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Date: 2006/05/26 19:43:18, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Hey! He wasn't a flight school washout. He has seat time in both the T-38 and the UH-1, both of which are Phase 3 aircraft. He just couldn't finish his B-2 Training.

Maybe it was because he was doing too much 30,000/Mach 1 Geology while flying over the Grand Canyon? (What a Grand thing that Flood must have been! )

I always limited myself to Geology of the 50/50 type in the interest of safety of course.

Date: 2006/05/27 19:37:10, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Yipper. I'm new, thanks for the welcomes.

Paul, I was a squid too.

My comment was about Air Force Special Undergrad Pilot Training (SUPT). There are three phases, Academic and Pre Flight, Primary Aircraft and Advanced Aircraft. The last is where you start to focus on a specialty. The T-38 pipeline leads to fighter/bomber track and UH-1 leads to choppers. With completion of the third phase you're considered a pilot and move on to your specialty.

AFDave claims seat time in a T-38 AND a UH-1 but he only  claims B-2 Simulator time. Sounds like he'd reached his level of Irreducible Complexity.

Date: 2006/05/28 20:50:50, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (Paul Flocken @ May 28 2006,16:36)
AirFarceDave does not seem to want to bragg about the operational aircraft he flew.  Why wouldn't he also bragg about his basic and primary aircraft if that T-38 was so important to him.  (I don't know, does the Air Force still use Tweetybirds?)  And why would the Air Force waste time getting someone qualified in advanced jet trainers only to stick them in UH-1's?

Thanks Crabby, you made my day.

They only use Tweetybirds when they're trying to hunt down puddycats.

His claimed Air Force record jumps out at anyone with experience for 3 reasons, seat time in 2 different phase 3 trainers (T-38 and Huey), the lack of operational aircraft experience and the track he seems to have been on, B-2 bomber.

Why didn't he finish B-2 training? The DoD doesn't like to spend large amounts of money training someone and NOT get some sort of return on their money. Two options come to mind, the B-2 was too complex for him as I've already alluded OR, since the B-2 is a nuclear weapons delivery system, maybe he wasn't considered mentally stable enough to finish training. I won't conjecture.

What to do with someone like this? You could use him as a T-38 instructor (if he's capable of that), or let him fly Hueys on S&R type missions till he's cashiered.

Either way he's NOT the AFStud he'd like us to believe.

Date: 2006/05/29 20:21:29, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Well I'm not going to chase different threads to cover one topic.

Dave admits that bombers were too boring so he probably had the same feelings about the A-10 (the F-117 falls into the same category since it ought to be designated the A-117), that leaves the F-15 and F-16.

Dave wanted to be a shit hot fighter pilot stud but he didn't have the right stuff.

The how and why of his eggbeater seat time is another issue. Flying Hueys when you wanted to fly Falcons or Eagles had to be a smack to the old ego/onions.

Just a quick question:
Why AREN'T you presenting your YEC evidence?

Date: 2006/05/31 22:55:15, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Well I for one will not try to read every entry in every thread before I post, as a newb it would take too long. I WILL try to read every entry in a thread before I post though. I did actually make it all the way through AFDave wants you to prove... before I looked at his blog and said, hmm, this Bozo is trying to blow smoke up my butt.

I DON'T like smoke blown up my butt. How can I knock his red nose off?

All of his ID assertions had been SMOTHERED before I came here so I had to call him on what I could.

T-38 hot shot, yeah, it's a minor accomplishment. Then what? It's not like he peed on the moon or splashed 2nd rate Libyan pilots over the Med!

I made some mistakes (see how easy it is to do Dave?), the B-2 wasn't in service when he finished Phase 3 so he couldn't have been in that pipeline (What did you ask for Dave? The truth shall set you free!;) and you don't always get what you want in the military even IF you graduate at the top of your class.

How likely is it that Dave was top of HIS class?

Dave, UH-1 Huey, Dewey and Lewey managed to outwit Donald, can you?

I honestly believe Daves problem is the thought that his mother shares common ancestry with the other apes. Sit back, peel a banana and THINK about it Dave.

Date: 2006/06/01 12:07:58, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ June 01 2006,11:14)
[b]  There are many flavors of false Christianity in the world today, and I probably would have rejected Christianity also if I had one of those flavors.

But there is a true version and the fact is, true Biblical Christianity is the only thing that offers satisfying answers to life's mysteries--whether you are studying biology, cosmology, origins, history, human nature, government, the family and many other subjects.

Wait a minute, are these "flavors" or "kinds" of Christianity?

YEC is the only TRUE Christianity! OEC is false, ID is false. Catholics, Protestants, Coptics, etc, are all false unless they believe EXACTLY what you believe. (Which flavor of Christianity tastes like chicken Dave, 'cause that's the flavor for me!;)

You can argue here all you want Dave, there's no science in your arguments. It's ALL about religion for you. That's why your kind inevitably falls back on the "Science is a religion" argument.

Since there are  Islamic, Hindu, Buddhist, Christian, atheist, agnostic, etc. scientists all over the world, it's obvious that argument is fallacious too.

Keep trying stud.

Date: 2006/06/03 19:42:59, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (Faid @ June 03 2006,19:14)
dave, on the other hand, seems like a closer relative of chickens. YEC? More like BEC-BEC..

NOOO, please don't tell me Dave's flavor of Christianity tastes like chicken! I LIKE chicken.

I prefer to think Dave's flavor of Christianity will taste like weasel.

Date: 2006/06/03 21:03:48, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ June 03 2006,22:07)
Hey OA ... I asked for helicopters ... got tired of flying T-38's believe it or not.  I've never washed out of anything ... I have always been near the top of my classes--in EE and in UPT... go do some FBI work and you'll find that out.  I have also been successful in business--built two businesses from nothing and sold them both.

Hmm, NEAR the top of your class in EE and UPT, the pipeline you were in leads to fighters/bombers. Bummer, all the F-15/F-16 slots were filled by the studs above you in UPT. You admit you thought bombers were boring (Heysoos, killing Soviet tanks in an A-10 would have been a BLAST compared to tooling around in a T-38 and would net you OPERATIONAL aircraft time). You don't always get what you want even if you are the TOP of your class in the military. It happens. You ended up a T-38 instructor and got bored.

So you ASKED for choppers and got assigned the Huey! Another trainer for the Air Force. Then you finish your AF career "flying" B-2 simulators. Do you see why your bragging about your Supersonic 30,000 Foot View of the World causes BS detectors to go off? It's similar to why people are hollering at you about all the other BS you keep quoting.

To give you the benefit of the doubt, all I can say is you were probably good at teaching others how to fly at the initial stages of advanced flight training. Nothing to be ashamed of there. But there was something going on that kept you from flying what you wanted and doing 30.


Anybody smell a weasel? Musky sort of smell, not like a lemming or a lamb at all.

Date: 2006/06/03 21:12:15, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Anybody here ever eaten a mustelid? Musky, skunky, what?

I have eaten rats, they kinda taste like chicken, if you're hungry enough.

Date: 2006/06/05 16:30:53, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ June 04 2006,17:17)
Go call up somebody at ENJJPT and ask about FAIPs.

Don't you think I might come up with something different like "I have a PhD in genetics" or something?

He worked it out so that I could have a "fighter with no nukes"

What do you do?

I don't need to call anyone at ENJJPT and ask about FAIP's, but at last you acknowledge what pipeline you were in (and whined about how a General came along and dashed your dream of flying a REAL fighter).

You couldn't pull off a claim of a PhD in genetics. But I did get a good belly laugh from that one.

What fighter with no nukes? The T-38? Last I looked a T-38 doesn't have ANY weapons systems. The missile support Huey? That's a freaking Taxi drivers job Dave. Maybe you were driving a Portuguese Fighter?

I was a GMG2 on a PBR before getting a degree in Computer Science (minored in Biology). I worked 3 years at the NMNH in the Vertebrate Palaeontolgy Lab and Applied Morphmetrics Lab. Presently I'm employed as Technical Operations Supervisor at a science museum.

I went in harm's way Dave, you on the other hand were nothing but a dilettante pilot, much like our current CIC.

Date: 2006/06/05 16:38:21, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (stevestory @ June 05 2006,12:43)
I would say we're beating a dead horse here, but at this point, the remaining pink mist we're wailing on can hardly be called a horse.

Now that got a me really laughing Steve, thanks. Is it a really big horse with single digits or a 'lil bitty horse with 3 we're beating here cause either way they're the same "kind"?

Date: 2006/06/05 17:02:41, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
I also have to say, like deadman, I'm pissed at the at the condescending and racist comments about my Native ancestors. Pissed but not surprised since my Paternal Grandmother and her brother were taken from their mother and tribal village for their own "benefit" by Salvation Army missionaries.

I can't believe you guys left out the Right Reverend Fred Phelps as a fine example the Creo/Fundie/Right Wingnut apologists NEED to apologise for. He's practically a neighbor of Dave's too.

Date: 2006/06/05 17:20:53, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (stevestory @ June 05 2006,21:42)
I'll beat up AFDavetard about what an idiot he is now, rather than what an idiot he was back in the day. ;-)

The thing is Steve he still IS bragging about his career, it just helps illuminate the mindset he has, this is an excerpt from his blog.

Can you tell I was trying to look cool in this picture?  I don't know if I succeeded or not ... maybe some of you ladies could tell me ... I was sure trying hard ... stomach in, chest out, frowning expression ...

I don't want to increase hits on his blog but the picture is hilarious, if Dave had his stomach sucked in and his chest out, he obviously wasn't eating his Wheaties.

But the comment, maybe some of you ladies could tell me ... says volumes about this man.

Date: 2006/06/05 17:26:04, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Hey deadman, what do you want to bet Dave's alternative fuel source is methane, cause he's sure full of it?

Date: 2006/06/05 17:34:17, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
His info on Constantine is off the mark too. Constantine tolerated Christianity after he had a vision and won the subsequent battle, not because of any martyrs. Constantine didn't even bother to get baptised till he was on his deathbed but because he did, he's surely beaming DOWN on us now and that's ALL that counts.

Date: 2006/06/05 19:37:08, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (Ichthyic @ June 05 2006,23:11)
any good stories?

don't tell me "none".  I've never seen a paleo lab that lacked some juicy arguments behind the scenes.

Heehee, trying to head me off at the past as it were?

Really, I don't have any juicy gossip along those lines. I was a trust fund temp fossil preparer (who kept his head down in matters politic) and because of my computer training I was often asked to work on the 3-D digitizer in the Morphometrics Lab. There were very few systems like it at that time. I remember Ralph Chapman was a really nice guy to work with though.

The bulk of my work was preparing a bizarre large Late Cretaceous turtle from Maryland that Gene Gaffney was supposed to describe, but I couldn't say what came of it. The matrix the turtle was in was siderite that was a bitch to remove.

I did a little work on the Ghost Ranch Coelophysis block with Alex Downs too.

Date: 2006/06/05 20:52:19, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (Ichthyic @ June 06 2006,01:13)
*sigh* i'll bet it was lightyears ahead of the digitizer we had in the lab at Berkeley.  I bet it was a fun thing to play with?

no stories?

I couldn't say how it compared to any system at Berkely. While state of the art at the time it all seems so primitive now, but yes it was fun.

Ralph and I used to have some animated discussions about which platform to use. I advocated using a Mac II with A/UX and he wanted a PC running DOS. He was the boss so he prevailed, easily. The cost of the Mac II was the big issue.

My position was that A/UX was a more robust OS and worth the extra expense for the hardware.

Is that juicy enough?

Date: 2006/06/06 16:59:58, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Oh sure, blame it on the software that you have no entry for THE ONE TRUE RELIGION! I speak, of course, of the Church of the Subgenius. Prepare yourselves for The Stark Fist of Removal.

Date: 2006/06/06 20:00:43, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (deadman_932 @ June 06 2006,22:34)
I was touched by his noodly appendage.


Why would you fall for that pink liberal PC folderal deadman? Next you'll be seeing octopods in trees.

The Subgeni have been around for decades, Bob has died and been resurected many times, we have several good books. FSM's book hasn't even been written yet and already those freaks have a schism.

How can you turn down Eternal Salvation or TRIPLE YOUR MONEY BACK?

Why won't you LISTEN?

I'm here to remind you of the emptiness and futility of existence without the Word of "Bob" permanently installed in your cranial soft drive.

Date: 2006/06/06 20:29:54, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (Ichthyic @ June 07 2006,00:25)
hmm, is there an emoticon for a group hug?

No, but there is one for what T-daddy likes.

(  o  )
/ /  \ \

Date: 2006/06/06 20:41:41, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (deadman_932 @ June 07 2006,01:24)
Fenton Hill is geothermically active

Of course it is, that why they drilled there in the first place but Dave's Taxi won't go there. Dave's "on call" light goes out whenever he's asked to go where there's data that conflicts with his 30,000'/Stuporsonic worldview.

Date: 2006/06/07 18:02:32, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ June 06 2006,22:48)
My point on that whole discussion, though, did not depend on language loss.  My point was that civilization appeared abruptly, simultaneously, and recently.  This to me is powerful evidence for recent creation of mankind according to the Biblical model.

Taxi Driver Dave, it would be hard to believe how wrong you can be about so many things were it not for your Faith in an inerrant Bible.

Everyone else is crushing your onions on the other topics you've brought up, so I think I'll address this statement.

Civilization appeared Abruptly?


CIvilization appeared simultaneously?


CIvilization appeared recently?

Correct! Dang folks he finally got one correct!

First I'll link to the Wikipedia page that addresses the history of agriculture since  Agriculture preceeds and is necessary for Civilization to occur. (And you seem to be willing to use Wikipedia it when it suits your purposes).

From the info on that page it doesn't appear that agriculture appeared abruptly and simultaneously. Note that they also state that evidence of agriculture is firm by 9500 BC and some evidence is there for +10,000 BC (and Wikipedia tends to be very conservative about dates).

Note also the mention of the Younger Dryas.

The only interesting question brought up is if modern humans evolved 100,000 BP (genectic eveidence show that humans passed through a severe bottleneck at that point that very nearly did us in), WHY did it take so long for them to develop agriculture? Well it turns out the answer is pretty simple Dave, weather.

It took a while to figure this out since it takes a multidiscipline approach to find all the relevant data.

The Ice Age was a pretty tough time globally, humans were basically scrabbling just to stay alive and any presumed attempts at agriculture were doomed by wild swings in temperatures.

The Younger Dryas was pretty much the end of the last Ice age. The weather got warmer and much more stabile.

Dave you don't have to take my word for it, one of the finest scientific libraries in the world is right there in Kansas CIty. You can access it on the web here or you can drive on down to 5109 Cherry Street and access the library yourself.

Or do a search on quaternary palaeoenvironments if you prefer to go that route.

But do us all a favor, stop blathering about Portuguese, you clearly don't have a clue about it (or physics, stratigraphy, geology, or any other sciency stuff).

Date: 2006/06/07 18:08:55, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
"Silly, bloody nonsense that should appeal to hormonally challenged teens."

Pretty much says it all.

Date: 2006/06/07 19:11:04, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Well whyn't ya tell me deadman? Heh

I DO realize it's futile but I wanted to remind him what a wonderful science resource he has right there where he lives. The Linda Hall Library really is a world class facility. I can't wait to hear his excuse for not using it.

Date: 2006/06/08 20:54:18, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
A better question would be, What is the connection between raging homophobia and latent homosexuality.

The results of the recent poll seems to point to the LACK of latent homosexuals here.

Date: 2006/06/09 20:43:07, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Heysoos, I have a job and grandkids to dandle (and I'm building a hot rod to boot) so I come to this party late everyday. By the time I get here you guys have flogged Dilettante Dave the Taxi Driver (You talking to me, you talking to me?) like a penitent in a Monty Python movie.

There's not much left for me to wale on (red mist indeed). I'll give it a try though.

DDTTD, why is this guy

trying to lead you and the other sheep down a primrose path with this statement?

Henke wants “fluids” from the magma to carry helium through the mineral interfaces in the granodiorite, through the biotite, and into the zircons.

It is doubtful that such fluids could travel very far. First, the granodiorite is presently dry and well-consolidated, even at the surface.

'splain it to us in sciency terms stud.

Linda Hall Library DDTTD.

O3 after ten years, pfft,  if you hadn't resigned, they'd have shown you the door and given you a FIRM shove.

Date: 2006/06/09 21:46:22, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
I'm glad you asked deadman, not only can we resurrect you at reasonable rates, but we can guarantee that if you end up in he11, we'll refund your money 300 fold AND sell you a guide for residing in he11 at very reasonable rates!

However, I have to inform you that OUR heaven has it's streets paved in gold (with cobblestones of diamonds the size of your fist) and those streets are literally and figuratively overflowing with Living Subgenii Topless Godesses (bottomless if you can see your way to pay me directly).

OUR heaven is superior to other versions of heaven, but to learn more about it you'll need to buy a copy of "Our Version of Heaven is Superior to the Other Versions of Heaven Because..." from $99.95  plus S&H

Now please keep your noodly appendages AWAY from me since they are obviously inspired by NDE apologists (BLASPHEEEEMY) and will be treated as such.

Date: 2006/06/10 08:49:40, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Ickthyick, much as I'd like to be able to say that we could aurically augment DDTTD with an EZ Quick-Implant Brain Wipe, it just doesn't work that way.

Although DDTTD has a good handle on Mockery Science, Schizophreniatrics, Disto-Utopianity and Facetiouism, there are many other areas where he's too far gone in his pinkishness to ever recover, even were he to recieve the kiss of Dobbs.

I'm afraid that DDTTD's only hope is the Stark Fist of Removal and Resurrection BUT, he can be reassured by the fact that if he can afford a Beech King Air, he can CERTAINLY afford to achieve TRUE SLACKERY.

I'm pleased to say that I know the Reverend Spanky Lovelace, who leads the faithful of the KCMO Clench and have forwarded DDTTD's particulars to him.

Please send me your contributions so we can buy DDTTD a pipe and set him on the path that leads to ACTION -- THRILLS -- SUCCESS IN SEX AND BUSINESS GUARANTEED!

Remember, Bob is a bulwark against the unbearable fear and anxiety tormenting mankind and the only TRUE short cut to SLACK!

Date: 2006/06/10 20:56:57, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ June 10 2006,21:54)
I thought I came here asking someone to prove Evolution to me in 5 statements.  Seriously ... tell me how I'm insulting you (other than my interpretation of data is different) and I'll stop doing it.

I swear to Bob this has to rate as the dumbest statement he's made yet!

DDTTD says "Summarize 140+ years of work in many different disciplines, with five statements so I, a mere Creationist, can be enlightened."

I almost peed my pants I laughed so hard.

Ain't nobody gonne crucify you here Dave, but they will b!tch slap you till you get tired of it and leave.

Date: 2006/06/10 21:56:11, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (clamboy @ June 11 2006,01:09)
Elvis might be in afDave, but he's trying to get out! He's trying to get out, Davey!! Let the pink-gelled light of Elvis break through to you, afDave!! Come on, sing it with me!!
Elvis is everywhere!!
Elvis is everything!!
Elvis is everybody!!
Elvis is still The King!!

No, no NO! clamboy. Mojo Nixon is mistaken when he claims Elvis is KING. Living Colour refuted that premise on Time's Up.

Mojo is a follower of Bob, he just doesn't know it yet.

Screamin' Jay Hawkins, Bo Diddley and Elvis were Apostles before the light ever hit Mojo on his reversed retina.

DDTTD has NO Elvis in him. If Elvis was in DDTTD would you blame him for wanting out?

Date: 2006/06/10 22:04:47, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Steve are you big boned?

Date: 2006/06/12 22:15:42, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ June 12 2006,09:21)
Ain't nobody gonne crucify you here Dave, but they will b!tch slap you till you get tired of it and leave.
Crabby ... you are not very bright if you think I'm going to get tired of being 'b!tch slapped' and leave.  There are two reasons I will leave:  Wesley bans me or I finish what I set out to do.

No DDTTD, the only reason Wes will ban you is if you display the "kind" of
lunacy that Larry did. You've already demonstrated you're willing to lie, distort, misquote and just plain ignore evidence when it doesn't suit your goals. Guys like you love to invoke "common sense" to bolster your arguments. The problem is, guys like you PROVE sense isn't very common.

Getting banned is your sole purpose here. You WANT to be crucified. Banned=Crucified  for DDTTD.

I answered your question about what I did in the military. I guess you overlooked it (or you chose to ignore it) or didn't understand the acronyms I used. Too bad.  You won't read or hear me bragging about it on a blog or in a bar narcissist Dave. You won't read or hear me whining about some General/Admiral changing the rules and dashing my hopes and dreams (or changing horses in mid stream and saying my new family changed my career goals). That crap has nothing to do with science anymore than your 30,000"/Mach Speed, jungle boy hunting pigs in a hollow log UNIQUE perspective on life.

Here, you have to present scientific evidence that PROVES your hypothesis. NOT spout SCIENCY statements that can't be refuted because they are based on preconcieved notions, psuedo science, common sense, incredulity or outright fiction.

Then you have the nerve to tell us you might pursue an advanced degree. Chaaa, ya know what? Ungh ungh. I said it before in another thread. Hey Bozo, stop trying to blow smoke up my butt. You're a dilettante. Get over it.

Now turn out the on call light cause nobody here wants to ride in YOUR Taxi.

Date: 2006/06/13 19:56:14, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
I ran into a problem similar to Alan Fox's, the board recognizes .gif but not .GIF as a valid format.

Date: 2006/06/13 21:19:04, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Icthyic said;

perhaps it would be a better idea to categorize the several INTERESTING topics that have spawned from the blasting of AFD's drivel?

then pick a topic and run with it.

Well it hasn't come up in Daves Drivel thread yet (if it ever does, he's too dim to do anything but march in lockstep with the rest of that crowd) but it's a topic that interests me and the AIG likes to claim it as proof of YEC.

Someone asked me for some juicy gossip from my time at the NMNH and I sort of blew it off and don't have the time to find who it was that asked me (I doubt it can be done, but the search function should zero in on the page, not the thread a term is found in, teehee) but at the time Protoavis was the rage and Greg Paul was visiting regularly to check on the Coelophysis block from Ghost Ranch.

Protoavis was pretty much dead from the start because honest preparers told the truth. Archaeoraptor was a mess from the git go.

What's the state of bird/dino evolution right now.

I'd like to spend more time researching it but my career went from technician doing research to technician running the day to day affairs (BIG difference).

Date: 2006/06/13 21:36:15, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (ericmurphy @ June 13 2006,01:14)
Wait—I thought the ONE TRUE CHURCH was the Church of God the Fairly Competent.

Eric, did you found a new church?

Date: 2006/06/14 19:26:28, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (Ichthyic @ June 14 2006,15:24)
honest preparers told the truth

could you refresh my memory here?

Sure, one the preparers at the VP Lab had a close friend at TTU who told him the Protoavis material was from 2 different sites and different levels of the Dockum. The consensus was pretty much that it was a mess that shouldn't have been written up.

Thanks for the links guys.

Date: 2006/06/14 20:42:54, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (Marcus Evenstar @ June 14 2006,23:10)
BTW, on another list, I've found a totally humorless AF vet who regularly posts paranoid conspiracy and the occasional legal threat foused against a long-defunct gaming club. Just what does the AF do to people?

Hey Marcus it's not the AF (or any other branch) that is at fault. You can find crabby curmudgeons from all branchs of the service and from the civilian world too.

I honestly think the US Military is one of the best examples of a meritocracy that can be found (till you get near the top, the higher you go it seems the more the Peter Principle kick in).

The reason I keep picking on Dave is because his service record shows he wasn't able to play the game as well as he'd have us believe.

Date: 2006/06/15 21:29:16, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (rmagruder @ June 15 2006,15:02)
None have identified themselves as I have no idea how much of the abuse is being hurled from the heights of academia or from main st. usa.

Perhaps if science has all the answers, it needs to learn to evangelize, pardon the term.  

I see the constant fighting about what should be taught in school, and our kids are caught in the crossfire.  The evolutionary side argues it's the 'thin end of the wedge' to get Creation taught in school again.  And therefore, every possible means must be made to ensure that not even the tiniest sliver of doubt or questioning be allowed in the public school system.  The issue with the 'evolution is a theory, be open minded and critical'  (or words to that effect) sticker on the textbooks was a good example of that.  By itself, there was no mention of ID or creaiton there, but there was a lawsuit to get those stickers removed.  It's behavior like that that makes me wonder why the evolutionary side is so insecure?  It's the slippery slope argument I guess ("If today we let them question, tomorrow they'll be thumpin' bibles").   So, there's no room for doubt, no room for questioning, no room for personal decision making after weighing evidence.  There's just...dogma.    The sheer insistence that every child be forced to attend public school and every child be taught evolution as fact is what, I think, drives the wedge deeper.  Instead of persuading, you're antagonizing.  Instead of leaving room for a healthy debate, you're squashing it.  

Many of my comments made about 'darwinism being religion' come from these kinds of incidents, where I seem to be seeing many forms of coercion, retaliation, and retribution aimed at FORCING My child to swallow something they can't avoid being exposed to (unless I have the $ for private school, of course, and sometimes not even then).  

Far from wanting creation to be taught in the class room, I want my child to learn how to think, not WHAT to think.  If the case for evolution is so open and shut, this should not be a problem.  There are many parents in the same boat as me.  But rather than engage us, you antagonize us.  You attempt to humiliate and condescend towards us.  And I'm not an idiot.  As I mentioned somewhere before, I took a lot of physics and chemistry (emphasizing organic chemistry).  I've forgotten a lot of it, of course, but I DID learn it, and got good grades in it, so I dare say I don't believe I'm a backward scientifically ignorant hick the way I've been portrayed.

But the bottom line is, you'll never get #1 best sellers on amazon or persuade the vast majority of Americans to rally to your side until you adopt the art of persuasion, not condescension.

That's my 2 cents worth on the public debate issue. I've tried hard to be thoughtful and honest in this post.  I wonder what kind of reaction it will provoke.


Why do you assume that those who work at the "heights of academia" don't live on Main Street USA (or in Suburbia or down on the farm for that matter)?

Science doesn't pretend to have ALL the answers, Creationists/Fundamentalists DO. Evangelizing/proseltyizing is a religious obsession.

Teaching Creation is a Christian/Muslim Fundamentalist preoccupation that can and should be done in Saturday School (or Sunday School depending on your "flavor" of those religions according to DDTTD), NOT in Public Schools paid for with my tax dollars.

Those stickers ARE a wedge to discredit good science, nothing more.

The bottom line is science is driven by what we can test and replicate. If you want your child in a Public School to learn about Creation in a SCIENCE class then I INSIST you teach them the Earth Diver School of Creation along with your silly Genesis stuff and ALL the other Creation stories.

Date: 2006/06/16 15:08:14, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ June 16 2006,10:02)
I predict that even the slowest people on this thread will detect enormous differences between the humans and both apes by 8 years of age.  In contrast to this, I predict that the gorilla and the chimp will behave in much the same way.

DDTTD's having ANOTHER Portuguese episode, add two more  branches of science he knows nothing about. Zoology and Animal Behavior. He can't blame it on AiG or IRC either.

DDTTD, gorillas and the two known species of chimps (there may be a third species) behave in completely different ways and the behavior of the bonobos is quite different from common chimps. Someone earlier called bonobos the "freaks" of the primate world. Indeed!

Dave you are such a dilettard it's hard to fathom.

Let me head off your objection that you said much the same way. No Dilettard, they don't behave much the same way.

Date: 2006/06/16 15:22:02, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Are you still speaking to him? I have two questions. What brand of toilet paper does he use? I'll bet it's the best!

Here's the big one, If Jesus died for my sins, what do I have to die for?

Date: 2006/06/16 21:02:53, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (Ichthyic @ June 17 2006,01:32)
Every new person who has ever come to here or PT who actually ASKS for help in getting information they are lacking is politely and copiously referred to excellent resources.

I can attest to that. I was pointed to a bunch of good links just recently and my question probably wasn't well phrased. But several posts led to great info.

Thanks again.

Date: 2006/06/16 22:26:26, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Sorry, the first question was the important one for me I did ask it first, (but if you quote me on it I'll sic Connie on you!;) I'm getting kinda old and I'm tired of my employers providing paper that has wood chips in it.

I can't tighten my belt enough to prevent the inevitable. The paper work HAS to be finished.

As for your point about me knowing the answer to the second question, I refer you to this book by Mr. F. Le Mur

Date: 2006/06/19 20:54:39, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Dang DDTTD how many times does BWE have to stand up and call you out?

This is the guy who claims he has a fighter pilot hanging out in a bar background, DIRECTLY CHALLENGED!

I've known fighter studs and whirly bird drivers who'd a stood up right quick and addressed the challenge IMMEDIATELY!

What does this suggest? The few times DDTTD ventured into a bar, he got his ass handed to him on a platter AND Dilettard Dave is a pencil necked sunken chested fighter pilot wannabe who didn't get the seat he wanted because he didn't have the right stuff.

I wouldn't let Dilettard Dave pilot a chair much less drive me somewhere in a taxi.

Can Dilettard Dave tell the difference between a Chimp and a Gorilla without an AIG sign explaining the difference?

Date: 2006/06/19 21:28:59, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (PuckSR @ June 17 2006,22:48)
God doesnt use toilet paper.  He only needed to defecate once, today we know it as the Big Bang.

He can't figure out why you care about dying.  Death is painless.  Death is the point at which all of your world responsibilies are removed....Death is a gift.

1. I had a "Big Bang" the other day at work that needed cleaning up and I need to know how "He" does the same. There was a lot of dark matter that had to be dealt with.

2. Death "may" be painless but dying seldom is. I don't want "his" gift.

Date: 2006/06/21 22:16:42, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Dave says;

I do not claim to have a definitive answer, ...

Yes you do. You've done so repeatedly.

You keep refering to the problems with the Documentary Hypothesis even though no one here has brought it up. Why?

but this company does even better by producing the oil in not just an environmentally friendly way, but actually an environmentally constructive way.

Recovering CO2 from industrial processes is environmentally neutral, not constructive so stop trying to blow smoke up my butt.

Find a different chair to fly DDTTFD.

Date: 2006/06/22 18:33:14, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Deadman, don't forget sites like Meadowcroft Rock Shelter (PA) or Monte Verde (Chile) that shows our ancestors were smart enough to get out of the Middle East WELL before those silly  Sumerians or Israelites pissed off their gods to the point of being inundated with Gods love.

The discovery of a 5000 year old quipu in Peru shows the Caral were keeping records well before DDTTD's mythic Tower of Babel incident.

Date: 2006/06/23 22:39:25, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ June 23 2006,21:24)
Haven't I covered this before?  I accept dates falling anywhere between the short and long chronology. 7000BC-4000BC for Creation.  5000BC-23000BC for the Flood.  The difference is unknown names which may be left out of genealogies.  How hard is that to understand?  I told you I would answer your other questions in proper sequence.

Now, have you got anything to refute my evidence that Genesis is literal, eyewitness history?  (Since that is your specialty?)

Hmmm, Genesis is a literal eyewitness account of history but we have a difference in dates due to unknown names left out of the geneologies. "and some other issues."

So how do these names get left out of the geneologies?

DDTTD sends us to a site that claims the bible is a literal eyewitness account and that it was recorded on tablets (clay or stone, ahh who cares).

The nomadic Israelites were trudging around the wilderness and lugging around clay or stone tablets while keeping the sheep and goats in the flock, the pigs and the shellfish out of the diet, smiting the enemies of the lord and they NEVER cached any of this heavy stuff.

Where are the tablets of clay or stone that back up this hypothesis? 20th century archaeologists haven't found a single one of them. NOT A ONE! Pfft, who needs them. WE have the Torah! I apologize to any Hebrew lurkers who might be out there.

Tablets concerning Gilgamesh, Utnapishtim and the flood are all over the place. The earliest known library has them.

DDTTD will have you believe they are second hand, illegitimate, incorrect and blasphemous.

DDTTD just crashed his T-38 chair yet again.

Date: 2006/06/25 20:46:58, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ June 24 2006,08:29)
2) Let's pretend my views of God are false.  OK?  So in this case you say I am harming children by teaching them my views, right?  And you say this is far more immoral than any atheist statements made here.  My question is ... on what basis is this more immoral?  What standard of morality are you imposing on me?  Yours?  What if my standard is different than yours?  What if my standard of morality elevates cruelty to children?  Do you see where I am going?  Silly isn't it.  The point is ... even though you and I disagree vigorously about the nature of God, we both agree on certain standards of morality.  I agree with you that cruelty to children is much worse than many other offenses.  So you have provided yet another confirmation of C.S. Lewis' Universal Moral Code.

I won't presume to pretend anything about your views on God, I will say your views of science and morality are ridiculous.

Your presumptuous assumptions about Universal Morality are hilarious too.

How does Ba'al Moloch and his followers fit into the Universal Morality scheme of things? How does Spartan Morality fit in, those nasty ole foy buckers?

Silly? Yes, your arguments are silly, much like your AF career.

Your evidence is NOT there.

Get a new chair and a new flight plan Dave.

Date: 2006/06/27 19:24:46, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Chris, JonF, why are you guys doing DDTTD's homework for him?

Deadman, I can understand your rancor at Dave's (barely) covert racism, his "Deadman claims muh Daddy was settin' on the verandah, sippin' mint juleps while darky was totin' dem barge and liftin' dem bales" spiel speaks volumes about his mindset.

Makes you wonder if his Daddy had those Wai Wai sleeping on four slat beds, rising at the crack of dawn, working (and larnin' the "word") 18 hours a day and consuming an 1100 calorie a day diet with no protein till they saw the "light"?

I can just imagine his reaction if one of his kids were to commit an act of miscegenation with one of the "devolved" races.

Date: 2006/06/27 19:30:53, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (stevestory @ June 27 2006,23:59)
...yet he's the landslide winner for dumbest. What is it he does, which makes him so obviously dumber than Ghost and the rest? What's he doing differently?

It's the swagger, had he shown up in a bar I frequented when I was in the service, he would have been handed his a$$ in a hat quickly and told to find another watering hole.

That and the fact that he wants to be banned (crucifixion) without displaying too much overt insanity.

Date: 2006/07/21 21:08:23, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton

The people here are NOT going to crucify you despite the fact you are a minor foot soldier in the cult of YEC even if you quote the dogma till the cows come home and you won't make any headway here till you're able to address any subject that hasn't already been thrashed to a pulp.

I realize you won't address my questions anymore than you have others, because your "priesthood" hasn't found a "reasonable" answer yet (your sciency guys are still scrambling to come up with an answer to Tiktaalik), but I still have to ask.

How does the newest specimen of Archaeopteryx support your claim that no transitional fossils can be found?

In the mean time, I'll make note of the fact that your air charter business is a dilettante operation like the the rest of your claims about your self.

Date: 2006/07/22 14:45:38, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (Ichthyic @ July 22 2006,02:59)
hey crabby!  long time no see.

I guess you got bored of AFdumbass too, eh?

Hey Icthyis,

I took a vacation so I've been away for a while but yes, DDTTD is exceedingly boring at this point.

His cut and paste reply about Archaeopteryx shows how hopelessly out of touch the dolts over at AiG are and what a dilettante DDTTD really is regarding sciency stuff (or anything else for that matter).

DDTTD, the most recent specimen of Archaeopteryx clearly shows what many paleontologists have been saying for a LONG time. Archaeopteryx has so many features of both dinsaurs AND birds that it's hard to say whether is should be called a flying dinosaur or a bird. It's hands are identical to the hands of Deinonychus, a Dromaeosaur. It has a hyperextended middle toe on it's feet like the other Dromaeosaurs as well (Greg Paul pointed out the hyperextended toe back in the 80's). The hallux that Fedducia and others saw, turns out to have been a misplaced (broken) fourth toe bone exactly like found in the Dromaosaurs and no one thinks Dromaeosaurs were using that fourth toe to perch.

In fact the Dromaeosaurs are so birdlike in so many ways that some have proposed they are secondarily flightless Archaeopterygians. But no one has proposed they be removed from the subclass Dinosauria. Many paleontologists have proposed removing Dinosauria from Class Reptilia and elevating them to their own Class, eliminating Class Aves and making Aves a subclass of Dinosauria though.

So you see DDTTD. Safartis assertion that Archaeopteryx CAN'T be a transistional fossil because Fedducia and others claim it is a bird is ridiculous at best. Without the feathers, Archaopteryx is clearly a birdlike dinosaur, as are many other advanced theropods.

Maybe DDTTD, you should take a short trip to Lawrence (KU) and take a look at some of the other transistional fossils that show the gradual transition from dinosaur to modern birds.

Camels and Zebras, pfft, what a dumbass but thanks for helping expose your lunacy yet again.

Date: 2006/07/22 19:53:01, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ July 22 2006,20:25)
Crabby, please tell me you are smart enough to know I was joking about the camels and zebras ...

Birds=Dinosaurs is one of the best ones I've heard yet on this thread ...

DDTTD, I'm smart enough to know you've exposed your ignorance again, much as you did when informed chimps are genetically closer to humans than to gorillas.

After all how could this,

be considered a secondarily flightless Archaeopterygian?

It don't look nothin' like that purty bird pitcher DDTTD showed us.That there is a scaly skinned lizard!

Here's another Dromaeosaur DDTTD,

Bird or Dinosaur DDTTD?

Another Dromaeosaur,

Starting to get the pitcher DDTTD?

Larry Martin is just down the road from you in Lawrence. He, like Alan Fedducia, thinks Archaeopteryx is a bird, but I'm sure he could help clear up your confusion about birds and dinos and their rock solid connection on the family tree of life.

Date: 2006/07/23 07:08:22, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ July 23 2006,06:26)
Hey Crabby--

Why don't you move to China and go into business manufacturing fossils for National Geographic ... I hear there's good money in it!

Oooooh, tough words from a fighter stud. Ooops, you never flew fighters, you were a sunken chested pencil necked taxi driver who avoided aircraft with weapon systems (unless you're willing to count your virtual seat time in a B-2).

All the fossil reconstructions I linked to are accepted as genuine DDTTD. They've been X-rayed, CAT scanned and confirmed as genuine, as has the newest Archaeopteryx specimen.

Your dolts at AiG had better get busy 'cause they've got a LOT of 'splainin' to do.

Date: 2006/07/24 19:56:41, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (The Ghost of Paley @ July 24 2006,16:45)
Theropod/Bird link:

Feathered Dinosaurs prove it.
No they don't.
Yes they do. The Ripper cuts in.

Digital Homology
We've got it.
Oh yes.
We're not concerned.
Perhaps you should be.
Here's why.

Pelvovisceral Pump
Ruben's wrong.

Shuttie, Feduccia.

With friends like this, DDTTD is really in trouble. The debate about dino/thecodont/bird evolution is SO far over DDTTD's head that if he ever delves into it he's sure to burn (out) and crash.

A bit of advice paley, DDTTD NEEDS purty pitchers and diagrams to help his engineers brain understand the concepts involved.

Keep it up paley!

Date: 2006/07/25 06:28:44, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ July 25 2006,06:01)
Hey Crabby ... did you not notice from my response to your pretty pictures that ...

National Geographic recanted ... ??

They got fooled by Chinese con artists ... just as YOU have been fooled by the just so story of Evolution!

AiG exposed the fake fossil Archaeoraptor?

Sorry DDTTD. AiG didn't do anything of the sort.

They are merely jumping on that incident to call into question ANY fossil that might contradict YEC theories(sic).

For how many years did YEC'rs claim Archaeopteryx fossils were fake? 130+? Now they admonish you NOT to make that claim because they know how stupid it makes them look! Heehee! Like that's the only reason they look stupid.

Like I said, your AiG dolts have lots of catching up to do because Microraptor and the latest specimen of Archaeopteryx (among others) are genuine and tell us much about the dino to bird theory of evolution. The evidence just keeps getting better and the obvious conclusion harder to deny.

Thanks for playing DDTTD but you'll have to do better. I realize you want to be the poster boy for YEC stupidity but for that you'd need to have an original thought. As it is, you're just a mouthpiece (what did Swift call them, Flappers?) cutting and pasting your cults nonsense.

Date: 2006/07/25 19:15:58, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ July 25 2006,12:41)
Fossils speak of catastrophe, i.e. rapid buiral.  Show me somewhere on earth where fossils are being formed today.  I don't think you'll find many.

And if fossils speak of catastrophe, massive fossil beds speak of massive catastrophes--A SINGLE, massive catastrophe, perhaps?

Crabby ...  
For how many years did YEC'rs claim Archaeopteryx fossils were fake?
I don't know about all YECers.  I know about AIG and ICR.  They don't claim they are fake.

Wrong again DDTTD, add taphonomy to list of subjects you're completely ignorant of.

The fossils from the Solnhofen Limestone (which includes the Archaeopteryx specimens) show they were buried in the most gentle way. No catastrophe involved whatsoever (other than the death of the animals). No currents, no scavengers rooting around, no massive floods. Bodies dropped into the calcareous mud, with salt levels too high to support anything but cyanobacteria, and oxygen levels too low on the bottom to support life, there was nothing to disturb them as they were slowly covered. That's why the preservation of those fossils is so good, hence the feather impressions (and the presence of soft bodied specimens like jellyfish).

If AiG and ICR personnel weren't involved with claiming Archaeopteryx specimens were fake, why do they emphasize this point so strongly? ..they doth protest too strongly!

Thanks for playing DDTTD, but once again you don't know your ass from a hole in the ground.

Date: 2006/07/25 19:37:35, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (The Ghost of Paley @ July 25 2006,16:14)
Part of the reason I collected the Archy links on Dave's thread was to make things a bit easier when it's time to address that topic, although apparently the debate blew right past it.

Whoa, the Dromaeosaur/Thecodont/Bird Evolution arguments have relevence to a Geocentric Theory of the Universe? I can't wait to read how that works (but I know I'll have to).

You're surprised DDTTD couldn't understand the information in the links you provided him?!!!

Sarfarti and the Cult of AiG doesn't understand the dino/bird evolution argument and Sarfarti's refutation of horse evolution is even more ridiculous. Why would you expect cut and paste DDTTD to do any better?

Date: 2006/07/25 20:32:17, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
How will the snowflakes survive when it's so dang hot?

Date: 2006/07/27 21:19:19, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ July 27 2006,22:09)
... no, I'm NOT sorry I said the NKJV is not without errors.  I'm quite sure it has a few.  This has no bearing on the concept of inerrancy of the originals.

Until you can point anyone to a location where they can view an original papyrus or vellum scroll, stone or clay tablet (guess which one the nomadic Hebrews would have been most likely to keep records on?), it renders any argument you make about the concept of inerrency irrelevant and ridiculous.

DDTTD, find another chair to fly, 'cause I wouldn't trust you to walk my grandson across the street.

DDTTD, I keep reminding you of the single most relevant fossil specimens that blows so many of your theories (sic) out of the water but all you could do was cut and paste AiG crap in answer.

Anybody here ever hit a piece of plattenkalk with a hammer?

Date: 2006/07/31 21:37:48, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (The Ghost of Paley @ July 31 2006,19:50)
Now, Jason, you know we don't talk about Miss Ann in these here parts.


Why wouldn't we talk about Miss Ann Thropy here?

I've seen her shoot and the only way she could hit the broad side of a barn is with a Chesapeake Bay Gun.

I'll bet DDTTD would love to take to her out hunting pigs in hollow logs. What the #### does that mean DDTTD? Did you look for pigs in hollow logs (I've never found a pig in a hollow log but I've found a few bears in them) or were you and your friends hunting pigs from dugouts? A dugout is hardly a hollow log.

Date: 2006/08/01 19:55:53, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Aug. 01 2006,20:42)

Tom Ames...  
Which is it?
Neither, but thanks for asking ... nice to have you back after such a long silence :-)

DDTTD, every claim you've advanced here so far has been so thouroughly disproved, demolished or exposed as a lie that it's ridiculous.

Here are two more of your lies.

Science will continue to expose the ignorant superstitious beliefs that are the core of your dogma, as it has in the past. It's inevitable DDTTD. Get over it, stud.

Date: 2006/08/01 20:14:05, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (Flint @ Aug. 01 2006,12:57)
And future scientists, if any, must take root and thrive in the soil Coulter is tilling.

Tilling ain't what she's doing to the soil. Bullshit is more usefull than what she spews because it enriches the soil.

Date: 2006/08/03 20:27:10, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (Glen Davidson @ Aug. 03 2006,12:29)
His scientific expertise is wasted on children.

What scientific expertise?

I was willing to give him the benefit of the doubt but Deadman called it, DDTTD is out to make some lucre while peddling ignorance.

I'm sorry but I'll take Bob Bakker over Jim Bakker anyday.

Date: 2006/08/04 20:47:31, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Aug. 04 2006,17:43)
The most conspicuous and perhaps also the most significant structural feastures of the face of the earth are the great belts of folded mountains, like those of the Himilayas, the Andes, the Urals and the Appalachians,

OK DDTTD, I'll play State Trooper for a few minutes and try to use analogies your feeble brain can grasp. I realize you're from the Show Me State. (Too stupid to understand written or verbal instructions, you need to be shown how it works.)

'Splain to me, stud, how the Appalachians got folded up?

You (North America) are hauling ass west on I-70 when you see the Pacific Plate moseying along in the fast lane at 50 mph. You slam on the brakes, but too late, you've been trying to convince your wife it's time to get busy if you're gonna father all those children you've planned for, hit the Pacific Plate and the front end (the Coastal Range, NOT the Rockies DDTTD) buckles up. I've seen a few car wrecks and I can understand your explanation.

Show Me DDTTD, who or WHAT was tailgating you, ran up your tailpipe and caused the Appalachians and why that damage on your rear end looks like it's from a previous accident?

Same for the Rockies DDTTD, damage from a PREVIOUS accident but after you got rear ended.

Answer quick bub cause the DUI test unit as well as the drug sniffing dog is on its way. Your "car" has clearly been involved in multiple wrecks at multiple times and you are clearly a wreckless driver or You're a LIAR!

Either way, you is headed for the pokey boy.

Date: 2006/08/05 09:58:25, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (deadman_932 @ Aug. 05 2006,03:52)
Hey Crabby! Your post got me thinking -- I wonder how DaveTard2 would explain the Coastal Mountain Ranges here in Calif...which run east to west.

Wait, my psychic powers say: "Dave pulls out the 'Miracle Card' again."

Well so far DM, all he has to say is, uh, I don't know of any east west range in the Coastal Range, heehee.

Why do the Atlas mountains run generally east-west

Hey DDTTD, you're busted. No one was tailgating you. Much earlier in the day, you backed out into traffic while adjusting your seat and Africa ran into you. We have the paint from your bumper on the damage you caused (Atlas Mountains).

So now we have two collisions with your "car", North America, travelling in 2 different directions, all in the space of a year!

Yep, that's plausible.

In the mean time I want you to blow hard into this tube. I know you can do it 'cause you been a blowhard for an awfully long time.

Date: 2006/08/05 23:05:44, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Aug. 05 2006,21:57)
Ahem ... it's late at night and I'm not in the mood ... you should know me well enough by now to know that I will answer questions when I get good and ready and if it serves my purpose ... otherwise, no.

(Remember what my purpose here is?  Do you need a reminder?)

Dang dudes, I can't believe your insensitivity!

DDTTD is obviously cramping and bloated and you still keep hammering him.

Yes DDTTD we remember what your purpose here is. To bilk the marks by spinning Tales of Ignorance and Stupidstition.

Since DDTTD is having a Midol moment, I won't press him for an answer about his damaged junk filled trunk (Appalachians). He passed the breath and blood tests so he's clearly challenged mentally. I will cite him for DWI though (Driving While willfully Ignorant).

Although his ignorance of all the other 'ologies is clear, let's expose his ignorance of orogeny some more.

Boston Mountains, stud muffin. East/west mountains, mud stuffin. Closer to your home than the Coastal String, er, I mean Range of mountains and in the middle of the continent

'Splain away when your AiG cult members ain't done it for ya buddy boy.

Date: 2006/08/06 20:48:45, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Aug. 06 2006,06:45)

R. H. Rastall, ?Geology,? Encyclopaedia Britannica, Vol. 10, 1954, p. 168.
?It cannot be denied that from a strictly philosophical standpoint geologists are here arguing in a circle. The succession of organisms has been determined by a study of their remains embedded in the rocks, and the relative ages of the rocks are determined by the remains of organisms that they contain.?

Dang DDTTD, you actually CHEW on stuff during your siestas? Do you chew on your blanky, stud? Your pillow?

Am I gonna have to break out my old Rolodex and have a foram counter from the oil industry come visit you and 'splain how fossils can be used to date deposits in terms your feeble brain can understand?

Keep in mind DDTTD, you are (obviously) WAY out of your league here.

Time to get your boys at AiG/ICR busy to find an answer for the Boston Mountains DDTTD.

Date: 2006/08/08 20:30:17, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Aug. 08 2006,21:01)

DDTTD decides to hand out some rabbit pellets and tries to convince us they are choice plump raisins.

Now ... I would like to know WHICH of these layers were dated RADIOMETRICALLY.  Is it correct that NONE of the layers above the Great Unconformity can be dated RM?  How about the layers below the GU?  I'm thinking that the only layers that CAN be dated RM are the Zoroaster Granite and the Vishnu Schist.  Is this correct?

If this is correct, then according to Eric's explanation, we should have dated these layers according to OTHER rock formations which ALSO contain these same fossils and CAN be dated RM, right?

Can you give me some examples?

Do you really think anyone here is going to fall for your pedagoguery? The ICR's 6 Million Dollar Man has already had his work exposed as fraudulent.

Try again Achmed.

Date: 2006/08/08 21:21:48, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Here's a link to some relevant RM dating of a sedimentary formation found at the south rim of the Grand Canyon.

I cain't find no purty pitchers that show the Chinle Formation in the Grand Canyon stratigraphy but it's there DDTTD.

'Splain it boy.

Date: 2006/08/09 20:18:57, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (deadman_932 @ Aug. 09 2006,04:40)
Here's more - on the Chinle - just because Crabby and I get along, and we both think you're pretty much a walking sphincter, Dave:

Ayep, walking sphincter is pretty good. Semi coloned, demi fundamentalist, hmm, I bet if we put our minds to it we could come up with something really good for DDTTD.

He might be a new species of hominid that we can describe and name.

Date: 2006/08/09 21:24:12, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Aug. 09 2006,16:22)
Ha!  That's what I thought.  There isn't a single one of you that even KNOWS (well, possibly Deadman ... we'll see when he checks in) how they determine the age of those layers.

All you can do is send me off to some references which you HOPE will explain it.  

What will I find if I go read those references?

I will most likely find ...

The rocks are dated by the index fossils in them and ... The fossils are dated by the rocks which contain them ... CLASSIC CIRCULARITY

And the funny thing is ... you guys don't even realize you are arguing in a circle.

Proving once again you are a liar.

The link I provided explains how the sedimentary Chinle Fm. has been radiometrically dated. DM (thanks bud) immediately added a bunch of related sources. You'll never check them because you can't handle the truth and it would require you to take the time to actually enter a secular repository of scientific knowledge like the Linda Hall Library, minutes from where you live.

No HOPE, no FAITH DDTTD. No circular reasoning. Science.

The Chinle Fm. isn't the only formation above or below the GU that can be RM dated as you well know, or you wouldn't have phrased your questions as you did. Having been caught, you moved the goal posts as DM (and eric and jon and jean and so many others) has pointed out so many times before

The thing is DDTTD, science is already hard to keep up with. If you waste all your time trying to debunk work that's been refined, as GC geology has, the present scientific work passes you by.

Try again Lielit.

Date: 2006/08/09 22:02:31, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Dang it dudes and dudettes, we has been duped.

Save me Jebus, but it turns out the we now KNOW the source of the fountains of the deep.

It's the Missouri Karst.


Date: 2006/08/10 20:10:59, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Aug. 10 2006,12:13)
I will promise never to teach kids about the Book of Genesis again.  OK?

Anybody here willing to take DDTTD at his word?

Show of hands.


>Leans forward in anticipation.


>Nose touches screen.

>Smacks monitor..... AIIEEEEEEEE! SPARKS, SMOKE, FLAMES. Grabs Class C Extinguisher. Whoo.


I thought so.

I'd loan money to a crack whore before I'd believe a promise of yours DDTTD.

Date: 2006/08/11 22:31:43, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (ericmurphy @ Aug. 12 2006,01:52)
You've spent dozens of posts trying, without success, to poke a hole in radiometric dating methods, but you've come up with exactly nothing to replace it with, other than counting begats in your Bible.

The most hilarious part of his explanation of using the "INERRENT BIBLE" as a dating sytem is his admission that some of the begats may or may not be missing, yet hit don't faze him atall. No sir.

I can't say quite why but DDTTD brings two mental images to mind. One is from an Ozark Mountain Daredevils album cover with two mule skinners on it, the other is from the movie Deliverance, where the old guy at the put in point screams, "You don't know nuthin!"

OT, DM what's your take on Cactus Hill as a pre Clovis site. Looks pretty solid to me that our ancestors sure as #### weren't no devolved lost tribe 'o Israel, not that DDTTD could ever be convinced.

Date: 2006/08/11 22:54:20, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Aug. 11 2006,13:18)


Correlate the Cardenas Lava with your begats DDTTD!

Found any Trilobites in the Bass Limestone DDTTD?


I don't think I'd trust Dave to "drive" a rickshaw much less a taxi. I might let him drive a 3 legged stool if he promised to keep it below 3 mph and 10'.

Date: 2006/08/11 23:18:24, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
#### did I say 10'? Keep your stool on the floor DDTTD!

Date: 2006/08/12 19:55:47, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Aug. 12 2006,12:54)
If there were no massive water catastrophe, there would be no massive layers of sedimentary rock which have no subsequent erosion and deposition -- all over the whole earth!!  The sheer quantity of sedimentary layers is enormous evidence for a water cataclysm.  It is self evident to anyone who has no agenda.

You're claiming you have no agenda DDTTD?

You're so full of shit that if I squeezed the shit out of you there'd be nothing left but hair, teeth and skin.

You want an example of historical deposition of sediments?

We know the Tigris and Euphrates Rivers had seperate mouths in the past, they don't now. Why DDTTD?

To infer there's erosion going on without deposition is another one of your Portugeuse moments. Stupid, ignorant liar, there's no question in my mind why you were never offered a seat in a fighter. I'm surprised they allowed you in a rotary winged bird.

Date: 2006/08/12 20:25:25, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Aug. 12 2006,15:32)
Secondly, of course sediments are accumulating at the Mississippi delta and other similar deltas ...

I was talking about ABOVE WATER ...

If you want to talk about river deltas, then you are going to be in much deeper water (ha, ha) than you already are.

But I'll be content to bury you one point at a time ...

Above water?, a single word DDTTD, loess. There are huge deposits just north of you (area and depth wise).

The only thing you've buried DDTTD is your head.

Date: 2006/08/12 21:08:06, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Aug. 12 2006,19:07)
It's as I suspected.  There are radiometric dates available for the Chinle, the Morrison, and the Carmel ...

Did I miss any?

Apparently all the other layers cannot be dated radiometrically ...



Not even close Sara.

I mentioned the Cardenas Lava WAY on the other side of the GU already, but you ignored it like you did my mention of dating the Chinle Fm till it was forced down your throat.

Do your own homework you incredibly silly excuse for a fighter stud.

Date: 2006/08/13 19:51:44, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (Faid @ Aug. 13 2006,08:56)
But then again, it makes sence; Conspiracy theories are always the last (and only) resort of the YEC mind.

I wouldn't say the last (and only) resort because in my experience, when they really get desperate, they always finish their arguments by trying to confuse the issue with the claim that Evolution IS IN FACT A RELIGION.

Dave thinks so too, hence his snide references to millionsofyearsism.

Date: 2006/08/13 20:05:05, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (JonF @ Aug. 13 2006,10:16)
Quote (Crabby Appleton @ Aug. 13 2006,01:25)
Above water?, a single word DDTTD, loess.

Interesting thread on loess and YEC at 600 kyr of not sweeping the floors.  Note that Glen had to revise his intiial estimate of the size of the loess deposit significantly upward.

The Loess Plateau

I thought about China as I mentioned loess but I know Creidiots like to claim it was a result of a Glaciation Event they THEY KNOW THEY HAVE TO DEAL WITH. But DDTTD can take an afternoon drive up the road and see some 'merican loess and then we can present him with sites that have clear multiple layers of loess the demonstrate that more than one Glaciation Event took place, again within driving distance of his home (I don't like the idea of this dolt flying over my house).

Date: 2006/08/14 20:50:25, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (Arden Chatfield @ Aug. 14 2006,18:43)
What's funnier is a couple months ago I asked AFD where he got that hilarious "we think on the order of 12" figure, and what the 12 languages were. Unsurprisingly, he ignored the question.

Let me hypothesize, the 12 languages are "kinds" of robust languages which god bequeathed us after the Babel incident (sic).

ALL modern languages derive from those "kinds" and the evolution of those languages involve "loss" of information.

Obviously, modern languages are devolved from the "Ur Language" that Adam spoke.

"We" don't know what that "Ur Language" was but rest assured it WAS inscribed on stone tablets by nomadic goat and sheep herders for multiple generations (and we may or may not know if or how many generations are unknown) and ultimately translated and compiled by Moses when he wrote the Pentateuch.

Could it be any more obvious?

Date: 2006/08/16 21:02:26, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Aug. 15 2006,20:55)
... just flush radiometric dating from your mind.  Pretend ...

Flushing your mind is something you should do more often DDTTD.

Pretending you understand science has been exposed as a sham.

You cite EB because actual scientific articles bore you to tears. I noted that when Skeptic posted links to help you. Real science is over your head.

You're getting desperate. You're goal was much more difficult and time consuming than you thought it would be.

Beating your broken drum about how 30% of UK juveniles (or anywhere else not controlled by a fundamentalist theocracy) believe in YEC is hilarious, they are clearly the lowest those figures have ever been.

When was the last time a YEC case won in court DDTTD? 1925?

It's time, as so many others have pointed out, for you to PROVE YOUR HYPOTHESIS.

Moron, fool, willfully ignorant liar, name the place and I'll call you that in public DDTTD.

Date: 2006/08/17 10:04:41, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Aug. 17 2006,06:11)
Beating your broken drum about how 30% of UK juveniles (or anywhere else not controlled by a fundamentalist theocracy) believe in YEC is hilarious, they are clearly the lowest those figures have ever been.
Reading comprehension, Crabby.  Again...  
Steve Jones, professor of genetics at University College London, who gave a public lecture on "Why evolution is right and creationism is wrong" at the time, has been talking about evolutionary biology in schools for 20 years. For the first 10 of those he was lucky to find one student in 1,000 expressing creationist beliefs. "Now in any school I go to I meet a student who says they are a creationist or [B]delude themselves that they are.",,1844478,00.html
Our buddy Steve Jones is lamenting that the number of creationist students has INCREASED, Crabby.  Read it several times if you need to.

Crabby ...  
Moron, fool, willfully ignorant liar, name the place and I'll call you that in public DDTTD.
OK.  My church.  As soon as possible.  When will you be here?

What's the address DDTTD?

When are you going to finish expounding on your own "Hypothesis"?

DDTTD is on the home stretch to his goal!

Date: 2006/08/17 10:14:12, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (Ichthyic @ Aug. 17 2006,02:29)
Flushing your mind is something you should do more often DDTTD.

ack!  don't you think he's been brainwashed enough?

heck, his brain makes "acid washed" jeans look crinkly and new.

any more "flushing" and all you will hear is air blowing through the empty space between his ears.

Hey, I think i can hear the ocean...

Air between his ears would be a big improvement over what's in there now.

Date: 2006/08/17 10:55:49, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Aug. 17 2006,09:50)
I've got an agenda here ... ... and that agenda is proceeding nicely!

A few pages back DDTTD, you claimed you had no agenda.

I called you a liar about it then DDTTD.

I'm calling you a liar again DDTTD, as well as a moron and a willfully ignorant fool.

Date: 2006/08/17 19:31:27, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Hey people, here's an idea.

Anybody want to join me in a trip to DDTTD's church?

Maybe we could save one young mind, maybe one of DDTTD's!

Date: 2006/08/18 20:58:24, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Aug. 18 2006,12:12)
Let me tell you something, Eric.  You have a smart mouth and I'll put my experience in the "big wide world" up against yours any day.  Why don't we begin by you telling me about your accomplishments in life so far.  How about it?

Ah yes DDTTD is playing the tough talking fighter stud with his barroom bravado. Bully DDTTD, bully!

Except, WAIT!

You're no fighter stud, you were a freaking rotary wing taxi driver at best. Your bravado is all 'net bluster, like a 14 yo troll.

You wouldn't survive 20 minutes with Kay Behrensmeyer, I know her, she'd hand you your onions and send you on your way like the prepubescent boy that you are.

Whine about Koobi Fora all you want, it has nothing to do with your UPDATED Creator God Hypothesis.

Get on with it boy. Get on topic or admit you can't bring the goods. If I wanted to read this cult bullshit I'd subscribe to AiG.

Date: 2006/08/18 21:53:26, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Aug. 18 2006,14:13)
Persecuting people who don't share their religious bullshit.....hmmmm sound familiar.
Yes.  It does sound familiar.  I don't share the religious beliefs--Evolution--of people here at ATBC, so you try to persecute me.  Name calling, stupid pictures, what have you.  Someone even said they would harm me physically if they could.

Not that I care .... but how exactly does that square with what you are trying to say?

Well let's just say that rather than associating YOUR cult of YEC fundies with the Cathars (Jeez DDTTD are you a Gnostic Chrisitian?), he's saying you're more like the Puritans who claimed they were escaping religious persecution only to come to North America and commit genocide on the inhabitants who were already here.

What he's saying DDTTD is that if you and yours were in control, anyone who disagreed with you would go up in flames, (or down on a Judas Chair). Your NEED to force your cultish fundie dogma on my offspring in public schools is just the first step on the long road to theocracy and scary as h3ll to boot.

Humanity survived that (Dark Ages) period already, we don't need to do it again.

Go mentally disable your chilluns with your stupidstitious bullshit, but when you come after mine I'm gonna slap you down.

Got that address to your church DDTTD?

Now get back on topic boy.

Date: 2006/08/19 06:02:31, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (Ichthyic @ Aug. 18 2006,21:32)
I bet the makeup sex is great though.

Which one of them wears the makeup?

Speaking of bashing other disciplines, Vert Paleos bash the four eyed Foram counters, heehee. Peer pressure made us do it.

Date: 2006/08/19 22:21:17, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Aug. 19 2006,22:06)
Leakey "helped" the geochronologists throw out all samples except ones with the 2.61 date because he wanted to make history.  But for this to happen, the paleos would have had to adjust the whole picture of human evolution, and this was grandly announced by Leakey.  The paleos dug their heels in and finally won with some help from pig evolution.

DDTTD has got to have the worst case of Athletes Mouth ever and the breath to go with it.

When he can't cut and paste from AiG/ICR or when he "thinks" he understands facts well enough to expound on his own, he gets it so wrong it's hard to believe (he's just as wrong when he cuts and pastes his creo cult crap too).

DDTTD would have us believe that Leakey the Younger, a home schooled Anthropologist, pressured the Geochronolgists into caving, to make history and the Paleoanthropologists and all the other millionsofyears 'ologists dug in their heels because they DIDN'T feel obliged to adjust the whole picture of human evolution. Riiight! Adjustments were made anyhow.

Resentment (he was home schooled), peer pressure (his hypothesis didn't fit the mold) and conspiracy???, obviously drove what happened. Wrooong!

Paleos and Anthros told Leakey the Senior he was nuts when he proposed to find early hominids in Africa. Eurasia was the place to be. He proved them wrong and the model was adjusted (and adjusted and adjusted, an ongoing process that won't stop anytime soon).

We're all of us Africans and naked apes. Get over it DDTTD. Your Momma is a naked African Ape, as are you.

Leakey the Senior then said he'd find modern hominid evolution in North America and was again told he was nuts. He failed. Big deal? Nope. His hypothesis didn't pass muster. No evidence, case closed.

Meanwhile, DDTTD keeps sinking lower and lower. He keeps projecting. The evidence? He was home schooled (hunting pigs in a hollow log in the Amazon), his "hypothesis" doesn't fit the mold (Goddidit), and a "conspiracy" kept him from his seat in a FIGHTER, (General changed the rules).

DDTTD, I need an address so I can tell you what a moron, liar and willfully ignorant fool you are. Bring a Roosian bodygard if you feel the need.

But above all, defend your "thesis"! Goddidit.

Date: 2006/08/20 21:29:53, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Aug. 20 2006,08:33)
Deadman-- I didn't invite you to the GC ... go back and look at what I said, and no, it's not cowardice to avoid people who threaten you physically.  I am interested in intellectual and verbal debate, not physical violence from a pissed off evolutionist.  You verbally insult me every day and I have never threatened you physically and I never will.  Yet you threaten me physically if I insult you?  No thanks ...

More on topic tomorrow ...

DDTTD, YOU invited ME to your church so I could call you a moron to your face. Give me an address and I'll be there.

I'm sure you could get Fred Phelps and his YEC Cultists to provide Security for the occasion if you can't find a Roosian to do the same.

Get back on topic and fill in the details of YOUR Updated Goddidit "Hypothesis".

Date: 2006/08/21 20:43:40, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Aug. 21 2006,07:36)
Also, I do not mind verbal insults a bit.  As I have said for a long time, calling people names does nothing but show that a person has no self control.  It actually helps the Creationist cause for Evolutionists to act like children and call names.  Keep it up!  The more you do it, the faster the general public will see you for what you really are.  What started the conversation about verbal insults was Louis portraying fundamentalist Christians like me as the "heretic burners" ... this is precisely backwards and I will correct this when I hear it.  It was actually the fundamentalist Christians and other suspected non-Papists who were being burned at the stake during the Inquisition.

As for visiting with me in person, I have no interest in meeting in person with anyone who even hints of physical violence towards me as Deadman has done.  Prior to Deadman's threat, I had no idea that there were any ATBC participants capable of stooping to that depth of quasi-criminal behavior.  I really believed that you all were upstanding people with high ethics (and many of you are).  My only complaint about you was that I disagreed with your worldview and I think you are rather blind to the truth.

But now everything has changed and I am very wary.  I will only meet in person with people who somehow convince me that they are non-violent, law abiding people.  (Crabby, does that answer your question?)

The only question you have answered DDTTD is that you are indeed a coward.

How many die hard rabid Evos killed and maimed those they disagreed with or burned and bombed churches and clinics in the last 20 years?

You're scared of Deadman? Reading comprehension DDTTD.

I offered to come to your church to offer you my opinion of you and you're scared of me? My calling you names like liar, moron and willfully ignorant or Dilettante Dave the Taxi Driver makes me look bad compared to whom? Neal Horsely, Randall Terry, Fred Phelps, Clayton Waagner, Ann Coulter etc. etc ad nauseum?

Here's a purty pitcher for ya DDTTD

'Splain to me which ones is the Fundies DDTTD. One of the churches in that there pitcher is just down the road from where I graduated from high school.

Now, get back on topic supporting your thesis or admit you can't do any such thing.

Deadman and others, I'd be proud to hoist a few, toss a few arrows and discuss some of the pre Clovis sites with you even though I'm sure you'll disagree with me about some of them.

Date: 2006/08/22 20:16:29, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Aug. 22 2006,06:52)
I am happy to meet Deadman in person if he can convince me that he is safe ... meaning that he will not attack me physically or legally.  This is not cowardice, friend, it's common sense.  His threat sounded like a physical one to me, but I am taking his word for it that it was not.  He says it was a legal threat which to me is not much better.  Do you realize that companies in America have literally shut down whole divisions because of thin-skinned, greedy, litigious people?  Cessna Aircraft Company is one of them.  People like this are helping to destroy America.  You are also right to condemn those people that burned churches in the South.  I condemn them also.  When I invited you to my church, the possibility of someone here on this forum physically assaulting me or suing me merely for a verbal insult had not entered my head.  If you can convince me that you have never assaulted anyone and have never sued anyone and can somehow convince me that you are not planning on starting with me, then fine.  You can start convincing me by sending me a PM with all your personal information and a picture.

What a steaming load of road apples DDTTD.

No one here has been able to convince you of anything, so how are DM, myself or anyone else to convince you we are "safe"?

Never assaulted anyone? DDTTD, I was a GMG2 River Rat, no can do.
Never killed anyone, no can do, see above, but both were done in service to this country (Well, maybe a few of the assaults weren't, but I had an extremely low tolerance for dumbasses and sh!t talkers at the time).
Never sued anyone, nope never did that but I can't imagine how I would convince you of that.
Send you ALL my personal info, insert hearty guffaw here, you are a dumbass DDTTD.

I was the one taking a chance with my offer to come to your church without asking any questions about my safety, considering what is known about the fundy tendencies to commit acts of violence.

But you refused to give up the address to your church, as I knew you would, before the "DM threatened me with violence" incident.

Is Milquetoast your middle name DDTTD?

I could do something cynical like saying here's my picture DDTTD

but you wouldn't get the joke.

So now I get to add pussy to moron, liar and willfully ignorant DDTTD.

Date: 2006/08/22 21:11:49, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (deadman_932 @ Aug. 22 2006,07:27)
Crabby: Yeah, that would be fun. The whole southern mound culture "Snake Cult" would be neat, too,  I have a buddy down in Fla/Georgia working on that. Cheers!

Hey DM, can't say I know anything about the ssSnake Cult (I'm Great Lakes Neshnabe) but the Mound Building cultures interest me greatly.

I just took my grandson to Kolomoki in July.

Date: 2006/08/22 21:39:23, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (stevestory @ Aug. 23 2006,02:24)
Earlier I let the misinterpretations of threats, real or imagined, go because I thought it'd quickly die down. I use adult language around here too, I know, but this thread is getting too full of words like sh*t, pussy, assault, etc. Everyone cut it out and get back to discussing AFDave's pseudoscience.


Date: 2006/08/23 20:43:20, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Aug. 23 2006,08:28)
Walker even says right in the article ...  
Look more closely at the outcrop photographed by Meert along Missouri State Highway 67. Of course, it is not possible to positively identify rocks from a photo at such a distance. One can?t clearly see minerals or textures, or easily discriminate between rock, lichen, mould and shadow. It would be preferable to visually inspect the outcrop.
Did you just not read that part, Deadman?  I know ... it's easier to just spout nonsense and hope no one will notice.

Keep it up though.  I notice.

DDTTD, do you remember way back when I made a joke at your expense about you doing 30,000ft/Mach one geology over the Grand Canyon?

No, of course you don't. It goes back to a joke a friend of mine likes to tell about doing 50/50 geology, identifying formations 50 meters away while driving 50 mph. Believe it or not it can be done.

What you do after spotting what you're looking for is pull over and positively identify the formation.

I've found tons of fossils using this method.

I would be happy to show you how it's done in KC, there are some pretty good roadcuts that expose quite a few layers in your area. They have index fossils too.

Date: 2006/08/23 21:03:03, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Aug. 23 2006,10:03)
This is because we are honest.  We do not lie about stuff we cannot prove.

Heehee, liar, fighter pilot DDTTD.

Date: 2006/08/23 21:46:06, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Teehee, good one Steve, driving in circles.

Dave is not only a liar, he's been implicated in a scam.

See, I already know what church DDTTD attends. It ain't no lil' fundy haven of the faithful.

There might or might not be some pissed off Granny's (amongst others) involved.

"I will admit no church is perfect, and ours is not," Hawkins says.

Kinda like his inerrant bible, eh?

DDTTD says, "'s just unfair."

Care to explain DDTTD?

Feet of clay and head full of ... well you know.

Shall I tell 'em what church you attend DDTTD?

Last chance boy.

Date: 2006/08/23 22:24:28, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (deadman_932 @ Aug. 24 2006,02:59)
Shall I tell 'em what church you attend DDTTD?

I know!! I know!!

Put your hand down DM, let's give him enough rope.

I said a long time ago you need to stop doing his homework for him.

But I will stand you for a couple of pitchers (not DDTTD's pitchers) if you promise to bring your arrows. You don't stand a chance, I learned how to toss from Conrad Daniels Dad and lil' brother.

Date: 2006/08/23 22:38:19, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (deadman_932 @ Aug. 24 2006,02:59)
And remember that Dave said he wasn't going to try to make any money off this? The yearly cost per child for the Kids 4 Truth clubs is $35.95. (plus you get to buy their crap, ranging from baby jammies -- to little "awards" to give your perfectly programmed kiddies.)

Yep, and I feel like an old man because it took me a couple more posts to catch on than it did you.

Thanks DM, all I need is to feel older than I actually am.

I'll still buy the pitchers. Kansas City Boulevard Pale Ale for everbody!

Date: 2006/08/24 20:24:18, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (deadman_932 @ Aug. 24 2006,04:50)
Hah..yeah, you're old. And as soon as you stop dancing on the table and pinching the waitress, I'll shoot you a game. Go easy on me, I'm just learning!  ;)

If I was dancing on a table it was because we needed rain and dang it the waitress pinched me first so it was quid pro quo!

Date: 2006/08/24 21:27:14, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Aug. 24 2006,06:39)
Dave is not only a liar, he's been implicated in a scam.

See, I already know what church DDTTD attends. It ain't no lil' fundy haven of the faithful.
What "scam" would that be, Crabby?  You know what church I attend?  So what Sunday shall I look for you?  Are you going to post a picture so I can recognize you?  

Jupiter--  what is your question?  I didn't mean to avoid you.

Oh and oddly enough, he already has an endorsement from "Answers in Genesis" ...looks like I DID hit it on the head two months back or whatever it was.
Where do you see that?  I'm glad ... I just was not aware that we have an endorsement from them.  I have personally never spoken to anyone at AIG except a customer service lady when I was ordering.  Also, how do you equate charging for stuff at K4T with AFD getting paid from K4T?  Is this Evo-logic?  Like there are different colored rock layers ... therefore the layers took millions of years to get deposited? (even though we cannot really date any of them absolutely as we have now seen)  Again, I have never been paid by K4T, but I have donated large amounts and continue to do so.  My plans are to NEVER take a salary from K4T even if I were to take a full time position with them.  I make my money the old fashioned way ... I work for it.  You know ... selling products and services that real customers want to buy.  How do you make YOUR money, Deadman?  Crabby?  Anyone else?  Any Government handouts out there?  

Bing ... you hit on one of my favorite topics ... the Roman Catholic Church.  The answer to your question is that I think the RCC began losing their way when Constantine legalized Christianity.  Since that time, the Catholic Church hierarchy became very corrupt, although there continued to be a great many members and some leaders of the church who were true Christians.  There are many Catholics who I admire -- Martin Luther being one of them.  The same situation is true today.  While the hierarchy is much less corrupt than they were in medieval times, the official church doctrine is in many ways very far from the teachings of Christ, especially touching on things like the mass, adoration of Mary, authority of church tradition over Biblical authority, purgatory, etc.  However, individual Catholic people are just like anyone else in that they can read the Bible for themselves and know the truth about Christ and his teachings.  So I'm sure there are many who have done this and are genuine Christians.  Anyone could look at some Baptist or Methodist or whatever organization and make the accusation that "those people aren't genuine Christians."  Well, true ... some are not.  But many are.  I cannot see a person's heart.  Only God can do that.

The only valid definitions we have for a Christian in the first place necessarily comes from the 4 gospels and the apostolic writings.  You have to find out what Christ taught, then follow it if you want to be called a Christian.  And I suppose that the degree to which you follow those teachings corresponds to the degree of genuineness of your Christianity.  Jesus said many things.  

And I for one am not a perfect follower although this is my goal.

OK DDTTD, Tri City Baptist Church, Independance MO.

A wonderful lil' haven of fundamentalism. How's Herbster doing these days DDTTD? Are you still his taxi driver of choice?

Remember when I compared Jim Bakker and Bob Bakker? No?

Guess who is a huckster and who is a scientist? Guess which one you and yours resemble?

Here's my pic Dave,

I hope you don't mind if I drop in unannounced, I'm sure you'll understand considering what a celebrity you are.

Gov't Handouts DDTTD? Geez I wish I could afford to buy the influence you and your compatriots do.

Now we get to the Roman Catholic Church. Dang DDTTD a couple of months ago you were crowing about how Constantine making Christianity the state religion was the breakthrough point for Christianity, NOW it's the point where Christianity starts it's decline.

Try to apologise for that dichotomy and explain how the target has shifted.

We also have to put up with DDTTD making an analogy between paleosols and wrecks and how to explain them. Do we NEED another reason to doubt why DDTTD never got a seat in a fighter?

I don't. You have to ask yourself how many pilots DDTTD trained are flying over YOUR house at any particular time to be scared.

I can't believe the moderators here haven't forced DDTTD to DEFEND HIS THESIS but I also said a long time ago DDTTD would have to display an amazing degree of insanity to achieve his goal. Bravo Steve and others.

Date: 2006/08/24 21:46:51, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Aug. 24 2006,10:38)
Also, I will not stand up in front of my church and make announcements because my Pastor would not allow it ... he would not allow you either, so I will simply agree to post my most humble apologies here on the forum if I am wrong.  I also don't expect you to leave the forum if you are wrong.  You can simply post a humble apology.  Maybe buy me a drink.  Maybe shake my hand.  Now ... let's see if you can do it.

Herbster won't allow it DDTTD?

Steaming heaps of road apples.

Who do we need to get a dispensation from to allow you to stand up in front of your congregation and admit you're wrong DDTTD?

'Splain it to me Taxi Driver.

Date: 2006/08/24 22:17:22, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Aug. 24 2006,12:26)
Deadman-- You'd better get cracking on your deal you made.  I made it less painful on you if you lose.  Did I hear you say you want to meet me in a bar?  Think you can get me to dance on the tables or some such thing?  Come on then.  Why don't you come with Crabby?  We'll go to church ... then the bar.

I offered to come to your church, sans anyone else, yet you've done nothing but avoid me or make completely unreasonable demands to meet you.

I haven't been in a bar in years but I'd be happy to change that in your case.

Do we have to get Herbsters permission to call you a moron, liar, pussy and willfully ignorant in your church?

Date: 2006/08/24 22:45:20, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (Ichthyic @ Aug. 25 2006,03:05)

I don't see the position of taxi driver associated with this church.

does dave do this under the table?

hame on you Dave!  I bet you don't even put the income from that on your tax return.

makes me wonder what else dave does for the clergy "under the table"...


I long suspected you were really Mel Gibson.

now, I have a few bones to pick with you mister....


You forgot to look under Deacon/Fighter Pilot Stud/CFO, is that NOT listed?



Date: 2006/08/25 10:41:26, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (Faid @ Aug. 25 2006,10:40)
Cha-ching.  Cha-ching!!  CHA-CHING!!!

Cha-ching.  Cha-ching!!  CHA-CHING!!!

aaah dave, for a spiritual man like you, you really seem obsessed with dough...  :D

davesy, once and for all: Your inability to understand what people are saying to you does not constitute victory. Not in the real world you keep shying away from, at least.

It has been explained to you in twelve different ways, how:
Sediments can be dated INDIRECTLY (by "bracketing", something you disputed but never managed to disprove)
And also DIRECTLY in some cases (using special methods involving events that are demonstratably contemporary with the sediment's forming. And all those HYPOTHETICAL examples you try to handwave away are not hypothetical at all, as both JonF and Deadman have shown (with links). The fact that you JUST figured it out (or should I say, were forced to admit?) doesn't pay off at the stand, dave.
It's not our fault if you bet on a mule.

Now, about our Paleosol thing... remember that? You said that we always embarrass ourselves, trying to prove you wrong... OK then champ, let's raise the stakes a bit, now that you say you got the green to play.
You claimed I could not do what you (say you) did: Quote Meert's response, and also show you where it answers to your engineer (you somehow seem to think copy/paste is a method only you are familliar with). You dared me to do so. Well, here's the double-dare:
If I do it, you will of course be free to respond and refute those claims.
BUT, you will have to address them in the same way everyone else here does: with ARGUMENTS and REASONING. You will provide arguments and evidence that, in your opinion, refute them. There will be NO EVADING ("whoops, I forgot to address point A, silly me"), NO DISTORTING ("how can you actually insist on (A), when I can easily refute (A';)?"), NO HANDWAVING ("haha, Faid, if you think you have proved anything you are way wrong, oh well where were we with the FLUD?")

IF you fail to do so, If you resort to any dishonest tactic such as the ones above, you must admit beforehand (that is, NOW) that you will have lost this issue, because you were unable to participate in it in a reasonal and honest way.

You think you're up to the challenge? After all, I don't ask for much: A chance to embarrass myself in exchange for a truly honest debate... For someone carrying the Torch of Truth, like you, it should be a win-win situation!

Faid, DDTTD is very much concerned with money, it's his major yardstick for success, as it is for the Tri City Ministries and it's spiritual leader Carl Herbester (Political Power is the other yardstick for the TCM boys).

The Prayer of Jabez, twisted out of context, is very much a guiding force for the TCM boys. DDTTD as a deacon of the TCM boys has been called on several times as an apologist for their convoluted business practices. Some have even dared to call TCM an empire.

I'm surprised anyone here still offers DDTTD a gentlemans agreement of any nature after he failed so pitifully to allow me to come to his church and call him names.

He can't be bothered with anything outside his "agenda". That's why whenever someone calls him out he changes the subject. He can't be bothered explaining how limestone forms even though

... right now I'm smack in the middle of a great debate on dating water-laid sedimentary layers which is of great interest to me.

DM, you got to dumb down all those technical papers, all the mumbo jumbo puts him to sleep don'cha know?

He can't understand how multiple massive beds of ash with different point sources differ from igneous intrusions, especially when you throw around terms like smectitic clay and airfall tephra. It all reads like ba ba ba ba ba ba to him as his eyes slowly close.

Heck, he could drive up the road to the Ashfall Beds of Nebraska and see some beds with his own bare naked eyeballs. But he won't.

On a lighter note, I look forward to giving you some darts lessons DM, I'll take it easy on you if you promise to bring that Divine outfit I've heard rumors of and do a little table dance for us too! <Climbs up on the table and shouts "High gravity Pale Ale for everyone!"

Date: 2006/08/25 10:45:15, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (Ichthyic @ Aug. 25 2006,14:22)
Is it my imagination, or is Dave exhibiting more and more disconnect from reality as we go on?

where will it end, I wonder?

Will he overdo his corporal mortifications?

Will his family finally check him into the looney bin?

any other projections?

Someone contacts the FAA and he loses his pilot license?

Date: 2006/08/25 11:46:21, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (deadman_932 @ Aug. 25 2006,16:19)
Crabby: Ever shoot pool? I'm just learning at that, too   ;)

Yep, I shoot some stick too. Dads pool table is still down in the rec. room.

Date: 2006/08/25 22:22:15, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (deadman_932 @ Aug. 25 2006,17:12)
Maybe they didn't read C.S. Lewis

Money, (Political) Power, (Underage) Sex!

It's starting to sound Bob Dobbsian.

The Herbster worked for P & G.

The TCM boys have lots of 'splainin to do.

Comments DDTTD?

Date: 2006/08/26 21:17:07, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
DDTTD, I thank you done got your stank bone kicked again.

I did tell you to look to Nebraska Ash Fall beds to help you conceptualize how ash beds are formed. Where do you think the ash in those beds comes from and how did it get there? Why aren't there dino fossils in those ash beds or modern animals or dad gum it DDTTD, some freakin' ocean living fossil type thingys?

It's similar to how the beds at Koobi Fora formed except the sources of the ash were a lot farther away. And NO ocean living fossil type thingys in Koobi Fora either DDTTD!

Water had nothing to do with it Cletus.

In the Morrison (and other Fms in the GS), water moved some of the ash around but you have to be playing stupid (or you really are that stupid) not to understand the huge areas covered by the multiple eruptions, that the ash blew there or that the eruption sources can be identified and dated.

Now dealing with your trees washing in and creating the appearance of a paleosol. Wrong again yahoo. Turns out we have a very nice example here in NA of just what you propose happening, massive trees transported in a huge flood and deposited half a continent away. They sure as heck didn't end up looking like they grew there and nobody confuses the matrix they're found in with paleosols. Where is it DDTTD?

Another gaping hole in your "hypothesis" the AiG/ICR Creidiots ain't gonna help you on DDTTD, multiple beds of loess with different parent sources.

Dang DDTTD, the Herbster needs a security force? Is it because of the widows who were coerced into purchasing church securities, his previous work for those notorius satanists at Proctor & Gamble or because the Herbster isn't Fundy enough (How fundy is fundy enough?)? Or did he not deliver on some promise he made (I hear the Bluntster is giving him the cold shoulder)?

I don't think I'll be visiting you and the Herbster till I'm sure I'm not gonna get burned or bombed by Fundies more Fundy than you, man handled by the Herbsters Leibstandarte, or coerced into buying TCM Securities. Your church is starting to look Papist to me (not that that is a "bad" thing).

Verstandt Prinzessin?

Date: 2006/08/26 21:30:43, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Please note DDTTD that although I didn't provide you with purty pitchers in the previous post, I DID refrain from using those soporific sciency terms you have such a problem dealing with!

DM do you know what a pen holder grip is (darts)? It's awkward at first but it leads to greater precision.

Date: 2006/08/26 22:52:29, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (deadman_932 @ Aug. 27 2006,02:41)
Senor El Crabster: Certainement mon frere! My hands themselves are lethal weapons seeking only the projectiles that would transfer my deadly powers to the uttermost center of the target board, thus fulfilling the cosmic fate required...nay, demanded by my godlike concentration. ( I was at the world S-F con today and made THREE banks in a row to whoop the butt of some loudmouth doofus, so I'm being facetious..[he was playing a snooker-like game of "hide the cue"]) Plus I drank a bit:P

So you ain't the weeble tyro stick shooter you claim to be? Bring that divine outfit anyhow (and your arrows).

Have tiswin backed with a shot of mezcal on me compadre!

Date: 2006/08/27 08:39:26, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
But hey, if you want to join my camp and disavow the "streams and river deposition" theory, OK.  Fine with me. My whole point has been that even if you can date material in some ash, this is not the same date as the deposition date of the layer if you are assuming that it takes millions of years to deposit this stuff.  

My point in this whole discussion of course, is that I see no way, even with YOUR assumptions about radiometric dating, that you can truthfully date the layers of the Grand Staircase with anything but fossils by speculation about evolutionary history.  If you change your story and say, "Well the volcanic event and the sedimentation happened at the same time" then NOW you are at least being consistent with your assumptions.  But be careful!  If you say that, then you are dangerously close to admitting a Global Flood.  Remember how big that Brushy Basin member is?  Covers something like 8 states?  Your ditching the "stream and river deposition" theory in favor of the "massive quantity of ash settled directly onto a massive body of water" theory?  Hey, go for it.  That's mighty close to believing there was a Global Flood.  My work will then be almost done because all I will have to do then is show you that that volcano really didn't erupt 148 myo.  (I need to call that Berkeley lab sometime and really get some firsthand info on RM dating)

It's too bad you can't understand how sedimentary layers that took a LONG time to form could get covered by windblown ash in a matter of days or weeks, while normal deposition continued. No flud involved. Got dang it this geology stuff is just too sciency! DDTTD really is the Mayor of Simpleton.

Stop talking nonsense.  This is the kind of stuff that makes me think you are dishonest.  No one said anything about trying to jam a tree down into mud.  I've been talking about water transport of plants and sediments.  I have shown you a real world example of trees getting deposited upright.  Now you guys seem to have some example in mind where ALL the roots are in the right direction.  Would someone care to show me an example?  Then maybe this discussion could be a little more meaningful.

All the trees got deposited upright? Yeah right!

Do your own homework Cletus, you're the only one claiming you have a "hypothesis" that better explains the BIG PITCHER. Jeez what a lazy putz.

Don't make stuff up, Deadman.  I know it's hard to make your lie win out over the truth without somehow lying, but you can at least try.  Show me where I have ever said that the Colorado or others like it are "almighty rushing rivers."

How again did the Colorado erode the GC in such a short time if it wasn't an almighty rushing river? Will this dog EVER catch its own tail?

DDTTD, you invited me, then withdrew the invitation, are you inviting me again?

In the meantime, let us pray,

O Lord,
Ooh you are so big
So absolutely huge
Gosh, we're all really impressed down here, I can tell you.


Icthyic, do you have some Jarts? I haven't played in years but I'm up for a beer soaked Jarts Tourney!

Date: 2006/08/27 21:38:24, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Aug. 27 2006,17:17)
Crabby ... Oh, so you still WANT to visit?  OK.  Come on then.  I did not recall that it was me that invited you first.  I thought you invited yourself.  Whatever.  I'll be glad to see you.  Would you like me to buy you lunch so you can insult me properly for an extended period of time?  Or will you just insult me in the lobby?  Or second hand via an usher?  Do you want me to introduce you to the Pastor so you can schedule your announcement about how evil I am?

Crabby  Aug 17 pg 144
Moron, fool, willfully ignorant liar, name the place and I'll call you that in public DDTTD.

DDTTD Aug 17 pg 144
Crabby ...
Moron, fool, willfully ignorant liar, name the place and I'll call you that in public DDTTD.
OK.  My church.  As soon as possible.  When will you be here?

Crabby  Aug 17 pg 145
What's the address DDTTD?

Crabby  Aug 19 pg 148
Got that address to your church DDTTD?

He never did post an address. I had to point out that fundies have burned fundy churches (bombed judges and shot doctors, YIKES!;) because they weren't fundy enough, to get a rise out of him.

He insisted I give him all my personal info before we could meet. Save me Jebus.

At this point the only thing I feel the need to say is,

Coward, moron, fool, willfully ignorant PATHOLOGICAL liar. I hope your shmekel is longer than your memory.

Date: 2006/08/27 22:06:41, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Outstanding post Faid, paleosols, upright trees (in situ) abraded stump deposition and tuff (Why are abraded stumps significant DDTTD?) in a single link.


Date: 2006/08/28 21:45:13, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Aug. 28 2006,10:00)
The first paragraph from Faid's article actually confirms my statement above!  See below ...

1. Eocene Fossil Forests in Yellowstone National Park

The Lamar River Formation in Yellowstone Park contains the best known example of a "fossil forest." Here we find multiple levels of in situ trees. The upright trees at Specimen Ridge are rooted in fine-grained tuffaceous sandstone and encased in conglomeratic mudflows. The grain size of the conglomerate decreases away from the location of the volcanic source areas, the East and West Absaroka belts. Also, the ratio of upright, in situ trees to horizontal trees increases away from the Eocene volcanic source areas - the eruptions and mud flows flattened whole forests proximal to the source, while many trees are preserved in growth position in more distal locations, such as at Specimen Ridge. Although it is unclear how many successive forest layers are present in the Lamar River Formation, estimates range from 9-12 for Specimen Ridge. Some of the levels have very wide and old trees trunks.

The mud flows caused by the Mt St Helens eruption in 1980 provide an excellent analogue for the geologic processes which produced the Yellowstone deposits. Fritz noted that the mixture of transported of upright and transported trees found in mudflows were virtually identical to the deposits seen at Yellowstone. In fact, several 'recent' fossil forests, containing in situ trees up to 7m tall, are present in the vicinity of Mount St Helens, each buried by lahar flows and/or pyroclastics. Exposures of these were exhumed by mudflows after the 1980 eruption. Most of the forest-bearing deposits have been dated to the period 1479-1857 by tree ring analyses of buried trees. These subfossil 'fossil' forests are excellent modern analogues for the Yellowstone forests exposed at Specimen Ridge. Karowe and Jefferson note that the "striking similarity between features of of trees buried in situ by Mount St Helens mudflows and features of upright fossil trees in the Specimen Ridge section of Yellowstone National Park strongly supports a depositional model of in situ burial for the upright trees at Yellowstone" (p. 203; see also Yamaguchi and Hoblitt, 1995).

What is the author referring to?  Well this, of course, which I posted previously.

Oh, and guess what.  After Mt. Saint Helens, they changed the sign!!!

Again, guys, you would know all this if you would expand your minds and read some creationist books for a change.  You've been propagandized all your lives that creationists are evil, lying, money hungry morons, who want to take everybody back to the Dark Ages.  The truth is that creationists have many right answers.  And mainstream science slowly catches up to what creationists often have been saying for a long time.  Again, as I have said before, it is often the creationists who are "at the tip of the spear" in science.  But to be at the tip of the spear is many times a very lonely place.  It is not for the faint-hearted.  It is not for people who seek approval from others.  It is only for courageous, independent thinking people who want the truth about everything no matter what the cost.

Now the rest of the examples given in Faid's article are basically repeats of the Yellowstone situation, which, of course, is exactly what we would expect if there was a Global Flood.  We would expect to see MANY buried forests all over the world.  Many trees would be buried in situ and many would not be.  

Now ... please tell me again what was your point, Faid, in giving me this link?  I guess I really do not understand the Official Millionsofyearsianism Viewpoint on Paleosols.

Crabby-- So are you coming or not?  I can't figure out from your posts if you are or aren't.  Am I buying you lunch?  Or are you just going to walk in and yell at us?

Teehee. OA, I agree, DDTTD has usually been slaughtered so many times over by the time I get here, I have to really work to find a way to get a bitch slap in. Even when he gets corrected, he just comes back with the same bullshit.

Like his stating AGAIN, that we only have 3 RM dated layers in the GS. I actually read through some of the articles DM listed and stopped at 21 layers! I gave DDTTD 2 off the top of my head that dated the bottom and top.


Moreover, the layers have the characterisitcs (sic) of being deposited by RAPIDLY-MOVING WATER.

The only thing I can call this is a pathological lie.

His claims about Yellowstone fossil forests are especially revealing because I warned him last night.

DDTTD can you explain to me what happend at Mt. St. Helens that confirms your flud theory? I was living in California when that happened and as I remember it it was a volcanic eruption, not a flud, much less a global flud.

Would I be surprised that the Mt.St. Helens eruption would leave evidence that resembled the many cases of fossil forests that were caused by volcanic eruptions that Faid linked to?

Nope. Not at all. In fact Faid gave you a boot to the head and you didn't even know it.

Do you think we don't know which trees were buried in situ and which were transported (and abraded) before deposition in any position? Volcanic eruptions DDTTD, not a flud. Paleosols, abraded trees, trees covered in situ by tuffaceous mud = volcanic eruption DDTTD.

Multiple layers of the same = Millionsofyearsism DDTTD. BAM

Volcanic eruption ? flud, mudflow ? flud, Paleosols ? flud DDTTD. BAM

Volcanic eruptions contribute to the destruction of DDTTD's arguments because they are RM datable. BAM

I told you we have a perfectly good example of massive trees transported across half a continent in a massive flood (but still not proof of a global flood). Where is it DDTTD? I also told you your AiG/ICR Creidiots wouldn't/couldn't help you find it. You've ignored the question. BAM

You need to prove your claims about the National Park Service sign too, (you ever seen it with your own barenaked eyeballs DDTTD?) that scan is crap Booboo. BAM

I'll meet you DDTTD but it will be on my terms, I want to show my grandkids a new subspecies of hominid, Homo dimidium fundamentus. I hereby claim naming rights, the question is, who do I use as the Holotype? I'm not waiting for fundy on fundy violence to make DDTTD available for description. Suggestions?

Date: 2006/08/29 21:34:12, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
How do explain(sic) my childhood in the jungles of Brazil where I had plenty of mosquitos, raindrops...

RAINDROPS ouch! Run Momma run, they's freakin' raindrops fallin' from the sky! It's a 'nuther freakin' fludde!

DDTTD keeps showing up as CFO/COO in all the messes he's involved in. Hmmm, the guy who looks at volcanic eruptions and sees (non existant) evidence of a fludde.

Try harder fighter stud Booboo.

My terms Booboo.

Date: 2006/08/30 20:32:53, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Aug. 29 2006,15:31)
And Bing, go talk to David Martin at the Pitch about my Pastor if you like ... your kind of publication possibly?  He will tell you what you want to hear ...

Dave Martin wrote, "Just thinking about ol' Dave gives me a headache."

Then we have this

That is an untrue statement.  You are making stuff up based on an article in a **cough** highly respectable *cough cough* publication (The Pitch--have you read through a copy?) who was fed information by a disgruntled church member.  Will you seek out both sides of the story.

In the Pitch article DDTTD was quoted saying it was a few disgruntled church members but it appears several hundred members left from the attendance figures. Coincidence? Heehee.

Now knowing what I know about DDTTD's creative math, 20-30 dated layers in the GS becomes 5 then 3 again, DDTTD's credentials as CFO/COO of the company he (co)founded and as Treasurer of kids4cults, should anyone trust him?

Some of us also remember the fact that DDTTD first came here and asked us to prove Evolution in 5 statements, like hundreds of years of work by thousands of individuals could be summed up as easily as his "I know Goddidit" statements. Clearly he was arrogant and antagonistic from the gitgo.

Moron, willfully ignorant pathological liar.

Date: 2006/08/30 20:41:50, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Aug. 30 2006,15:45)
Try storing them in your comes to a point.
That's a pretty good one too ... even if it was directed at me :-)

DDTTD like likes you DM.

Date: 2006/08/30 21:28:39, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (deadman_932 @ Aug. 30 2006,16:17)
Creationism attacks specific targets, as ID does...and pretends that it only seeks the elimination of those targets: materialism, evolutionary theory, etc. But the fact is that what creationism/ID represents is ultimately an attempt to "prove" God. You may disagree with this...that's fine, but I will further point out that what you teach those kids is going to be remembered. When they realize, as you have here, the weakness of your position and the folly of trying to "prove" God...**SOME** of them will resent your manipulation and misrepresentations ( to put it kindly).

Two things chap my fundament.

First is this claim that they attack materialism. Why are so many of the leaders of the Fundies (of whatever stripe) so materialistic and how can the sheep be so blind to it? How many 6 figure priced homes does Herbster need and own DDTTD and why?

Second, the unrelenting attacks on science and the anti-science indoctrination of otherwise bright and healthy minds removes those minds from fields which the human race is most in need of.

Sorry, I was trying to explain hole theory in semiconductors to a young person AND listening to another Talking Head explain why it's neccessary for us to militarily intervene in Iran, and I've lost my train of thought.

Date: 2006/09/01 20:58:09, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (improvius @ Aug. 31 2006,17:20)
Don't feel too bad.  My parents told me that chiggers would burrow under my skin.  whenever I got chigger bites, my mom would cover them with nail polish to "smother" them.

They also fed me, among other things, Spam sandwiches.

Strangely enough the old nail polish remedy is one of the best. It doesn't smother redbugs but it does keep oxygen away from the stylostome and helps prevent the bite from turning into that nasty suppurating wound.

I swear by it anyhow.

Chigger bites are the only thing I hate worse than fire ant bites.

What's wrong with Spam sandwiches?

Date: 2006/09/01 21:03:53, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Aug. 31 2006,21:50)
... glad you are still here drinking from the Fount of Creationist Wisdom :-)

Guess what I do in that fount?

Date: 2006/09/01 21:28:58, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (stevestory @ Sep. 01 2006,13:52)
Was Jesus driving a '68 Charger?

Cause that's what I'd drive if I were god.

Oh come on, God was driving a Matra in '68, Jesus was driving a Chaparral and Judas was driving a Charger.

Date: 2006/09/01 22:07:14, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
DDTTD, your whale of amount of water needed to lay down the sediment we see in Grand Canyon is exactly the amount of water that's always been here. No more, no less, no fludde.

I've asked you several times to identify a fossil forest that shows every sign of having gigantic trees moved across half a continent in a massive (but not world encompassing) flood.


It would seem to support your claims but the AiG/ICR boys ain't got no answers

What would Jeshua drive? It depends, if it was a performance car it would probably be like this

Date: 2006/09/02 22:09:37, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Sep. 02 2006,19:06)
Nice organized fossils, huh?  Wanna show me an example?

Mosasaur maximus fossils are found in a constricted range of deposits world wide but they are all of the same age.

Go stud boy Don't let the raindrops slow you down!

Ouch Mama, the rain is falling SO Hard!

Date: 2006/09/03 22:48:18, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
DDTTD says...

Why does it always seem that every time the word 'God' is even mentioned, everybody runs for cover and says it's not science?

Nobody's running for cover, but until you understand that saying goddidit, you just don't have a clue what science is.

DDTTD says...

And so people don't think I'm greedy...


Do you realize that companies in America have literally shut down whole divisions because of thin-skinned, greedy, litigious people?  Cessna Aircraft Company is one of them.  People like this are helping to destroy America.

We have every reason to think you and yours are greedy.

Destroy America? Teehee. What investment did you get BURNED on to spout that nonsense? Why did that lousy socialist rag The Pitch bring up your church's involvement with Graco? (The original story was first printed by the Kansas City Star, what's wrong with their credentials DDTTD?) There's enough evidence, dubious or not, that YOUR church is involved in a LOT more than saving souls. Greed for both political and monetary power is defininatly involved. Your kids4cults site is just another mani(in)festation of that mentality.

You've told us why you're here repeatedly but the story's changed whenever you had your back to the wall (and you've taunted us by telling us we didn't REALLY know why you're here, OOPS hand me that crack pipe DM).

Now you drop these steaming heaps on us and run.

I have no such illusions.  Here at ATBC, I am really in the role of Investigative Journalist. So I investigate the claims of Evolutionists and the claims of Creationists.


I write materials for kids.


And I want to write accurately.


Because that is really my goal -- to weigh the claims of the Evos against the claims of the Creos.

DANG DDTTD I'm gonna go whack a dead skunk to get the stench outta my nose!

DDTTD, you have no illusions, you have major league delusions.

Is there any question why some have equated your behaviour with child abuse?

I picked up a copy of your Creo rag, "The Stitch" today, and I gotta tell you boy, I laughed till my stomach muscles hurt and I do 40 sit ups a day!

Dammit, I just rubbed two neurons together and the colours are fantabulous! Anybody up for some dead skunk Satay? The grill is hot! Beers are on me.

Date: 2006/09/03 23:21:30, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
How the #### do you get a stingray to poke you in the chest?

Date: 2006/09/05 20:45:35, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (JonF @ Sep. 05 2006,15:30)
Quote (afdave @ Sep. 05 2006,10:35)
JonF is still yelling "Fraud, fraud" while failing to see how completely irrelevant and silly his fraud claim is.  But alas ... what's a Darwinist to do?  Honest dealing with facts is impossible for many of them ... so that leaves goofy techniques such as yelling "Fraud" just for the fun of it.

Actually, and incredibly, Dave has somewhat of a point; there's more to the paper than Snelling's fraud.  But not much more ... I'm going to reproduce the entire conclusions section so everyone can see exactly how bizarre it is:
The Rb-Sr, Sm-Nd and Pb-Pb radioisotopic ratios in these samples of the recent (1949-1975) andesite lava flows at Mt Ngauruhoe, New Zealand, as anticipated, do not yield any meaningful "age"; information, even with selective manipulation of the data. Instead, these data provide evidence of the mantle source of the lavas, of magma genesis, and of crustal contamination of the parental basalt magmas. Subduction of the Pacific Plate beneath the Taupo Volcanic Arc has carried trench sediments with it -- sediments identical in composition to the Torlesse metasediment basement underlying, and outcropping adjacent to, these volcanoes. Scraped off the subducting slab, the sediments have contaminated the basalt magmas generated by partial melting of the peridotitic mantle wedge at the mantle-slab interface. The resultant andesite magmas rose in the melt column through the mantle wedge, and then ascended through fracture conduits in the overlying crust into magma chambers below the volcanoes that erupted when full.

The Sr-Nd-Pb radioisotopic systematics are thus characteristic of the depleted mantle source, modified by mixing with the crustal contaminant. Variations in the depleted mantle Nd "model ages", which range from 724.5 to 1453.3 Ma, and which are meaningless in this recent (even in conventional terms) tectonic and petrogenetic framework, and the Pb isotopic linear arrays, indicate geochemical heterogeneity in the mantle wedge. Thus the radioisotopic ratios in these recent Ngauruhoe andesite lava flows were inherited from both the peridotitic mantle wedge and the subducted trench sediments, and are fundamental characteristics of their geochemistry. They therefore only reflect the origin and history of the mantle and crustal sources from which the magma was generated, and therefore have no age significance.

By implication, the radioisotopic ratios in ancient lavas found throughout the geologic record are likely fundamental characteristics of their geochemistry. They therefore probably only reflect the magmatic origin of the lavas from mantle and crustal sources, and any history of mixing or contamination in their petrogenesis, rather than any valid age information. Even though radioisotopic decay has undoubtedly occurred during the earth's history, conventional radioisotopic dating of these rocks therefore does not necessarily provide valid absolute "ages" for them. This is especially so if accelerated nuclear decay accompanied the catastrophic operation of those geologic and tectonic processes responsible for the mixing of the radioisotopic decay products during magma genesis.

Now, we know that Davie-doodles (the one in the corner with the dunce cap) can't see how incredibly disjointed this is, but can anyone else in the class see it?  Anyone?  OK, you in the back with your hand up, Maurice?


Absolutely correct, Maurice!  The last paragraph is not supported by the data and discussions in the paper.  It's actually even worse than that; the last paragraph, claiming that all radiometric dating is wrong, has absolutely  no relationship to the rest of the paper!.  Here, I'll summarize the paper on the blackboard so we can all see the disconnect:

  • A K-Ar dating test on samples known to be invalid produced incorrect results.  Duh.  Fraud.
  • Isochron analyses produced no valid age and the data clearly and objectively indicated that no valid age could be obtained.
  • Nd model age calculations are also meaningless since the data clearly and objectively indicates that the samples contain Nd derived from other sources than in-situ radioactive decay.
  • Analyses of isotope concentrations produced results consistent with those of nearby volcanoes.
  • The isotope concentrations are also consistent with mainstream theories of mantle-generated lava and subduction of plates.
  • The existing isotopic profiles of this young lava are inherited from the parent lava. (Since it's too young to have developed an age-determining isotopic profile -- jonf)
  • Therefore all isotopic profiles are inherited from the parent lava and all radiometric dating is wrong.

Yes, Sarah?


True, Sarah, it's difficult to see how anyone could fall for that, but they do.  Af "sedimentary tuffs" dave swallowed it hook, line, and sinker.  The major problem is that they don't understand how age-diagnostic radiometric methods work (although Snelling does, and knows that his last paragraph is bovine excrement).  The secondary problem is that they immediately and unquestioningly accept anything that agrees with their preconceptions; they can't handle the easy questions, much less the tough ones.  Sad, really, and kind of pathetic.

Got dang it Jon I had my hand up but you completely ignored me (no doubt because I'm a member of of devolved race).


Even though radioisotopic decay has undoubtedly occurred during the earth's history, conventional radioisotopic dating of these rocks therefore does not necessarily provide valid absolute "ages" for them. This is especially so if accelerated nuclear decay accompanied the catastrophic operation of those geologic and tectonic processes responsible for the mixing of the radioisotopic decay products during magma genesis.

Those continents whizzing around at great speeds obviously sped up nucular decay at the same time. How much clearer can it be?

We can trust the Naval Observatory Clock nowadays but obviously there was something going on 6000 YA to mess things up. I ain't saying goddidit but SOMEBODY did.

Now please kindly stop trying to indoctrinate me and mine into the cult of IT'SOLDERTHANMYFEEBLEBRAINCANCOMPREHENDISM

Thanks and have a nice day!

Date: 2006/09/05 21:16:25, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
One more problem for DDTTD and his ilk (he likes to use ilk so I will too), peat above lignite above bituminous above anthracite.

I won't apologise for using fossils to date sedimentary layers, there aren't any angiosperm fossils found in deposits older than the late Cretaceous.

Why DDTTD? Can you (or your nose wiggling magi) discern the difference between pollen and spores?

The grill is hot and a couple of teriyaki whistlepigs are on their way, anybody hungry?

Date: 2006/09/06 20:43:12, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
How could the Nickajack State Blasphemers be left out of this list of great football teams?


Punt Nickajack State PUNT!

Date: 2006/09/08 22:54:53, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Sep. 08 2006,13:21)
We'll see who's laughing 10 years from now ...

Deadman and friends?

Or the RATE Group ...

Heh, DDTTD says, "You talkin' to me, you talking to me...?

In ten years we'll see wing nuts like DDTTD from the FUDPUCKER (Fundamentalists Using Discredited Protocols to Utilise Creationist Kinderspielen for Enlisting Recruits) PROJECT spouting the same old crap, with a few corrections, because it's been force fed to them.

Like the old saw about how archaeopteryx was a fake. None of DDTTD's AiG/ICR "experts" made that claim! Es(bullshit)chew! Remember that claim DDTTD?

The YEC guys repeatedly start new organisations because they keep getting the crap whipped out of them (and arguing about whos' interpretation of the "inerrent bible" is more correct).

Loneliness has followed me my whole life. Everywhere. In bars, in cars, sidewalks, stores, everywhere. There's no escape. I'm God's lonely man.

Evidence for your hypothesis DDTTD??? Come on! You can do it!


Date: 2006/09/09 22:21:13, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Sep. 09 2006,19:20)
And you will be too one day ... by choice or by force!

I'm sure this type of threat/argument works well on 3rd graders who are   intimidated by (pseudo) adult authority figures like yourself DDTTD, but there aren't any 3rd graders here.

This type of statement does lend itself to the earlier questions about whether what you do falls into the category of child abuse. The answer is an unqualified YES.

Statements about the ability of educated humans to reconstruct train wrecks (or plane crashes) or how systems that aren't 100% reliable aren't safely usable also call into question your education as an engineer of any type (much less a fighter stud).

Do you drive across the I-35/Paseo bridge often DDTTD?

What school did you receive your EE degree from?

It's obvious you can't defend your "hypothesis"!

DDTTD, how are you gonna 'splain Aspen tree roots that are older than your 6K "theory" of the Universe?

Date: 2006/09/11 20:30:19, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Sep. 11 2006,10:18)
Not too many people I know want to drive across the Paseo bridge in KC that Crabby mentioned and it has NEVER dropped a car into the river.  It's just been suspect.  Imagine how much traffic it would get if it had dropped cars into the river in 4 out of the last 20 years!  That's the situation we have with Argon dating.

The unprecedented freedom in England and subsequently in America is a direct result of Martin Luther and the Reformation which he started.

DDTTD, once again you expose your massive ignorance.

The I-35/Paseo bridge is the most used bridge in KC! Just because you and your clique think it's a "suspect" bridge doesn't make it so. It just exposes your prejudice and ignorance, as does the next statement I've quoted.

Martin Luther had nothing to do with "unprecedented freedom" in England... That process started 300+ years earlier with the Magna Carta Libertatum, a legal document, not a religious document.

I can understand why you won't tell us what your alma mater is seeing how it did such a terrible job of educating you.

Date: 2006/09/11 20:51:35, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
DDTTD, again, how do you 'splain living Aspen tree roots that are older than 6000 years (or other living organisms older than that magik figure)?

Or YOUR hypothesis?

How much did you pay for this indulgence?

Date: 2006/09/11 21:30:34, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (Ichthyic @ Sep. 12 2006,01:43)
well, see, there's your problem, Crabby.

You assumed that the education Dave got had any impact on the previous amount of brainwashing he was subjected to.

Dave was washed and dried long before he attempted to get any kind of degree.

in fact, I think we had this discussion before; getting an engineering degree appears to be one of the few degrees someone with Dave's state of mind can actually obtain, which might explain why there appears to be a preponderance of engineers among the ranks of the creobots.

You are correct, my problem is trying to understand how an accredited school (that the Air Force would accept) could produce a student as massively ignorant as DDTTD and why the majority of them are engineers.

I'm truly baffled.

Date: 2006/09/12 20:35:33, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
DDTTD in his Buster Brown suit swinging his legs and licking his lolliplop says

Nice essay, Steve.  You're telling me that Google scholar is not even in the ballpark for the results I posted?  Tell me how to search ISI Web of Science, then, and let's see those results.


Eric-- What page was that on where you re-posted my piece on Tyre.  Will you kindly post that again for 7P?

Will you do my homework for me PLEASE!

Moron, coward, and lazy, willfully ignorant liar.

Date: 2006/09/12 20:58:05, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (Occam's Aftershave @ Sep. 12 2006,18:20)
Hey SFBDave, check this out!

Over at TheologyWeb Natural Science, geologist Glenn Morton (the devout Christian and ex-YEC you love to hate) has a new thread about the geological evidence that refutes YEC.

Glenn can provide dozens of examples (including the buried limestone canyon in China you already ran from) that make your pathetic YEC claims look just silly.

Here's your big chance for redemption Davie.  Why don't you go register over there (it's free) and tell him yourself why his geology is all wrong?

I'd pay money to watch an honest Christian like Glenn Morton kick your lying ass up one side of the page and down the other.  Do you have the balls to take on a Christian professional geologist Davie?  Or is anything beyond lying to kids outside your comfort zone?

OA, as you and everyone here already knows, DDTTD isn't going to respond to questions that don't show up in searchs of AiG/ICR websites.

White Cliffs of Dover, deeply buried canyons, orogeny of mountains in places they shouldn't be (east/west mountains in North America), Tiktaalik, where the water came from and went too and Living organisms older than his magik 6000 year age of the Universe.

I especially love this statement,

Radiometric dating is bogus and there are right now about 8 PhD's criss-crossing the country doing RATE Seminars and telling huge crowds how mistaken you all are.  The next one is in Dallas on Sept 30.  Maybe you could go and heckle the speakers :-)

I just think it's great that a few PhD's committed to the truth can make such an enormous splash on the world scene!  I get a chuckle every time I think about it.

Reminds me of a Three Stooges bit... Doctor, Doctor, Doctor, good work Doctor, thank you Doctor, outstanding work Doctor!...(shaking hands all around)

Nyuck, nyuck, nyuck.

Date: 2006/09/12 21:07:36, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (Seven Popes @ Sep. 12 2006,22:46)
And yet we gave him proof that the city has been continuously inhabited. It's been built and rebuilt continuously since it's  formation as a city, and Dave will not address that.  Instead, he throws this totally refuted bit of rubbish up and scampers off.

DDTTD would be better served reading a piece of fiction like Micheners The Source to gain some insight into the prehistoric and historic Middle East.

Date: 2006/09/12 21:18:47, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (stevestory @ Sep. 12 2006,14:18)
Maybe it would be available at the public-access computers at your nearest university. Otherwise, you might get lucky and find a review paper where someone has spent days going through the data for you. Otherwise it would take you several days at the library. I have no idea why you'd want to do that. JonF's 54 vs 30 number is good enough.

I told him about the Linda Hall Library a LONG time ago but that would require DDTTD to make a trip to the inner city!


The horror!

They's people down there I cain't cower with my threats of eternal damnation!

I ain't takin' my lillywhite suburban popo down to Dens of Iniquity like that!

Date: 2006/09/12 21:46:14, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Come on DDTTD, explain the orogeny of the St. Francois/Ozark/Ouchita complex of mountains!

Your "theory" already has North America racing, bumping and grinding around, one more fender bender shouldn't be too much of a stretch for the "great" minds at AiG/ICR to answer.

Those "dedicated PhDs" should have some sort of plausible explanation for those old, old mountains.

They's diamonds in them thar hills DDTTD! Come on! We can get rich in the name of the lord! The Prayer of Jabez guarantees it!

Date: 2006/09/14 21:03:40, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
All I can say at this point, is DDTTD has been given way more leeway to produce evidence of his "hypothesis" than he would have been at any other forum I ever visited, without doing anything of the sort.

It's time to spank DDTTD, like the bad widdl' boy he is and move his non relevant posts to the place they belong.

I realise this could mean moving ALL his posts there but I'd say just move his new posts that don't actually deal with "AF Dave's UPDATED Creator God Hypothesis" to that place.

It might tighten him up intelectually, but I doubt it.

Date: 2006/09/17 21:12:16, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Sep. 15 2006,11:48)
It also is helpful in dialogue to know where a person is coming from.

Yes, American history to me is about the United States of America, which in my opinion, began with white settlers.  Sorry if that sounds insensitive or something, but that appears to be the facts of history.  And I'm not excusing Indian mistreatment either.  Just stating the facts.

Yes, it is useful to know where a person is coming from. Your condescending attitude towards non whites (and Native Americans in particular) has already been noted. You've also made the claim that your "good book" can explain racial differences. I can't wait for that explanation.

You aren't stating the facts, you are expressing your massively ignorant opinions.

American History extends farther into the past than your "inerrant mythology" can account for so you have to discredit anything that predates your dogma.

We don't even need to discuss pre Clovis sites to blow your 'merican history starts with fundy white immigrants wiping out the local inhabitants view of American History (much less the History of the Universe).

Let's add racist to moron and willfully ignorant liar!

Date: 2006/09/18 20:55:37, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
The Sumerians/Babylonians were writing on clay, the Egyptians were writing on stone walls and papyrus, contemporary Incas were writing with knots and colored strings and yet DDTTD contends (without any evidence whatsoever) the nomadic Hebrews were keeping records on stone tablets!

Come On Hezekiah! The goats are hungry and we gotta MOVE! Hang on 'Zeke, I gotta chisel out a few more notes and pack these tablets away. DANG, that tablet broke! You guys go ahead without me while I re-chisel it or Moses is gonna be powerful pissed.

I say my progenitors were smart enough to get out of the Middle East well before all that fludding and tower of Babel craziness went down.

We were begatting over here in America (North and South) before the post glacial weather settled down enough to permit agriculture to develop. That's why we domesticated a completely different set of flora and fauna. Think about that when you give thanks for "our" Turkey on "your Holidays" and let me celebrate my Green Corn Ceremony in peace.

Ghost of a paleass

You might want to look into the influence the Iroquois and other Natives had on the Founding Fathers. I don't confuse American History and U.S. History. American History began a long time before Europeans stepped off the brow and said, "Hey, what's for dinner?"

Yep, everbody who knows me calls me Mr. PC, but you can call me Mr. Appleton.


There are organisms that have been alive longer than your "hypothesis" allows for.

Date: 2006/09/19 21:15:41, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Sep. 19 2006,06:55)
Crabby ... you are displaying some monumental ignorance of basic history ...

The Hebrews didn't even exist as a people until after 2000BC.  They probably used the same writing systems as the Egyptians until they left Egypt, when they began using vellum (hopefully you know what vellum is).  When I talk about the book of Genesis being a written account of eyewitness history, I'm talking about the tablet records which comprise what we now know as Genesis 1:1-37:2a.  All these were composed prior to birth of the Hebrew nation.  Moses was simply a compiler of these records, plus he wrote his own record.

I'm displaying ignorance? Heh.

5000 year old quipus (hopefully you know what a quipu is, eh?) have been unearthed that predate your 2000 BCE Hebrews. It'd be pretty hard for the sons of Abraham to make it to the New World before that Patriarch was born would it not? Keep in mind you've admitted post flood dating works!

Golly gee, American History goes wayback Mr. Peabody!

So much for the "theory" that Native Americans are one of the "Lost Tribes of Israel". Go stand in the corner with Joseph Smith, boy and leave the moldy rye bread alone.

Yet you're still spouting nonsense about nomads carrying around tablets that record all that begatting and speculating that the Hebrews were using Egyptian writing systems, hieroglyphs on stone or clay tablets,  vellum or papyrus?

Where in the world is the evidence for any of this claptrap DDTTD?

Date: 2006/09/20 21:24:20, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Sep. 20 2006,21:52)
... your ancestors were pond scum :-)  (the sad part is you really believe that last part)

... you did finally realize that I said "people like PZ" which of course means Evolutionists in general.

Steve Story-- I guess I will have to watch out ... I have an able and distinguished Photoshop opponent now!

Has it dawned on you that I plan to be here as long as I can find a good YEC purpose for being here?  Or until I am banned?

You are not even CLOSE to falsifying a 6000 year old earth.

It's not sad that we realize that Evolution has taken place during the Deep Time you fear so greatly, what is sad is that you are so revolted by the fact that your Momma is a nekkid African ape. We have proof of that too DDTTD! Get over it. You and you children are nekkid African apes.

DDTTD doesn't "mean" the same old stuff, he means the old same stuff! SEE! You can't get there from heah. Come on guys, the red dots are DDTTD hypothesizin'!

Photoshop opponent? You admit you're doctoring evidence? No surprises there. You needed Photoshop to doctor that graph? What a dolt.

Ahh, dawned on us about your purpose? I said a long time ago you were here to be crucified (banned) about the same time DM said you were here to bilk the ignorant of their filthy lucre.

You're too cowardly both physically and mentally to ever suffer as Yeshua alledgedly did (but you can play at it over the internet, pseudo fighter stud).

No one here has to falsify a 6000 YO "theory" of the earth, YOU do. Then you have to prove your "hypothesis".

Good luck with that Taxi Driver.

Date: 2006/09/27 20:03:33, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (Mike PSS @ Sep. 27 2006,21:29)
I'm going to start holding AFDave's evidence to the same level of expectation. :D

AFDave is Luddite and doesn't like those RM machines.

The only evidence DDTTD has presented here is that he's a liar and a willfully ignorant moron (as well as a coward).

From his own blog;

I actually enjoy getting comments from people who DISAGREE with me. The stronger your disagreement and the more intelligent you sound, the better!

He thinks he's being clever by making statements like this.

His sole purpose here is to be (symbolically crucified) banned.

He's too cowardly to die for what he believes (like the apostles supposedly did), he won't take a physical beating for what he believes. He won't even take an intellectual/psychological beating on HIS OWN BLOG! That's why comments are turned off on his blog and why I'm sure he hasn't shown any of his friends this website.

Our Radical Diletantte Dave is merely tolerated by those in his life because he's a competent taxi driver.

Date: 2006/09/29 21:59:29, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (ericmurphy @ Sep. 29 2006,17:11)
By contrast, ask Dave virtually any question about his "hypothesis," and he won't have an answer. But somehow, his "hypothesis" is a "better explanation" for huge swaths of observations than the standard theories.

Sure, Dave.

Wait a minute! DDTTD always has an answer for those tough questions, it's his Mantra.

Say it with me, I know you can.



I keep pointing out to DDTTD that there are plenty of places close to his home where he can explore his issues with fossils in more depth, but he keeps flying off to other locales.

Avoiding the issues?

Silver Dollar City is a bastion of scientific theory!

Granny, whomp us up a load o' possum and grits while we search for some black gold, Texas Tea, yada yada yada.

Try DRIVING out to Elmo Kansas and finding some of the absolutely amazing Permian insect fossils at that site.

WHAT catastrophe preserved the delicate features of those fossils?

It weren't a dang MASSIVE flood did that me bucko.

Enjoy your vacation in Redneck City and try again, Jethro.

Date: 2006/10/06 20:50:16, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Oct. 06 2006,22:40)
Yes, Argy, it seems I will have to drive the 40 miles to do that (sigh).

More lies from RDDTTD. A short trip to the Linda Hall Library would fulfill all his sciency needs.

Here's a contact for you to continue your education on paleosols in Missouri,

Chalfant, Michael
Soil Scientist and Archaeologist
Phone: (573) 884-3440

View paleosol and loess with your bare nekkid eyeballs Davey and be enlightened. I dare you.

You can also start preparing your refutation of cosmogenic-isotope dating.

Science keeps outrunning you and your AIG/ICR knuckleheads RDDTTD.

Date: 2006/10/09 21:30:46, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Oct. 09 2006,10:58)
I do not pretend to be a scientific researcher with plans to publish research papers with detailed predictions of anything.  As I have said many times, I am more of an investigator who is very interested in finding out if there is anything scientific about the claims of establishment scientists WRT Origins--you claim to be one of these.  So you are missing the boat to say "I can make predictions ... and you, Dave, cannot."  Great.  You're a scientist.  I'm not.  I'm more of a science journalist.  Science journalists--which is a fair label for someone like me, considering my work at Kids4Truth--don't make scientific predictions.  Science journalists read the published works of scientists and report on their findings.  And when a crime has been committed, an investigator gets involved.  From my perspective, a crime has been committed.  What is the crime?  Large scale lying to kids in the name of Darwin.  So an even better description of someone like me might be "Investigative Science Reporter."


Dave says elsewhere,

I AM a scientist who has used my science in business to become quite wealthy. Believe me, I know the difference.

I don’t believe I have ever said that science is a religion. I practice science and apply it in my business.

Our own Radical Diletantte Dave The Taxi Driver has spun so many lies he can't keep track of them any more.

Davey Bickle/Travis Hawkins has made so many claims about why he's here, while taunting us that we have have no clue why he's here, that it's hilarious.

But hey, it's just a witch hunt.

RDDTTD are you a witch?

Questions RDDTTD has avoided to be added to the list.

Orogeny of the Saint Francois/Ozark/Ouachita Mountain Complex.

Beautifully preserved Perman insect fossils in Elmo Kansas, no evidence of a flud here!

Tuff deposts in the Nebraska Ashfall beds.

Paleosol/loess deposts one on top of the other in Missouri and neighboring states with rock solid dating.

Buy an Estwing rock hammer and a loupe and get out and investigate some of these sites close to your home Dave. Fieldwork will set you free.

In the mean time stop lying to children like David Koresh did.

Date: 2006/10/11 21:42:31, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
RDDTTD says, "How about naming one of my lies?"

You've got to be kidding!

RDDTTD says, "I do not pretend to be a scientific researcher with plans to publish research papers with detailed predictions of anything."

Hmm, already covered this,

RDDTTD says elsewhere, "I AM a scientist who has used my science in business to become quite wealthy. Believe me, I know the difference."

RDDTTD says, "I don’t believe I have ever said that science is a religion. I practice science and apply it in my business."

RDDTTD says, "I agree that this would be dishonest.  I try very hard not to do this.  You will also notice that if I ever DO quote someone and I am shown that the quote does not support the conclusion which I drew, I will publicly withdraw my assertion."

RDDTTD says, "I'm more of a science journalist."

Come on RadicalDiletantteDave! Can you show me how none of the above quotes are yours or how they've been taken out of context?

As far as I can tell, you ain't none of the above except a cowardly, willfully ignorant liar!

Date: 2006/10/17 20:04:28, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (deadman_932 @ Oct. 17 2006,08:56)
Hah. One of the most pleasant digs I'd ever been on was "doubling up" with some fish biologists studying arctic grayling and char (a salmonid, Dave, JFYI) in Alaska. On rainy days when the archaeology was slow, it was fun to set nets and catalogue populations -- reminded me of the leisurely earthiness of geology fieldwork. Plus the char wuz some good eats and feisty, too. Sorry, Ichthyic.

OT but I have to ask DM, do you know Tim Heaton?

Date: 2006/10/18 21:15:13, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (Henry J @ Oct. 18 2006,23:40)
Re "how come we don't see any people lving to be, oh, 700 or 900 years old anymore?"

Cause Lazarus Long and his kinfolk try to avoid being noticed by us shorter lived folk. ;)


Heh, Henry ...right theory, wrong universe...

DM, U.spelunkus, THAT provoked a belly laugh. For a good time, call Zog!

Dave, add neutronium dating to cosmogenic-isotope dating you need to refute.

You keep falling behind in your homework and fail to make it up. You realize this WILL end up in your permanent record?

Date: 2006/10/19 21:37:31, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Hey Davey, why hasn't an archaeologist, anthropologist, biblical scholar or anyone else for that matter, ever found human remains that show the wear of 900 years of living (or 500, or 100)?

It'd be pretty hard to hide that kind of wear and tear on a human skeleton even if they were "genetically rich"! Don't wave your hands or diddle your nose. 'Splain please.

Considering the number of Egyptian (and other) bodies we've recovered, it's kind of hard to believe not one 900 YO set of gigantic or normal sized human remains have ever been found in the Near East.

Did Adam and his begats shed teeth like T-Rex or did they have super teeth, super knees, super hips, super prostates? Was Adam a six billion shekel man?

It's Get Busy Time Davey and you keep falling behind. Test is on, ... whoops it's already Friday! Permanent record Dave. Yeshua is watching!

The proper name for the new holotype of hominid Davey represents is Homo spelunkus. Probing the depths of ignorance. Ouch!

Date: 2006/10/21 22:15:13, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Why did god need to rest on the 7th day?

Date: 2006/10/22 19:53:19, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Davey the Taxi Driver is real. Remember the author of the Pitch article about the monetary shenanigans at Daveys church commented on his frequent use of BOLDED CAPS in correspondance?

His reponse to a question about Davey was, "Just thinking about ol' Dave gives me a headache."

Davey's not stupid, he's willfully ignorant (as well as all those other things we call him) which is much worse in my opinion.

His behavior here makes it clear why his Air Force Career went the way it did despite his protests to the contrary. His comments about a General changing the rules on him after he accepted FAIP duty and avoiding nuclear capable aircraft are also telling.

I'm sure it would be quite entertaining to read Daveys annual Air Force evals.

Davey proves he has few original thoughts because he rarely answers questions that don't have ready answers provided for him at AiG or ICR and when he does (see Portuguese Moment) he promptly shoots himself in the foot and retreats from the battlefield (with his hands clasped above his head and his tail between his legs).

Davey, please explain to me how fossils and sediments can be "sorted" by liquefaction? LIQUEFACTION? Remember we need a sciency explanation and not more hand waving/nose wiggling!

Date: 2006/10/23 20:58:44, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Davey says,

You've taken on an enormous burden, guys, to try and convince me the record of these events (except the Ice Age) was dictated to selected individuals such as Adam and Seth and their descendants and carefully recorded on stone tablets, then passed down to successive generations.

I will admit, I am no expert on all this yet ... Don't be too quick to declare victory!

WOW! Davey refutes himself COMPLETELY! We can all declare victory and banish Davey to the dunce corner forever.

Now do you understand what quote mining is Davey?

Why wasn't the Ice Age (and the Continental sleigh ride, WOOHOO le's do it again, that was FUN! ) recorded Davey? Was god plum tuckered from all that majik? How many begats are missing from the bible?

Why do Native Americans have a completely different set of domesticated flora and fauna from the rest of the world (except dogs)?

Did we forget our seeds and goats and engraved stone tablets with the inerrent bible in our haste to get away from YOUR crazy progenitors?

I'm still open to suggestions for a type specimen name for Davey and his comrads, I'm leaning towards Homo simplex at this time.

Fossil and sedimentary sorting by liquefaction Davey?

Date: 2006/10/24 21:43:05, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (Steviepinhead @ Oct. 24 2006,14:44)
The correct question may not be, in what species or subspecies of Homo to place Dave and fellow tards (comtards?).

First, it appears possible that Dave forms a unique outlier, even more tarded than all "comparable" Creotards.

Second, even if Dave does indeed have company in his tarditude, and even if Homo remains arguable as the proper genus--based on descent, if nothing else (possibly Dave's parents were well within the range of sapien[t]-ness, and he is simply a "hopeless monster," a "perfect storm" of deleterious mutations)--then I would suggest that  H. tardus or (my favorite of the moment) H. refluxus come closer to capturing the essence of the new species than H. simplex.

Hmmm, I see part of your point, Davey is more likely a sub species of H. sapiens at this point, in which case I'll insist we go with H sapiens simplex.

Obviously much more study is required. Will the known (and unknown) specimens of H sapiens simplex willfully isolate themsleves and rapidly evolve/devolve/speciate lose information/specificity like salmonids (or Branch Davidians)? I smoked a salmon for supper tonight, the #### things are hard to get lit but once you do it's to die for!

If someone comes up with a good design for an H. tardus postage stamp, the challenger might just take the field despite those silly little rules of priority.

Cory, you leave your sticky handed philatelists out of this! H tardus is well, ... juvenile, not that that doesn't apply to Davey but we do have standards here don't we?

DM, H cretinus, I get it but we NEED something better.

Davey, when are you going to address organisms that have been alive longer than your "hypothesis" can explain? I'm not talking about Ents if that will help.

Date: 2006/10/25 21:09:12, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (argystokes @ Oct. 25 2006,23:50)
Quote (Artist in trainig @ Oct. 25 2006,20:29)
Quote (afdave @ Oct. 25 2006,22:24)
And please tell me how in the world are we to have a meaningful discussion of biological information.  Am I to take my entire lexicon and scratch everything out and write in new definitions?

That's what we call "learning".

Ouch, Dave.  You've just been given the proverbial smackdown by both Scary and Artist, both of whom (if I'm not mistaken) came here as creationists.  So why are they laying into you, Dave?  Are they blind and cannot see the evidence for creationism, because they have the need for Darwin to be right?

Davey, even Paley is trying to show you how you can reconcile your belief in god/jesus/creator/designer with real science.

Go view some paleosols in Missouri and thereabouts, Davey. Go look at the St. Francois/Ozark/Ouchita Mountains yourself. See how complex that orogeny really is. Crack some rocks in Elmo Kansas and find a beautifully preserved Permian insect that COULD NOT POSSIBLY have been preserved in a massive flud. Drive up to Nebraska and see some tuff covered by paleosol covered by tuff covered by paleosol, etc.

Step away from your 'puter and do some field work Davey.

The evidence is there if you'll open your eyes and work with your hands and (an open) mind.

We're trying hard to be your friend here Davey but you're making it awfully hard.

Date: 2006/10/25 21:18:55, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (Artist in trainig @ Oct. 25 2006,22:35)
How about God?

OK, which one?

Date: 2006/10/31 20:34:38, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (dougp59 @ Oct. 31 2006,21:25)  Where we fish for the truth on the theory of evolution.

Don't you mean you "fist" for the truth? Open mind my fundament!

Edit, oops he asked for free not open minds. Has Dan Quayle returned?

Date: 2006/10/31 21:05:08, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
OK I took the test!

Question 1. Goddidit!
Question 2. Goddidit!
Question 3. Goddidit!
Question 4. Goddidit!
Question 5. Goddidit!
Question 6. Goddidit!
Question 7. Goddidit!

WHAT DO I WIN DOUG? It better not be a set of ginzu steak knives or you're gonna be dodging them sucka.

Has the Taxi Driver finally found a Doorman to play second fiddle for him?

Date: 2006/11/01 21:26:24, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Obviously boredom with Davey and his C&P vaudeville act is setting in. I can't believe no one has called Davey on the ridiculous claims in the Mutant Dogs post, especially this!

Short spine

In this mutant, the entire backbone of the dog is shortened, but the legs and skull are normal. Such mutations kill most dogs, with an interesting exception being the female Baboon dog. The male Baboon dog dies before reaching maturity, so it should be obvious that this breed has not got much going for it.

I've heard of dog faced baboons but a BABOON DOG? Baboon dogs die before reaching maturity but Baboon bitchs survive! How is this breed sustained Davey? Where is your bullshi.. er excrement detector?

Can we add another page that AiG NEEDS to remove?

Maybe Dougp can help you Dave? Come on Dougie, Davey NEEDS your help!

Davey, why did Native Americans bring dogs with them but forget the rest of the domesticated flora and fauna, as well as the stone tablets/vellum scrolls/papyrus notebooks?

Date: 2006/11/02 21:38:56, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Come on Dave, degenerate mutant baboon dogs? The males die before they reach maturity but the females don't!


I realize you just C&P this crap but do you (or anyone at the WCFA or AiG) actually read this nonsense with comprehension before you post it?

Date: 2006/11/08 02:13:51, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
WOW you guys keep donkey punching Davey and he keeps coming back for more. How sick is that?

k.e. clarify, are you big endian or lil' endian?

Big endian clearly RULES as does toilet paper coming off the outside of the roll.

Davey, care to discuss the most recent Archaeopteryx without cutting and pasting AiG crap?

Didn't think so.

Baboon dogs Davey!

Willfull ignorance, etc ,etc.

Date: 2006/11/09 00:42:43, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Bozho DM, I found these bloody brass knucks, I think they're yours. The tiswin is on me. I think the lead shot filled sap is Mikes. What'll you have mate? Eric, I think this dented 'luminum bat is yours, what's yer poison?

Russell, I haven't had time to read 1491 yet but a perusal of a review looks like it covers many topics I feel to be current. I am a firm believer in the Pre Clovis immigration of my ancestors into the new world, most likely by a coastal route, the weather in an inland corridor between glaciers would have been too brutal IMHO. I have also been watching developments at Caral Supe. I've often thought of bringing it up to Davey but he pretty much blew off Catalhuyuk so I'm sure he'd do the same with evidence of people in the new world that predate his flood. He ignored mention of Monte Verde and other sites previously. (Keep in mind Russ that when DM calls my people his "spirited northern cousins", it's just his envy showing. My ancestors preceded his by quite a bit and got a better location, location, location than his did! Teehee.)

k.e., Sounds like you engaged in a few episodes of swizzling (not that there's anything wrong with that!;), who hasn't had a girlfriend who is all wrong for them but trips their trigger for a time just the same. Hmm... time to cue up some Mojo Nixon. I enjoy my coddled eggs with a few grains of salt too.

Stevie, Hardworkin' Davesmackers sounds like a killer name for a rock band!

Date: 2006/11/10 02:26:52, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Davey says,

(You know ... the NYSE ... that icon of capitalism that creationists don't know anything about because we don't know how to turn a profit in the real world :-)   )

This is a perfect example of why we know you're a liar Davey.

No one has said creationists can't turn a profit, or be hard working contributors to local, national and international economies.

What HAS been stated many times is that no corporation makes money by using a creationist science model to extract resources, they don't use creation science to drill for oil or mine coal. Your attempts to avoid this issue has been noted by many. Oil and coal companies use index fossils and RM dating on a daily basis to determine where to drill the next well or dig the next mine or pit.

We do have plenty of examples where evangelicals bilk others of their hard earned money while living the vida loco. Your kids4cults site is greeted with so much cynicism because you fundies have such a long track record of deceiving others for profit.

Your failure to defend your own hypothesis is your biggest failure though Davey. It's a HUGE FAILURE.

Why aren't angiosperm fossils ever found in conjunction with coal deposits?  Is it due to liquefaction/sorting during the flood Davey? Why weren't the gymnosperm fossils liquefied too?

Your "hypothesis" has so many holes in it you don't even even pretend to defend it while you spend an inordinate amount of time to trying to dismantle ToE which even your Creo "scientists" can't even keep up with.

The biggest laugh you've provided me though is the Baboon dogs nonsense. Got a purty pitcher of a baboon dog?

I can provide you with a pitcher of a "baboon faced dog" Davey.

Does that dog look abnormally short Davey?

I breed block headed, web toed, otter tailed, pointing (mutant degenerate) Labrador Retrievers Davey. You're as ignorant about dog breeding as you are about every other subject you've posted on here.

Go back to school and study comparative anatomy for 2 years and then we'll discuss why the latest Archaeopteryx specimen is the perfect transitional fossil your "theory" cannot handle.

Date: 2006/11/13 02:15:03, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Russell suggested;

I'm currently reading "1491", and I'm interested in learning your opinions about that book. Largely reflective of current thinking? Am I likely to be misled in any particular areas?

This all should probably be taken up in a separate thread,

and posted;

The book left the impression that pieces of the puzzle remain to be found (no, dave, that doesn't mean "Ha! that proves my 'hypothesis' is correct"). But I do also come away with the conclusion there was some pre-Clovis influx from Siberia, and that a coastal route is the most likely one. With sea level changes and all (ice age, Dave, not flud) most if not all of the archeological evidence may now be underwater.  

The overall thesis of the book, which you probably got from your perusal of a review, is that (1) the pre-Columbian American population was a heck of a lot higher than has generally been appreciated, as was the degree of decimation - in both quantity and quality of life - due to viral epidemics introduced by the Europeans, (2) the paths that civilization took do not match general expectations of social anthropologists, who anticipated that cultivation of fields should precede and drive higher social organization, (3) the "untouched wilderness"/"noble savage" mythology is way off; the "pristine state" of nature eulogized by Thoreau was actually the result of massive pre-Columbian human intervention.

Really a fascinating read. I recommend it.

On a completely tangential note, as long as I have the attention of at least a couple of people who have significant indiginous ancestry... The author sticks to the term "Indian" - and gives a number of good reasons for doing so. I've always avoided that term, I guess largely because most "Indians" I have personally known are from southern Asia. Your thoughts?

Bored to tears with AFD's (baboon dog) tail chasing, I thought I'd take Russell up on this subject.

What do you know about Cahokia and the Mississippian Culture in general? Have you visited Cahokia or any other mound sites? Visiting Monk's Mound is one of the best introductions to what was going on during that time in NA.

Personally I describe myself as a Neshnabe "Indian". Spelling varies widely. Amerind is good but few outside science circles know that term.

Date: 2006/11/13 09:09:39, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Nov. 13 2006,08:09)
* Please spare me the nonsense about "Oh that's GRISDA you are quoting - a creationist source."  The data is from Brookhaven (a famous non-YEC source), not GRISDA.

Davey, Davey, Davey!

"Didja ever notice, when you tell one lie, you have to tell another, and another?"

Date: 2006/11/13 10:04:50, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Nov. 13 2006,09:23)
Uh ... what "lies" would you be referring to there, Mr. Crabby?

Oh Davey, the lie that the page of quote mined nonsense is data from this  Carbon and the biosphere; proceedings of the 24th Brookhaven symposium in biology, Upton, N.Y., May 16-18, 1972.

by G M Woodwell;  Erene V Pecan;  Brookhaven National Laboratory

amongst all the other lies you've told here.

You do realise that the Seventh Day Adventists consider you apostate dontcha Davey?

OT, why does this image

cause the Weird Al song Weasel Stomping Day come to mind? Dammit that song is gonna be in my head all day!

Date: 2006/11/13 22:17:19, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (notta_skeptic @ Nov. 13 2006,20:17)
Quote (afdave @ Nov. 13 2006,15:15)
(And in case you forgot ... Proof for the Flood >>> say it with me ... Millions of dead things, buried in rock layers, laid down by water, all over the earth!;)

This is a quote that we see repeatedly from Dave, but I'd like to point out a few missing dead things we've found buried in rock layers:

1. Modern humans
2. Modern cats
3. Modern dogs
4. Pigs, deer, rabbits, frogs, cows, chickens, goats, sheep, lions, tigers, antelopes, zebras, kangaroos, anteaters, water buffalos, bison, mountain lions, woodchucks, skunks, raccoons, opossums, etc.

Why are all those fossiized remains missing in your "millions of dead things"????

Where are all the people??

Good point NS. When you add the point Eric brought up

One more thing, Dave. It's not "millions of dead things." It's "hundreds of billions if not trillions of dead things."

and consider that so few animals become fossils out of any population, there had to have been so many creatures running around it's a wonder Noah found room to build an ark!

Date: 2006/11/13 22:39:26, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Nov. 13 2006,22:02)
Notta ...    
This is a quote that we see repeatedly from Dave, but I'd like to point out a few missing dead things we've found buried in rock layers:

1. Modern humans
2. Modern cats
3. Modern dogs
4. Pigs, deer, rabbits, frogs, cows, chickens, goats, sheep, lions, tigers, antelopes, zebras, kangaroos, anteaters, water buffalos, bison, mountain lions, woodchucks, skunks, raccoons, opossums, etc.

Why are all those fossiized remains missing in your "millions of dead things"?

Where are all the people??
Think about the capabilities of all these organisms ... they are very mobile.  They can CLIMB ... hills and mountains that is.  When the water finally gets them they are very high and are not trapped by sediment.  They drown and meet the same fate as a run-of-the-mill dead fish, i.e. they get eaten by scavengers.  Dear me!  What do they teach these kids in school?

OH Davey!

So now you're claiming that crocodilians, turtles, frogs, newts, chickens, rabbits, skunks, badgers, sloths and rodents etc. managed to get to the tops of mountains before dinosaurs, pterosaurs, archaic mammals and birds?

Only archaic fish succumbed to the flood but no modern ones did?

If you teach third graders it's no wonder you're so used to bullying them into taking your word for it, because your explanations are goofy at best!

You NEED a Goliath of your own Davey 'cause it's clear you have no conscience of your own.

Date: 2006/11/14 01:31:13, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Arden asked,

Are you Potawatomi?

I prefer Neshnabe but I'm not dogmatic about it. Potawatomi is an Objibwe word that decribes our position in the Council of Three, Keepers of the Flame.

I don't mind being called Indian or Native American or Amerind. There are other terms that tend to make me bristle, no need to bother with them here as I think Russells question has been answered. I'm sure some of the terms DM and I would toss at each other would open some eyes and be found quite humorous too. I have a Lakota friend who I razz because The Council of Three chased the Lakota out onto the Plains and he teases me about us being too scared to follow them out there because we were cowards and prefered ambushing them from behind trees.

As far as Pre Clovis sites, DM what sites do you find give convincing evidence? I've mentioned a few and the only one you concurred on was Monte Verde. The last ice age began about 30,000 years ago and peaked 18-20k YA so I've always found it hard to believe humans waited to make the trek till just before the end when an ice free corridor in the interior opened up. It seems to ignore what the weather would be like in such a place.

I never really bought into the Pleistocene Overkill theory though. The idea that animals had no fear of humans because they'd never been hunted might make sense in say, a place like The Galapagos Islands where there were no predators at all. NA was a place full of large carnivores at that time and any prey animal is going to be leery of anything it hasn't encountered before.

I worked a year with a salvage archaeology company and one of my coworkers (a retired anthro) told me a story about an elephant slated to be put down being donated for research. He said they tried to kill it using an Upper Paleolithic tool kit and they couldn't do it. I don't think I would have wanted to hunt mega fauna using the tools available at that time. Was Clovis tech the tool that made overkill possible or just something the made it easier to prey on the old and the sick? I dunno.

Climate change, disease, human predation are all possible scenarios but it might have been a combination that did in most of the mega fauna.

The reason I brought up Cahokia earlier was one of the points Russell made about 1491 and the premise that there were a lot more Natives than is generally recognized. The Cahokia Complex is massive and obviously required quite a few people to develop and maintain and it's influence was widespread. Heck I've got a small temple mound two blocks from my house and I live in the inner city.

DM, I ain't dancin' no Charleston, my knees ain't up to it and I need another Anchor Steam to lubricate 'em. Thanks bud.

Date: 2006/11/18 01:54:29, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Take back a thread? Guys run with it!

Date: 2006/11/18 02:15:10, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
DM, what can I do to help at the Big Eddy site?

Date: 2006/11/20 01:45:30, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Nov. 19 2006,05:53)
This may come as a shock to you, but I can take you to the old Science Magazine archives right now and show you MANY articles just as erroneous as the SINGLE one at AiG we found.

A single article at AiG that has errors?

Oooh Davey.

Show me a page at AiG that ISN'T filled with egregious errors, like the one you posted about mutant degenerate baboon dogs, the breed is so degenerate that THE MALE DOGS DIE BEFORE REACHING MATURITY


Come on Davey, I hate to keep fish slapping you with this but you have to admit it's pretty darn stupid!

You show the same ability to grasp reality as Shirley Phelps-Roper.

Date: 2006/11/20 01:58:19, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Double post removed.

Date: 2006/11/21 00:12:36, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Nov. 20 2006,22:00)
Steve Story ...  
What the #### is a Baboon Dog, and how could AiG fall for such an idiotic claim?
Maybe it's somewhat related to a Boondoggle, which I think is a synonym for Darwinism.  I admit I have no idea what a Baboon Dog is, but it makes for some entertaining mental images ... maybe I'll bounce this one off the question answerers at AiG and see what they say.  It's also interesting to me though, how you have such tunnel vision that you see nothing in that article but a goofy dog name that doesn't come up when you Google it.  You seem to miss the point that dogs (and humans and all other critters) are degenerate mutants, headed for extinction, not higher evolution.  Mutations are BAAAD, my friend ... they are not your hoped for "Engine of ToE."

Davey ignores the real question and then changes the subject and accuses others of having tunnel vision.


Do you honestly need to contact the "boys" at AiG to see what they say? Where's your own common sense that you claim to prize so highly?

The point here isn't about degenerate mutants Davey, it's about how you buy the AiG "evidence" hook line and stinker, no matter how goofy it is.

Date: 2006/11/21 02:08:49, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
While we know Piltdown Man was a hoax, assigning a reason for why it happened would imply we knew who perpetrated the hoax.

Now we NEED to know who started this Baboon Dog bullsh!tt and why it's lasted so long!

Who the #### is L. Johannesen and how much did he get paid to punk AiG?!

Date: 2006/11/24 01:58:57, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Dave posted,

Short spine

In this mutant, the entire backbone of the dog is shortened, but the legs and skull are normal. Such mutations kill most dogs, with an interesting exception being the female Baboon dog. The male Baboon dog dies before reaching maturity, so it should be obvious that this breed has not got much going for it.

When repeatedly asked HOW DO THEY KEEP THIS BREED ALIVE IF THE MALE DOGS DIE BEFORE REACHING MATURITY? the best answer he can provide is...

He'll contact his AiG handlers and get back to us in a couple months.

If he can't answer a question like that with his "iron on iron sharpened common sense" without help from the Overlords@NeoAiG, it should be obvious that this breed of superstitious, willfully ignorant, situational ethics practicing, quote mining, cowardly, goal post moving, yellow bellied, spineless, lickspittle, carpet bagging, hand waving, BOLDED ALL CAPS TYPING, miracle invoking, Phelpsian, rentaboy, homophobic, Haggard disciple, donkey luvin', meth head, Horsleyian, fighter pilot hangin' out in a bar stud wannabe Taxi Driver has not got much going for it.


Date: 2006/11/26 02:33:10, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Nov. 25 2006,07:49)
* We pointed out the simple fact that fossils are formed rapidly by catastrophe ... not by slow steady processes.  What do we find all over the earth?  Millions of fossils buried in rock layers laid down by water all over the earth.  Friend, you don't have to be a rocket scientist to know that there was a Global Water Catastrophe at some point in the past.

Oh Davey.

It's a crying shame the Archaeopteryx specimens kill your claims about the catastrophic formation of fossils, they also demolish your claims about transitional fossils.

I even pointed out to you that you could take a day trip from your home to a site that has produced insect fossils clearly laid down in the most gentle way.

You are clearly NOT a rocket scientist much less a scientist of any sort (can you boil water in a paper cup Davey?). You've even claimed you used your EE/Computer Science Degree to further your business plans in hydroponic tomato farming and/or your prepaid phone calling card business. I'd love to see the Veitch diagrams.

Now 'splain to me how you breed dogs when the males of the breed DIE BEFORE REACHING MATURITY!

I ain't askin' the dolts at AiG. I'm asking YOU.

I wouldn't trust you with a puppy.

Date: 2006/11/29 01:54:05, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (skeptic @ Nov. 28 2006,23:33)
k.e., I think that last post would make Mike Richards proud but for rational people it's not even good comedy.

Buy a clue skeptic.

Maybe we can get Grace Jones to help "straighten out" the Reverend Ted, or would Shirley Phelps-Roper be a better choice? Should we ask him?

As for the album cover pics this one

caused a severe case of deja vu.

As for the album cover pics this one

caused a severe case of deja vu.

I dunno why.

Can somebody tell me why?

Davey, still waiting for the baboon dogs explanation. Are you really that stupid? Iron on iron sharpened common sense indeed!

Date: 2006/11/30 02:49:16, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (Mike PSS @ Nov. 29 2006,08:08)
Quote (Crabby Appleton @ Nov. 29 2006,02:54)
As for the album cover pics this one

caused a severe case of deja vu.

I dunno why.

Can somebody tell me why?

There's something for everyone in music.

I read w-a-a-a-a-y back why you chose your avatar and what it represents.

Now, with selective memory loss....  I ummm.....  oh yeah...  I forgot what it represents.

Can you provide a link to your historical avatar?

Mike PSS

I'm not sure what you mean by a link to my historical avatar Mike but unlike Davey I'll try to take up the slack and accomodate you.

G.Thomas Powell wrote, "Surprisingly enough, yes, there actually is an answer to all the problems, large and small, that are plaguing this planet. The answer is J.R. "Bob" Dobbs and The Church of the SubGenius. Not just another cheesy scam like all those other One-True-Religions, The Church of the SubGenius delivers on its promises of salvation, fortune and power over others, and backs it up with a triple-your-money-back guarantee.

Let's see the Baptists match that."

Follow this link to start your own quest for Eternal Salvation or Triple Your Money Back

I could toss in a lot of comments about my success in business and real estate using the techniques I learned while earning a Computer Science degree at AU but that would be untrue.

I never achieved REAL success untill I submitted to The Stark Fist of Removal.


My block headed, floppy eared, web toed, otter tailed, pointing Labrador Retrievers got much better too despite the fact that they are about to go extinct any day now, praise Bob.

Date: 2006/12/03 07:04:13, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (stevestory @ Dec. 03 2006,00:55)
Is it time to close this thread?


What it is time to do (and this will be much more work for you as a moderator, and I suggested it a while back) is to make Davey defend his "hypothesis".

Davey has broken many rules for posting here while crying like a 6 YO when others have done the same.

Davey is here to be crucified but he hasn't exhibited the type of insanity required for that to happen.

When his posts don't support his "theory", move them to the BW where they belong.

Davey NEEDS a Goliath for a conscience and rigorous training in what constitutes science, not sciency.

If by scientific you mean it's not like other hypotheses, I would agree.  It is unique.  And it needs some polishing to be sure which is partly why I am here.  You can call my faith blind if you like, but I assure you it is not blind.  I believe because of what I have seen.  I mention hellfire and damnation occasionally because I feel obligated to warn people of a message which I do not like but I am convinced is true.

Davey has been busy polishing coprolites. He is the Baboon Dog boy, the Portuguese messenger, the antipathy of the scientific method. How much can you reduce the stupidity and still take it seriously?

It's time to reminder Davey of his illogicalness (sic) and watch him go bonkers!

It's time to put his blind faith to the test for what it's worth.

Date: 2006/12/05 02:39:48, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Davey, you posted it, did you not vet it before doing so?

Baboon dogs.

Reminder me when you can answer the question without asking your AiG/ICR etc, etc handlers.

How do they keep this breed alive if the dogs die before reaching maturity?

I'd like to apply your EE/Computer Science/Hydroponic Tomato Growin'/Phone Card Distribution bidness smarts knowledge to my own endeavours without all the Yeshua baggage if that's possible.

Thanks in advance buddy.


Date: 2006/12/08 02:32:07, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (Russell @ Dec. 07 2006,17:35)
[afdave:] Also, Russell ... it is a common practice of yours to try to ridicule your ideological opponents by the use of their typographical errors?
[7popes:] Hey Dave, do you REALLY want to go there?  Because you have a track record of doing the same.
Dave must be referring to my new "sig". Well, if if hurts your feelings, dave, perhaps I'll change it. When I get a moment.

Because, see, I'm not using it to be cruel. I'm using it because it is a humorous reminder (reminderer?) of how we need to be careful with words if we're accusing others of being illogical with words. This example is a sort of trivial emblem of your habit of shooting your mouth off without either doing the requisite background check, or even, it seems, reading what you've written. (Baboon dogs, anyone?)

Heehee, baboon dogs.

It seems enquiring minds want to know just what these mysterious, mythical, fantabulous beasts are and how the breed is kept alive, compared to the merits of a new breed like the Labradoodle. We'll ignore all the other misinformation in your (in)famous dog post for now.

Come on Davey,

Goliath NEEDS to know why AiG is so slow to respond on this subject.

Goliath would also like to know how his webbed toes, otter tail and abilty to point make him a degenerate mutant or demonstrate that all mutations involve a loss of information or are degenerative? He seems to think he's the bees knees of hunting dogs and I'd have to agree.

He's a pretty good companion in every other respect too Davey (he sheds a bit much but I forgive him for that since he's subjected to MY lighting schedule.)

Davey, don't prove you're the Mayor of Simpleton by failing to answer these simple questions

Thanks buddy.

Date: 2006/12/13 02:32:31, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
To support the Constitution of the United States one must uphold an underlying principle of that document, liberty of conscience,  without interference by the government. Supreme Court Justice Joseph Story, in his "Commentaries on the Constitution of the United States" in 1833, observed concerning the First Amendment that "The rights of conscience are, indeed, beyond the just reach of any human power. They are given by God and cannot be encroached upon by human authority without a criminal disobedience of the precepts of natural, as well as revealed religion." Justice Story echoed the sentiments of Thomas Jefferson in his Bill for Religious Freedom in 1777 in which he stated that "Almighty God hath created the mind free and manifested His supreme will that free it shall remain by making it altogether insusceptible of restraint."

My bolding, agree or disagree Davey and explain in detail?

Baboon dogs Davey. So simple Davey. Credibility Davey. No one here needs to address the complex sciency issues you can't comprehend.

Baboon dogs Davey. Degenerate mutant baboon dogs Davey. Goliath NEEDS to know.

Date: 2006/12/14 01:37:40, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Davey puffs up his chest and claims,

There exists the very real possibility that I could get some of the leading YECs from AiG or ICR (you know ... the ones with advanced science degrees) to come to this forum and debate.  I know Deadman wants to debate dendrochronology with Dr. Don Batten, and I would like to get Dr. Sanford and others to make appearances.  I have not attempted to do this yet, but I am well connected and feel sure that I could make some of these things happen.

Will one (or more) of these "leading YEC's with their advanced science degrees" be able to explain the Baboon dog paradox? I say pull those strings of yours and let's get them cleared up ASAP! Show us what a man of action you are.

You gotta give Dave credit guys, he's trying really hard to get the job done. He didn't understand how hard it would be.

His Caspar Milquetoast threat to expose ATBC's lack of intelectual tolerance is freaking HILARIOUS!

He spouts so much nonsense it's hard to know where to start and most of it gets demolished so fast that all I can do is pick nits out of the pink haze,

I know what you are saying and I agree that it is impossible for a finite human mind to comprehend such a thing as an Uncaused Cause of all things, which is essentially what the Bible describes when it talks about God.  The problem is that to believe the alternative (Chance caused all things) not only presents it's own difficulties, but also requires us to close our eyes to everything that science has taught us.  At least with the Uncaused Cause, we are consistent with science up until the point we hit the Uncaused Cause, at which point, like the Naturalist, we must say ... "We don't understand how this can be."  With Naturalism, we are not even consistent with the known facts of science -- EVER!

The Bible is describing an Uncaused Cause when it talks about God?


"Chance" (or ToE) presents difficulties that requires us to close our eyes to everything science has taught us?


Difficulties, sure but they are steadily and surely being worked out as our knowledge base expands and our tools get better but we know which person here has closed his eyes (and ears and mind) to the lessons of science Davey.

Your worldview does NOT say "We don't understand how this can be." when it hits the brick wall of what you're now calling the Uncaused Cause. In fact, you and yours claim to have the ONLY answers to the Uncaused Cause, Life, the Universe and Everthing and everyone else be damned, literally!

Davey, you suffer from (among other things) a "Nostalgia for an Age That Never Existed".

Date: 2006/12/16 03:08:06, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton


Why do you persist in dodging something so simple as the baboon dog BS you yourself posted? AiG didn't come here and post this crap, YOU DID.

The "peer reviewed sciency" website you rely on needs months to review this and come up with an answer?

The answer is obvious. Pick two fingers Davey.

Date: 2006/12/16 12:50:46, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Davey says,

BIOLOGICAL MACHINES!  Right there in with all the other, NON-biological machines!

Hmmmm ...

(Nothing about analogous in there, see? )

You did click on the Biological machines link right Davey? You did read the linked page right Davey? Did the linked page mention machines anywhere Davey? Hmmm? You read the Degenerate Mutant Dogs page with comprehension too, eh?

Try harder stud!

Date: 2006/12/18 10:15:55, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (Russell @ Dec. 18 2006,09:51)
This is just too tiresome to keep up. For now, let me just say that in dave's last post, every single point he addressed to me is wrong. Every one. Completely.

Truth be told, EVERY point Davey addressed is wrong. He's even stooped to quote mining posts from this thread, not that I'm surprised.

I especially love the comments about the degree of technological sophistication of butterflies and bacterium, and artifacts in every living cell that resemble known creations of human technology.

When is "Dr." Don gonna show up and refute dendrochronology Davey? Is anyone else from AiG or ICR gonna show up and "rescue" you Davey?

Baboon dogs Davey, we need to know.

Date: 2006/12/18 18:59:46, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton

Date: 2006/12/22 01:24:15, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Dec. 21 2006,22:09)
It's no use trying to distract me with discuses (disci?) and natural nuclear reactors ...

Remember ...

All it takes is ONE example that was probably designed to vindicate Dembski and Co. ... the flagellum does it for me.


Dilettard Dave the Taxi Driver is a closet Flagellant.

Pie Jesu Domine, dona eis requiem.

Not happenin' stud.

Date: 2006/12/24 02:53:09, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (Russell @ Dec. 23 2006,11:28)
Dave? Dave... are you there? Could you supply a quote, or reference, or some clue that you're not just pulling this stuff from where the sun don't shine?

He's getting this stuff from Seattle?

Date: 2006/12/28 15:10:10, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
dgszweda writes,

I do not hold advanced degrees, but I think those are highly overrated anyway.  People bow down to those with a PhD, but I have met many PhD's who have difficulty balancing equations.  A PhD is a basically a cheap slave for a tenured staff member.

That's a cynical view of academia. I've never felt a need to bow down to a PhD/cheap slave. Would you care to elaborate why you feel that way?

He then writes,

I do believe that small changes can occur in a species, it is even observable today, and in reality is all the evolution supports, but I do not believe that all species originated from a single species. I do not dispute that current measurements show a very old universe, I just don't believe that we can extrapolate that to a creation date of the universe.

Do you have some data that explains your position on evolution? Why is the notion that many small changes (which you agree are observable) can add up to large changes over long periods of time hard to understand?

If current measurements show the universe is very old, what other data should we use to extrapolate the creation date of the universe?

Date: 2006/12/28 15:35:11, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Mike, Szweda is a fine old Polish name which means Swede.

dgszweda writes,

I do not believe that non-Christians should be teaching a religious belief.  I am not up on ID as much as probably you are even up on it.  But the last I heard was that ID was really pushing the idea to teach an alternative theory and not to treat evolution as carte blanche fact.

Huh? You have to be Christian to teach a religious belief? Would one have to be Christian to teach Kaballa? Is ID a scientific theory or a religious belief? It can't be both.

On the flipside, I don't think that most school teachers should be teaching evolution.  First, most do a crummy job at it.  Facts aren't straight in most of the science text books, people are misquoted and our children are being brainwashed by a bunch of bumbling text book writers.  So just because you feel confident that someone isn't pushing Intelligent Design down your children's throat, doesn't mean they still aren't getting a bunch of evolutionary mistakes in their classrooms.  If you don't believe me, read some of the textbooks and listen to some of the teachers.  Movies like Jurrasic Park don't help either.  Teachers teaching young children that Velociraptors had flexible tails, because they see it on a movie.  Give me a break.

Right, let's throw out the baby 'cause the bathwater is dirty. If science teachers aren't teaching proper science, the obvious (to me) solution is to better educate the science teachers, you on the other hand think we should stop teaching science or to teach an "alternate theory" based on religious beliefs.

Sorry but that's not a solution to your objections.

Date: 2006/12/28 15:44:44, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (deadman_932 @ Dec. 28 2006,15:27)

1. What is an "evolutionary archaeologist?" Do you mean paleoanthropologist?

I wondered how long it would be before you pounced on that. I note that Davey has never answered questions about why no "creationist archaeologists" have ever found specimens of early man of gigantic proportions or showing signs of advanced decrepitude that bear witness to 800+ year life spans.

Heh, any wagers on whether the subjects those "evolutionary archaeologists" were arguing about were completely over szwedas head?

Date: 2006/12/28 18:27:07, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (notta_skeptic @ Dec. 28 2006,17:57)
Quote (dgszweda @ Dec. 28 2006,15:39)
If you don't believe me, read some of the textbooks and listen to some of the teachers.  Movies like Jurrasic Park don't help either.  Teachers teaching young children that Velociraptors had flexible tails, because they see it on a movie.  Give me a break.

I use to eat lunch at a research institute with a bunch of evolutionary archeologists.  I don't remember them agreeing on a whole lot.

Yeah, let's blame the teachers. When I taught, I always relied on Hollywood to provide my background information. :D

And, hey! I used to eat lunch with a bunch of Christian fundamentalists from different churches. They used to argue over infant vs. adult baptism, whether one needed to go witnessing to enter heaven, and if there was food and/or sex in heaven! I guess they were just as wrong as those "evolutionary archeologists" were, huh? Did you even know your faith was in such danger from dissent?

Heh, a couple of colleages were technical advisors for the original JP. When Spielberg was told Velociraptor mongoliensis wasn't as big as portrayed, he decided to go with them as planned. During the filming, Utahraptor was discovered.

Date: 2006/12/29 02:12:25, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (dgszweda @ Dec. 28 2006,17:09)
Ahh you don't need to cut me my own thread.  AfDave and I have a mutual friend, so I just stopped on by.  I may or may not stay on long since I travel a lot as well.  I will answer a few of your comments though.

dgszweda is a crunch of the name Dave Szweda.  And yes Szweda is a fine Polish name :)  Okay no Polish jokes, I know them all already.

I do not criticize the one holding the PhD, and yes there are some very smart PhD people out there, maybe even many smart ones.  I was just stating that the degree holds very little in my mind, as much as the research they do.  That is where they really build up there knowledge.  If any of you hold PhD's I apologize, sorry you got paid so little for your research :)  In all seriousness though, I would hold up the credibility of the scientist based on his research and his published work not on his degree.

I used the term evolutionary archaelogist to indicate that they were archaeologists who held to the evolutionary view (there are some out there who don't).  And no they weren't speaking over my head.  I will be more than happy to discuss Particle Physics which I enjoy more than biology.

I unfortnately have ran out of time for today.  Too many responses to answer so quickly.


The few comments/questions you've bothered to answer so far don't address any of the very specific questions you've been asked.

You need to get busy backing up your statements or get ready to recieve the full ATBC treatment.

Lock your wig Rev. Szweda, let the air out of your shoes, follow the rubber line to your seat. The ride might not be pleasant but it's sure gonna be a rush!

Date: 2006/12/30 01:11:23, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Dec. 29 2006,11:59)
JohnW ...  
How much dog speciation has occurred in the last 500 years, Dave?
Who cares?  Why are you changing the subject?  I was pointing out that radical variation can take place in a very short time ... the BBC quote shows that very nicely, thanks.

Wow! Davey doesn't understand the pertinence of the question or why it hurts his argument, so he flippantly blows it off.

Davey still thinks his AiG wonks are gonna supply him a credible answer to the Baboon Dog BS. Talk about FAITH with a Capital F.

Maybe this guy can help you with the Baboon Dog thing Davey.

You gotta hand it to him though, he's really trying to be annoying enough to get "crucified" banned. He's just too dumb to understand how bad he has to be to have that happen. His genuflecting to Steve to keep the thread open when he thought it was gonna happen was hilarious though.

Come on Davey, you CAN do it.

Date: 2006/12/30 11:03:13, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Dec. 30 2006,06:22)

... and I'm waiting on you to comment on the dog article I posted.

Are we afraid to talk about dogs?


I want to hear your answer on dogs.

OK Davey, let's talk dogs. Let's start with baboon dogs Davey.

Short spine

In this mutant, the entire backbone of the dog is shortened, but the legs and skull are normal. Such mutations kill most dogs, with an interesting exception being the female Baboon dog. The male Baboon dog dies before reaching maturity, so it should be obvious that this breed has not got much going for it.

How do they keep this breed alive Davey? Can you hook me up with a responsible breeder of baboon dogs? Can you link a pic or an article (other than your AiG claptrap) of a baboon dog Davey?

Didn't think so.

Man, the whistling sound those tiny impotent fists of rage are making while trying to flail away at all the evidence are annoying but you're gonna have to try harder.

Date: 2006/12/30 11:09:31, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
The only dog mutant which comes anywhere near qualifying as useful (from the dog's point of view) is found in that big lovable St. Bernard.

It suffers from hyperthyroidism, which means that its overactive thyroid gland enables it to turn food into body heat at an incredible rate, not by choice, but by compulsion. His feet can sometimes be so hot they can melt the snow around him. This makes it easy for him to live in the snowy cold conditions and to play his part in rescuing and or inebriating lost mountaineers. But it has bad points too. He cannot tolerate the heat since he makes so much of his own. It is anything but kind to bring a St. Bernard to a tropical climate. Secondly, he must eat huge quantities of food to survive because he uses it so rapidly and this creates his dilemma. A St. Bernard is best suited to live in the snow and cold, but in such conditions he would normally find nothing to eat and would starve. If man did not artificially maintain the breed, it would soon die out.

How about this statement Davey? Do you agree or disagree? Would the same thing be true for Newfoundlands Davey? All of the larger breeds?

What about my web toed, otter tailed, pointing Labradors Davey? Are they degenerate mutants that couldn't survive in the wild?

Date: 2006/12/30 11:20:37, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
How do you explain this, Russell?  
They conclude that intensive breeding by humans over the last 500 years - not different genetic origins - is responsible for the dramatic differences in appearance among modern dogs.
Hmmmm ... "intensive breeding is responsible for the dramatic differences in only 500 years!"  

NOT due to genetic origins.

Intensive breeding.

Hmmmmmmmm .........


Dog breeders have used mutations to change the dog for hunting man's way. They have made many grotesque forms and are still trying to make the 'best' domestic dog. But all results considered, man has still not made a dog into a non-dog or a more doggish dog (every postman can verify this).

NOT due to Genetics Davey? *Slight edit for context

We know you're deluded Davey, it won't get you banned.

Date: 2006/12/30 11:41:39, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Dec. 30 2006,06:22)
... and I'm waiting on you to comment on the dog article I posted.

Are we afraid to talk about dogs?


I want to hear your answer on dogs.

Typical Davey.

Pounds his chest and roars a challenge, then flees with his tail between his legs.

Maybe he wanted to talk about these "kinds" of dogs?

Date: 2006/12/30 12:35:51, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
You yourself posted the article that calls them degenerate MUTANTS Davey.

What is intensive breeding if not selection of mutants for breeding?

So we're back to mutation and selection Davey. 'Splain away!

Date: 2006/12/30 14:26:47, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Dec. 29 2006,11:59)
JohnW ...  
How much dog speciation has occurred in the last 500 years, Dave?
Who cares?  Why are you changing the subject?  I was pointing out that radical variation can take place in a very short time ... the BBC quote shows that very nicely, thanks.

Davey, till you can understand JohnW's question and answer it correctly you aren't gonna make any headway on this.

Date: 2006/12/30 16:03:05, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
You say that only because you erroneously believe that ALL variation is due to mutation, which, of course, is one of the key differences between you and I.  The truth is that only SOME variation is due to mutation and the variation due to mutation is NOT the kind that helps survival in the wild.

Wrong, try again.

Let me tell you the truth about these dogs (in the BBC article).

Considering your track record for honesty and lack of reading comprehension, no thanks! How long did the BBC article say dogs have been with us? Try again Davey.

Let's pretend that your ToE story is true for a moment.  OK?  If it is true, then that means that MOST of the "dramatic differences" we see today in modern dogs happened BEFORE 500 years ago, agreed?  I mean ... dogs just didn't evolve overnight according to you ... it took a million years or so.  And if that is your story and you're stickin' to it, then you cannot say that there were any mutations to speak of in the last 500 years, right?

Wrong again Davey.

"Dave's been saying all along that massive variation can happen with NO mutations in a very short time and we've been pooh poohing him."

Heh, if you choose to call it pooh poohing Davey, go right ahead. You are very confused about the difference between variation and speciation.

Here are some examples of variation Dave,

Here are some examples of speciation,

That's a racoon dog Davey but I still can't find a pic of a baboon dog.

That's a Darwin Fox.


This has absolutely ZERO do to with HOW the previously existing genes cames to be (you say mutation only, I say God+mutation)

So ...

My point is proven ...


(IOW Eric's signature nonsense is destroyed)

Davey, you truly are a honeyhole, poke you with a stick and the sweet tard flows.

My cousin DM suggests,

By the way, lots of people have mentioned this, but as CK1 reiterates above...Dave will keep playing his whack-a-Mole Gish gallop Game as long as he is not held to responding to single questions.
The only way Dave was pinned down on geologic radiometry by Jon was a concerted effort, same with Fenton Hill zircons, mutations, his hilarious crap on information theory and radiocarbon and all his other major claims.

I feel uncomfortable appearing as though I'm asking others to do anything that might impinge on their rights to act and question and post as they wish, though, so...I'm just pointing out that Dave will continue to take advantage of this "divide-and-bullshite" selective answers routine he has.

He IS afraid of having his toy taken away, and OTHERWISE, he's NOT GOING IF he were "embargoed" and only presented with select questions, not a barrage...then that would cut down on his escape routes, no?

I'd like to hear about baboon dogs, too...since it points out that creationists use lies without substance, flawed "science" and sheer sleight-of-hand rhetorical mummery...kinda like Dave. Oh, and I still haven't even found that there IS a breed of dog called a "baboon dog," other than an Afghan, once in a while , being called that...but it can't be Afghans because I know the males don't die "before maturity" -- I've seen them before...unless they were like transsexual post-operative Afghans. So...what breed IS the "baboon dog?" That should be easier for Dave to answer to than the evidence of his lies I post and will keep on posting

I'm with you, it's time for Dave to try to answer the hard questions.

*Edit, some of the links didn't work

Date: 2006/12/30 17:47:52, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Dec. 30 2006,16:50)
Almost right. Intensive breeding is selection of CHARACTERISTICS.  Remember, my view (the correct view) is that the vast majority of alleles were DESIGNED--as in, not caused by mutations.  SOME alleles are caused by mutations.  I think if you compare alleles, many times you will find only one nucleotide position difference.

But you are missing the point.  The point was that ...


... which refutes people like Eric Murphy.

Intensive breeding is selection of CHARACTERISTICS? Hmm, like short spines that prevent the males surviving to maturity Davey? Didn't you call those dogs degenerate mutants? You DO know what mutant means don't you Davey?


Try again Taxi Driver.

Date: 2006/12/30 18:25:38, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Hey notta skeptic, you don't need to qualify your statement that all dog breeds can successfully mate, all you have to do is insure the female is the larger of the 2 breeds you are crossing and use artificial insemination if the dog isn't big enough to reach the bitch.

You can easily breed toy Labradoodles this way. The possibilities are endless. St Bernardoodles, Spitz Foo dogs, Brittanycuintlis or my nominee for a Dog Dave is likely to own, the Bull Shih Tzu!

Date: 2006/12/30 18:51:10, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Hmm, I see Eric as a remarkable autodidact, the AtBC Bulldog, Scourge of Davey the Taxi Driver, The AtBC Air Force Ace, Official Rolled Newspaper Nose Swatter of our Resident Bull Shih Tzu, heehee. Keep it up Eric!

Those tiny impotent fists of rage are whizzing around again.

Date: 2007/01/02 03:00:50, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton

Eric, as I said before, you're AtBC's Bulldog ala Huxley, (STOP MAKIN' 'SCUSES. YOU CAN TEST PAST YOUR HURDLES IN A MATTER OF MONTHS)

Davey the Taxi Driver, all you have to do is answer the baboon dog thingy.

How do they keep that degenerate MUTANT breed of dogs alive if the dogs die before reaching maturity?

I hope your dolts at AiG can answer it before time runs out! Clocks a tickin'. >Insert Michael Kackson laugh here, hee hee he.<

Date: 2007/01/03 21:56:32, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (Mike PSS @ Jan. 03 2007,19:40)
Go away to the U.P. for the New Year and everything changes.  Gotta get this post in quick before the end times comes.

Does Stevestory have an e-mail version of kool-aid for all the thread participants?  I can't think of anything better occurring after this ends.  My numerological analysis shows the number 5000 very prophetic for some reason.  Something to do with "reasoning will return" and "knowledge will flow like hot cocoa".  If that's the case then I know I can't face it so soon.  I've purchase my purple coveralls and have my white sneakers already.

I'd like to thank everyone for their continued dilligence of facts.

And Eric also gets my vote for persistance in opposition.

I thank you for teaching me new ways to obfuscate, confuse, and confound a debate opponent.  Your lessons in semantics and verbal manipulation deserve some type of mention.  Too bad the big sky mommy chose for you to reveal these skills in such an unproductive endeavor.

Mike PSS

p.s.  Dave, since I believe in radiometric dating techniques does that make me an idiot or a liar?  You said that once, do you want me to find the quote OR DO YOU TRUST THAT YOU SAID THIS!

Hey Mike, did ya see any Turdy Point Bucks whilst you was up dere?

Date: 2007/01/05 02:09:17, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (Ichthyic @ Jan. 05 2007,02:02)
and it might be that Wesley owns all the contributions anyway.

hmm, never thought about content rights on a public blog before.

do newspapers own the rights to letters sent to the editor and published in the opinion section?


anywho, I'm sure Wes, given his interest in cataloging UD threads previous to the hissy fit the 'tard threw, would be more than encouraging of this endeavor.

another question:

best to filter out repetitious posts, and have merely representative ones, or leave it as a "complete work of art"?

best to reindex via topic, so spread out posts regarding the same topic end up being referenced together (like the endless refrain of Dave's portuguese "arguments"), or leave the structure in it's current haphazard state, with just sectional reference instead?

any and all opinions more than welcome; anything to delay the monumental task of actually tackling the thing.


Editing would be a mistake IMHO. Only the Raw & Unabridged Taxi Driver thread will do. The problem as I see it is how to include all the links. Not a task I'm willing to undertake.

Date: 2007/01/08 00:48:26, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
See Davey. I knew you were capable of showing us the lunacy of your ways, why did you wait till the thread got yanked to display it? You could have been properly crucified instead of being bitch slapped out the door like the village drunk cadging drinks.


(he was also a witchdoctor ... they are real, BTW, and can truly communicate with evil spirits ... I have no doubt about that)

Lenny-- Laughter?  Did you expect anything else?  Why would someone like me who believes in a literal God, not also believe in a literal Satan and literal demons?  Especially when my dad was an eyewitness to what could only be described as demon-possession?  Have you ever experienced the occult firsthand?

And no, Faid, I'm not into alchemy or whatever it was you were saying that Galileo also believed.  This is what I mean by not following your logic.  I make a comparison to someone and you jump in and spin a web of confusion.

I too have witnessed the occult Davey but in my case the witchdoctor taught me to say, Ooh eeh ooh ahh ah, ting tang walla walla bing bang. Guess what Davey? I GOT THE GIRL!

Seriously Davey, you're the one who spins what you and others say to suit your needs. Way back when, you were asked if you believed in astrology because you displayed your sign on your blog. You, embarrassed, stammered that it got there by mistake and removed it. Now you're obfuscating Faids questions by denying a belief in Alchemy which Faid ascribed to Newton, NOT Galileo, yet you never denied a belief in Astrology and you still have not.

Davey, you DO know that dabbling in the occult opens you up to demon possession, yes?

Also, please explain to me how Newton was a fundy in light of his Arianistic beliefs?

One last question Davey, are you gonna come back here to the Bathroom Wall to inform us when your AiG "PhD's" finally deign to answer the baboon dog mystery, fill us in on your own blog, or shout out the answer proudly on Dawkins forums if you set up there?

Date: 2007/01/13 11:02:00, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (afdave @ Jan. 13 2007,07:59)
The only "paleosols" ever posted that I remember were those posted by JonF ... do you remember those?  They did not look like ancient soils at all.  Do you want me to find those and show you?  Or do you have pictures of some particularly convincing ones?

The Taxi Driver keeps telling lies. The sign at Yellowstone was changed due to political pressure as he well knows, not due to scientific reasoning.

I pointed you to a paleosol site 2 1/2 hours east of you and gave you a contact/phone number.

Prairie Fork Conservation Area
Research Division
P.O. Box 43
Williamsburg, MO 63388

Chris Newbold
Phone: (573) 592-4080

5 glacial tills with intervening paleosols Taxi Driver. The 2 oldest tills dated paleomagnetically. Current testing for dating is ongoing using the cosmogenic-isotope method.

Did you visit the site for some bare nekkid eyeball research stud? Did you contact Mr. Newbold?

Seems to me someone so interested in "facts" would get out and get their hands dirty with some fieldwork.

No purty picthers for you Taxi Driver, do your own homework.

Date: 2007/01/13 11:13:04, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Oops, the contact I gave you earlier was

Chalfant, Michael
Soil Scientist and Archaeologist
Phone: (573) 884-3440

but I'm sure either fellow would be willing to help pull the scales from your eyes.

Date: 2007/01/14 02:17:23, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
The Taxi Driver replies,

Crabby--  If you want me to check out your "paleosol", you're going to have to post a picture that looks more convincing than JonF's and more convincing than Faid's non-existent one.

to my statement;

Did you visit the site for some bare nekkid eyeball research stud? Did you contact Mr. Newbold?

Seems to me someone so interested in "facts" would get out and get their hands dirty with some fieldwork.

No purty pitchers for you Taxi Driver, do your own homework.

Which part of this statement is too hard for you read with comprehension Davey?

Date: 2007/01/14 02:30:19, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (Russell @ Jan. 13 2007,17:09)
Those software companies that make "Firewalls"... I wonder if they've thought of "Mosquito Netting"?

I'd like to see some "Show Me State" chigger repellant.

Date: 2007/01/15 01:59:35, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
We're still waiting on the AiG explanation for baboon dogs Davey. You keep claiming you have some major league pull, couldn't you expedite this since you yourself have already admitted you think baboon dogs are a joke? (We're up to 3 examples where Davey admits AiG is wrong? We ARE making progress however hard won it may be.)

Come on Davey, get tough with them, warn them how Yahweh will consign them to eternal lakes of fire if they don't preach the truthiness of genesis.

Go Terminator on them like this,

Real paleosols 2.5 hours from your house Taxi Driver. Get your hands dirty and some mud on your boots, buddy. REAL Show Me State kinda stuff.

Date: 2007/01/23 01:44:24, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (Steviepinhead @ Jan. 20 2007,20:12)

Let's see if it works for me!  Ah, yes!  Thanks, Henry, I didn't want it for an avatar, just as a cool "old" animal!  These Mississippian shell pieces are something I'm drenching myself in at the moment (it's all Crabby's fault...), though this particular gorget is thought to be more Hopewell or Adena.

Maybe I should add that this design comes from an Indian gorget dug up in the American midwest.  IOW, around 1,000 years ago, there were jaguars (or ocelots) roaming the Mississippi bottomlands.  Which I thought was kinda cool.

My fault?

Oh, OK. You're welcome Mr. Pinhead.

I like this one better but it's MIA.

Date: 2007/01/23 01:50:17, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Found one of these inadvertantly during a NANFA survey and now that I know what to look for have not found another.

Date: 2007/01/31 01:07:01, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (Steviepinhead @ Jan. 27 2007,16:37)
Crabby, I saw that a collection of pottery was "missing in action," but that collection did not seem to include this gorget.

What's your "MIA" reference mean?

I knew what you meant about "fault" Stevie. My reply was tongue in cheek (sans smiley, sorry).

I can't seem to quickly navigate back to the page I got the MIA quote from but that gorget was stolen.

I want to read 1491 and discuss it but time is short and priorities are priorities. I did take my grandson sledding on the local mound a week ago.

Date: 2007/02/07 00:30:40, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Hmm, this one reminds me of my least favorite Taxi Driver. Considering the level of smarm, I dub Coney Hunter the Limo Driver.

Date: 2007/02/14 21:27:44, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Wow, that site has me flashing back to playing Myst with my son.

Date: 2007/06/18 02:45:43, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Been a while since I've posted here but the discussion about onions lit a bulb in my head about what to do with the last Vidalias from this year (The color of an onion has nothing to do with whether it's sweet or not).

I find chopping onions, garlic and other veg relaxing in a mindless sort of way so I ransacked the larder last night and made some olive relish and tonight the missus and I ate muffaletas.

I'd have put on a seersucker suit if I'd owned one.

I also confirmed (at least to my feeble taste buds) that Fat Tire Amber Ale is distinctly different in 12 oz and 24 oz bottles. The 12 oz bottles seem to be hoppier and less malty. My preference is for the 24 oz bottle flavor which is out of character for me.

Date: 2007/07/08 21:48:36, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Heh, Work Is A Four Letter Word!

So bad on so many levels, it's no wonder it's a rarity.

Date: 2008/07/07 23:45:37, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Hey Steve, I'll be in Fayetteville this coming weekend and I have a hankerin' for crabs at the beach, (Shut up Louis, I ain't talking 'bout your kinda crabs).

A quick search of the web shows Dirty Dicks in Kill Devil Hills and Buddy's in Wrightsville Beach.

Ever been to either establishment or have another recommendation for a crab house at the beach?

Wrightsville will be closer but I think Kill Devil Hills would be more fun for a day at the beach.

Any advice would be appreciated.


Date: 2008/07/08 02:49:41, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
[Graffiti moved to Bathroom Wall. -Admin]

Dirty Dick's it is. If it turns out less than stellar I'll blame it on you. I'm not gonna get that close to the coast and stop for a Chinese buffet.

I never drink less than 3 beers or more than 40.

Salmon croquettes? Blecch! My Mom used to make 'em, they always had vertebrae innem. I'd rather eat salmon raw.

I'll PM you later this week.


Date: 2008/07/08 09:08:35, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Dirty Dick's it is. If it turns out less than stellar I'll blame it on you. I'm not gonna get that close to the coast and stop for a Chinese buffet.

I never drink less than 3 beers or more than 40.

Salmon croquettes? Blecch! My Mom used to make 'em, they always had vertebrae innem. I'd rather eat salmon raw.

I'll PM you later this week.


Date: 2008/07/12 00:12:18, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
3 generations of Crabby boys ate fresh caught Carolina Largemouth Bass with boiled baby red potatoes and steamed green beans.

A few of these

washed it all down.


Date: 2008/07/24 02:58:59, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Well, Crabby Jr. couldn't make a trip to the Outer Banks so Crabby Jr. Jr. and I went on a road trip to Wrightsville Beach to see if Buddies had the crabs.

No, they did not, despite what their website says! No oysters either, the bastids and parking for public access to the beach or anything else for that matter is 25 cents for 10 minutes! WTF? Who carries a couple of rolls of quarters to the beach?

So the mission was set, find some live blue crabs we could take back to Fayetteville. Failure was not an option.

We finally found 'em at a place called Mason's Marina on the Middle Sound. We bought a bushel of medium jimmys and iced 'em down for the trip back. Alarmingly (to me) they were selling sponge crabs along with sooks and jimmys. Is this legal in NC? I need to check.

Jr. Jr. slept most of the way back (2 hour trip in the Lil' Red Rocket). I prepped the spices (my own super secret MD style recipe) while the water was set to boil, then threw the first batch in to steam, extry spice of course.

Jr., Mz. Jr. and friends walk in just as they were ready, naturally.

Mz. Jr. was reluctant at first, this being her first time and all but she soon fell to with mucho gusto (you have to or starve around Crabby and his boys).

A very tasty Belizean shrimp, conch and sea trout ceviche was on the bar. Widmer Hefeweizen, Negra Modelo and more Boulevard Pale Ale were the beverages served.

Much fun was had by all.


Date: 2008/07/25 00:03:55, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (Argon @ July 24 2008,09:19)
Quick question: How much $$ are a bushel of Blue crabs going for these days? I thought they were getting tougher to find.

I paid $72 for the bushel which was very reasonable. The woman at the dock said she had carpal tunnel syndrome so I had to tong them out of the sluice. I made sure there wasn't a whitey in the basket and they all had both claws.

I just looked around on the web and found a report that MD harvests are down 70% since 1990?!


Date: 2008/09/24 01:10:39, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
For those who haven't heard of it, or have but haven't tried it, let me recommend the beer butt chicken.

Take your favorite brand of beer, in a can, and punch several holes in the top of the can with a church key. Pour off about half the can and stuff the can up the rear of the chicken. Use the legs to form a tripod to hold the chicken upright and place in a shallow pan. Plug the neck with whatever is handy, an onion, chunk of apple or something similar. Bake, grill or as I do, smoke the bird at º350 for an hour and a half or till the juice runs clear and prepare to enjoy the best bird you ever ate.

There are devices to hold the can upright making spills less likely, I have one that holds 2 cans/birds and 8 ears of corn for when company comes but I also have a device made by Weber that eliminates the need for a can altogether.

I use cherry wood and a dry rub for extry flavor.

Look at the juice on that cutting board.



Date: 2008/09/24 01:37:51, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Another summer favorite around here is Parmesan Stuffed Peppers.

Take a block of cream cheese and let in soften at room temperature. Add grated Parmesan cheese and stir it in till the mixture is loaded with Parmesan, I do it by feel and taste.

I use Hungarian Hot Wax Peppers for stuffing but anything milder or hotter of a similar size will do. Cut the end off and make a slit down the side and remove ribs and seeds. If I'm making them for me and Missus Crabby, the ribs/seeds get chopped and mixed in to the cheese for extra flavor.

Stuff the peppers with the cheese mixture and squeeze to close.

Ready for beer batter.

The beer batter is simple, take 3/4 cup of flour, 1/4 cup of corn starch, 1 1/2 tsp of baking powder (not soda) and salt to taste, (I use a short teaspoon). Sift the ingredients into a bowl. Add a tablespoon of olive or peanut oil. Add 3/4 cup of good beer just before you are ready to start cooking and whip till it's smooth. You can add a bit of water to make it a bit thinner if you prefer.

Heat some good quality peanut oil to º375, dip the peppers in the batter and fry a few at a time till golden brown and cheese starts to come out of the peppers. Drain well and enjoy.


Date: 2008/10/27 18:55:42, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (stevestory @ Oct. 21 2008,23:31)
So gradually over the past year I've been doing grilled cheese experiments. the bread's pretty standard white bread. The coating on the outside has been variable (Promise, Smart Balance, olive oil, or whipped butter) and hasn't made too much diff. But the cheese...I'm now thinking the lowbrow approach might be better. So far I've used, for cheese, slices of provolone, swiss, mozarella, or muenster. And the results have all been unsatisfactory. I'm starting to think the lowbrow approach, aka those fake cheese slices like Kraft singles, which are I think mostly vegetable oil, would work better. The real cheese melts but is too stiff. The fake cheese gets gooier and I'm thinking that might actually be better.

Steve, try grating your high quality cheese and using cream cheese or softened queso fresca as a binder. A little binder goes a long way. Monterey Jack might work well as a binder too, I love toasted Pepper Jack sammiches.

Date: 2008/10/27 19:01:09, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (C.J.O'Brien @ Oct. 22 2008,01:43)
baked apple goodness with ice cream for dessert.

Works well on the grill, too.

Date: 2008/10/27 19:32:52, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
With cooler weather coming in, I made a pot of Split Pea Soup this weekend.

1 lb. of split peas, 3/4 lb. ham diced, 8 large carrots sliced, 4 stalks celery sliced, 1 large onion diced, 6 minced cloves of garlic, 7 cups of water and the secret ingredient, the drippings from a smoked beer butt chicken. Salty from the dry rub and  with an intense smoky flavor, this ingredient turns the pedestrian into the sublime.

Low boil all the ingredients for 30 mins, stirring several times, then reduce the heat for another 10 mins to thicken.

Stick to your ribs goodness.

Date: 2008/10/27 19:51:39, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (Arden Chatfield @ Oct. 27 2008,19:21)
Quote (stevestory @ Oct. 24 2008,19:52)
I was making curry chicken tonight and it was going fine until i absolutely ruined it in the end. First I sauteed some diced chicken breast, onion, and garlic. Then I added about 2 tsp curry powder, a little cumin, salt, cayenne powder, and pepper. and 2 cups water, and was reducing that. Then I decide it's too watery

Just cook it half an hour with the lid off. Fixes that right up.

Also, in my experience, with curries dark meat like chicken thighs works better, tho I guess that's pretty subjective.

I agree with the bold part, but remove the meat while you're doing it so it isn't overcooked.

I'm a big fan of dark meat too which is why I cook a lot of duck.

The big treat with cooking duck is the rendered fat.

Cottage Fried Potatoes cooked in duck fat ROCKS! Scrambled eggs with tomato, mild pepper, garlic, chives and diced smoked pork chops, ooh I could go on.

Date: 2008/10/27 20:50:11, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (C.J.O'Brien @ Oct. 22 2008,01:43)
this yummy German noodle concoction.


Mrs. Crabby used to make these but hasn't in a long time.

Date: 2008/10/27 21:00:56, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (khan @ Oct. 27 2008,20:09)
Quote (Crabby Appleton @ Oct. 27 2008,20:51)
Quote (Arden Chatfield @ Oct. 27 2008,19:21)
Quote (stevestory @ Oct. 24 2008,19:52)
I was making curry chicken tonight and it was going fine until i absolutely ruined it in the end. First I sauteed some diced chicken breast, onion, and garlic. Then I added about 2 tsp curry powder, a little cumin, salt, cayenne powder, and pepper. and 2 cups water, and was reducing that. Then I decide it's too watery

Just cook it half an hour with the lid off. Fixes that right up.

Also, in my experience, with curries dark meat like chicken thighs works better, tho I guess that's pretty subjective.

I agree with the bold part, but remove the meat while you're doing it so it isn't overcooked.

I'm a big fan of dark meat too which is why I cook a lot of duck.

The big treat with cooking duck is the rendered fat.

Cottage Fried Potatoes cooked in duck fat ROCKS! Scrambled eggs with tomato, mild pepper, garlic, chives and diced smoked pork chops, ooh I could go on.

Goose fat is also great, especially for potatoes.

Finishing off the Cottage Fries Mrs. Crabby made yesterday!

I can't get goose fat unless I hunt/shoot the bird myself.

Maple Leaf Farms produce a delectable duck raised by Amish farmers that I can buy in the local market.

Date: 2008/10/27 21:18:28, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
If you live close enough to Kansas City to get Boulevard Brewing beers (Missouri's second largest brewer) give Bob's 47 a try.

It's their fall seasonal beer, a Munich style lager. Not as good as their springtime Irish Ale, but still a very good brew.

Date: 2008/10/27 21:49:11, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
That bread looks awesome/toothsome!

Date: 2008/11/02 18:28:16, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (Arden Chatfield @ Oct. 29 2008,11:37)
Quote (carlsonjok @ Oct. 29 2008,09:21)
You know, I am sitting here and cannot really think of any peculiarly American food.  Most of our cuisine is derived from some other ethnicity.  Even scrapple.

I would recommend lots of corn dishes, but technically that's Mexico, as are tomatoes and chocolate.

So if you're insisting on some strict notion of North American, pre-Columbian purity, then go with buffalo burgers and wild rice, like they serve at powwows. Maybe some acorn mush just for variety.

Sufferin' succotash, corn was and is grown by Amerinds all over NA (and Mexico is part of NA). Corn, beans and squash were staples along with the wild rice some northern tribes harvested. Sunflower seeds and peppers were also cultivated.

With that, I'm off to pop some pop corn! :D


Date: 2008/11/02 18:54:00, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (khan @ Oct. 30 2008,18:42)
All that aside, how is ghee for deep frying?

Quite good.

Date: 2008/11/02 18:58:10, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (carlsonjok @ Oct. 31 2008,16:36)
If you have a choice of wood, I recommend apple.  Hickory is traditional, but I prefer the subletly of apple.

Maple is great with pork ribs too but I prefer pecan wood when I can get it.


Date: 2009/06/20 00:35:26, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (Richardthughes @ June 16 2009,13:37)
In an attempt to coax Heddle back..

Is Gulf Livery Teh_sexi_hawt?


Well, to be honest, that is a Lola with a Ford powerplant.


Date: 2009/06/20 00:38:00, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
This is what I lust for.

Once again, a British chassis with an American mill.


Date: 2009/06/20 00:53:25, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Arguably the most beautiful car ever made,

The Alfa Romeo 8C 2300 Viotti. Built on a Le Mans winning chassis too I might add. Only one was ever made so it's out of my price range.


Date: 2009/07/03 00:09:59, Link
Author: Crabby Appleton
Quote (Tracy P. Hamilton @ June 27 2009,21:17)
[quote=keiths,June 27 2009,21:06]
I had a 1976 Chevy Vega.  Engine actually did very well.

I laughed at the Chevette owners.  Kind of like we say "Thank God for Mississippi" here in Alabama.

I had a '75 Cosworth Vega. If memory serves me, it was the first production car with 4 valves per cylinder and electronic controlled fuel injection. It ran like a scalded dog but once it passed the 12,000 mile mark it started coming apart at the seams. Then a friend borrowed and totalled it.