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Date: 2005/10/02 02:16:24, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Having nothing better to do, I've just been reading the opening statements.  During his statement for the defendents, Gillen says this:

Quote

He will also testify that efforts to disqualify IDT from science based upon causation ortestability or other so-called demarcation criteria, including so-called methodological naturalism, are inherently flawed. Dr. Fuller will explain that intelligent design theory is not creationism. It is not inherently religious. He will also explain, for that matter, that any number of phenomena we now understand, whether it's gravity or the wave-particle duality of quantum mechanics, were once thought to be supernatural.
(p25, l24 - p36, l9)


Why is the defence (sorry, defense) calling a witness who will argue that "God of the Gaps" doesn't work?

Bob

Date: 2005/11/29 20:09:52, Link
Author: Bob O'H
From the (Manchester) Guardian:
Fundamentalists 'threaten scientific progress'
http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/story/0,3605,1653748,00.html

Two quotes stick out:
"The speech warns of the emerging problem of creationism being taught in school science lessons as a theory on equal footing with evolution. Lord May called on scientists to be more proactive in making their voices heard."

and

"All ideas should be open to questioning, and the merit of ideas should be assessed on the strength of evidence that supports them and not on the credentials or affiliations of the individuals proposing them."

which we can interpret as meaning that we can happily ignore anything the outgoing president of the Royal Society has said.  :-)

Bob

Date: 2006/01/14 23:22:38, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Sorry I'm a tad late, but little Lionel had hidden the bat behind the shed and it took me hours to find it.  The little devil's more of a Rooney than a Flintoff.

Bob

Date: 2006/01/15 20:13:45, Link
Author: Bob O'H
ALGENON!  Put that back!

No! Where you got it from.  Yes.  On the table.


Um, sorry.  Where were we?

Bob

Date: 2006/01/20 22:40:11, Link
Author: Bob O'H
It was a bit quiet whilst the Chief Constable was here.  Do you think he's on to our ginger beer smuggling?

Bob

Date: 2006/01/20 23:05:02, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
I'm working on a theory (like Paley ;) ), and am wondering if our Islander friends can clarify Blair's position on ID for me?

I've read several UK news articles, but all seem to actually deal with his positions kind of indirectly.

Is he voicing 'teach the controversy', open denial of evolutionary theory, or just what exactly?


Nobody else has answered you, so I'll try.

Blair is a believer in choice, and the creationist stuff got caught up as part of this.  He may well not have a strong opinion on evolution: my guess is that he believes it to be true, but doesn't think about it.  Most Britons are like that.

He wouldn't push any policy on this even if he was a creationist.  Partly because it's not his job: the British system is more diffuse, so it would be the job of the Education Secretary (who's got too many other things to worry about now).  He would also be aware that it's a vote loser: he would look like a fundamentalist and would be attacked from all sides, including from within his party.

In summary: one less thing to worry about.

Bob

Date: 2006/01/21 02:52:23, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Ah, that explains his kindly mood: we all know that absinthe makes the heart grow fonder.

Bob

Date: 2006/01/24 07:16:44, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Sorry I took so long, the jelly took age to set, and then I couldn't find the cream.

What? Ah, TRUFFLES??? You [CENSORED] son of [CENSORED]  and his flagellate [CENSORED]!  I won't be responsible for my actions....

Bob

Date: 2006/01/29 04:13:03, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I sent a letter to the Editor clearing up any mis-understanding that Meyer may have (inadvertently) created by explaining that ID is only scientific if you redefine "scientific".  And then citing Behe etc. as evidence.

I had forgotten that Meyer directed the Disco Institute when the Wedge was drawn up, otherwise I would have raised that as well.  I think we should be writing letters to the papers (oh gods, has it come to that???) pointing out the duplicity and dis-honesty of the ID crowd.

Incidentally, I saw the article after it was pointed out at Bad Science yesterday.  There are a few discussions about ID there, and we're sending them over to PT, so you may see some oddballs at the garden party.

Bob

Date: 2006/01/29 04:43:58, Link
Author: Bob O'H
The email address is a bit hard to find, but this is it:
dtletters@telegraph.co.uk
(yes, their letters page has the dt's!;)

As for strawberries Romanov, well we all know what happened to them in the end.

Bob

Date: 2006/01/29 06:16:27, Link
Author: Bob O'H
The latest from DaveScot.  It looks like he's channelling Larry Fafafarman.

Bob
P.S. what happened to Larry?  Did I miss something?

Date: 2006/01/29 08:45:46, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Alan Fox @ Jan. 29 2006,14:31)
Quote
Probably just an inadvertant omission.


Worth pointing out to the Telegraph though. I'll give it a go.


Hmm.  The problem is to not make it look like an ad hominem attack: Meyer's article wasn't about the theological side.  If you can get around that (and the Wedge might help), you might also find
this useful.

Does anyone out there have a quote from Meyer saying that ID is about God?  Something like the Dembski's Logos theory cracker.

Bob

Date: 2006/01/30 06:06:46, Link
Author: Bob O'H
The Telegraph published some letters about Meyer's article today, including a cut-down version of mine, with the sarcasm de-clawed.

Bob

Date: 2006/01/30 19:11:33, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Yeah!  There was I thinking that Dave Scot might have run out of people to ban.  But, joy of joys, he then did this:

http://www.uncommondescent.com/index.php/archives/744#comments

I can't see russ being at UD for much longer.

Bob

Date: 2006/01/31 07:00:22, Link
Author: Bob O'H
You know this old ID business?  Well, my brother was asking today whether Shane Warne was intelligently designed.  Eventually he decided that Warne couldn't be, because if the Aussies were to do some genetic engineering, they would add another mouth first, so they could drink two tinnies at a time.

I'm sure the vicar will be able to enlighten us as to what a "tinnie" is.

Bob

Date: 2006/01/31 20:12:11, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (tacitus @ Jan. 31 2006,23:55)
Heh - Bill Dembski just stepped in and slapped DaveScot back down. Methinks Billy boy didn't like the way things were going.

http://www.uncommondescent.com/index.php/archives/747

And, curiously, DaveScot's thread has disappeared, and he hasn't been heard of since.  But two new moderators have appeared.

I guess we'll work out in a few days whether this is jsut because DaveScot is taking a cold shower.

Who predicted the end of January?

Bob

Date: 2006/02/01 08:58:06, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Won't the DNA just say "What is six times nine"?

From which you will be able to work out that God has 13 digits.

Bob

Date: 2006/02/04 00:25:39, Link
Author: Bob O'H
What's so disturbing about Darwin's Ucks?

Bob

Date: 2006/02/06 19:44:44, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
However, unlike in mathematics or philosophy, in science one cannot conclusively prove a negative. One can’t conclusively prove that Darwinism is false any more than one can conclusively prove that the “ether” doesn’t exist.


Wow.  So, Behe is admitting that he wasted his time with IC?

Overall I'm impressed with Behe's ability to miss the argument.

And the scorecard reads
Big bang 11, flagellum 7 (3 by the court)
Plus 5 ethers.

Bob

Date: 2006/02/24 07:40:02, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I've just checked Cordova's post about the equation that proves the existence of God.  And what does the equation say?  

"Oink".

Bob

Date: 2006/03/05 18:50:07, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
That explains why you never saw a phylogeny that puts mammals, bacteria, and yeats at the same distance, in what we call a “rake” (not sure whether the translation from French “rateau” applies here).


Are you looking for a "star phylogeny"?  It's the same thing, but a different shape.  :-)

To get far too technical, evidence of long branch attraction (i.e. the Felsenstein zone) in a pair of sequences would falsify the falsification quite nicely.  Anyone have a reference handy?

Bob

Date: 2006/03/05 18:58:55, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Psycho Springer hasn't inititiated a thread in the last thirteen.
You don't suppose Dembski has realised Psycho is our greatest asset on UD, and clipped his wings. That would be a shame.


Nope, he's back and on about the second law, with added bold bits.  I'm not a physicist, so I'll wait for your expert opinions over whether he's making sense.

Bob

Date: 2006/03/11 06:23:32, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Alan Fox @ Mar. 11 2006,11:56)
Quote
...If someone actually conspired or threatened to commit a specific criminal act they might draw the line there but I’d have to see it to believe it. ... -ds

Comment by crandaddy — March 10, 2006 @ 8:56 pm


(From this comment at UD with crandaddy trying to get Dave2lot to stop digging his hole deeper.)


Hmmm, didn't someone get banned from PT for threatening to commit a specific criminal act?

Bob

Date: 2006/04/01 07:54:30, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
I was joking, Wes.


Only just noticed this.  I thought the correct reply is "That was hyperbole".

Bob

Date: 2006/04/05 07:33:38, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
OK, brace yourselves: Here's something nice about a UD poster for a change.

BarryA has the guts to stand on the side of truth and reason:


In fairness, BarryA seems a decent guy.  OK, I don't agree with him on ID etc., but I think we should give him some credit.

And then start laying bets on how long he lasts before he becomes disgusted with the way certain other people behave on the blog.

Bob

Date: 2006/04/06 08:58:38, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Oh, they've got a transcript of Pianka:
http://www.uncommondescent.com/index.php/archives/1005

It's worth reading: he's not saying anything that I haven't heard from a lot of other ecologists: the worst we can say is that Pianka is a pessimist.  His comments on diseases are just obvious to anyone who knows anything about epidemiology.  Lots of people, easier for diseases to spread.

It looks like it would have been a fun talk to listen to.

Bob
P.S. I don't even need to point out that DaveScot misses the point, do I?

I won't be missing you -dt

Date: 2006/04/07 07:51:26, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
It gets better, in the same issue their is a paper showing how an "irreducibly complex" lock and key recognition system can evolve.
http://www.sciencemag.org/cgi/content/full/312/5770/97


There's a commentary on this, with the title Reducible Complexity.  Just classy.

I've been waiting for a post on either of these Science papers on PT, but everyone seems distracted by this Pianka business.

Bob

Date: 2006/04/07 19:22:16, Link
Author: Bob O'H
:02-->
Quote (Stephen Elliott @ April 07 2006,23:02)
[quote=sir_toejam,April 07 2006,22:46]...

now that's a church worth torching!

Torching?

Sir, your thought processes are medieval. Let's "Nuke-Em Till they glow"![/quote]
... then shoot them in the dark.

Bob

Date: 2006/04/08 20:21:07, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
April 8, 2006
ID Event at the University of California, Irvine
...

It is going to be very interesting to watch the Intelligent Design versus Blind-Watchmaker-Evolution debate in coming years, because technically competent people who have a reasonably well-integrated knowledge of modern hard science (mathematics — especially combinatorics — chemistry, physics, and software engineering), know way too much for very many of them to buy BWE for much longer.
...
Filed under: Intelligent Design — GilDodgen @ 11:56 pm


Hands up how many of you spotted the subject that was missing from the list?  Answer below the fold

The fold

Yes, statistics!

Bob

Date: 2006/04/09 04:32:35, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote

Is dwelling on Pianka really going to make us feel cleaner inside? I do NOT endorse snuff-talk of any kind, but fixating on Pianka’s alleged words is merely going to give us ulcers and high-blood pressure. Who needs that. We would feel much happier (and calmer) if we dumped this affair and went on to more fruitful activity-like looking for a Designer.

I can only speak for myself and the answer is yes, yes, a thousand times yes. -ds
(italics added)


I can only assume DaveScot was replying to the question, rather than the rest of the post.

Hmm, we could ask "Is dwelling on DaveScot really going to make us feel cleaner inside?" but we all know the answer is "who cares?"

Bob

Date: 2006/04/09 19:54:12, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
(The reporter on this story is Mike Argento. For those of us who waited with impatience for his hilarious send-ups of the "breathtaking inanity" revealed in the KvD case each week, this report shows clearly that Argento does straight reporting well, too.)


When he's awake, second post down.

Bob

Date: 2006/04/15 08:05:53, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (stevestory @ April 15 2006,11:32)
Quote
April 15, 2006
Sounds Fishy (or, How to Get Published at AAAS)

unScientific American and Science News are reporting in (this) story that “darwinian debt”s are being generated by over-fishing and the result is that

   "Fast-growing fish therefore get penalized evolutionarily
    because they quickly become large enough to get caught…"

Correct me if I’m wrong, but isn’t this nothing more than an exagerated example of dog-breeding (except with fish, of course)?

DougMoron, promise me you'll never leave.

http://www.uncommondescent.com/index.php/archives/1037#more-1037

By chance I was chatting to some fisheries biologists last night about following up the work.  Dougs' cluelessness finally got me to post over there: we'll see how long I last.

Bob

Date: 2006/04/15 20:00:46, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Bog standard evolution rules out Intelligent Design a priori, supernatural or not. It’s judicially-sanctioned, tax-funded intellectual terrorism, but only a monority of people realise the extent of the damage being done.


We can get tax funds for burning churches?!  I thought that was only in Sweden.

Bob
P.S. I think there's a typo in there: it should be "moronity".

Date: 2006/04/16 20:01:39, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Looks like I've lasted two posts before being banned.  Apparently it's against the rules to think that scientific papers on "micro-evolution" are not about "macro-evolution".

Dang, and for a moment I was naïve enough to think that a rational discussion would be possible.  Ah well, I always have my viral cultures to talk to...

Bob

Date: 2006/04/18 07:04:10, Link
Author: Bob O'H
In today's Grauniad, Seth Shostak of SETI distances himself from ID.  If he distanced himself any more, we'd need SETI to hear him.

Bob

Date: 2006/04/18 20:14:39, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Go Dave!

Quote

Disney is understood fantasy

[b]Not really. Their future themes are supposed to be plausible futures. Pirates of the Carribean - there really were pirates in the Carribean. The Haunted House - plenty of people believe in ghosts. Not Disney but Santa Claus, the Easter Bunny, and the Tooth Fairy are real for a lot of kids. If people want to believe these things (Dinosaur Land included) that’s their business and I don’t see any particular harm in it. Believing this stuff isn’t a cause of anything, it’s a symptom of something if you know what I mean. -ds[b]


I would comment further, but he's being nice to me and letting me educate him about evolutionary ecology.  And anyway, I don't need to say more.  :-)

Bob

Date: 2006/04/19 19:18:32, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Kevin (or can I call you W.?) - in the interests of irony, you should post under a different name each time.

Bob

Date: 2006/04/23 08:33:32, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Sorry to drag you all away from Larry Farfarafarfarman, but Dave has been removing posts again.  Did anyone get the original?  As I recall, it said (roughly) "Hasn't Nick Matzke already answered this?

Now now.  At least try and look surprised.

Bob

Date: 2006/04/24 07:58:15, Link
Author: Bob O'H
:06-->
Quote (Rilke's Granddaughter @ April 24 2006,12:06)
[quote=stevestory,April 24 2006,07<!--emo&:0]While a few bad words might give some people the vapors, the seriously off-the-rails stuff involves indirect death threats.

That is a very seriously worrisome post.  I mean, I know that JAD is nutters, but I didn't realize he might be... well, homicidal.[/quote]
Are we sure it is JAD, and not someone pretending to be him?  OK, it looks like him, and links to his profile, but can that be faked?  There's an apology there, for example, that to me doesn't read like JAD.

I've just had a WTF moment.  I searched Web of Science for JAD's name, and found this:
Dionyssiou DD, Demiri EC, Davison JA (2005). A simple method for determining the breast implant size in augmentation mammaplasty.  AESTHETIC PLASTIC SURGERY 29: 571-573.

I think it should be acknowledged that my actual age and emotional age are slowly diverging.

Bob

Date: 2006/04/24 08:34:45, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Reading this blog is quite an enjoyment.  :D


Yeah, but it's #### confusing.  As far as I can tell, the professor did it, in the hallway, with a shotgun.

Bob

Date: 2006/04/24 19:03:13, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Tiax @ April 24 2006,22:49)
http://www.uncommondescent.com/index.php/archives/1067#comments

Qualitative sez:

"I just would hate to see IDers become like Creationists and Darwinists — mocking adversaries rather than addressing the accuracy of claims. "

Apparently Qualitative's monitor doesn't display bold text that ends with -ds.

Apparently your monitor won't display bold text that ends with -ds from now on either.  You're outta here! - dt

Date: 2006/04/29 20:44:33, Link
Author: Bob O'H
From the junk DNA comments:

Quote
And why didn’t you use your real name when you registered here? What are you hiding? -ds


What's that about real names Mr. Scott, err, Springer?

Bob

Date: 2006/05/01 19:47:02, Link
Author: Bob O'H
:06-->
Quote (tacitus @ May 02 2006,00:06)
I like the idea that the creator of this Universe is a grade D science student at the local multiverse high school who screwed up his science project.  It would explain a lot...

There was a Far Side about this: in God's kitchen.

Bob
P.S. None of you are really God.  I, however, have noodly appendiges and smell faintly of tomato.

Date: 2006/05/02 19:38:30, Link
Author: Bob O'H
How to detect design

Sal is showing ID up again.  He (fals to) link to acompany that detects genetically modified material by looking for the DNA that was inserted.  IOW, they look for a label saying "this is genetically modified".  If only the search for the intelligent designer was that easy.

Aaagh!  Can't resist!  Can't resist!

It'll be banned anyway, but here goes:

Quote

1. Can you fix the link?  It's pointing back to UD at the moment.

2. If only detection of the intelligent designer was so simple!  Genetic-id look for the DNA that was inserted into the plant.  It's a bit like working out that a book was written by Bill Dembski because it says "Bill Dembski" on the cover.

Please tell me that an ID researcher has worked out what the Intelligent Designer's signature looks like.


GMOs are serious stuff, and something I work on.  So why am I wasting my time taking the piss out of these guys?

The person with the best answer wins shares in my new, explanatory filter-inspired business: book-id.

Bob

Date: 2006/05/04 19:15:12, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
I can't comment on the book, but for some strange reason Mike Duggins from Campus Crusade for Christ sent me a letter today asking me to help fund a counter-point campaign.


Perhaps you should send him a Bach fugue.

Bob

Date: 2006/05/04 19:41:47, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
http://www.pssiinternational.com/
?

Shouldn't that first i should be before the s's?

OK, childish, and I apologise.  But if they're going to make it that easy for us to take the pssi out of them, we just have to oblige.

Bob

Date: 2006/05/05 20:43:42, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
17 doctors? 17? I can get 20 doctors who believe in evolution from my hospital alone, first thing Monday.


But how many of them are called Steve?

Bob

Date: 2006/05/05 21:46:33, Link
Author: Bob O'H
On the conservation of information thread, I've just posted this:
Quote

I'm afraid I don't get this:

<blockquote>This higher-level bar{S} random search will be consistent with the original random search S, which serves as the baseline for searching the original space, provided that, on average, the bar{S}_{$i}s yield a search whose probability of success on the original space is no greater than p.<blockquote>

Why is this so?

Bob



It's in the moderation queue, which is nice.  We'll see if it's too inflamatory when DaveScott wakes up.

Bob

EDIT: Oooh!  It got through (and yes, I forgot to close the blockquote).  Now, that is interesting.  I've tried another couple of posts earlier, which didn't make it.  But this one, cross-posted here, did.  Hmmmm...

Date: 2006/05/07 04:20:24, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
So anyone with the math background could get a few hits in.


Actually, I think we're doing pretty well over at UD. We just await Dembski's response...

Bob

Date: 2006/05/07 08:24:42, Link
Author: Bob O'H
It's.  It's horrible.  I just had a quick peek to see what Larry was up to, and just had to read all of the thread with Colin the Lawyer (and JAD, of course).  It's like a Jeffrey Archer novel.  You know it's crap, but you can't stop yourself.

Bob
P.S. for hockey fans: Finland managed to amass 39 minutes of penalties in the first period of their match against Latvia.  And the score was still 0-0.

Date: 2006/05/07 19:35:10, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Quote
I briefly forgot about that guy.


So you're not "anonymous" then?


No.  At least not over there.  I'm uneasy with the way people are tormenting Larry: he is still a human being, and deserves some respect.  Although I am starting to lean towards the Mr. Potatohead theory.

Quote

Quote
P.S. for hockey fans:


?


Sorry, ice hockey.  I've been in Finland too long.

Bob

Date: 2006/05/08 05:54:45, Link
Author: Bob O'H
SENSE OF HUMOUR FOUND AT UD!!!

Read all about it!

Give 'em credit, they're actually quite funny, and most of it is deliberate.  Larry's comment, I have my suspicions about.

Bob

Date: 2006/05/12 22:15:55, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (BWE @ May 13 2006,02:14)
Evidence for god?

What was the torture device in Hitchhikers guide where you could see yourself at scale in the universe? anyone remember? I couldn't find a google link in a quick search. Somehow, it reminds me of evidence for god.

Ah, so Zaphod really is God.

Bob
P.S. is it only the radio series that explains how Zaphod survived the Total Perspective Vortex?  And no I'm not telling: get the CDs yourselves!

Date: 2006/05/13 08:48:42, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
What is conventional Darwinite wisdom?  Should I pop over there and ask them that?  I've never been banned from anywhere before.


You'll never be taken seriously here until you change that.  If you want to gain our everlasting respect, you have to ask something totally innocuous and be banned.

Oh, and doesn't Darwinite wisdom have something to do with banana bending?  Or is that Queensland?

Bob

Date: 2006/05/14 20:13:37, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I guess Dembski put this up whilst you were all asleep:

Public Retraction and Apology to Kevin Padian

For those of you who like your irony, from Dr./Prof. Padian's letter:


"In the first place, you completely distorted what I said by quoting out of context."


There's plenty more in there for you to chew over: I'm off to work now, but I expect to see a couple more pages of froth and mirth here by the time I get back.

Bob

Date: 2006/05/15 19:25:22, Link
Author: Bob O'H
One for the nerds,
comment 4:

Quote
#

What I like best, what I think is the most accurate, about this cartoon is that the data on the left, while it looks intellectual, is unintelligable nonsense.

Comment by bFast — May 15, 2006 @ 11:22 am


Anyone else but me recognise those equations?  Anyone remember their introductory population genetics course?

Sorry, that's the same question.

Bob

Date: 2006/05/16 09:32:53, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I'm a fan of this one:
Quote
Haeckel’s thinking and writings are relevant to the ID/Darwinism debate for a very important reason. They reflect the mindset and philosophical penchants of the people with whom, and the age in which, Darwinism took root.


Hey, we've moved on from then, even if ID hasn't.  From the Pandas decision:

"...defense expert witnesses Behe and Minnich admitted that their argument for ID based on the “purposeful arrangement of parts” is the same one that Paley made for design." (pp24-25)

Paley's Natural Theology being published in 1802, of course.

Bob

Date: 2006/05/16 20:52:26, Link
Author: Bob O'H
(warning: another nerdy academic post coming up.  Feel free to ignore)
Quote

Quote

as was Darwin’s work. “Inheritance of acquired characters” became the cornerstone of the Nazi Monism religion. Neo-darwinism rejects Lamarckism replacing it rather with Natural Selection (survival-of the fittest).


Another boob who gets his evolutionary theory from a Jack Chick comic.

No, 'Darwinism' replaces Lamarckism. Or did Lamarck 'recant on his death bed', too?


It's a it more complicated than that.  Darwin originally suggested belnding inheritance, but it was pointed out that that didn't work (because everything becomes blended, so you have no variation).  He then went back to Lamarckism (at least to some extent).

Bob

Date: 2006/05/17 20:28:17, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (jeannot @ May 17 2006,14:00)
Apparently, Dembski is working on the evolution of allelic frequences in a population (p and q).
I don't know what he wants to prove, but whatever it is, it will not be supported by any data from population genetics, since they totally support evolution by natural selection or drift.

Hmm, I suspect not.  I think it relates to his Conservation of Information stuff.

Excuse me whilst I get technical again for a moment...
The last two constraints are on the expected values of f and g (which, I assume, are probability density functions).  I'm guessing now, but the integral looks like it's the expectation of g(x)/f(x), taken w.r.t. g(x).

Wes: I think writing f>=0, g>=0 is OK for real mathematicians.  It's saying that the function is non-negative for all values of x.


OK, back in the real world: if I couldn't solve something like that, I'd ask a student to do it (one of the perks of being in a department stuffed with mathematicians.  But the coffee is still awful).  Poor Dembski is slumming it in a theological college, so that option probably isn't available.  I suppose he could try praying for some help.

Bob

Date: 2006/05/19 08:35:59, Link
Author: Bob O'H
DS is demonstrating his breathtaking inanity again.  

The following reply will probably not be appearing over there:
Quote
Err, you have heard about <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gene_regulation">gene regulation</a>, haven't you?

Bob


Bob

Date: 2006/05/19 21:06:48, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I've noticed that whenever I post a post to UD here, it gets through.  Now, like any good scientist, I'll try an experiment to test this hypothesis...

Quote

DS: I take it you'rw now admitting that this was wrong:
<blockquote>So anyhow, I now have a volvariella colony that <em>mutated</em> beneficially within a matter of weeks in a most Lamarckian way in response to environmental stress. I<blockquote> (emphasis mine)

and that it's just simple gene regulation.  Incidentally, how do you know that the new mushrooms were produced by spores, and not through hyphal growth?

Yep, I'm up for a banning.

Bob

Date: 2006/05/20 07:02:02, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Ooh, that DaveScot makes me so mad...

But he still may not have banned me from this thread yet, so let's try again:
Quote
<blockquote>Where did I say anything about any fruiting bodies? These are mycelial cultures. I’m admitting nothing. Descent with modification took place.</blockquote>

If the cultures are mycelial, then they are <em>the same individual</em>.  Hence, no descent.

I was asking about whether they were produced from spores because I <em>do</em> know something about the life cycle of fungi:
I spent 5 and a half years doing research in mycology, and my PhD is in fungal plant pathology.  The point with mushrooms is that if they are only hyphal, then they are the same indidivual: two mushrooms produced by one hyphal culture are parts of the same individual in the same way that my left arm is a part of the same individual as my right arm is.  Would you claim that your liver cells (say) have "inherited" their function when they were produced?  That's not evolution: it's development.  

Epigenetic inheritance isn't an issue, because inheritance isn't an issue.

Bob
P.S. I was hoping to be banned with a bit more of a flourish than "Thanks for playing.".  I'm really disappointed. :-(


Yes, folks, deep in my heart I know this is all foolish, and I should just give up on DaveScot now.

I'm giving up on you now.  You're outta here -ds

Bob

Date: 2006/05/20 22:11:23, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Hark! What’s that sound I hear from the peanut gallery? I do believe it’s the sound of crickets chirping! :cool:

You’re not banned Bob, in case you thought that. Feel free to keep on playing if you think you have a move left.

Comment by DaveScot — May 20, 2006 @ 12:33 pm

So post his latest comment, then, Davey.


I have to sleep at some point!  In case DaveScot hasn't worked this out, Finland is in a different time zone to him.

I even missed Finland's big night, which is the real news today (I live in Helsinki, so this is of local importance.  As well as being the biggest laugh since Judge Jones III passed down his ruling).

Bob

Date: 2006/05/21 20:39:13, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Interesting.  I sent another post to UD (on the Lamarckian mshrooms thread), but didn't post it here.  And... it hasn't been posted.

I sent it mid-morning to mid-afternoon UD time, so it's not as if everyone was sleeping.

I think this goes a long way to demonstrating my hypothesis that the way to get a post up at UD is to post it here too.  Which is not good news, really.

Bob

Date: 2006/05/22 07:50:36, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (GCT @ May 22 2006,12:27)
I can't believe that you all assume that those atheistic ACLU terrorists and their minions at snopes and truthorfiction are telling the truth.  They are obviously caught and now are trying to lie their way out of it.  They make the baby Jesus cry.

Right on!

Bob

Date: 2006/05/22 19:23:45, Link
Author: Bob O'H
DT's little faux pas almost meant I missed this little exchange:

Comments 8 and 9:
Quote
#

Dr. Dembski you are proving yourself very adept at painting the enemy. How about putting some intellectual energy into actually responding to the points he makes? Does it really satisfy you to use him as a poster child? What is the point of posting someone’s opinions and then failing to respond meaningfully to them? It is just a gesture of self-righteousness. “look how bad he is. we are so much better!”

Comment by tinabrewer — May 22, 2006 @ 2:18 pm
#

Sorry, Tina, but I’m not going to take the bait, tempting as it is.

Comment by William Dembski — May 22, 2006 @ 2:24 pm


Errr, right on?

Bob

Date: 2006/05/22 19:31:09, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (steve_h @ May 22 2006,19:32)
Ignore, Laugh, Fight, Win        
Quote
First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win. –Mahatma Gandhi

Am I the only one wondering if things are running backwards in ID-world?

Bob

Date: 2006/05/23 08:27:13, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Back on the fungi (sorry).  I guess this won't show up:

Quote
Your first question deserves to be ignore with disdain: the answer is obvious, and beside the point I was trying to make: I was making a point about what the organism was actually doing, not what it might do.  Your original post was about what the organism had actually done, nut what it might have done.

To answer your second question, organisms can't evolve (in a Darwinian sense).  That sort of change within an organism is called <em>development</em>.

Bob


I really should give up, as we all know it's not going anywhere. But it's the nearest UD will get to a scientific discussion.

Bob

Date: 2006/05/23 08:34:05, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Ha!  Vindication!  I'm going to claim that the reason DS posted the fake story about the ACLU is that I had distracted him with all this mycological talk.

That's my excuse, and I'm sticking to it!

Bob
P.S. I think his last comment on the ACLU thread may be a joke, but with DS it's difficult to tell.

Date: 2006/05/24 05:34:15, Link
Author: Bob O'H
The Hefner thread seems to have changed a bit since I looked at it this morning.  But Wes be praised, it's archived!!!!.

I thought there was a comment by shalini pointing out that "his comment history" is actually "her comment history".  Which would have been obvious if anyone had followed the link to her web page.

Oh well, more fuel on the fire:

Quote
#

Keeping some Darwinists around on these threads would help generate interesting,and lively, discussions, or has there been too much ugliness around here when dissent was given free reign?

Comment by apollo230 — May 24, 2006 @ 10:27 am


Go on, you know you can't resist.

Bob

Date: 2006/05/24 21:05:48, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I just saw the following phrase over in the Bad Science forum:

unhinged forum-monster

Bob

Date: 2006/05/25 19:31:16, Link
Author: Bob O'H
This looks like part of an exam question:
Quote

Given the complexity of systems already unraveled why should “nature” be constrained to accepting dumb luck in descent with modification and direct some “mutations” to benefit itself in its immediate environment? In fact this is exactly what is being discovered about life - Lamarck was right it’s just that the mechanism isn’t Mendelian which was why he was discounted, it’s epigenetic. The key isn’t in the coding genes. Those are just a library of subroutines. The key is in the regulatory regions which control the when, where, why, and how of protein production and this is controlled in significant measure by non-Mendelian inheritance i.e. transposable elements. -ds

The rest of the question being (roughly)

 
Quote
Explain why this is almost totally bollocks


OH, and both great_ape and Chris Hyland are on the side of Goodness, Light, and Random Mutation.  I remember DT trying to break a few ironymeters by whining about great_ape using a pseudonym recently.  I think he might have threatened to ban great_ape, but I can't be bothered to check.  Chris Hyland has survived by not giving them anything to use against him.  I suspect he's a diplomat in real life.

Bob

Date: 2006/05/26 09:31:31, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (guthrie @ May 26 2006,06:08)
Cant some of you engineers come up with fuses for ironymeters?

Alas the b**tards insisted on using genetic algorithms to design them.

Bob

Date: 2006/05/26 09:56:15, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I think George (who may or may not be a pink hippo) is asking for a banning:
 
Quote
#

Mung:

“So far the book appears to be more anti-creationist than anti-ID, lol. I guess the authors either cannot see the distinctions or don’t care to.”

I admit that I have difficulty seeing any distinctions, especially on this blog. Would anyone be ambitious enough to do me a favour and come up with a quick list? Thanks in advance.

Comment by George — May 26, 2006 @ 11:49 am




"Geoffrey, can I zip DaveScott up?"

Bob

(sorry, this is probably obscure unless you're British, but take a look here for a clue as to what it's all about, or the more staid wiki version)

Date: 2006/05/27 21:07:23, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Dembski is trying to whip up fervour from the troops:

The argument from incredulity vs. The argument from gullibility

Turn your irony meters off first.

Ha!  I love this one:

Quote
ID is the only theory under which certain research could be validated.

For example, it is observed that introns (’junk’ to RM+NS) have Functional Sequence Complexity (FSC) of the same order as human langauge. Studies have revealed that unexpressed introns are informationally more dense than exon expressions.

Anyone who has designed any sort of code knows the importance of embedding documentation in the source. When the code is compiled the documentation does not appear in the resulting binaries.

Similarly, introns are not trascribed.

Source code documentation contains information about the algorithms such as:
- Meta-data (ontological descriptions)
- Pseudo code (methodological descriptions)
- Copyright information (intellecutal property notifications)

If we believe that genetic code is designed by an intellect, then shouldn’t we be looking for the copyright information? This intellect would probably have considerable legal abilities, not to mention foresight.

Exam question: What impact would this have on genetic patents?

Comment by Collin DuCrâne — May 27, 2006 @ 8:37 pm


Based on his previous posts, I don't think he's joking.

Bob

Date: 2006/05/28 05:06:08, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Curious.  I wrote two messages to the Incredilby Gullible post.  One got through (and received a typical ds response).  The other did not:
Quote
<blockquote>The comments from Dennet, Dawkins, Hauser, Coyne are all assertion and no substantiation.</blockquote>

Perhaps the substantiation is in the rest of the articles.  I'll leave it to BarryA explain the perils of quote mining.  :-)

Bob

I guess they don't want me spoiling the fun.

Bob
P.S. bFast's comment (no. 21) clearly show the lack of relationship between creationism and ID.  *ahem*

Date: 2006/05/29 05:59:30, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Just spotted in a PT comment:

Quote
Posted by Shalini, BBWAD on May 29, 2006 02:28 AM (e)


BBWAD?  Took me a moment, but it thoroughly deserves a

"Right on!"

Bob

Date: 2006/05/30 18:46:41, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Dante @ May 30 2006,20:35)
Quote
I gave up atheism for intelligent design about 15 years ago when I was 30-something. -ds


http://www.uncommondescent.com/index.php/archives/1168#comment-41011

This is a very interesting quote. Not only does it imply that DaveRot is a born-again Christian (not that it wasn't obvious), but that he admitted intelligent design and atheism are incompatible. If ID really wasn't religious, then why would it be incompatible with religion?

Really makes me wonder...

It makes me wonder too: how old is DaveScot?

Bob

Date: 2006/05/31 05:04:44, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (GCT @ May 31 2006,07:53)
Quote (Bob O'H @ May 30 2006,23:46)
It makes me wonder too: how old is DaveScot?

Bob

Hey Bob, it looks like he heard you...

http://www.uncommondescent.com/index.php/archives/1168#comments

Quote
19.  For the peanut gallery at ATBC

Bob OH wonders how old I am. I turn 50 this year.

<snip>
Comment by DaveScot — May 31, 2006 @ 6:10 am

Whatever Dave, keep lying for Jesus, he likes that.

You gave up what you consider to be a religion (atheism) for something that you swear up and down isn't religion (ID) even though it makes you mad as h*ll any time someone leaves "god" out of the government, etc.  Yeah, you know, I'm just not buying it.  Not only do I have an irony meter, but I also have a working BS detector, or at least I did until I read this.  Thanks, DaveTard for blowing the meter off the thing.  Now, I'm going to have to buy a new one.

Oh, and before you get all Dawkins quote on our a$$es, you might want to understand what the quote means first.

I had imagined DaveScot to be older than that: I thought he was mid-60s at least: one of those sclerotic old codgers who just complained about how bad the world was nowadays.

Egads!  What will he be like when he becomes a sclerotic old codger?!

Bob

Date: 2006/05/31 09:08:57, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Wonderpants @ May 31 2006,13:40)
[quote=Bob O'H,May 31 2006,10:04]
Quote (GCT @ May 31 2006,07:53)
I had imagined DaveScot to be older than that: I thought he was mid-60s at least: one of those sclerotic old codgers who just complained about how bad the world was nowadays.

Egads!  What will he be like when he becomes a sclerotic old codger?!

Bob

Let's not even go there.

If you thought John Davison was bad enough, wait till you get a load of a 70 year old DaveScot....

Oh, please.  I was trying to blank that thought out of my mind.  I want to sleep tonight.

Bob

Date: 2006/05/31 19:51:59, Link
Author: Bob O'H
John Wilkins points to an article in the Grauniad about a Vardy school near Doncaster:

http://politics.guardian.co.uk/publicservices/story/0,,1785743,00.html

Why, you are wondering, is this not totally off-topic? Because of this:

Quote
"When all this started we thought they were trying to get rid of the under-achievers but now we think they are getting rid of any child, regardless of academic ability, who thinks for themselves, who challenges things ..."


Sound familiar?

Bob

Date: 2006/06/01 07:22:01, Link
Author: Bob O'H
great_ape, kindly remove your tongue from your cheek.

Bob

Date: 2006/06/02 05:31:05, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Oops

Bob

Date: 2006/06/06 19:21:39, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (dhogaza @ June 06 2006,14:25)
That DuCrank guy who's shown up recently's pretty funny, too:

I agree: he's given us this little gem as well:
Quote
The origin of the universe and the origin of life would then seem to share the same first cause.


Bob

Date: 2006/06/08 09:27:06, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Didn't Bush, et. al. come out in favor of ID before the Dover ruling came out?

I thought Bush came out in favour (sorry, favor) of Teach the Controversy, but that was a couple of years ago, and he might have been briefed by his science advisors since then.

Quote
What Wesley and his motley crew just don’t get is that the science argument in ID vs. NDE is over.

Phew, my new ironymeter is still intact.  Just.

Bob

Date: 2006/06/09 22:06:02, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Wesley R. Elsberry @ June 09 2006,17:56)
The use of "Rate My Professor" as a tool on UD to diss people is a bit ironic, given the entries there for William Dembski.

Finance?!!

I agree that the site isn't the best way to measure a professor's courses.

Bob

Date: 2006/06/11 00:48:22, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I don't think johnnyb has been reading the DI's orders, he's just opened up a nice can of worms: Thinking about ID as a Theory of Causation.

Basically, he's saying that ID should be about more than design detection: it should start looking at the how and why (and who) of the design.  Jack Krebs has already replied encouraging him: I've added a post that probably won't see light of day (hi, Dave!;) prodding the discussion towards the "who is the designer?" direction.  Of course, this is the one direction the DI doesn't want to go in, so we'll see what happens...

Bob

Date: 2006/06/11 19:13:47, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I tried to post the following on the Thinking about ID as a Theory of Causation thread:
Quote

<blockquote>Some people mistakenly think that ID is all about design detection. But that’s merely one aspect. The goal is to examine intelligent causation in its fullest.</blockquote>
One would hope that this would be true, but if it were then one of the first questions that would have to be addressed is "Who is the designer?".  But we don't see this problem being tackled: it seems to be quietly ignored instead.

Bob


And, oh my, it didn't appear.  Is someone scared of the "Who is the designer?" question?  Am I starting to turn into Lenny?

Bob

Date: 2006/06/11 19:46:10, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Ichthyic @ June 12 2006,00:30)
oh yes, bob.  even periodic examination reveals that Dave Scott Springerbot is "tired" of that specific question, and has banned folks for asking it previously.

Yep, that's why I asked it: JohnnyB seems to be showing intellectual honesty by setting up these questions, so let's try and show him what happens when you follow them up.

And I won't actually be banned: my comments will be moved to the Pit of Spam and People We Don't Like.  Which is not the same thing at all, oh no.

Bob

Date: 2006/06/12 19:32:23, Link
Author: Bob O'H
From the Ann Coulter thread:

Quote
#

Have William and Dave found their Joan of Arc??
:)

Comment by apollo230 — June 12, 2006 @ 8:35 pm

Sorry apollo230, we only burn churches.

Bob

Date: 2006/06/12 20:04:56, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Dembski admits all:
Quote
Moreover, I regard the rhetorical enterprise as unconstrained by Marquess of Queensberry Rules — sometimes one needs to put a bit of pepper on the gloves, a feat Coulter accomplishes nicely. –WmAD

Now file that away for the moment: it's going to come in useful.

WmAD: Load.  Aim.  Fire!

*BANG!*

WmAD: Oooh!  Oooh-ooh-ooh-ooooh!  My foot!

Bob

Date: 2006/06/13 09:21:05, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Ichthyic @ June 13 2006,13:50)
ya know, UD often makes me think i need to go out for a beer...

in fact:

http://www.physorg.com/news69380566.html

40's for everybody!

Just remember to drink plenty of coffee, too.

Bob

Date: 2006/06/15 19:26:46, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Congratulations!  Welcome to the club!

You took advice for the title from Piled High and Deeper, didn't you?  Only the preposition was missing: I'm not sure what that implies.

Bob

Date: 2006/06/16 05:01:40, Link
Author: Bob O'H
There was a thesis defence today in our department, on absorption and scattering of light in forest canopies (it's important here in Finland).  The final two questions were "what was the name of teh only opera Beethoven wrote?", and "which English poet wrote The Daffodils?".  The poor student didn't know either of them.  Mind you, he had already thrown the examiner by bringing semiotics into the discussion.

I hope you didn't have anything as hard.

Bob

Date: 2006/06/19 03:43:35, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Mark Frank @ June 19 2006,02:01)
I agree that the complex phrase mutator is not a good analogy for evolution. But it did make me think that there is probably an optimum rate for mutation. Too low and you don't get enough variation. Too high and every advantageous mutation is swamped by deletorious mutations in the same individual. Is that true? Has anyone worked on it?

Google "evolution of mutation rate".  Top of the search comes this paper:
André and Godelle (2006)
The Evolution of Mutation Rate in Finite Asexual Populations.  Genetics 172: 611-626.

We now return you to the normal programming...

Bob

Date: 2006/06/19 08:14:49, Link
Author: Bob O'H
GCT: you're missing the point.  DS' original challenge:
Quote
Fair enough. I’ll give you an opportunity to present examples of practical value in any fossils from many millions of years ago. Have at it. -ds

And then, when it has been met, he responds with:
 
Quote
...Addendum for GCT at ATBC: The given example is a practical application for oil drilling in being able to easily date some strata with quick microscopic examination of the drill tailings. The subject of this article is a bird fossil and the practical application was in modern biology. Please explain how bird fossils millions of years old have any practical application that would vault their collection from harmless hobby into worthwhile science. Good luck. -ds


Yeah, good luck with those moving goalposts.

And you're moving as well.  Red card, and you're gone - ds

Bob

Date: 2006/06/19 19:59:38, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (GCT @ June 19 2006,14:31)
http://www.uncommondescent.com/index.php/archives/1229#comment-44063

Quote
Going by the fact that archeology has validated every historical biblical claim it has ever examined, I am persuaded that all science will eventually concur with the Bible’s view on origins, and much else.

I wasn't aware that archeology had validated the global flood.

This is also the source of this gem:

Quote
It may come as a surprise to some to be told that the Bible, rather than being the operating manual of ignorant flat-earthers, actually declared the earth to be round some 2,707 years ago. A good many centuries before scientists came round to that notion. The prophet Isaiah (Chapter 40:21-22), writing circa 701 BC, said this of God:

“Have you not understood since the earth was founded? He sits enthroned above the CIRCLE of the earth, and its people are like grasshoppers. He stretches out the heavens like a canopy, and spreads them out like a tent to live in.”


Only an atheistic evilutionist would think that circles are flat, naturally.

Bob

Date: 2006/06/20 07:30:19, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (blipey @ June 20 2006,12:21)
Makes you wonder if DaveTard is amazed that he can pick up a gallon of milk out of his fridge all by himself--against the gravitational field of the entire planet Earth.  With strength like that, he must have worked in a circus freak show.

From the OED-American Edition:
 
Quote
regime = a system of government, administration


DaveTard:

Quote
Gravity is only weak in low mass regimes. In high mass regimes it overwhelms the other forces...


Is he saying that gravity follows a two party system: Lilliputians and Beer-guzzling, Braut-eating Couch Potato-Guys?

Perhaps gravity is stronger around the Vatican.  In the Establishment-clause US, people just float away...

Bob

Date: 2006/06/20 19:44:06, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (GCT @ June 20 2006,14:00)
http://www.uncommondescent.com/index.php/archives/1235#comment-44591

Quote
How does one even infer universal common ancestry without knowing the mechanism of abiogenesis?

Shit, there goes my irony-meter.  It inserted "ID" for "universal common ancestry" before I could stop it.

Now I need to go and buy some new wallpaper.

Bob

Date: 2006/06/21 07:38:21, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Ha!   This is hilarious!

Why?  Well, a few months ago I got an email from Salthe.  He'd sent it round a few people who had expressed an interest in his work.  The email was his response to questions from a Chinese reporter.  It included his comments on evolution and ID.  In summary: the man who is "at the top of the Discovery Institute’s Dissent from Darwin honor roll" doesn't believe in ID either!

I remember I forwarded the email to someone (Wes?), because I thought it might be useful at some point.  It's in my computer at work so I'll have to retrieve it tomorrow.

Bob

Date: 2006/06/21 21:38:02, Link
Author: Bob O'H
OK, here's the dirt from Salthe.  It's from an email he sent out in March this year.  Apparently he had been contacted by someone in China and asked to do an interview by email.  Here are the relevant excerpts (the questions are in italics):

Quote
2.I wonder if you believe in ID? I have interviewed Alan Leshner, chief executive of AAAS, he said that ID has no science base and does not involve scientifically testable questions. And I want to know how do you think of  this.
I agree with him.  In my view, the basis of ID is that organisms are machines, and therefore require to have a designer. I do not believe that living systems are machines, and so there is no need for any idea about designers.

...

3.I heard that Discovery Institute is a leader to promote intelligent design, how do you think about this.
I do not know anything about this institute exept that neoDarwinians hate it.  I was led into signing the petition because it stated that natural selection is insufficient to explain biological evolution (which I think is a true statement).  The statement made no mention of ID or of religion.  I signed it because the idea that neoDarwinian theory cannot explain biological evolution is being suppressed by evolutionary biologists, and this petition was an opportunity to make that view visible in general.

...

6.Last question is how do you think about teach evolution or ID in school.
There is no place for ID in ordinary schools (only in religious schools if they want it).  Biological evolution should be taught as part of biology.  And the neoDarwinian theory needs to be taught as well, but it should be emphasized that it is only the currently favored theory.


I think there's enough material in there for Cordova to work on and explain why Salthe has a brilliant mind.

Bob

Date: 2006/06/23 03:41:06, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Another test of the robustness of your ironymeters:

Lutepisc on "fanciful speculation"

Read the comment, and then try and work out what book he's on about.

Bob

Date: 2006/06/23 07:10:38, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I must have missed something.  Eight new topics on UD yesterday, and two more already today.  What balls-up did miss that they are trying to hide?

Bob

Date: 2006/06/25 10:21:50, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Chris Hyland @ June 25 2006,14:17)
Quote
it'd be interesting to hear from Chris Hyland, Bob OH, Tiax, & Jack Krebs as to whether DT is representing his treatment of them accurately.
In my case I can't argue with that, all my comments appear immediately so I'm guessing I'm not on the moderation list.

I agree, it sounds reasonable.  To be honest, I think it's reasonable that the UD moderators is a bit more careful about those of us who are a part of the Evil Enemy: it makes it easier to keep the discussions on their own topics without being trolled.

In practice, alas, most of the moderation is done by DaveTard, and most of the discussion vacillates between sycophancy and nonsense, with added bold tardiness.  

Egads!  Figo has just butted a Dutchman, and didn't get a red card!

But you're seeing red: get outta here! -dt

Date: 2006/06/25 19:36:20, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (argystokes @ June 25 2006,17:38)
Quote (Richardthughes @ June 25 2006,15:13)
Quote (Joseph Beres @ June 25 2006,16:38)
From dave
     
Quote
[Admin Announcement] Get Back to Intelligent Design

I’ve been lax in keeping the topic here on intelligent design and away from everyone’s favorite religion (or lack thereof). I’m as guilty as anyone. To remedy this situation I’m going to be deleting any comments I see with gratuitous references to religion until further notice. I’ll make an exception for any of our authors who’ve PhDs in both theology and mathematics.


PhDs in theology and mathematics huh? Guess that leaves Dembski out.

Dembski has a 13 page CV.

Get a grip. May I suggest a 14th page to include what he had for lunch and top 5 breeds of Dog?

That's not really very long.  I've seen CVs over 100 pages.  Of course, that requires extensive publishing in peer reviewed literature.

But I bet those guys didn't list every lecture they'd been asked to give.

Bob

Date: 2006/06/26 19:43:57, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Is DaveScot doing this deliberately?  From ID Defined:
Quote
ID is controversial because of the implications of its evidence, rather than the significant weight of its evidence.


Indeed.

Bob

Date: 2006/06/30 22:38:43, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Dembski's skating on thin ice.  He's complaining about someone who (a) appears to be less than honest in a book review on Amazon, and (b) dares to say that someone with a PhD in biology is talking rubbish, when they aren't themselves qualified.

Turn your irony-meters off before looking.

Bob

Date: 2006/06/30 23:12:12, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Richardthughes @ June 30 2006,10:36)
Quote (Wesley R. Elsberry @ June 30 2006,09:50)
Apparently anybody can join the discussions on the weblog set up to discuss Allen MacNeill's "intelligent design" course at Cornell University. But be sure to read the ground rules for discussion. I don't know how the co-moderation thing there might work, but you might consider copying any comment made there to a comment here, too, just to have a backup.

I put this up:

...

but it looks like there's a moderation queue? How novel, for an ID blog.

Allen MacNeill's on our side.  I think the moderation is because the site is primarily intended to support his course, so he wants some control so that doesn't get too heated, especially with outsiders getting involved.

Or perhaps he's just worried in case PZ and Lenny turn up.

Bob

Date: 2006/07/01 10:11:35, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Bob O'H @ July 01 2006,03:38)
Dembski's skating on thin ice.  He's complaining about someone who (a) appears to be less than honest in a book review on Amazon, and (b) dares to say that someone with a PhD in biology is talking rubbish, when they aren't themselves qualified.

Turn your irony-meters off before looking.

Bob

Something I didn't mention was that I tried to post the following on this thread:

Quote
It's terrible what you can get away with in Amazon reviews, isn't it?

Bob


It has mysteriously not shown up.  Now why would an innocent comment like that be censored?  :-)

Bob

Date: 2006/07/02 03:30:22, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote ("Rev Dr" Lenny Flank @ July 01 2006,19:55)
Hence, we have creationists blaiming evolution for Hitler, for Columbine, and anything else evil in the world (including Carol Clouser, who thinks evolution is evil because it makes hyaenas eat the poor zebras).

Creationists blame evolution for Carol Clouser?!  She'll be impressed.

Bob

Date: 2006/07/02 19:35:36, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Bugger!  I turn my ironymeter off, and moved it into a different room, and this still made it explode:

 
Quote
Why do they have to be so rude?

If you’re not rude often enough you can have your membership in the card carrying atheist club revoked. :-) -ds

Date: 2006/07/02 19:54:34, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Go Dave!

Dave: what part of "The case cannot be heard by a jury because juries are not available for cases seeking an injunction." are you having difficulty with?

Gads, man!  You can't even quote-mine correctly: you're meant to leave out the stuff shows that you're wrong.

Bob

Date: 2006/07/04 08:11:45, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Alan Fox @ July 04 2006,01:50)
I have found it very difficult to be consistent at by blog, where to draw the line on foul language. I am now using the rule, "anything I would feel embarrassed about my mother reading has to go, everything else is OK."

Well, it works for me.

Yeah, but what does your mother think about it?

More seriously, it was an interesting experiment: thanks for trying it.  Sorry I didn't come to play, but I just found a nice solid brick wall to bang my head against, so the virtual DaveScot version had lost its appeal.

Bob

Date: 2006/07/05 08:29:34, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (tacitus @ July 05 2006,00:52)
His main claims to fame are his infowars.com web site, his arrest for disturbing the peace while refusing to be fingerprinted for his driver's license, and for sneaking into the elistist Bohemian Grove and taking some very shaky and indistinct footage of the "pagan rituals" being performed there.

Oh, him!  The story of the Bohemian Grove escapade is told by Jon Ronson in his book Them: Adventure with Extremists.  A great book, in which Ronson meets several nutters, and Denis Healey, who's responsible for setting up the secret conspiracy that really rules the world.

Bob

Date: 2006/07/05 08:51:16, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (guthrie @ July 05 2006,08:03)
Then theres this paper:


cached from google

Which appears to be a pukka science paper, but I cannot see how it got past peer review.  With statements like:
...

It's not in a good journal: I checked the impact factor, and it's towards the bottom of the pile in cell biology (124th out of 153 journals).

Bob

Date: 2006/07/06 07:16:17, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (guthrie @ July 06 2006,02:35)
Denis Healey?  Wasn't he a minister in the Thatcher junta?  Doesnt strike me as being a likely candidate for running the world.

No, Healey was on the other side.  Think big eyebrows.

Bob

Date: 2006/07/06 09:38:13, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (guthrie @ July 06 2006,12:45)
Quote (Bob O'H @ July 06 2006,12:16)
Quote (guthrie @ July 06 2006,02:35)
Denis Healey?  Wasn't he a minister in the Thatcher junta?  Doesnt strike me as being a likely candidate for running the world.

No, Healey was on the other side.  Think big eyebrows.

Bob

ooops, your right.  ahh well.  My only excuse is that I was a child in the 80's.  

So in that case, how come he was trying to take over the world?

Well he wasn't having much success at the ballot box.  :-)

He was a founder of the Bilderberg group, which is seen as a big conspiracy to rule the world.

Bob

Date: 2006/07/06 19:11:59, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (stevestory @ July 06 2006,19:27)
Quote (dhogaza @ July 06 2006,18:39)
Oh, JanieBelle totally has him by the balls, that's why I wondered above if she's what she claims to be, rather than a clever imposter out to impale Sal while disguised as a 17 year old who claims to be mostly clueless about science.

Here's more:

 
Quote
Ok, I get your drift. But isn’t that a calculation of one particular hunk of material becoming alive? Wouldn’t you have to multiply that times all the hunks of material in the universe? The universe is pretty darned big, so by that reasoning, it almost seems like it would equal out to 1/1, which would mean that life would not only probably happen, but it would almost HAVE to happen “accidently”. Not that that rules out design, just that it doesn’t seem like it rules out random chance, either.

Sorry if I’m missing something, I’m just trying to get an idea here. (I’m blonde, whatdaya want?)

Thanks again, by the way, for taking so much of your time to explain this to me. It’s really very kind.


Oh, my, how good.

Hmmm....you guys might be right... that is a suspicious comment of hers...she might be setting Sal up for that technique where you rip someone's balls off in one move.




Whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Egads!  It's Wayne Rooney!

Bob

Date: 2006/07/08 08:46:51, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Six posts already today, and of such profundity that I can't tell my XX from my YY.  What balls-up are they trying to hide now?

Bob

Date: 2006/07/08 20:20:21, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (mcc @ July 08 2006,17:25)
Quote (Bob O'H @ July 08 2006,13:46)
Six posts already today, and of such profundity that I can't tell my XX from my YY.  What balls-up are they trying to hide now?

Bob

Hm. I'm XY, what does that mean?

Man, that's a difficult question.

Bob

Date: 2006/07/09 20:15:04, Link
Author: Bob O'H
DaveTard doesn't just get his science from SciAm.  He also get is from science fiction:
Quote
Astrobiology used to be the domain of hard science fiction and that’s where I picked it up over the course of 40 years (a great many scientists like Sagan moonlight as SciFi authors).


Dave: what do you think the "fiction" part means?

Bob

Date: 2006/07/10 06:59:06, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Richardthughes @ July 10 2006,09:14)
Speaking of ‘not being consistent’:

http://www.uncommondescent.com/index.php/archives/445#comment-11687

 
Quote


Scientists in general need to be kept on a tight leash. Atheist scientists hold no moral absolutes and there’s no telling what they’ll do in the name of scientific discovery. Christian scientists as well will do unspeakable, completely unChristlike things to animal subjects that just makes me want to put the heartless SOB’s in a cage and do the same things to them so they can see how it feels. Christ, son of God or not, set an example we should all try to live by and he never caused any living thing any pain - all he did was help and heal.
Comment by DaveScot — November 1, 2005 @ 12:22 pm


“Atheist scientists hold no moral absolutes and there’s no telling what they’ll do in the name of scientific discovery” – But Davetard, Honey, aren’t you agnostic? So presumably you too “hold no moral absolutes” and so “there’s no telling what you’ll do”.

Twat.

I'm sorry, but isn't our Dave being consistent here?  For once.

Bob

Date: 2006/07/12 19:43:35, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Sal's rocking the boat:

Quote
What if the artifacts for this front-loaded evolution are still stored somewhere like a software module no longer in use. We could, in principle, attempt to trigger the software module. If we even partially succeed in triggering these software modules on the way to getting a placental to become a marsupial or a marsupial become a placental, we have evidence of front loaded evolution.


Yes, he's actually suggesting an experiment!

Bob

Date: 2006/07/24 09:34:21, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Egads!  I go away to Canada to a meeting for a week ("proper" science.  Well, statisics anyway).  And now I'm back I find out I've missed all of the fun.

*sniff*

Bob

Date: 2006/07/25 21:32:58, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Fish, barrel, BANG!

Quote
I have no particular reason to believe that men are more intelligent than women. On the other hand, I can’t say twithout a doubt that we are equally intelligent.


Bob

Date: 2006/07/26 06:45:25, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Someone's got a lot to learn:
http://www.uncommondescent.com/index.php/archives/1358#comment-49706
Quote
#

From moderator Denyse: Whoops! I don’t think this should develop into a discussion of the merits or otherwise of Calvinism. Van Till is no longer a Calvinist but is still a Darwinist. I am now going to log in again and post my own comment.

Comment by O'Leary — July 26, 2006 @ 10:36 am


How are you going to stop a religious war breaking out, eh?

Bob

Date: 2006/07/27 07:49:57, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Too easy...

post 35 on the Van Till thread:...
Quote
#

With respect, we do not invoke God ever.

...

Comment by idnet.com.au — July 27, 2006 @ 7:01 am


and, four posts later...
Quote
#

Food for thought…

Speaking of Jesus Christ, Colossians Ch. 1 in the New Testament says:

   16: For by him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things were created by him and for him. 17: He is before all things, and in him all things hold together.

The literal greek in the portion I emphasized indicates an active \”sustaining\” of nature/creation, by Christ.

Comment by Scott — July 27, 2006 @ 11:16 am


Come on folks, at least make an effort to hide it!

Bob

Date: 2006/07/28 08:10:20, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (jeannot @ July 28 2006,12:25)
Yes, Davetard, gene exist, didn't you know?

So the word "program" is an evidence of ID?
Next, it will be "DNA", "Gene", "Protein"...  ???

Psst, Scott isn't DaveTard.  There's another one as well.

Bob

Date: 2006/07/29 02:18:45, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (mcc @ July 28 2006,23:04)
MSNBC USES "COMPUTER PROGRAM" METAPHOR-- EVOLUTION DISPROVED

Bugger.  I suppose I'll have to start looking for a new job, then.

Bob

Date: 2006/07/29 21:45:21, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I'm beginning to like the church lady.  She evokes a subtler humour, but we can laugh at her anyway.

A case in point:
http://www.uncommondescent.com/index.php/archives/1369

In which she argues that the design doesn't have to be perfect, only optimal.  In an effort to hide any link to Christianity, she titles the thread "God woun’t'a dun it dat way?".

I was thinking of commenting, and pointing out a couple of problems, but I think the first two comments do a much better job of dis-mantling the argument:

Quote
2 Comments »

  1.

     “…we can assume that any designer, even an omnipotent one, must work within the constraints that are created by the very nature of the medium…” :

     Does the medium create the constraints? Then we might ask why the omnipotent creator, who also created the medium, would create a medium with such constraints. it just pushes the question back a jump, but I think its a legitimate question. However, a legitimate question doesn’t necessitate the silly answer “God wouldn’t have done it that way…” It could however, lead to a fruitful philosophical dialogue about the nature of the material vs. ideal worlds, etc.

     Comment by tinabrewer — July 29, 2006 @ 9:01 pm
  2.

     I think we need to be careful before saying that the designer had to work within the constraints. In the same breath as tinabrewer’s comments, only stronger, why would the omnipotent creator, who also created the medium, create it with these constraints. Or, to be more blunt, where did the laws of nature come from? It is similar to asking in mathematics, where do the axioms come from? Are axioms something that we must attribute to a certain system, or are we free to pick and choose as we please?

     Of course, as most any advanced mathematician or scientist knows, it is the axioms we choose which determine the behavior of the system. But, we are free to choose those axioms arbitrarily. In doing geometry, I can choose which version of parallel’s, if any, I want to work with. It is once I have chosen these axioms that I am then burdened with their constraints, but I was still the one who chose the axioms.

     In the same way, the creator who created the medium must first have chosen the “axioms”, or laws of nature, and then developed his body of work inside those constraints. This differs from Shakespeare or any other artisan because they have to create within the constraints that have been set by others and thus are limited in what they can design. I disagree, however, that this is the case with the creator, and thus I do not know how much understanding we could venture to gain from such an endeavor as the one proposed.

     Comment by tburus — July 30, 2006 @ 12:29 am


I wonder, are the UD masses getting restless?

Bob
[EDIT: typo removed.  Can you see from where?]

Date: 2006/07/29 21:53:08, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Oh, I forgot to mention this little titbit:

Quote
Phil Johnson, the lawyer who put ID on the map, is currently seeking more input from the arts community (he calls it Wedge II).

I agree that the ID debate will develop along more useful lines when more people from the arts participate.

Artsies (those who are not crazy) understand some aspects of intelligent original design better than most people.


I guess this means that the engineers are out now.

Bob

Date: 2006/08/01 19:38:24, Link
Author: Bob O'H
http://www.uncommondescent.com/index.php/archives/1370#comment-50694

Quote
1. The people promoting the Teach the Controversy initiative do not in any way endorse or require the Of Pandas and People book.


Why do I associate comments like this with French ducks?

Bob

Date: 2006/08/02 08:57:26, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (stevestory @ Aug. 02 2006,11:19)
You claim you've got 500 'scientists' who stand up against Darwin. You've been at this for 15 years. You've spent over $10,000,000.

No, they're up to 600 now.  You're not following the revelation-a-minute world of ID, are you?

Bob

P.S. There are now 749 Steves, BTW.  That's not much for the millions of dollars, euros and pounds (Sterling) money is spent on evolutionary biology, is it?  :-)

Date: 2006/08/03 06:07:59, Link
Author: Bob O'H
http://www.uncommondescent.com/index.php/archives/1387#comment-51094

Quote
#

“Whether or not past scientists believed something or not makes no difference.”

Certainly it does.
Dembski, Behe, etc disagree with NDE for intellectual reasons based off of the evidence that they have viewed. They, therefore, believe that some of the strong support voice for NDE is done more for philosophic reasons than scientific reasons.
...
Comment by Doug — August 3, 2006 @ 10:15 am

Ah,so Doug thinks that Dembski and Behe are no longer scientists.

Bob

Date: 2006/08/05 04:46:05, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (k.e @ Aug. 05 2006,08:45)
Quote
2. Nonetheless, the typical Darwinist continues to insist that only ignorance or some vast conspiracy among pious wingnuts explains growing public disbelief in his system.



Yes, Dense Denies.........and your point?

I do enjoy her "as a journalist" comments: "as a journalist I know how to use Google.  And because I'm a journalist I don't need to understand what I read, or make sure my arguments make sense".

I do still miss the ebola-boy taunts, though.

Bob

Date: 2006/08/07 07:17:19, Link
Author: Bob O'H
http://www.uncommondescent.com/index.php/archives/1407#comment-51932
Quote
#

I believe it was Paul Nelson (really) who said something to the effect of:

If intelligent agency WERE a causal factor in the history of life on earth (certainly a live, logical possibility), would materialism allow us to discover that?

I think the answer is no, and therefore the deficiency of the materialistic framework becomes obvious.

...

Comment by ultimate175 — August 7, 2006 @ 11:04 am


I think he's just said that Dembski's Design Inference is bollocks.

Bob

Date: 2006/08/08 20:22:12, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Oooh!  The knives are coming out for Roughgarden now!

Quote
(I forgot which direction the sex change went, I think it was man to woman, Denyse O'leary probably knows)


The change was Jonathan to Joan, and that last comment was unkind!  How dare you, make us laugh like that!

Bob

Date: 2006/08/09 19:14:09, Link
Author: Bob O'H
http://www.uncommondescent.com/index.php/archives/1428
Quote




To which I responded:
Quote
Wow!  Best thread yet!


I bet they censor my comment, and then delete the whole thread, claiming it never happened.  The bar-stewards! :-)

Bob

Date: 2006/08/10 08:49:08, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Tom Ames @ Aug. 10 2006,08:22)
Quote (Bob O'H @ Aug. 09 2006,22:14)
http://www.uncommondescent.com/index.php/archives/1428
 
Quote




To which I responded:
 
Quote
Wow!  Best thread yet!


I bet they censor my comment, and then delete the whole thread, claiming it never happened.  The bar-stewards! :-)

Bob

What was in this thread? (As you predicted, it's gone now.)

Exactly what I put in the quote.

I guess BarryA cocked up somewhere (he had the next post).  I just can't resist being silly over something like that.

Bob

Date: 2006/08/11 05:00:35, Link
Author: Bob O'H
After Joseph's comment, I decided to act:

Quote


<blockquote>ID doesn’t say anything about “God”. Only people who don’t understand ID make that connection.</blockquote>

I see. So this is a statement by someone who don’t understand ID:
"Intelligent design is just the Logos theology of John's Gospel restated in the idiom of information theory,"

Bob


That's not going to see the light of day at UD, is it?

Bob
P.S. Apollo: You're trying to get yourself banned, aren't you?  Well, it's fun watching it, and you'll be welcome to take up a more permanent residence here!

Date: 2006/08/12 05:15:55, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (lkeithlu @ Aug. 12 2006,10:06)
Bob posted:

After Joseph's comment, I decided to act:

Quote


<blockquote>ID doesn’t say anything about “God”. Only people who don’t understand ID make that connection.</blockquote>

I see. So this is a statement by someone who don’t understand ID:
"Intelligent design is just the Logos theology of John's Gospel restated in the idiom of information theory,"

Bob


That's not going to see the light of day at UD, is it?

I can't find it-did it ever appear?

Nope, I posted it again today (well, I changed it a bit: I suggested that Joseph check out who make the quote).  If it still doesn't appear, I might prod Barry "I welcome dissenting views" A to see what happened.

Bob

Date: 2006/08/13 03:12:50, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Ah, my jibe at Joseph did get through:
http://www.uncommondescent.com/index.php/archives/1431#comment-52964
So credit to BarryA fo not censoring everything!

The responses are typically amusing (BarryA appears not to understand the verb "to be").

Bob

Date: 2006/08/13 19:55:17, Link
Author: Bob O'H
http://www.uncommondescent.com/index.php/archives/1449

Quote
It was known in Haeckel’s day that his embryo drawings were faked, but these drawings persisted in public-school textbooks for more than a century. How could this have possibly happened in a theoretically “self-correcting” scientific discipline?


Ah, GilDodgen thinks that writing school textbooks is a scientific discipline.  Do textbook writers write papers about their research into writing textbooks ("Stimulants and Statistics: Does caffeine consumption improve the writing of metaphores to explain experimental design?  A double-blind study")?

Or is it only writing of public-school textbooks that is a scientific discipline?  No wonder education is so poor in the US if textbook writers are using THE SCIENTIFIC METHOD!!!!!

Bob

Date: 2006/08/14 19:39:35, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Richardthughes @ Aug. 14 2006,22:59)
Exlpanitory Filter Failiure..

http://www.uncommondescent.com/index.php/archives/1454

It's a parody, you bellends*

I read that and thought you were linking to this:
http://www.uncommondescent.com/index.php/archives/1442#comment-53133
They can't even recognise their own parodies.

Bob

Date: 2006/08/15 19:56:26, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (thurdl01 @ Aug. 15 2006,14:19)
Quote (blipey @ Aug. 15 2006,11:07)
Quote
For instance, I’m starting a website (www.overwhelmingevidence.com — not yet up and running)


What's the point of that?  Does cyberspace really need a vast collection of new posts with no comments?  ???

Also, isn't that the project that he claimed was the reason he stepped away from UD and handed it over to Davetard to begin with?  That was what, about 8-9 months ago now?

No, that project was to "... provide a suitable antidote to the Dover trial ...".  I'm sure there's a message in there somewhere about its progess.

Bob

Date: 2006/08/17 20:11:05, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (argystokes @ Aug. 17 2006,15:54)
Meanwhile, Joel is making posts utilizing my favorite of Waldorf Story's pictures:


<snip image>
Morans.

Oh, this is too good.  All pile on, and get yourselves banned.

Bob

Date: 2006/08/20 01:30:02, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Wonderpants @ Aug. 20 2006,05:13)
Just submitted this at UD, on the off chance it gets through:

"Frankly, I am bored with this topic and will delete future posts on it. Most blog readers will want to hear about issues around ACTUAL evidence for Darwin’s theory. Anyone got some?"

I've a better suggestion, why don't you provide some actual evidence for ID?

And even boredom didn't stop her from posting another bit of idiocy, did it?

I posted something similar: I'll race you: see who gets posted first!

Bob

Date: 2006/08/20 19:51:48, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Bob O'H @ Aug. 20 2006,06:30)
Quote (Wonderpants @ Aug. 20 2006,05:13)
Just submitted this at UD, on the off chance it gets through:

"Frankly, I am bored with this topic and will delete future posts on it. Most blog readers will want to hear about issues around ACTUAL evidence for Darwin’s theory. Anyone got some?"

I've a better suggestion, why don't you provide some actual evidence for ID?

And even boredom didn't stop her from posting another bit of idiocy, did it?

I posted something similar: I'll race you: see who gets posted first!

Bob

Hahaha-ha!

We all lose: neither of our posts were put up, and instead the article was subtly altered...

Perhaps the Church Lady was inundated with so much information that she had to take a break to read it all.

Bob

Date: 2006/08/21 06:01:24, Link
Author: Bob O'H
He's BACK!!!!!

Bob

Date: 2006/08/23 08:02:01, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Richardthughes @ Aug. 23 2006,09:46)
Tom English kills 'frontloading":

http://www.uncommondescent.com/index.php/archives/1481#comment-55271
...

And I think this reply may have moved beyond irony:
Quote
#

Tom English: The researchers set up an evolutionary program in which the population was a collection of checkers strategies

And they remained checker strategies. You couldn’t use them to win at poker.

Nobody here denies that natural selection is real. The debate is about how much it explains.

Comment by tribune7 — August 23, 2006 @ 8:06 am


Bob

Date: 2006/08/24 06:29:56, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Richardthughes @ Aug. 24 2006,10:29)
DT:

http://www.uncommondescent.com/index.php/archives/1491#comment-55740

Quote
Music appreciation is intensely subjective. And since the appreciation is subjective so too must be the composition otherwise everyone could be a wildly successful composer just by following formulaic procedures. I think the mathematical connection pretty much starts and ends with simple relationships between notes on the scale and also the way the notes combine to form harmonic sounds.



Time signatures and dynamics?

I think you're Bach-ing up the wrong tree.

Sorry

Bob

Date: 2006/08/24 09:43:32, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Bebbo @ Aug. 24 2006,12:11)
I'm beginning to wonder if it's not mere coincidence that Denyse hasn't posted since DaveScot re-appeared. Anyone want to bet on how long it'll be till Denyse's name gets taken off the UD banner?

Perhaps they'll replace it with a photo of DaveTard himself.

Bob

Date: 2006/08/24 19:14:37, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I've just gone through this snippet at PT:

Quote

Comment #122521

Posted by Collin DuCrane on August 24, 2006 06:48 PM (e)

Actually the bathroom here at pandasthumb.org is much nicer than the one over at uncommondescent.com ;)
Comment #122522

Posted by Sir_Toejam on August 24, 2006 06:51 PM (e)

that’s true, at UD the “bathroom” consists of a bottomless pit.
Comment #122527

Posted by Collin DuCrane on August 24, 2006 06:55 PM (e)

True, the only redeeming quality is getting to watch DS try to clean it.


Bob

Date: 2006/08/25 09:17:02, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (deadman_932 @ Aug. 25 2006,09:00)
Quote
So if each individual can be considered a population (within a population) then it is populations that drive evolution.
Comment by Joseph — August 24, 2006 @ 9:31 pm


My brain just shrieked and tried to leap out of my skull

A couple of weeks ago, someone claimed that Joseph was a parody, and saying how stupid someone was to argue against him.  Dang, I can't find the post.

Bob

Date: 2006/08/25 20:48:57, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (argystokes @ Aug. 25 2006,14:32)
Bob, I think that comment was in the Darwin Youth thread.

http://www.uncommondescent.com/index.php/archives/1454#comment-53913
Ah, thanks.  Of course it's not clear if that post was serious...

Bob

Date: 2006/08/27 09:10:12, Link
Author: Bob O'H
The Church Lady is back:
http://www.uncommondescent.com/index.php/archives/1520

And no sign of a DaveTard post.  Has anyone ever seen the two of them together in the same place?  Hmm...

Bob

Date: 2006/08/28 19:13:02, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Distressing signals:
http://www.uncommondescent.com/index.php/archives/1523
Quote
The IDEA club at UVa had a meeting September 22, 2005 before 100 students (with me as invited speaker). Then, in the summer, an article referencing that meeting and the club’s activities throughout the year were highlighted in an article which I link to here: IDEA UVa adviser, molecular geneticist and biochemist doubts Darwin.


Where's the distress?  Could it be in the letter from members of the faculty?  Or could it be this:

Quote
Following the lecture…there was a question and answer session. Students…faculty…and members of the public…denounced Cordova for his inability to present hard evidence supporting intelligent design. One U-V-A professor criticized Cordova for relying on out-of-context quotes from a few select scientists for his claims.

Even strong believers in intelligent design and fundamental Christians…I.D.E.A. co-founders John Copper…and Kristine Hereford…expressed some disappointment in Cordova’s lecture. Copper says…”I feel like he could have done a better job. There could have been more numbers and things like that.” Hereford says “There wasn’t much pointed evidence.”


Sal really shouldn't quote his own reviews: it's bad form.

Bob

Date: 2006/08/29 09:00:27, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Out of boredom I wandered back over to the Blyth thread, and found this:
http://www.uncommondescent.com/index.php/archives/1518#comment-57129
Quote
#

In the OP scordova wrote:

“My hypothesis is that Edward Blyth should have been given far more credit for the theory of natural selection. Because Blyth was a creationist, he did not see natural selection as an adequate mechanism for biological innovation. He believed natural selection as primarily a means of preserving species, not primarily creating large scale biological innovations. Even though a creationist, he seemed open to some forms of evolution (as creationists are today), and it would be hard to argue that he believed in the absolute fixity of species. Blyth’s position on natural selection would be consistent with many IDers and creationists today.”

Well, let’s do it then, give Edward Blyth more credit. But shouldn’t we then in all fairness also give him more blame?

scordova quoting Blyth (1836):

“…. The original form of a species is unquestionably better adapted to its natural habits than any modification of that form; and, as the sexual passions excite to rivalry and conflict, and the stronger must always prevail over the weaker, the latter, in a state of nature, is allowed but few opportunities of continuing its race.”

Oh, my, oh my, what have we here? The very proof that we should give credit, where it is due. Clearly, “social Darwinism” is a misnomer, ir should be called “social Blythism”.

This most important information should change a few things. As you all know, Coral Ridge Ministries have released a video and book called “Darwin’s deadly legacy”, which traces social Darwinism from Farwin to Hitler. But clearly the title should be changed to “Blyth’s deadly legacy”, shouldn’t it?

And imagine that we all thought that Edward Blyth was such a gentle and good-tempered human! No, we must the root of evil right, where it is: amongst the evil creationists that have supplied the evolutionists with the idea of “struggle for survival”.

Yes, indeed, credit should be given where it’s due.

By the way, Blyth wrote in 1835 that

“[s]ome arctic species are white, which have no enemy to fear, as the polar bear, the gyrfalcon, the arctic eagle-owl, the snowy owl, and even the stoat; and therefore, in these, the whiteness can only be to preserve the temperature of their bodies …”

If Blyth had done a bit further of thinking, he might have figured out that the whiteness of these predators could have served to make them less easy to spot for their prey.

Comment by Poul Willy Eriksen — August 29, 2006 @ 10:49 am


Mr. Eriksen appears to be Scandinavian, and fortunately we have good medical services up here, so they willbe able to operate to remove his tongue from his cheek.

Bob

Date: 2006/08/31 06:51:28, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I wonder if one can study virology in Finnish jails.

Bob

Date: 2006/08/31 08:20:21, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Glen Davidson @ Aug. 31 2006,12:37)
Quote
….if truth be told, evolution hasn’t yielded many practical or commercial benefits. Yes, bacteria evolve drug resistance, and yes, we must take countermeasures, but beyond that there is not much to say. Evolution cannot help us predict what new vaccines to manufacture because microbes evolve unpredictably. But hasn’t evolution helped guide animal and plant breeding? Not very much. Most improvement in crop plants and animals occurred long before we knew anything about evolution, and came about by people following the genetic principle of ‘like begets like’. Even now, as its practitioners admit, the field of quantitative genetics has been of little value in helping improve varieties. Future advances will almost certainly come from transgenics, which is not based on evolution at all.


Attributed to Jerry Coyne at UD.

I have no idea how badly, or well, the above was quote-mined. <snip>

It's accurate: it's from a book review.  I don't totally agree with him: evolutionary theory has helped in managing pests and diseases in crops, for example.  

Coyne does make the point that macro-evolution hasn't been of much practical benefit, and that's what creationists etc. object to, but goes on to observe that they don't object on utilitarian grounds.

Coyne ends his review with this:

Quote
In the end, the true value of evolutionary biology is not practical but explanatory. It answers, in the most exquisitely simple and parsimonious way, the age-old question: "How did we get here?" It gives us our family history writ large, connecting us with every other species, living or extinct, on Earth. It shows how everything from frogs to fleas got here via a few easily grasped biological processes. And that, after all, is quite an accomplishment.


Bob

Date: 2006/09/01 20:03:12, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (dhogaza @ Sep. 01 2006,13:38)
PaV starts a new thread ...
 
Quote
the more I read and keep up with experimental evidence, the more I question the existence of Natural Selection.

These boys don't get out in the real world much, do they?
Here's the thread...

They can't even read the article they cite.  No one pointed out that PaV gets it totally wrong.

Bob
P.S. I've just searched Origin of Species for hidden messages, and found out that it says "Bill Dembski is a credulous fool".  I guess this proves that I'm right to worship Darwin.

Date: 2006/09/03 05:46:09, Link
Author: Bob O'H
MikeFNQ seems to have finally cracked under the sheer weight of the tardity at UD:

http://www.uncommondescent.com/index.php/archives/1539#comment-58231
Quote
#

When I first started to read and contribute to this blog a number of people, both ID and otherwise, correctly bemoaned the sad tendency of people on both sides to play the “Hitler Card”. Hitler used and abused Christianity. Hitler used and abused science. The maturity of both sides to realise that Hitler proves nothing about Christianity or Darwinism was refreshing.

Unfortunately some individuals let their desperate desire to attack the other side cloud their judgement, and in they rush. So much for maturity and integrity.

Comment by MikeFNQ — September 3, 2006 @ 12:51 am


http://www.uncommondescent.com/index.php/archives/1541#comment-58232
Quote
#

I can’t help but laugh at the editor’s desperate need to remove posts that hold Ms O’Leary up to the ridicule she deserved.

Comment by MikeFNQ — September 3, 2006 @ 1:01 am


http://www.uncommondescent.com/index.php/archives/1541#comment-58234
Quote
#

Ms O’Leary

If you ARE the editor doing the deletions then I was wrong. You are dishonest rather than just boneheaded.

Comment by MikeFNQ — September 3, 2006 @ 1:05 am


Bob
EDIT: that last quote is now a quote, not a code sample!

Date: 2006/09/03 07:52:10, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (lkeithlu @ Sep. 03 2006,11:49)
Odd; when I check those links, Mikefnq's comments are not there. Have they been deleted?

Excuse me, I'm trying to look shocked.

It looks like Mikefnq conveniently flipped out when the UD moderators were all out enjoying the long weekend, doing whatever it is IDers do in their spare time.

Bob

Date: 2006/09/04 06:36:09, Link
Author: Bob O'H
http://www.stoplyingtous.com/2006....g-to-us
Quote
With the problems in culture so vast, our topics will also be extremely vast. Discussing teenage sexuality, drug use, all the way over to the Middle East conflict; the topics will be varied and mostly written from an Orthodox viewpoint of Christianity.


Greek Orthodox, or Russian Orthodox?

Bob

Date: 2006/09/05 09:18:03, Link
Author: Bob O'H
What I want to know is: what did they cross the road with?  And why are they so interested in road genetics?

Bob

Date: 2006/09/05 09:25:26, Link
Author: Bob O'H
On this thread about Nick Matzke's online discussion with Turkish journalist Mustafa Akyol, we can read this at the moment:

http://www.uncommondescent.com/index.php/archives/1552#comment-58524
Quote
#

Mr. matazke is filled with bovine fecal matter.

Comment by avocationist — September 4, 2006 @ 11:02 pm


I wonder if the Church Lady is prepared to remove comments from one of their own.  Well, I'm off to bed, so you'll have to find out for yourselves.

Bob

Date: 2006/09/09 06:13:19, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Another Record Month for Tardity!

Congratulations all on another record month in all the metrics! We continue to create a larger and larger tard-pile. Thanks to our tireless tards for all the great stupidity and a special thanks to our members for all the great uncommon tardity!

BobTard

Date: 2006/09/09 21:18:39, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Alan Fox @ Sep. 10 2006,01:28)
Quote
#

Carlos is no longer with this forum. –WmAD

Comment by William Dembski — September 10, 2006 @ 1:19 am


Plus ça change...

Unless it's for something unpublished, I can only think it's because of this:

Quote
Why is it so hard to believe that ID is based on evidence of informational complexity and probability?

Speaking strictly for myself, it’s because I think the notions of “informational complexity and probability” at work in ID theory are vacuous by contemporary standards of empirical and mathematical precision.


One momentary slip, and look what happens.

I think that was a mistake: Carlos was actually engaging with people at UD, and was showing that one could have an intellectual discussion about ID, where views could be chan..  

Ah, I get it.

Bob

Date: 2006/09/10 03:39:21, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote ("Rev Dr" Lenny Flank @ Sep. 10 2006,07:48)
When the IRA bombs London, the Brits don't bomb Boston for giving money to the IRA.  They arrest the people involved and jail them.

Or send the SAS to shoot them in Gibraltar.

I'm afraid we weren't terribly innocent either:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki....taries.

Bob

Date: 2006/09/10 19:34:54, Link
Author: Bob O'H
OA:

Someone with the delightful name of cjok raised this point:
http://www.uncommondescent.com/index.php/archives/1576#comment-59899

DaveScot hasn't replied.

Bob

Date: 2006/09/11 05:13:04, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I guess he'd expect to see a guy with a long white beard with his hand stuck in a tophat.

Oh, hang on.  Rowan Atkinson use to do a sketch about that.

Bob

Date: 2006/09/11 19:57:57, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Today, such people pride themselves on being good non-conformists for gurgling the treacle administered to them by an establishment.


I'm a non-conformist too!  I don't conform to non-conformist views!

I don't gurgle treacle either.  Gargling it is much more fun.

Bob

Date: 2006/09/19 05:10:09, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Wesley R. Elsberry @ Sep. 19 2006,02:22)
Quote

“only an editor will be able to approve contributions. Otherwise the texts risk being wrong,”

We need to get some ID friendly people on the editorial staff.


Arrrrgggghhhh.

Well, it is speak like a pirate day.

Bob

Date: 2006/09/19 19:55:31, Link
Author: Bob O'H
DaveScot chimes in with a list of top regions for searches for evolution and ID:
http://www.uncommondescent.com/index.php/archives/1628#comment-62893

Arden will instantly remember a previous occasion where the list of top regions was analysed by an ID expert.  We'll wait to see who follows in the great man's(*) footsteps.

Bob
(*) no, not Arden.  Not to say he isn't a Great Man, but rather that his followers aren't as funny.

Date: 2006/09/20 07:36:18, Link
Author: Bob O'H
####, they're not biting.  So, to refresh Arden's memory:
http://www.pandasthumb.org/archives/2006/06/something_rotte.html

And, egads, it hasn't been deleted:
http://www.uncommondescent.com/index.php/archives/1226
Ah, happy days.

Bob

Date: 2006/09/22 08:30:33, Link
Author: Bob O'H
http://www.uncommondescent.com/archives/1633#comment
(towards the bottom):

Quote
lucID  // Sep 22nd 2006 at 6:23 am

ScaryFacts

Not to let this turn into a blood feud. I’m glad you do find some enjoyment from reading the posts here. I certainly do. For the most part ID specific posts (such as involve biological, mathematical subjects etc, etc) should be taken literally and in a *slightly* more serious light. Other subjectsthat are clearly somewhat peripheral to the central issues discussed here (such as running the site etc, etc) may well contain sarcastic elements occasionally. Elsberry is certainly a thorn in the side of UD/ID (albeit somewhat of a small prick) and thus when the hilariously entertaining thought of bankrupting a gutter-snipe such as Elsberry is brought up, tears well up in our eyes and we know it too good to really be true. And as we are not nearly as vindictive as our Darwinian brethren, though the thought be pleasing the action would be beneath us.

I hope this bring some clarity to the issue. If not - well feel free to rant and we’ll just laugh.


Vindictive?  Well, I don't really need to say anything, do I?  

Bob

Date: 2006/09/26 19:49:57, Link
Author: Bob O'H
One thing caught my attention looking at the blogs (warning: your didn't think I could sink any lower in your esteem, I'm about to disprove it).

The two most recent posts are from yesterday (the 26th).  The previous post is from July.  Similarly the posts in the fora: a couple of recent ones, and then stuff from July or earlier.

According to Dembski, the site was "not yet up and running" on the 10th August (
link).  So how could people post blog entries and forum comments?

Curious.

Bob

Date: 2006/09/26 20:01:13, Link
Author: Bob O'H
ID book banning shock!

Yes, Pandas is a banned book, because it was removed from a Dover curriculum that it was never part of, and was removed from a library that it is still in.

I wish some of these guys would review my grant applications.

Bob

Date: 2006/09/27 05:26:46, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Richardthughes @ Sep. 27 2006,09:38)
Quote

There are currently 3 users and 7 guests online.
Online users
admin
oleary
Alan Fox


Same ol' same ol'!

That gave me an evil idea.  Alas, the usernames are not case sensitive, so I couldn't have Admin as a username.  But Administrator wasn't taken.  :-)

Any suggestions for what to do?  I don't want to make a total mess, but some gentle fun could be had.

Bob

Date: 2006/09/27 06:20:22, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Ha ha!!  I got banned first from overwhelmingevidence.com first!  Administator has been removed.

Na-na di na-naa!

Slightly more seriously, I'm sure the idea can be used later: telling DaveTard "you're outta here" or something.

Bob

Date: 2006/09/27 19:31:56, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Bing @ Sep. 27 2006,19:48)
So even if he invokes powerful space aliens or time travellers from our future it's all just "nudge-nudge wink-wink say-no-more it's G*d".

No, no.  It's DaveScot.  He is the Intelligent Designer.  You can tell by the way he breaks the SLoT at will.

Bob

Date: 2006/09/30 04:23:27, Link
Author: Bob O'H
It almost makes me want to go and change the Wiki censorship page.  :-)

Bob

Date: 2006/09/30 04:29:12, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Wow!  They've finally noticed that
underwhelming evidence is up and running.  Get with it, folks!  :-)

Bob

Date: 2006/09/30 19:41:04, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (stevestory @ Sep. 30 2006,17:09)
UnderwhelmingEvidence.com:
<snippi-poos>

UPDATE:
Maybe he won't get banned. He goes on to make a Grade A Intelligent Design move: he make up a new jargony term and pretends it supports design.

Quote
My Design theory
In my intro quote, I said I'm skeptical about using ID to scientifically identify design. That doesn't mean, however, that I'm opposed to ID in principle, and in fact I've done some work on my own theory of intelligent design. I haven't published it before, so I thought I'd share it here.

My theory is based on what I call "cognitive distance" or CD. Don't let the big words fool you, all it really means is "how far away are we from knowing who did it?"

It's not scientifically exact, but it does help us be a little more scientific about how we decide whether or not something is intentionally designed. (I like "intentional design" better than "intelligent design," since "intelligent" can mean different things).


Irreducible Complexity, Complex Specified Information, Ontogenetic Depth, now Cognitive Distance...

He'll get banned for that: if almost IDer calculates CD honestly, they'll find it's zero, and it was the butler that did it.

Or God.  I can never remember who Agatha Christie framed.

Bob

Date: 2006/10/03 20:20:43, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Church Lady Admits Cluelessness

She finds ...  NOTHING!

Dave: I know you're listening, so can you toddle off and explain to Ms O'Leary how to use colons please.

Bob

Date: 2006/10/06 23:32:16, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Someone bitter?

http://www.uncommondescent.com/archives/1675#comment-67337
Quote
5. John A. Davison  // Oct 6th 2006 at 9:46 am

It will be very interesting to see how the Darwimps here as elsewhere will respond to these comments by a member of the National Academy of Sciences.

Here is my prediction. He will probably be accused of senility. After all that is what they have done with me.

Or how about this one?

“He used to be a decent scientist but something happened to him in the 1980s.”

It is especially significant that Skell saw through Dobzhansky’s claim about how nothing makes sense in biology without evolution. The Darwinians conveniently forget that Dobzhansky is also the one that proved that the most intensive selection cannot exceed the species barrier and he did it with Drosophila, the favorite pet animal of the Darwinian geneticists, an animal which has not changed in millions of years. Yet Dobzhansky remained a staunch Darwinian. Is it any wonder that I often declare -

It is hard to believe isn’t it?

It sure is!

In any event Skell and I had a fine conversation and while we didn’t agree about everything, we sure did on the failure of the Darwinian model.

I love it so!

“A past evolution is undeniable, a present evolution undemonstrable.”
John A. Davison

Comment by John A. Davison — October 6, 2006 @ 9:46 am

Date: 2006/10/07 06:17:06, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Zachriel - I've just checked for Skell in Web of Science (use to be the ISI Science Citations Index), and according to them, Skell has 3 papers in "LIFE SCIENCES & BIOMEDICINE".  The most recent was in 1947.

Here they are:
1. CARTER HE, LOO YH, SKELL PS
STREPTOMYCIN - THE LINKAGE BETWEEN STREPTIDINE AND STREPTOBIOSAMINE
JOURNAL OF BIOLOGICAL CHEMISTRY 168 (1): 401-402 1947
Times Cited: 9

2. LOO YH, SKELL PS, THORNBERRY HH, et al.
ASSAY OF STREPTOMYCIN BY THE PAPER-DISC PLATE METHOD
JOURNAL OF BACTERIOLOGY 50 (6): 701-709 1945
Times Cited: 193

3. CARTER HE, CLARK RK, DICKMAN SR, et al.
ISOLATION AND PURIFICATION OF STREPTOMYCIN
JOURNAL OF BIOLOGICAL CHEMISTRY 160 (1): 337-342 1945
Times Cited: 40

The second one is the only one cited since the 1970s.  Clearly it's a methodological paper.

Bob

Date: 2006/10/07 21:22:21, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (stevestory @ Oct. 07 2006,22:53)
It looks like Phil Skell has joined UncommonlyDense.

It's all pile on time!  Or would be if most people hadn't been banned.  :-(

Bob

Date: 2006/10/08 01:52:09, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Monsters from the ID?  I guess now we know what they the DI have spent their $4m on: playing mad scientist.

Bob

Date: 2006/10/11 19:25:16, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Arden Chatfield @ Oct. 11 2006,17:36)
Quote (stevestory @ Oct. 11 2006,17:23)
No.

Got that? Write it down!

I love it so!

Bob

Date: 2006/10/14 03:20:29, Link
Author: Bob O'H
The Darwin Skeptics list is interesting.  Aside from the usual suspects, and some "proper" academics, we have entries like these:

 
Quote
...is a Russian Biologist.  He has a ? from ?
...
...after earning his BS in Environmental Resources from California State University, Sacramento and working as a contract exhibit preparator in historical museums, he received a MA from the State University of New York in Museum Administration. Peterson is Founder of the Creation Resource Foundation.
...
...is a free-lance writer residing in Massachusetts. He has a BS in Nursing from Boston University and was a contributing editor to The New American for several years.
...
...received a BS from Massachusetts Institute of Technology and a MS in Business Administration from the University of Chicago.  ...
...
...received a BA in Geography and a MA  in Geography from the University of Washington. He is the Founder and owner of Pacific Meridian Publishing Company and owner of a Microfilm business in Seattle, Washington.
...
received a BS in Civil Engineering from the University of the Pacific, Stockton, California, a MA in Theology from Oral Roberts University in Tulsa, Oklahoma.
...
...Author and high school science teacher, has a MS from Purdue University.


Whilst these may be fine people, I wouldn't count them as academics or scholars, unless I was trying to stretch the definitions.

There's also this oddity:
Quote
George Price. PhD. A research scientist on the Manhattan Project and a professor at The University of Minnesota until his untimely death  He has a PhD in Chemistry from the University of Chicago and has published in Nature, Science and other major scientific journals. He is considered one of the leading evolutionary theorists. but had to carefully word his articles so as not to reveal his creationism and yet publish.


After extensive research (OK, reading Wikipedia), it appears it is the Price, of equation fame.

Bob

Date: 2006/10/15 09:09:40, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (carlsonjok @ Oct. 15 2006,09:10)
Remember Carlos?  Dembski banned him, but was forced to bring him back by popular acclaim of many of the UD regulars.  Carlos, using his new carte blanche, became more forceful in his criticisms (I think it was the GilDodgen-you-gotta-hit-the-computer-with-a-meteor thread) and then stopped posting without so much as a peep about him being banned.  He was, if you will, disappeared.  My guess is MacNeill will get the same treatment.

I'm not sure they'd ban MacNeill.  There's an air of obsequiousness at UD, and any "big player" is welcomed in, because it makes them look bigger and better.  Booting such a big player would earn them scorn and derision from said big player.

Lay your bets on how long before this hypothesis is falsified...

Bob

Date: 2006/10/15 19:55:25, Link
Author: Bob O'H
It's great to get my daily dose of Tard first thing in the morning with my coffee:

Quote
59. crandaddy  // Oct 15th 2006 at 11:46 pm

Welcome to UD, SeekAndFind. Looks like you’ve already gotten some good answers from other commenters, so I’ll be brief. ID, as I understand it (and I’m pretty sure this is correct), is fundamentally a study of minds and the patterns they produce in the external world. IDists look at marks in nature and then try to determine whether or not the cause of those marks is intelligence. The characteristics of the designer, how many designers there are, how competently it/they design, etc.–these are all interesting subjects of inquiry, but they’re not ID. In fact, ID doesn’t even postulate a designer. The way design detection works on any level is first, a pattern is recognized, and then, the most probable cause (intelligence/nonintelligence) is determined. Designer detection is folly–even in cases involving humans.

Comment by crandaddy — October 15, 2006 @ 11:46 pm


Gets the day going with a smile.

Bob

Date: 2006/10/26 19:26:56, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Egads!  A sensible thread on UD:
http://www.uncommondescent.com/archives/1741#comments

OK, GilDodgem's comments are typical UD dross, although his claim "I am Richard Dawkins’ worst nightmare" may be close to the truth, albeit not in the way he thinks.  But ScaryFact and cfrench (hmmm...) are kindly doing the demolition work.  No doubt The Banninator is warming up as I type this.

Bob

Date: 2006/10/28 23:34:32, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Notice how the censored words all have a religious connotation?  I think someone has a strong sense of irony.

As long as they don't censor ########### ########, I don't mind.

Bob

Date: 2006/10/28 23:50:37, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Yes!  We have an ID prediction:

Quote

SF–What predictions is ID making?

That biological complexities exist that cannot be reduced consistent with evolutionalry theory.

Comment by tribune7 — October 28, 2006 @ 10:25 pm


ID predicts that ID is true.  Well, I guess that's me converted.

Bob

Date: 2006/12/03 03:03:11, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Wes, are you listening?

Curiously, it's listed under "off-topic".  I guess this means that posts about global warming, theology and other such matters are on-topic on an ID blog.

Bob

Date: 2006/12/06 05:10:14, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (keiths @ Dec. 05 2006,22:39)
Wes was just pointing out that you don't get listed in the Baylor faculty/staff directory simply by "staying in touch with Baylor colleagues."  Dembski may not be ditching the West Southwest Bible and Taxidermy College, but it does look like he's starting something new at Baylor.

...in the Dean's office of Engineering and Computer Science.

Engineers and computer scientists?!  You couldn't make it up, could you?

Bob

Date: 2006/12/06 05:23:53, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Zachriel @ Dec. 05 2006,18:47)
Apparently, 'Darwinism' went down to defeat in around 1918 — just like the German army.

... and was resurrected in the same year by R.A. Fisher.

Darwinism was in trouble then, because it seemed to be at odds with genetics.  But Fisher showed how the two could be reconciled, and started the field of population genetics.  And things have moved on a bit since then.

Bob

Date: 2006/12/09 03:55:13, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
My mind goes back to Davetard's explanation that he's an expert in things like biology and cosmology because he's read a whole lot of Scientific American.


Didn't he get his wife to subscribe to it, just so he could cancel his subscription as a protest?

Bob

Date: 2006/12/11 13:54:59, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Reciprocating Bill @ Dec. 11 2006,11:44)
This comment, posted on this thread, bears a bit of rebuttal as it bears a germ of truth (and a load of crap):
...

That is worth noting.

I think you missed an h there.

Bob

Date: 2006/12/12 13:52:00, Link
Author: Bob O'H
In fairness, we should record this comment:
http://www.uncommondescent.com/archives/1853#comment-80700
Quote
12. bj  // Dec 12th 2006 at 2:23 pm

When I was a lad, long ago, I played baseball. When beaten by an opposing team, we would often complain about the unfairness of it all. We would accuse the other team of cheating, being lucky, or just generally being the scum of the earth. Our coaches would tell us to shut up, stop whining, improve our game and beat them next time.

Generally, I am a supporter of ID’s cultural goals, but I found the above to be good advice.

Blessed are the whiners, for they shall inherit the earth. I don’t remember that one.


...before the whole thread gets deleted.

Bob
P.S. Alan: I've passed your message on.  We'll see what happens.  I might not join in (I only started on the thread because I wanted to try and push it in one direction.  But I'm being distracted by consciousness), but I appreciate you making the effort, and  hope someone turns up from the Other Side.

Date: 2006/12/19 00:45:02, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Occam's Aftershave @ Dec. 18 2006,23:54)
Quote
*Etymology(petard): Middle French, from peter, to break wind, from pet expulsion of intestinal gas, from Latin peditum, from neuter of peditus, past participle of pedere, to break wind; akin to Greek bdein to break wind. (Merriam-Webster)

So we are correct in saying that Bill "Divine Wind" Dembski was literally 'hoist with his own petard'   :p

The petard (why do I want to put a hyphen before the t?) was an early form of bomb.  Basically, is was gunpowder and other stuff in a bug cauldron on the end of a long stick.  During sieges, engineers would light the fuse, and then press the cauldron against the doors/wall that they were trying to demolish: the open end of the cauldron was against the door.  Sometimes they got it wrong, which is how the phrase came into the English language.

There.  You learn something new every day.  Whether you wish to or not.

Bob

Date: 2006/12/19 00:49:03, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (oldmanintheskydidntdoit @ Dec. 18 2006,17:59)
ohh, it's tit for tat now! The handbags are out between Dembski and Dawkins!
 
Quote
Since Richard Dawkins thinks he has the right to reprint my letters to him by posting them over the Internet (go here), I’ll assume the same privilege applies to me. Let’s start with this exchange from the spring of 2000:


The Dawkins-Dembski Briefwechsel, Installment I

Coming up, Installment II: My God's Bigger than Your God.

Dawkins will react by blubbering to Teacher, because he doesn't have a god.

Bob

Date: 2006/12/21 14:02:28, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Over at the Churchlady's thread, we have a long essay on religion. Curiously it's filed under "Intelligent Design", which of course has nothing to do with religion (especially not Christianity).

So, I made the following post:

Quote
I'm just curious - why is this filed under Intelligent Design?

Bob


It didn't appear straight away, which is odd as DaveT is enough of a friend to let me off moderation: this still seems to be the case, as I had a later post about sex on the Komodo dragons page.

So, O'Lry is moderating her thread.  That's fine.  But now there are two posts there: neither mine.  AND the post is still filed unser Intelligent Design.  Ergo Ms O'Leary has read my post, rejected it, and is still perfectly happy to conflate ID with an incisive examination of the behaviour of atheists opposing Christianity.

Denyse, YOU'RE MEANT TO BE DENYING THAT ID IS TO DO WITH RELIGION.

Dave, got that?  Write it down and pass it on.

Bob

Date: 2006/12/22 12:10:04, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Calling the vise squad

Dembski -
Quote
Forrest, Ken Miller, and others seem to have a problem with my charging $200 per hour to be an expert witness in the Dover case and hold themselves up as examples of virtue in going it pro bono. I charged the Thomas More Law Center that amount because (i) I regarded this case as a loser from the start...


Presumably the costs were passed on to the school board.  Does anyone know?  Searching for "Dover" or "Kitzmiller" on the TMLC web doesn't bring up much.  Have they hired DaveT?

Bob

Date: 2006/12/23 03:44:07, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Another Brit: brought up in Scunthorpe (born on the Wirral, parents moved when I was two.  Luckily they took me with them).  Such an awful place I tried to get as far away from it as I could: now in Helsinki (Finland), via Denmark.

My brother also escaped Scunthorpe, and now lives in Slough...

Bob

Date: 2006/12/23 03:50:51, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
I don't know how I can say that except that his writing has become suddenly shrill and boring, and he certainly never bored me before.

He should be careful: he'll have to ban himself if he gets boring.

Bob

Date: 2006/12/24 01:53:37, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Going back to a Tard comment that Richardthughes pointed out:
http://www.uncommondescent.com/archives/1893#comment-82269

Quote
Can a non-religious person come to believe there is a designer without becoming religious?

Sure. I did. I was a positive atheist for decades until I read Michael Denton’s book “Evolution: A Theory in Crisis” 15 years ago.
...
I’m still an agnostic in rational thinking but I more or less formulated Pascal’s Wager on my own and bet that way before I was out of grammar school.


He took Pascal's Wager whilst he was an atheist?!

Bob

Date: 2006/12/24 06:52:47, Link
Author: Bob O'H
10) What I did was the right thing to do as a Christian, because of this quote from the Old Testament (even though the contradict the Sermon on the Mount).

Bob
P.S. jujuquisp, on point 9, s/atheist/agnostic/.  Or was it not just Sgt. Tard you were thinking of?

P.P.S. Don't try typing after having a bottle of Norwegian IPA.  I think they only sell it here because they're not allowed to sell anything that strong in Norway without paying 520% tax.

Bob

Date: 2006/12/24 07:48:45, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Sorry to go completely off-topic but what is Norwegian IPA?


Err, IPA made in Norway?  
The brewery has it's website here:

http://www.nogne-o.no/  

Oddly enough, it's all in Norwegian.  Although the brewery is in Grimstad, which translates as "Ugly Town".

Bob

Date: 2006/12/24 12:25:18, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Wonderpants @ Dec. 24 2006,10:37)
"I refuse to prove that I exist", said God, "for evidence denies faith, and I am nothing without faith.."
"But", says Man, "the Babel Fish is a dead giveaway. It couldn't have evolved by chance, therefore by your arguments, you don't exist. QED."
"Oh dear", says God, "I hadn't thought of that" and vanishes in a puff of logic.
"That was easy" says Man, and for an encore goes on to prove that black is white, and gets killed on a zebra crossing.

I think that was an actual theological argument.  Unfortunately, the only other place I've seen it is in a Dave Langford parody of C.S. Lewis.  The parody ends (roughly) "And thus the lion slunk out of Narnia."

Bob

Date: 2006/12/24 13:46:22, Link
Author: Bob O'H
And ds's comment has now been deleted.  I'm not sure if I want to know what he wrote: I think I can guess the general tenor.

Bob

Date: 2006/12/26 02:06:34, Link
Author: Bob O'H
http://www.uncommondescent.com/archives/1901#comment-82456
Quote
17. Joseph  // Dec 25th 2006 at 8:10 pm

Out of the 20 amino acids that can be found in living organisms only 2 have only one corresponding codon(triplet). This is a perfect way to use a limited number of amino acids in many different ways.

Viva the dsign inference…

Comment by Joseph — December 25, 2006 @ 8:10 pm

My brain refused to analyse this argument: I think it must have a safety switch.

Joseph, shouldn't you be in a stable somewhere, looking after your kid?

Bob

Date: 2006/12/26 14:10:02, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I asked Joseph, and he started his response here:
http://www.uncommondescent.com/archives/1901#comment-82485

I'm not moderated on UD (thank the Tard!;), so my comments won't be slowed down by that, but only by the time difference (=I'm off to bed now), and by the brain fade I get from reading Joseph's writings.

Nighty night!

Bob

Date: 2006/12/27 12:14:27, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (afdave @ Dec. 27 2006,08:07)
SUGGESTED NEW-YEARS RESOLUTIONS FOR THE ANTI-ID CROWD
...
9) No more court cases.  Way too much media attention on the controversy debate ... er ... well, just way too much media attention PERIOD.

Why?  We like court cases: they're very educational, and they're good for Dr. Behe's health (what with all the lifting weights he as to do).

Now then, boys and girls.  Can you say "breathtaking inanity"?

Bob

Date: 2006/12/28 10:50:48, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Take creationism, dress it up in a clown suit and viola! ID.


Oi!  As a former violist, I object!

Although I never did play the viola in a clown suit.  It only ever sounded like it.

Bob

P.S. Fart

Date: 2006/12/28 12:15:02, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I've got a fan!

*blushes*

I hope you enjoyed the entertainment Joseph was providing.  I'm afraid the show's over now: if I continue, even my greatest fan will want to ban me.

Bob

Date: 2006/12/29 08:10:55, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
d) But comes back with a classic DS move - the details, always the details.

yeah, but I'm not bothered about matching his pathetic level of detail.  *Fart*

Bob

Date: 2006/12/30 03:14:48, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (stevestory @ Dec. 29 2006,20:55)
Those of us who get amusement from ID are going to become bored as 2007 progresses.

You were making similar commesnt a couple of onths ago, as well.  But that was before the Judge Jones School of Farts.  I guess as long as ID is slowly sinking, we'll have to rely on simple tardity, and even that may fade.

We need Dembski to write a blockbuster that will set evolutionary biology back 200 seconds, so that they can re-invigourate the movement.

Bob

Date: 2007/01/01 01:17:16, Link
Author: Bob O'H
hblavatsky?

I thought the name was familiar, but I couldn't place it. Isn't Wiki great?  ;-)

Oh, and Happy New Year to you late-comers!

(this excludes k.e., obviously, as he beat us to the next year.  But happy new year to you too).

Bob

Date: 2007/01/06 03:17:10, Link
Author: Bob O'H
http://www.uncommondescent.com/archives/1930#comment-83870]DaveT:
 
Quote
That plus I’m a jarhead and I like explosions and other things in general that make loud noises.


*fart*

Date: 2007/01/06 08:13:58, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I agree with curious that Sober & Wilson is useful, although one should always keep in mind that they're advocating one point of view.

For a overview of the sociology, have a look at Segerstråle's book Defenders of the Truth.

There's also Keller's edited volume "Levels of Selection".  The intention is obviously to move the debate on from the old discussions about group selection and trait group selection, and more towards JMS's evolutionary transitions viewpoint.  Because of this, the introduction is a hoot with its rather grouchy "oh, just shut up will you?" approach to the old debates.

Oh, and the three volumes of Bill Hamilton's Narrow Roads of Geneland have to be mentioned as well.

Bob

Date: 2007/01/07 13:59:01, Link
Author: Bob O'H
A couple more theoretical papers from JEB:
Social semantics: altruism, cooperation, mutualism, strong reciprocity and group selection
S. A. WEST, A. S. GRIFFIN & A. GARDNER


and

The evolution of cooperation and altruism – a general framework and a classification of models
L. LEHMANN & L. KELLER

The latter has a bunch of commentaries after it too.  As I recall, they were quite entertaining.  I can't remember if they referenced any empirical work, though.

Bob

Date: 2007/01/07 14:06:23, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
It's allowed any Joe Crackpot with a computer in his mom's basement to posture as the equal of people with true expertise. So it's produced a vast amount of white noise in just about any controversial public discourse.  


Not white noise, brown noise, surely.

Date: 2007/01/09 00:23:36, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (ScaryFacts @ Jan. 08 2007,21:40)
Steve:  These 4-5 posts might go well moved to the "Board Mechanics" thread, no?

Not to say that all mechanics are bored, though I'm sure some are.

Is trepanation a common thing amongst mechanics?

Bob

Date: 2007/01/09 12:21:29, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Decades of subscribing to Sci-Am

You mean decades of his wife subscribing to Sci-Am, don't you?

Bob

Date: 2007/01/10 00:52:24, Link
Author: Bob O'H
bFast (via Zachriel) -
Quote
(This is not so with plants. However plants can reproduce asexually, so are much more maliable to speciation.)

Does this get into the "not even wrong" category?

I've explained why over at UD.  Hopefully I'll find myself stirring up a tardfest for your delight.

Bob

Date: 2007/01/10 11:06:45, Link
Author: Bob O'H
http://www.uncommondescent.com/archives/1941#comment-84731
Quote
2. a5b01zerobone  // Jan 10th 2007 at 12:01 pm

This is interesting.

In the 2001 census 72 per cent of Britons described themselves as Christian but only about 6.3 per cent go to church on any given Sunday.

The United States on the other hand has a higher level of church attendance than any other developed country. 20% of Americans actually go to church one or more times a week.

My point is that ID is taking root in secular 21st century Britain. This is extraordinary!

I guess this is some kind of proof that ID truly is a science.


Bugger.  He's right.

Bob

Date: 2007/01/10 13:43:35, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Turn off your irony meters:
http://www.uncommondescent.com/archives/1941#comment-84744
Quote
6. Atom  // Jan 10th 2007 at 12:51 pm

Yeah, props to the Guardian. As much as Leftists seem to embrace Darwinism as unquestionable axiom, they still published an openly pro-ID article.

It warms my heart to see Leftists living out their beliefs, proving that they really do embrace open discussion of ideas, even ones they disagree with.

Comment by Atom — January 10, 2007 @ 12:51 pm


Bob

Date: 2007/01/10 13:47:26, Link
Author: Bob O'H
EDIT: Double post.  Sorry: one was bad enough.

Bob

Date: 2007/01/12 13:20:28, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
I wonder what Joan Roughgarden would make of this?

She'd probably start think it's a very good reason to get a sex change.

Bob

Date: 2007/01/13 07:34:57, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Hmm, I thought Dave said he's got a jarhead.

Obviously it's in a different jar.

Bob

Date: 2007/01/17 13:04:15, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
When I'm sat at my keyboard, I was in the SAS.

What, Scunthorpe Alloy Services?

Bob

Date: 2007/01/17 13:20:51, Link
Author: Bob O'H
From comment 9:
http://www.uncommondescent.com/archives/1961#more-1961
Quote
The definition of intelligence I like best is “the ability to choose between good and evil.”

So, is the flagellum good or evil?

Bob

Date: 2007/01/22 00:25:52, Link
Author: Bob O'H
GilDodgen and irony:
Quote
The bottom line is that Darwinism is a 19th-century, puerile, ill-supported, futile attempt to explain away design in nature — especially in living systems, although it is now applied to almost everything from cosmology to psychology — that stares every reasonable person in the face.

(Comment 17)

Date: 2007/01/29 13:20:53, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Cornelius Hunter @ Jan. 26 2007,15:11)
It is strange that evolutionists never get around to addressing the scientific issue. Wesley Elsberry appears to be denying convergence, but that can't be true. If he has an explanation for convergence then let's hear it. If not, then admit it. Here is the question for evolutionists: How is it that similarities such as the pentadactyl pattern are such powerful evidence for evolution, in light of equala and greater levels of similarity in distant species, such as dsplayed in the marsupial and placental mouse?

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/evolution/library/01/4/pdf/l_014_02.pdf

Sorry for coming in late on this (just got back from a workshop in the wilds of Finland).  Anyway, I just want to complain that the marsupial and placental mouse are totally different: there's not the same colour for a start.

Bob

Date: 2007/01/31 00:33:37, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (djmullen @ Jan. 30 2007,17:16)
If you check that .pdf file, you'll see why Dr. Hunter has trouble telling them apart by color.  He's using a coloring book as a reference and it hasn't been colored yet.

Hence my joke.

I guess it didn't work terribly well after a two page delay.  Curse you (or someone) for bringing this up whilst I was in a meeting about pathetic levels of detail.

Bob

Date: 2007/02/01 10:26:54, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Sal -
http://www.uncommondescent.com/archives/2013#comment-88790
Quote
Let me add, I have a sneaking suspicion biology exploits emergent phenomena.


Dang, we never would have noticed.

Bob

Date: 2007/02/02 00:22:59, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
I feel uncomfortable discussing Lenny's situation, as I'm sure many are, simply because most of us can hold up a mirror and see a lot of Lenny.

Poor Lenny....

Bob

Date: 2007/02/04 04:06:14, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Richardthughes @ Feb. 04 2007,01:26)
Does ID 'theory' predict this?

http://www.newscientist.com/article....ay.html

It does now.

Bob

Date: 2007/02/08 00:14:52, Link
Author: Bob O'H
djmullen - Have a heart, think of the poor telephone sanitizers.

Bob

Date: 2007/02/19 00:06:31, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Richardthughes @ Feb. 18 2007,14:02)
Happy Birthday Bob O'H



Thanks!  Err, how did you know?

I'm now officially paranoid.

Bob
P.S. I haven't been posting much, because I've discovered that DaveScot is right about green tea.  I've been drinking it for the past week or so, and my appetite for tard has totally disappeared!

Date: 2007/03/01 01:08:28, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (stevestory @ Feb. 28 2007,15:35)
We need to archive the ISCID website. ...

I have a spare 3½ inch floppy you can borrow.

Bob

Date: 2007/03/11 11:05:43, Link
Author: Bob O'H
hblavatsky provides run-of-the-mill irony over at OE

Quote
Who could be better to provide an authoritative criticism of neo-darwinism than a fully-qualified neurosurgeon who also majored in biochemistry?


Answers on a postcard...

Bob

Date: 2007/03/18 01:34:11, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Richardthughes @ Mar. 17 2007,22:29)
The quiz answers are very telling:

http://www.designinference.com/teaching/teaching.htm

Hey, but there's a great quote-mine:
Quote
The virgin birth of Christ is absolutely inconceivable and meaningless
(exercise 2, question 2e)


It's even in his own handwriting!

Bob

Date: 2007/03/21 15:14:15, Link
Author: Bob O'H
http://www.uncommondescent.com/evoluti....-100317
Quote
If intelligence was purely genetic and materialistic, the trend would be for humanity to get stupider as time goes on.

Anyone care to provide the punchline?  Or just too easy?

Bob

Date: 2007/03/24 01:47:28, Link
Author: Bob O'H
A belated happy birthday, Kristine!

I won't ask how many times you've been 23...

Oh, and Mr_Christopher as well.

Bob

Date: 2007/03/25 04:05:20, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Ah, the gentle irony!  I haven't been posting at UD (even if I had wanted to) because I changed computer a couple of months back, and tried to log in with what I thought was my username, and wasn't recognised.

Today I had to get a file from my old computer, so thought I'd use the opportunity to check my UD username.  So, I come here to find a link to UD, and see that Dembski's chuntering on about 19th Century Irish racism.  I go to UD, see a bit more about the same subject, and then find my username.  

Finally, we come to the irony.  Over here my username is Bob O'H (I'm too lazy to type the extra 'ara'), but UD doesn't like apostrophes, that common staple of Irish surnames.  It won't even let me escape it.  What have they got against the Irish?

Bob
P.S. Someone else can have fun with Dense O'Lry's "I can't be bothered to read what I'm criticising" post.  I can't be bothered to criticise what I'm reading.

Date: 2007/03/25 04:15:15, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Something else has struck me: periodically, stevestory says that he's getting bored with UD, because it's not amusing or interesting any more.  Then, within a week or so, they bring up a new pile of superior quality tard from the mines.  This seems to have happened too often to be a coincidence.

Steve: they're doing all this just for you!

Bob

Date: 2007/03/25 07:40:42, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I know what you mean, Steve, and you're probably right.  It certainly doesn't seem to have any intellectual vitality.  Isn't Behe meant to be publishing a new book?  If that doesn't contain any new ideas, then ID will have to wait for the Biologic Institute to start producing results.

It might recover, possibly under another name, but it doesn't look good.

Incidentally, I'm curious to know why money has been poured into efforts to promote ID and creationism in Europe.  What with the Truthiness in Science people in the UK sending schools lots of free material, and Harun Yahya sending his tome to European scientist (including the editor of the Journal of Evolutionary Biology.  It gave people in his department a laugh, anyway), a lot of money has obviously been thrown at us.  I just want t know who from, and can I have some?

Bob

Date: 2007/03/25 10:33:06, Link
Author: Bob O'H
True, Richard.  But it's only appropriate that you don't pay up.

Bob

Date: 2007/04/06 02:22:29, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Don't worry Kristine: the Rev. Moon isn't that mad yet.

*runs and hides really well*

Bob

Date: 2007/04/06 05:06:46, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (jeannot @ April 05 2007,14:03)
Darn Jeanne d'Arc! How can I continue my PhD if everything I've learnt so far is wrong?  :(

I guess you're not the only one to have got your fingers burnt.

Bob

Date: 2007/04/08 12:34:58, Link
Author: Bob O'H
http://www.uncommondescent.com/evoluti....-113089
Quote
This Great Ape guy is a trouble maker.
How come he hasn’t been prohibited from commenting yet? He provides nothing constructive.

Is this guy one of ours, yanking their chains?

Bob

Date: 2007/04/12 00:27:02, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Richardthughes @ April 11 2007,22:53)
Dembski seems to have just found Youtube.

Or he's been reading Pharyngula.

Bob

Date: 2007/04/14 07:40:19, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Full report here

Don't know who those people in the other photo are, though.

Bob

Date: 2007/04/14 07:48:34, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Afarensis has an interesting hypothesis: Egnor and DaveTard are the same person.

Blipey: be careful when you go to meet Mr. Springer.  He might try to get inside your head.

Bob

Date: 2007/04/14 23:56:27, Link
Author: Bob O'H
idnet.com.au shows his ignorance -

http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....-116711
Quote
The energy crisis could be solved if we were able to use a modified photosynthesis complex to either just form H2 and O2, or store charge separation (a battery), or to form CH4 or C2H6 and O2. No more green house gases, no more globaal warming crisis.


And Designed Jacob's disguise slips in his response:

Quote
What’s gonna be emitted when you burn the methane and ethane?


Bob

Date: 2007/04/15 04:56:20, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I thought Zero was subtly criticising Dembski.

Bob

Date: 2007/04/15 05:05:08, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Aardvark @ April 14 2007,15:34)
Creationist Museum Challenges Evolution (BBC)

Quote
As we prepare to leave, Eugenie Scott quietly slips a panda glove puppet from her handbag and photographs it among the dinosaurs.


;)

Panda glove puppet?

Oh, I guess sometimes Prof. Steve Steve acts like a glove puppet because, believe it or not, it really helps that the other side thinks he's a glove puppet.

Bob

Date: 2007/04/15 08:56:48, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Ftk @ April 14 2007,17:50)
Quote
Are you saying that the “designer” has intervened millions of times to create the next species, and the species after that?


No, I don't think science has answered that question yet either.  

Scientifically, I'm saying we can't rule out design.  As to how you scientists are going to get that fact worked into your science, I'll await patiently.

I guess the people you should be waiting for are those who agree with you about design, like Bill Dembski and other ID theorists.

Bob

Date: 2007/04/16 12:06:45, Link
Author: Bob O'H
For the fuller story...
Everyone's favourite sociologist has a book out.  I'll wait to see if there's any comment on this line from the Amazon.co.uk site:
Quote
IDT’s proponents take literally the Biblical idea that humans have been created in God’s image.

I'm sure Lenny will appreciate it.

Bob

Date: 2007/04/18 00:10:20, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Interesting: nobody reads lots of Scientific American.  They must have put up the prices to counter dt's cancellation of his subscription.

Bob
(who actually has a degree higher than a PhD.  Unfortunately, the certificate is in Finnish, so I'm not sure what it's in)

Date: 2007/04/18 00:24:19, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (J-Dog @ April 17 2007,13:47)
WATERLOO PART DEAUX  (Sorry Jeannot)

Uh Oh... Looks like the rubes at OD are catching on!

The latest post is "Has This Site Gone Extinct?"

http://www.overwhelmingevidence.com/oe....extinct

A moment of silence please...

No one else noticed the name of the guy?  BobMort.  Mort?!

If he's the only guy posting there, I think extinction might just be a possibility.

Bob
EDIT: <b>Note to self</b>: don't use html here.

Date: 2007/04/18 12:10:49, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
B.A. in humanities, that's me, working toward an MLIS degree.

Master of Librarianship, ID and Shimmying?

Bob

Date: 2007/04/27 00:14:54, Link
Author: Bob O'H
At the bottom:
http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....-117923
Quote
As you know, Bill, technical problems with your server have prevented my posts from going through. I’m sure your moderators can put this post directly onto the blog; or you could do it yourself.


Hmmmm.

Date: 2007/04/29 11:31:57, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Whilst "word salad" is reduced to being the current buzz-phrase.

<insert "I am an annoying pedant smiley" here>

Bob

Date: 2007/04/29 13:51:18, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
ermm I didn't mean any of the stuff I said. Louis? Who's Louis? I'm Bob!

Lou...Bob

Git.  I only just got out.  In the end I claimed I was called Dave, and was a highly trained marine with an IQ of 270.  That scared them!

Date: 2007/05/03 00:04:50, Link
Author: Bob O'H
If we're quote-mining, how about this from WmAD:

Quote
The virgin birth of Christ is absolutely inconceivable and meaningless


It's in his own handwriting too!

Bob

Date: 2007/05/05 08:57:20, Link
Author: Bob O'H
GilDodgen points to a blog article about the decline and fall of the BCSE, wherein a guy tries to show that the BCSE people act worse than our friends at UD.  It includes this rant:

Quote
An archaelogist who lives in Cambridge. Why do you think they mentioned Cambridge? It all sounds rather prestigious, doesn't it? Do you think he's one of the university's own archaeologists? Perhaps he has a teaching post there?

Or perhaps he just lives there.

Bob

Date: 2007/05/09 00:19:22, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Richard rejoice!  The Server is your friend.  Trust the Server:
http://www.uncommondescent.com/religio....d-state

FTK's post was only removed so that it didn't spoil the full weight of Tardiness.

Bob

Date: 2007/05/10 12:42:21, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Why don't you get back to work trying to explain what parts of the bible TE's take literally and which parts they don't.


Matthew 5 v9?

Bob

Date: 2007/05/11 06:58:10, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Oh, it looks like I've been quietly put back on moderation at UD (I guess PaV didn't like me suggesting that he shouldn't indulge in teleology).

Mind you, I'm not totally black-listed, so I'm not going to really let rip on DaveScot's ignorance of epidemiology.  

Dave - check out AIDS research.  They've been looking at precisely these problems for some time.

Bob

Date: 2007/05/13 02:53:51, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Must resist replying to tard.

Bob
EDIT: my will is weak....

Date: 2007/05/14 12:45:58, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I went to a talk today about systems biology, which mentioned the No Free Lunch theorems.  Somewhat surprisingly, Dembski was not brought up at all.

Bob

Date: 2007/05/15 00:04:12, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
I was even tired of crazy sick people (by far the better part of the deal).

And yet, you continue to post here.

:-)

Bob

Date: 2007/05/18 00:26:19, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Patrick - it's obvious that the Intelligent Designer never intended us to find kiwis.  Or k.e.  Or something.

The 1 in 1000 is bag of crock: it's based on Polaris being in the top 50.  The article says that there are 2000 stars visible to the naked eye, and this gives a 5% (well, 4.732543%) probability.  If we want to be inclusive and allow that penguins might need navigational aids, the number rises to 9.2%.

I also wonder if it would matter if the difference from north was 2 degrees.  if that is allowable, then the probability shoots up to 35%, just for Polar bear navigators.

Bob

Date: 2007/05/18 13:37:12, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Orac's latest dose of woo includes this little titbit:

Quote
The pyramid effectiveness may also be explained using Einstein's concept of Tachyons and Tardyons. Tachyons are particles of invisible energy that move faster than the speed of light (that means it is faster than 186,282 miles per second). Tardyons behave in the opposite way, moving below or at the speed of light.

(I really want to give the whole quote, it's magnificent.  But that might distract)

Joyously, this means that all of the UD crowd must be made of tardyons.  And I bet tardyons disobey the SLoT too.

Bob

Date: 2007/05/20 01:25:30, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Strange, very strange .  Nobody at UD has posted about the Science story on the design inference being childish.  Have we finally found an argument they can't counter?

Bob
P.S. Steve - hat tip for the argument.

Date: 2007/05/25 08:47:40, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Achilles25 isn't too long for the UD world:
http://www.uncommondescent.com/evoluti....-122832
Quote
Maybe Avalos was just engaging in a little street theater.

Date: 2007/05/26 05:16:43, Link
Author: Bob O'H
The sea looks a bit choppy for our Dave to be out on his boat.

Bob

Date: 2007/05/28 11:47:29, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Alan Fox @ May 28 2007,08:59)
Edit:New Scientist link found!

Wo-hoo!  Evilution is proven: Alan's found a missing link!

Bob

Date: 2007/05/29 00:36:58, Link
Author: Bob O'H
This is the text of WmAD's offer:

Quote
http://www.uncommondescent.com/evoluti....-123025
By the way, my wife is from Iowa, and I get up there now and again. I’d be happy to debate you at ISU if you’re up for it. My one condition is that I have as much uninterrupted time to present my case as you do yours. The title of my talk would be “How to be an intellectually fulfilled atheist.”

I would read that as saying that "getting paid" is not a condition.

Bob

Date: 2007/05/29 14:10:31, Link
Author: Bob O'H
http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....-museum
Quote
I have little use for creation museums, but way, way less use for self-regarding, overaged art twerps who pretend superiority to millions of people who do real jobs for a living. So, I thought, Die. Twerp. Die. Before the cat gets you.

Is it common for irony meters to gently melt into a puddle of molten metal?

Bob

Date: 2007/05/30 00:22:51, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Richardthughes @ May 29 2007,23:55)
Giltard testifies:

http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....science

I've been waiting for a couple of weeks for UD to respond to that essay, ever since it passed editorial review in Science.

It was worth the wait, though.  The title was enough for the molten mass of my irony meter to ooze onto the balcony and start decomposing.  At least I think that's what it's doing.

Bob

Date: 2007/06/02 13:48:20, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Hm.  Amusing that oner at UD Paul Nelson reacts to an opinion piece about Gonzalez, but totally ignores the other story on Gonzalez in the same paper.

Afarensis - I wonder if Sal is just playing up his reputation.

Bob

Date: 2007/06/03 09:13:47, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Meanwhile, back in the "real" world, we finally have the announcement we've all been waiting for, an ID researcher appointed at a major university.  Of course he's a biologistcomputer scientist.  And the major university is Baylor.

Bob

Date: 2007/06/04 00:11:37, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
...chance dt/de..vout.

Don't do that!  There might be mathematicians reading.

Bob

Date: 2007/06/04 00:59:28, Link
Author: Bob O'H
This needs to be repeated, from Mark Carroll-Chu's blog:
http://scienceblogs.com/goodmat....-454279
Quote
"I take it that DaveScott and Dembski are welcome here, unmoderated, unlike their blog?"

I'm not even sure they are welcome there on their blog, considering how many times they've erased and changed things they've said.
...
Posted by: plunge | June 3, 2007 07:50 PM


Bob

Date: 2007/06/05 13:39:25, Link
Author: Bob O'H
You know, I've been musing about writing an article for PCID, asking "what can we say about the designer from observations of nature?".  I'm amused by the idea of doing a serious job of it, and then seeing what happens - it would have to be good, because the PCID rejection rate is clearly very high.

The problem is I can't be bothered to do the work - too busy doing "science".

Bob

Date: 2007/06/07 12:40:32, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Arden - you send Dave the cross, I'll supply the nails.

Bob

Date: 2007/06/12 00:12:01, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Aaagh!
http://www.uncommondescent.com/humor....-124454
Quote
scordova

06/11/2007

11:15 pm

Here is some surprising attempts at geneologies from other cultures. They all shockingly converge on the figure Morowitz cites:

RECORDS OF HUMAN LONGEVITY FROM OTHER NATIONS

   Data From 88 Generations of Kings of China - 2943 B.C.-314 B.C.

   Data From 124 Generations of Kings of India - 2964 B.C.-1193 A.D.

They also corroborate Cornell geneticist John Sanford’s Genetic Entropy hypothesis.

What is especially astonishing:

1. 7 geographically dispersed cultures independently discover agriculture

2. written language appears about the same time (again, in geographically dispersed regions).

3. Artifacts like pyramids appear about the same time in geographically dispersed regions.

4.Geneological records go back only to those times (ask yourself, why did this happen simultaneously to geographically dispersed cultrues).

Of course, one could argue there are geneologies that reach farther back, we just haven’t found them. They are missing links….


Quick, somebody tell Sal about the Younger Dryas!

Oh, hang on, you're all banned.  I'll have to do it...

Bob

Date: 2007/06/12 11:10:29, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (djmullen @ June 12 2007,01:31)
Ahh... yeah... it was called the Agricultural Revolution.  It was when we learned to grow our food and forsook our wandering ways and started settling down in cities.  Ever hear of it?

In fairness, she does raise the point that agriculture was (apparently) started independently in 3 places at about the same time, so there is a bit more to it than that.

Bob

Date: 2007/06/14 13:23:14, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Sal has a new post up, about Carroll's review of Behe's book.
Sal is quote-mining.

But, I repeat myself.

Bob

Date: 2007/06/17 06:13:07, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Duae Quartunciae has discovered something amusing from the Brookfield site:


Bob

Date: 2007/06/18 00:28:16, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
OK, you can turn the irony meters back up to 11 again now.


I wish I had waited until after I had read Noetic Guru's comment:
Quote
I think Ruse is worse than most. A vast majority of the time, he’ll simply appeal to his status as a self-proclaimed Darwinist as though we were supposed to glean some meaningful content from it.


I'm just glad he didn't post that on one of Denyse's threads.  Meaningful content?  Bah!

Bob

Date: 2007/06/18 00:41:48, Link
Author: Bob O'H
http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....-125200
Quote


11

NoeticGuru

06/17/2007

6:57 pm

Heh, long time lurker, first time poster here. But I’m glad that organizations like ICON-RIDS are showing up, and that proponents of ID are taking notice of them. I think that it will help show that ID isn’t a single religious doctrine since it can incorporate so many different non-materialistic philosophies. ICON-RIDS, for example, will probably attract a lot of followers with its ethical philosophy (you’ll probably need to scroll down a bit to get to his Transparadigmic Pleasurian socio-ethical paradigm, but it’s worth a read).

Since I’m also a dabbler in mathematics, I’ve been particularly impressed with Dr. Brookfield’s cosmological proof of cosmological physical incompleteness — I wonder how many mathematical polymaths ID will have to accumulate before Darwinists stop making light of the field’s credentialed researchers?


OK, so NoeticGuru might be One of Us (note the lack of smiley at the end of the first paragraph).  Either that, or we're going to be royally entertained.

Bob

Date: 2007/06/19 00:23:18, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Lenny, care to comment:
Quote
http://www.uncommondescent.com/culture/so-many-id-books-so-little-time-id-sympathetic-book-by-gingerich-2006/
At Goshen I was a chemistry major, and I knew that chemistry provided many opportunities for service to humankind. Meanwhile the stars and Harvard beckoned, but of what practical use could astronomy be? Here my mathematics professor came to the rescue. “If you feel a calling to pursue astronomy,” he counseled, “you should go for it.
We can’t let the atheists take over any field.”


I just feel there's something in that quote which might just, just mind you, have some bearing on the question of the relationship between ID and creationism.

It's only a hunch, though.

Bob

Date: 2007/06/20 00:32:46, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Zachriel @ June 19 2007,21:33)
[URL=http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelligent-design/evolutionary-biologists-allstar-atheists-apparently-or-very-occasionally-teddy-bears-for-j

esus#comment-125366]Jehu[/URL]          
Quote
Seriously, the more I read objections to The Edge of Evolution the more I am struck by what a devastating blow it has struck to the heart of the materialist establishment.

Well, thank Goodness that's over with. I suppose the scientific community materialist establishment can be put on relief and retrained for useful work.

Just as long as they keep on paying us.

Bob

Date: 2007/06/22 08:32:56, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Some advice here on how to control Kristine

I guess one should check what it is first, The Design Inference won't work too well.  Anything by Dawkins, and she's yours.

Bob

Date: 2007/06/22 13:25:58, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
And “To actually refute this assumption, and thereby eliminate chance, S will have to do one more thing, namely, show that the probability P(D* |H), that is, the probability of the event described by the pattern D, is small enough” is a total pickup line.

Don't try it with a Bayesian.

They'll be more interested in your posterior anyway.

Bob

Date: 2007/06/23 00:53:59, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Oooh, Dembski is now taking the piss out of his own readers:

Quote
So, to make amends, I’m helping to circulate this advertisement for a position they are trying to fill. Note the paragraph in bold. I expect many who read this blog would be qualified to fill this position.

and the part in bold reads
Quote
Candidates must have at least a college degree; advanced degrees in the sciences, particularly biology and geology, or in the history and/or philosophy of science, and/or science education, are pluses. A record of involvement in or understanding of the creationism/evolution controversy, or church/state separation issues in general, is also a plus.

Biology and geology?  Hmmmm.

Bob

Date: 2007/06/23 11:37:35, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Has Hermagoras been banned yet?
Quote


22

Hermagoras

06/23/2007

8:10 am

DaveScot,

So, gleaner’s view of civility’s importance is all for fun. Glad you cleared that up.

Your taxonomy is incomplete: what about the pro-ID a**hat?

Date: 2007/06/24 00:22:13, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (stevestory @ June 23 2007,14:08)
http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....omments

Quote


1

NoeticGuru

06/22/2007

8:05 pm

I wouldn’t stop there, even. This goes far beyond physics and biology, and shows up in sociology as well.

Whether they realize it or not, secular humanists believe in teleology. They like to think of human society as “evolving” in a kind of way that leads to progress.

How that’s not teleology is beyond me.


I'm sure it is.

Hey, look, our own Bob O'H is over there:

Yeah, I was bored, so I thought I'd yank Sal's chain a bit and see what fell out.  A mixed metaphor, apparently.

Anyway, it seems like I/we were wrong about Noetic Guru.  He's not on our side seems

sa he appeared to be, but is genuine 100% tard.  Lovers of woo will enjoy his blog.

Bob

Date: 2007/06/24 12:51:33, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Hermagoras @ June 24 2007,10:05)
I appear to have been banned at UD.  Or at least my comments no longer appear.

You're not banned: you're in one of the moderation queues.  But you're in DaveTard's "infinite items or more" queue, so you may be there some time.

Bob

Date: 2007/06/25 11:39:22, Link
Author: Bob O'H
http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....-126128
Quote


1

bornagain77

06/25/2007

11:15 am

That was a very encouraging interview. The strange silence of your most worthy opponents is very telling to the fact that you have reached a level of unimpeachable integrity. I for one think you have done a great service for science by providing the mathematical foundation for detecting design in biology. Your opponents, for the most part, would not know a first principle of science if it bit them on the behind. Keep up the good (but hard) work Dr. Dembski.

I just want to ask - can one be impeached if one doesn't hold office?

Bob

Date: 2007/06/25 13:22:48, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
WD: The work itself is immensely satisfying and intellectually stimulating. Moreover, I see those who seek to shut it down as intolerant dogmatists who encapsulate a tyranny that I despise. So I get to see myself as both a scientific researcher and as a freedom fighter—a rare combination.

Oddly enough, I could see PZ saying exactly the same thing.

Bob

Date: 2007/06/26 12:04:10, Link
Author: Bob O'H
http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....-126199
Quote


21

gerardharbison

06/26/2007

9:19 am

Johannes Lerle was not convicted for teaching ID. He was not convicted for comparing abortion to the Holocaust. He was convicted for denying the Holocaust, period. If you actually look at the two web pages which formed the basis of the case against him (and can read German), you’ll learn he called Auschwitz a deception, and questioned whether the gas chambers could have killed so many Jews. Like it or not, that’s a crime in Germany.

Now, if it were me, I wouldn’t want to be seen portraying a Holocaust denier as some kind of Christian martyr, but then I’m not a Christian. In any case, you’ve now been informed of the problem; I’ll be watching to see if you fix it.


Expect to see a sflurry of new posts, now the UDites realise what WmAD's done.

Bob

Date: 2007/06/27 13:15:09, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote ("Rev Dr" Lenny Flank @ June 26 2007,19:34)
He did another sci-fi film in the . . . early 80's, I think it was . . . called "They Live".  It was actually very good commie propaganda  ;)  but had abysmal effects, a horrid soundtrack, and an interminable five-hour-long-plus (it seemed) fight scene.

Ah, that brings back memories.  But you missed the punchline over the fight.  It was all about one character trying to persuade another to put on a pair of shades.

There was one good line though - "I came here to chew gum and kick ass.  Unfortunately, I'm all out of gum."

Bob

Date: 2007/06/28 13:48:37, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Albatrossity2 @ June 28 2007,12:54)
Plant breeders routinely seek mutations that confer increased resistance to fungi, bacteria, viruses etc. that certainly would be beneficial to a plant in the wild. Mutations that increase the yield of seeds (e.g. in wheat) would certainly benefit those plants in the wild. The key phrase, of course, is that he is "not aware".

Perhaps I should have sent a biology book to Texas as well...

I almost replied to Mr. Tard pointing out mlo in barley, which gives resistance to barley mildew.  It was first discovered in a mutation line in Denmark - basically they put a bunch of barley plants (from lines called "Carlsberg") next to a nuclear reactor, and looked at the results. A couple of years later the same genotype was found in Africa (Ethiopia IIRC).  It certainly didn't come from Denmark, and I think the mutation is even in a different place in the gene.

I didn't post because Dave might have looked into it, and gotten sidetracked onto loss of information (the resistance phenotype is a loss of function).

Bob

Date: 2007/06/29 01:08:54, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Hermagoras @ June 28 2007,18:13)
I probably got a bit technical, because I was annoyed at being told I didn't know what I was talking aobut in precisely my area of expertise.  In a word, I got rhetorical on their ass.

Ah, you succumbed to the Dark Side.  Every so often, you just want to shout "You're a bunch of f***ing morons at them.  At that point, you just have to walk away from the computer, and then come back 5 minutes later and surf on over here.  If you don't you're lost in the Bannination Queue for all time.

It is possible to survive at UD for a long time without developing Tard (as I think I've shown), but it's not easy and if everybody did it, Steve would complain that UD was getting boring.

Bob

Date: 2007/06/29 13:57:17, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I thought Sal was suddenly showing an ability to laugh at himself.  Stupid me.

Bob

Date: 2007/06/30 00:21:11, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Good point. And the longer you insulate yourself from reality, the harder you will fall when that insulation deflates.

Oh just shut up about Paris Hilton.

Bob

Date: 2007/07/05 11:38:44, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Doc Bill @ July 03 2007,07:16)
I dropped this comment on UD last night.  This morning it has evaporated:

 
Quote
Chemistry and math?

Hannah Maxson, Cornell.

Prez of the ID Club.

Good choice.


I thought it was a good guess since they were being so secretive.  Ohhhh, don't want to ruin the student's career having accepted a whole $100 from the Disco Institute.

At least Hannah could use the coin to buy a real science book.

(sorry for being a bit late: I've been sampling the Asturian cider, and teaching Bayesian statistics to biologists).

Ha!  That was my guess too.  I read the citation, and it struck me that the word "he" was being avoided, so I, um, made a design inference that it was a "she".

Oh, and I now have a blog, so this is a good excuse for a bit of blatant blog-whoring.

Have fun whilst I'm away - I have to get back to writing tomorrow morning's exercise.

Bob

Date: 2007/07/05 12:45:24, Link
Author: Bob O'H
http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....of-life
Quote
When you really analyze them, most of the strongest arguments against ID as an explanation for the development of life are of the form: “this just doesn’t look like the way God would have created things.” Perhaps not, but we are finding more and more that it does look very much like the way “we” design things.

(a) you mean badly, don't you?
(b) So, who are you suggesting is the designer?

Bob
P.S. Rich - a belated happy birthday!  It's your fault I'm late with this - you picked the wrong day to pop out.

Date: 2007/07/08 04:20:17, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I was thinking of having a laugh by quote-mining this:

(start of last paragraph)
Quote
ID theorists don’t postulate a designer for their arguments.


Then I read the rest of the paragraph, and found out that it wouldn't be a quote-mine.  Time to stir the pot, methinks.

Bob

Date: 2007/07/09 00:37:46, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Oh the embarrassment.  DaveScot comes to my support:
Quote


20

DaveScot

07/08/2007

3:45 pm

It’s axiomatic that where there’s design there’s a designer. Design is inferred. It’s semantic nitpicking to say a designer isn’t an inference.

The real question is what qualities of the designer can be inferred from observation of the design. In the origin and evolution of life we can reasonably infer that any designer(s) had somewhat advanced skill in biochemistry and/or genetic engineering. There’s no requirement as far as I can determine that any non-physical (supernatural) means was required to impliment the design. If anyone thinks that abilities that go beyond known physical laws are required to design and construct organic life as we know it please feel free to state what it is and why.


There is some more bad news:
1. I agree with his points
2. Dave has removed the links to the moderation policy, so I can't see how many rules he has broken.  Hint, Dave: read the text on every page beneath "Uncommon Descent holds that...".

Hands up all those who think Dave might have to ban himself.

Bob

Date: 2007/07/09 13:38:14, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Oops.  Looks like the ICR has stepped outside the big tent, and has started to piss in.

Bob

Date: 2007/07/10 01:34:42, Link
Author: Bob O'H
There's a nice tale in the history of science, involving Euclid, Newton, Riemann and Einstein, isn't there?

Bob
P.S. Wintermute's Greasemonkey script is great, although I don't appreciate having "Tard Alert!" written next to my name.  :-(

EDIT: OK, so the Greasemonkey script didn't work quite the way I expected it to.  And UD seems to be down at the moment, but the comment came just after below this one.

Date: 2007/07/10 12:52:12, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Zachriel @ July 10 2007,06:23)
For posterity,

crandaddy    
Quote
We need a paradigm case of design in order to have any idea what it looks like, so design (and a designer) at the ground level of our reasoning processes starts with the self as a designer. In this way, I suppose you might say that ID postulates the self as a designer.

Any attribution of design to anything else (i.e. not caused by the self) must be built up from this foundation, and any conclusions of design arrived at are epistimic–they are beliefs which sit atop structures of rational argumentation. Any statement such as “P is designed” is ontological; it is a statement about the way things really are.

Talk of a designer as a designer of some particular object includes the presumption that the particular object is designed. That the particular object is designed is what the IDist concerns himself trying to justify. To employ the use of a proposition asserting the ontic status of design for the particular object (or similarly, postulating the designer qua the designer of the particular object) in the course of rationally justifying belief that the object is designed would be to commit argumentive circularity.

Is it starting to become clearer?

Does anybody know what it means? Is it another unwitting argument in support of ID?

Nope, I haven't a clue either.

I hope you lot appreciate the effort I'm making in the Tard mines: this one will keep you going for weeks.

I'm risking my sanity here!

Bob

Date: 2007/07/11 11:30:49, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Yesssss!  Finally struck gold
Quote
 
Quote
   I’m wondering if you meant to say something like “ID theorists don’t make any postulates about the properties of a designer for their arguments.”.

No, as I tried to explain above, design (and designers) don’t come into play in ID argumentation at all except in reference to the self.

Says it all really.

Bob

Date: 2007/07/11 13:18:19, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Bob, we know you've had a rough week toiling in the tard mines so that we don't have to, and don't think we aren't grateful. You can see how your labo(u)rs have paid off. Help yourself to a well-earned beer.

Not one of Steve's tho. You wouldn't believe the cheap swill he buys.  :O

Thanks.  Actually, I'm having a rather nice glass of L'Esprit de Sainte Marguerite rosé wine that I picked up in Nice over the weekend (what I was doing in Nice is a long story, but I did finally get my luggage back).  It makes more sense than having beer around here: what with the taxes, all we can get is expensive swill and rabbit's piss.

Bob

Date: 2007/07/12 11:57:32, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
But man, a story with Nephilim, Dinosoars, an exploding Earth would be pretty exciting.

Dinosoars?  I guess they would be the pterodactyls.

Bob

Date: 2007/07/13 13:28:31, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Has anyone read through Dr. Dr. Dembski's Jesus Tomb manuscript?  He's gone Bayesian.  Which is odd, as he argued previously that the Bayesian approach was wrong.  I'll let you lot risk your ironymeters on all his, and just point out that Dembski's argument at the end is hand-waving that just says "well, we never believed it was the tomb in the first place".

I think you might be able to work out why it was important to attack the Bayesian approach to design inferences.  :-)

Bob

Date: 2007/07/14 00:16:41, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Meanwhile, I'm back in the
Tard mine.  Crandaddy is now in effect claiming that ID can only detect human design (i.e. design where we know about the designers).  I do so want to ask him who designed the bacteria flagellum.  'coz is wasn't me: I was too busy persuading Jesus he should be buried at sea.

Bob

Date: 2007/07/16 11:59:40, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
But let's start at the beginning.  

No, don't do it!  It's not worth your sanity!

I seem to have spent the whole thread asking one question, and not getting an answer to it.  It's not even a difficult question.

Bob

Date: 2007/07/16 15:08:36, Link
Author: Bob O'H
hologans - basically, he says that the maths is wrong, but a lot of other people say the same thing.  If it wasn't so late, and I didn't have a cat tail waving over my keyboard, I might dig out MarkCC's posts on it at Good Math, Bad Math.  He then goes on to invoke a Bayesian approach - one he has previously dismissed with respect to ID - to, in effect, obfuscate the rather obvious point that nobody believed it in the first place.

That good enough for you?  If you want more, you'll have to negotiate with Jack about tail placement.

Bob

Date: 2007/07/18 01:00:10, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
And how much did he bring in in grants? More to the point, how much indirect?

Someone posted the numbers, and IIRC it wasn't enough to keep a single PhD student going.

Bob

Date: 2007/07/18 01:04:58, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (N.Wells @ July 17 2007,08:28)
From http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....-128201
 
Quote
Now, B, you ate by your own admission, a published author on phil of sci.


Bob, is there something you ought to be telling us????

One paper in Oikos.  An ecology journal:

O'Hara, R.B., 2005. The Anarchist's Guide to Ecological Theory. Or, we don't need no stinkin' laws. Oikos 110: 390-393.

I think it's still the most downloaded paper from that issue.

Bob

Date: 2007/07/18 09:55:06, Link
Author: Bob O'H
N.Wells - you actually read it?!  More than just the abstract.

You'll go blind.

Bob

Date: 2007/07/18 12:40:32, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Amongst the biologists here, hands up who pissed themselves laughing when they saw Sal try to use Nei to bolster ID?  He sneaks Lewontin in too.

We're doomed!  Doomed I tell you!

Bob

Date: 2007/07/18 13:42:06, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Random adaptation...? It doesn't make sense.

Well, it could be adaptation in a random environment (I actually wrote a paper on that, using some data that Fisher and Ford had started collecting!).  But overall it's nothing particularly revolutionary, and not as revolutionary as Nei seems to want it to be.  

I've posted at UD about this - you lot can see how they react, I'm off to bed.

Bob

Date: 2007/07/20 08:54:17, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Aaagh!  The stupid!  I'm not going to post it: I don't hate any of you enough.
http://www.uncommondescent.com/science....-128501

I guess I just have to acquiesce.

Bob

Date: 2007/07/20 11:44:05, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Richardthughes @ July 20 2007,10:52)
Hey UDers. I'm missing some of my premium content!

Why no "Bast month eva" chart from DaveTard?

Why no "I'm fleecing some rubes with 'ID for bizniz folks'" post from D*mbski?

It's like, they only want me to know certain things, or summin'.

Ah Rich, if you want Tard, you should go here:
http://www.uncommondescent.com/science....omments

Some high-grade stupidity there - I barely tapped with a hammer, and the whole seam gushed out.

It includes Sal repeatedly trying to quote-mine, in the hope we'll get upset.  He also tries to derail the thread, presumably to the annoyance of the poor guy who started the post, who is, um, wait a moment...

Oh.

Bob

Date: 2007/07/20 13:53:05, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Albatrossity2, why are you expecting consistency?  They would need some level of understanding first.

Bob

Date: 2007/07/22 04:29:46, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Revealing my utter mundanity, I just received my copy of "Deathly Hallows," the final Harry Potter book.

Oh, I finished that yesterday.  :-)

All I can say I that Harry did better than Arthur Dent: Kings Cross does have a bit more class than Southend.

Bob

Date: 2007/07/23 00:12:44, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
But I'd better not try to reverse-engineer this.  They'll sic some patent lawyers onto me:

If they do, just claim it evolved naturally.

Bob

Date: 2007/07/23 12:39:15, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I think I'm OK at the moment, because Sal is on my side.  But it's not easy faced with so much ignorance.

It does remind me of this article (pdf), though.

Bob

Date: 2007/07/23 13:04:34, Link
Author: Bob O'H
A professional journalist
has written:
Quote
At Mindful Hack I have put up some information from a neurosurgeon on what the mind obviously isn’t merely the brain.


Unfortunately, there's nothing at all funny about the title:
Quote
Just how much brain do you need? Could you use that space for something else?

There's no way you lot are going to get a humo[u]rous jibe at Ms. O'Leary's expense out of that, is there?

Bob

Date: 2007/07/24 13:12:24, Link
Author: Bob O'H
In my quest to get the UDers to understand simple evolutionary theory, I just did a google search to find a decent definition of Fisherian fitness.  To my embarrassment, the best link I could find was my own lecture notes.

There's good tard over there at the moment.  Enjoy.

Bob

Date: 2007/07/25 00:18:38, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Ha!  This is why I work to stay on UD:
Quote
Next he tried to solve this problem by reference to trade-off, which has no bearing on my argument (as my argument refers to surviving offspring, not just numbers of offspring) – this is the classic red-herring (i.e. dragging a red-herring through the argument).

http://www.uncommondescent.com/science....-128988

The last part, after the dash, is correct.  If it refers to the part before the dash...

Bob

Date: 2007/07/25 11:27:58, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I was amused by how aggressive kairosfocus was in his question: I know what would happen if I had posted that.

I also wonder what are the chances he'll get an answer.

Bob

Date: 2007/07/25 13:40:53, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Damn, I've decided to try to extract myself from the tard, but then PaV gives me this:

Quote
“The fittest, to Darwin, were not those which survived, but those which could be expected to survive on the basis of their traits.”

Don’t you see how illogical this statement is on the face of it? Darwin didn’t think the “fittest” were “those which survived”. So, he then thought they were the ones that didn’t survive?

He can't even read to the end of the sentence!

Bob

Date: 2007/07/27 00:42:03, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Now, everybody.  Sit down and take a deep breath.  Good.  And another.  Make sure you are nice and relaxed before you read on.  Are we sitting comfortably?  So, we'll begin...

johnnyb has put up a sensible and interesting post at UD.  He compares the way the early mutation researchers worked to how he started learning to programme his computer.  Nothing about ID, nothing about the evils of Darwin or materialism.  No snide remarks about the cluelessness of scientists.  Just a simple post pointing out that randomly using pokes and peeks is sometimes how we learn things, albeit inefficiently.

The emergency services and their defribrilators will be with you in a moment.

Bob

Date: 2007/07/27 06:47:28, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
He's confusing a "scientist trying to work out how life works" with "life".

I interpreted that part as him talking about himself trying to write programmes (with peeks and pokes), not about what had been programmed.

Bob

Date: 2007/07/27 12:00:23, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Zachriel @ July 27 2007,11:55)
What happened to JAM, Jehu? What happened to JAM.

The rule is JAM tomorrow and JAM yesterday - but never JAM today.

Bob

Date: 2007/07/28 12:40:25, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Now, now Hermagoras.  Remember one of WmAD's PhD theses was in probability theory.  He even published this:
W.A. Dembski (1990).  Uniform probability. Journal of Theoretical Probability 3: 611-626.
Just in case you were thinking of reading it, this is the abstract:
Quote
A general theory of uniform probability is developed for compact metric spaces, which agrees with Lebesgue measure, Haar measure, and various fractal measures in specific cases.

(I've no idea how good this paper actually is: it's not the sort of thing I would read.  And in my opinion, anything with metric spaces is to be avoided, as is any journal on theoretical probability.  That's just overkill).

Bob

Date: 2007/07/29 01:12:58, Link
Author: Bob O'H
It's not just the SLoT we'll have to violate:
http://www.uncommondescent.com/science....-129590
Quote
194

Charlie

07/28/2007

2:22 pm

Tard Alert!

Hi DaveScot and Acquiesce,
Funny Denyse reviewing Tipler right now, as yesterday I wrote (and discarded) a reference to him in response to this conversation.
Dave’s idea that humanity is a necessity of this universe and our survival reminds me of Tipler’s ideas. He says that humans must and will develop technologies to halt the expansion of the universe. This is a necessity of the future because without it the expansion would entail breaking the laws of physics. Because the laws of physics cannot be broken, the expansion will be stopped, and humans will arrive at the ability to facilitate this.
The future determines the past in that the necessary and decided outcome must be accommodated by what comes before it.

As Dave says:

   So the way I see it humanity is here to provide relocation services so that life doesn’t end when the earth does.

Nothing but teleology and design there.

Start the clock: we only have 42 billion years to save the universe!

Bob

Date: 2007/07/30 03:54:23, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Should we set up a fund to pay for Bill's psychotherapy?

Thanks for the hard work: somebody had to do it, and I'm glad it wasn't me.

Bob

Date: 2007/08/01 03:29:17, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Egad, Galapagos Finch is at it again.

I'm not going to link to it, just in case someone wants to claim that the photo looks like Jerry Coyne.

Oh, and why hasn't the word "projection" been used here in the last day?

Bob

EDIT: so that I don't claim that the photo looks like Jerry Coyne.

Date: 2007/08/01 08:56:52, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Albatrossity2 - may I suggest a way of dealing with your frustration, and helping Lenny too.  You're going to become increasingly steamed up, so any time you feel like throwing it away, do so in the direction of Florida.  Then continue reading from where it lands.  Let's see if you finish the book or the delivery first.

Bob

Date: 2007/08/01 09:06:29, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Thanks, N.Wells.  And that was only one: I think the whole paragraph could be used to power a 20-screen multiplex.

And that's before we get to the comments:

Quote
As Augustine put it, “the ridiculous deserves to be ridiculed”

Quote


“I try to avoid criticizing my own side.”

An unmistakable manifestation of an ideologue.


Quote
When will these legacy media nerds grow up and start thinking their own thoughts?

All they ever do is show how terribly ignorant they are by repeating the Darwinian mantras over and over without ever checking out whether the mantras have become old, obsolete and moldy like the inane one cited by the ignoramus from Chicago Reader.

You’d think they’d figure out that they themselves, anything but scientists of any kind, are merely chanting the politically correct versions they prefer without wit, investigation, logic or even eloquence


Bob
(EDIT to move the "Bob".  Gah!)

Date: 2007/08/08 04:31:03, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I'm no sure if a round of applause for Lenny is appropriate, so I thought this would do instead:
(shrug)
(shrug)
(shrug)
(shrug)
(shrug)
(shrug)
(shrug)

Bob

Date: 2007/08/11 03:00:58, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Bugger, there goes my theory that Paul Nelson and k.e. are actually the same person.

Bob

Date: 2007/08/11 06:44:32, Link
Author: Bob O'H
The comments in BarryA's latest post are confusing:

Quote
To compare religion and science in this way is rediculous. Both (ideally) seek the truth, but religion has never claimed to be “self-testing” in the scientific, imperical sense. I


Quote
Both religion and science adjust to new data. Otherwise most people would still be 6-day creationists. Is she trying to say that religions don’t adjust to new data? That’s ridiculous.


Quote
Why would God’s word need revising like science given the presuppositions held by Christians? The whole point is that divine revelations is right — it does not NEED adjusting.


Quote
Is it even correct to say that religion doesn’t entail a “self-testing process”?

Doesn’t the fruit of a particular belief system (atheism, vodoo, Christianity) constitute a kind of test of its divine vs. human origin?


So is religion open to revision or not?

And the final comment at the moment is:
Quote
You don’t really want Eric Von Daniken on board. Most people consider him a crackpot and by association…


Bob

Date: 2007/08/11 12:07:43, Link
Author: Bob O'H
The full interview is on the ABC's site.  A couple of comments:
1. Calder is a global warming sceptic (and therefore designated Officially Evil by us scientists).
2. The interviewer helps by buggering up his criticism of Dawkins by throwing in epigenetics, when Calder seemed to be talking about epistasis.  Either way, it's not clear what it is that Calder thinks Dawkins is actually missing.
3. Does Calder have any training in biology?  I'm wondering why someone at UD would presume him to be an expert in...  Oh, never mind.

Bob

Date: 2007/08/12 08:25:50, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Zachriel @ Aug. 12 2007,07:51)
Quote
kairosfocus: Having seen and been a victim of the sort of abuse that often takes over blog threads on this general topic, I sympathise with a strong policy on abuse and willful obtuseness or mere empty regurgitation of a party line.

Argh!

I called the emergency services, and told them you address, and said I thought you might need an ambulance.  There was a weary sigh from the other end of the phone, followed by a resigned call of "Zachriel's irony-meter has blown up again".

I hope your insurance company never catches on.

Bob

Date: 2007/08/13 11:36:14, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Richardthughes @ Aug. 13 2007,01:42)
Looks like creobots might be trying to edit this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Falsifiability

I went there, and then by mistake clicked on the "Conspiracy Theory" link.  The article has one of those "The neutrality of this article is disputed" banners.  I bet it is!

Bob

Date: 2007/08/14 11:14:47, Link
Author: Bob O'H
The post was written by the Tard.  He must have gone for a lie-down after all that violating of the SLoT.

Bob

Date: 2007/08/14 13:59:15, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Apparently global warming deniers have bannination buttons too:  
Quote
tribune7
I think one common aspect between ID and GW skepticism is how those of us who are IDists or GW skeptics treat those with whom we disagree.

Date: 2007/08/16 09:44:06, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Oh, don't worry VM.  If UD goes, we'll just find another ID blog to mock (I can think of at least one  ;-))

Bob

Date: 2007/08/17 00:21:58, Link
Author: Bob O'H
The least said about this the better:

Quote

4

DrDan

08/16/2007

8:42 am

Tard Alert!

Hi Denyse,

Thank you for the wonderfully written ?blog?. I think that what you have written gets to the heart of darwinism. As David Warren wrote

? ? why [do] so many people get so excited about an area of science that should not concern them. For most of these correspondents know precious little science, and haven?t the stamina to engage in detailed argument.?

I am a physicist, and I have to confess that I know little about biology, not enough to argue the merits of Darwinism. I would venture to say that most non-biological scientists know as little as I do. Yet most would defend darwinism as though their eternal soul mattered. And I think this is the crux, for most people the argument is spiritual rather than scientific. This is one of my slogans (maybe someone else said it first but I don?t know): Never let facts get in the way of what we believe.


Bob

Date: 2007/08/17 00:29:48, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Via ERV, we learn that the Journal of Creation is now available online, with a 12-month delay.  Lots of pdf fun for all the family!

There's even an ID prediction pdf) (in a review by Walter ReMine of Simon Conway Morris' book):
Quote
Message Theory claims life was reasonably designed: (1) for survival, (2) to look like the product of one designer (or group of designers acting together as one, rather than multiple independent designers), and (3) to also resist evolutionary explanations. This theory explains
and predicts: (a) the vast unity of all life-forms, including their astonishing unity at the biochemical level (which
is not predicted by evolution). It also predicts the system-wide, large-scale patterns exposed by Gould and Morris, (b) the large gaps between life-forms that defy Darwinian gradualism, © the absence of clear-cut ancestors and lineage ? in other words, (d) the abundance of diversity (i.e. in Gould?s words, ?indecipherable bushiness?), plus (e) the abundance of ?convergence?
(which cannot be explained by common descent, by atavism, or by Transposition). Also, there is, (f) the
substantial absence of a Transposition pattern (particularly in the fossil record, the multicellular life-forms). Plus (g)
the origin-of-life is such an intractable problem for naturalism. Life is unified as the work of one designer, while simultaneously designed to resist evolutionary explanations. These are the major patterns of life, and
Message Theory explains them all in a coherent, scientifically testable (i.e., empirically risky) manner. I claim the entirety of Morris?s book?and its documentation of life?s abundant ?convergence? pattern?as evidence for
Message Theory.


Go on folks, start digging....

Date: 2007/08/18 01:24:26, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Denyse
weighs in again:
Quote
The basic problem, in my view, is that Behe outclasses Dawkins. Behe is a working biochemist who knows exactly what Darwinian evolution has and hasn?t done. Unlike Dawkins, who has contributed nothing of substance to science for many years, he does not make Darwinian evolution a substitute for religion. So it is safe for him to know what it can and cannot do.

Which sort-of implies that Behe has contributed something of substance to science over the past few years.  But if I check I find that ...  

Oh, sod it.  You know the punchline.  But he did write this appeal to political understanding:

Agarwal S, Behe MJ
Non-conservative mutations are well tolerated in the globular region of yeast histone H4
JOURNAL OF MOLECULAR BIOLOGY 255 (3): 401-411 JAN 26 1996

The UD take on this:
"The liberals are infecting our yeast!  They're plotting against good American bread!"

Bob

Date: 2007/08/18 08:11:06, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Err, my apologies to you and your dog (and the ironymeter, I suppse) djmullen.  But I thought pointing out that the post was by Denyse would be enough of an alert.

?????B??o?b

Date: 2007/08/19 03:03:16, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I'm suffering from withdrawal - two mornings without any new tard fix from UD.  Who do I complain to?

Bob

Date: 2007/08/19 09:08:56, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Perhaps Marks just has better inter-personal skills than Dembski, and he didn't piss off his colleagues.

Bob
EDIT: just a thought: how would UD and others in the ID crowd have reacted if anyone else had been treated in this way?  Surely there would have been complaints about "Sternberging" and loss of academic freedom.

Date: 2007/08/19 10:40:26, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Ah, but not new tard.  

Ah, but now there is: Denyse is so happy - of the many newspapers in the US, one has finally published a positive review of Behe's book.

Bob

Date: 2007/08/20 00:07:37, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Yeah, you Americans are lagging behind when it comes to evolution.  Our European Journal of Evolutionary Biology managed to stagger on to September 2007.

And we don't have to hide in some God forsaken place like New Zealand when we want to meet each other.  No, we go to Sweden instead.

Bob

Date: 2007/08/31 14:18:03, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Well, it looks like you folks were having fun whilst I was away being an evilutionist in godless Sweden.  Whilst there I learned two things:
1. Swedes do make one decent beer - the kloster?l from Visby.  This is made away from the mainland, to stop it infecting their normal stuff.
2. Jeannot is Bill Dembski's long-lost brother.  Poor guy.  I'd willingly give up my beard so he can hide his shame, but we're rather too attached.

Bob

Date: 2007/09/01 01:30:57, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
If you take away the readers of this thread who check UD several times per day, their audience is even smaller.

*counts on fingers*

Yep.  That's right.

Bob

Date: 2007/09/01 02:16:06, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Richardthughes @ Aug. 27 2007,14:47)
New advert in the Tardshoppe window:

http://www.evolutionnews.org/

Ha Ha Ha!

Look at the screen dumps of the questions.  In the first, it's cut off at the right.  The second is for question 77, and it's not cut off, so we can see most of one of the potential answers.  We can also therefore see the current score - 22%.

Bob

Date: 2007/09/02 03:55:51, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Sal seems to make a strange admission:
Quote
I attempted to apply both at Hopkins and at Baylor.

What happened with Baylor?  Was the form too complicated to fill in?

Bob

Date: 2007/09/02 06:18:13, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I'm going for Botnik being Denyse, the style is a give-away.  Can you see any of the others writing this:
Quote
{For heaven?s sake people, THIS IS A P-A-R-O-D-Y!!}


I reckon Bill will be a bit pissed off when he wakes up - if Botnik doesn't apologise, then she's scuppered any chances WmAD has of getting back to Baylor in the near future.  If she apologises, she'll make herself look silly after writing this:

http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....-135273
Quote
Fork - I?ve been given administrator privileges, so I could remove your post, but my motto is ?once on the web, always on the web.? I?m happy to apologize to Lilley once he apologizes to Marks and puts back his website on the Baylor server. By the way, to which tune do you sing ?Baylor ueber alles??

(there, copied just in case she deletes it)

Bob

Date: 2007/09/02 10:57:19, Link
Author: Bob O'H
http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....-135327
Quote
Besides, when Darwinists fool people with a hoax, they don?t wait for the laughter to subside (or as in Botnik?s case, wait for it to bomb) and then confess it as a parody. On the contrary, they collaborate to keep the lie alive until it becomes institutionalzed and then close ranks around it.


Hoax?  Us?  *Tries to look innocent*

Bob

Date: 2007/09/03 00:47:55, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Wesley R. Elsberry @ Sep. 02 2007,15:33)
TDoL is the third edition of "Of Pandas and People", a Foundation for Thought and Ethics project. FTE brought Dembski aboard as the editor back before the Kitzmiller case. Dembski's bragging about that position and his coming to have expertise by revamping OPAP in his expert report for KvD made it pretty much obligatory that the plaintiffs demand the manuscript for TDoL, and the drafts of OPAP.

It might have been a different ballgame without Dembski's "unwitting" assist that way.

Ah, another highlight from Dover, when the creationists intelligent designers sudden emergentists discovered breasts.

A couple of quotes from the record:
 
Quote
Matt, could you pull up pages 99 to 100 and highlight our favorite passage? That was the passage we spent some time on yesterday, " 5intelligent design means that various forms of life began abruptly through an intelligent agency, with their distinctive features already intact, fish with fins and scales, birds with feathers, beaks, and wings, etc." You said a few things about this passage. One is you don't like it so much.


and the updated version
 
Quote
This passage of the draft manuscript reads, "Sudden emergence holds that various forms of life began with their distinctive feature already intact, fish with fins and scales, birds with feathers and wings, animals with fur and mammary glands. Sudden emergence is the face value interpretation of the fossil record. It interprets the structural differences separating the major types of organisms in the fossil record as a generally true reflection of biological diversity and natural history." First of all, the use of the word "true" in science is somewhat problematic I think you have told us?

(emphases added.  And as always, thanks to Wes for putting this up as html)

Ah, happy days.

Bob
EDITS: repaired my buggering up of the links

Date: 2007/09/04 00:47:56, Link
Author: Bob O'H
One for those in academia:
(all quotes from Denyse O'Dembski.  Emphases mine)
 
Quote
On Thursday (12.07.06) I learned it was definite that Baylor University was revoking a postdoctoral fellowship that I held in the Department of Electrical and Computer Engineering.


 
Quote
My appointment as Senior Research Scientist in Baylor?s Department of Electrical and Computer Engineering began November 2006.


For those of you stuck in the real world, a post-doc is someone who has just got their PhD, and is still considered junior - they can't officially supervise PhD students for example.  A senior research scientist is at least one step above in the ladder.

I was initially amused that Dembski was prepared to take a demotion, but it looks as if he wasn't, even if administratively that's what was happening.

Bob



Date: 2007/09/04 01:32:26, Link
Author: Bob O'H
JAM - I think your description of a senior scientist would (in practice) match mine for a university - I assume you weren't thinking of technicians.  I guess for applied institutes your definition is appropriate (I'm thinking of places like CSL or NIAB in the UK, which do mainly monitoring work rather than academic research).

Mind you, whichever definition we take, it doesn't help Dembski much, does it?

Bob

Date: 2007/09/04 10:15:02, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Wesley R. Elsberry @ Sep. 04 2007,07:20)
So, as of the 2006/12/03 posting date, Dembski's understanding was that he did have employment at Baylor University, something he was at pains to obscure in his post on UD of that date.

This raises one issue that isn't clear.  Dembski had a full-time job at the seminary, and there was no comment about taking leave (even partial).  So he couldn't really be employed to work as a post-doc elsewhere.  Was he actually being employed at Baylor?

I wonder if the grant was simply for the overheads to give Dembski an office (without a window!) in Baylor, and not for salary.

Bob

Date: 2007/09/04 13:40:05, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Denyse O'Leary and neuroscientist Mario Beauregard have a new book published.

I just hope Beauregard did the writing.

Bob

Date: 2007/09/05 02:25:06, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Poor Bill's been replaced at Evolutionary Informatics by another Bill.  Welcome Bill Basener!

He has even done some work on biology - on population dynamics (errm, not evolution).  Admittedly it's just mathematics, and I'm pretty sure it (or something similar) has been done before , but it's more than most IDers.

Bob

Date: 2007/09/05 03:32:03, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I suspect New Bill might know who Shannon was.  Or if he doesn't, it's because Shannon did applied stuff that isn't interesting.

New Bill looks like a perfectly respectable mathematician (and it's not often you see those words next to each other: only 168 hits on Google).  He'll be worth watching with interest: is he honest but mis-guided?  Or more Dembski-like in his character?

Actually, the same questions could be asked about Marks too.

Bob

Date: 2007/09/06 10:45:26, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Erasmus - I think jerry is one of their regular tards.

I'm hoping someone tried to argue against his comment.  The next post is about an article in the Lebanon Daily News which includes this bit of hard-core science:
Quote
I?m confident that in the not-to-distant future the information-revolution will sound the death knell for Darwinism. The hard evidence of technology will shake the pillars of evolutionary theory and toss them into the dustbin of history. When America restores true Bible science and accountability to our Creator God into our political and educational institutions, we?ll have taken a giant step toward healthier national character and the prevention of crime, life without purpose and the consequences of our condom culture.

Condom culture? What a dick.

Bob

Date: 2007/09/08 01:41:54, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Oh, and to avoid being totally off topic - how old is the Earth?

And when's its birthday?

Bob

Date: 2007/09/08 04:45:09, Link
Author: Bob O'H
WmAD
 
Quote
As I indicated in my insertion to your comment, the work of the lab is squarely within Robert Marks’s area of expertise. Go on the IEEE website and you’ll find that evolutionary computing is an established subdiscipline of engineering.

DaveTard
 
Quote
It is my understanding that the EIL charter was to further the understanding of random mutation in biologic machinery.

It is my understanding that DT is talking out of his arse.

Bob

Date: 2007/09/08 08:49:44, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Can I play too?
Quote
Occasionally, fake science has been artificially produced. Examples include ‘Darwin's Black Box’ and some
farty noises. How have the fakes been detected? What motivated the fakers? Has anyone ever mistaken genuine science for a fart? Research and write a 200 word essay.

I was an undergrad in Leeds, where McIntosh is a professor.  Luckily I didn't do chemistry.

My impression is that thee guys haven't gained any traction - there isn't the support on the ground that there is in the US, so when they sent their crap round to schools, I suspect most teachers just laughed at them over coffee.

Bob

Date: 2007/09/08 09:02:24, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Reciprocating Bill, you may have to be called into action soon to record a bannination:

http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....-136340
Quote


22

mullerpr

09/08/2007

4:52 am

Tard Alert!

This clearly states the fact that the cure for cancer will come from an inferred design presupposition and not from any evolutionary presuppositions.

More people will break the presuppositional paradox of evolution and their actual scientific work. That should be the current count of how much ID work is actually being done.

Well, I presuppose that's what'll happen.

Bob

Date: 2007/09/08 13:27:20, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (k.e @ Sep. 08 2007,12:33)
Sal is shining shit over here

Oh boy, in there Sal writes
Quote
I put little credence to someone who will not identify themselves.

Hmmm.  What did he write when he retreated from public view?
Quote
Thus, on the advice of professors from other universities, I have decided to play it safe and retreat from further public debate (at least under my own name).

Ah, that was it.  So, he's taken less than a week to reappear elsewhere, and is still holding out the possibility of using a sock-puppet.

Oh, and somewhere he said that "Sal" wasn't his real name.  Anyone remember where?  ERV's cottage cheese filled blog?  I can't find it at the moment.

Bob

Date: 2007/09/08 14:00:05, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Ah, thanks.  Sal at his, um, best.  This is precisely what he wrote
Quote
I'm listed at Hopkins under the last name "Cordova", but you'll see me under my birth name, not under "Salvador".

The thread around it is hilarious, in case any of you haven't read it already.

Bob

Date: 2007/09/08 14:23:33, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I've watched bits of all matches so far and it's looking like a southern hemisphere side is going to win this year.  NZ were awesome.  England (at least in the second half) were awful.

But we beat Israel 3-0, and India by 7 wickets, so it's not all bad.

Bob

Date: 2007/09/09 01:14:17, Link
Author: Bob O'H
GilDodgen opines:
Quote
Apparently, one needs a Ph.D. to be this stupid.

[Evolutionary Informatics Lab]

I think that should have been a colon, not a full stop.

Bob



Date: 2007/09/09 13:01:27, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
"It is possible that the article might be accepted on its previous review" indicates that this article has not necessarily survived a peer review process of any kind.

I think you're being ungenerous in your interpretation.  Top journals will often reject papers because they're not of high enough interest, even if the work is done well enough.  I read this as saying that the previous peer reviews will be read, and if the only problem is that the work isn't good enough for a top class journal (i.e. the referees have done a proper job, and don't see any major weaknesses), then they'll accept it.

It's a slightly odd idea, but I can see some merit in it.

Bob

Date: 2007/09/10 00:54:57, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Hmmm, this idea might be testable.  If front-loading occurred, then the genomes of the "lower" taxa would have been larger.  Earlier this year, Organ et al. had a paper published (not in Cell Cycle, in one of their feeder journals) which estimated genome size from cell size in bones:

http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v446/n7132/abs/nature05621.html
Organ, C.L., Shedlock, A.M., Meade, A., Pagel, M. and Edwards, S.V. (2007).  Origin of avian genome size and structure in non-avian dinosaurs.  Nature 446: 180-184.

[b]If[b] a similar relationship could be found in "lower" taxa, and [b]if[b] cells could be distinguished and their sizes measured from old (e.g. Cambrian) fossils, then one could test the prediction.

If one found that "lower" taxa had more DNA, then one only has to get round the problem of mutation degrading the genome.

Bob

Date: 2007/09/10 11:25:39, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Zachriel @ Sep. 10 2007,07:20)
Quote
bornagain77: Who will lay odds that PZ doesn’t even know how to work on cars?

Well, that settles it then. PZ Myers doesn't know anything about evolutionary biology because he may not be able to replace a car's alternator. He has no scientific credibility whatsoever.


PZ even thinks that bits of cars reproduce, and he's teaching his students this.  I mean, how can you have a course in transmission genetics, when everyone knows that their inheritance is Lamarckian.

Bob

Date: 2007/09/10 13:13:16, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Kindly remove your ironymeters from the room.

Done it?  Good.  On the But PZ Myers is still evil post, DLH gives us the following.  The emphasis is mine.
Quote
True science is an application of:
* “As iron sharpens iron, so one man sharpens another.” Pvbs 27:17;
* “. . . to search out a matter is the glory of kings.” Pvbs 25:2; and
* “. . . rebuke a wise man and he will love you.” Pvbs 9:8b.

Love you?  Is that why they read the marriage bans in church?

Bob

Date: 2007/09/10 13:28:09, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Richardthughes @ Sep. 10 2007,13:18)
Quote (k.e @ Sep. 10 2007,12:49)
Fttt anyone can do that. I once rebuilt a VW beetle gearbox and got 4 reverse gears and 1 forward gear.

Pfff. French tanks come with 4 reverse gears out of the box. They're for expedited withdrawing.

Yeah, but at least they didn't only have armour fitted on the rear. like the Italian tanks.

There aren't any Italians reading this, are there?

Bob

Date: 2007/09/11 00:54:32, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Denyse and several others are trying to exploit this incident by making it seem that the Darwinian establishment is shutting down ID's attempts at research.  

That would be difficult to do.

Bob

Date: 2007/09/11 01:10:50, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I like bornagain77.  He's a rich seam in the tard mine:
Quote
Do you think the younger races have more information for skin color than the younger races?
I think it is fairly obvious that the East Africans have all the inherent traits of all the races in their genomes! Whereas it is also obvious that Europeans are much more deficient of the raw material to “make” other color races. To me it is clear that more information for skin color resides in the East Africans! It is commonly known that the black color is really a mixture of all the other colors when referring to materials, whereas white contains all the other colors when referring to light! As to how to extrapolate this basic fact for color information to the genome I do not know right now.

(and there's more where that came from!)

Bob

Date: 2007/09/13 12:15:09, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Huh?  The Taliban are in to role playing games?  D&D or Runequest?

I'm guessing not Call of Cthulhu.

Bob

Date: 2007/09/13 12:30:13, Link
Author: Bob O'H
In honour of OE, presumably everyone would have hip-points.

Bob

Date: 2007/09/13 13:43:22, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
"It was the best of times, it was the worst of times..."

...so they called it The Independent.

Bob (stealing from ISIHAC)

Date: 2007/09/13 13:48:23, Link
Author: Bob O'H
http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....on-line
Quote
Mario Beauregard speaking at mind-brain conference in Finland

Oh, thanks.  Tell use in the evening, why don't you?  I could have popped down and had a giggle.

Bob

Date: 2007/09/14 12:48:30, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Zachriel @ Sep. 14 2007,11:27)
This one is rather long, so read it for yourself. Gareth is doing an excellent job explaining why the Rabbit in the Pre-Cambrian would be a valid falsification of the Theory of Evolution. Johnnyb, idnet.com.au and DaveScot chime in.

Quote
russ: A science buff/atheist coworker of mine offered this possible falsification of NDE: “A fossilized rabbit in precambrian rock.” This strikes me as a rigged example, but I’m unsure why that is.

Gareth: I don’t think the “rabbit in the Pre-Cambrian” idea is rigged - it’s very valid.

Bornagain77 pulls out all the stops--the full panoply of quote-mines.

Egads.  bornagain77's post is over 2000 words long.  Yesterday he managed to write over 1000 words to fail to answer one of my questions.  I hope he's a fast typist.

Bob

Date: 2007/09/15 04:42:03, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (stevestory @ Sep. 14 2007,20:34)
We've been so devastated, it's inconsiderate of us to act like we haven't. Continuing to publish thousands of papers per year is downright rude...

Err, yeah.  Sorry about that.

If it helps, I've tried to get journals to reject a few.

Bob

Date: 2007/09/15 10:46:29, Link
Author: Bob O'H
She's up now.  Perhaps UD went for a toilet break.

Bob

Date: 2007/09/15 14:14:51, Link
Author: Bob O'H
It's up to 5 in the charts now.

Which, given the popularity of UD, must be pretty depressing for the board.  Does no one know who they are?

Bob

Date: 2007/09/16 02:21:49, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Over on another thread, Rich and BWE have pointed to this book:
Sex and Character (Pandas Publications a Series About Central Questions)by Deborah D. Cole (Author), Maureen G. Duran (Author), William Dembski (Editor)

I thought it was better to come over here to quote the way the book starts:
Quote
How far would you go to do what you know is right?  Would you sacrifice something important?  Would you risk your life?  Would you face being ridiculed and rejected?


Bob

Date: 2007/09/16 06:46:05, Link
Author: Bob O'H
In amongst Glen's short and pithy replies, we have this:
http://expelledthemovie.com/blog/2007/08/21/bens-blog/#comment-1275
Quote
Dear Ben,

I see by the comments that you’ve ticked off a bunch of Darwinists. It’s interesting that they can only resort to calling you names. I just wanted to let you know that I applaud your willingness to put out the truth about the suppression of dissension. My bachelor’s degree is in electrical engineering. It’s interesting that none of the courses (taught in a secular university) which I took had anything to do with evolution. It was never even mentioned because engineering has to do with science, not science fiction. It saddens me that most of your critics have never stopped for a moment and questioned what they believe. I have studied both evolution and ID. What are those people afraid of? GOD.

Keep up the good work.

Josh

Savour, just savour.

Bob

Date: 2007/09/16 11:21:10, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Jean - I think your nixplanatory filter needs to be serviced.


Um, no.  I didn't mean that way.  Now you'll need to clean it before you take it to the engineer.

Bob

Date: 2007/09/16 12:37:35, Link
Author: Bob O'H
They're busy reading the thousands of reports about the great Baylor scandal, so they don't have time to post anything.

Bob

Date: 2007/09/17 10:02:01, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
She is employing the argumentum ex curru urbano, the "argument from the street-car" which, if I recall my Aristotle correctly, is completely irrefutable.

Unless one is aboard the Clapham omnibus.

Bob

Date: 2007/09/17 12:14:21, Link
Author: Bob O'H
JohnW - argumentum ad making shit up is a nice segue into me pointing out that I've just put a post up on my amazingly brilliant blog, about the frontloading paper DaveTard was so excited about last week.

I mention this here partly because I'll get more traffic than if I did at UD, but largely because I don't know the personal phone numbers of anyone important.

Bob

Date: 2007/09/18 10:48:08, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
You are my NEW HERO, and I want to have your baby! (which might be a little hard, seeing as how I got this XY chromosome thing you know...)

You'll just have to pretend you're birds.

Bob

Date: 2007/09/18 11:52:42, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (supersport @ Sep. 17 2007,23:45)
Well actually, the past 30 years have seen the biggest rise in degnerative diseases -- heart disease, cancer, MS, diabetes, alzheimer's, etc etc......none of which have cures and all of which are killing more and more and more people despite the trillions of dollars being pumped towards Big Medicine.

You missed out stupidity.

Bob

Date: 2007/09/18 13:48:58, Link
Author: Bob O'H
http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....-137803
Quote
“From a scientific view point there is absolutely no doubt that evolution is a central theory for our understanding of the Universe and of life on Earth.”

I think this sentence sums up all the problems.

First and foremost, they are positing evolution in arenas not deemed correct. One does not need evolution to understand the universe. The universe was not built on darwinian theory.


What I almost wrote on UD as a reply:
Quote
Curses, bork!  You've got us Evil Atheists.  For years we've been trying to persuade the rest of the world that it's actually a part of the Universe.  But you've seen through our plot.

What put you on to us?

Date: 2007/09/20 00:14:54, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Nice avatar. I've been meaning to use CorelDraw to do up a "C" type logo.

Indeed.  Is Dr. Heddle admitting that he's an average atheist?

Bob

Date: 2007/09/21 00:35:05, Link
Author: Bob O'H
UD's down again.  Boo Hiss!

I'm blaming ERV for this.  My nixplanatory filter says it can't be a coincidence that it went down just after she and her 'friends' asked wMad a few 'questions'.

I hope ERV will be a nice girl and apologise to the poor unfortunate Dr. Dembski.

Bob

Date: 2007/09/21 13:03:28, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I, um, ...
http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....-parody

Dembski quotes Lilley saying that Dembski is an execrable character:
Quote
I greatly regret the difficulty that Dembski has created.

Oooh, how awful.

Bob

Date: 2007/09/22 10:25:05, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Remember that front-loading paper Dave was so happy about?  I've finally written part II of my fisking.

I'm not claiming I'm any good at this stuff, but it's better than errrm, well.

OK, perhaps it isn't.

Bob

Date: 2007/09/23 01:47:23, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Hey Bob-O: your link to noted fashion-physicist David Tyler killed me.

Honestly, I was only asking so I could make sure I was emailing the correct person.  Any humour is just added value.

Although I did like the "Strategies for Rochdale".  There's just something about these Northern industrial towns that's the antithesis of romantic.  One could almost imagine our Bill (D., not his reciprocal!) ending up somewhere like there.

I can also imagine the locals' reaction to him.  :-)

Bob

Date: 2007/09/23 05:11:26, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
like about Front Loading, I've still never seen them actually put down a proper testable prediction of this

Ah, but someone has.  In a journal that is sometimes peer reviewed.  It's still a pile of crap, but it's a published pile of crap with predictions.

Bob

Date: 2007/09/23 06:33:16, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Polonius said that brevity is the soul of wit.  Bornagain must therefore be witless:
http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....-138275
Quote
In  ...snip 2835 words ... science.

The List of Diverse Disproofs of Materialism is now up to 12 items, BTW.

Bob

Date: 2007/09/24 11:14:50, Link
Author: Bob O'H
The Masterson Series?  Reminds me of ...

The Masterson Inheritance

"In this week's Masterson Inheritance, The Tard of the Mastersons".

OK, only funny if you know the original - improvised comedy.  A bit like UD, only with less flatulence.

Bob

Date: 2007/09/24 13:05:52, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Buckminster fullerines don't behave like normal soccer balls because their quantum wavelength is proportional to their size (deBroglie's equation).

Hey, that's given me a great idea for a film, intended to get more girls interested in physics:

  Bend it Like deBroglie

No?

Date: 2007/09/25 00:46:15, Link
Author: Bob O'H
k.e. - wouldn't 90% of the bridge be made out of junk?

Bob

Date: 2007/09/26 01:00:26, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Ooh, someone new asking to be banned
Quote


35

ReligionProf

09/25/2007

2:06 pm

Tard Alert!

For some, the apparent inexplicability of such aspects of our existence is a pointer towards God. For others, the fact that we can understand, and that simple laws of nature give rise to great complexity, points towards God. The problem with treating these things as ‘proof’ is that, as Van Till points out, this is a ‘heads I win, tails you lose’ situation.

http://exploringourmatrix.blog.....ge-of.html

Date: 2007/09/26 09:21:22, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (dheddle @ Sep. 26 2007,07:59)
Is it just me, or do get the impression that Matthew Tan thinks Darwinism is religion?

Oh, but he's even-handed.  He thinks that ID is religion too.

I like Joseph's take on this:
Quote
Also there isn’t anything in ID that requires intervention.

I think this means that ID is agnostic about intelligent design.

Bob

Date: 2007/09/27 00:19:09, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
If the definition of science doesn’t allow for the possibility of the actions of intelligent agency in the universe then the definition needs to change.

I guess Dave thinks that psychology isn't a science.

Fortunately, for us Tardology still qualifies.

Bob

Date: 2007/09/27 00:49:13, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Rich's Trouble at t'mine link

More relevant than linking to his Yahoo! email account, although not as disturbing (Rich - what do you want with a shipment of 342 fluffy bunnies and a quart of HP sauce?).

Bob

Date: 2007/09/27 11:43:55, Link
Author: Bob O'H
This is what wMad was responding to:
Quote
Dave says that you are non-committal regarding common descent. There are Darwinists claiming that at your recent talk in Oklahoma, you said you did not believe that humans and apes share a common ancestor.

I think they’re making it up. Is there a transcript of the talk available so we can show that they’re lying?

Notice how he dances round ignores the question about the transcript.

Bob

Date: 2007/09/28 00:31:23, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote

http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....-139096
14

shaner74

09/27/2007

3:57 pm

Tard Alert!

Wow! Scary stuff. Honestly, what is wrong with EuropeAmerica? Seems every few decades or so, some crazy thinking gets a foothold there and then all hell breaks loose. At least it’s clear to see they’re absolutely petrified of IDscience.

Fixed it.  None of you mind, do you?

Bob

Bob

Date: 2007/09/28 12:40:48, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
No, he keeps a '45 in his sock, with the sheriffs concent.

So you're safe unless he's stood next to a turntable.

Bob

Date: 2007/09/29 01:41:57, Link
Author: Bob O'H
OK, which one of you is lotf?
Quote


18

lotf

09/28/2007

3:09 am

Tard Alert!

I have to admit as a non christian (though a believer in a higher power) but supporter of ID I am seeeing more and more references to christianity here and it’s beginning to put me off. I assumed my religion would not be an issue in the science of ID but I am worried it might be.

(and it gets better further down)

Bob
EDIT: Oh, yeah.  that's what lotf stands for.

Date: 2007/09/30 02:14:43, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Another newbie enters the pit:  
Quote

Yeah, as if scientists were more dogmatics than you proponents of intelligent design.
As for the method use to obtain interviews for people as Myers…
Two thumbs down for Ben Stein.

Later, in replying to the usual tard, he comes out with this nice bit of understatement:
 
Quote
I’m not involved in Darwinism, by the way. Darwin’s theory don’t make any use of the works of, say, Mendel, and it’s quite a flaw in it.


Eventually, The Tard Himself appears:
 
Quote
P.P.S. If I read any more snotty condescending crap from you it’ll be your last comment here.

Start warming up the banninator button!

Bob

Date: 2007/09/30 06:39:29, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I voted "other".  ID itself should not be taught (unless you're working to destroy a culture), but I have no problems with students being taught about ID, e.g. as an example of a movement in sociology or politics.

I guess it could also be taught in rhetoric classes.  *fart*.

Bob

Date: 2007/10/01 00:25:32, Link
Author: Bob O'H
bFast is a tard
Quote

Granville, Thanks for the post. I’ve been having a thought that needs an appropriate thread to carry it.
Actually Dr. Dembski, I would love your critique of this argument.
As we know, the standard solution to the dilemma of the finely tuned universe is to postulate a multiverse. The theory is that if there are an infinite number of universes, then every possible combination of universal constants will have been tried eventually, ours included. With an infinite number of universes, any inconceivable combination must have had a chance to come up somewhere.
However, I have recently been recalling my basic calculus. In calculus, as I recall, infinity (I’ll use oo) * 1/oo = some value. This causes me to think that an infinite number of universes isn’t enough.
Let me clarify my reasoning. If we consider, in calculus we solve the problem of getting our minds around infinity by calculating N as N -> oo. We should well be able to use the same algorithm to determine whether an infinite number of universes is enough to produce the finely tuned universe that we know of.
My understanding is that in what might be called super-space (because the big bang creates its own three-dimentional space) there are an infinite number of universes being spawned at any given moment. Further, there was infinite time past, but only time to the present day, whereas there is infinite time future that has not yet seen universes. I therefore contend that time only qualifies as oo^1/2. We then see that we have oo universes spawning at any given moment, * oo^1/2 moments to spawn them. So there is a total of oo^3/2 universes spawned so far. Let’s calculusize it (new word) to become N^3/2 lim N->oo.
Now, there are multiple constants that must be “just right”. Consider only the four primary forces. For each value that “works” there is an infinite number of values that will not work. If we only consider these four forces, and not other factors such as the speed of light or the planct constant, we already have oo^4 possible variations which would not produce a life-sustaining universe. Where I come from oo^4 is much more than oo^3/2. Again, to calculusize it, N^4 > N^3/2 lim N->oo.
If my calculations are correct, the multiverse hypothesis will not realistically account for the finely tuned universe that we live in.

Infinity welcomes careful drivers...

Bob
P.S. A few people have told Bornagain that his Einstein story is a fake, so I don't have to risk a bannination.

Date: 2007/10/02 14:23:39, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Don't worry folks, you'll get to see the denizens at UD fan over Bill an his apology.  In a couple of days he'll put up a post explaining how he negotiated the apology, so that he could rejoin the EIL and that now everyone's happy, except for those evilutionists who wanted to see him nailed to a tree.

If Bill doesn't write this, I'm sure Denyse will.

Bob

Date: 2007/10/03 01:17:46, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Tom - you can probably reconstruct two of them (and most of the comments!) from this thread.  The board of regents post can be reconstructed from the Baylor web pages and the phone directory.

Failing that, Wes must have them hidden away at DUUD.

Bob

Date: 2007/10/04 15:18:04, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (oldmanintheskydidntdoit @ Oct. 03 2007,12:51)
Quote (Richardthughes @ Oct. 03 2007,12:39)
Quote
Only intelligently designed processes can detect error.


Sometimes, creatures aren't formed perfectly and so they die. Sometimes, creatures don't have the right attributes to cope with their environment, so they die.

Is death an "intelligently designed process that can detect error"? Would that make the NS "intelligently designed" in RMNS?

Bob, go on ask em that over at UD, dare ya!

Sorry, I'm hiding in Estonia at the moment, building beautiful bridges.

Bob

Date: 2007/10/05 23:56:42, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Ah, Henry J.  You mean 10^150 minus 10^9 equals 10^16.67!  I knew I'd been making a mistake somewhere all there years.

Bob

Date: 2007/10/07 11:34:11, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Richardthughes @ Oct. 06 2007,22:37)
THE WHOLE THREAD HAS GONE!

Must be a selective server glitch, again.

*points and laughs at UD*

You are a bunch of bad, bad tards.


WATERLOOPY.

According to my sources, what happened is that John Lilley (pres of Baylor) faked a letter from Botnik to Dembski complaining about the article, because it was too funny.  Dembski didn't want to upset Botnik's feelings ('coz he's nice like that), so he took it down.

Bob
P.S. This is a P-A-R-O-D-Y

Date: 2007/10/08 09:05:01, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I think tribune7 must have meant "cool" in the same way that a corpse becomes cool.

Bob

Date: 2007/10/08 11:24:57, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
I promise to post a list of the top 10 ID research papers (as long as they are peer-reviewed) on my (not so well-known) university web pages. I am absolutely confident that my university administration will not censor that.


I'll promise that as well, on my equally unknown web pages.  I even promise not to intersperse the list with rude comments.

Bob

Date: 2007/10/09 00:03:25, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Atom is a tard
Quote

leo,
Quote
If God was perfect and designed us perfectly, than how could we “fall”?

Can a perfectly designed fuse break?
Can a creature designed to make its own choices possibly choose what its creator does not want?
Atom


Hey, we're missing out on quality tard here.  Starting from Atom's analogy of Fallen Man as fuse.  There's so much, I don't know where to start.

Bob

Date: 2007/10/09 12:48:51, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Dave's hypothesis is confirmed by the fact that his arms are exactly the right length to reach the keyboard.  Explain that, evilushonists!

Well, obviously his keyboard was intelligently designed.  You won't catch us out with such simple tricks.

Bob

Date: 2007/10/09 12:54:26, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Gods iPod is a tard
Quote

I hope this will be available as an audio book. I try to buy all my books in audio now. It lets me “read” 3 times a many books as I can reading. Would sure be nice to see some of yours in audio Dr Dembski.

I feel there's an opportunity not to be wasted.

k.e. - you do the reading, Reciprocating Bill - you speed up k.e.'s reverberating bass voice, Rich - you add the farty noises.

Bob
P.S. k.e., are you talking to Jeannot again yet?  :-)

Date: 2007/10/09 13:51:05, Link
Author: Bob O'H
What exactly do the authors suggest?  There's nothing that explicitly says that they say that creationism should be taught positively: they do say that it should be discussed, and that the pupils should be respected.  I think we should know more before condemning the authors.

Even if one of them was the inaugural editor of the journal Sex Education.

Bob

Date: 2007/10/10 00:31:27, Link
Author: Bob O'H
John Kelly is being naughty
Quote

Maybe the next book should be entitled “Darwin, Satan’s Servant”.
That would raise a few eyebrows.
Follow up with a two-part documentary called “The Love of Money”.


Alas, russ doesn't get it
Quote

Quote
Follow up with a two-part documentary called “The Love of Money”.

I don’t get it.

Date: 2007/10/10 12:25:27, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Louis @ Oct. 10 2007,09:33)
I'm tempted to show them what persecution really looks like.

Louis

Does that mean you're going to force them, Clockwork Orange-like, to watch Monty Python and the Holy Grail?

Bob

Date: 2007/10/11 00:52:25, Link
Author: Bob O'H
This request came through the back-channels of the Evil Darwinist Conspiracy:
Quote
I am trying to get hold of two brief creationist clips for teaching purposes.  They are the infamous "banana" and "peanut butter" videos, which can be seen at YouTube and other sites:

Banana http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9zwbhAXe5yk
Peanut butter
http://axiomsun.com/home....3;.html


I'm unable to get these as stand-alone clips in an mpeg or mov format. Does anybody have these?

Thanks,
Jerry Coyne


Can anyone help?  I'll pass this link on to Prof Coyne

Date: 2007/10/11 10:25:46, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Remember that Jerry was telling us all how he was knowledgeable about biology?  Well, Prof. Myers may like to look away...
Quote

I have a remote related question to what paraklete just said,
Has any part of the body been identified with development. We all know that development operates quickly during gestation so it is guided some how but it also operates for several more years after that and maybe till death. If some part of the brain or part of the body is removed, does it affect development? I find this an interesting question because “how does it know?” Obviously this could be done with any experimental mammal such as mice to get the answer. Does anyone know if this has been done?

Luckily I'm not a developmental biologist, but reading this I feel pain on their behalf.

Bob

Date: 2007/10/11 12:34:17, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Bob, just remember that they laughed at Copernicus too.  Jerry is Copernicus.  This is what a scientific revolution looks like.

Damn.  I was having such a good week until I read that.

Bob

Date: 2007/10/12 00:48:04, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Thanks Dave.  My exchange with Apollos was civil, and actually getting interesting.

I guess it's clear that beneath my questions was the point that ID as science (well, a poor approximation to science, anyway) stops at "it was designed".  This really irritates me as a scientist (*adjust pens in lab coat*).  Interesting, then, that both Dave and gpuccio are happy to go beyond this, and ask more about what the designer is like.  This is what I would like to see from ID.  I would like to have tried to explore this in more detail with Apollos - see if we could find some point of agreement about what ID can and cannot say.

In spite of all the mockery, there are aspects of ID that I do find genuinely interesting.

Bob

Date: 2007/10/12 06:59:54, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Richardthughes @ Oct. 12 2007,00:53)
Are you on double secret moderation now?

I don't think so, but I'll check later.

Bob

Date: 2007/10/13 04:02:14, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I'm surprised ex-xian is still posting at UD.  Dave must have gone for a lay-down.

A couple of responses to ex-xian:
PaV is a tard
Quote

ex-xian, you don’t seem to have a clue, so I will kindly give you one. The link between Darwinism, HIV/AIDS and Global Warming: government funding! So what we have is basically “scientific political correctness”.
I really have no axe to grind when it comes to the HIV/AIDS controversy; but consider this: HIV, the retrovirus, has been around since the 1920’s. If it’s been around since 1920, why did the AIDS epidemic start in the 80’s? Doesn’t that make you scratch your head a little? But, of course, you’re a liberal; and no one is more close-minded than a liberal, so, if the NY Times says that there’s no controversy, I’m sure that’s good enough for you. But we’re here to try and help you along.


Borne is a tard
Quote

ex-xian : I suppose that stands for ex christian - a very dumb, judas-like confession if ever there was one.

How nice.

Date: 2007/10/14 10:22:53, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Fodor is, in my opinion, a brilliant and fearless thinker (and very clever writer), and I recommend his thoughtful and challenging article to everyone here.

It's awful.  The guy clearly knows very little modern evolutionary biology (modern= stuff from the 1970s or later).  He's read Gould, but that's about all.  His "conceptual problem" is the old levels of selection thing, and the way he states it, it can be shown to be a non-issue simply by looking at the Price equation.  The issue about selection not producing pigs with wings is simply saying that evolution is an historical process - one can only progress from where one is now, and that produces constraints.  But even adaptionists have hear about the panda's thumb.  It's also the insight that drives the discussions about the bacterial flagellum (which is nothing if not part of an adaptionist programme).

Fodor may be a brilliant and fearless thinker, but he evidently didn't bother to learn about evolutionary biology before writing his piece.

Grrrr.

Bob

Date: 2007/10/14 13:29:32, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
I'd be interested in your thoughts on "The Brick" (Gould's The Structure of Evolutionary Theory) in which Gould much more recently elaborated upon many of these themes (levels of selection, "channeling" and developmental issues as important in the large scale patterning of the history of life on earth) at great length.  

I must admit to not having read it.  I'm put off by it's, well, brick-like size and reputation.

The levels of selection debate really irritates me.  The basic theory is well established (Price etc.), but some people keep on banging on about a controversy.  The effect is that there are a couple of good examples of trait group selection that the researchers working on them have to talk about without mentioning the phrase.  Really, this should be the last word.

Quote
Fodor's thoughts respond to the adaptionist excesses of evolutionary psychology of the Barkow, Cosmides and Tooby Adapted Mind variety, which are both more recent and sometimes silly.

Then again, sometimes the Emperor IS clothed, after all.

Ah, that's the background.  I don't follow the evolutionary psychology literature (I'm too busy trying to keep up with the, um, evolutionary biology literature.  :-)), but I guess there was something like that.

I'm certainly not going to defend some of the sillier excesses, but I think Fodor goes too far in dismissing the whole programme.

Bob

Date: 2007/10/16 01:09:52, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Richardthughes @ Oct. 15 2007,16:06)
Uh oh. Darwinian idol facing its Waterloo.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v....%2Ehtml

About 1m 40s in "...it's the Darwinists who hold the power [gulps back tears] and influence and prestige ..."

Poor man.

Date: 2007/10/16 12:41:15, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
hey oldman - good catch!  Looks to me that they want the Sweedish Bikini Team to be smart as well as hawt... and I would pick our Abbie Smith over their Professor Smith any day of the week, in anything from tiddlywinks to poker.


Abba (Adba?) Smith surely.

Bob

Date: 2007/10/16 12:43:15, Link
Author: Bob O'H
geoffrobinson
Quote

We need to start offering political assylum to Europeans.

Can we make this into an exchange?  We get your Eviluiotnists and Al Gore, and you get all our loonies?

Oh, and over here that would be arseylum.

Bob

Date: 2007/10/16 13:29:12, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Does anyone actually read BA77's stuff, or, like me, do you all just derive amusement from the length of his posts?

4591 words this time.  I didn't see a list of 12 reasons why materialism is wrong either.  Did anyone else spot it in there?

I tried to read it, but I think I had a neo-Darwinist experience halfway through.

Bob

Date: 2007/10/17 11:30:07, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Lotf is the natural candidate for the next Bannination.

I thought he already had been, but clearly not.

Bob

Date: 2007/10/20 00:21:13, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Richardthughes @ Oct. 19 2007,16:07)
Quote (oldmanintheskydidntdoit @ Oct. 19 2007,15:58)
Quote (Richardthughes @ Oct. 19 2007,14:57)
Okay - we now have IntelligentDesignNews.org

Put up a links page to positive (i.e not dependent on criticizing some aspect of "Darwinism") evidence for ID.#

To keep out the loony fringe (aka BA77) better make it peer reviewed only.

here's my thoughts:

Main page is a variant of the above press release where the date changes each day automatically.

An 'about page' says why the website exists, how it parodies evolution news, discussion on positive evidence, link to talk origins, etc.

I also want a "mail me" function so I can post Fundie Screeds here.

You also need a blog, just so you can ban anyone who comments on it.

Bob

Date: 2007/10/20 05:34:16, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Louis - why do you hate Frank Skinner so much?

Date: 2007/10/20 11:44:06, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Come on Zachriel, you're being a bit unfair - BA77 had to type "Berceuse" as well.

Or perhaps he used a Ctrl-C, Ctrl-V.

Bob

Date: 2007/10/21 02:59:51, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Richardthughes @ Oct. 19 2007,17:33)
No "Friday-meltdown" from Dembski.  ???  :angry:

Not so fast.  He just didn't do it at UD.

Date: 2007/10/22 00:06:26, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Richardthughes @ Oct. 21 2007,18:28)
Logo inspiration for IntelligentDesignNews.org

http://www.ncseweb.org/resourc....002.asp

I vote for the first one, but with a paper bag over the head of the guy on the right.

Bob

Date: 2007/10/22 11:26:41, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Patrick can't read:
Quote
Horizontal Gene Transfer (HGT) is now being invoked fairly often as a magic wand by Darwinists. So what experimental evidence do we have?

Genome-Wide Experimental Determination of Barriers to Horizontal Gene Transfer

   Horizontal gene transfer, in which genetic material is transferred from the genome of one organism to another, has been investigated in microbial species mainly through computational sequence analyses. To address the lack of experimental data, we studied the attempted movement of 246,045 genes from 79 prokaryotic genomes into Escherichia coli and identified genes that consistently fail to transfer. We studied the mechanisms underlying transfer inhibition by placing coding regions from different species under the control of inducible promoters. Our data suggest that toxicity to the host inhibited transfer regardless of the species of origin and that increased gene dosage and associated increased expression may be a predominant cause for transfer failure. While these experimental studies examined transfer solely into E. coli, a computational analysis of gene transfer rates across available bacterial and archaeal genomes supports that the barriers observed in our study are general across the tree of life.


In short, over 80 percent of the genes tested stopped E. coli from growing, meaning that when transferred across species they are toxic to their new hosts. From what I’ve read elsewhere things are even more grim for HGT as a Darwinian mechanism for major innovation when it comes to higher species.
...

(he links to this paper)

In case it disappears, here is my reply:
Quote
<blockquote>In short, over 80 percent of the genes tested stopped E. coli from growing, meaning that when transferred across species they are toxic to their new hosts.</blockquote>
If I'm reading the paper correctly, this is 80% of the genes they tested, which they selected because they had been marked as untransferable (top of second column, p2).  However, only 1402 of 246045 genes (=0.6%) were classified as untransferable.  So, this would suggest that less than 0.5% of genes were toxic.

Bob

Date: 2007/10/23 00:52:47, Link
Author: Bob O'H
And even the David B bannination was banned:
DaveScot:  
Quote

DavidBrennan is no longer with us. His comments and responses to his comments were disappeared along with him.

Date: 2007/10/23 10:40:21, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Denyse O'Leary:
 
Quote
To the best of my knowledge, young earth creationists (the accurate term for people who think that the earth is only thousands, not billions of years old) do not treat Ussher’s chronology as a form of prophecy.

I prophecy that she's post this on October 23rd.

Bob

Date: 2007/10/26 02:51:09, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Ah, memories, memories.  DaveScot the Agnostic:
Quote


gaspass

Can a non-religious person come to believe there is a designer without becoming religious?

Sure. I did. I was a positive atheist for decades until I read Michael Denton’s book “Evolution: A Theory in Crisis” 15 years ago. At that point I became agnostic. I was too busy in my career to really look into ID until a couple of years ago but all my life I’ve spent most of my spare time reading science and hard science fiction so I was pretty well informed on a wide range of science and engineering topics before concentrating on evolution and ID. I’ve been retired for almost 7 years and have oodles of time now for learning about things that will probably never bring home any bacon. I’m still an agnostic in rational thinking but I more or less formulated Pascal’s Wager on my own and bet that way before I was out of grammar school.
(emphases in bold added)
DaveScot, the only man to take the wrong side of Pascal's wager.

The "I learned half of my engineering from SF" is added bonus Tard.

Date: 2007/10/28 00:45:57, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Dave waitied a full 26 minutes for temminicki to reply before waving the banning stick.  Always the gentleman.

Bob

Date: 2007/10/28 08:06:43, Link
Author: Bob O'H
The "related videos" contain several other clips about the Church of Satan, and also ...  the intro to The Onedin Line.

Date: 2007/10/28 11:56:05, Link
Author: Bob O'H
In the middle of one of his usual (if short) meanderings, ba77 tells us:
Quote
This is a first inference postulation of basic principles of science!

Wow!  I'll be disappointed if he didn't take that line from some 50s SF.

Date: 2007/10/29 13:24:05, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Richardthughes @ Oct. 29 2007,11:29)
Quote (stevestory @ Oct. 29 2007,11:27)
Steve_h wins the very prestigious Post of the Week Award.

On a friggin Monday, too!

Congrats, Steve h!

Fear the power of Ecky-Thump, lad!

Bob

Date: 2007/10/29 13:55:32, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Dave indulges in hyperbole:
 
Quote
Edge of Evolution I found to be amazing. It presented a case history of a eukaryote (p.falciparum) that has replicated billions of trillions of times within a span of a few decades.

Right, so for you Yanks, a billion is 10^9.  And a trillion is 10^12.  So, one billion of trillions is 10^9*10^12 = 10^21.  

Behe's "edge of evolution" is 1 in 10^20.  According to our favourite tard therefore, P.falciparum would have broken the barrier at least 10 times.

Later he gets even better:
 
Quote
The big picture is that while p.falciparum under intense scrutiny for billions of trillions of generations did exactly what ID theorists predicted - next to nothing.

So, assuming P.falciparum has been "under intense scrutiny" for 100 years, that would be at least 10^21/100=10^19 generations per year.  Or about 3.2*10^11 per second.  One paper I found (pdf) uses a rate of production of 16 offspring per 2 days, suggesting 4 rounds of replication, and hence one generation every half day (this is horribly rough, but never mind: you can see where I'm going).  That would suggest 7.3*10^4 generations in 100 years.  In other words, Dave's error is about a quarter of a Dembski.

Bob

Date: 2007/10/30 14:16:42, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Louis, are you turning into k.e.?

Bob

Date: 2007/10/31 01:31:56, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (djmullen @ Oct. 31 2007,00:40)
Quote (Richardthughes @ Oct. 30 2007,18:52)
Hey Zach!

http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....project

right up your alley, chief!

Neat!  It found "dembski is a tard" in anywhere from 50 to 132 tries.  

BUT: when I told it to search for "bornagain77 is a tard", I cut it off when it got up to 1300 tries!

ID RULZ!  Take that,,,Darwin!

Try it with "bornagain^77 is a tard".

Date: 2007/10/31 01:35:40, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Mister DNA - Remove that post, and repost it next Monday.  Win 'Post of The Week' and 'Dembski of the Week' in one go!

Bob

Date: 2007/11/01 01:30:31, Link
Author: Bob O'H
OK, come on.  Admit it.  Which one of you is Granville Sewell?
Quote
23

Granville Sewell

10/31/2007

2:56 pm

Tard Alert!

To those who say I am anti-science for ruling out the possibility that computers will evolve consciousness: what about TV sets and radios, will they become conscious someday? What about a typewriter, it can be used to write amazing things, will there be conscious typewriters? And what is the real difference, computers are just like typewriters, they also do exactly what you tell them to do.

Eh?  Eh?

Date: 2007/11/01 01:31:47, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (snoeman @ Oct. 31 2007,23:51)
Quote (Reciprocating Bill @ Oct. 31 2007,20:35)
Quote (Bob O'H @ Oct. 30 2007,15:16)
Louis, are you turning into k.e.?

Bob

For that matter, what ever happened to k.e?  Did Lenny leave with k.e under his arm?

No, I seem to recall k.e. just up and disappeared temporarily to one o' them islands in the neighborhood of Oz for a while.

Went searching for cannibals, or something.

Date: 2007/11/01 11:36:39, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Bannination by DaveScot?  Not sure.
Quote

Peter
If you want to be secretive you can do it elsewhere.

Date: 2007/11/01 13:53:36, Link
Author: Bob O'H
If Barry doesn't have administrative privileges, I guess that means he didn't ban Mickey.

Sorry RB, you'll have to sink this post into the memory hole.

Date: 2007/11/02 02:03:18, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Hermagoras @ Nov. 01 2007,15:32)
Quote (Mr_Christopher @ Nov. 01 2007,15:18)
 
Quote (Richardthughes @ Nov. 01 2007,14:53)
My goodness, BFast has begun thinking!

He should be very careful, that thinking can lead to all sorts of trouble.  For starters it will get him banned from UD.

Speaking of which, Mickey Bitsko is not long for that world.  He managed to post a comment that says  
Quote
the concept of CSI involves inescapable circular reasoning.

I'm opening the betting table now.  Weekends are slow at UD, so I'll put the over-under on Bitsko's bannination at 4 days (Monday 5 November).

As long as he stays on BarryA's threads, I'm taking over.  Barry seems to be more decent than most of the UD posters.  The trick is to avoid the evil eye of DaveScot.  Thus far he may have been saved by writing long comments.

Bob

Date: 2007/11/02 02:07:38, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Denyse is, of course, a tard.

She responded to SteveB:
Quote

Denyse,
I looked at the first 4-5 entries, all of which were written anonymously and without any facts that could be verified. If a pro-Darwin site did the same, how much credence would you give to it?

with some evidence based reasoning
Quote

SteveB: I’d conclude that it was worth looking into.
But re the Expelled witnesses, all the more so.
I ALREADY know credible people who are practically in hiding for saying that they doubt some of the Darwinian fables.

So, they're more credible because they're anonymous?

Mr. Christopher, how's your creative writing coming along?

Date: 2007/11/04 09:23:00, Link
Author: Bob O'H
getawitness doesn't want to be banned
Quote

rrf was quite rude. But I think the ID position may have changed over time. Back in 2005, Dr. Dembski wrote that “President Bush is to be commended for his courage, wisdom, and foresight in publicly supporting the teaching of intelligent design alongside evolution.” He even linked to that op-ed on this site. At least at the time, Dr. Dembksi did “advocate teaching ID to school children.” But positions change, and there’s nothing wrong with that.

Even though (s)he appears to read us here.

*waves*

Date: 2007/11/06 12:43:21, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Missed it?  They want to turn back the clock!

Huh?  Are you still on summer time over there?

Bob
P.S. Thanks Hermagoras for the last PM.  I sit in awe of you.  I would stand, but I'd disturb the cat.

Date: 2007/11/07 12:10:24, Link
Author: Bob O'H
We do know that the soul weighs 21 grams.  Although Mr. Brown's may be heavier.

Date: 2007/11/07 12:23:20, Link
Author: Bob O'H
bornagain77 mixes science and religion, only without the science:
Quote

Jack I really mixing science and religion,,,
But the point being, that if God was “continually” acting in this world then entropy as a whole, and genetic entropy in particular, would not be discernible…Yet because of entropy, and Genetic Entropy, we can forcefully infer exactly when God acts in this material realm and exactly when he does not.
Theistic evolutionists are blind to this crucial point of evidence.
Does this make them “bad” Christians? NO!
Does this make them “bad” scientists? You bet your bottom dollar it does!

So, entropy doesn't increase when God acts?  I think he's just proven that DaveScot is God.

Hmmm.

Date: 2007/11/08 00:41:24, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Although, I've been wondering who the "16 lawyers and legal scholars" are?

Luskin, for sure.  deWolf.

BarryA at UD?

Date: 2007/11/08 01:05:01, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Aww, poor Paul Nelson.  He has a whole thread about his up-coming engagements, and this is the sum total of the comments:


 
Quote
Anything scheduled for Massachusetts?




I guess that's a no.

Date: 2007/11/08 12:15:37, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Oh dear, David Springer's at it again
 
Quote

8 November 2007
Weather Channel Founder: “[Global Warming] is the greatest scam in history”
DaveScot

Weather Channel Founder: Global Warming ‘Greatest Scam in History’


DaveScot, yesterday, walking his dog:

Date: 2007/11/08 14:04:07, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Sorry to admit it, but I'm me.  And yes, I'm actually trolling here.

Anyway, everybody's favourite writer decided to weigh in on yesterday's shooting in Jokela.  She got complaints about this.  But she's defiant, and in the midsts of her justification came up with this:
Quote
First, it’s rubbish that anyone who enjoys this blog was upset.

Why do I think I'm not interpreting that in the way it was intended?

Date: 2007/11/09 00:48:59, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Nah, let's wait for ba77 to steal this stuff again, and give him the proper definition.

Date: 2007/11/09 10:28:01, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Humans can tell the difference in acoustics between a bathroom and a cathedral just from the sound of their own footsteps.

It's easy - it's the difference between slippers and best shiny Sunday shoes.

Date: 2007/11/09 12:45:57, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
(Oops, looks like I invented a nucleotide. TATA. Naughty, naughty me.)

D?  No, that's just 5,6-dihydrouridine.

Yes, I am happy sat on my own in the corner reading a biochemistry textbook.

Date: 2007/11/09 13:51:06, Link
Author: Bob O'H
All science so far

Date: 2007/11/10 05:22:19, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Remove your ironymeters from the room. Denyse is shock about what's happening to the stuff Auvinen put on the web  
Quote

Go here for story updates. Stuff is getting removed from the ‘Net.

Date: 2007/11/10 06:00:29, Link
Author: Bob O'H
From Part III of Behe's reply to Nick Matzke:
Quote
And isn’t there a rather well-known evolutionary biologist with the initials Richard Dawkins currently traveling the world to tell us exactly that Darwinism means purposelessness?


So, what's his full name?
Richard
Ian
Cornelius
Henry
Angus
Robert
Daniel

Denyse
Albert
William
Kenneth
Ivan
Nelson
Springer?

Date: 2007/11/10 12:07:17, Link
Author: Bob O'H
And Zachriel, what about the pigeons?  Will nobody think of the pigeons that have been massacred throughout history?

Date: 2007/11/11 03:11:43, Link
Author: Bob O'H
The schoolmarm goes red with embarrassment
Quote

correction: for “jeery” read “jerry.” I wasn’t playing with his name, promise.

You should, though.

Date: 2007/11/11 10:38:01, Link
Author: Bob O'H
The Headmistress was responding to this
Quote

Bob O’H,
I hope this does not sound rude, as I am not face to face with you, but for the 5th time, please go get the book Bob.
getawitness,
I believe that Dr. Sanford, being a more than highly qualified, Geneticist, is interpreting the evidence, presented by Gerrish and Lenski, exactly as he sees it, and you, not being privy to what he knows intuitively to be true, interpret their evidence very differently from his highly educated and more qualified perspective.
Thus, I stand by what he wrote and will not retract it.

Poor bornagain77 - he gets so frustrated when he can't answer a question, and just lashes out.

Date: 2007/11/11 12:43:20, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Sorry I'm a bit late, but Happy Hang-over day!

Oh, and that guy in the "jealous" photo is clearly a Vulcan.

LL&P

Bob

Date: 2007/11/12 01:30:53, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Not to belittle anyone's hardship, but:

Not only must the factor of truthfulness be considered, but also perspective.


I think I have to be fair here - I don't see any reason to doubt BA77's story, so I think you are being, well, somewhat unkind.

As others have pointed out, the story is consistent with what we know of BA, and I don't see why we shouldn't take him at his word, and congratulate him on overcoming his problems.

Of course, that is no reason to stop criticising him for anything he writes now (e.g. the rest of that message).

Date: 2007/11/12 14:07:49, Link
Author: Bob O'H
But hooligans, remember Behe's definition of science.

Date: 2007/11/13 00:47:27, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Oooh, the schoolmistress gets snarky:
Quote

allanius,
“People fall for claptrap when they’re in an environment where everyone thinks the same thing and critical thought is neither valued nor encouraged.”
That is so true! And well put.

Ouch.

Date: 2007/11/13 14:24:16, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Behe -
Quote
She writes:

Quote
HIV-1 Vpu requires two casein kinase II sites. ... Yet some SIVcpz Vpus have only one CKII site, and instead utilize a simple string of negatively charged amino acids in place of the second site. Different ways of performing similar tricks with totally different amino acids. I think that’s biochemically significant as well.


I disagree with her assessment; I think this is a trivial biochemical change given HIV’s mutation rate.

I hope Behe doesn't suffer from a bad back, with all those goalposts he keep on moving.  Surely a biochemist would understand "biochemically significant" to mean significant to the biochemistry, not "having dissimilar DRNA sequences".

Play soccer, mate.  Then you only have to move a couple of coats.

Date: 2007/11/14 12:53:59, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
I've lived at one time or another in at least a dozen different UK locations and know a decent bit of local colour for many places from the Peak District on south.

Tha's a southern pansy!

Having lived on a Northern cuisine for most of my life, I wouldn't claim to know about good food.  But for drink in Helsinki, there are a couple of good bars in Kaisaniemi, right next to the railway station square.  Kaisla is a good beer pub.  The commercial Finnish beer is awful, so these places are a necessary part of the culture.  Just around the corner is Teerenpeli (scroll down), which brews its own beer, and also makes HUGE sandwiches.

The more culturally enlightened may want to try Zetor.  It's owned by the Leningrad Cowboys, and is usually known as "the tractor bar".  'Tis a strange place, rather like central Finland.

If you do want really good food, you'll have to find an excuse to go to Tvärminne Zoological Station.  It's one of our field stations, and the fish is excellent in particular.  It's right on the shoreline in a nature reserve on the archipelago, so if you're lucky you can see sea eagles from the canteen.

Bob

Date: 2007/11/15 01:09:40, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I'm still waiting for Dave to wake up and start the bannination.  Perhaps he's having an affair with Miss Getawitness.  

In the mean time, here's a quote from the physorg article PaV links to:
Quote
The group trolled the human genome for ERVs, identified p53 binding sites in them, and tested their ability to activate genes regulated by p53.

I don't know why they did that - they could just have trolled here.

Bob

Date: 2007/11/16 03:06:08, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Just a quick word of advice to sock-puppets everywhere:

KEEP OF THE DEMBSKI POSTS!!!!ONETYONE!

If you want to stay at UD, don't get yourself noticed by wMad.

Or if you intend to keep commenting, ask whether DaveScot is OK, and where should we send the flowers.

Bob

Date: 2007/11/16 04:04:12, Link
Author: Bob O'H
New Year?  They'll all be banned by then.  We're just waiting for Davey to come back from his holidays.

Date: 2007/11/16 04:11:20, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
ps. I can't wait until this thread moves to page 7. I find the photo at the top disturbing for some reason

Me too.

One post closer.  :-)

Date: 2007/11/16 13:39:08, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Richardthughes @ Nov. 16 2007,11:58)
Dembski Retraction:

http://www.uncommondescent.com/science....-148959

 
Quote
194

Patrick

11/16/2007

12:55 pm
Is there any place where he either retracts the paper publicly, contests the refutation by Schneider and others, or offers another explanation for its disappearance?

http://cayman.globat.com/~trad.....s/eev.html

Thanks to those who pointed to a bug in our software. This paper has been withdrawn.

For revised analysis, see HERE.

Not sure if Bill has publicly stated if they intend to revise and resubmit.


Suprise! the link is dead...

In a thread with the title "Speculation presented as fact".  Hmmm.

Date: 2007/11/17 02:00:35, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Toolbox_Tim is unkind
Quote

Dr Dembski and Dr Behe are the wide portion (heavier too) of the wedge (as described by Mr Johnson).

I think he's suggesting they should go on a diet.  Evidently the loose sweater isn't so loose any more.

Date: 2007/11/17 04:27:46, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Also, if humans are simply genetic mutations of some simpler life form, then why are we the only species that wears clothes? why then the timidity?

I dunno.  Ask a caddis fly.  Or a hermit crab.

Bob

Date: 2007/11/17 04:44:08, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Also from the PBS thread:
Quote
Gee I can't help but notice so few of the so-called 'scientists' in here responding to this thread.

Gee, you'd think they'd be stacked up like planes over O'Hara to get into this thread and say something, seeing how it's in the nice and tidy so-called 'scientific' language they claim they prefer.

They are.  I can hardly breathe thanks to the palaeontologists sat on my chest.

Could be worse, though.  Last week it was lung surgeons.  It was like Thoracic Park.

Bob

Date: 2007/11/17 08:31:04, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (dheddle @ Nov. 17 2007,05:52)
Quote (Reciprocating Bill @ Nov. 16 2007,20:51)
The Committee on Nixplanatory Accuracy has ruled on Stanton Rockwell's phantom bannination here.

Interesting, but I am concerned that your solution violates unitarity and is not renormalizable.

OK, RB is an abnormal trinitarian.  So?

Date: 2007/11/17 13:46:51, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Genes acquired? I thought our genes are modified copies of those of our ancestors, just as those of other apes are also modified copies of those of our common ancestry.

You just don't go to the right car boot sales.

Date: 2007/11/17 14:08:58, Link
Author: Bob O'H
OK, which one of you is Solon?
Quote

BA you are right on the money with those predictions. in fact you will never see darwinists or materalists trying to test those predictions because they know this is what is propping up their religion and they can’t expose it.
i’ve been thinking a lot lately about the fact that information is always lost during this sort of thing and it made me feel very humble. think about how much information all the animals in the garden of eden had!!! Wow! especially the beetles. they must have been virtual libraries of information! we can never know how much information the things that God created were carrying around, but I am certain that each and every bit spoke volumes about the love that the creator has for his creation.

Someone who knows their Haldane!

Could you PM me, so I can be sure you won't be offended when I call you BA77's VMartin.

Bob

Date: 2007/11/17 14:26:07, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Or their other socks were in the wash.

Date: 2007/11/18 01:01:47, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Could you PM me, so I can be sure you won't be offended when I call you BA77's VMartin.

Hmmm.  Perhaps not....

Date: 2007/11/19 01:31:54, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Gil wants a brown nose!
I'm guessing that's so BA77 will say he's got more information.

Bob

Date: 2007/11/19 12:13:44, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Being gay is like having red hair.

Really?  There was a recent study showing that Neandertals had red hair.  Perhaps that's why they died out.

Date: 2007/11/19 12:57:19, Link
Author: Bob O'H
OMG, those trolls....  they're not us ... they're ... DaveScot.  He's playing with our minds.

<curls up in a ball and starts whimpering>

Date: 2007/11/20 12:44:21, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
I bent over backwards so far that I got headhunted by Cirque du Soleil.

If you had bent over that far, they would have needed a torch.

Date: 2007/11/20 14:01:53, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
I always thought statler and waldorf watched the watchers or guarded the guards or had custody of the custodians or ate custard.

I always thought Custard was statler and waldorf's cat.



"They won't understand you" said Custard smirking. "Try talking about the Clangers instead".

The birds tittered.

Date: 2007/11/21 09:19:24, Link
Author: Bob O'H
bornagain77 is a tard
Quote

Bob you asked:
No. We have a new function appearing in a sub-species (virus). You claimed it shouldn’t happen. So, is genetic entropy wrong?
Is the overall principle of entropy wrong when rocks pile up at a bottom of a mountain?
No, of course not, The entropy was payed for by the rocks that disintegrated from the mountain side.
Thus, for a starting position in defense of Genetic Entropy, I maintain that the integrated complexity of life, when viewed as a whole symbiotic entity, gives Genetic Entropy its foundational validity. Thus I maintain that the “trivial” gain in complexity of the “non-living” virus (which is another subject altogether (CSI)) will come at a cost of complexity to the “higher living organism” it attacks”.
That is to say more complexity was lost from a living organism than was gained by the non-living virus.

Well, he got me there.

Date: 2007/11/22 10:06:43, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
I thought the narrator was Dembski, but that opinion is really not based on much.

Can someone speed it up and add farty noises, so we can check?

Bob

Date: 2007/11/24 04:42:15, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (dhogaza @ Nov. 23 2007,13:19)

Shot this one for a biologist friend working for the Oregon Department of Fish and Wildlife.  Red-legged frog male in amplexus with a bullfrog female.  Illegal in ten southern states!

But goes on a lot in the south of France (different species, but the same principle).

I have a paper where we explain this - basically it works if the males aren't very good at recognising their own species, but like big female frogs.

Oh, and the females are happy with it, because there's female biased segregation distortion in the offspring, which can offset the reduction in fitness.  IOW, they're taking advantage of male stupidity.  No lesson for humans in there then, eh?

Bob

Date: 2007/11/25 02:30:16, Link
Author: Bob O'H
jerry
Quote

getawitness,
Nearly all experiments in evolutionary biology are based on the Darwinian model. ... It is also a model that has no empirical underpinning.

Except for all those experiments we keep on doing.

Bob

Date: 2007/11/26 09:33:15, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Just in case, now Dave's back (and also because I like Jerry's witlessness)
Bob O’H is most definitely not a tard, oh no.
Quote

Jerry @ 18
Quote
I brought in Stalin because there is lots of evidence of purges going on in biology though they are not eliminated the same way that Stalin did the elimination.

(emphasis mine)
Jerry @ 56
Quote
Bob, academia has purged/restricted them for investigating areas of biology. Whether they are in biology or not is of no consequence.

(emphasis mine)
It makes all the difference in the world to your original claim.
As for defending ID proponents, if they’re genuinely trying to do good science, then I have no problems with them. I suspect we might have to agree to disagree on what we think of as “good science”, though.
Bob

Date: 2007/11/26 09:47:25, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (stevestory @ Nov. 26 2007,08:25)
Quote


1

mathstudent

11/26/2007

8:29 am

Tard Alert!

Kind of dishonest to claim this was actually “produced” by the jibjag guys, isn’t it? It’s the “can-can” video that anyone can make by uploading photos of anyone else.

I suppose now someone at Pandas Thumb will have to make a jibjab with Dembski and Behe.

And the march of honest intellectual debate continues….*sigh*


http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....-151274

Oh noes, the whole thread has gone.

mathstudent's very observation of the dark and murky matter caused it to decay, shortening the life of the very thread.

Bob
P.S. which one of you has a sockpuppet over at UD called DaveScot?  It can't be the real one posting now.

Date: 2007/11/27 00:54:00, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (oldmanintheskydidntdoit @ Nov. 26 2007,16:08)
On the scientists r dumb (quantum doubly so) thread at UD it appears Lawrence Krauss has taken time out to respond directly to UD reprinting the story of the day as-is.
Quote


Bill: Thanks for attacking me.. always makes me feel good when you remember me.. But it would be good in future to look at the submitted article itself instead of press reports about the article.. it is somewhat mathematical, but you can try… and alas, it does not say we are destroying the universe by looking at it.. and thanks also to Bob O’H for having the foresight to point out what I actually might have been saying.

best

L. Krauss

Linky. Liking the math dig.

Of course, I only put up the quote because someone here had already found it.  I'm just the messenger.

Bob

Date: 2007/11/27 01:06:58, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Damn, is it Friday already?  Short week.

Anyway, Dembski shows utter unfamiliarity with the title of the animation he used:
Quote
...titled “The Inner Life of [/b] Cell”...

Quote
(see www.uncommondescent.com/…/the-inner-life-of-[b]a-cell)

Quote
“The Inner Life of the Cell”
(emphases in all three quotes mine)

And all along it was “A Cell as the Automated City” .

Date: 2007/11/27 01:10:57, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Oh, the irony:
Quote

Eek. Please. Leave God out of ID.
…and yeah, there are profound metaphysical implications. So be it. Scott Minich. UTMOL
That should be the extent of “God” and ID being mentioned in the same sentence in the “secular” world. In an apologetics class, different story, but ID must stand on its own merits and nothing else.


Thus spake God's iPod.

Date: 2007/11/27 01:42:08, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Unfortunately for you, UD has a nasty habit of shooting the messenger.    :(

Well, they won't get any help from St. Ursula:
Quote
St. Ursula is the patron of archers, orphans and students. However, since 1969, not even the Church of Rome believes in her anymore.

This also means that they don't believe in the  11,000 virgins either.

Bob

Date: 2007/11/27 11:48:29, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Damn it, someotherguy.  I was listening to the BBC's version when I read that comment.

Nice master.  Smeagol will be good...

Date: 2007/11/28 01:09:24, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Now this is how to apologise:
http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....-krauss
Quote
28 November 2007
Apology to Prof Lawrence Krauss
idnet.com.au

I would like to apologise to Prof Krauss for a posting which inferred, based entirely on the quotes in a Telegraph UK interview(see here), that he had asserted that observing the universe had adversely changed the universe. Unfortunately the New Scientist paper upon which the Telegraph article is based is not available on line without subscription.

idnet.com.au

Even if he did forget to mention that his inference was falsified by quotes in the same article.

The original thread seems to have disappeared into the memory hole.  A pity - it was worth reading for the way that jerry sucks up to Lawrence Krauss (there was a great compre and contrast opportunity (and subsequent posts)).

Bob

Date: 2007/11/28 12:59:31, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Wesley R. Elsberry @ Nov. 28 2007,09:57)
Oh, kind of like showing staged moth photographs as an illustration of crypsis gets to be, "Fraud, fraud, FRAUD!"

Do you realise how long Kettlewell spent painting that tree?

Bob

Date: 2007/11/29 00:38:26, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Can anybody explain to me what the hell kairosfocus is saying?

BA77?

Date: 2007/11/29 01:15:11, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I thought this was worth reposting here, from the blog of some strange guy:

Quote
Hey, it suddenly occurs to me that, on an abstract level, there's something about this pattern that seems like what might be called "the inner life of the cdesign proponentsist." Consider

Statement 1: I found it on the internet.
Statement 2: the Designer did it.

In each case, there's no natural explanation.

Of course there isn't.  The internet didn't evolve, it was designed by designers.  So nothing on there is natural.

Bob
P.S. Methinks it is like a weasel.

Date: 2007/11/29 06:36:43, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Aardpig is gore'd
Quote

One of the great things about the internet is anyone can be a professor of astronomy huh aardpig;)! Especially when it comes to lurking ID websites with something to prove! If you read the link provided by russ, he shows that Gonzalez had funding from NASA… As for how much money is expected to be received to keep tenure, I will ask actual professors of astronomy at NAU tomorrow. Ooh wait, am I still supposed to pretend to be the professor? Anyhow, I will post tomorrow with my findings!

Date: 2007/11/29 13:08:39, Link
Author: Bob O'H
No, Arden.  Better during the day.  The telescopes are free then.

Date: 2007/11/30 00:30:59, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Ptaylor @ Nov. 29 2007,13:28)
Double bannination!

 
Quote


37

Patrick

11/29/2007

1:22 pm

After watching the actions of Lazarus and cdesignproponentsists for a while I decided to block them. I cannot tell if they legitimately believe what they are saying but they are not here to reasonably discuss issues, they are here to accuse people based upon a disagreement on priorities. Besides, some terminology they used made me suspect they were frauds. If they’re not going to have any positive contribution to UD I don’t see why they should stay.

Solon, and thanks for all the fish.

Date: 2007/11/30 00:45:26, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Alann is not long for the UD world
Quote



18

Alann

11/29/2007

5:06 pm

Tard Alert!
I think the material is a little inconsistent.
As I was reading through I noticed the way it divided evolution into 3 sections, which for easy of reference I will supply my own names for:
1 - “Adaptation” small changes over time
2 - “Common Descent” organisms are descended for a single common ancestor
3 - “Alteration” natural selection had the power to produce fundamentally new forms of life.
It goes on to explain how adaptation is generally excepted and is not in question. More specifically Intelligent Design does not conflict with either adaptation or common descent but rather with alteration. It continues to say that it is important not confuse an issue with alteration with a challenge to the widely accepted adaptation.
But as I read further I was confused by the section on “What Are Some Scientific Problems with Darwinian Evolution and Chemical Evolution?” here are some things which seemed wrong to me:
The item on Genetics seems to be an attack on adaptation and not just alteration.
The items on Paleontology and Taxonomy are focuses on attacking common descent, which isn’t in conflict with intelligent design according to the above.
The item on Chemistry is out of place. None of the three definitions of evolution in the material discuss the origin of life itself, nor has the other side ever claimed it did. The field of abiogenesis is an entirely different can of worms.
Its this tendency to switch between a focus on alteration and seemingly random attacks on abiogenesis, common descent, and at least by appearances adaptation, which enforces the very misrepresentation of intelligent design which the material is attempting to address.

And on a Dembski thread too.  Oops.

Date: 2007/11/30 05:23:31, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Woo-hooo!  It's Friday today!  I can't wait to see this week's Friday Dembski Meltdown over at UD.  Especially with the way we started the week.

C'mon Bill, wake up and give it to us!

(EDIT: "too use"?  No, "to us"!  Gah, the excitement got to me)

Date: 2007/11/30 08:25:45, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I,err, well.  See for yourself.
Quote

37

allanius

11/30/2007

8:05 am

Tard Alert!

BA77, kudos. It is important to understand that Christ offers a way, not a religion. This way is rooted and grounded in love and depends upon the proposition that all things work together for good to those who love God. Fine-tuning suggests that this proposition may involve something more than fevered optimism: there appears to be a very high level of integration in the universe, which is necessary for life. And as we see from Michael Behe, this is true in the microscopic realm as well. Perhaps, then, faith and reason are not the irreconcilable opposites that Dawkins and his band of merry iconoclasts assert. Fine tuning supports the reasonableness of the way revealed primarily through faith.

Date: 2007/11/30 13:19:41, Link
Author: Bob O'H
OK, the meltdown hasn't happened yet (can we sue Wes if it doesn't?), but we've always got Denyse keeping us abreast of the situation:
Quote
Reflections on key recent events: Eminent science journal advises meat puppets to get over “image of God” rubbish
O'Leary

Nothing in the intelligent design controversy is more instructive than a convinced Darwinist making his true position very, very clear.

etc. etc.

The key recent events are the publication of an editorial in Nature.  In June.

The copyright discussion is the icing on the tard.  It's almost as if they were scared some student might report them.

Date: 2007/11/30 13:50:13, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Please, George.  The image of activist Sal waving his pom-poms about is not one I want in my head just before I go to sleep.

Date: 2007/12/01 05:19:49, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
I remember musing at the time that if I was on the board of regents of Dembski's employer, the Southwestern Theological Seminary and BBQ, I wouldn't sleep easy until he was off the payroll.

Didn't ERV comment that the SWTS & BBQ was investigating?  Sorry, I'm too lazy to check.

It's a good job Dembski has contacts in the catering industry, otherwise he'd have to take sandwiches to work.

Date: 2007/12/01 10:11:38, Link
Author: Bob O'H
BarryA asks the question
Quote

18

BarryA

12/01/2007

8:41 am

Tard Alert!
The title of the editorial is:
“Scientists are increasingly likely to be called upon to discuss the myth of intelligent design as a scientific theory.”
WAIT A MINUTE! This can’t be right. Judge Jones buried ID once and for all two years ago this month. How can it possibly be that scientists are INCREASINGLY having to deal withe the ID challenge?

Doesn't that tell us more about the supporters of ID?

Bob

Date: 2007/12/02 07:27:26, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I always use to wonder why some episodes of Scooby Doo were put on after the watershed.

Date: 2007/12/03 00:33:23, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Mister DNA @ Dec. 02 2007,23:24)
[quote=Arden Chatfield,Dec. 02 2007,23:17]    


Okay, other than bacterial antibiotic resistance, what have the Darwinists ever done for us?

'Ere, that's Steve Jones on the left!

Date: 2007/12/03 13:48:41, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (keiths @ Dec. 03 2007,10:19)
Quote
Is External Delivery the same as Santa Clausism?

No. The theory of external delivery is only concerned with empirically testing whether Christmas presents are delivered by an external agent, or an internal agent such as your parents. Santa Clausism typically starts with the premise that Santa Claus is delivering presents, and then seeks to fit the evidence to that theory. The theory of external delivery has developed strictly from objective interpretations of the empirical evidence.

From External Delivery the Future.

OK, own up.  One of you is responsible for that, aren't you?

Or possibly more than one...

Bob

Date: 2007/12/04 00:38:09, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Art @ Dec. 03 2007,22:42)
Quote
What new genes need to be added to form a type-three secretory system from a pilum?


Um, none.

Classical molecular microevolution.  (Which, when it refutes IC, is NOT accepted by IDists.  Apparently.)

What, you mean the Romans had syringes at the end of those things?

Egads, they were even more advanced than I thought.

Oh, wait a moment.  Pila being placed in bacteria to form Type III secretory systems?  I think we've found our intelligent designer, folks.

Date: 2007/12/04 11:33:30, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Someone wake RB up
Quote



7

William Dembski

12/04/2007

12:08 pm

Tard Alert!
Carl Sachs and Tedsenough are no longer with us. Word to the wise: Watch tone and don’t insult others on this blog, even if provoked.

The original posts are enjoying their new surroundings in the memory hole.

Date: 2007/12/05 01:05:33, Link
Author: Bob O'H
RB, we need your judgement here.
O’Leary is a tard
Quote

19

O'Leary

12/04/2007

7:28 pm

Tard Alert!
Bugsy and digdug are gone, I gather (not my doing), and aardpig will soon be too, as a matter of fact.
It was expected that people anxious to paper over the scandal would post here to detract Gonzalez by associating him with nonsense.
This is a case where the perpetrators of systems intended to discriminate on the basis of viewpoint have - so far as I can see - been caught redhanded. So the spin, spin, spin begins - and it won’t end any time soon. Except here.

Is this is double or do we finally have the fabled triple bannination?  And by proxy, too?

Enquiring minds need to know.

Bob

Date: 2007/12/05 13:05:19, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Don't laught too loudly.  You'll disturb Hermagoras.
Quote

14

specs

12/05/2007

1:09 pm

Tard Alert!
Denyse and Barry,
Getawitness has been one of the most, if not the most, thoughtful commentator on this site, which has unfortunately been overrun with too many Darwinists acting as if left alone by their parents for the first time. I am disappointed that you would criticize a fellow Christian as a dupe for the other side just because he doesn’t nicely fill the role you would have him play in this whole melodrama.
Your treatment of GAW makes me ponder 1 Samuel 2:3: “Do not keep talking so proudly or let your mouth speak such arrogance, for the Lord is a God who knows, and by Him deeds are weighed.” You might ponder your approach to Christianity and why it fills you with such anger towards fellow believers who don’t toe the line of your certainty.

Date: 2007/12/05 13:26:33, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Oink oink

Quote
As a litigator, getting to the facts of a matter is integral to my job, and it never ceases to amaze me the extent to which people will lie or deny the truth, even when they are under oath and even when everyone in the room (except apparently them) knows what’s going on.

Somehow I get the urge to start singing Vera Lynn hits.

Bob

Date: 2007/12/06 10:57:04, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Maya, you'll be needing this.  Steve will hand you one, once Reciprocating Bill has processed your bannination.

Congratulations on joining a club almost as large as Project Steve!

Bob

Date: 2007/12/10 10:07:45, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Jake @ Dec. 10 2007,08:38)
Heads up!

Getawitness is a goner

Hermagoras will provide the eulogy.

EDIT: edited just so I look like I'm in on the joke.

Date: 2007/12/11 09:32:21, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Oh noes!!!onetyone!!!

DaveScot links to a report about climate change
Quote
BALI, Indonesia - An international team of scientists skeptical of man-made climate fears promoted by the UN and former Vice President Al Gore, descended on Bali this week to urge the world to “have the courage to do nothing” in response to UN demands.

Lord Christopher Monckton, a UK climate researcher, had a blunt message for UN climate conference participants on Monday.

Lord Monckton is a familiar name.  And what are his credentials as a scientist?  Let's look in Wiki...

Christopher Monckton, 3rd Viscount Monckton of Brenchley
Quote
Monckton was born on 14 February 1952, the eldest son of the 2nd Viscount Monckton of Brenchley. He was educated at Harrow School, Churchill College, Cambridge where he read classics and University College, Cardiff, where he obtained a diploma in journalism.[1] On 19 May 1990, he married Juliet Mary Anne Malherbe Jensen. He inherited his father's hereditary peerage upon his father's death in 2006.

OK, so he can write better than Ms. O'Leary.  (U.C.Cardiff  is a good college - my brother got his PhD from there.  Not in journalism though).

Ah, you're asking, but what about his publications.  Well...
Quote
   * The Laker Story (with Ivan Fallon). Christensen, 1982. ISBN 0950800708
   * Anglican Orders: null and void?. Family History Books, 1986.
   * The AIDS Report. 1987
   * European Monetary Union: opportunities and dangers. University of St. Andrews, Department of Economics. 1997
   * Sudoku X. Headline Publishing Group, 2005. ISBN 0755315014
   * Sudoku X-mas. Headline Publishing Group, 2005. ISBN 0755315022
   * Sudoku Xpert. Headline Publishing Group, 2006. ISBN 0755315294
   * Junior Sudoku X. Headline Publishing Group, 2006. ISBN 0755315286
   * Sudoku Xtreme. Headline Publishing Group, 2006. ISBN 0755315308

The Science and Public Policy Institute has published nine papers by Monckton on climate-change science.[31]

The IPCC must be quaking in their boots (laughing).  They are being challenged by a Sudoku compiler.

Bob

Date: 2007/12/12 05:51:29, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Richardthughes @ Dec. 11 2007,16:27)
get NASA on the phone:

https://www.blogger.com/comment....5980302

 
Quote

Joe G said...
BTW Rich, if you think that we have to visit a planet in order to determine whether or not it is inhabited by complex living organisms, you are a hopeless retard without any idea of how science is conducted nor what scientists can determine just by observation- no matter how distant that observation is.

So again I thank you.

5:19 PM


That was more or less one of James Lovelock's points (well, up to the "no matter how distant it is").  He pinted out that an atmosphere rich in oxygen is unstable, so there must be something violating its SLoT to keep it there.  Hence, if you find a planet with an unstable atmosphere, you can infer the presence of life.

Of course, Arthur C. Clarke beat him to it ("Report on Planet Three", IIRC).

Bob

Date: 2007/12/13 09:16:24, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Is this guy one of us?  If so, you may like to browse this thread (if you have a spare month or two) to see the origins of your blog's name.

Added in edit: has the editting joke gone past its use-by date yet?

Bob

Date: 2007/12/14 00:59:12, Link
Author: Bob O'H
[Graffiti moved to Bathroom Wall. -Admin]

Quote (Annyday @ Dec. 13 2007,23:37)
Quote (franky172 @ Dec. 13 2007,21:13)
Quote (Touchstone @ Dec. 13 2007,20:16)
 
Quote (franky172 @ Dec. 13 2007,20:07)
 
Quote (Touchstone @ Dec. 13 2007,19:50)
   
Quote (Touchstone @ Dec. 13 2007,19:47)
Just for grins, I brewed up a set of spoof "inspirational posters" for the Intelligent Design d00dz as part of some good-natured jousting on an email loop I'm on.  Just thought I'd share a couple here.






More at my blog here.

-TS

Whoops, sorry 'bout that. Guess I have to link to the large-format pic.





link

-Touchstone

Spectacular!

I'm partial to Consilience.... what?

Thanks,

Sorry about the link bummage. Not sure what voodoo I'm missing on IMG tags here, but I can't edit, so folks can click over if they wanna have a look.

-Touchstone

It looks like blogger.com doesn't allow hot-linking - i.e. you can't direct link to pics from other sites.  For example, I can't link to your pics using <img src =""> also.

Try hosting them on any of the free image hosting sites like Flickr or photobucket...

I'll be honest, I just wanted to add another quote box into to the mix. I have nothing to say.

Oh dear, oh dear.  We all kjnow what's going to happen now.
Bob

Date: 2007/12/15 01:49:43, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Another atheist plant! They discovered another one of our moles!

Plant?  Mole?  Kristine, I think you need a refresher course in biology pretty quick.

Bob

Date: 2007/12/15 06:51:08, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I do hope Robo was being unintentionally ironic and sexist...

Quote
9

Robo

12/15/2007

1:03 am

Well done Bill. Great stuff!

Zoe: this leaves you and me and all others who embrace ID on another level where we can finally shake the cursed monkey off our shoulders and talk about why you believe what you do and why Bill believes as he does. At last, one day at least, we will be able to have open dialog about this stuff. Let the debates begin I say! :-)

You aren’t going to persecute Bill are you, and stifle free dialog about all this stuff, Zoe?

May the best man win!

.. or that (s)he's one of you.

Oh, and I did enjoy this little piece of juxtaposition from the article:
Quote
Leading scientist and mathematician William A. Dembski has devoted years to researching intelligent design.

He is a research professor in philosophy at Southwestern Baptist Theological Seminary...

I wonder where he's leading us.

Date: 2007/12/15 07:00:52, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Hermagoras - if you want a quick divorce, ask your wife to read it to you.

I'm finally reading Tristram Shandy.  Highly recommended, and much better than the book on survey sampling that's my 'work reading'.

Bob

Date: 2007/12/15 12:32:14, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
... so if God doesn't come in and "toggle the flagellum", design event style, would this not imply that the flagellum ... evolves? In fact, would this not imply that it evolves via processes indiscernible from naturalistic ones? Putting "teleological" or "telic" next to "organizing principles", although it does lend a certain air of magic, does not generate a radical new "paradigm". It makes a complementary, somewhat inelegant, minor hypothesis for a single case of evolution. We discover new things about evolution a lot. This is not too big a deal.

Well, it does let in front-loading as a mechanism.

Front-loading is great because it actually makes predictions that might be testable - there should be the remnants of programmes still kicking around, and older fossils should show some evidence of larger genomes, for example.  Which means that we get the chance to point and laugh when they're shown wrong.  Errm, not that I'm pre-judging in any way.  But this is a good reason why the leading lights of the ID movement should arm themselves with 10 foot poles whenever the idea appears.

Of course, the fact that two of its leading proponents are JAD and DaveScot might be a contributory factor too.

Bob

Date: 2007/12/15 12:34:33, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Gotta love this
Quote
And I’ve stressed throughout my writings that there are alternative philosophical frameworks for making sense of ID. None of these considerations undercuts the scientific core of ID.

Anyone?  Anyone?

Date: 2007/12/16 03:56:18, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Over at the "Dembski is a Christian, discuss" thread, alext has self-banninated, after having a siezure reading this:
http://www.uncommondescent.com/educati....-156312
Quote


44

StephenB

12/15/2007

5:21 pm

—–alext, “i’m afraid freedom of speech does not affect science.”

You are not serious, right? Secularist judges have arrogated to themselvws the right to define science and set limits concerning where and when these matters may be discussed.

——…”as my understanding is, intelligent design presents itself as a secular theory.”

Your understanding is not informed by the facts. ID does not present itself as either religious or secular.

—–“i’d take issue with the posts referring to Isaac Newton. although he was religious, his laws are entirely secular.”

Earth to Alex—–they are not “his” laws. He discovered them; he did not create them.

—–“if in fact, Newton was trying to find the nature of God, or similar, his laws would be noticably different.”

Scientic laws do not change their texture because of the intent of the scientiest.

——”in reference to your point about it being “quite logical for [Dembski] to assume the designer is God” i’d suggest that it’s a massive leap of assumption (some might say faith) to go from observing complexity in biological systems to vindicating a very extravagent and ancient religion.”

According to the Bible, God revealed himself in nature. In both the Old and New Testaments, God’s “designs” have been made manifest. Inasmuch as no other religious or secular world view makes that claim, it’s not that much of a leap now is it?

—–”I didn’t realise there was a strong antipathy towards the “s”-word in these parts. i’m afraid i won’t refrain from using it, as it is an important concept. obviously, in my usage of “secular” in relation to the laws of thermodynamics, i meant that the Laws have absolutely no relation to God at all in their application. whether or not God exists, the laws of thermodynamics will apply the same way.”

There is no antipathy toward the “s” word. The only problem is secularists who pretend not to have a world view and try to pass themselves off as disinterested observers.

Where to start, where to start?

Bob

Date: 2007/12/16 04:16:30, Link
Author: Bob O'H
RB, what happened to the other three?

Date: 2007/12/16 07:26:14, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Alan - bannination's too easy.  I want a challenge.

Date: 2007/12/16 12:22:29, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Ouch.  If I ever try to get into a blog-fight with Wes, I hope one of you will be merciful and stop me.

Just one of the highlights:
Quote
” [471]THE WITNESS: I’m sorry. I’m thinking with my eyes closed. I’m sorry.”

Date: 2007/12/16 12:57:29, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Evolution makes people on far away planets act all mean and stuff.

And not just on faraway planets.  Arsemuppet.

Bob

Date: 2007/12/17 12:41:29, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Is it just me, or does Huckerbee look a little bit too much like Peter Mandelson?

Bob

Date: 2007/12/18 11:50:51, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
DaveTard!

http://www.uncommondescent.com/off-top....u-brute

List of 100 dissenting scientists... gets press coverage...therefor global warming denialism is okay.

Actualy, no more than 99 scientists.  One of the signatories is Nigel Lawson:
Quote
The Rt. Hon. Lord Lawson of Blaby, economist; Chairman of the Central Europe Trust; former Chancellor of the Exchequer, U.K.

I'm going to come over all grumpy and say that economists aren't scientists.  Especially when they've been in politics or journalism or business since 1961.

Bastard's richer than me, too.

Bob

Date: 2007/12/19 03:15:08, Link
Author: Bob O'H
snoeman - you don't know much about flies, do you?  The correct continuation of that quote is "..and some end up in the soup, because God wanted lots of 'Waiter, waiter' jokes".

Bob

Date: 2007/12/19 13:23:05, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Amadan @ Dec. 19 2007,12:29)
Quote (Rob @ Dec. 19 2007,12:19)
[URL=http://www.uncommondescent.com/biology/are-those-without-formal-academic-training-in-evolutionary-biology-justified-in-challengin


g-the-experts/#comment-157227]Fafarman[/URL]:        
Quote
IMO anyone who has read several of the popular books about evolution should consider him/herself to be fairly expert in the field.

I'd love to watch Larry in court, especially when he brings in his "expert" witnesses.

Honest, that pome was intended as a parody!

Well, that makes me fairly expert on ... no hang on a minute, those are magazines, not books.

What a double-act you too are.

I'm in awe.

Bob
EDIT: Can I have those magazines when you've finished with them?

Date: 2007/12/19 13:27:56, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Hermagoras shows up at Joe G's door to get that elusive ID evidence and is shot; the state contends that it was Joe G who shot Hermagoras.

Speaking of which, has anyone heard from Hermagoras recently?  The last I saw he was starting to read Sanford's Genetic Entropy book.  I'm concerned that Hermagoras' DNA might have succumbed to the SLoT.

Bob

Date: 2007/12/19 14:15:07, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Mister DNA - that's what worries me.  Remember, he works in the humanities, so he knows how to write.

Bob

Date: 2007/12/20 00:19:09, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (keiths @ Dec. 19 2007,20:51)
O'Leary:
 
Quote
But if you think that the information service that Bill Dembski has provided you here for years - out of his own resources - is worthwhile, go to Amazon and vote up the reviews that sound like the person has actually READ the book. Vote the others down.

Ironic that she wants people to sound like they've read the book.  Here's her review:
http://www.amazon.com/review....Helpful
Quote

5.0 out of 5 stars At last - serious information about what the ID guys say!, December 13, 2007
By Denyse O'Leary "Denyse"
A growing pile of books dealing with intelligent design (ID) is published each year. Some argue for or against a given ID hypothesis, others try to interpret the controversy on behalf of an interest group. After we have set aside the works of conspiracy theorists and sectarian or atheist cranks, which of the new books legitimately demand our attention? Design of Life, by ID theorists William Dembski and Jonathan Wells, is certainly one. It offers the ID theorists' current analysis of key problems in the evolution of life on Earth. Origin of mind, origin of species, and origin of life are all covered in detail, as is irreducible and specified complexity in The Design of Life: Discovering Signs of Intelligence In Biological Systems. Design of Life is particularly valuable as a supplement to textbooks that minimize the problems with current accounts of evolution. It is also a timely resource for those who are willing to consider the possibility that an accurate history of life includes an account of design, not only of chance and necessity. - Denyse O'Leary, author, journalist, and blogger, and co-author of The Spiritual Brain

Date: 2007/12/20 02:29:58, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Look on the bright side, Hermagoras.  At least you have a ready supply of mushrooms.

Bob
P.S. good to see your DNA hasn't suffered from heat death yet.

Date: 2007/12/20 07:26:34, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Interesting stuff, thanks for doing the research.  At times I like BarryA, because he seems to have enough brain cells to rub together.  But then he uses shooting tragedies to come out with his crap about it being the atheists' fault (but, errm, not directly, oh no).

However...

Quote
...among legislation he promulgated was a bill designed to present the exposure of minors to sexually explicit materials...

I guess your only reaction to that slip can be "Oh, shoot!".

Bob

Date: 2007/12/20 09:10:25, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Right down to the French accents, oui.

Le Bob

Date: 2007/12/21 00:35:04, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I think DaveScot is getting himself warmed up again:
http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....-157416
Quote


32

DaveScot

12/20/2007

4:17 am

Mike Gene is a shrinking violet. He carefully hides his identity so his notions about ID can’t be used to blemish his reputation (whatever that reputation might be). While I admire his thinking on the subject to some extent I don’t have any respect for the man (or possibly woman) himself. His rejection of ID as science is par for the course - my guess is he’s covering his ass in case his boss or peers find out what he’s been doing in his secret life. No doubt he appeals to many Western Europeans. Western Europe has lost its backbone and has become a continent full of shrinking violets. I’m guessing the United States will have to rescue it yet again in the not too distant future when the Muslim horde successfully takes it over.

It's like he's covalescing from a long illness.  It's not the Dave of old, but it's a good sign, so we should all smile and say encouraging things to him - he'll be back to his old self in no time etc. etc.

Bob

Date: 2007/12/21 01:12:13, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Full confession time - I'm a blog pimp.
http://www.uncommondescent.com/science....-157678

Thanks Falan Ox for the blog design, and JAD for the content.

Bob

Date: 2007/12/21 01:19:13, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (oldmanintheskydidntdoit @ Dec. 20 2007,11:03)
Quote
At times I like BarryA, because he seems to have enough brain cells to rub together.

Yeah, that's coming to somebody's defence. In bizzaro world.

It was meant to be undserstatement.  I hoped enough British culture would have seeped through here.  :-)

Seriously, I would like to see Barry reply here - he strikes mas as one of the few people at UD with whom we might have a genuine exchange of ideas, even if we didn't agree in the end.

And if it doesn't happen I'm going to fly over to Texas, buy a gun, shoot a few lawyers and blame it all on Thomas Aquinas.

Bob

Date: 2007/12/21 01:24:18, Link
Author: Bob O'H
http://www.uncommondescent.com/the-des....contest
Quote
21 December 2007
EXPELLED Sticker Contest
William Dembski

In my last post, I mentioned the prospect that THE DESIGN OF LIFE would, with the help of our Darwinist friends, become a companion volume to Ben Stein’s EXPELLED: NO INTELLIGENCE ALLOWED (www.expelledthe movie.com — check out also www.getexpelled.com).

In the event that THE DESIGN OF LIFE becomes such a companion volume, a colleague sent me a sticker that could be put on it. Here is that sticker:

EXPELLED Sticker

I like it, but frankly I think we can do better. I’m therefore offering a $100 prize to anyone who can come up with a better sticker (receipt of payment for the prize cedes copyright to me). The sticker needs to be posted online as a jpeg with a link in the comments to this thread. For now, the sticker should only publicize EXPELLED (explicit connection with DoL as a companion volume can be done later). The contest extends through February 12th, 2008 — Darwin’s birthday and the official release date of EXPELLED.

Come on folks, surely one of you will win $100.  You'll be able to buy a bottle of Scotch with it!

EDIT (not for FtK's benefit): Men - careful how how you stretch when there's a cat sat in your lap.  The push-off from
his back legs as he escapes can be, um, painful.

Bob

Date: 2007/12/21 08:54:08, Link
Author: Bob O'H
In the discussions of the book, there's one that stands out
No middle ground here

Including this little titbit:
Quote
 Mona Albano says:
Yes, it's sort of the reaction that one would get for a book called, "I was abudcted by little green men" when the commenters were the Abduction Survivors Group on the one hand and the Psychiatrists' Association on the other.

Date: 2007/12/21 12:54:29, Link
Author: Bob O'H
But by implication only one Richard.

Date: 2007/12/22 01:40:22, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
I hereby pledge $500 to anyone who successfully submits to UDensity a logo about non-existent censorship.

I hereby bet a bottle of single malt scotch that Jupiter won't pay out.

Although I too am hoping to see some AtBC entries (either submitted or not).

Bob

Date: 2007/12/22 01:45:03, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
I hope she's not as strung-out as she appears to be on Newsnight.

Ah, Coulter vs. Paxo.  Good times, good times.

There was only ever going to be one winner in that contest.

Bob

Date: 2007/12/22 10:46:45, Link
Author: Bob O'H
From the page Annyday recommended:
 
Quote
"ATLANTA NIGHTS makes the legendary EYE OF ARGON read like Asimov!" — Nick Pollotta

Ouch.

Date: 2007/12/22 13:08:37, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Jerry (who is a tard) doesn't get it
Quote
I actually prefer those who are anti ID as long as they are polite. If they are knowledgeable, it is a great way to learn something. People come here thinking it will be easy to put us in our place but no one has done it yet and those who are hostile usually don’t stay long because they get frustrated having to justify their comments when they cannot provide any relevant data or arguments.

Date: 2007/12/23 02:07:05, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Albatrossity2 @ Dec. 22 2007,20:36)
Just for giggles, I checked to see the status of one of my books on Amazon. Unfortunately they only have the first edition (there was a second edition, really), it is currently ranked at #1,056,389 in sales, and you can get it for as cheaply as $0.35.

But it does have an average of 5 stars (from one reviewer)...

Still and all, I'd like to think that it did a lot more good for the world of science than any of Dembski's efforts  :)

You're more appreciated in the UK - there it's worth at least £1.48.

Bob

EDIT: and it even has a review now!

Date: 2007/12/23 08:05:35, Link
Author: Bob O'H
The definitive answers, part 1

 
Quote
• Could you play sports in space, if you had a spacesuit?

Yes, but only fencing and basketball.

 
Quote
• Can a baby get drunk off of nonalcoholic beer?

Yes, if they can find a toddler prepared to share their Baileys.

 
Quote
• Very rare to find a hotel room with a light on the ceiling, they're usually floor lamps or desk lamps. Is there some structural reason for that?

No.  They are on the ceiling.  You shouldn't go drinking with toddlers.

   
Quote
• Mitt Romney is running for president. His father, George Romney, a former governor of Michigan, ran for president in 1968. Is "Mitt" named for the mitten-shape of Michigan?

No, he's called that because he was the one who could handle the hot chicks.

   
Quote
• How do surface-dwelling fish survive monster sea storms?

They have water wings.

   
Quote
• If I drank a bunch of orange juice, which caused me to get heartburn, then ate a bunch of antacids, would it neutralize the vitamin C, thus providing no benefits from the ingested vitamin? If so, if you ate antacids continually, would you get scurvy?

Only if you drank a lot of vitamin C.  Otherwise it woulds not be possible for the antacid to neutralize it.

   
Quote
• I've been looking for information on how the word "dick" became an insult, especially since people still go by the name Dick. Why would anyone choose that name, when it has other meanings?!?!

I am not qualified to answer this question, but Mr. Hughes will be along in a moment.

 
Quote
• Why do male ice skaters have routines that are so feminine in execution? After all these years, there should be some kind of movements on ice that would be more masculine-looking. The gymnastics shows have them.

They do have more masculine moves, but can only perform them with 9 other men, two nets and an over-done hamburger.

 
Quote
• Why are some cats softer to the touch than others? Is it possible I have the softest cat in the world?

Possibly, but you should make care to put conditioner on his tongue before he grooms himself.

 
Quote
• In Robert Ludlum's The Bourne Identity, he says that Jason Bourne can pack with great economy of space, allowing him to pack much more in a small bag than it would seem. How would one do this, and is it even a real thing?

It is not possible, although a Bag of Many Things may give that appearance.

 
Quote
• Do you have any idea why sporting the moustache was so much more common in the military than in any other job in 19th-century Western countries, and to some extent present-day Western countries?

Yes.

 
Quote
• If an unscrupulous bar owner was to mix diethylene to, say, whiskey, what would the effect be on the consumer?

None.  The customer only drinks Bud.

 
Quote
• I am an Afro-American woman. I am in my youthful 50s. My hair is strong and a little past the shoulders. I wear it pressed (hot combed or flat iron). It is also a salt-and-pepper color; I get great compliments on it. The problem I have is static. Could you give me some tips on what to use to stop this?

Silly woman.  If your problem is static, it has already stopped.

 
Quote
• There was the most beautiful sunset here in Indiana last evening. Would the California fires have anything to do with that?

Only if they were caused by the heat of someone's romance.

 
Quote
• I haven't seen this in the news, but perhaps you could explain it anyway. Why do people feel like destroying things when angry?

It is because we are intelligently designed.

 
Quote
• Why do most reptiles go to sleep when you rub their bellies? I have done it myself with everything from domestic water dragons to wild alligators, but I heard recently that it is bad for them—and they only appear to be sleeping, when in fact they are having trouble breathing. Is this true?

It is true that they are having trouble breathing.  But that is because they suffer from asthma, and are stress because they are worried about being approached by a human and rubbed to sleep.

 
Quote
• Would it be possible to "shoot" someone with "lightning"? Like, a Taser with no electrodes.

Yes, but they need to be standing under a tree.  It is a little known fact that in reality MacBeth was prophesized to die by a lightning strike, a fact which lead to massive forestation of the Scottish moors.

In reality, again, he died after a hunting accident when he was struck in the face by a panicked grouse.

 
Quote
• Why do men almost never win on ABC's Wheel of Fortune?

This is clear from the femine Latin root - Fortuna Imperatrix Mundi.  Now clear Orff.

 
Quote
• Are any of the scorpions in central Vietnam deadly? I was stung three times one night, and evacuated to a hospital where doctors said the one that stung me was the only lethal one in Vietnam. Truth or lie?

True.  You should consider yourself honoured to have been worthy of attack by such a rare individual.

     
Quote
• Why don't we drop medical waste and nuclear waste into active volcanoes, the "ultimate high-temperature incinerators"?

Because we don't want to release more thetans.

Date: 2007/12/23 08:07:38, Link
Author: Bob O'H
The definitive answers, part 2
   
Quote
• Hello. I am an editor and writer and I would like for everyone to change some letters that are now in lowercase to uppercase. An example would be the 18th century to the 18th Century. Where does one go about starting to do this?

not HeRe.

   
Quote
• Is it "open sees me" or "open says me"?

Ask Big Bird, it's right up his street.

   
Quote
• Can dogs be mentally retarded?

No, but they can be fire retardant.

   
Quote
• Why don't they build into cars a secret button for police to use, and when these people are trying to get away from police down the freeway and city streets at 100 mph, the following police car could push the button, making the engine on the speeding car stop? Surely there must be some smart person who could make this.

They have done this.  Try driving up Pensylvania Avenue in Washington D.C. at 100 mph in an SUV with "Kill Bush" written on the side whilst wearing a towel on your head, and you will get a demonstration.  And a five year holiday in sunny Cuba!

   
Quote
• Why does having a foreign accent make a person seem more attractive?

Dunno.  Never worked for me.

   
Quote
• How often are presidents born, and how often do they die? Do they die in bunches, or on average every four years?

Presidents are never born.  They are manufactured in vats.

   
Quote
• When a fly lands on a ceiling, does it execute a barrel roll or an inside loop?

You've been drinking with toddlers again, haven't you?

   
Quote
• Is there such a thing as "crazy eyes," where the whites go all the way around the corneas and makes the person look psycho, such as those of runaway bride Jennifer Wilbanks and wife-dismemberer Stephen Grant?

No, but there are such things as "crazy eyes" .

   
Quote
• I've always wanted to know why bald heads shine!!!

Me toooneoneone

   
Quote
• Who is Daniel Engbert? I'm sure that I'm spelling his name wrong, but he's one of a few guys that you regularly go to as a reliable source—and I want to know who he is and why he's qualified.

He has two PhDs, in quaternary geology and quaternion mathematics, so is therefore able to speak with expertise on art history and animal health.

   
Quote
• What infections do viruses and microorganisms suffer from? My guess is none. They only suffer from random mutations and suffering caused (mostly by humans) by chemicals.

They also suffer from bloat due to front-loading.

   
Quote
• I have been looking for an old movie from about the late '60s. I was born in 1960 and watched it as a little kid. It was a Santa movie and it had the Devil in it. It was like the Devil was trying to stop Christmas. I remember the Devil was wearing red PJs. Santa has a magic powder that would make people sleep. It was a cute movie. Please help.

No, I will not be a party to the corruption of the middle-aged.  Read some Jeffrey Archer instead.

   
Quote
• What do the SWAT teams do to keep their fitness? Like, do they run for half an hour, or do five pressups?

They chase and squash flies for half an hour.

   
Quote
• If mountains are measured from sea level, then the 12,000-foot peaks in Colorado are only about 7,000 feet above Denver since they lie on a 5,000-foot-high plain. That being so, a one-foot rock lying on the ground becomes a 5,001-foot-high mountain. Do we need to address this differently, if it really matters at all?

Yes, please.  Address this to anyone but me.

   
Quote
• Is it possible in any way to prove that someone was on crack cocaine nine to 10 years ago?

Yes, simply ask them if they knew Deigo Maradonna.

   
Quote
• Why don't long-haired football players, many of them of Polynesian descent, get their tresses tugged during their gridiron clash?

Because that's a girly thing to do.  Better to knee them in the balls.

   
Quote
• This may be a dumb question. Most people spell their names as first name, middle initial, and last name. But some people spell their name as initial, given name, and then last name. Is the initial before the given name their first name, and they go by their middle name? Or is the initial before the given name their middle initial? If it is their middle initial, why would you put it before your first name, because then it is not in the middle anymore? It seems like conservatives or Republicans are more likely to list their name starting with an initial.

Not so, although all elected Republican politicians have R. as their middle initial.

But you are right, it is a dumb question.

   
Quote
• What would happen to the rest of the planets and the sun if Jupiter were to explode, or somehow leave our galaxy altogether?

The whole suite would be about 8 minutes shorter, and not as jolly.

   
Quote
• Which is the best hearing aid? Why are there so many different ones, and are the ones that allow you to hear others' conversations across the room legal?

Your ears.

   
Quote
• When a man lies to his lawyer to obtain a divorce from a wife of 47 years when she is ill and does not even know and cannot defend herself, is this legal, or perjury?

This question has been passed on to the DHS.  You will be receiving a call shortly.

Date: 2007/12/23 13:26:01, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Richardthughes @ Dec. 23 2007,12:53)
Quote (someotherguy @ Dec. 23 2007,12:40)
# 7,001

Geez. Waterloo. Blink and you miss it.

Yeah, Blücher almost had that problem too.

Date: 2007/12/24 00:31:52, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Alan Fox @ Dec. 22 2007,16:59)


For Bob O'H (though they slightly misspelled vittu)

And the wine is quite good, too!

PS thanks for the plug.

Aaah, thanks for that Alan.  I guess it doesn't taste like cat's piss.

And have a merry Christmas!

Date: 2007/12/24 11:04:20, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (oldmanintheskydidntdoit @ Dec. 24 2007,07:55)
 
Quote (Albatrossity2 @ Dec. 24 2007,08:11)
It's amusing that even the regulars at UD seem to be getting bored with Granny Tard and her dullness. On her post about the duality of mind and brain, there was only one comment. And on her most recent post, a link to her interview with Guillermo Gonzalez, the very first comment points out a typo in her OP, and the third comment points out that she is confusing IC with ID.

Maybe her Christmas stocking will have a copy of this.

KariosFocus says
     
Quote
PPS: In 30 above, Q, I explicitly addressed the explanatory filter, step by step. I therefore find your comment on situations commonly enountered in nature but not filtering out to exhibiting FSCI, puzzling in that light.


Could somebody with an active account ask for a worked through example of the EF please from KF?

He does alot of "inferring"
     
Quote
For instance, DNA is a complex and functionally specified digital bit-string, just like the underlying code for this web page. The odds of getting to a functioning DNA string by chance, on the gamut of our observed universe, are negligibly different from zero. It is therefore reasonable to infer — absent imposition of arbitrary selective hyperskepticism or philosophically question-begging, historically unwarranted rules such as so-called methodological naturalism — that it is designed.


but no numbers are present.

Lets see the EF done for a
Snowflake
Fractal (Mandelbrot)
Stonehenge
malaria parasite.

and so on. Lets see if the EF can tell what is designed and what is not
:D

Link

You bastard.  Now I feel obliged to read that stuff.

Bob
P.S. Erasmus - it's Fisherian and Bayesian.  Rev. Th. Bayes and R.A. Fisher were people.  And I'm both a pedant and a statistician.  :-(



Date: 2007/12/24 11:46:41, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Too late, OldMan.  If it's short, it's bearable.

As far as I can see, your weight has FCSI, because it's between 50kg and 200kg, because it is possible to be can be somewhere 0 and infinity.

Quote
Edited by Lou FCD on Dec. 24 2007,12:16

Now, now.  Winding up FtK by proxy.  Not kind.  Have you no consideration for the kids?

Bob

Date: 2007/12/24 13:51:05, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Lou FCD @ Dec. 24 2007,12:22)
Just fixing the links, Bob.  That wasn't even a deliberate pigtail pulling (this time).

Oh, you may not have been.  :-)

Date: 2007/12/24 14:35:42, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I'm sure there's something I should say here:

Hyvää joulua!  God jul!  Merry errrm, ...

Oh, yes.  Happy Easter everyone!

More at my blog, including the inevitable YouTube clip.

Bob

Date: 2007/12/25 00:28:40, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Ilíon Says:
December 25, 2007 at 12:25 am

Rich: “Prove god is necessary. Please. We’ll all convert. Not sure ro which faith, though.”

That’s easy: to the “faith” demands the least; to the “faith” that allows you to continue to play God.

It has been proven over and over that God is necessary. You folk don’t listen.

Huh?  I can't even parse that argument.  I assume it's a quote from somewhere, and if one knows the quote, one knows the argument.

Reading over the comments, it's clear that Rich is at a disadvantage, because beastrabban is utterly lacking in a sense of humour.

Hmmm.  Pointing and laughing at theists is a vital part of militant atheism.  beastrabban doesn't have a sense of humour.  Therefore beastrabban is an atheist.  Annyday can fill in the gaps.  :-)

Bob

Date: 2007/12/25 00:34:54, Link
Author: Bob O'H
It's 8.30am here at the moment (that's 6.30am GMT), and look who's here:
Quote
19 guests, 4 Public Members and 0 Anonymous Members   [ View Complete List ]
>Bob O'H >sparc >Ftk >Doc Bill

Ftk - go to bed now or Santa won't visit!  He knows if anyone in your house is awake, and won't come until later.

Oh, and Merry Christmas!

Bob

Date: 2007/12/25 01:11:03, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Hmmm.  Galapogos Finch has created a curious quandry for me.  He's put up another one of his amusing photoshop posts.  Now, because it's Christmas, I feel that this should be the time to be a bit more civil and forgiving of our fellow man, woman and finch.  However, he includes this line:
Quote
"These dogs deserve rights.  They should even be allowed to vote in the Presidential election," said Fetcher.

"I'm voting for Hillary!" Roxie Kleveland exclaimed.  "Our kind needs to stick together."

which seems to be stretching the concept of seasonal goodwill a bit too far.

So, do I let it pass, or do I point out the utterly superfluous political insult?

Hmm, well none of you are going to read this until after Christmas day is over, so here's a chance to let out all that bile you've been holding in every time you hear Cliff Richard singing carols on the radio.

And Happy Boxing Day!

Bob

Date: 2007/12/25 12:26:50, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Now it's clear that the ID God is hiding in the error term.  

So at least we know he's normal.

Sorry.

Bob

Date: 2007/12/26 01:03:20, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
But WADerloo seems to be imminent...

We've been thinking that for years, but it never seems to arrive.

Date: 2007/12/26 01:39:59, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
This may be the prototype for all future ID blogs:  If you don't allow replies, they can't point out your mistakes.

You don think they're just starting the banning as they mean to go on?

Date: 2007/12/27 08:19:56, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Obviously it's a transitional form, MillstoneCam.

Bob

Date: 2007/12/28 00:11:22, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Paul Leautaud

Is that an alternative spelling of LyoTARD?

Bob

Date: 2007/12/28 00:25:08, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
That's you, that is.

Is that a Mary Whitehouse Experience reference sneaked in there?

Bob

Date: 2007/12/28 00:32:03, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Is Salvador really so stupid that he confuses what is with what should be?

We could just ask him, but since he's on a creationist blog he would probably delete the question.

Oh, he wouldn't.  It wouldn't even make it to the delete button - you have to be invited onto the blog to be able to comment.

Bob

Date: 2007/12/28 00:43:20, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
For Christmas this year, I got the very finest, top-of-the-line, ultra-heavy-duty model from Acme Irony Meters.

I could have told you that would happen.  I bought some second-hand German irony-meters they had used with the English fans in the World Cup in 2006.  They were quality German industrial engineering.  Each one lasted about a week at UD.  One post destroyed three simultaneously, when none of them was even switched on.

Bob

Date: 2007/12/28 00:50:21, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Nice slip by bFast:
Quote
3 - in “Evidence, a Theory in Crisis” Michael Denton renders...

Date: 2007/12/28 09:26:12, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Richardthughes @ Dec. 28 2007,09:19)
Tis twue.

Another meme for the board!

Homo

Date: 2007/12/29 10:01:51, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Richardthughes @ Dec. 28 2007,10:24)
Actually, Bob, it's a nice square size, just right for an avatar...

;)

He's right, you know.

If Mr. Williams' estate notices this, they're not going to be happy by the association.

Bob

Date: 2007/12/31 02:19:16, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I'm waiting for Wes' take on the Meester paper (please? :-)).  I'm not convinced by his arguments - I regularly use models of the real world when we don't have precise knowledge about the mechanisms.  It's taken me about 15 years to overcome my surprise that any of them actually work in practice.

Ah, but more seriously, I'm still waiting for the good tard to turn up there  Where's GEM of TKI and BA77 when you need them?

Bob

Date: 2007/12/31 10:55:00, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Urgh. I'm going to need to do some other stuff, but Meester is off to a bad start here.

I think his argument worth taking seriously.  I don't think he's right, but I think he's wrong in ways that might be interesting.
Quote
They correctly point out that natural selection (selecting the optimal in each generation) may or may not be the most efficient strategy long-term.

I think one of the problems with the whole approach of viewing evolution as a search for an optimum is that it isn't even that - at best it's a search for something better, and even that isn't guaranteed.  I think there are better trees to bark up.

Anyway, this is interesting (and you might have missed, because it must have been lurking in the moderation queue waiting to be released):
Quote
12

markzwart

12/30/2007

4:59 pm

After being a long time lurker, both here and at the thumb, I finally have to make a comment. Why? Two reasons:

1. I’m currently finishing up a Ph.D. in experimental evolution of baculoviruses (anyone ever heard of them here?). My thesis mainly concerns the development and validation of models of viral infection and population genetics - my first publications will be out the coming half year. Nevertheless, I’m interested in the philosophical ramifications of evolutionary biology. And I have a Christian background.

2. I’m Dutch - as is R. Meester - and have read some of his popular articles in Dutch and heard a few debates on ID in which he has participated. But enough about me.

What surprizes me greatly is no one has recognized that Ronald Meester is one of the people who started getting ID in the spotlights here in the Netherlands. Granted, he has always taken a somewhat agnostic position with respect to ‘ID proper’, and even more so to any religious/philosophical implications of ID. But, he has really stuck his neck out in order to get people - in scientific and lay circles - thinking about ID. And he has taken a lot of flak for his stance, from both camps. To qualify his position in his latest paper as ‘grudging acknowledgement disguised as disagreement or even claimed refutation’ is skewed. If anything, Meester is a friend of the ID movement, even if he is not (or perhaps no longer) a part of it. I am by no means an ID supporter myself, but cut the man some slack. ;-)

Date: 2007/12/31 12:34:33, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Richardthughes @ Dec. 31 2007,10:48)
HAR HAR THIS IS POO:

http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....-159774

 
Quote
1

JWarner

12/31/2007

11:35 am
CAUTION! This article contains graphic images.

But astonishingly little humour. I will admit I do not have the stomach for most material that passes for satire on this great Electronic Superhighway, and TheBRITES does absolutely nothing to change that.

To each their own, I suppose, but please tell me one of our UD own is not involved in that disturbing site.

Does anyone else agree that the content and the amateurish and unsettling PhotoShop hack jobs do nothing to make our cause seem reasonable, viable and attractive to an outsider?


All science so far!

toc agrees:
Quote


3

toc

12/31/2007

1:04 pm

sorry, I meant to say This should be the place for sound reasoning — NOT embarrassing cartoons and character assassination.

I guess someone's forgotten about certain animated Christmas presents, with or without flatulence.

I can see a bannination coming up - the clock is ticking on toc.

Bob

Date: 2008/01/01 03:06:07, Link
Author: Bob O'H
What was that about Galapagos Finch's sense of humor?

http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....-159851
Quote


46

Galapagos Finch

12/31/2007

8:24 pm

Look at this man’s picture! Quick! Someone give him a laxative!

Gloppy

I should admit that I found the "grater as children's slide" post amusing, but I freely admit to having a sense of humour so tasteless it's happy with English cuisine.

Happy new year folks!  May the tard flow bountifully, and may you enjoy regular meltdowns every Friday!

Bob

Date: 2008/01/01 10:47:38, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (ERV @ Jan. 01 2008,08:55)
I know this person.  They had a different blog before and linked to me... lemme do some hunting to see if I can find the old site.

I'm guessing you don't mean this person:
http://professorsmith.vox.com/

Bob

Date: 2008/01/02 12:16:22, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
3. FTK will elope, not with Rich, although they will always be "just friends" but RB.

Not with Sal?  We'll have to set him up with someone else.

ERV - fancy some cottage cheese?

Quote
4.  Some FL school board will "Do A Dover" and be busted.  Hilarity will ensue.

You mean they'll try to paint their cliffs white?

Quote
5.  Denyse will not receive any Pulitzer nominations.

I was going to object to that, until I realised the first letter wasn't a B.

Oh, I predict that Galapagos Finch will produce a funny photoshop story sometime in July.  That's funny strange, not funny ha-ha.

Bob

Date: 2008/01/03 00:57:04, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
I predict Luskin will undergo a sex change operation and move to remote Vermont where he'll use his eyebrows to predict the severity of upcoming winters

Vermont?  I love it so!

Date: 2008/01/03 01:06:43, Link
Author: Bob O'H
If you can drag yourselves away from the Sal/FtK show, the regulars are getting creamed on the NFL thread.  PaV, of course, just demonstrates his cluelessness:
Quote
116

PaV

01/02/2008

11:07 pm

kairos #95:

After all this is what allow microevolution.

Can anyone definitely say exactly how microevolution works genetically? If you start talking about alleles, just remember that the term, allele, arose before anyone knew about DNA.

You’re arguing here about the characteristics of NFL theorems based on biology; which is what Haggstrom does. Maybe that’s not the best way to do math.

perlopp #97:

You misunderstand Haggstrom’s argument. The uniform distribution is over the set of fitness functions.

First of all, it isn’t a uniform distribution over the fitness function for two reasons: (1) Haggstrom doesn’t mention fitness functions, he simply introduces a function, f, which, of course MAY be a fitness function; (2) the distribution is over the set |S|^|V|, which is a combination of both |V| and |S|.

Second, you say I ‘misunderstand’ Haggstrom’s argument. I suppose this means that you do understand it. Please do us the kindness of presenting Haggstrom’s actual argument.

ETA: close that quote...

Date: 2008/01/03 14:33:26, Link
Author: Bob O'H
ERV - unless Oleg has changed his account recently, he appears on Prof. Smith's blog as Oleg Tchernyshyov.

FWIW, I also noticed the name today and thought "that looks familiar!".

Well done Oleg on getting something into Nature!  I guess you and Prof. Smith are poles apart.

*ahem*

Bob

Date: 2008/01/04 09:11:49, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Perhaps he's passed the mantle of King of the Meltdowns on to Sal.

Bob

Date: 2008/01/04 12:58:47, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Swivel unicorns?

Never mind...

Anyway, Sal has shown his class again.  But it is a politician he's being ungenerous to, so I'm not sure it counts:

http://www.youngcosmos.com/blog/archives/173
Quote
That said, at least for now, it appears that we won’t have to worry about having the anti-Christ for President.


All this time I've been thinking that Galapagos Finch was wMad.  But perhaps it's Sal.

Bob

Date: 2008/01/06 00:52:16, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
How dare I try to stir up the Status Quo people are comfortable with?

Indeed. How dare you teach them a third chord.  It'll be the end of civilisation, I'm telling you.

Bob

Date: 2008/01/06 02:01:07, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
1) Since Sal is currently allegedly studying "engineering or physics" at a much better institution than Baylor, he should be thanking the evil darwinismus rather than blaming them.

2) AFAIK, Mark's lab is still running. The controversy was over a web server. If Marks wanted Sal to be there, he could still have him. One can only hope that this is a sign of sanity on Marks' part.

3) It was Sal who declined the offer/possibility to work at Baylor.  It's not clear to me what Marks' position on Sal is.  So, the forces of Darwinism only cost Baylor the chance to educate a posturing coward.

Bob

Date: 2008/01/07 12:14:57, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Thanks for the link, Art.  I can't be bothered to go through it in detail right now, but mutation accumulation is something on which there's a decent literature (it relates to things like inbreeding, a big problem in Drosophila populations apparently).

A couple of years ago ReMine asked Leonard Nunney for some code Nunney had used to do some simulations on Haldane's dilemma.  Nunney refused, and ReMine got really upset, apparently unaware that he could read the paper and write his own code.  I mentioned this to someone at ESEB last summer, and the guy's reply was "Oh, so he's [ReMine] stupid and lazy".

Bob

Date: 2008/01/07 12:35:46, Link
Author: Bob O'H
More tard coming up.  Including....







Battle of The Metaphors

xcdesignproponentsists
 
Quote
It seems a bit like saying that Stonehenge could never have been built without cranes or modern-day machinery.


kairos
 
Quote
No, what it’s unplausible is to claim that Stonehange could have been built by earthquakes and tornados.


Of course, the Tornado is modern-day machinery too.

Date: 2008/01/07 14:17:10, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Richardthughes @ Jan. 07 2008,13:54)
I was in the SAS* / **

Me too.  Scunthorpe Alloy Services.

Bob

Date: 2008/01/08 13:23:18, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
You should kick him. er box him. er kickbox him.

Kick him in the box?

Date: 2008/01/09 08:59:35, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Granville Sewell is starting to sound like JAD:

Quote


1

Granville Sewell

01/09/2008

9:34 am

can someone tell me how to get my last link to point directly to my Sept 30 post? (I assume I need a “# something”)

Of course, I've helped him out (before writing it down), but I thought I should store this here, before it gets deleted.

Oh, and the rest of the post is a joy to behold.  Sewell demonstrates a quantum leap in his intelligence.

Bob

Date: 2008/01/10 00:56:59, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
DaveT shows why philosophy ...

Is DaveT related to olegt?  Or to GCT?  We might have a couple of spies here in our midst.

*runs and hides*

Date: 2008/01/10 11:42:52, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I think k.e. is having trouble adjusting his tone to the board.  Poor lad, he's probably only been talking to Australians recently.

Bob

Date: 2008/01/12 09:44:35, Link
Author: Bob O'H
DaveScot writes something I think we would all agree with
Quote
4

DaveScot

01/12/2008

5:16 am

Rick

Good points. But I think the trust issue isn’t about the science but rather about scientists, especially those in academia. Increasingly it seems as if they’re willing to sacrifice objectivity and truthful reporting of the facts in order to acheive political goals. The science underlying flight and laser eye surgery doesn’t really have any partisan politics connected with it. Evolution and global warming on the other hand are rife with politics, deceit, and corruption of science towards political ends. Let’s hope the stink of it doesn’t spill over to the innocent, honest scientists who quietly and competently do their jobs without letting politics influence their work. I’m sure they are in the majority but the dishonest are a vocal minority while the rest are a silent majority.

I agree that it's dreadful that climate change denialists and creationists are bringing deceit and politics into these subjects, whilst honest scien-  

Oh, hang on.  Never mind.

Bob

Date: 2008/01/13 01:17:52, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Curses, I'm getting this from UD at the moment:
       
Quote
We are performing system maintenance
This site should be available once again shortly.

I guess they're hoovering out the cheesy poof dust.

Bob

Date: 2008/01/13 10:50:41, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I was wondering who this mapou was who has recently appeared at UD.  So I followed the link back to
his blog.

The first sentence I read:
Quote
In the previous article, I made a falsifiable prediction about the cerebellum based on my interpretation of certain metaphorical passages in the book of Revelation.


All science so far!

Bob

Date: 2008/01/14 00:59:09, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Hey, folks!  PaV has an ID research project:
Quote


30

PaV

01/13/2008

8:09 pm

Bob #25:

Here’s a “just-so” story: through disuse of the eye, some type of RNA is transmitted to the progeny that is capable of repressing eye-development during embryonic growth. In the two populations, the RNA and its method of repression is slightly different. Since the genes needed for eye development are at no time absent, when these different populations are crossed, the differing RNAs don’t interact in the same way as in each native population, and eyes develop.

I like my “just-so” story better.


Someone tell teh Biologic Institute!

Date: 2008/01/14 14:00:35, Link
Author: Bob O'H
KCdgw - enough about your private life.  What's the book like?

Bob

Date: 2008/01/15 11:00:03, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Richard Simons @ Jan. 15 2008,04:33)
I was entertained by PaV writing
   
Quote
When they find genes for the expression of digits in sea anemones (sea squirts?) . . .

Sea anemones? Sea squirts? What the heck, they're all just bags of jelly.
No-one seemed to notice or think that it mattered to get the facts correct. I would find them marginally more convincing if they occasionally discussed matters of fact instead of endlessly nattering about opinions, but I suppose that is what makes them IDers in the first place and it would be less fun to read.

Perhaps someone should let them in on a secret. A prediction in science is worth nothing if it can not be potentially disproved.

He might be thinking of the front-loading paper that came out last year:
Sherman, M. (2007). Universal genome in the origin of metazoa. Cell Cycle 6: 1873-1877.

If you read up on evo-devo on Pharyngula, you'll discover why this doesn't mean what he thinks it does (essentially, genes can be re-used in different parts of the developmental process).

Bob

Date: 2008/01/15 12:38:21, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Oh, err, hi!

Date: 2008/01/15 13:14:16, Link
Author: Bob O'H
J-Dog - I'm wondering if hooligans go a PM,and decided to pull an FtK.

The whole thread is great, isn't it?  PaV is coming out with some great ideas - I think he's now determined to show that Lamarckism happens, and prove us all wrong.

Bob

Date: 2008/01/16 00:53:10, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
I was thinking that, assuming that genomic entropy is true, if the rate of degradation is known and if the average degree of degradation of a population sample can be obtained, it should be easy to calculate backwards to get an approximate creation time for a given organism.

I'm predicting somewhere between 6000 and 10000 years.

You can guess which thread this is from.  And there's still no sign of kairosfocus, or BA77.

Bob

Date: 2008/01/16 01:02:48, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Well, if it their identities were exposed, who would be left to teach refrigerator repair in the eastern US?

Bob

EDIT: The whole abstracts are worth repeating:
Quote
Viral/Bacterial Attenuation and Its Link to Innate Oncolytic Potential: Implications of the Perfect Original Creation in the Beginning
Luke Kim,1 Independent Scholar

The Bible tells us that microorganisms such as bacteria and viruses were created by the Lord (Colossians 1:16). Since the discovery of microorganisms, they have been mainly recognized as disease-causing agents. However, most microorganisms are benign (indirectly beneficial) or beneficial to humans or other organisms. For example, recent cancer/molecular biology studies show that many benign or attenuated bacteria/viruses are powerful anti-cancer agents specifically targeting cancer cells while sparing the normal ones. Even pathogenic strains of bacteria and viruses can be attenuated to convert them to oncolytic viruses or bacteria. Currently, some of these oncolytic viruses and bacteria are being used for various stages of clinical trials for anti-cancer therapy.

After the Fall, the Bible (Genesis 3:18) suggests that post-Fall viral/bacterial oncolytic activity may have arisen as a phenotypic extension of preexisting normal viral/bacterial activities (possibly serving a role as apoptosis inducer, activator of cellular signalling pathways, etc.) due to a change to harsh biological environments. Ubiquitousness and persistence of these microbes in the biological ecosystem strongly implicate a beneficial microbe-host interaction in the original creation and subsequent disruption of the beneficial microbe-host interaction after the Fall. Nonetheless, due to their genetic flexibility, some viruses and bacteria today still display some of their original/derivative functions, such as oncolytic activity. The study of beneficial microbe-host interactions will help us comprehend the correct biological view of microorganisms (before and after the Fall) from a biblical perspective.

and
Quote
Pathogenicity Tools and Mycotoxins: In the Beginning or after the Fall?
Ira S. Loucks,1 Independent Scholar

Fungi are amazing organisms. As a group, they have colonized practically every ecological niche on earth. Originally created “very good,” certain fungal interactions have degenerated over time resulting in serious human and animal diseases. Fungi are also capable of producing powerful compounds called mycotoxins, which are products of the nonessential processes of secondary metabolism. Mycotoxins are a type of secondary metabolite, and as such are not normally required for normal growth and reproduction. In fact, one particular mycotoxin, ergot alkyloid, may have been the cause of the Salem Witch Trials. Consumption of ergot alkyloid can result in hallucinations, convulsions, and gangrene of the extremities. Other mycotoxins are potent carcinogens, while others are immunosuppressive. However, other secondary metabolites are useful. Many antibiotic drugs including penicillin and cyclosporin are secondary metabolites. Likewise, many cholesterol lowering drugs are based on the “statin” class of secondary metabolites.

Fungi have been important in agriculture for centuries as both commodities and crop pests. Much of our understanding of fungal biology stems from research on plant pathogenic fungi. Since the Fall, many plant-fungal interactions have deteriorated into parasitic and/or pathogenic relationships: biotrophic, hemibiotrophic, and necrotrophic interactions. These interactions result in famine and potential contamination of crops with toxins harmful to humans and animals. Also of concern is the expansion of medically relevant fungi. Fungal pathogens are difficult to treat in humans and animals due to the similar biochemistry of fungal and animal systems. Recent research demonstrates a possible mechanism for the rise of animal pathogenesis in fungi: co-opting of environmentally relevant survival mechanisms for survival in the host environment. More research is needed to elucidate the means by which these originally “very good” microorganisms devolved into the destructive pests and pathogens they have become.

I love the way fungi cause diseases in animals and human, but are pests of plants.

Bob (former plant pathologist)

Date: 2008/01/16 06:09:53, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Well.  That worked well, didn't it?

Bob

Date: 2008/01/16 12:49:08, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Will Teh Fall be preceded by a group of lions?

Bob

Date: 2008/01/16 14:25:55, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Except with more kids viewing it.

I mean greater than 3.

Bob

Date: 2008/01/17 00:54:40, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Errm, did anyone realise that they had a nationwide tour in Nov/Dec last year?

Anyone?

Date: 2008/01/18 08:25:14, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
New Book: Your Inner Fish, evolutionary origin of hiccups, etc.

I read that as "evolutionary origin of chips, etc."  The etc. presumably including the newspaper wrapping.

Bob

Date: 2008/01/18 08:27:14, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
I wish the cold around where I live would lose some of it's energy... :p

Ha!  That'll only happen when Hell freezes over.

Date: 2008/01/18 09:19:14, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
maybe a 14th century French Lit Professor?

What happened to the other 13?

Bob

Date: 2008/01/18 11:24:08, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Now you know that's wrong, don't you J-Dog?  It should be

Quote
Ach du Lieber!

Ve vill haff to hurt you, ja? Ist zat vat you vant?

You English - always so weak... Ve must be strong, und Ve do not likes ze questions, ja?

Got Mit Uns und Heil!

Date: 2008/01/19 08:41:08, Link
Author: Bob O'H
There certainly has been a Marxist strand in evolutionary biologists.  Haldane and Maynard Smith in the UK come to mind.  And Lewontin and co. in the US.

For a really good read about how evolutionary biology and sociobiology developed, try Ullica Segerstråle's Defenders of the Truth, where the Marxist influence is one of the sub-plots.

Bob (not a Marxist.  At least not that Marx)

Date: 2008/01/19 08:50:05, Link
Author: Bob O'H
How/when are html numbers assigned to the comments (I mean in things like #comment-164354)?  Are they assigned when the post it appears, or when it is submitted?  

They appear to be numbered consecutively, so it should be possible to count the gaps over the whole site, with a bit of scripting.  Of course, it wouldn't tell us where the comments had been removed from, but would tell us what proportion had been removed.

Does anyone out there fancy writing a quick script to do it?  I'd have to learn PERL first.

Bob

Date: 2008/01/20 01:12:46, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Whilst you've all been contemplating whether out esteemed moderator is the guy on the far right of the photo, the UDites have been producing Tard,

Firstly Ms. O'Leary confuses classification with real life:
Quote
Darwin’s tree of life vs. real life: The curious case of the beefalo
O'Leary

Apparently Darwin was wrong because cows and buffalo were separated into separate genera.  Err, before Darwin even went on the Beagle.

And DLH gives us this package:
Quote
Are ATP energy cycles essential for life?
DLH

Including these bold statements:

Quote
1) ATP energy cycles are essential to self reproducing biochemical life.

2) ATP energy cycles require biochemical gradients and membranes.

3) Mutations in ATP energy cycle or related membrane formation genes degrade or destroy ATP energy cycle function, causing disorder or death.

Predictions:

4) Unknown biological systems will depend on ATP formation and supply for function.

Inferences

5) An ATP energy cycle is essential for self reproducing life and must exist before natural selection can occur.

6) ATP synthase is irreducibly complex and cannot be formed from abiotic systems by Neo-Darwinian mechanisms.

Woo-hooo!  He predicts that there are some biological functions that we don't know about that require energy!  I hope Dr. Dr. D. takes note and adds it to his predictions.

Bob
EDIT: Extra slash, just because I want to.

Date: 2008/01/20 02:07:59, Link
Author: Bob O'H
In 1123 the Roman Catholic Church in fact did endorse the Knights Order of the Shoggoth.

Date: 2008/01/20 08:10:41, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
C'mon, dudes and dudettes! Let's see your countenances and appurtenances! Your trappings, appendages, accoutrements, equipment, paraphernalia, impedimenta, bits and pieces, and things! Think of the thrill it was to finally see an image of DaveTard.

Grr.  You've forced me to put up the photo of me on Birdshit Island.  I was there trying to catch beetles.

Bob

Date: 2008/01/20 11:17:19, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Damn - that  cool!  I will treasure it always, even tho that extremely lifelike Denyse makes me throw up a little in my throat.

Just think of it as one of Davy's little Inuit.

Bob

Date: 2008/01/20 12:50:25, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
My definition of "design" is probably not the same definition that either Dembski or Mike Gene uses.  I consider the Mandelbrot Set to be not only a design, but a real world example of "design".

Yes, but what is your definition?

Date: 2008/01/21 00:53:20, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
5. No account of human evolution will show a long slow emergence from unconsciousness to semi-consciousness to consciousness,

Denyse has obviously never been hung over.

Bob

Date: 2008/01/21 01:10:31, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Mastodons have been extinct in North America for over 10,000 years. Were they wiped out by the fluud?

I guess you've already read Grrlscientist's piece about the creationist museum selling off its (beetle-sized) mastadon skull, but for those who haven't, here's the last line:
Quote
But how's this for irony: even though the museum says the everything was created 10,000 years ago, the Mastodon skull is described as being 40,000 years old by the Heritage Auction Galleries. Hrm.


Bob
P.S. will some more of those photos be appearing on Grrlscientist's blog in the future?  Please?  I think I recognise the gull - it's the top half of my laptop's wallpaper.  Or is it the bottom half?

Date: 2008/01/21 12:20:15, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Steve - I think you should delete your post, in a fit of irony.

And then ban Richard.  And then Richard Simmons.

Date: 2008/01/21 12:41:05, Link
Author: Bob O'H
The PaV and jerry show is proof that you don't need scriptwriters for good entertainment:
Quote


188

PaV

01/21/2008

12:46 pm

jerry, (186)

But it is also a constant source of bad reasoning and science by well intentioned commenters.

Who exactly is the judge of whether something is ‘good’ sicence or ‘bad’ science? I’m curious.

Let me state, unequivocally, that the change in beak size of Darwin’s finches has absolutley nothing to do with the modern synthesis, nothing to do with drifting gene pools, nothing to do with ‘changing gene frequencies’, and everything to do with environmental triggers.

OTOH, Jerry, I think you buy the microevolution/modern synthesis/variation+NS story “hook, line and sinker.’ One of us is very right; one of us is very wrong. Now, do you want to dogmatically state, ahead of time, that you’re correct and that I’m wrong? Frankly, UD seems like an unlikely place for someone who wants to assert, unequivocally, that they know the modern synthesis to be true, and, consequently, this must be incorporated into the ID position.

Someone alert the networks!

Bob

Date: 2008/01/22 08:14:01, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Hmm.

PaV suggests that the change in beak size in Darwin's finches might be due to a Lamarckian response to the shift in diet in 2004.  Three facts are worth considering:

1. The Grants only measured adult birds
2. There was no breeding in 2003 or 2004
3. Beaks size is stable in adult birds

From this I predict

4. I'm liable to get banned from UD when I point this out

Bob
P.S. buy my book.

Date: 2008/01/22 11:11:04, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Alan Fox @ Jan. 21 2008,14:27)
Never mind. googled.

That was an interesting journey. Besson is somewhat under-rated.Anyone else enjoy The Big Blue?

If it's the film I think it is, I saw it on a small crappy TV, so it just came over as being rather boring.  I guess I should get the DVD and borrow a projector from work.

Bob
P.S. your new avatar makes me think you might be interested in a few more cats.

Date: 2008/01/23 00:56:47, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote

http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....-165255
4

Mapou

01/22/2008

4:38 pm

Denyse, the abuse, in my opinion, is a psychological phenomenon born out of fear. It’s the result of a siege mentality reminiscent of medieval times. The inhabitants of a walled city under attack would use catapults to hurl putrefied animal corpses and fecal matter at the enemy camp. It was a sign of desperation with little military consequence if any. In fact, it would strengthen the attackers’ resolve and cause them to redouble their efforts.

Eh?  I always thought it was the people on the outside chucking the stuff in.

Does that mean we're winning?

Bob

Date: 2008/01/23 01:13:11, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
We were so poor we could only afford the first two terms of a Taylor series.

Ah, you certainly wasn't one of those squares, then.

Bob

Date: 2008/01/23 05:47:00, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Bob O'H clearly doesn't know anything about finches.

I do.  I just don't know anything about baseball.

Well, except who's on first, obviously.

Bob

Date: 2008/01/23 11:38:35, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Amadan - that's not evolution, it's gravity that causes the hair to descend.

And I'll, um, tenth or eleventh the "Happy Birthday Wes!".  I hope the creationist crowd keeps quiet for today, and give you some peace.

Bob

Date: 2008/01/24 01:33:31, Link
Author: Bob O'H
My morning trawl through UD:

1. PaV admits he's wrong about Darwin's Finches.  But Grant and Grant were still mis-interpreting the data.  Could it be that PaV is right this time?  The answer's come up, right after the break.

2. jstanley01 is stirring the pot

     
Quote
12

jstanley01

01/23/2008

6:12 pm

Hmm. Finch… Finch… Finch… Any relation to the late Peter (I’m mad as h*ll and not going to take it anymore) Finch???

How long before he becomes jstanley02?

3. bFast says more than he intends:
     
Quote
It is clear to me that the scientists, as usual, are clearer thinkers than the guys that report on them.


4. And the debate hots up in the comments section of DO'L's DoL post:
     
Quote




chirrp






Bob

Date: 2008/01/24 03:13:36, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Enter Hawking and black holes.  Suddenly it all dropped out.

Surely not if it entered a black hole.

:-)

Bob

Date: 2008/01/24 05:56:54, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Egads. I followed steve_h's link.  Did DO'L really write this with a straight face:
Quote

Biology's Big Bangs
Apparently, it’s not just physics that starts things off with a bang. Life forms have done that too, and with equal drama.
...

Date: 2008/01/24 11:13:39, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I've got a cat sat on me, otherwise I would dig out Jon Ronson's book "The Men Who Stared at Goats".  I think he wrote about those remote sensing operations.  He's British, so it wasn't his tax dollars.  

You should also read his other book, "Them".  It's about people who believe that there is an international conspiracy of silence and control of the masses.  What this has to do with UD you can decide.

Bob

Date: 2008/01/25 00:52:52, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Richardthughes @ Jan. 24 2008,22:41)
http://www.ideacenter.org/contentmgr/showdetails.php/id/1454

She as emails. Ask her about ID research!

Or ask her why Young Cosmos isn't in their long list of links.

Bob

Date: 2008/01/26 01:27:40, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Frost122557874425three85
Quote


5

Frost122585

01/25/2008

7:43 pm

Scott the truth is - she is just part or the Stalinist atheist left. If you believe in anything higher than the government or the corrupt teacher’s union you are to be eliminated. This is the scary reality of today’s political climate and landscape- but it is not new. God is always hated by humans in power- absolute power corrupts- tenure is one of those absolute powers and unions think they too are due their invincibility.

The mainstream media right now is declaring a war on Mitt Romney because he is a man of faith. (they hate Mormons) and of course until they back Hillary Clinton all the way they will be supporting John McCain- who by the way fought tooth and nail to pass his brain child Mccain-feingold law which is completely unconstitutional and makes it illegal to air a commercial criticizing a political figure on TV 2 weeks before an election.

Maybe if Fox and MSLSD and the ©linton (n)ews (n)etwork get their way and knock off the good man of faith - we can make ID illegal! Yahooo! And Eugene Scott can become the first director of mind control and propaganda for Washington.

A McCain and or Clinton win is a loss for ID- have no doubt about this. I’m sorry to bring the election so directly into this but the connection between expelled (which gets no media coverage) and ID which gets only negative and false coverage- is the same as the effort to kill Romney in Florida. The forces at work here in my view are one and the same and the spiritual- political battle is inextricable.

Clinton, Scott and McCain represent everything that is wrong with the country right now-

I hope that we can save intellectual freedom from a dominating collusive media-

One more thing- it is said that fox news is republican and conservative- Don’t believe this for a second! Rupert Murdock owns Fox News and has endorsed Hillary Clinton. Don’t be fooled by the ignorant and biased.

I think he might be a tad biased.

Bob

Date: 2008/01/26 12:35:59, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (blipey @ Jan. 26 2008,10:11)
Ftk:

you're a seven foot kick boxer?  Have we finally found your area of expertise?

She has to use the eighth to stand on.

No wonder PZ likes her blog so much.

Bob

Date: 2008/01/27 01:47:11, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Bonus questions: Who is Peter Singer, and why are we supposed to care?

He's a philosopher who's interested in animal rights (amongst other things).  According to Sal, he advocated sexual relationships between humans and animals.  Wikipedia has a slightly different version.

Quote
So far as I know, he's totally irrelevant to everything.

Sorry, who do you mean here, Singer or Sal?

Quote
Also, am I counting wrong or does Sal have three undergraduate degrees for some reason? Why do so many creationists have so many degrees?

I've no IDEA.

Bob

Date: 2008/01/27 01:56:26, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
My mental defect is I am lopsided towards the analytical.  I can solve puzzles quickly.  I tend to be able to debug software systems based on the symptoms alone.  I see the holistic picture.  I understand it.  This ability is at the expense of bypassing irrelevant details, like proper semantics.

Methinks a bit more attention to relevant details might come in handy.  Things like being able to work out when something is accelerating.

Bob

Date: 2008/01/27 02:34:18, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I just wandered over to see what Sal was doing, and noticed the recent comments:
Quote
#
Recent Comments

   * John A. Davison on My view of the End Times
   * John A. Davison on Nomogenesis by Leo Berg
   * John A. Davison on Rachmaninoff plays Chopin Nocturne Op. 9 No. 2
   * scordova on Nomogenesis by Leo Berg
   * John A. Davison on Rachmaninoff plays Chopin Nocturne Op. 9 No. 2
   * John A. Davison on Nomogenesis by Leo Berg
   * John A. Davison on I have a new boss! Dr. Caroline Crocker!
   * John A. Davison on I have a new boss! Dr. Caroline Crocker!
   * John A. Davison on Homosexuality may be partially inherited, YECs shoot themselves in the foot again
   * scordova on The home I was raised in....

I'll get the popcorn.

I love it so!

Bob

Date: 2008/01/27 11:25:48, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Is BA77 into triple figures then?

Date: 2008/01/27 12:49:44, Link
Author: Bob O'H
A soulmate for us all.  Much piss-taking of people who comment on the BBC.

Bob

Date: 2008/01/28 00:57:47, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Ooh, Denyse has been reading a science book.  Of course, she somehow manages to interpret    
Quote
Is extinction through bad luck a challenge to Darwin’s natural selection? No. Natural selection remains the only viable, naturalistic explanation we have for sophisticated adaptations like eyes and wings. We would not be here without natural selection.

as  
Quote
Raup was taking a big risk by even suggesting that Darwinism might not be true

Denyse, dear - take some lessons from Sal in quote-mining.  Cover your tracks, so we have to go to the original source to see that you're talking bollocks.

EDIT: sorry.  Of course, the "O'Leary" at the top gives it away anyway.  My bad.

Bob

Date: 2008/01/28 01:02:25, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Let me give you a hint. Some finches like to catch flies.

I'm mentally scaling up finches by the same amount as the fly to baseball scaling.  All of a sudden, I don't want to visit the Galapagos.

Bob

Date: 2008/01/28 13:15:29, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (carlsonjok @ Jan. 28 2008,12:42)
Quote (Richardthughes @ Jan. 28 2008,12:31)
True story. I once brought half a cup of coffee back up through my nose and elected to catch it back in the original cup.

here's the cool part: It was regular coffee originally, but cappuccino at the "second coming".

Is this:

A) Design
B) A Miracle
C) Transmogrification
D) Unaccounted for by darwinism
E) Sick

F) British Haute Cuisine.

Can't be.  It was only cycled through the system once.

Bob

Date: 2008/01/29 00:14:33, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Ha ha ha!  Denyse is arguing for Intelligent Falling:
http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....diction
Quote
Strictly speaking, nothing. By definition, it is the one form of evolution that banished purpose (teleology) from nature. That was supposed to be its big advantage, right? So by definition, it makes no predictions. Not that you’d know, from Darwinist huffing.

Time to get back to the tard mine.  :-)

Bob

Date: 2008/01/29 00:50:52, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Annyday @ Jan. 28 2008,15:45)
If someone can translate Paul Nelson's latest into English, I'd appreciate it. Assuming that such is even possible.

The version I've got is: One of the many analytical tools in molecular evolution is contentious and really hard to use, and this makes Paul Nelson angry. Am I right, or did I miss something?

Also: So what? Lots of scientific fields are annoying to be in. Possibly all of them. If the data is new, it's going to give you headaches. If it made complete sense, it would not be research, it would be undergraduate textbook material.

You've pretty much got it.  It seems to be a set-up for part II, rather than anything drastic on its own.

The finding that alignments can be wrong, and this screws things up, isn't a great surprise to me, and probably not to anyone else who has seriously thought about the problem.  But it's nice to see it being demonstrated clearly, and perhaps it'll stimulate some ... wait for it ... research.

Yes, there could be a young computer scientist reading UD who thinks that adding uncertainty in alignments in phylogenetics is a problem that they could crack, and advance science as we know it.

Bob

Date: 2008/01/29 13:30:07, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
... ERV's inspired detective work and pit-bull tenacity ...

What?  You mean she rolls over after 5 minutes wanting her tummy scratched?

Lou FCD - Your reading for today.

Bob

Date: 2008/01/31 13:32:55, Link
Author: Bob O'H
It's a good job for you that DaveTard isn't a member of the Disco Institute, otherwise you would have Casey Luskin chasing you for copyright violation.

You're quaking in you boots now, aren't you?

Bob

Date: 2008/02/01 00:56:08, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Ouch.  On the nuclear pores thread, the first three comments:

Quote


1

DLH

01/31/2008

10:38 am

Excellent find.

ID hypothesis on the same data:

1) Nuclear pores are essential to DNA function and duplication.

2) DNA is essential to express the proteins in nuclear pores and the mechanism to assemble them.

3) Nuclear pores are irreducibly complex.

2

hrun0815

01/31/2008

12:05 pm

DLH, how are nuclear pores essential to DNA function and duplication if there are countless organisms that get by without a nucleus in the first place?

3

DLH

01/31/2008

12:54 pm

hrun0815
Good observation. That demonstrates that an ID hypothesis can be tested and thus be part of the scientific process. ...

Date: 2008/02/01 01:16:18, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
except possibly by brute-force comparison to known sequences (and wouldn't that be a bitch)

That's why proper scientists BLAST them.

Bob

Date: 2008/02/01 12:13:36, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Bugger

Bugger

Bugger

Bum

I've only just got it (I'll write it down later).  Simmons is an NCSE sock-puppet, isn't he?

Date: 2008/02/02 02:16:59, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Our friends at UD have noticed that the challenge has been altered:
http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....allenge

They've immediately cracked open the tard and declared themselves victorious.  kairosfocus has even decided to score his own cricket match:
Quote
6

kairosfocus

02/02/2008

1:16 am

PPS: I see DLH’s:

   a single mutation (SNP) can cause a fatal difference. So presumably, a single mutation can change common virus’ into deadly air born pandemics. Determining if that was natural or human caused would require forensics examination of the spread to determine the source etc.

In short, by widening the context we see a wider configuration that now allows us to infer to agency, thence perhaps isolation of which agent has motive- means- opportunity. This upgrades the score — the no-ball was batted for six, so it is 12 runs off one ball in the over, with five more to go.

I think Evo Mat team Captain Dawkins is getting worried about this bowler!

My (ID) prediction is that in reality Patrick was bowled off the final delivery of the over, after failing to pick the wrong'un.

Bob

Date: 2008/02/02 02:57:04, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
The proof is that Under Pressure goes "Dum-Dum-da-da-Dum-Dum"

Blipey, you've missed a Dum out.

Proof, with added dress (and me).

Bob

Date: 2008/02/02 11:35:47, Link
Author: Bob O'H
... and FtK is not happy:
Quote


6

FtK

02/01/2008

8:39 am

Oh, good grief…

Date: 2008/02/02 11:44:00, Link
Author: Bob O'H
My musings.  Whilst you're doing that, I'm enjoying watching getting the Welsh getting hammered.

Bob
ETA: OK, England getting hammered.  *whimper*

Date: 2008/02/03 01:45:54, Link
Author: Bob O'H
This ID challenge is great.  Whether deliberate or not, Musgrave has set up a huge trap, and they're all walking straight into it, claiming the reason you can't see the ball is because they've hit it over the pavilion.  And not given a dolly to short fine leg.

Even DaveScot is taking part:  
Quote
Imagine asking a criminal investigator to determine whether someone who died in a fall from a tall building was accident or homicide by looking at nothing but the hat the person was wearing when he fell. This is what Ian is asking us to do.

I think that's a pretty good description of what the Explanatory Filter tries to do.

Bob

Date: 2008/02/03 02:10:11, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
But I have had misgivings.  If a conspiracy, who did it?

I think there are three main suspects - the father, the son, an the holy ghost.

Bob

Date: 2008/02/03 07:20:59, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Oh, this is hilarious (read: Dave, you need to leap into action to stop it!).  The
DO personal beliefs change behavior thread descended into a theological.
Quote
4

larrynormanfan

02/02/2008

10:58 pm

I wonder if the same results would have occurred if the subjects had been given a Christian treatise against free will (such as Martin Luther’s The Bondage of the Will).

5

Mapou

02/02/2008

11:45 pm

larrynormanfan wrote: I wonder if the same results would have occurred if the subjects had been given a Christian treatise against free will (such as Martin Luther’s The Bondage of the Will).

I take this as a not so subtle attack against Christianity. You are apparently aiming to discredit the Christian faith by pointing out its inconsistencies and conflicts. But so what if Christianity is inconsistent and filled with conflicts? Do you have something else in mind for Christians to fall back on? Is science (the atheistic kind) somehow free from inconsistencies and conflicts?

Christians worship Jesus Christ and his Father. That’s it. We honor and admire but we don’t worship human beings (Martin Luther included) regardless of their apparent greatness. At any rate, debates and arguments on free will are notoriously fuzzy. It is highly likely that you are misinterpreting Luther’s original intent.

6

larrynormanfan

02/02/2008

11:55 pm

Mapou, I’m a Christian, so no, it’s not an attack against Christianity. It’s an attack against an idiotic study that proves nothing and makes unwarranted assumptions. And as it happens, I agree with Luther on the whole. I read The Bondage of the Will over twenty years ago and have never forgotten it.


...


8

Mapou

02/03/2008

12:06 am

larrynormanfan wrote: Mapou, I’m a Christian, so no, it’s not an attack against Christianity.

My apologies.

9

Gerry Rzeppa

02/03/2008

12:46 am

“Christians worship Jesus Christ and his Father. That’s it.” - Mapou

“…And I believe in the Holy Ghost, the Lord and Giver of Life; who proceeds from the Father and the Son; who with the Father and the Son together is worshipped and glorified; who spoke by the prophets.” - Nicene Creed

10

Mapou

02/03/2008

3:17 am

Gerry, thanks for that quote. Even though I’m Christian, I don’t have much knowledge or understanding about the nature and function of the Holy Spirit. I just assume it to be a part of the Godhead. There is no doubt in my mind, however, that the Father and the Son are like the right and left hemispheres of the God’s brain respectively. I find it easier to identify with this metaphor.


What's the going rate for apostasy these days?

Date: 2008/02/03 11:45:48, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I think Zachriel has Post of the Week for this week sewn up, then.

I'll only add that Hrun is the name of the barbarian in The Colour of Magic.  This is the English version of the Pratchett book some of you may have read that was translated as The Color of Magic.

Bob

Date: 2008/02/04 02:57:56, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Don't be mad at Bob.  Now he has to deal with the stubble-burn on his ass.

Please.  That's one image I didn't
want associated with me.

Anon.

Date: 2008/02/04 13:10:32, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
He's been hiding in deepest rural England, playing cricket and using the name Ian Botham.

I wonder why he's never mentioned it?

Well, would you want to admit you had played for Scunthorpe?

Bob

Date: 2008/02/04 14:24:49, Link
Author: Bob O'H
From Dave Munger's post at bpr3:
Quote
I should point out that Evolution News & Views has not registered with ResearchBlogging.org and has made a copy of the icon and placed it on its own server. Since we own the copyright on the icon itself, in principle we have the authority to ask them to stop using the icon because we only give permission to use the icon to blogs following our guidelines.

Do I detect the merest trace of irony here?

Bob

Date: 2008/02/05 11:48:57, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Apparently Expelled will be renamed Crossroads, and will be about the relationship between science and faith:

http://www.uncommondescent.com/the-des....me-time
Quote
   DESIGN OF LIFE: You interviewed 150 scientists for your film. I wonder if that’s a record. I gather an effort has been made to discredit the film on the grounds that the anti-ID folk were misrepresented, basically that you tricked them into taking part.

   MATHIS: … But they’ve become very used to only one side. Apparently they didn’t understand that we were really going to do just what we said we were going to do.  


Bob

Date: 2008/02/05 13:00:35, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Luskin explains all.  

Quote
(2) On Feb. 4, I became aware of the fact that ResearchBlogging.org requested registration to use their graphic,
...
At the time that I posted this post, I was not aware that the graphic I had used was owned by ResearchBlogging.org. ResearchBlogging.org did not request that I remove their graphic, and in fact their rules are ambiguous, and they do not say that the graphic I used cannot be used while one is seeking an application with Researchblogging.org. (emphases mine)

Right, so he was aware that one should be registered to use the icon, but wasn't sure whether one could use the icon if one was not registered.  Got it.

Bob

Date: 2008/02/05 14:03:17, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (PsychoAtheist @ Feb. 04 2008,15:10)
Oh, and I lived in Scunthorpe for 3 years!

You poor dear.  I was relatively lucky - I was brought up in Bottesford.

Bob

Date: 2008/02/07 01:37:49, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I think we should find someone in the House of Lords who would set up a blog where they review this stuff and rip it to shreds.  Then it would be peer reviewed.

Bob

Date: 2008/02/08 11:27:11, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Tracy P. Hamilton @ Feb. 08 2008,08:05)
Quote (olegt @ Feb. 08 2008,06:19)
As always happens in discussions of academic freedom at UD, Rick Sternberg is paraded as an ID martyr.  Daniel King asks:
 
Quote
Does anyone know what Sternberg is doing now?

Richard von Sternberg has served out his term (5-Jan-04 to 4-Jan-07) as a Research Associate at the Smithsonian and is now serving another term (15-Nov-06 to 14-Nov-09) as a Research Collaborator.  Neither is a paid position, so he has never been a Smithsonian employee.
STernberg's CV at his web site.
Smithsonian Research Associates in 2004
Smithsonian Research Associates in 2005
Smithsonian Research Associates in 2007

How does he support himself?  Repairing refrigerators?

He has a "proper job" at the  NCBI.  Although he's curiously absent from their pages.

The Smithsonian thing is just a hobby.  Quite frankly, I think he should have been kicked out because of the way he treated the samples, never mind anything else.

Bob

Date: 2008/02/08 12:00:56, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (PTET @ Feb. 08 2008,04:35)
Quote
Jerry
02/08/2008
5:02 am

...If the genomes of various species of a genera or family (such as cichlids, birds, various types of mammals) get sequenced and the gene pools of these species show only a reduction in the gene pools of the species from the estimated gene pools of the original ancestors, such research would obviate the creativity of the modern theory of evolution. If it shows that the gene pools of all the species in these families do not exhibit any creative elements but only reductions in the gene pool from some prior larger set, then this is ID supportive research. Such research is going on in the biology labs today all over the planet and like Lenski, the researchers would probably be upset to know that they are doing pro ID research...

Any biologists out there who can help on this one?

Has (by Jerry's argument) ID already been refuted by Lenski?

I thought cichlids were the classic example, but that's not a story I've followed closely.

The problem is that we don't have direct access to the ancestral gene pools, so we have to infer their...

Bugger, yes we do.  Yellow rust in Oz was introduced as a single clone by a French farmer.  They even identified the farmer, but (quite rightly) won't say who he is, because it was a total accident.

Bob

Date: 2008/02/08 13:22:36, Link
Author: Bob O'H
OK, which one of you is Joseph?
Quote
11

Joseph

02/08/2008

1:32 pm

Unless Dr Gonzalez really likes to teach then perhaps the Discovery Institute could hire him to start an astrobiology project.

The Cosmologic Institute

All that tard in the past must have been a cover.

Bob

Date: 2008/02/09 00:19:47, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
It's merely the incompetent mistake of an FTL editor ...

FTL editor?  Anyone working that quickly is bound to make mistakes.

Bob
(I think you meant FTE, but who am I to miss out on the opportunity for pedantry and nitpicking?)

Date: 2008/02/09 14:13:09, Link
Author: Bob O'H
OK, LISTEN UP, I'M TALKING.  I WANT YOU TO ...

Bum, I just can't keep that up*

Whilst you've all been watching Dave "oats eater" Springer**, idnet.com.au has been a naughty boy.  I have explained it all to the readers of my blog, so go there and send my hits through the roof.  Please.  Pretty please.

I think idnet.com.au was given the task of having the meltdown next week, and is already preparing the ground.

Bob
* reference to PTET & Louis' current discussion an added bonus.
** seriously, how can anyone with a middle name that links them to a nation so bad the inhabitants preferred the Canadian climate go on about Obama's middle name?

Date: 2008/02/10 00:52:29, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Hermagoras @ Feb. 09 2008,15:23)
Quote (Richardthughes @ Feb. 09 2008,15:05)
Idnet.com.au replies to a post that isn't there?

http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelli....-170729

 
Quote
3

idnet.com.au

02/09/2008

3:35 pm
Thanks Bob O’H

Bob had earlier pointed to the copyright violation of the post.  The new version of the post is (a) shorter, and (b) without Bob's gentle advice.

And now makes even less sense:
Quote
Our intuitive preconceptions about can mislead us.

Come on, Noel, at least put some thought into your quote-mining.

Ah well, as he didn't answer my question about copyright, I'll have to see if NPG (Nature Publishing Group) will answer it...

Bob

Date: 2008/02/10 01:22:32, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Hermagoras - are you aware that this means you'll have to write posts on your blog?

Are you aware that you still have a blog?

Mister DNA - how about setting up a thread here to discuss your latest plans?

Arab Hobo

Date: 2008/02/10 01:51:53, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Nope, cabbie is short for cabman.  There are a lot of them in Huntingdonshire*.  The caricature is that they are opinionated (well, what else is there to do in a taxi but talk and drive?), and not necessarily tolerant of others in society.

Bob
* thrown in because somebody here will understand it.

Date: 2008/02/10 11:57:40, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Wesley R. Elsberry @ Feb. 10 2008,10:56)
Fascination with Nobel prizes is not new for antievolutionists.

Alas access is denied, at least for this pro-evolutionist.

Not that I'm at all interested in Nobels anyway.  Just give me an FRS and I'll be happy.

Bob

Date: 2008/02/10 13:12:36, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Ah, thanks - a nice Sunday evening read.  I'm just shocked, shocked I tell you, that the DI would quote-mine and lie.

Bob

Date: 2008/02/11 00:17:49, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Whoa! Finland scores top marks in edmacation? But Dembski himself said in 2006:

Oh, stop gloating.  :-)

Bob

Date: 2008/02/11 10:37:35, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Sage is working fine for me.

Sort-of off topic, but I think Wes might be needing some moral support soon.

Bob

Date: 2008/02/11 10:42:29, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Paul - didn't you know that Desmond is Tutu's middle name.  His first name is Archbishop.

And, yes, as you ask.  King is related to the swallow.

Bob

Date: 2008/02/11 13:02:00, Link
Author: Bob O'H
What is the Spanish for "cat"?

Le chat needs to know.

Bob

Date: 2008/02/11 14:30:08, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (sparc @ Feb. 11 2008,14:04)
I was surprised that DO'L at UD missed it but luckily, one can always count on Sal Cordova. He celebrated the notorius Warda and Han paper on February 8th:  
Quote
Creationist paper passes peer-review, Darwinist Endosymbiotic theory trashed
Obviously this is not enough, later he writes:  
Quote
I foresaw this event.

Yeah, well, he had probably read the originals.

Bob

Date: 2008/02/12 00:25:39, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (J-Dog @ Feb. 11 2008,13:34)
Quote (Bob O'H @ Feb. 11 2008,13:02)
What is the Spanish for "cat"?

Le chat needs to know.

Bob

El Gato!

Ah, thanks.  But the cat wasn't happy when I told him that (where did he learn his French?).  Now I just have to get the cream out, and he scampers off to hide.

Bob

Date: 2008/02/12 10:44:26, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Reciprocating Bill @ Feb. 12 2008,09:04)
Quote (olegt @ Feb. 12 2008,09:47)
Not content with being a mere Isaac Newton of information theory, Bill Dembski photoshops himself onto the picture of the 1927 Solvay Congress alongside Einstein, Bohr, Planck and the like.  No farting noises this time.


The wish-fulfillment in this pic is both touching and pathetic. Mostly pathetic.

Yes, it's sad that people like Einstein and Bohr had to manipulate a photo so they could appear alongside such scientific greats.

Incidentally, Bohr had such difficulty getting funding, he frequently had to turn to beer.

Bob

Date: 2008/02/12 12:23:34, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
His griping about a "glass ceiling" is patently ridiculous.

Hey!  Stop calling my friend Davey's patents ridiculous.

Oooh, I'll have you.  I'm warning you, if you do that again I'll report you to Matron.  Then you'll be sorry.

Date: 2008/02/13 00:55:38, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Oh, just found this new tard
Quote


14

peter borger

02/12/2008

10:36 am

Non Mendelian inheritance is often observed. It is caused by Variation inducing genetic elements VIGES, previously known as ERVs, LINEs, SINEs, ALUs, etc.

VIGES integrate into certain areas of non-coding parts of genetic instructions and modify protein expression patterns and other genetic output. They have an ability to excise an reintegrate, duplicate or diminish, and this explains the non-mendelian fashion of inheritance.

I have completed a MS (200 pages) containing the complete overturn of the main Darwinian hypotheses and GUToB, a set of testable hypotheses that explains what falsifies Darwinism.

Is there an interested publisher around?

I hope he sticks around, it could be fun.

Bob

Date: 2008/02/13 01:36:58, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Political labels are a bunch of crap, though, I agree.

Yeah.  In Denmark the main centre-right party is The Left (Venstre).  The main centrist party is The Radical Left, and I've never been able to work out what the Social Democrats are.

They also have not only a Green party, but also a Red-Green party.  I think this equates to a mucky brown colour.

Bob

Date: 2008/02/13 09:11:37, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Aaron - that's like boasting that you've been sworn at by Michael Winner.  It would be a greater wonder if it hadn't happened.

Bob
P.S. that should really be BBDT.  Skim through this thread to see why.  Or just watch for a bit.  :-)

Date: 2008/02/13 13:16:47, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Mr_Christopher @ Feb. 13 2008,12:10)
Quote
No one should pass judgement on Denyse until they, at least, know her middle name.

Denyse “Hussein” O’Leary?


THAT was funny!

Quite.  Sorry, JohnW, but sparc is getting my PotW vote this time.

Bob

Date: 2008/02/13 13:42:07, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I was a bit surprised that PZed wasn't in earlier, but perhaps he hadn't seen it.

I guess our next targets should be Orac and Ben Goldacre.  I emailed Ben a couple of weeks ago about it, and I've posted at the Bad Science forum, so if nothing happens soon I might have to up the pressure.  :-)

Bob

Date: 2008/02/14 12:09:59, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Where does the Morphodyke fit on the tree?

Bob

Date: 2008/02/14 13:05:55, Link
Author: Bob O'H
The descent has gone so far I hope it's a radio telescope.

Bob

Date: 2008/02/14 14:25:36, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Ooh, don't get me started about laws...

Philosophers have decided that laws describe general regularities that always hold.  But they have also described ceteris paribus laws, which are laws that hold except when they don't.

I think "law" is a throw-back to a more naïve age, before we realised that physicists were conning us with their claims that they couldn't be wrong.

Oh, hi, Dr. Heddle.  Didn't see you lurking there.

Bob

Date: 2008/02/17 11:28:26, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Dammit, RB, you know they'kk just quote-mine instead.  e.g.
Quote
Machines are stable and accurate because they are designed and built to be so.

Look!  Look!  He wrote "designed"!  He must be a closet supporter of ID, who's too scared to come out.

Personally, I rather like this one:
Quote
A society that permits biology to become an engineering discipline...is a danger to itself.


Bob

Date: 2008/02/17 11:48:06, Link
Author: Bob O'H
The Dembski predictions thread is still going strong, with plenty of tard for everyone.  The latest is gpuccio trying to decide if bacteria are intelligent:
Quote
Are bacteria intelligent? I don’t know. But I know for sure that they behave very intelligently, as do ants, bees, birds, and so on. Whence does that intelligence come?


BTW, is Joseph at UD Joe G?  I lose track sometimes.  

Bob

Date: 2008/02/17 12:42:24, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Thanks.  It's always nice to know who I'm being gratuitously insulted by.

Bob

Date: 2008/02/18 00:44:28, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Thank you (and thank you for the present, too!).

I'll only celebrate over at UD if Dave puts up a thread like this.  I'm sure the likes of Mapou and Joseph will be keen to pass on their fondest greetings.  I'll just make sure they have the first slice of any cake they give me.

Bob

Date: 2008/02/18 03:33:56, Link
Author: Bob O'H
It's been a good day for me so far.  Not least because I found a blog article for my friend Dave:
Things You Can Learn From Cheetos

Bob

Date: 2008/02/18 12:47:55, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Thank you, thank you kindly, one and all.  As well as tack, kiitos and merci.

It's rather disturbing to discover hold old some of you are (especially RB.  For the rest of you, I'm a minor medical miracle because of my 32 year gestation).

In case you're worrying, I'm celebrating in the only way possible



Skål!

Bob
P.S. You're not a day late, Kristine.

Date: 2008/02/19 13:22:52, Link
Author: Bob O'H
No, no, Tracy, it's only the equivalent of Noah's Ark.  It's probably Utnapishtim's Ark.

Anyway, the geggies in the Burgess Shales were all smaller, so it would be easier to fit them all in.  No doubt the raven is metaphorical.

Bob

Date: 2008/02/19 13:30:07, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Without mentioning any names, I'll just comment that I'm amused that there's an obvious sockpuppet at UD, and they haven't noticed yet.

Well, OK, there's actually several sockpuppets there. "Denyse O'Leary" is really Barbara Forrest taking the piss.

Bob

Date: 2008/02/20 13:18:46, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Wonderful, sparc!  Allen MacNeill's performance is reminiscent of today's xkcd


It should be easy to adjust, but I can't be arsed right now.

Bob

Date: 2008/02/21 00:19:51, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (REC @ Feb. 19 2008,13:37)
Anyone follow O'Leary's link to the 'file drawer' effect paper?
File Drawer Effect

The Society for Scientific Exploration is endlessly entertaining.....
Some of their 'peer reviewed' publications:

The Journal for Scientific Exploration stopped publishing in winter 2005.  Anyone see the significance of that date?

Well, I only just got around to checking it, but PCID last published in November 2005.

I've no idea what to make of this, either.

Date: 2008/02/22 03:07:41, Link
Author: Bob O'H
More of a heads-up than anything else, for those of you who have access to ´Science, there's an article about
scientists who leave creationism for evolution.

The main point is that it's a hard personal struggle:
Quote
Trying to articulate where his religious beliefs stand now, Godfrey's eyes fill with tears. "It's been so long, a lifelong struggle, to sort out," he says. He has flirted with atheism but found it too depressing. Several years ago, he stopped attending church for a year before returning. He believes in God today, he says, but tomorrow may be different.

One sub-text is about how we should support people in this situation.

Date: 2008/02/22 14:11:05, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I read through most of the article Denyse put up.  The author's close to clueless.  Here's how I responded on Mindless Hack:
Quote
Hang on...

From (1) and the first (2), I(E_x) = -log P_f.

From (3) and the second (2), I_nat = -log P_f.

So, the inequality in (4) can never hold.  The only way I can make sense of this is if they are different P_f's, in which case the author should be made to stand in a corner and recite <i>How to Solve It</i> as punishment for poor notation.

But if the P_f's are different, then this simply says that intelligence is more likely only if the search is worse than blind chance.  That gives natural processes a pretty low barrier to cross.

(yes, I know.  I'm using _ and ^ because I'm not sure if Blogger will accept the sub and sup tags.  Well, let's <sub>try</sub> <sup>it</sup>).

Bob

Date: 2008/02/23 12:44:04, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Speaking of which, have you read The Egyptian?  I haven't, but I'm curious about parallels drawn with the current U.S. political climate as opposed to the traditional ones drawn with the political climate of the era in which it was written.

Do you mean the Mika Waltari book?  I read it recently (or at least a translation!).  I could see a neo-con drawing parallels (idealist trying to change history, and being let down by their own incompetence), but not really anyone else.

Incidentally, I assume that Sinuhe is a pun on "sinua", which is "you" in Finnish, in the partative, suggesting he's the "common man".  The Hittites are presumably Russia, and Horemheb is probably Marshall Mannerheim.  The parallels aren't exact, but close enough.

Now some diabolical advocate can come along and tell me why I'm wrong.  :-)

Bob

Date: 2008/02/24 01:20:51, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (dochocson @ Feb. 23 2008,23:04)
Okay, I'll fess up. larrycranston is me.

Yes, but who are you?

You could actually be Denyse O'Leary pretending to be a doctor, who's pretending to be larrycranston on UD.

Yours in peace

wMad

Date: 2008/02/24 01:36:23, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
I thought the veiled comparisons were about Nazism, but again, I haven't actually read it, just snippets about it.

For much of WWII Finland was allied with Germany, because nobody else would help against Russia.  As a result of this, Hitler actually gave two Iron Crosses to Jews.  The response of one of them was to say that he would wipe his arse with it.

Eventually, Finland reached a peace deal with Russia, part of which was that they had to drive the Germans out of Finnish Lapland.  The Germans weren't happy, so burnt much of the area as they left.  So, if you're ever traveling in Lapland with a German, it's safer if you have the matches when the police stop you.

Thus endeth today's history lesson.

Bob

Date: 2008/02/24 03:24:53, Link
Author: Bob O'H
sparc and larrycranston, you are very naughty boys.

Quote
26

sparc

02/23/2008

11:07 pm

in order to avoid the confusion you should have published your post under the name Botnik and filed it under the tag P-A-R-O-D-Y!!

Quote
28

larrycranston

02/23/2008

11:51 pm

Well said sparc!

Alternately, one could use a gif of some praying Marines to tag parody posts that might be interpreted as sincere.

Um, if Dave sees that, it'll mean more work for RB.

Date: 2008/02/24 04:58:12, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
To me, time, like size and direction, has a middle, a reference point, zero.

So it goes:

BC/zero/AD

And unfortunate example.  The first century AD only has 99 years: those poor Romans had to go from 1BC to 1AD.  There were riots that year, because the citizens were unhappy because they thought the Emperor was stealing a whole year from their lives.

Date: 2008/02/25 00:21:59, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
26

Jason Rennie

02/24/2008

4:04 pm

“The scientific imperative is not to reconstruct the entire process but simply to prove that the evolution of the flagellum is plausible using well-established natural processes.”

I wish I could get away with this sort of handwaving and half assedness in my job. Sure would make things easier. Yeah sure this design of mine for this software system plausibly works. Details ? Bah, i’ve demonstrated that it might plausibly work in some hypothetical make believe land. We don’t need to stinking evidence or details.

Jason, apply for a job at the Biologic Institute.

Date: 2008/02/25 05:32:59, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Salamanca rang a bell.  From the Wiki page:
Quote
In the Peninsular War of the Napoleonic campaigns, the Battle of Salamanca, fought July 22, 1812, was a serious setback for the French, and a mighty setback for Salamanca, whose western quarter was seriously damaged. The battle which raged that day is famous as a defining moment in military history; many thousands of men were slaughtered by cannon fire in the space of only a few short hours.

Can anyone think of another famous battle of the Napoleonic wars?

Also according to wiki, Cordova is the English name of Cordoba.  I went to a workshop there a few years ago, and was ill the whole time.

I think Ceiling Cat wins the Design Detector of the Week Award.  The prize is three hours of insurance for his ironymeter.

Bob

Date: 2008/02/25 14:02:58, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (sparc @ Feb. 25 2008,13:52)
Quote
Looks like the whole Expelled release/Darwin's death day thread has been 404-ed.
To sad. I had suggested to use May 25th instead because it's kind of another Lincoln day.

I thought it was a rather nice use of irony (look the date up, folks!).  I'm not sure any of the UDites understood it, though.

Date: 2008/02/26 00:53:37, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (khan @ Feb. 25 2008,19:40)
As I read this thread (and sometimes venture to UD) an image comes to mind:


http://preview.tinyurl.com/2bm7aj

Tard flowing from UD like lava flowing from Vesuvius.

It's The Earth weeping because she can't get away from this stuff.  All those exploding ironymeters are like ants crawling over her skin.

Date: 2008/02/26 01:45:05, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Kristine @ Feb. 25 2008,17:06)
Who can quote from the first season of "Space 1999"? Arden? :)


"That's the last time you confuse the armoury and the office supplies".

Date: 2008/02/27 00:58:36, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Yeah, happy birthday youngster!

I hope you get lots of sock puppet protectors as prezzies.

Bob

Date: 2008/02/27 01:13:31, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Viagra software?  Does you still use floppy disks?

Date: 2008/02/28 13:21:56, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Polar bears and arctic foxes don't seem to mind the wind much.  Must not be that much of a problem.  Of course they really are adapted to the cold.

I posted there and suggested that they should look at how animals like stoats and weasels adapt to the cold climes and a similar prey (essentially voles).  It was disappeared (I think because he didn't recognise the tongue-in-cheek tone of my second post).

Their biology's crap, but who cares? It was a fun post, and I thought it would be nice to prod them into finding out about real biology.  And who could resist the link I gave to cycling lemmings?

Date: 2008/02/28 13:51:18, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Arkwright's favourite nephew is back:

Quote
My essay  “How Evolution will be Taught Someday” approaches the debate by saying, ok, maybe evolution does give the appearance of natural causes, and we’ll even let you call it a “natural” process, as long as you don’t claim you know what those natural causes are. Then what?

Conclude Goddidit?

EDIT: because FtK might return

Date: 2008/02/29 01:07:13, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Lou FCD @ Feb. 28 2008,18:30)
ETA: Ooo ooo!  Forgot the money shot:

Quote
The finding, reported online Feb. 28 in the journal Current Biology, narrows the gap between humans and chimpanzees a little bit more.

"If we really want to talk about the big differences between humans and chimps — they're covered in hair and we're not," Taglialatela told LiveScience. "Their brains are about one-third the size of humans'. But the major differences come down to ones of degree, not of kind."

Oh, a closet Baraminologist, eh?

:-)

Date: 2008/03/01 08:38:31, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Test Your Irony Meters Here

Gil finds a report of a study where the victimsparticipants were given the same wine, but told it had a different price, and were then asked to rate it.  Of course, they rated the more expensive wine as better.  Gil says...
Quote
In the ID versus Darwinism/materialism debate, who are the most likely victims of this expectations phenomenon? I vote for the Darwinists, because as evidence for design continues to mount at an ever-quickening pace, they seem most determined to prop up their expectations with ever-more desperate storytelling, conjecture, and appeals to the statistically impossible, to denounce their challengers with ever-more vitriol, and to attempt to silence them with ever-more coercive tactics.

Date: 2008/03/02 10:12:22, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Gerry Rzeppa says
Quote
But, incidently, what can we really expect from a University Chair that was financed by a third-rate Microsoft programmer who (as evidenced in his infamous “Hungarian Notation”) couldn’t rightly distinguish between a data name and a data type!

A couple of questions came, totally at random, into my head.  Who is bankrolling/working at the Biologic Institute?  And who was trying to pay Dr. Dr. D.'s post-doc salary at Baylor the year before last?

Hmmm.

Date: 2008/03/02 13:02:55, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Shocking news, as reported by me at my new blog home:

The Biologic Institute's webpage has evolved.

It now has an empty blog too.

Date: 2008/03/03 00:42:29, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Steve Story use to post comments every month or two at the UD mockery thread making similar complaints - they were getting boring, and nothing had really happened since the halcyon days of flatulent animation.

But then a melt-down would happen, and then another one, and now he's given up.  So, be patient.  Another meltdown will be along soon.  It may not shake the handsets of the Baylor Board of Regents, but it'll be worth waiting for.

Date: 2008/03/04 02:00:38, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Oooh!  Someone's in a bad mood
Quote


5

O'Leary

03/03/2008

4:15 pm

sparc, you wrote,

“Isn’t citing the Vice President for Research and Personnel Development Martin Bucer Seminary who according to the seminary’s web pages hosted an intelligent design creationists symposium in Prague (October 22, 2005) the same as discussing the issue with a Toronto-based journalist; grandmother; Roman Catholic Christian?”

Watch it. You and your posts may be gone soon.

This list is for intelligent people who want to discuss issues, not personalities.

You are not persuading me that either you or your posts belong here.

This whole thread could disappear into the night with no loss, and it well may, unless you start saying something to the purpose.

For all her faults, Denyse doesn't normally channel the DaveScot stream of tard.

Date: 2008/03/04 03:02:39, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Ouch.  Unkind.

Date: 2008/03/04 03:14:29, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
I fail to see the difference between Professor Allen's army and a family (grouped by paternity).  Am I blind?

Nope.  Or at least I am too.

I think the point a out the army is subtle, and the description doesn't do it justice.  The general at the top of his hierarchy is a soldier.  So are the men below him in the hierarchy.  Therefore it is a nested hierarchy.  But, the chain of command consists of the power relationships between soldiers rather than membership relationships, so the command structure isn't a nested hierarchy.

Paternal lineages are also a nested hierarchy if one considers the lineage.  Any lineage can be defined by its members at a point in time.  The lineage contains all lineages at a later  point in time.  Hence it is a nested hierarchy.

In fact, one way of modelling evolution is to define the lineage in terms of nested sets, and model the pattern of nestedness.  IOW, it's formally defined as a nested hierarchy, using proper set theory an' all.

Date: 2008/03/04 08:36:12, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (J-Dog @ Mar. 04 2008,08:11)
Quote (Steverino @ Mar. 04 2008,06:33)
Quote (olegt @ Mar. 04 2008,06:08)
Sal informs us that Caroline Crocker is selling a new product, intellectual honesty.  $5,000 if made from scratch, $1,000 for gently used.  Details are available from her agent at intellectual IntellectualHonesty.info.

Oh and it's a real slick website!

The 90's called and they want their copy of FrontPage back!

Ha!  If they were trying to win an award for The Most Annoying WebSite, they win.

Yeah.  I love the "Showing the Intelligence of Design" graphic.  Luckily my ironymeter had already flagged the site as comedy.

Date: 2008/03/06 12:51:03, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Erasmus, FCD @ Mar. 06 2008,07:23)
I'm just saying.  I didn't do it.  But Gawds that is funny.

Quite.  I don't think it's too difficult to guess who Turner Coates is: if you're stuck ask Raevmo.

Date: 2008/03/06 12:58:48, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Yeah, I can only assume Heddle is showing that he's a mean atheist.  :-)

(with apologies to the 99% of you who don't understand statistical notation)

Date: 2008/03/07 00:56:50, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Albatrossity2 @ Mar. 06 2008,19:42)
Waaaah waaah atheists! - WAD gets his shorts in a bunch over a degree in "scientific literacy" which seems to be a bit negative toward ID.

And the big tent seems to include Bedouins; a commenter named Ahmed Aouin chimes in with this incomprehensible yet hilarious post    
Quote
Is a hope Intelligent Desnig is to be part of this course?

Congratulations Doktor Dembski!

That one must be the offspring of some diabolical tryst involving Larry Fafarman and VMartin...

From some of his other posts there, he's Turkish, and his English is poor.  It's often difficult to work out if the person is trying to say something nuts, or if they just aren't able to express themselves clearly in a foreign language.

I'd suggest that any jokes about his language skills have to be made in Turkish.  :-)


Is AussieID a sockpuppet?
Quote
I remember when I was doing my Degree that one lecturer basically stated that to pass his subject you had to buy his book … and use it as the only frame of reference. I wonder what texts will be on offer in this course, and what would hapen to the student who dared question the party line?

Date: 2008/03/07 01:06:45, Link
Author: Bob O'H
For high-quality, concentrated science, have a look at the Journal of Evolutionary Informatics' Instructions to Authors
Quote
Sorry. We are not yet accepting manuscripts.

I guess they're trying as hard as they can, but it's not easy when you only have a broom cupboard.  But then we get this footnote:
Quote
The material on this Web site does not necessarily represent the views of the employers of JOEI's volunteers - but it should.

Someone a bit bitter?

(JOEI is a rather unfortunate acronym, especially if you're Britsh and of a certain age to remember Mr. Deacon)

Date: 2008/03/08 01:07:57, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (JohnW @ Mar. 06 2008,11:16)
As a statistician, I was drawn to the first item on Dr Dr D's list.  Magnificent stuff: not just sciency but mathematicsy too!  If you assume God exists, Bayes' Theorem states that you'll think God exists.  Hold the front page!

Have you read Dembski's Jesus Tomb "paper" (pdf)?  He says just that about Jesus' resurrection.  Go straight to Section 7: it's better for your sanity that you skip the rest.

Date: 2008/03/08 01:10:52, Link
Author: Bob O'H
How about using (a) the Wedge document's goals, or (b) Dembski's prediction that Darwinism would be overthrown in 10 years.  I think Kristine still has the quote somewhere.

Or just wait until the next trial comes up.

Date: 2008/03/08 11:37:41, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Zachriel - done.  I wonder if bFast will acknowledge you.

Date: 2008/03/09 04:59:02, Link
Author: Bob O'H
This might disappear, it might remain, but either way I'm sure there's something to amuse you:
Quote
http://www.uncommondescent.com/the-design-of-life/reviews-reviews-of-the-design-of-life-pats-and-pans-ink-and-angst/#comment-181205

2

Bob O'H

03/09/2008

4:45 am

Denyse - in your comment on the review, you write

   I assume that Mohrhoff refers here to the two three-star reviews and the one four-star review as worth checking out - because they are probably normal reviews, like his, as opposed to elements in a campaign for or against the book.

The one review Mohrhoff refers to is by “David Springer”, i.e. your good friend DaveScot. I’m not sure I’d classify his review as “normal” in this sense: Dave is pretty partisan.

Date: 2008/03/10 01:21:50, Link
Author: Bob O'H
bFast - just a couple of observations.
1. It would help if you could clarify your terminology.  I think when you write "alleles" you mean "genes".  In Zachriel's notation, when he has a string of numbers (1112111), each number is a "gene", and each value that a gene can take is an allele.  I think you're describing the same thing, but you're using "allele" when you mean "gene".

Yeah, I know.  Terminology is a pain.  But it will help everyone understand what you're doing.

2. I agree with Zachriel that you have an odd selection scheme.  A "better" scheme might be to select an individual at random to die, and then select the replacement with a probability proportional to the individual's fitness (i.e. divide by the sum of the fitnesses).  Or have a discrete time model and at each generation pick N individuals with replacement with probabilities proportional to the individuals' fitnesses.

3. The reason the focal gene's frequency drifts when there are more genes is that it has a smaller effect on fitness.  If we just think of the binary case, the genetic variance for one gene is p_i(1-p_i) where p_i is the frequency of the 1 allele, and the total genetic variance is sum p_j(1-p_j).  The proportion of variance for one gene is then

p_i(1-p_i)/(sum p_j(1-p_j))

and obviously the sum increases as each new gene is added, so the proportional effect of the ith allele get smaller.  Hence, the effect on fitness is less (because it is the absolute numbers you are using for that), so drift becomes more important.

Date: 2008/03/10 13:53:31, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
I will qualify this by saying I haven't read it all (my brain went into emergency shutdown), but the "paper" seems to be simply apologetics - throwing a lot of probababble around to justify what the intended audience already thinks is true.  The technical term is argumentum ad making shit up.

Ah but the beauty of Bayes' theorem is that it formalises the process.  The paper (and no, I haven't read it all either.  Same reason) demonstrates this perfectly - if you're reasonably numerate, it's clear this is what's happening.  Well, unless you're up against obfuscationary writings of of a high a level as Dembski's.

Incidentally, the real Bayesian action nowadays is in the likelihood, not the prior.  Graphical models rule!

Date: 2008/03/10 14:00:34, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Naughty Nelson
Quote

Hey chuckhumphry,
Really good imitations of IDers aren’t written so broadly. Work on your nuances.

Come over here and say that.

Date: 2008/03/14 01:44:04, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
2: Per cycle, I randomly select two organisms to compete.
- I call a random number < 100,
-   if that number is < "random", I choose the organism that dies by random coin toss.
-   Otherwise I compete them as follows:
-      for element 2 through 10, I call a coin toss.  If heads, I add the fitness of the element for each organism into separate accumulators.  If tails, I subtract the fitness.
-      I add the fitness of element 1 into the accumulator.
-      The organism with the lowest accumulator value is destroyed.
-   I then choose two organisms at random to "mate".  (I could modify my algorithm here to simulate sexual selection.)
-   To mate an organism, I coin toss for each entry in the two organism's arrays, creating a new array.  I then map the strength of each element as described during initialization.
-   I dynamically maintain a count of how many "mutants" are in the array.

This is needlessly complicated.  Why not simply choose an organism to die, according to its fitness (you can use rejection sampling, which should be quick), and then choose the 2 parents randomly.

I'm surprised you're complaining about it taking a long time.  There shouldn't be anything particularly complicated to simulate.

I'm also with Wes in saying that you're looking at issues that have been sorted out.  There's nothing wrong with trying to replicate them, as it should help you understand evolutionary biology, but don't expect us to be wowed by something new!

Date: 2008/03/14 12:33:32, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (carlsonjok @ Mar. 14 2008,06:34)
Quote (CeilingCat @ Mar. 14 2008,04:50)
UD's latest attempt at humor:


Or latest attempt at co-opting the work of others. See here.


Is that a copyright note in the bottom right-hand corner of the original?  It seems to have become rather smudged in the Finched version.

Date: 2008/03/15 01:41:49, Link
Author: Bob O'H
RRE is clueless about natural history
Quote

...
Allen_McNeill wrote (#105):
“Now, show me how you have determined the same thing for, say, Microtus pennsylvanicus, using empirical methods. Then I will freely admit that Microtus pennsylvanicus is intelligently designed.”
It’s already been shown to you. How do you not see it? Microtus pennsylvanicus is a MICROSCOPIC MACHINE with an even smaller genetic CODE or INSTRUCTION SET to BUILD proteins from scratch.
The bacterium fits the standard definition of a machine; you can look it up yourself.
All machines when studying their origin were intelligently designed.
(bold added)

Microtus pennsylvanicus, cute furry bacterium:

Date: 2008/03/15 03:19:06, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Given that these values are randomized for each cycle, this would be tantamount to every organism awakening daily to an environment that is completely unrelated to the one that obtained the day before, unrelated to the environments to which almost all other organisms are exposed (each of which experiences, in turn a completely unique environment), and to those environments that will arise on the following day.

Looks like the conditions for NFL theorems to be applicable.

Date: 2008/03/16 02:06:24, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I responded to this at UD, but for those of you with more sense than to wade through that lot, I give you bFast
Quote

Bob O’H:
Quote
Now, what mechanism do you have that brings machines as complex as like voles into existence? And what evidence do you have for it?

We have historical evidence that “intelligence” can bring extremely complex machines into existance. We have historical evidence that the machines available today are much more complex than the machines available just 10 years ago. There is good reason to believe that machines much more complex than exist now will be developed via the process of “intelligence” in the near future. So “intelligence” has the recognized ability to produce extremely complex machines.

Ergo, the vole will be designed, some time in the future.

Date: 2008/03/16 12:02:56, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (stevestory @ Mar. 16 2008,11:48)
I am a native speaker and an American and "TARD" is about the nicest thing you can say about that Davetard comment.

I took a couple of courses in Native, but could never really understand the grammar.

English is so much easier.

Date: 2008/03/16 12:20:24, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Chess teams don't have "locker" rooms though.

Date: 2008/03/16 14:06:23, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Oh no, he's given in his homework ,and now he's trying to change the subject, in the hope we don't look at his work very carefully.

Date: 2008/03/17 13:18:09, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Lou FCD @ Mar. 17 2008,12:43)
How 'bout this instead?

Or this?

Dave for Teh Win!!!onetyone!!!!

Date: 2008/03/17 14:17:58, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (J-Dog @ Mar. 17 2008,10:39)
Bob O - You have an in with those UD Bozos - (no disrespect Blipey) - Please suggest to kairosfocus that he give it a rest.  A long rest.  Until he gets better.  And let him know we're all "rooting for him".

What?  And deprive you of tard?

Date: 2008/03/18 01:44:58, Link
Author: Bob O'H
What's going on here?
Quote

Deleted: Please add objective/constructive comments, not ad hominem attacks. DLH

DLH admitting to deleting a comment?!

Date: 2008/03/18 01:50:07, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Dave waves his arms a bit
Quote

Bob
It said nothing about the range of possible amino acid sequences that could accomplish this task.
Correct. We also don’t how many possible different combinations of the atoms in a space shuttle will carry passengers to space and back. We know from experience that most of them will not as it’s a lot harder finding arrangements that meet the specification versus finding arrangements that don’t meet it. A moron can build a space shuttle that doesn’t work. It took hundreds of man years of effort from very bright engineers to build one that does.
A physicist can explain to you precisely why most combinations of matter won’t fly to space and back but most people have a well enough developed sense of intuition to know this without invoking statistical mechanics.
I think we know from experience that the vast majority of combinations of amino acids won’t meet the specification of energy storage. ATP synthase is highly conserved in all forms of life. This is indicative that even small changes in sequence result in something that doesn’t fit the specification. If small random changes result in catastrophic failure that’s pretty compelling evidence that very few of all the possible polymer sequences meet the specification.
I suppose this could be better characterized by replacing the genes that specify the protein components in ATP synthase with random strings of codons and see how many of the random sequences still result in a working ATP synthase molecule. What I don’t suppose is anyone will bother doing it because the result is almost certain - no amount of effort will find a randomly generated sequence that works.

Dave - surely you realised what would happen when you said you'd calculate CSI.  I'm surprised you went down this path.

Date: 2008/03/18 01:57:44, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (guthrie @ Mar. 17 2008,18:03)
Just to check, my limited understanding is that a bell shaped curve is what you would expect if it was random...

In general, adding lots of random things up leads to a normal distribution.  The amazing thing is how often it works in practice.

Date: 2008/03/18 01:58:29, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (JohnW @ Mar. 17 2008,11:56)
Quote (Guest @ Mar. 17 2008,09:41)
a standard bell-shaped distribution hardly implies complete randomness.

in fact, just the opposite.

Sometimes I say to myself, "Fuck it.  I'm not getting out of bed today.  There's just too much stupid out there."

Now you know what it's like for the biologists.

Date: 2008/03/18 02:51:48, Link
Author: Bob O'H
It's a very small kirk (or "church" to those of us from the right side of Hadrians's Wall).

Date: 2008/03/18 05:51:00, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Methinks Emkay is a YEC.  Or one of you.
Quote

bFast: “For example, during the cambrian explosion, many phila were generated, shortly after that, most of these phila dissappeared. Why? The data looks like experimentation to me.”
The so-called Cambrian explosion is only proof that a global flood took place about 4500 years ago, in the time of the biblical Noah.

A tard-fight ensues.

Date: 2008/03/18 14:34:55, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Teh Logos
Quote
In teh beginz is teh cat macro, and teh cat macro sez "Oh hai Ceiling Cat" and teh cat macro iz teh Ceiling Cat.

Translated into Information Theory:
Quote
0100000011101101010100011010001010001010110000000010001001010011110001010110010won11010011

0101000110011won0111000001001000011000101nuthing010111101100000010011001101110111100010111
1
100110101100110100010011011001101011100011101101100111011101011010110110001100000110101001

011011100110110101100111010110111100100100000010000011101001110001010000110001001110111111

110000000001110111011111011000100wonwon011100111011001110101110110110100110001100101110110
000001
000010000010010100001010001101110011101110011000111001011011101000101011000110001111010000

0000000101110110101101010101011011111110nuthings101001100011110001111011111101010110000011
01000010
001011101000000011011001001101101101010111111000100111000000100001101000001010010011001111

111000011100111101000100000010110110011110010011001010111001000011111011100101101001010111

100000010000001000101110110000101101000110010101001011000010011110001011110111010011001010

11100001010100110011010100001011101011000111001000001111101110111101000won1010010101011000

0111110000011011000101100

Date: 2008/03/19 13:07:22, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (carlsonjok @ Mar. 19 2008,08:25)
Quote (CeilingCat @ Mar. 19 2008,01:45)
Kairosfocus        
Quote
Now, on substance, how can we move on from this point?

GEM of TKI

Okay, which one of you SOB's is Leo Stotch?  He is poking fun at Kairos and is cruising for a wollop from the banning stick.
   
Quote
   
Quote
Mr Storch may well be surprised to see that his “expertise” was tried and found wanting.

It is Stotch, KF. Stotch with a T and not an R.

I would think that someone, such as yourself, who takes such care to fully express your thoughts, and with the parent’s pride that can only come from investing so much of yourself in those words, ensuring that said words are dressed in only the most resplendent finery offered by Noah Webster’s literary haberdashery, would exercise the appropriate level of diligence that the names of your fellow colloquy participants were expressed with the appropriate sequence of alphabetical characters.

Or perhaps you have confused Leo Stotch with Larry Storch, the acclaimed American thespian, known best for his role as Randolph Agarn on the sweeping frontier epic, F-Troop?

Surely, though, I should not think that you have deliberately misspelled my name in order to draw a (some would say) clever allusion to the fire metaphor that you often return to? Surely not. That would be to poison the conversation by torching my contributions after soaking them in the oil of the adolescent playground tactic of taunting someone by the deliberate disfigurement their given appellation. You are far too dignified a personage to engage in such sophomoric antics.

Alas, I guess my desire to understand why the entirety of the world’s scientific academy should cease their use of a process that has served them for untold centuries, and await your learned disquisition on how they should henceforth practice their art, will remain unrequited. I despair, but shall not vex you further. Please, commence with the topic of interest. Onlookers await.

PS: It is Davescot, not Dave Scott. It is one thing to mangle the name of a poor participant, such as myself. It is whole other matter to test the indulgence of your host by not recognizing their preferred spelling.

PotW?  Not for carlsonjok, for Leo.

Date: 2008/03/19 13:17:12, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I suspect the animation is also the one used in this Pat Robertson report.  I would strongly advise turning your sound off before watching.

Date: 2008/03/20 01:39:54, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Bloody hell
Quote

Quote
ID examines evidence and applies methods like the Explanatory Filter to determine if any appearance of design is due to physical law, chance, or Complex Specified Information.

So is CSI now a causative agent? I had thought it was just a number(*).
Can you point to examples of the Explanatory Filter being used to infer the action of CSI in creating the appearance of design?
(*) and not therefore a free man.
{DLH Thanks for the catch Bob O’H. Oh the differences between what I wrote and what I intended! I’ve corrected it above.}

Normally when I point out a silly mistake like that, the tards try to defend it, and hilarity ensues.  Full credit to DLH for doing the right thing.

Date: 2008/03/21 03:02:20, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
He had no limits when he was inhaling whiteboard marker fumes.

*ahem*  Chalk dust, please.

Bloody kids.

Date: 2008/03/21 04:19:17, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Keep a look out for the 100 000th post - coming soon!

Date: 2008/03/21 10:39:17, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Is there anyone else who might care to sign up for this screening? I'd like there to be a truthful witness or two for whatever might happen.

Or to hold you back if you get too irate?  :-)

Date: 2008/03/21 13:48:58, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Richard - the matter has been alluded to:
Quote
http://www.uncommondescent.com/atheism/dr-berlinkskis-book-tour/#comment-189684

10

larrynormanfan

03/21/2008

12:43 am

Tard Alert!

Quote
   A great way to meet authors and commenters from the Uncommon Descent community is to attend Discovery Institute events like this one.


But what if PZ Meyers shows up?

Date: 2008/03/22 05:34:12, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Oh, I haven't missed it.  So, happy birthday, Kristine!  I hope the potion doesn't wear off for many more years.

Date: 2008/03/22 12:28:12, Link
Author: Bob O'H
p.noyola is cruisin' for a bannin'
Quote

Quote
… small men who above all are afraid of a fair contest.

As opposed to the DI fellows who testified at Dover.
Please.

Date: 2008/03/22 12:35:09, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Oh yeah, pop-pickers.  FtK's back
Quote

This is just priceless. No doubt this little ruse is going to increase ticket sales by leaps and bounds.
PZ et. al. are causing such a ruckus that one guy over at PT joked that, “Now, when you google Richard Dawkins its an ad for ‘Expelled’”. ROTFL.
This debate is so entertaining…

Date: 2008/03/22 13:06:07, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Ah, so that's how he'll respond to the criticisms that Expelled is badly made.  He'll appeal to its emotional impact: "And yet it moves".

Date: 2008/03/23 02:20:42, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Wesley R. Elsberry @ Mar. 22 2008,22:49)
There are people claiming vociferously that the animations used were the Illustra media ones. Given that PZ has the DVD with some portion of the animation used on it, he should be able to do some side-by-side comparisons and put this to rest one way or the other. But I think that relying on recall alone probably isn't sufficient in this case.

There's also a short snippet in the Pat Robertson interview that UD linked to.  It's only short, but it looks similar to the famous XVIVO animation.  If it's the same, I'm sure someone will be able to spot where exactly it's from.

Ugh.  Going to UD to find a link to Robertson.  Well, I had to go for a shower anyway, so let's cut out one of them, and go straight to Pat.  It's about a minute in, wedged between Berlinski and Dembski.

Date: 2008/03/23 07:55:28, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I seem to have struck a nerve.
Quote

idnet.com.au, thanks much for your quotation from Dawkins. I was aware of it but couldn’t place it.
I will let Jews decide whether it is anti-Semitic. But I will say this on my own account:
Reference to some “successful” Jewish lobby that allegedly “monopolize[s]” policy should always raise a red flag.
The idea that Jews have power but other people somehow don’t is a cradle for anti-Semitism.
Look, nearly half of Americans don’t even VOTE, apparently.
And if you live in a democracy and don’t vote, get OUT of my face, m’kay?
I don’t want to hear your complaints about your government.
How did you THINK you were supposed to change the government? Just by wittering that you don’t “like” it?
The American founders would whack you with a broom!
Of course, Dawkins may be making the usual Brit/French mistake of commenting on North America without understanding it.
Here is an example: One thing that greatly strengthen’s Israel’s voice in America’s ear is the support of Christian evangelicals, who are presently much more numerous than Jews.
But if one’s view of North America is formed from reading the “warp world” copy of legacy media - instead of by living the reality of life here - one might believe that Christian evangelicals are anti-Semites. So one would not even see their lobbying and voting efforts.
And if a given individual pays for that mistake by making dumb and questionable remarks, so be it.

Very odd.

Date: 2008/03/23 11:59:05, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Hang on, so Allen was deemed too boring in a film narrated by Ben Stein?!

Allen - give up teaching.  Now.

Date: 2008/03/23 12:58:57, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Or the fact that ID is not science, has led to exactly zero scientific predictions, observations, or breakthroughs, and thus deserves to be expelled from science journals and classrooms?

Now now, that's unfair.  Someone once got a very nice pocketwatch out of it.

Date: 2008/03/24 08:53:59, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
This means my god rules, and all of your gods suck.  and get butt fucked by my god.  your puny gods.

Pah!  It's my god in charge of the camera and running the website where the video footage is posted.

Date: 2008/03/25 02:39:34, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Horace_Worblehat is a tard
Quote
20

Horace_Worblehat

03/24/2008

5:43 pm

Tard Alert!

Myers had had tenure since 2003.
Why speculate when the facts are readily available?

Which one of you is Horace Worblehat?  Whoever it is, I just want to say - great name!

Date: 2008/03/26 12:27:43, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (JohnW @ Mar. 26 2008,12:03)
If I wanted to use a false name in order to blend in and not attract attention in a room full of swivel-eyed fundies, I'd definitely go with "Clinton".

Do you think it would work if we tried to persuade him that Dawkin's third Christian name (Christian! Ha!) is Ahmed?

Date: 2008/03/26 12:47:46, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Allen_MacNeill is not a tard...
Quote

I was asked:
“What, precisely, has been “redacted”, please?”
The list of forthcoming advance screenings of the film, some of the procedures for registering, and the list of dates (all of which are now listed as “TBA” and “Waiting List”.
BTW, the term “redacted” means essentially “edited, following changed interpretation”.

but is a very naughty boy
Quote

See, for example:
Rendsburg, G. A. (1986) The Redaction of Genesis. Eisenbrauns, Winona Lake, IN, ISBN 0931464250, 129 pages.

Date: 2008/03/27 11:02:10, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Jack - I suspect you both you and Allen are fairly immune to bannination, because you've both been well behaved (I know.  Difficult, isn't it?), and also because you're seen as being movers and shakers in the whole ID-evolution debate.

Dave also seems to have done less banning recently.  There are a couple of sockpuppets who I'm sure he knows are sockpuppets, but he's allowed to remain posting at UD.  He could have banned them a couple of months ago.

He must be going soft in his old age.

Date: 2008/03/28 01:34:59, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (bfish @ Mar. 27 2008,21:20)
And KF has rare moments of illumination.

 
Quote


16

kairosfocus

03/27/2008

5:15 am

A little fact-checking is in order I am afraid; after all, this is UD!

But only a little.

Date: 2008/03/28 01:45:24, Link
Author: Bob O'H
After reading DLH's latest dreck, I decided blatant sarcasm was the only response.

Bob O’H is a tard
Quote

Quote
Are there parallels between the effects of “Big Science” Darwinism severe job discrimination against non-Darwinists as shown in Expelled, and recent terrorism by Jihadists?

Not yet. The zealots from our training camps have yet to graduate (the selection regime is rather severe). But when they do, you’ll see waves of suicide bombings, hijackings and aerial assaults on centres of ignorance like churches, temples and warehouses of Chiquita Brands International. We were planning to target ISCID, but we can’t find it.


I wonder if they'll get the Chiquita reference.

Date: 2008/03/29 05:55:33, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Dave's gotten angry
Quote

Allen
Due to disrupting threads with continued denialism you’re now in moderation. If you want to quote Mein Kampf at length do it on your own blog.

Allen's post seems to have disappeared too.

Date: 2008/03/29 07:46:31, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Link for Allen MacNeill being censored

A new sock-puppet has appeared at UD in the past couple of days.  Whoever you are, carry on - you're doing great!

Date: 2008/03/29 12:44:50, Link
Author: Bob O'H
mohammed.husain isn't going to last long.
Quote

Sayings of the Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him):
“None of you will truly believe until you love for your brother what you love for yourself”.
(narrated by Bukhari). Nawawi the famous of the 13th century says that brother here means brother in humanity.
God loves kindness when you deal with any
matter” (narrated by Bukhari and Muslim)
“You will not enter Paradise until you have faith
and you will not have faith until you love one
another. Do you want me to tell you
something you can do to make you love one
another? Make it a habit to greet one another
with “Asalamu Alaykum” - peace upon you”.
(narrated by Muslim)
“Give gifts to each other, as this will make you
love one another.” (narrated by Muslim)
“Where are those who love each other for the sake of My glory? Today I will shelter them with My shade, as there is no shade today except My shade”.” (narrated by Muslim) (with reference to the Day of Judgement.
“God Almighty said: “My servant draws near to Me with nothing more loved by Me than the acts of worship that I have enjoined upon him. My servant continues to try to draw near to Me with more devotion, until I love him. When I love him, I will be his hearing with which he hears, his sight by which he sees, his hand with which he strikes, his feet on which he walks. When he asks Me for something, I will respond and when he takes refuge in Me, I will grant it to him. I do not hesitate in doing anything I intend to do as much as I hesitate in seizing the soul of My faithful servant; he hates death and I hate hurting him. But death is a must for him”.”
(narrated by Bukhari)

Imagine, quoting the Prophet Mohammed at UD!  What next?  Somebody quoting Hitl....

Oh, never mind.  RB, you'll be wanted over at the bannination thread shortly.

Date: 2008/03/30 00:41:05, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Annyday @ Mar. 29 2008,19:00)
I was taught to write primarily by women, and I still write like a guy according to the gender genie. There's some really intricate commentary on the ways people use language in this, but I'm not gonna make it. Mostly, I think Granny Spice just confuses the genie because her writing is very, very far outside of the sample the genie was calibrated for.

Like fiction.

Ah. Scratch that.

Date: 2008/03/30 11:56:35, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Zachriel - Petrograd is St. Petersburg, not Moscow.  Still not tropical, though.  It use to be part of Finland.

Date: 2008/03/30 14:19:08, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Advocatus Diaboli - it might be more correct to say that Sweden owned.  Apparently it use to be called Nevanlinna (which might be a familiar name to you).

Just think, if you got it back you'd more than double the population size.

Date: 2008/03/30 14:22:34, Link
Author: Bob O'H
OK, who bought FtK a sock detection kit for Easter?
Quote

Dear ATBC puppets (aka Leo and Blair),
Chill boys. You guys giggle at us, we have a little giggle at you.
Sal’s puppy paragraph is child’s play in comparison to the obnoxious, horrific things said about him.
Now, let’s all take a little breather, have a drink and take a minute to laugh at how ridiculous this conversation is.
Cheers!

As you might have worked out, Sal is being Sal on that thread.  It's not a pretty sight (site?).

Date: 2008/03/31 11:23:45, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Correct, Bob. It was way back when all Finns were sex slaves for the Swedes. We're still sore over that epoch.

Oh, so they told you you were going Pole dancing during the Thirty Years War then?

Date: 2008/04/01 10:30:48, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (oldmanintheskydidntdoit @ April 01 2008,09:37)
For those who say Dr Dr Dr Dembski no longer does science I've got news for you
Quote
In line with DLH’s request, I’d be happy to do a cluster analysis (a multivariate statistical procedure) to see if those who were recommended for tenure and then denied it by the administration differ significantly along any relevant criteria (number of publications, quality of publications, research funds, etc.) from those who were granted tenure by the administration. Having been on the faculty at Baylor for a number of years, I have my own sources, and the picture that emerges is not nearly as optimistic as you make out.

Link
Hey Dr Dembski, perhaps you'd be better off using your skills to put ID on a solid experimental footing.

Cluster analysis?  Hahahahahahaha.

Sorry, that's just dumb.  Logistic regression, discriminant analysis, CART (or whatever variant is appropriate) would be OK, but using a cluster analysis is just wrong.

Date: 2008/04/01 12:50:08, Link
Author: Bob O'H
JohnW - I had wanted to say that I only sort that sort of statistical suggestion from biologists, but then I realised this might not be the best place for that observation.

The whole comments thread is excellent.  Denyse gets slapped down by an anonymous Baylor insider ("The Fork").  She complains that the insider is anonymous, so Francis Beckwith backs The Fork up.

My guess is that The Fork is someone who has crossed Dembski in the past, and who has decided to hide from him in the canteen.

Date: 2008/04/02 00:23:33, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I'm resisting the urge to go to Denyse's thread and ask what DLH's real name is.

Date: 2008/04/02 10:38:18, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
2. DaveScot has banned more people than he has had sexual congress with. He is proud of this.

As are the Inuit.

Date: 2008/04/04 07:44:38, Link
Author: Bob O'H
For all venters (Craig included):

Source

Hands up who wants to try it out on Kairosfocus.

Date: 2008/04/05 02:25:14, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Bob O'H could be quite an educational resource at Uncommon Descent. Unfortunately, I don't think scordova has his listening ears on.

This is Sal we're talking about.  Does he have listening ears?

Date: 2008/04/05 08:33:12, Link
Author: Bob O'H
At the start of his post on Fisher's Fundamental Theorem, Sal quotemines four people: Walter ReMine, Mae Wan Ho, Stan Salthe and Mike Lynch.  ReMine is a creationist, Salthe is an oddball philosopher who dislikes evolutionary biology because of its moral implications.  Mike Lynch is a proper biologist, one of the big names in evolutionary biology (I really should buy his book!).  But who is Mae Wan Ho?

Well, Wiki helps.  Apparently she is a "noted and controversial holistic scientist" who believes that living creatures do not obey the second law of thermodynamics. She also signed the Disco Institute's Dissent From Darwin list.  So, not looking good as far as main-stream science.

Then I googled a bit, and found this little snippet in an interview:
 
Quote
ACRES U.S.A. So, what actually happens when we eat these foods?

HO. As I already mentioned, these modified genetic materials were designed to overcome the natural barriers between species. What happens when we eat ordinary vegetables and animal protein is that the DNA is broken down by our enzymes. Then, our cells also have enzymes for breaking them down further, and ultimately they will be nutrition for the cell. Unfortunately, if you design genetically modified DNA to jump into genomes and to overcome species barriers, then there is a chance that this DNA can avoid enzymatic breakdown and get into other unrelated species. For example, one of the dangers of these organisms is that, as I said previously, they are mainly made up of genetic material belonging to viruses and bacteria. So if these genetic materials meet other viruses and bacteria, they can join up to make new combinations — new viruses and bacteria that cause diseases and resist medical treatment.

Apparently she used to be a lecturer in genetics.  But she still believes in magic.  I'm rather more sceptical that sticking a strand of DNA to a gold particle, and then  shooting it at a plant will give the sequence the ability to avoid degredation later.

Date: 2008/04/05 12:23:03, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Zachriel @ April 05 2008,11:37)
Quote
Bob O'H: I guess you’re too busy learning new skills to have remembered you Introductory Quotemining lessons. That qualification should have been changed to an ellipsis.

Ouch! I think he may have heard that.

Maybe not.  He either didn't notice, or chose to ignore, my comment in post 18.

Date: 2008/04/06 02:45:28, Link
Author: Bob O'H
As a part of my public service to IDists I checked Dr. Dr. Dr. Dembski's CV.  Now, as we know ID isn't aimed at school students, and is also not religious, so it is no surprise to see this new entry:
Quote
Intelligent Design 101 (coauthored with Sean McDowell, foreword by Josh McDowell; introduction for high school students and Sunday school classes to intelligent design). Eugene, Oregon: Harvest House, to appear 2008.

Date: 2008/04/07 11:04:49, Link
Author: Bob O'H
midwifetoad - didn't Feyerabend do that?

Date: 2008/04/07 14:21:16, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
But evolutionary biology has never been just about the science. Why else would there be such a heated debate over it?

It's not because evolutionary biology has never been just about the science, it's because creationism has never been just about the science.  You've managed to spot the wrong culprit in a short-list of two.

Quote
I'm not saying they should be held to a different standard. I'm saying exactly the opposite. Just as Christians can't gloss over the fact that Hitler used elements of Christianity to justify his actions, neither can proponents of Darwinian evolution gloss over the fact that Hitler did the same with this theory. As for Luther's influence on Hitler's anti-semitism, there's no need to explain it away. It's patently clear. No one is saying Darwinian science inspired Hitler's anti-semitism, he just used it to provide a scientific justification for what he believed.

So how did Crossroads, a film about the relationship between science and religion, only discuss the effects of science on Hitler, and not religion?  Or was that part expunged after the script was written?

Date: 2008/04/08 12:32:40, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Great catch by TRoutMac
Quote

Maybe my eyes are bad at 5:30 in the morning, but on the second clip, at Dr. Dembski’s appearance, some type appeared in the lower right corner which identified Dr. Dembski. But it looked to me like they misspelled his name! “Dempski” is what I saw. The first clip didn’t contain this error. I hope the 2nd clip wasn’t actually used as-is in the final cut. That would be rather embarrassing.
Regardless, I’m anxious to see the film.

He's right, you know.  Oh, and they also have a clip from the animation 'Inner Life of a Cell' 'The Cell as an Automated City.' 'A Journey into the Cell'.  It looks slightly out of focus.

Date: 2008/04/09 11:22:02, Link
Author: Bob O'H
One to keep in the archives from Denyse
Quote

leo stotch, the work of addressing the strengths and weaknesses of specific arguments for Darwin’s theory in the academy is the job of qualified experts, working in an atmosphere of scholarly respect and academic freedom.

I'm guessing the "qualified experts" aren't biologists.

Date: 2008/04/09 12:27:11, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Denyse
Quote

As a textbook editor, I always did my best to ensure that critical thinking was a component of every program I worked on.

Now I'm really worried for the Canadian education system.

Date: 2008/04/11 10:27:13, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Is there no honour among sock-puppets?
Quote

FYI. You might want to google “Leopold Stotch”, then tell me who is the troll.

Date: 2008/04/11 11:04:58, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I was worried I was late to the party, but evidently I'm not the last.

I just hope k.e. had as much fun on his birthday as the rest of you did.

Date: 2008/04/12 02:09:27, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
That sounds good, actually.  The higher the gross that first night, the higher the damages requested should be if they are sued the next day, after it is confirmed that they used the plagiarized XVIVO animation for commercial purposes.

Sounds like we (well, you) should all go and see the film and pay for our (well, your) tickets.  Do your bit to help XVIVO win Ben Stein's money!

I'm safe in Finland, so I won't be able to see it myself.  But I've checked the exchange rates, so I can send over a couple of glass beads that should pay for about 15 of you to get in.

Date: 2008/04/12 02:16:26, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Two comments I couldn't leave at UD:
Apollos is a tard
Quote

It’s too bad for them that Darwinists don’t have a monopoly on showing how complex and wonderous the cell truly is.

If you had to steal our visualisations to show this, perhaps we do have a monopoly.

Charlie is a tard
Quote

It’s satire.

No, it's P-A-R-O-D-Y.

Date: 2008/04/12 02:23:20, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Didn't Sal say on UD that he had been told that Expelled was cuddlier and called Crossroads?  Can anyone remember where he said it?  I'm not prepared to wade through all that tard to try and find it.

I think it will effectively make the point I want to make over at UD.

Date: 2008/04/12 06:04:17, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Thanks Didymos.  It'll be interesting to see how they respond.

Date: 2008/04/13 08:49:48, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Oldman - probably not.  But they might be guilty of attempting to do it.

Date: 2008/04/15 13:16:37, Link
Author: Bob O'H
It won't be quite all over, Kristine.  All over bar the court case, I say.

Date: 2008/04/16 00:42:36, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Well, I guess in Dembski's case, Ph.D really does mean "Piled Higher and Deeper".  Question is, do the multiple Doctorings simply result in additive bullshit or exponential bullshit?

Any sort of shit has to be measured on the log scale.

Date: 2008/04/16 00:45:33, Link
Author: Bob O'H
What is Dave up to?
Quote

Bill,
The explantory filter doesn’t give false positives. Without knowing it Bolinski used the explantory filter to make a design inference. It could be stated more formally, and the complexity could be more mathematically rigorous (I’m certain it’s rigorous enough just from the verbal description).
There isn’t 1 chance in 10^150 that the person who created the Expelled animation didn’t look at the Harvard video during the process. Inspiration doesn’t rise to copyright infringement and Harvard is in no position to pursue the matter which will only make Harvard waste money in litigation, come out looking like an ahole for it, and make Premise look like the newest victim of the academic suppression that the film documents.

It's axiomatic that arguing with Dr Dr D. is the quickest way of being invited to contribute elsewhere.  Has Dave finally flipped?

Date: 2008/04/16 06:58:41, Link
Author: Bob O'H
RB - you bastard.  I was working as a double agent.

Date: 2008/04/16 14:33:53, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Oh look
Quote

Quote
They also suspect that some will try to influence Internet search ranks for Expelled, to direct persons seeking information to attack sites instead.

They’re doing it by trying to send people to this site instead.

Someone quietly removed my link.  Booo!

Date: 2008/04/17 13:28:17, Link
Author: Bob O'H
AussieID dreams
Quote

Yes, yes … I know I’m way ahead of myself, but the Academy Award for Documentary Feature must be in some minds over at Premise Media. I realise that this is what could arguably be seen as the most controversial award area, but it will be interesting to see whether it gets a nomination (it will certainly be KNOWN!) before even considering its weight against other nominees.
The great thing about the Academy Awards for me is not the actual kudos associated with the awards, but rather the rebirthing in the public eye of movies that have been and been seen in the movie theatres already. Another mention through Award nominations means more knowledge and broader acknowledgement amongst the movie-watching masses. Another bite of the cherry …
VOTE 1 - Expelled

I thought they would be thinking of Best Animation or Best Soundtrack.

Date: 2008/04/18 00:42:11, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Sal takes aim at foot...
Quote

By the way, here is another episode where the one-time grad student Casey Luskin was “outed” by PT-mafioso Wesley Elsberry. Elsberry was intent on making trouble for Luskin, and pulled a lowly stunt when he came to speak at Casey’s class.
See:
No comparison to Celeste Biever.
PT-mafiosos have been coming to our IDEA meetings in 2006. That was creepy!!! I have sinced cancelled publicly advertised meetings and call the meetings privately.

Date: 2008/04/18 10:57:38, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Thanks Quidam.  I knew the face looked familiar, but couldn't place it.

This might also explain the abilities of the film-makers to make so many blunders - they're being led by Hercules Grytpype-Thynne.

Date: 2008/04/19 07:54:25, Link
Author: Bob O'H
guthrie - why across the US?  Why not just around Waco?

Date: 2008/04/20 08:07:37, Link
Author: Bob O'H
ungtss is a tard
Quote

Gerry: I’m with you. Their minds have already melted down. It’s a waste of time and energy expecting them to behave rationally or cataloguing their myriad failures to do so. Our energy is best expended sharpening our own understanding, articulating it effectively, and keeping our behavior above reproach.

... by not resorting to generalisation and slander, I guess.

Date: 2008/04/20 10:22:47, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Poor Dog_of_War
Quote

You figure about 4 people per showing (just a number I pulled out of the air, but it seems reasonable), 1,050 theaters with 2 showings per theater, that’s 8,400 people per day.
At 7 dollars per ticket, that’s $58,800 a day. Not a big number as movie grosses go, but it adds up. Over a reasonable run, that could easily add up to over a million dollars.
Well, you’re only off by a bit over two orders of magnitude. Now go away. -UD admin

It doesn't seem to be a bannination, as Dog_of_War replies to this, so RB can calm down.

Nochange 's response is sarcastic bewilderment
Quote

2 orders of magnitude? You think that there are 400 people sneaking into each theater? That would mean that most of the viewers were Darwinists.
I hope the Expelled group has a good legal team, and starts suing the theaters for not providing proper care to extract payment for the movie.

Date: 2008/04/20 11:20:05, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I put up a comment on another thread which didn't appear either. Perhaps Dave is in there with his spanner, trying to remove Dog_of_War and Nochange.

He's using the wrong tool, of course.  He'll get No change with that.

Date: 2008/04/21 01:32:34, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Bob O'H are your comments still moderated?  after all this time?

Looks like I'm back in moderation.  Booo!

Date: 2008/04/21 08:04:55, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Poor Dave
Quote
21 April 2008
Adminstrative: Spam Filter Acting Up
DaveScot

The Akisment spam filter is acting up and holding up a lot of comments it shouldn’t be blocking. If your comment doesn’t appear right away where in the past it had then it’s the spam filter. Every single one of my comments are being held up in it. So are about a dozen other members’ here.

Don’t ask why because I don’t know why…

It hiccups like this occasionally and goes away soon. I suspect it gets noticed and fixed at Akismet during normal working hours so it’s more prone to become a bothersome issue on weekends.


Can't bring himself to admit in public that he's been put in moderation too.

Date: 2008/04/21 13:19:05, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Coincidentally, potatoes don't have caterpillars over their eyes either.

Date: 2008/04/22 01:33:24, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Good new folks, we can recall the search parties.  The real Dave is back:
Quote

That William Provine does not understand Darwinism?
Provine looked like a raving lunatic in Expelled, so yeah, lunatics lack understanding of many things.
Provine doesn’t believe in free will. So he has no choice about being a raving lunatic, does he? He is, in his own stupid opinion, a puppet with no control over himself.

Date: 2008/04/22 14:10:57, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I'm not sure Horace_Worblehat is his real name.

Ah, having googled, I wonder if it's Kristine's new sockpuppet  Can someone wave a banana at her and see how she reacts?

Date: 2008/04/23 02:27:43, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (didymos @ April 23 2008,01:55)
I don't know, but does this help?

Quote

PannenbergOmega

04/22/2008

6:38 pm

Very cool.

“Compass into a world bustling with riches yet to be discovered.”

Ben Stein said something about your research potentially curing Cancer. I may be mistaken, but if you do, that would make one heck of a story.

Expelled 2: How We Cured Cancer.


I just don't even know what to say to that.

Ask "Wool, cotton or artificial fibres?"?

Date: 2008/04/24 00:55:58, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Sal haz an IDEA
Quote
The next generation of pro-ID students are being persecuted and bullied by the powers that be. Despite this, several of our members are matriculating through the establishment, getting diplomas, getting jobs, becoming medical doctors, getting graduate degrees, getting post docs, getting research positions, publishing in peer-reviewed articles….

Words will be spoken to the powers that be by The Powers That Be about the inefficiency of the powers that be in their persecution.

I expect the powers that be will complain about their persecution by The Powers That Be to The Powers That Be and ask that The Powers That Be are reprimanded.

A Power That Is

Date: 2008/04/24 02:49:29, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Erasmus, FCD @ April 24 2008,01:59)
Bob is this power responsible for the high proportion of these pro-ID students winding up as engineers?  and hausfrau in BFE, Blue Heronville?

The hausfrau is none of our doing.  But yes, we do hate the engineering profession.

Date: 2008/04/24 11:42:48, Link
Author: Bob O'H
*ahem*
Quote

This is a prime example of what happens when science gets politicized. It reflects poorly on Al Gore and casts unwarranted suspicion on the underlying science.
The moral is that one should treat all political documentaries with some healthy skepticism and check the underlying facts from some independent sources.

Date: 2008/04/25 00:30:09, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I see Sternberg has got his von back.

Date: 2008/04/25 01:11:58, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Wes, you didn't get a bit tipsy, and email "Hahaha! not even the Biologic Institute wants you!" to Dembski, did you?

Date: 2008/04/25 11:32:36, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Yes, folks.  It's true.  Darwin has joined up with Nature Publishing Group, and has his own blog.

Thus far, his only post is to be a bit upset about some American making movies blaming him for genocide.

Date: 2008/04/26 00:31:52, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Hero, that's a UK address and phone numbers.  I'm pretty sure the Wallace at UD is a Yank.  If you have an edit button I suggest you remove the contact information: I doubt the Wallaces of Surrey will appreciate being called in the middle of the night to be accused of tardary.

Date: 2008/04/26 12:54:21, Link
Author: Bob O'H
I think blipey is interested in the effects of his recent, um, sales campaign in California.

Date: 2008/04/27 10:44:30, Link
Author: Bob O'H
It's gone quiet here, all of a sudden.  Was it something I said?

Date: 2008/04/28 00:14:10, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Granny Spice
Quote
A kind correspondent wants to know why I am not in Expelled (”Well, for one thing, I wasn’t kicked out of anything for making the intelligent design controversy my major beat. Oh sure, people laughed at me in 2001 when I said it would be one of the biggest stories of the decade by mid-decade.”)
(bolding mine)

That didn't stop anyone else appearing in the film, ma'am.

Date: 2008/04/30 09:17:06, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
Blogger blows goats! I'd love to take my blog somewhere else, when I get some time.

Lucky goats.

Shifting over to Wordpress is really easy - you can transfer all your posts too.  I did it, but then got an offer I couldn't refuse, and moved to Nature Network instead.

Date: 2008/04/30 10:46:06, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote (Erasmus, FCD @ April 30 2008,09:57)
I CAN HAZ STEGONAGRAHPHOSAURUS INFERNCE?
tard
 
Quote
Thus I think we need prouder american citizens that
are willing to go to bat for their Faith. We don’t need
ridiculous excuses for why we can’t force the soulless
dead in christ materialists to give in.

At least one person has too much time on their hands.

Date: 2008/05/01 10:42:53, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Happy birthday old man!  As a treat, do we get to throw all your posts today to the bathroom wall?

Date: 2008/05/02 00:53:18, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Good news, didymos. Dave wants to play on the pseudodoc thread too
Quote

thogan
In both cases there is an undue respect for science, perhaps to the point of idolatry.
Yet you’d have me respect a bearded thunderer who can only speak through the written word of mortal men instead? Non sequitur.


And before that, godslanguage provides the in-thread public health announcement:
Quote

off-topic:
Interesting outlook on the parallels between the design in biology with fruits and vegetables:
Click here (video)

I can't work out whether he's being serious or taking the piss.  The video is worth watching for the hilarity it provides, although I was wondering when a certain part of Baldrick's anatomy would make an appearance.

Date: 2008/05/02 01:08:50, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Quote
2. The lesbians have either not arrived or my wife found the package before I did.

Have you since your wife since the time the package should have arrived?

Date: 2008/05/03 01:07:24, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Dave's had enough  
Quote

Gerry
I’ve had all I can stand from you. You’re out of here.

You can read on from the quotes didymos gives - Gerry was being an idiot, and Dave did give him a subtle warning that he was going too far.

Oh and Gerry, if you're reading this, now you're not able to dig any more, Venus Mousetrap wants his spade back.

ETA: *waves fist at RTH*

Date: 2008/05/03 11:27:26, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Dave is who he is.  I'm surprised that Gerry acted the way he did - it looked like he was a sock-puppet trying to get banned.  Impressive, in its own way.

Date: 2008/05/04 04:28:34, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Is that photo from the BBC documentary Dembski has been whinging about?

Date: 2008/05/04 13:55:53, Link
Author: Bob O'H
olegt - Sal's main point, that most new mutations will go extinct through drift, is correct.  But we've known about this for a long time: it even gets taught to undergrads.  But Sal never answers the "So what?" satisfactorily.  It just means that evolution takes a bit longer.  I guess this is a problem for Sal or Sanford, who only allow it 10 000 years, but the rest of us just take it into account.  I'm guessing that Sal has never taken a course on phylogenetics: you get shown that the mutation rate equals the fixation rate for neutral alleles.  And yet we can still build trees, and time events with sensible figures.

Sal screws a few other things up: the quote of Mike Lynch at the end is a non sequitur, and the rest of that book shows Sal's argument is crap (basically, Mike was trying to show that molecular evolution can happen without selection).  And his stuff about multiple genes is nonsensical.

I'm sure there's more too, but I'm off to bed.

Date: 2008/05/05 00:13:01, Link
Author: Bob O'H
Yah!  ungtss goes for the Creationism Tard
Quote

The diluvial model, of course, accounts rather admirably for the population bottleneck necessary to set characteristics in isolated population. If 7 pairs of primal “cats” of substantial heterozygosity stepped off the boat, genetic drift would “set” them into a numnber of distinct species within a matter of a few generations.

Date: 2008/05/05 23:34:53, Link
Author: Bob O'H