...

Ga. Aquarium Probes Whale Shark's Death

ATLANTA (AP) -- Georgia Aquarium officials say it may be months before they know what caused Wednesday's death of another whale shark, the second this year at the only facility outside Asia that displays the huge, rare fish.

Norton's death also came only a few weeks after two new whale sharks arrived at the aquarium from Taiwan. At the time, Taiwan fishery officials had said they were satisfied the aquarium provided the quality care the young whale sharks - named Yushan, which means "Jade Mountain" and Taroko, named after a national park in Taiwan - would need.

Aquarium officials planned a necropsy Wednesday afternoon for Norton. His death came five months after the death of Ralph, another whale shark that was among the aquarium's first stars after it opened in 2005.

More at the above link...

Date: 2007/06/14 07:58:12, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Has anyone brought Prof. Steve Steve the news?

MEMPHIS, Tenn. (AP) -- A giant panda at the Memphis Zoo has miscarried, an ultrasound test discovered Wednesday.

Ya Ya, a 6-year-old panda on loan from China, was artificially inseminated in January. The miscarriage was caused by her low level of the hormone progesterone, and she was not harmed by the pregnancy, zoo president Chuck Brady said shortly after the ultrasound was completed.

Ya Ya was artificially inseminated after she and Le Le, her 8-year-old male companion, from China, failed to mate. Brady said the zoo will attempt to mate the pandas again in January or February and will try artificial insemination again if that fails.

Pandas are notoriously poor breeders - one reason their species is endangered - and females have only three days a year in which they can conceive.

Three other U.S. zoos - San Diego, Washington and Atlanta - have giant pandas. The most recent panda cub born in the U.S. is Mei Lan, who was born in September at the Atlanta zoo.

It was short, so that's the full article.

Date: 2007/06/14 11:14:41, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (SpaghettiSawUs @ June 14 2007,11:07)
Yoikz!! I iz @ teh wr0ng c0nfernse...

... wiv teh scooby fanz!!!


Date: 2007/06/14 19:31:09, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Arden Chatfield @ June 14 2007,15:29)

Only 24! By god, you young punks don't know anything! Why, back in MY day, we had to walk 20 miles in the snow to attend the Scopes trial, and 25 miles back again! And when WE went to the Galapagos Islands, we didn't have no fancy AIRPLANES or CRUISES, we had to SWIM there! Damn punks. I swear...


Have a great birthday.  :)

Arden, you forgot "uphill.  Both ways."

Happy Birthday, Argy.

Date: 2007/06/16 19:38:23, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Funy is Teh SINNNNNN!!!!!!!!!LOL

Date: 2007/06/18 13:50:15, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Y'know, if WAD is now linking to "ID, the smutty version", I wonder if he'll let JanieBelle back into The Big Tent.

Date: 2007/06/21 08:22:13, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Heh, funny.  I just popped in to bump this thread.  I had been thinking I'd be interested in hearing Spags' thoughts as a fellow ex-fundy type.

You beat me to the punch.  Better Nate than lever, I s'pose.

*bump anyway*

Date: 2007/06/21 12:44:10, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Just came by to add a Panda Pinup to The Bathroom Wall.

I thought it appropriate.

Image from  Grrl Scientist at scienceblogs.

Date: 2007/06/21 15:19:47, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Given the current social/political climate wherein christianity tends to get special deference for no apparent reason other than popularity, it's not surprising that people hesitate.  It often seems to me to be ingrained in our society that christianity is somehow special, that it is not classed with other religions, that it enjoys special privilege.

I wonder if some of that is due to or is revealed in the word "god".  I suppose we all have noticed that whenever someone speaks of the gods of other religions, they are called by name, yet christianity has for all intents and purposes co-opted the generic for use as its god's name.

Hmm.. how to be more clear on what I'm saying...

It's like christianity and all its trappings are the assumption, the default.  If I say to you "I'm going to church" or "God is blah blah" our society is so steeped in christian tradition that you probably wouldn't even consider that I might be speaking of any other church or god unless I specifically made a point of mentioning it.

This works in the fundies' favor, most of the time.  Even if I refer to "a cult" it's almost a given that I'm not referring to any christian sect, in popular parlance.  In fact, I'm fairly sure that "a cult" by most Americans' definition is "any non-christian religion".

Sad that one religion gets a free pass on just about everything.  Interesting that the same religion is the one most fond of crying "Persecution!!!!"

In any event, I find it unsurprising that there is a hesitation to indict christianity at large for child abuse, even in its most extreme forms.

Depressing, but unsurprising.

Date: 2007/06/21 15:22:25, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Happy birthday, Paul!

Date: 2007/06/21 15:23:54, Link
Author: Lou FCD
P.S.  Both Janie and I have posted and pointed to this thread today on our respective blogs.  Perhaps we might gain a participant or two.

Just so y'know.

Date: 2007/06/21 16:34:40, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Arden Chatfield @ June 21 2007,16:04)
Thank you for plugging your nose and cataloging this. This list deserves to be much more widely publicized.

OK, we did our part....

Date: 2007/06/21 16:50:48, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Tara @ June 21 2007,16:44)
Quote (Richardthughes @ June 21 2007,15:53)
Quote (Tara @ June 21 2007,15:52)
Hey all,

Saw J-dog's mention of the trip over at Aetiology.  I live not too far from Chicago, and I'll be there Aug 2-5 to talk science blogging at YearlyKos...can someone keep me updated about what you decide?  I've been wanting to go see the exhibit anyway...

I was going to buy PZ dinner untill you stole his gig!


Heh.  Sorry!  All his fault--he backed out to go do his elitist science snobbery stuff.  :)

Well, I'd like to come, but I'm sort of stuck.

Y'see, JanieBelle, Kate and I are stuck at the mailbox.  We've been waiting for a special package, an autographed picture of someone...

To tell the truth, we can't even remember who, because we've been waiting so long in the wind and rain...

Seems like it was someone important...  definitely female.  I think she mentioned having the picture ready to go, in her glove box, and ...

Is it Christmas yet?  I'm sure it was supposed to be here by Christmas... or JanieBelle's birthday...  hm... is it Valentine's Day yet?  JanieBelle's birthday is Valentine's Day.

Anyways, we can't come.  We're still huddled around the mailbox.


Date: 2007/06/21 19:28:48, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Hi PennyBright!

Good to see you're still checking.

There's a similarly themed thread over on Pharyngula that went up yesterday.

Child Abuse?  Or not?

Worth a read.  (You'll find Ichthyic amongst the 150+ comments there.)

Ichthyic posted a link to this thread, so perhaps the conversation here will pick up as that thread falls off Dr. PZ's front page.

Date: 2007/06/21 19:32:41, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Y'know, I have to confess that I enjoyed the first one.

'course anything that involves Jim Carey and Jennifer Aniston's boobs can't be all bad, right?

Without even reading the reviews, and having only seen a few trailers for this one, I have exactly zero desire to bother with it.

Date: 2007/06/21 20:45:27, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Ichthyic @ June 21 2007,20:29)
of course, I was also particularly fond of "On his Majesty's Secret Service", which I also often catch flak for.

No doubt.  There's a reason for that - LAZENBY SUCKED!


I've seen 'em all a bunch of times myself.  I'm pretty partial to the Connery flicks.  It may be a similar thing as the Dr. Who thing, where your favorite actor in the part may depend entirely on who was playing the part at your introduction to the series.

Just a thought.  (Tom Baker rulzzzzz!)

Date: 2007/06/22 13:06:56, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Isn't MichaelS one of the UD regulars?

Either way, such a person showed up in the comments over at BadAstronomy and I think JanieBelle is about to throttle him.

Just so y'know.


Date: 2007/06/22 19:12:47, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Reciprocating Bill @ June 22 2007,18:09)
Howabout you engage in self-referential coitus.

Oh crap that gave me the chuckles.

I happened to bump into a link to a link that landed me at the PD earlier today.

I had totally missed this at the time, I think

At Sunday, July 16, 2006 8:24:00 PM, Anonymous said...

Denyse- if you can keep this private, or delete it when you read it...I just wanted to share this with you, but I don't see an EMail address.

I see "janiebelle" a lesbian with "no sexual preference" who lives with someone she calls "Corporal Kate" is attacking you and saying you're a prude. I guess everyone is a prude to a bisexual lesbian with no sexual preference who doesn't realize Lilith first showed up in medieval Jewish literature, long after the OT and NT were written, compiled, etc.

I talked to Dr. Dembski, but it seems he has no interest in reigning in DaveScot. Actually, his reply to me was rather rude "take it up with him yourself" was all he said when I pleaded with him to reign in Dave as the moderator...if you're going to attack O'Leary, I told him, then you might as well shut your blog down.

Dembski doesn't seem to understand that HIS name, HIS face, HIS rep. is associated with the blog. I'm honestly starting to lose all respect for the man. If the guy Bill chooses to run his blog cannot get along with ANYBODY (not even you!), then ID itself will never get anywhere.

my email is <redacting is an ethical thing to do, despite the stupidity of the poster who posted it>

I read this blog as much as I can. Agree with nearly all of it. Thanks a lot.

Ahh, the stroll down memory lane.  That was about 36 hours before JanieBelle got the boot.

(It'll be a year next week since the evil plot hatched on page 19 of the BW.)

Date: 2007/06/22 19:25:41, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (stevestory @ June 21 2007,20:36)
Quote (Ichthyic @ June 21 2007,21:24)
it reminds me a LOT of the arguments a couple decades back about the issue of corporal punishment.

at one time, corporal punishment was quite acceptable, even in schools.

attitudes change...

Growing up in the Deeeep South I've seen my own attitudes dramatically change. They used to be pretty conservative, including on things like spankings. After I was exposed to well-behaved kids, from intelligent families, who were reasoned with in disciplinary moments, and compared those to the kids I know who're now in prison in Florida (BTW prison in Florida is no joke, especially Raiford) who were disciplined via beatings, my opinions gave way to the evidence.

My father used a belt on us.  I didn't get it much, mostly cause I disliked it enough to stay out of trouble (or at least not get caught).  My brother, not so much.

His (my father's) parents used a closed fist on him, so in a way I s'pose that's progress.

I spanked my daughter until she was about 2 or 3.  About the time my son was born, I quit.  He's never been spanked.

Sometimes, I regret that choice.  Maybe Pop was on to something.  (jk of course)


Date: 2007/06/22 19:32:00, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (stevestory @ June 22 2007,19:21)
Posts like this make me proud to be part of the After the Bar Closes gang.

I'd love to agree with you, Steve, but I can't get through RB's comment.

Every time I get to "self-referential coitus" I bust a gut and can't finish.

Perhaps that in itself is reason enough...

Date: 2007/06/22 20:15:31, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (stevestory @ June 22 2007,20:07)
That was a really funny moment. I am terrible at predicting things. I thought, over a year ago, that Dembski would be so humiliated by Davetard that he'd shut UD down. Upon further reflection, that was in the same vein as my prediction that John Kerry would win in 2004.

Could be worse, Steve.  You could have predicted:

Quote (DaveTard @ 09/30/2005 3:03 pm)
Judge John E. Jones on the other hand is a good old boy brought up through the conservative ranks. He was state attorney for D.A.R.E, an Assistant Scout Master with extensively involved with local and national Boy Scouts of America, political buddy of Governor Tom Ridge (who in turn is deep in George W. Bush’s circle of power), and finally was appointed by GW hisself. Senator Rick Santorum is a Pennsylvanian in the same circles (author of the “Santorum Language” that encourages schools to teach the controversy) and last but far from least, George W. Bush hisself drove a stake in the ground saying teach the controversy. Unless Judge Jones wants to cut his career off at the knees he isn’t going to rule against the wishes of his political allies. Of course the ACLU will appeal. This won’t be over until it gets to the Supreme Court. But now we own that too.

Date: 2007/06/23 11:39:45, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Real quick little story I want to share:

Long 'bout an hour or so ago, I had to go pick up my daughter from her very first job interview and run a few errands.

I hop in the car and of course NPR is on the radio.

Car Talk is on.  I love Car Talk.

The boys finish up with the caller, then go to the next.

Steve from Chapel Hill.  (heh.)

Steve has a bet he needs resolved.  (heh heh.)

The stakes of Steve's bet involve alcohol.  (heh heh heh.)

The bet in which Steve is involved involves physics. (Nuh uh.  Couldn't be him, could it?)

The solution to the problem has a theoretical answer which has no practical bearing on real life.  (!)

A fella just has to wonder, y'know?

(The question was about whether the ambient temperature affects the amount of gasoline one gets for a given price or gallon.  Steve contended that buying your gas in the morning would get you more gas for your dollar due to the contraction of the gasoline at a lower temperature.  Since gasoline is sold by volume, he would technically be correct, but because the gas is kept in underground storage it likely has no practical effect.)

Date: 2007/06/23 11:45:57, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Ichthyic @ June 23 2007,00:27)

Really like the composition, colors, and lighting of it.

Date: 2007/06/23 12:11:03, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (stevestory @ June 23 2007,11:48)
It wasn't this Steve. This Steve doesn't have a car at the moment, and could hardly care less about the price of gas. Also, this Steve would guess that gas wouldn't have a thermal expansion coefficient high enough to matter to him. Lastly, Steve has a deep aversion to taking significant measures to save insignificant pennies, ever since as a child he watched his Dad drive all over town to find the gas station which was a penny cheaper.

Well it was an entertaining thought anyway.

And I have a similar aversion, for similar reasons.  Unfortunately, the source of my "drive all over town wasting $20 in gas to save a few pennies on gas, milk, bread, etc." stress is yet with me.

She is my wife, and I refuse to go shopping with her....

unless I'm really really really really really really.... um...


Let's just say it's pretty rare.


Date: 2007/06/23 12:17:23, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (nuytsia @ June 22 2007,17:00)
:D It's one of mine....

I think you're right.... I'll try to get around to making some changes over the weekend.
I'm working on a "Street Theatre" card at the moment but I  can't find
a) when that all happened
b) a decent photo of a clown

Anybody help?

a. shallits deposition now availalble online

Comment 6 by WAD

William Dembski


1:43 pm

Tard Alert!

The previous postings were a bit of street theater. I now have what I needed. As for responding to Shallit and his criticisms, I have been and continue to do so through a series of technical articles under the rubric “The Mathematical Foundations of Intelligent Design” — you can find these articles at The most important of these is titled “Searching Large Spaces.” Shallit has indicated to me that he does not intend to engage that body of work: (link snipped).

b.  I've got a few good ones of blipey, but I think he'd hang us both...


Date: 2007/06/23 12:26:28, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Fundy baptists (my former flavor) are on much the same page.

"Go ye into all the world.."

"Come out from among them and be ye separate..."

Right down to the 'we are the only true followers, everyone else is wrong because they aren't like us and we're right because we are'

Shunning and fear and constant reinforcement are typical weapons to keep the sheep in line...


Is it child abuse? Is it anything else!

Exactly my view at this time.

Date: 2007/06/23 13:09:26, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (stevestory @ June 23 2007,12:37)
Davescot says:
Other than those [spam] I’d say about 1 in 5 comments don’t get approved. Over half are automatically approved and over half of those remaining are approved manually.

First of all, he must be retired, because who in the world would want to do so much work to stifle expression? Second, 1 in 5 comments is disappeared? Holy crap. What a creep that guy is.

(for comparison, maybe one in every 200 comments here gets moderated, and even then we almost never delete them, we kick them to the bathroom wall.)

So just to be clear, he's saying that 20% of all contributions to UD show intelligence and the rest get posted, right?

Date: 2007/06/24 15:08:45, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Seen The Hovind Music Video yet?

Funny, funny stuff.

Date: 2007/06/25 00:18:22, Link
Author: Lou FCD
It'd been a while since I tweaked Larry's nose, so Janie just paid him a visit on a couple of threads.

I'll have to remember to check back and see if I stirred anything up.

Date: 2007/06/25 00:25:51, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (stevestory @ June 24 2007,21:58)
Galapagos Finch dreams of being Professor Steve Steve. Then he wakes up in his studio apartment where the power's been cut off.

Mom keeps turning off the breakers to the basement because he owes her money.

Date: 2007/06/25 21:35:50, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (stevestory @ June 24 2007,22:11)
So I'm watching Deadwood season 3 and Cy Tolliver is holding the bible. And of course lying that he's reading it. That got me thinking. I read pretty much the whole thing sometime in my teenage years (skipping the boring this guy begat this other guy stuff etc} but wasn't much paying attention. Now, as a collection of interesting stories about human nature or as a baseline for lots of references in literature (especially my beloved Wodehouse) it's nice to be familiar with it. The question I want to submit for discussion is, what's the best cost/benefit scenario for consuming it? Skim the whole 2000 page monstrosity? Get some Cliff's Notes? Forgo it in favor of modern stuff? Opinions welcome.

I PMd this to Steve, but he suggested I share it here so you all can suffer equally....

A good deal of it is flat out boring, so I wouldn't recommend going the route I went (read every word).

Usually a bible will have little chapter synopses at the top of each page, so you can use that as a guide.

Read through Genesis, for the "know thy enemy" value, as most of the creo arguments come from there and most of the most famous of the Old Testament stories are as well.  Exodus has more of the stories about Moses.  

Leviticus is the book with all the really strict laws and dietary rules and stuff.  It's the main reason Christians have to have that whole "not under the law any more" thing.  If they had to follow a third of the laws of Leviticus, they'd spend their lives hunting for sheep to sacrifice or something.

The rest of the Pentateuch (Numbers and Deuteronomy) is mostly weird laws and begats and more obscure stories and crap. Not terribly interesting stuff.  Skip it.

Joshua is about... well... Joshua.  Not overly important, but occasionally interesting.

Judges purports to be a history of the rulers of Israel over the course of several generations.  They were called judges, appropriately enough.  Seems like they were kinda priest/warrior/king/judges.  King Arthur types, but only boring.

It's sort of a cycle that repeats 7 (if I recall correctly) times.

The people rebel against God.
God strikes back and punishes the people by having other people kick their ass.
The people repent.
God makes nice with the people and tells them to go kill other people.

Samson's story appears in Judges, and that's the only real good part.

Ruth is sort of the oddball of the Old Testament.  It's just stuck in there and has little to do with anything else.  It features a female main character named (oddly enough) Ruth, and what's notable is that she is portrayed in a positive light in her own right.  She's not just "The wife of Steve", and she's not some evil whore out to destroy Israel.  She is arguably one of only two or three women in the entire contemporay canonized bible given such treatment.

That's all you really need to know about Ruth, so you can skip it, but it's only like four chapters or something so you wouldn't waste a great deal of time on it anyway.

The books of I and II Samuel, and I and II Kings, are about what the Kings of Israel were up to.  Some good stories here.

King Saul, the first king of the Israelites, David and Goliath, David and Bathsheba, Solomon and his bunch o' wives and concubines, Solomon and the two women arguing over the baby, Solomon and Absolom, Elijah, Elisha, Jezebel, all the really good sex and intrigue stories are here.  At the end of II Kings, Nebuchadnezzar the king of Babylon comes in and takes over and hauls them off to Babylon to be slaves.

I Chronicles backs up to Adam and does the heavy duty begetting thing pretty much up to King David.  Then there's a little Reader's Digest version of David (maybe Solomon and some others too, I forget) and then goes back to begets.  II Chronicles is more story telling stuff, but it's not nearly as good as the Samuels and the Kingses.  Not a bunch of famous type stuff.

I'd just skip both Chronicles, I think.

Ezra and Nehemiah start after the Israelites come back from Babylon and off the top of my head I can't really remember anything notable about them.


There's this king.  He gets drunk and calls for his wife to show off her beauty.  She tells him to piss off.  The king's council guys realize that if the other wives get wind of this, they'll tell their husbands to piss off, too.  So they tell the king to banish her, and he does.

Then he goes and gets hisself a new virgin wife, Esther.  After that it's boring.  She does stuff, she dies, there's a holiday.  blah blah blah.

Job, I think you probably have a handle on, so read it or don't according to your preference.

Psalms are lyrics to songs.  Some of them are rather good in English.  There's an old theory (in the colloquial sense, not the scientific sense) that involves some date fudging or something and alleges that William Shakespeare may have had a hand in the translation of the Psalms for King James.  IIRC, the translation was commissioned in 1611, and Shakespeare died a few years after that, so I s'pose it's possible.  The bone of contention is that "he wouldn't have had time to translate all that so beautifully" or something.  I'm not intimately familiar with the ins and outs of it TBH.

He supposedly even signed his work.  Psalm 46.  46th word in the KJV is "shake".  46th word from the end is "spear".   One of those two is a really poor word choice for the translation - poor enough that it sticks out in comparison to the rest of the translation of that Psalm - but I honestly don't remember which. William Shakespeare was born in 1564 and so the 64 backwards... blah blah blah.  There's something about his father involved  (maybe his father was born in '46? - don't remember)...

Proverbs is self explanatory, I think.  Some good advice, some dumb advice.  Pick and choose as you see fit.

The best thing to come out of Ecclesiastes is that song "To every thing, turn turn turn, there is a season..."

Other than that, it's pretty whiney.

Song of Solomon is a smut poem, pretty racy for its day.

The rest of the OT is the prophets, major and minor.

Some of it is story telling, and mixed in will be dreams and prophesies.  Some of the prophesies are pretty straight forward and contrived even, others are just out there, like a bad acid trip.  Then when the prophet gets around to interpreting the dream you go "How the f#%k did he get that out of it?"

A surprisingly large amount of fundy theology regarding prophesy comes from here, although if you actually read the book it's all about what was happening at the time.  The fundies really bend over backwards to try to force it to mean  something about our current future.  (Not that it should be taken as anything other than fiction anyway, but in the context of the story being told, the prophesies are about goings on at the time.)

Let me know when you get to the NT, and after that I'll give you the Reader's Digest version of what I know about the books that didn't make the cut.


Date: 2007/06/25 21:56:27, Link
Author: Lou FCD
There were some movies that we were tortured with back in the mid/late seventies about being left behind.

I think we've discussed them before on another thread, but I don't remember which one.

One was called "A Distant Thunder" I think.

Scared the hell outta me... fortunately that was only temporary.


Date: 2007/06/26 12:09:11, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Rev. BigDumbChimp @ June 26 2007,11:35)
I have a serious question. What is it about people who are in your life position that make them want to believe the most far fetched and least supported ideas by people like Brown or Ham or Hovind? Some who's methods and research are so poor they're laughed off by even other creationists and yet dismiss the findings of the people who are the best educated, most experienced and happen to occupy the vast vast majority of the scientific population?

Sometimes it's helpful to remember that in Fundyworld, the alternative isn't very pleasant.

The apparent choice is Jesus and Heaven and acceptance by friends and family, or Hell and Death and Torment and ostracization and ridicule.

Reality isn't even a considered option, so one has no real choice but to grasp at any straw that happens by.  It really is a lot like trying to build a grass hut in the midst of a tornado.

When the full weight of reality and mortality lands on your head like a ton of bricks, it's a terrifyingly agonizing moment.

Been there, done that, totally understand, but I wouldn't repeat the experience for all the tea in China.

Date: 2007/06/27 14:12:23, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (oldmanintheskydidntdoit @ June 27 2007,12:36)
What I always wonder, and ask people like FTK, is that why god seems to have stopped. I mean, he came along burnt some bushes, did a bit of re-decorating (teh flud) and then, 2k odd years ago just stopped. Nothing else. From hero to zero. Why?

All this action (to the point of killing all but 8 people on the planet and appearing in person at times) and then nothing at all. If you are going to be a planetary overlord then just disappearing for thousands of years is just not on!

He's on vacation in the Magellanic Clouds.

I hear they're lovely this time of galactic rotation.

Date: 2007/06/27 14:14:47, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Peace, Ichthyic.

Date: 2007/06/29 07:14:19, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I'm reposting this (with permission of course) from UDoJ:

Quote (JanieBelle @ June 29, 2007 – 8:09 am)
Ira Flatow talks today on Science Friday with Craig Venter.  Craig and his team of scientists have taken the genome of one bacteria and transplanted into another, thus changing it to another species.

Reported in today’s issue of Science (gotta pay for it), this research may be the first step in creating an artificial life form from scratch, which is just too amazing for words.

Of course creationists will have to have a huge conference on where they’ll move the goal posts now.  If they were honest, they’d just stop giving all their money to the invisible psycho in the sky who’s never been observed creating a damned thing and send it all to Craig.  I guess the key word in that sentence is “honest”.

Very cool.   Check out Science Friday this afternoon on NPR.

Date: 2007/06/29 07:24:30, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Hehehe.  That cracked me up.

Anyways, here's the SciAm article, just for DaveTard.

Date: 2007/06/29 07:40:30, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (carlsonjok @ June 29 2007,07:19)
This is unequivocal support for ID.  It didn't happen by chance.  It took intelligence to create this new species!  

Praise Be the Disembodied Telic Entity!!!!

They'll have to change that to Embodied Telic Entity now.

God has a body, and he is bald.

Date: 2007/06/29 08:52:03, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I guess I was going more for the "hey look, here's something cool" with an added thumbing of the nose at the IDiots across the way, than a profound scientific statement of my own on the current state of evolutionary biology.


Date: 2007/06/29 09:06:06, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Try to think of it...

as Street Theatre.


Date: 2007/06/30 08:09:38, Link
Author: Lou FCD
That seems to work much better than the old way, Wes.

Easier to keep track of who said what, plus it's prettier when the avatars and all go with it.

Date: 2007/06/30 13:30:18, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote ("Rev Dr" Lenny Flank @ June 30 2007,13:14)
What, no Marine?

Kate was a little busy that day.

Something about cherries and a park bench...

Date: 2007/06/30 15:55:59, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Particularly bad street theatre, I might add.

No coins for that hat.

Date: 2007/06/30 16:53:07, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (JAM @ 06/30/2007, 3:18 pm)
That someone wouldn’t be me, and I make my living designing mutations that enable proteins to utilize new substrates that aren’t found in nature.

Oh yeah, he's a goner.

"He knows too much.  He must be eliminated!"

Quote (Patrick @ 06/30/2007, 3:23 pm)
Been reading Dawkins, lately? ;)

Quote (JAM @ 06/30/2007, 4:16 pm)
No, why?

Quote (Patrick @ sometime later tonight....)
Because he poked the same damned hole in our argument you just did!  Sycophant Darwinist Scum!!!!!!!!11111!!!!

Date: 2007/06/30 16:54:33, Link
Author: Lou FCD
You may have been faster, Steve, but I'm much better looking.


Date: 2007/06/30 16:58:09, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Arden Chatfield @ June 30 2007,16:08)
Quote (stevestory @ June 30 2007,16:06)
Today's terrorist attack in the UK fits in with my earlier link to Profile of the Terrorist as an Idiot.

This guy provides further support to that theory.

That dipshit is also the reason we all have to take our shoes off when we go thru airport security now. Thanks a fucking LOT.  :angry:

I rather enjoy walking around without shoes.

Perhaps I've just been down south for too long.

(Of course that doesn't explain the whole "walking around without clothes" thing.  The cops down here have no sense of humor.)

Date: 2007/06/30 17:01:39, Link
Author: Lou FCD
ooo! oooo! Pick me!  Pick meeeee!


In a beehive, there's one freeloader at the top who sits on its ass while everyone else mindlessly serves?  Not exactly complimentary to religion, I might observe.


ETA - Um..  That is the answer you were looking for, right?  Right?

*sits down sheepishly*

Date: 2007/06/30 17:08:00, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (BWE @ June 30 2007,17:04)
But the freeloader has to keep on laying eggs to get the free ride.

HA!  My eensy weensy wit hadn't quite come up with that pun just yet.

Hey, I get one brilliant idea a week month year decade, and I already used that one up.

Whaddya want from me?


Date: 2007/06/30 19:57:50, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Hermagoras @ June 30 2007,19:24)
If an ID critic had said that, he would have been banned instantly.

With gratuitous insinuation about sexual preference, no doubt.

Date: 2007/06/30 20:03:58, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Albatrossity2 @ June 30 2007,20:01)
Re O'Bleary's thread on intercessory prayer at UD, the natural question (per usual) would be:

WTF does this have to do with ID?

Cue Lenny in 3...2....1...

"Nothing at all.  No religion here, nope.  Move along, nothing to see....


Date: 2007/06/30 20:45:45, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Does this mean he's a pusher now?

My how the mighty have fallen.

Date: 2007/06/30 20:51:22, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Sex and drugs were the first two of my own 12-step recovery process from fundyism.  (More the former than the latter, but whatever.)

Perhaps there's hope for the boy yet!

See FtK?  Just follow J's example.

Date: 2007/06/30 20:54:05, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I usually forget to actually use the damned thing, but I love it just for the "Tard Alert!" message all over the comments at UD.


Date: 2007/06/30 21:29:16, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Not to increase anyone's workload or anything, but what I occasionally ponder when these comments get bounced here from PT, is what thread they came from and what precipitated the remarks.

Not terribly important to know, but sometimes it would be nice to have a link in them pointing to where they came from.

Just sayin'.

Date: 2007/06/30 21:50:07, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Geez, gimme a few, I gotta find the link.

Their formatting is crappy and different than here, so it gets a little wiggy sometimes and it's a pain in the butt.

The script puts a little sign next to all the comments that says "Tard Alert" and when you click it the script takes the comment and reformats it so you can paste it in your comments here, and even opens a comment window for you and adds a link to the comment.

It's pretty cool.

Date: 2007/06/30 21:52:52, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Wintermute's Script Page at

He's only got the one, so it's pretty easy to find.

ETA - (It's the only thing on the whole page...)


Date: 2007/06/30 22:05:29, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Happy to help.

I ain't no damned scientistical degreed guy, but I gots me some good Tard minin' tools now.


Steve, you're alright in my book, and the girls love you to death, you know that right?

They send their kisses (with lots of tongue, of course!;).

(...and I still remember I owe you some beer.  I'll probably be up that way before the summer's out.)

Date: 2007/06/30 22:13:22, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Should we clean that up and cross post it to the old Abiogenesis thread here?

Date: 2007/06/30 22:40:31, Link
Author: Lou FCD
bornagain77 is a tard

I’ve had prayers answered many times in my life! In fact that is what I think differentiates Christianity from other religions in this world, for in Christianity a personal relationship with God is what testifies to the validity of Christianity as the true way.

Why of course, bornagain.  Muslims certainly never make that claim at all, so of course your religion is the right one.

(Just demonstrating the power of the UD2AtBC Tard Alert script, and sticking my tongue out at Mean Steve.)


It really is a cool script.

Date: 2007/06/30 22:45:57, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Holy crap, did anyone manage to get through the rest of that comment by bornagain without a brain explosion?

Date: 2007/06/30 22:48:54, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I dunno.

My brain exploded.

Or imploded.  I'm not sure.

Date: 2007/07/01 12:49:59, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I wonder if Jesus is happy with whoever is bearing the false witness.

Y'know for a bunch that spends so much time preaching about their moral superiority...

Date: 2007/07/01 14:40:01, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Wesley R. Elsberry @ July 01 2007,14:28)
Hmm. I moved some of my own posts to the BW at the same time, and I think I'm loyal... is there such a thing as self-referential minioncy?

Further, what happens when you decide to mutiny against yourself?

Can you ban yourself?  Would you install a big red button on your control panel that says "Do Not Push" and then push it?

Would AtBC implode?

There's probably a grant proposal in there for some young psychology student.  Or an IT student, I'm not sure...

Date: 2007/07/01 15:01:25, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Geez, ol bornmessedupsohehadtobebornagain771111!!! ain't gonna like this!

"What happened before the Big Bang?" at BadAstronomy.

I heart the BA.

Date: 2007/07/01 16:24:17, Link
Author: Lou FCD
1.  In the beginning, there was this itsy bitsy point called a singularity.  It was a point of zero volume and infinite density, and then it had this quantum instability and went boom.

2.  And Moses sayeth unto the Lord, "WTF are you yammering on about, God??!111??"

3.  And with a loud voice God backeth up and beginneth again, for he messed up the setteth up line.  

4.  Actually that wasn't the beginning.  Before the beginning there was this other universe that wasn't quite fine tuned enough for humans.

5.  I dideth this thing with the dirt, and it didn't hold together so good.  What a mess.

6.  Anyways, where waseth I, Moses?

7.  And Moses questioned the Lord and quizzeth him thusly, "Could I just paraphrase?"

8.  And God smiteth his ass.

Date: 2007/07/04 14:45:39, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Happy birthday, Rich!

Date: 2007/07/07 13:31:29, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote ("Rev Dr" Lenny Flank @ July 06 2007,17:22)
Quote (khan @ July 06 2007,09:40)
Quote (Paul Flocken @ July 05 2007,20:56)

Perhaps Lenny is mixing up his presidential daughters.  I still want to see a citation.

You're right, I conflated the two.

As did I.

Alas, though, Paul, I don't BS.  I don't have the need to.  (shrug)

As for a citation, alas, I don't recall any photographer giving me any documentation of the event.  And I doubt Amy remembers me (though I think I did try to hit on her -- and yes, I tried to hit on Morgan Fairchild too.  Hey, ya never know, right?).  

But, speaking of photos, there are three different press photographs of me that I now wish I had, all from 15-20 years ago.  The first was, IIRC, when I got arrested at Wall Street -- I had let the local newspapers know beforehand and got a write up on the Sunday edition, front page, above the fold, with a photo of me wearing a t-shirt that said "We don't need a war on poverty -- we need a war on the rich!" (I also had another Sunday-above-the-fold photo for a piece that the newspaper did about the collapse of the USSR, by interviewing all the local lefties that they could find, including me -- my view was "good riddance" -- so that particular photo may have run with this piece instead of the Wall Street one, I don't remember anymore.)

The second was during a "Tax Day" rally (marking the day of the year when the average American finally paid his share of Federal income taxes) -- a photo appeared of me holding a sign that read "Tax the rich pigs !!!".  

And the third was shortly after the First Gulf War began, at a rally in front of then-Congressman Don Ritter's office (a regular thing for me since Don and I were on a first-name basis -- ask me sometime about the night he lost re-election . . . ).  Some ex-Marine VFW guy showed up and was heckling us with things like "go back to Russia" and "you should all be shot for treason".  So I went over to talk with him, and the press, hoping for a confrontation, followed en masse.  So after a little chat with the guy, I reached out with both arms ---- the photographers went nuts, snapping away crazily hoping to catch me in the very act of strangling the guy ----- but alas all I did was hug him.  Then I said to him, "Dude, I don't want to fight with you."  "Well," he spluttered, "I don't want to fight with *you* either."  Of course, the photo that appeared in the paper the next morning (and the caption) made it look as though I tried to kill the guy.  And IIRC, that photo probably helped me lose my job at the Bethlehem Steel mailroom, since a few days after it appeared, I went to work wearing a T-shirt that said " 'Iraq' is Arabic for 'Vietnam' ", and was fired the next day.

I think any of those three photos would look wonderful hanging on my wall, as a reminder of the carefree days of my activist youth.  Alas, after 20 years, I doubt I could still get any of them (and I no longer remember the dates they ran, or even which of the two local newspapers they ran in).

But if anyone wants to go to the newspaper morgue at the Easton (PA) Express-Times and the Allentown Call-Chronicle and do a search for my name, there's, uh, lots there.   :)

I do a bit of family genealogical research online, so I had already started checking before I got to this comment, and though your name has some hits, I have to remember which library online had a free backdoor into the site.  Seems like it may have been the one I access for Oswego County, NY, but I'm not sure and can't find the link I'm looking for.

Unfortunately, neither of the two papers you've mentioned is archived there yet, but they're adding papers all the time.  I've come up with some good stuff over the past several years there.

The Intelligencer (out of D-Town) is pretty well digitized at this point, if you've created any anarchy down that way.

Date ranges are helpful (I know you said you don't really remember when), as the search file is generated by OCR, which isn't always very good at old newspapers.  Some serious butchery goes on, so sometimes you have to page through the paper manually and just read the whole damned thing.

Gossip columns from the turn of the century are quite entertaining, as an aside.

ETA - Turn of the previous century, I mean, as in around 1900.

Date: 2007/07/09 06:36:29, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Wesley R. Elsberry @ July 03 2007,14:20)
"I'm with the BANNED" graphics...

Since many regular commenters here have tried to post comments  on IDC-advocate forums and have ended up being banned from those places, the graphic plays off the ability for IDC skeptics to gather here and discuss it fully.

[Who first suggested this bit of wordplay? They should get a mention here.]

(images snipped)

I've put one of these to use on the right-hand side of the main page.

I believe that was Kristine, but I don't have a link handy.

Date: 2007/07/13 07:34:52, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I read that post and immediately assumed someone had gotten hold of his password and was taking the piss.

He's worse off than I thought.

Date: 2007/07/25 23:19:28, Link
Author: Lou FCD
A link bar would be nice.  Links say to PT, talkorigins, various sciencebloggers, Science, Nature, UDoJ, Tangled Bank, NCSE, NASA, New Scientist, y'know, all the good stuff that would be nice to have handy.




Date: 2007/07/28 13:08:42, Link
Author: Lou FCD

How sad to be so forgotten...

I got a whole thread deleted and rewritten.  That's gotta count for somethin'.

Date: 2007/07/28 23:18:46, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (jeannot @ July 28 2007,19:06)
Quote (Richardthughes @ July 28 2007,18:42)
DaveTard is on JAD's PEH bus now.

He's been for quite some time.

It's a very short bus.

Date: 2007/07/29 18:31:46, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Hermagoras @ July 29 2007,17:54)
bFast serves the Tard in thick, juicy slices:  
I, for instanct, am quite convinced that man truly has free will. If God ultimately controlls each particle/wave then free will does not exist. My theistic perspective, therefore, is that there is something truly outside of God’s control within the universe, something that God chose to give up control of.

Whew!  I'm glad this is a science blog and not, for "instanct," a religion blog.

Wait.  If God gives up his omnipotence, doesn't he by definition cease to be God?

Shades of DAJ's PEH.

Date: 2007/07/29 20:47:43, Link
Author: Lou FCD

Date: 2007/07/29 20:51:59, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Arden Chatfield @ July 29 2007,18:41)
Quote (Lou FCD @ July 29 2007,18:31)
Quote (Hermagoras @ July 29 2007,17:54)
bFast serves the Tard in thick, juicy slices:    
I, for instanct, am quite convinced that man truly has free will. If God ultimately controlls each particle/wave then free will does not exist. My theistic perspective, therefore, is that there is something truly outside of God’s control within the universe, something that God chose to give up control of.

Whew!  I'm glad this is a science blog and not, for "instanct," a religion blog.

Wait.  If God gives up his omnipotence, doesn't he by definition cease to be God?

Shades of DAJ's PEH.

I wonder what Bfast's position is on the Divine Burrito Paradox?

I'm guessing sitting in his computer chair, leaning hard to the left, right cheek high in the air, talking out his ass.

But you might choose to blame the burritos.

Date: 2007/08/11 19:27:54, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Zachriel @ Aug. 11 2007,14:57)
jerry: It may one day represent a big PR victory

Does that answer your question?

Hints of a Waterloo on the wind...

Date: 2007/08/11 19:30:05, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I see VMartin's English is improving...


Date: 2007/08/18 11:56:29, Link
Author: Lou FCD
I just heard DaveTard was in a car wreck.

Sounds like it was him, anyway.  I could be mistaken.

Thought y'all would be interested.

Date: 2007/08/18 12:43:43, Link
Author: Lou FCD
Quote (Arden Chatfield @ Aug. 18 2007,12:16)